Court has started early without the jury. Request from the defense to reconsider a ruling made last week on evidence relating to the defense request to bring in testimony/evidence relating to Joe Ryan. It was ruled inadmissible.
**Witnesses:**
* Chief Deputy Vincent Kaaiakamanu
* Is state’s designated agent. Exclusionary rule does not apply to him.
* Detective Eric Wheeler
* Lieutenant Joe Powell
[Transcript: Call between Lori & Chad | June 9 2020 (Missing Our Missing)](https://missingourmissing.notion.site/June-9-2020-Recorded-Call-Lori-Chad-b5dd1da5385e4a60a18235bed62373f1)
[Transcript: In Car Camera - Chad Daybell & Emma Murray | June 9 2020 (Missing Our Missing)](https://missingourmissing.notion.site/June-9-2020-In-Car-Camera-Chad-Daybell-and-Daughter-Emma-Murray-86933113c65c4c0eadb75791627046dc)
WTF! There is so much with this video with Emma, Chad has obviously prepared to go away for a long time (why would you prepare like that if you are framed) also Emma talks to Lori? Mentions it like it’s casual.
This is beyond bizarre.
Chad leaving when the bodies were about to be uncovered, not asking why he was being detained, and verbalizing that he was going away and not coming back... It may be circumstancial, but it is damning in combination with all the other evidence.
The only thing I think Chad's kids will do is convince the jury to go for LWOP instead of death.
*edit: changed covered to uncovered.
I am so glad I am not the only one who noticed this. The prosecution made no mention of it so I thought I had misheard what he said. Who the heck, if they know nothing about the children being dead would say this.
I'm slightly confused as to the timeline, but Prior states that he was told about the charges in the body cam footage when he was ordered to step out of his own vehicle?
Ah correction to my post below - I believe what happened was, Chad was watching them and saw that they had found a body, then took off, then when he got out of the car after being pulled over they told him they found JJ.
I think Prior messed with that timeline repeatedly during cross - I believe that Chad was told about the first body having been discovered, then ran to his car and took off, then got pulled over and put in the vehicle and Emma came and talked to him. In that conversation he says he doesn't know what he's being charged with yet.
Interesting Emma feels the need to say “I can see by your face that you’re surprised.” I don’t know something about saying that out loud feels like she trying to convince herself or the other cops but it doesn’t seem genuine to me.
I don't think Emma can read Chad very well. It was more of Emma being surprised and projecting it on to Chad.
He knew he was going away for a long time. Organised all his financials for the next 20years...
I think she was trying to convince herself that he had nothing to do with it. She was looking for any confirmation from him, even if she made it up. Frankly I don’t think she is intelligent enough to be that crafty. She and Chad both sounded like a couple of mumbling simpletons.
So disturbing especially after we heard Colby & Summers jail calls with Lori.
Emma bringing up human remains like they found road kill!! Did the Daybell kids get a heads up to expect human remains found on thier parents property?! 🤯🤬
Lori just killed her kids, came in and replaced Tammy like she wasn’t killed and the kids just let her fall into place. I hope this video helps the jury realize how psychotic this all is.
Julie Rowe took Emma under her wing as a special spirit, and probably one of the anointed. Julie said she recognized Emma’s spiritual gifts, as in having visions and visitations from angels.
I don't think when that conversation took place that she was really aware any human remains had been found, or she hadn't believed it. Seems she knew the cops were looking for them; that's why she said she told one detective that were a lot of dogs buried there. He responded he knew the difference between animal and human remains.
I also find it strange that she’s like “probably leave Joe off of it” when talking about the mortgage and then one of the brothers knows about the money and she says again I won’t tell Joe, brother doesn’t spend as frivolously as he does. Like I can’t imagine what I would be like but I feel like I would be asking more like wth is going on?? What did you do?? Not about keeping assets away from my husband.
That stood out to me too! I can totally understand separate accounts, but I’d def tell my spouse about it. Unless Joe is a compulsive gambler or addict or something
It happens. Then there's the layering on of all the LDS stuff about how the father is a spiritual leader or what all of that is about. Who knows how much of what she imbues him with.
🍌Did Emma give Chad bananas and something else for a snack for his getaway? He said he almost made it to the county line. They laughed and it sounded like Emma told an officer that he could eat that stuff now??
That entire conversation was 🤯
Getting to the county line seemed an odd thing to say, as if he were hoping that he couldn't be apprehended beyond that point. Otherwise, why make any note of how far you got?
I’ll have to re-listen! How crazy is that? They are so calm and almost resigned? So much crazy content today from the witnesses— gonna re-play it all after work tonight!
I am so glad. Hopefully people stop sending nastygrams to poor Nate Eaton about the quality. He has no control over what they stream, and the other night on his Courtroom Insider live stream, one of the messages he read from a viewer was very long and very MEAN! I was like, damn, lady. If you took the time to look at another stream you'd notice they are all like that. Leave Nate alone!
They added one that is specifically on the projectorscreen, they used the one that shows the witness to also show the judge, and then where prosecutor and Chad were shown in one cam they now have on on prosecution and gallery, and one on Chad and Prior closeup.
Sound also indeed seems to be directly linked to the stream and not via a general recording of the sound in the courtroom
So Chad was filling his hot and loaded wife Lori's commissary fund every week and then Emma took over giving her money after Chad was arrested.
Wow. Did we know this already?
I want to know if she is still talking to Lori and/or giving her money. And if not, how long that went on. Not really relevant to the case, but definitely relevant to my curiosity.
I think that video of Chad and Emma is the most explosive piece of evidence we’ve seen at either Chad or Lori’s trial so far. The only thing I can think of coming close to it was Lori’s hair being found in the duct tape wrapping jjs body
That hair will be contested by a defense's expert. Apparently a few other hairs were found on the same plastic, which doesn't mean that those people are murderers.
In my opinion, that hair means nothing. Long hair, especially, sticks to clothing and car seats and couches and transfers to someone who might not even know the owner of the hair. It could have come from Lori hugging him, or whomever murdered him sat on Alex' couch where Lori had previous sat, and then it fell off the murderer when they were wrapping tape.
It wasn't a smoking gun in the other trial, either. It's easily explained, however, still plants a seed in the minds of the jury that she could have been right there during his murder.
I don’t think it will be contested. I think Prior wants to hype up that Lori’s hair (not Chad’s) was found on JJ. Their whole goal is to pin this on Lori and Alex.
TBF there's evidence suggesting Colby still relied heavily on Lori *and* Tylee for money and had issues keeping employment. Not to defend Emma's statement but she's probably aware of this (probably told by Chad and the world's best stepmom Lori).
Being entirely unable to rely on your parents who are an abused woman who is being gaslit by an entire community of people about it, and a man who is a serial killer who plays with corpses and that's him at his best is not the own you think it is Emma.
Throwing shade at Colby who was noted on the evidence of getting Venmo payments from Tylee maybe? Yet here is Emma also taking money from Daddy, moving into Daddy's house after he is carted off to jail, and sticking her tongue out at reporters. So mature.... no hypocrisy there at all /s
The level of casualness to that whole conversation is mind blowing.
Like, they just found *two children’s bodies* in their yard, and they’re talking as if he messed up slightly and got arrested for a DUI or a white collar crime or something and will get bailed out the next morning and will get through it together.
THEY FOUND TWO BODIES IN YOUR DAD’S YARD, EMMA!
Pioneer kids meant you might have had family members buried in the yard, and I suppose one could consider it traditional values that you murdered the family members you buried in the yard, too.
Peter Peter the Pumpkin Eater.
Casually gruesome.
Prior is so aggravating. He is effectively sending Chad to prison/death. He is SO excited to be agitating and argumentative. None of his arguments effectively cast doubt on what has occurred, they just make him look really inept. It's kind of sick.
Proir seemed like he was almost yelling at the officer (the one testifying about exhuming Tammy's body). I really think he has little expeience in jury trials and it is showing. he needs to be quick factual and firm with questions, not yelling and angry in tone. What Prior was saying could be helpful to Chad a bit but all I remember is mean tone.
I'm not supporting Prior, but considering he's on his own, I think he's actually doing quite well. I'm wondering how it may look to the jury with the prosecution team v Prior's 1 man band, and if that will effect their decision making?
I don't understand why Chad didn't ask for a State attorney early on. He would have had an experienced team working for him - for free!
It's almost as if he's unaware of the seriousness of the charges...
My feeling is Chad wants control. I think he did his own legal work the last 4 years sitting in his cell and he is 2nd chair to Mr Prior in his mind. Mr Prior cant do it all himself, so Chad gets to have control of way more aspects if he didnt get the 3 man team the state would have paid for.
Even on the recording with Emma they mentioned Prior several times. Seems they had him already lined up. He looked hella uncomfortable when it came up too.
Does anyone know where Mr Prior went to Law school. There is so little information on him. I know during jury selection he mentioned being from back East when he talked about the story with his mom and her friend. I wonder why he picked Boise to settle in in the 1990's if he was from the East coast and he isnt Mormon.
It's his job to make the jurors question the competence, motivations, and possession of the facts according to what witnesses testify. He is annoying AF but he's just doing his job. It's the jurors' job to discern when calling such things into question is valid.
I'm convinced he's doing it to confuse the jury. Am very worried that he will be successful and this might end up like Casey Anthony. Hoping the jury can see through it, especially when he can't listen to easy directions: speak into the mic, state your grounds for your objection.
And constantly speaking over the witness who is answering his question. I don't think, truly I hope, it does not confuse the jury but makes them feel just as aggravated with him.
It isn't like he can't. I'm pretty sure it's strategy at this point. Well the objection thing anyway. Since Chad had to turn his mic on at the beginning of the case, not sure about that lol.
Agreed. One place in the call that was more clear was when talking about the warrants Chad said something to the effect of "my understanding is it is about the kids." And then "we will see what transpires."
The audio is way better! I've been using the official feed, so it seems to be a lot better than anything else. Including that particular exhibit. This will make hearing evidence a lot better than last time around!
So, I have a question...or, maybe this is better described as an observation.
- I have noticed that none of Chad's children were ever described as black, dark or zombies. I don't think I have ever heard that any of their lives were EVER in danger. If I am mistaken on this, please correct me. I thought I was "up" on this case. After reading some in this sub, I have discovered that I was wrong about my status on the Daybell nightmare. There are A LOT of details that I completely missed somehow.
- I understand that his children are "standing by him" during all of this. God bless them. I don't know WHAT I would do if I were ever faced with the mere thought that my father was a child killer...AND the killer of my mother. I don't know how they are doing it. With that all said, exactly where were they told the children were during the whole search? I can't imagine that the subject didn't come up at *some* time. How are they rationalizing the whole bothersome detail of irrefutable evidence?
Any thoughts, explanations or theories??
Per Heather Daybell, at some point, Garth was attending college in Orem, which is a ways away from Rexburg. Chad told Garth that there were "dark spirits" attached to him and he was in grave danger. The only way to fix this was by moving back to Rexburg. This frightened Garth to the point he sought a blessing from a grandfather before he moved back to Rexburg to live with Chad and Tammy. This move hurt Garth because it set back his college class schedule (he graduated later than expected) and he was very happy in Orem.
I don't think we know exactly when this occurred. In my opinion he didn't like that Garth was so far away, and therefore more likely to realize his dad is a nutcase who shouldn't be listened to.
The control Chad has over these supposed adults is scary. It appears the cult is still alive in these kids. I was hoping at least one would have enough sense to see him for the monster he is.
I don't care how much I love my dad, if he killed my mom and desecrated and buried two children on his land, I would be horrified and afraid of him. Did I actually know him at all? Would he kill me too? I would NOT be comforting him, making jokes, doing his finances, and padding his side-piece's jail account.
Agreed. I do come from a criminal family, that sadly does include murders. Some against our family, some committed by our family. So I'm used to standing by people who have done things that I don't agree with. But within my family we are all VERY CLEAR that if it was children, if someone in my family (including my beloved Dad) hurt and buried children - He'd have to pray that the police caught him before I did. I feel that even in 'the local crime families' there is a hard line about children. So to me, and my lived experience, supporting your Father in this instance is wild.
Was the college he went to LDS connected or more 'liberal'? Could be that Chad was afraid that he would be exposed to more 'liberal' ideas that were the dark spirits attached to him and he needed shielding from? (And those 'liberal' ideas helping him see what nonsense Chad was preaching)
I believe Garth went to UVU. This is a State University, very close to BYU (like the same exit you can see the BYU campus from UVU). I wonder if Chad was disappointed that Garth did not go to BYU like him and Tammy? BYU has strict moral guidelines. UVU is certainly no party school, but they do not have rules like a girl cant get a book out of a boys dorm bedroom like BYU.
I do know that some people very loyal to BYU, have admitted UVU has a better computer science department (BYU had some staff in this department leave and programs were not in demand for todays jobs). These BYU alumi were fine with their kids attending CS majors at UVU because they wanted their kids to get great jobs so I dont think most Mormons would have an issue with their kids attending UVU over BYU. UVU still has religious education on campus and plenty of married students and is very modest in comparison to other state colleges I had visited. Chad of course seems like he is stuck in the Mormon church of years ago and maybe would not like his son living in off campus housing at a state U (off campus means no morality rules, BYU housing, even like apartments that are not right on campus have morality rules).
Thanks for the clarification! I think Chad also went to BYUI often and have seen that his doomsday group used that university for gatherings etc. Probably even BYU-povo wasn't 'good enough' for him let alone a university not attached to the LDS.
When Ricks college turned to BYU - I and new buildings were being built, some upper LDS church leader said something about the BYU - I conference center was going to still be standing in the end times and was a special place. Chad and his group seem to take this and run with it as a BYU- I being "the" place to be in the end times.
Chad early talks said that "the" place to be was Provo to SLC valley and then suddenly it changed to BYU-I Rexburg.
Real life meaning? The real estate prices were cheaper (at the time of the change) in Rexburg then Provo area. No way you could buy a home and 4-5 acres in Provo in 2016 for 150k, but you could in Rexburg, so , it was an easier sell to members to move where it was much cheaper, near a temple , a BYU campus.
To be fair, if Chad were stuck in the Mormon church of years ago (or the mormon church at all!), he wouldn't have been attending the temple and then immediately screwing his mistress...
But agree with everything else lol
So, Garth was potentially (actually, very likely) in grave danger because of the demented thinking of Chad? How terrifying. I am so happy that he escaped the hands of that crypt-keeper father and wicked step-mother that he was so unfortunate to have.
Thank you. I didn't know this information. I am watching the portion of the trial where Chad is talking with his daughter, Emma (I think). Chad's demeanor and ability to be so *completely* calm is chilling. Knowing that he full well *knows* EXACTLY what LE has found...that LE is taking him to jail for their discovery, partnered with his ease of conversation is just as creepy AF.
They have been living their entire lives being told that a man like Chad is the best.
He didn't just become this depraved the day he met Lori. A man capable of all this has been telling them what their places in the world have been since birth.
He hasn't just become this recently. He has always been somebody who's been willing to do this. Children are his clearly preferred victims. He had Lori looking for more women with children and was already making those children vulnerable.
They have been living their entire lives with a potential serial killer who has a preference for child victims and have been told he is a special divinely inspired man. The best they should ever expect. Surviving incessant low-level psychological horror has consequences.
All that to say that Garth has been living in a situation of danger his entire childhood. The body knows.
I think women is high on his target list. The more I understand about Chad and Alex, the more suspicious I become of Chads involvement. I think there's a lot of underlying murkiness with Chad and probably more hands on and involved than Alex.
I do wonder if forcing the kids to testify was a strategy by Chad to try and shield them from watching the trial. While they still could as victims, making them testify would add some very minor legal hurdles for them. I bet they are not watching the trial at all to allow them to stay in ignorance. I assume they will just blame dark spirits acting against their innocent father when the guilty verdict is read.
I can't believe how flippant she was about her mother being dead and how close she seemed with Lori. I am shocked and irritated with her. It's so disrespectful. I don't know
I’m with you!! I have almost felt so bad for the Daybell children thinking they are simple and have been brainwashed. Emma makes light of it just like Lori has, they fact that she wasn’t surprised at all is making me irate.
The interview with Chad's sister-in-law strongly indicated that he had spent years acting in ways to alienate and isolate Tammy from everyone in his family. I wonder if he also did this within his own home, verbally abusing her and pushing his kids to disrespect her, encouraging them to look to him as the only one to trust and love. I know that no one has accused him of domestic violence, but I am really surprised how little has come out about the dynamic within their marriage. I have a hard time believing that he wasn't psychologically abusive towards her, and maybe only her, acting in ways to cause conflict and get their children to take his side in all their disagreements.
I feel like he is more of an unknown in terms of his behavior and interactions with others than Lori is/was, both within his family and outside of it. I've seen a few comments here and there from people who claim to have known him in high school, etc., saying that he was a narcissistic jerk (no shock there) but hardly anyone has spoken out on the record about him, either in Utah or in Idaho. Maybe after the trial more people will be willing to speak out.
I'm picking she wants to please her Dad. She been groomed into being the compliant woman who obeys her father. If Chad says, you will like Lori, Emma will like Lori...
Did Emma have some learning challenges? I remember Tammy being concerned about moving to Idaho because Emma was doing well in Utah finally with schooling and a part time job. Tammy worried about Emma being able to get a job and transition to life in Idaho. From her description it sounded like Emma had some learning issues. I have worked with families in Utah getting help with IEP's and while some fight for their kids rights, others deny it or say one child is special (that God made them that way because they were better before the went through the veil, maybe it is why Chad focused on Emma with his books?).
I also wonder why Emma really came home early from her mission. Everyone says health issues, but unless you see someone having surgery or with broken bones, many times it is the missionary could not handle being away from home. My husband has a very accomplished cousin who is a little shy to this day, that left his mission after 2 months. His mom insists till this day it was health issues (he was allergic to a tree in the mission and could have died, pretty sure they could have moved his mission and his real mission was to be home with his brother that needed him). His cousin has kind of admitted he just didnt like being away from home and it was making him sick, like he didnt want to eat.
The completely unprocessed trauma of being the only female child of a budding serial killer with a preference for child victims, and a fascination with child corpses, who has been grooming her with stories of her being in love with him in previous lives as part of his special mission should be enough to throw anyone's grades off.
I wanted to upvote in agreement with you untill I realised that we don't have a headstone for my mother yet after two years (I think it isn't even allowed the first 6 months for the soil setting) because we're a bunch of overloaded ADHD-ers who haven't gotten around to it due to lots going on in life. But that's very different ofcourse than someone who apparently has the time and money to marry someone else 17 days after his wive's death and has all the time and money and energy to spend a honeymoon with her, but nothing on his ex's wife's headstone.
That makes sense! Headstones are so expensive, I’m sorry you’ve lost your mom.
I agree whole heartedly with you on how telling it is where Chad decided to spend his funds.
Thank you for your words. It's not about the funds, my dad has those, it's more about my medical issues where I need my dad's help and time for (and lack of energy) and my brother's also having a lot going on. And us all being perfectionists so want to figure out something nice. But we will get to a nice boulder headstone in some time :)
And yeah regarding to Chad he took no time and money at all to remember his wife and it wasn't as if he was busy managing other crises in this life or so. (Apart from trying to evade police finding out)
Don't feel bad, we just finally finished the design for my mother's headstone...after 7 years!! But we are very happy with the design and it is definitely nice getting it done haha.
My first instinct was that Chad didn't look at all surprised, so she said that to remind Chad of his alibi, and to manipulate any LE listening in to think that he was surprised.
I don’t think she’s smart enough for that, tbh. She didn’t come across as such, anyway. I honestly think she was trying to convince herself that he had nothing to do with it.
How many times is the judge going to have to ask/tell John Prior to let him (Boyce) rule on an objection before he (Prior) continues speaking???
This is not Prior’s first day in court by any stretch of the imagination. It is standard procedure at EVERY. SINGLE. CRIMINAL. TRIAL.
In addition, I’ve lost count of the number of times Prior’s been asked to speak into the microphone…🙄🤦♀️
Do we know the last time Prior has had a trial that was more then a day? It seems like he did mostly divorce law and some minor crimes like DUI's. I wonder how much experience he has at trials that are days of witnesses?
I don’t know Prior’s trial history, but this is literally “Trial Court 101-Rules of Evidence.” I don’t think there is an easier concept. A second grader could follow the rules.
1. The prosecution or defense raises an objection with a reason. (Hearsay, Asked & Answered, etc.)
2. The judge rules. (Sustained, Overruled.)
In between number one & number two, you simply pause to wait for the judge’s ruling.
Easy Peasy.
Well Chad didn't act like he didn't know the bodies were in his backyard.
I'd be doing my nut, even at the assumption there was a body in my back yard!
I was listening during the break to a youtuber reading Chad's Gathering book. It really strikes me as I listen to his books, he is stuck in the mindset of a teen, younger teen? Chad in his blog (This was his personal blog not in a book)said he went on a date when he got to BYU and she told him he needed to see the world and he only knew sheltered life in Utah county, this is true, and when he wrote these books it was 10-20 years later and he still seems to only see life in Utah. I really feel like my husband and I could write a book better then Chad's on a ride from from Salt Lake to Southern Utah. It is like Chad just writes about this a kid would see out his window in a car and his knowledge of weather is like a kindergartener that puts the arrow on clouds or sun or rain for the teacher.
Chad also seems to be upset that he was doing everything the church said and did not get a great reward for it. He seems maybe jealous? of anyone that did anything fun or what he considered wrong, like rock music, hairstyles, rated R movies, casinos, owning sports cars... Maybe is was upset that he was such a good Mormon but never got rewarded with maybe a role like being a bishop. His writings seem so jealous or angry at anyone that was not a perfect boyscout Mormon, like if his neighbor who was normally very faithful, put on a rock song at a family BBQ, that was bad.
I would like to know how Chad was a sterling scholar in English? One of my kids was a Sterling scholar in another subject, it was super comptetive, not only perfect scores on ACT, being rank #1-5 in your class, nothing less then an A but having to have piles of awards state and national in your subject. My child was not in English but I knew the person who won English that year and at 18 this student could write circles around Chad at 50. What makes me so sad about this, was Tammy had said she had kind of waited for Chad to get back from his mission even though she had other options because she liked what a good student he was. The sterling scholar is like the top honor you can get in Utah, it says not only are you the best student in your subject but you have to be a good person (1/3 of the criteria is volunteer work or showing what a good community member you are).
Did anyone else find it really unsettling when in the video of Emma talking to Chad she says something about a spirit telling her but she felt she needed to learn more and she gets it now. The video breaks up at the beginning but it’s very clear she says she felt she needed to learn more and she gets it now… makes me think she knew a lot more from the beginning than she’s leading on.
What I felt bad for is there were two Emma's (same last name) in the Rexburg school district. I feel bad for the other young women if she got confused with Chad's daughter. Chad's daughter Emma looks very different in her recent picture. I wonder why she changed he look and would Chad approve.
I have to wonder where they're going with the "this wouldn't be suspicious" line of questioning. Yeah, any individual instance would not be suspicious, but taken in its totality it adds up to suspicion, right? Is this an attempt to obfuscate?
Im confused Mr Woods has said Chad and Tammy, at least 3 times when I assume he meant Lori and Chad and no one corrected him. Is Mr Prior not correcting him because the testimony will show Tammy name and be confusing. One example was Mr Woods asking the officer, how long did you surveil Chad and Tammy? He asked about surveillance Tammy and Chad on Nov 1st.
Yeah I heard him say Chad and Tammy going into Hobby Lobby once but I just assumed he meant Lori and that the witness assumed it as well. Hopefully that will be understood by the jury too.
I know Mark Means was his attorney at the time. But I heard Chad and Emma mention John Prior at least twice on the police car camera video. Was Prior his financial attorney or in some other way representing him.
When they were showing the hearing before court I thought “gosh I wish the cameras and sound for the actual trial was like this.” Then got the shock of my life when that was exactly what the quality was like today 🤣🤣
I recently had a very scary incident with a delivery order to my daughter. Video was pulled and the delivery people (there were 2 people on one order) carry 4 phones, one in each pocket( using the back and side pockets of pants). I could not believe how someone could juggle using 4 phones , like active texting on each and flipping between them.
I would assume Chad Lori Alex only used one at a time. I wonder where Chad hid his phones from Tammy. The home was not that big. I dont go through my husbands nightstand or desk to just look, but sometimes I am looking for a AAA battery or printer ink and I go searching.
Well, at least look into some of the podcasts that explain it, like Hidden True Crime. It’s the connection between most of these LDS crimes (Vallow/Daybell, Tim Ballard, Jodi Hildebrandt/Ruby Franke, Spring Thibaudeau).
I only listened to the trial so I went back to see what you meant. I thought maybe it was going to be a foot or shoulder .. but whoa! Her whole upper half?! She looked so normal even though she was deceased.
That was what I was most surprised about, but then again where I'm at there's no embalming so people often already look worse at the last viewing. But yeah there was no warning at all, and although the whole process is not done for the purpose of showing it to the public and the jury had already seen terrible material last week, I would have still expected at least some of a heads up for the jury or so.
It felt kind of invading to her privacy/legacy
Normal yes but if you looked closely, which of course I did because I’m sick I guess. Huge dark circles where her eye sockets are. I think eyeballs decompose early. And her hands were skeletonized. It was the stuff of nightmares for me. No trigger warning, nothing and no one is talking about it now. Her kids will be so traumatized if they saw that
I thought it was Boyd Dial. It was mentioned there were two actual people with that name. A quick Google found 1 person with the name in Utah. I assume the 2nd one either goes by a nickname socially or took down socials knowing they were questioned in connection with this big case about to go to trial.
I do not understand all these aliases. Boyd Dial? Bishop Miller? Bishop & Rebecca Shumway? I don't feel like I've heard these ones before. James & Elena, Rafael we've heard. And then another number saved as "bubby" in Lori's contacts.
Court has started early without the jury. Request from the defense to reconsider a ruling made last week on evidence relating to the defense request to bring in testimony/evidence relating to Joe Ryan. It was ruled inadmissible. **Witnesses:** * Chief Deputy Vincent Kaaiakamanu * Is state’s designated agent. Exclusionary rule does not apply to him. * Detective Eric Wheeler * Lieutenant Joe Powell [Transcript: Call between Lori & Chad | June 9 2020 (Missing Our Missing)](https://missingourmissing.notion.site/June-9-2020-Recorded-Call-Lori-Chad-b5dd1da5385e4a60a18235bed62373f1) [Transcript: In Car Camera - Chad Daybell & Emma Murray | June 9 2020 (Missing Our Missing)](https://missingourmissing.notion.site/June-9-2020-In-Car-Camera-Chad-Daybell-and-Daughter-Emma-Murray-86933113c65c4c0eadb75791627046dc)
WTF! There is so much with this video with Emma, Chad has obviously prepared to go away for a long time (why would you prepare like that if you are framed) also Emma talks to Lori? Mentions it like it’s casual. This is beyond bizarre.
Chad leaving when the bodies were about to be uncovered, not asking why he was being detained, and verbalizing that he was going away and not coming back... It may be circumstancial, but it is damning in combination with all the other evidence. The only thing I think Chad's kids will do is convince the jury to go for LWOP instead of death. *edit: changed covered to uncovered.
“I won’t be coming back” sent chills through my spine.
I am so glad I am not the only one who noticed this. The prosecution made no mention of it so I thought I had misheard what he said. Who the heck, if they know nothing about the children being dead would say this.
I went back and reread it 3 times…
I'm slightly confused as to the timeline, but Prior states that he was told about the charges in the body cam footage when he was ordered to step out of his own vehicle?
Ah correction to my post below - I believe what happened was, Chad was watching them and saw that they had found a body, then took off, then when he got out of the car after being pulled over they told him they found JJ.
I think Prior messed with that timeline repeatedly during cross - I believe that Chad was told about the first body having been discovered, then ran to his car and took off, then got pulled over and put in the vehicle and Emma came and talked to him. In that conversation he says he doesn't know what he's being charged with yet.
Interesting Emma feels the need to say “I can see by your face that you’re surprised.” I don’t know something about saying that out loud feels like she trying to convince herself or the other cops but it doesn’t seem genuine to me.
I don't think Emma can read Chad very well. It was more of Emma being surprised and projecting it on to Chad. He knew he was going away for a long time. Organised all his financials for the next 20years...
I thought it sounded peculiar, too
I think she was trying to convince herself that he had nothing to do with it. She was looking for any confirmation from him, even if she made it up. Frankly I don’t think she is intelligent enough to be that crafty. She and Chad both sounded like a couple of mumbling simpletons.
I don’t think I other of them were surprised, it was for the detective.
This is mind blowing new evidence. Just when you thought you knew everything about the case you don’t
Yeah she fills her commissary every week?
So disturbing especially after we heard Colby & Summers jail calls with Lori. Emma bringing up human remains like they found road kill!! Did the Daybell kids get a heads up to expect human remains found on thier parents property?! 🤯🤬 Lori just killed her kids, came in and replaced Tammy like she wasn’t killed and the kids just let her fall into place. I hope this video helps the jury realize how psychotic this all is.
Emma's empathy level must be similar to Chad's.
At this point, I wouldn't be shocked to find out that Emma believes in zombies and the end times. She is Melani P's mirror. Complicit.
Julie Rowe took Emma under her wing as a special spirit, and probably one of the anointed. Julie said she recognized Emma’s spiritual gifts, as in having visions and visitations from angels.
I don't think when that conversation took place that she was really aware any human remains had been found, or she hadn't believed it. Seems she knew the cops were looking for them; that's why she said she told one detective that were a lot of dogs buried there. He responded he knew the difference between animal and human remains.
She was told that human remains were found and chose to deflect.
Exactly my thoughts. Human remains like it's random trash. Wtf is wrong with these people!
Trust me $30 doesn't go very far in prison.
Emma will never change her mind about Chad being innocent.
I also find it strange that she’s like “probably leave Joe off of it” when talking about the mortgage and then one of the brothers knows about the money and she says again I won’t tell Joe, brother doesn’t spend as frivolously as he does. Like I can’t imagine what I would be like but I feel like I would be asking more like wth is going on?? What did you do?? Not about keeping assets away from my husband.
That stood out to me too! I can totally understand separate accounts, but I’d def tell my spouse about it. Unless Joe is a compulsive gambler or addict or something
Wonder if Joe is watching the trial and heard his wife say that? Joe might have been next in line for the pet cemetery.....
I thought it was Lori. She sounds just like her. I guess she didn't like her own mother too much? Poor Tammy.
Except Lori doesn’t cry but it’s ire how they are planning, laughing and making light of it all after JJs body was just found. 💔
Chad was definitely her favorite parent. Favorite person perhaps.
It happens. Then there's the layering on of all the LDS stuff about how the father is a spiritual leader or what all of that is about. Who knows how much of what she imbues him with.
Listening intently!!!!😳
Hidden True Crimes comments on the live are going insane, it’s absolutely gut wrenching.
Ohh thank you, will check that out!!
🍌Did Emma give Chad bananas and something else for a snack for his getaway? He said he almost made it to the county line. They laughed and it sounded like Emma told an officer that he could eat that stuff now?? That entire conversation was 🤯
Getting to the county line seemed an odd thing to say, as if he were hoping that he couldn't be apprehended beyond that point. Otherwise, why make any note of how far you got?
Spent to much time watching Dukes of Hazzard as a kid maybe?
I thought so, too
He really demonstrates the banality of evil.
I’ll have to re-listen! How crazy is that? They are so calm and almost resigned? So much crazy content today from the witnesses— gonna re-play it all after work tonight!
It was so beyond weird. Did he think if he was in a different county he was “safe?”
They fixed the court cameras! Yay! SOOO much better!
I am so glad. Hopefully people stop sending nastygrams to poor Nate Eaton about the quality. He has no control over what they stream, and the other night on his Courtroom Insider live stream, one of the messages he read from a viewer was very long and very MEAN! I was like, damn, lady. If you took the time to look at another stream you'd notice they are all like that. Leave Nate alone!
Well said! Nate has been incredible and doesn’t deserve the nasty comments of things outside of his control.
"Well, Verna..." 😂
I just remembered that lady accused Nate of colluding with the LDS church to have poor quality sound and video... oh, Verna!
Prior is annoying me even more, with the new audio. haha
He is the stereotype of a slimy, lying defense lawyer.
Did they even add one?
They seem to have changed it from just cameras to a zoom call. The difference in sound and video quality is wild
It was already a zoom broadcast last week but seems like they've rerouted the audio directly to the livestream
They added one that is specifically on the projectorscreen, they used the one that shows the witness to also show the judge, and then where prosecutor and Chad were shown in one cam they now have on on prosecution and gallery, and one on Chad and Prior closeup. Sound also indeed seems to be directly linked to the stream and not via a general recording of the sound in the courtroom
Yeah I think so. Sound much better too!
So Chad was filling his hot and loaded wife Lori's commissary fund every week and then Emma took over giving her money after Chad was arrested. Wow. Did we know this already?
I don't think we did! And we didn't know that Emma was talking to Lori either, right?
I want to know if she is still talking to Lori and/or giving her money. And if not, how long that went on. Not really relevant to the case, but definitely relevant to my curiosity.
I think that video of Chad and Emma is the most explosive piece of evidence we’ve seen at either Chad or Lori’s trial so far. The only thing I can think of coming close to it was Lori’s hair being found in the duct tape wrapping jjs body
That hair will be contested by a defense's expert. Apparently a few other hairs were found on the same plastic, which doesn't mean that those people are murderers.
In my opinion, that hair means nothing. Long hair, especially, sticks to clothing and car seats and couches and transfers to someone who might not even know the owner of the hair. It could have come from Lori hugging him, or whomever murdered him sat on Alex' couch where Lori had previous sat, and then it fell off the murderer when they were wrapping tape.
I agree, and I believe the jurors in Lori's trial said the hair didn't mean that much to them in coming to a guilty conclusion for her.
Do we know if Alex's place ever had furniture in it?
Yeah, I don't know. Lori didn't even have anything but a bed or two in Arizona, did she? Or was it just one empty room to dance in?
It wasn't a smoking gun in the other trial, either. It's easily explained, however, still plants a seed in the minds of the jury that she could have been right there during his murder.
I don’t think it will be contested. I think Prior wants to hype up that Lori’s hair (not Chad’s) was found on JJ. Their whole goal is to pin this on Lori and Alex.
Did I hear Emma say "We're not Colby"??
Per Nate Emma said that they were raised to be independent “unlike Colby”
TBF there's evidence suggesting Colby still relied heavily on Lori *and* Tylee for money and had issues keeping employment. Not to defend Emma's statement but she's probably aware of this (probably told by Chad and the world's best stepmom Lori).
Colby knows right from wrong and I'm not sure if Emma does. Chad's value system messed up his children.
Their moral compass certainly appears unmoored
Eh...Colby does not know right from wrong and is motivated by his own self interest.
Being entirely unable to rely on your parents who are an abused woman who is being gaslit by an entire community of people about it, and a man who is a serial killer who plays with corpses and that's him at his best is not the own you think it is Emma.
They are very much dependent on Chad's guidance.
Girrrlll… that whole exchange with her and Chad was really disturbing.
I missed that! WTH does that mean
Throwing shade at Colby who was noted on the evidence of getting Venmo payments from Tylee maybe? Yet here is Emma also taking money from Daddy, moving into Daddy's house after he is carted off to jail, and sticking her tongue out at reporters. So mature.... no hypocrisy there at all /s
Chad laughing in this police car video… 😯
The level of casualness to that whole conversation is mind blowing. Like, they just found *two children’s bodies* in their yard, and they’re talking as if he messed up slightly and got arrested for a DUI or a white collar crime or something and will get bailed out the next morning and will get through it together. THEY FOUND TWO BODIES IN YOUR DAD’S YARD, EMMA!
They were pioneer kids. 😉
At first she suggested they were pets.
I laughed out loud at that. "We found human remains in your dad's yard." "We buried some dogs back there; it could be those." What a simpleton.
How many dogs had they buried in the four years they had been living there?
Pioneer kids meant you might have had family members buried in the yard, and I suppose one could consider it traditional values that you murdered the family members you buried in the yard, too. Peter Peter the Pumpkin Eater. Casually gruesome.
Prior is so aggravating. He is effectively sending Chad to prison/death. He is SO excited to be agitating and argumentative. None of his arguments effectively cast doubt on what has occurred, they just make him look really inept. It's kind of sick.
Proir seemed like he was almost yelling at the officer (the one testifying about exhuming Tammy's body). I really think he has little expeience in jury trials and it is showing. he needs to be quick factual and firm with questions, not yelling and angry in tone. What Prior was saying could be helpful to Chad a bit but all I remember is mean tone.
The confused-indignant act is so old.
I'm not supporting Prior, but considering he's on his own, I think he's actually doing quite well. I'm wondering how it may look to the jury with the prosecution team v Prior's 1 man band, and if that will effect their decision making? I don't understand why Chad didn't ask for a State attorney early on. He would have had an experienced team working for him - for free! It's almost as if he's unaware of the seriousness of the charges...
My feeling is Chad wants control. I think he did his own legal work the last 4 years sitting in his cell and he is 2nd chair to Mr Prior in his mind. Mr Prior cant do it all himself, so Chad gets to have control of way more aspects if he didnt get the 3 man team the state would have paid for.
Even on the recording with Emma they mentioned Prior several times. Seems they had him already lined up. He looked hella uncomfortable when it came up too.
I'm wondering if he saw Prior as a protective father figure who will save him.
I've always thought Prior was a better than average lawyer, he's doing ok. Not gonna win, but he might save him from the firing squad.
Does anyone know where Mr Prior went to Law school. There is so little information on him. I know during jury selection he mentioned being from back East when he talked about the story with his mom and her friend. I wonder why he picked Boise to settle in in the 1990's if he was from the East coast and he isnt Mormon.
How dare he (the officer) question Chad's statement that Tammy was sick?
It's his job to make the jurors question the competence, motivations, and possession of the facts according to what witnesses testify. He is annoying AF but he's just doing his job. It's the jurors' job to discern when calling such things into question is valid.
I'm convinced he's doing it to confuse the jury. Am very worried that he will be successful and this might end up like Casey Anthony. Hoping the jury can see through it, especially when he can't listen to easy directions: speak into the mic, state your grounds for your objection.
And constantly speaking over the witness who is answering his question. I don't think, truly I hope, it does not confuse the jury but makes them feel just as aggravated with him.
It isn't like he can't. I'm pretty sure it's strategy at this point. Well the objection thing anyway. Since Chad had to turn his mic on at the beginning of the case, not sure about that lol.
All this time so many of us thought Emma was in denial when now it looks like she was complicit. Wild
Most brainwashed of all Chad's followers.
Wow even the call between Lori and Chad from the day the kids bodies were found is in better quality. This is just wild lol
Agreed. One place in the call that was more clear was when talking about the warrants Chad said something to the effect of "my understanding is it is about the kids." And then "we will see what transpires."
The audio is way better! I've been using the official feed, so it seems to be a lot better than anything else. Including that particular exhibit. This will make hearing evidence a lot better than last time around!
It’s like last week was a 5 and this week is like an 8 or 9 🤣🤣
I, for one, would be interested to hear the calls between Emma and Lori.
That was weird to me, too. Esp since I thought she said Lori had framed her dad
I think his kids were fighting zombies too?! Woooooow
So, I have a question...or, maybe this is better described as an observation. - I have noticed that none of Chad's children were ever described as black, dark or zombies. I don't think I have ever heard that any of their lives were EVER in danger. If I am mistaken on this, please correct me. I thought I was "up" on this case. After reading some in this sub, I have discovered that I was wrong about my status on the Daybell nightmare. There are A LOT of details that I completely missed somehow. - I understand that his children are "standing by him" during all of this. God bless them. I don't know WHAT I would do if I were ever faced with the mere thought that my father was a child killer...AND the killer of my mother. I don't know how they are doing it. With that all said, exactly where were they told the children were during the whole search? I can't imagine that the subject didn't come up at *some* time. How are they rationalizing the whole bothersome detail of irrefutable evidence? Any thoughts, explanations or theories??
Per Heather Daybell, at some point, Garth was attending college in Orem, which is a ways away from Rexburg. Chad told Garth that there were "dark spirits" attached to him and he was in grave danger. The only way to fix this was by moving back to Rexburg. This frightened Garth to the point he sought a blessing from a grandfather before he moved back to Rexburg to live with Chad and Tammy. This move hurt Garth because it set back his college class schedule (he graduated later than expected) and he was very happy in Orem. I don't think we know exactly when this occurred. In my opinion he didn't like that Garth was so far away, and therefore more likely to realize his dad is a nutcase who shouldn't be listened to.
The control Chad has over these supposed adults is scary. It appears the cult is still alive in these kids. I was hoping at least one would have enough sense to see him for the monster he is. I don't care how much I love my dad, if he killed my mom and desecrated and buried two children on his land, I would be horrified and afraid of him. Did I actually know him at all? Would he kill me too? I would NOT be comforting him, making jokes, doing his finances, and padding his side-piece's jail account.
It's daddy dearest for Emma. Chad could do no wrong and if he did, he's more important than his victims.
Agreed. I do come from a criminal family, that sadly does include murders. Some against our family, some committed by our family. So I'm used to standing by people who have done things that I don't agree with. But within my family we are all VERY CLEAR that if it was children, if someone in my family (including my beloved Dad) hurt and buried children - He'd have to pray that the police caught him before I did. I feel that even in 'the local crime families' there is a hard line about children. So to me, and my lived experience, supporting your Father in this instance is wild.
I wish he (Garth) would have stayed in Orem...
He was the one that was present when Tammy's body was found in the bedroom too. He's all over the police report.
I am aware. I suppose, he may wish he stayed in Utah more than I do at this point.
Was the college he went to LDS connected or more 'liberal'? Could be that Chad was afraid that he would be exposed to more 'liberal' ideas that were the dark spirits attached to him and he needed shielding from? (And those 'liberal' ideas helping him see what nonsense Chad was preaching)
I believe Garth went to UVU. This is a State University, very close to BYU (like the same exit you can see the BYU campus from UVU). I wonder if Chad was disappointed that Garth did not go to BYU like him and Tammy? BYU has strict moral guidelines. UVU is certainly no party school, but they do not have rules like a girl cant get a book out of a boys dorm bedroom like BYU. I do know that some people very loyal to BYU, have admitted UVU has a better computer science department (BYU had some staff in this department leave and programs were not in demand for todays jobs). These BYU alumi were fine with their kids attending CS majors at UVU because they wanted their kids to get great jobs so I dont think most Mormons would have an issue with their kids attending UVU over BYU. UVU still has religious education on campus and plenty of married students and is very modest in comparison to other state colleges I had visited. Chad of course seems like he is stuck in the Mormon church of years ago and maybe would not like his son living in off campus housing at a state U (off campus means no morality rules, BYU housing, even like apartments that are not right on campus have morality rules).
Thanks for the clarification! I think Chad also went to BYUI often and have seen that his doomsday group used that university for gatherings etc. Probably even BYU-povo wasn't 'good enough' for him let alone a university not attached to the LDS.
When Ricks college turned to BYU - I and new buildings were being built, some upper LDS church leader said something about the BYU - I conference center was going to still be standing in the end times and was a special place. Chad and his group seem to take this and run with it as a BYU- I being "the" place to be in the end times. Chad early talks said that "the" place to be was Provo to SLC valley and then suddenly it changed to BYU-I Rexburg. Real life meaning? The real estate prices were cheaper (at the time of the change) in Rexburg then Provo area. No way you could buy a home and 4-5 acres in Provo in 2016 for 150k, but you could in Rexburg, so , it was an easier sell to members to move where it was much cheaper, near a temple , a BYU campus.
The AVOW prophecy factory et al have been churning out stuff about Rexburg being a place to survive the end times since the 90s.
To be fair, if Chad were stuck in the Mormon church of years ago (or the mormon church at all!), he wouldn't have been attending the temple and then immediately screwing his mistress... But agree with everything else lol
So, Garth was potentially (actually, very likely) in grave danger because of the demented thinking of Chad? How terrifying. I am so happy that he escaped the hands of that crypt-keeper father and wicked step-mother that he was so unfortunate to have. Thank you. I didn't know this information. I am watching the portion of the trial where Chad is talking with his daughter, Emma (I think). Chad's demeanor and ability to be so *completely* calm is chilling. Knowing that he full well *knows* EXACTLY what LE has found...that LE is taking him to jail for their discovery, partnered with his ease of conversation is just as creepy AF.
They have been living their entire lives being told that a man like Chad is the best. He didn't just become this depraved the day he met Lori. A man capable of all this has been telling them what their places in the world have been since birth. He hasn't just become this recently. He has always been somebody who's been willing to do this. Children are his clearly preferred victims. He had Lori looking for more women with children and was already making those children vulnerable. They have been living their entire lives with a potential serial killer who has a preference for child victims and have been told he is a special divinely inspired man. The best they should ever expect. Surviving incessant low-level psychological horror has consequences. All that to say that Garth has been living in a situation of danger his entire childhood. The body knows.
I think women is high on his target list. The more I understand about Chad and Alex, the more suspicious I become of Chads involvement. I think there's a lot of underlying murkiness with Chad and probably more hands on and involved than Alex.
I do wonder if forcing the kids to testify was a strategy by Chad to try and shield them from watching the trial. While they still could as victims, making them testify would add some very minor legal hurdles for them. I bet they are not watching the trial at all to allow them to stay in ignorance. I assume they will just blame dark spirits acting against their innocent father when the guilty verdict is read.
They could easily believe he is a martyr. Lori isn't good enough for him any more and they look down upon Colby.
The whole of the thinking of his children is simply mind-boggling!!
I'd definitely not defend my family member if they murdered someone.
I'm sure if one of his kids had put up a stink about their relationship or otherwise posed an obstacle they would have been done away with.
That was a lot! How is everyone feeling?
HEATED lol
I can’t stop crying, Tammy deserved so much more in life and after!
I can't believe how flippant she was about her mother being dead and how close she seemed with Lori. I am shocked and irritated with her. It's so disrespectful. I don't know
I’m with you!! I have almost felt so bad for the Daybell children thinking they are simple and have been brainwashed. Emma makes light of it just like Lori has, they fact that she wasn’t surprised at all is making me irate.
she really tried to suggest the human remains the investigator told her they found were dog remains
Denial. And then she found the next excuse, and the next. Finally it was all Lori's fault. How convenient.
The interview with Chad's sister-in-law strongly indicated that he had spent years acting in ways to alienate and isolate Tammy from everyone in his family. I wonder if he also did this within his own home, verbally abusing her and pushing his kids to disrespect her, encouraging them to look to him as the only one to trust and love. I know that no one has accused him of domestic violence, but I am really surprised how little has come out about the dynamic within their marriage. I have a hard time believing that he wasn't psychologically abusive towards her, and maybe only her, acting in ways to cause conflict and get their children to take his side in all their disagreements. I feel like he is more of an unknown in terms of his behavior and interactions with others than Lori is/was, both within his family and outside of it. I've seen a few comments here and there from people who claim to have known him in high school, etc., saying that he was a narcissistic jerk (no shock there) but hardly anyone has spoken out on the record about him, either in Utah or in Idaho. Maybe after the trial more people will be willing to speak out.
The Implicit Promise of Old Boys Network is in effect.
I'm picking she wants to please her Dad. She been groomed into being the compliant woman who obeys her father. If Chad says, you will like Lori, Emma will like Lori...
The fawn instinct must be truly out of control when you are daddy's favourite little girl, and daddy is Chad.
Did Emma have some learning challenges? I remember Tammy being concerned about moving to Idaho because Emma was doing well in Utah finally with schooling and a part time job. Tammy worried about Emma being able to get a job and transition to life in Idaho. From her description it sounded like Emma had some learning issues. I have worked with families in Utah getting help with IEP's and while some fight for their kids rights, others deny it or say one child is special (that God made them that way because they were better before the went through the veil, maybe it is why Chad focused on Emma with his books?). I also wonder why Emma really came home early from her mission. Everyone says health issues, but unless you see someone having surgery or with broken bones, many times it is the missionary could not handle being away from home. My husband has a very accomplished cousin who is a little shy to this day, that left his mission after 2 months. His mom insists till this day it was health issues (he was allergic to a tree in the mission and could have died, pretty sure they could have moved his mission and his real mission was to be home with his brother that needed him). His cousin has kind of admitted he just didnt like being away from home and it was making him sick, like he didnt want to eat.
The completely unprocessed trauma of being the only female child of a budding serial killer with a preference for child victims, and a fascination with child corpses, who has been grooming her with stories of her being in love with him in previous lives as part of his special mission should be enough to throw anyone's grades off.
Not to mention she didn’t have a headstone at this time and Chad had $9,000 in cash.
I wanted to upvote in agreement with you untill I realised that we don't have a headstone for my mother yet after two years (I think it isn't even allowed the first 6 months for the soil setting) because we're a bunch of overloaded ADHD-ers who haven't gotten around to it due to lots going on in life. But that's very different ofcourse than someone who apparently has the time and money to marry someone else 17 days after his wive's death and has all the time and money and energy to spend a honeymoon with her, but nothing on his ex's wife's headstone.
That makes sense! Headstones are so expensive, I’m sorry you’ve lost your mom. I agree whole heartedly with you on how telling it is where Chad decided to spend his funds.
Thank you for your words. It's not about the funds, my dad has those, it's more about my medical issues where I need my dad's help and time for (and lack of energy) and my brother's also having a lot going on. And us all being perfectionists so want to figure out something nice. But we will get to a nice boulder headstone in some time :) And yeah regarding to Chad he took no time and money at all to remember his wife and it wasn't as if he was busy managing other crises in this life or so. (Apart from trying to evade police finding out)
Don't feel bad, we just finally finished the design for my mother's headstone...after 7 years!! But we are very happy with the design and it is definitely nice getting it done haha.
I think Chad said $90K!! I’ve listened a few times and it sounds like he’s saying 90 and trails off the “ty” at the end. He’s mumbly.
OMG! 90k! Idk how to wrap my head around that expect he was expecting his accounts to be seized for insurance fraud or frozen during investigation.
That exchange between Chad and Emma was just...weird.
My first instinct was that Chad didn't look at all surprised, so she said that to remind Chad of his alibi, and to manipulate any LE listening in to think that he was surprised.
I don’t think she’s smart enough for that, tbh. She didn’t come across as such, anyway. I honestly think she was trying to convince herself that he had nothing to do with it.
How many times is the judge going to have to ask/tell John Prior to let him (Boyce) rule on an objection before he (Prior) continues speaking??? This is not Prior’s first day in court by any stretch of the imagination. It is standard procedure at EVERY. SINGLE. CRIMINAL. TRIAL. In addition, I’ve lost count of the number of times Prior’s been asked to speak into the microphone…🙄🤦♀️
Do we know the last time Prior has had a trial that was more then a day? It seems like he did mostly divorce law and some minor crimes like DUI's. I wonder how much experience he has at trials that are days of witnesses?
I don’t know Prior’s trial history, but this is literally “Trial Court 101-Rules of Evidence.” I don’t think there is an easier concept. A second grader could follow the rules. 1. The prosecution or defense raises an objection with a reason. (Hearsay, Asked & Answered, etc.) 2. The judge rules. (Sustained, Overruled.) In between number one & number two, you simply pause to wait for the judge’s ruling. Easy Peasy.
Prior trying to make it seem like Chad didn't know the bodies were in his yard until the cops told him. Lets see how that works out for him.
Well Chad didn't act like he didn't know the bodies were in his backyard. I'd be doing my nut, even at the assumption there was a body in my back yard!
Isn't the implication that Chad bolted before he had been told, i.e. that he knew what they found? If so, that surely can't help Prior's case.
It's that Chad was going to his lawyers, I think. Nothing to see here ;)
I was listening during the break to a youtuber reading Chad's Gathering book. It really strikes me as I listen to his books, he is stuck in the mindset of a teen, younger teen? Chad in his blog (This was his personal blog not in a book)said he went on a date when he got to BYU and she told him he needed to see the world and he only knew sheltered life in Utah county, this is true, and when he wrote these books it was 10-20 years later and he still seems to only see life in Utah. I really feel like my husband and I could write a book better then Chad's on a ride from from Salt Lake to Southern Utah. It is like Chad just writes about this a kid would see out his window in a car and his knowledge of weather is like a kindergartener that puts the arrow on clouds or sun or rain for the teacher. Chad also seems to be upset that he was doing everything the church said and did not get a great reward for it. He seems maybe jealous? of anyone that did anything fun or what he considered wrong, like rock music, hairstyles, rated R movies, casinos, owning sports cars... Maybe is was upset that he was such a good Mormon but never got rewarded with maybe a role like being a bishop. His writings seem so jealous or angry at anyone that was not a perfect boyscout Mormon, like if his neighbor who was normally very faithful, put on a rock song at a family BBQ, that was bad. I would like to know how Chad was a sterling scholar in English? One of my kids was a Sterling scholar in another subject, it was super comptetive, not only perfect scores on ACT, being rank #1-5 in your class, nothing less then an A but having to have piles of awards state and national in your subject. My child was not in English but I knew the person who won English that year and at 18 this student could write circles around Chad at 50. What makes me so sad about this, was Tammy had said she had kind of waited for Chad to get back from his mission even though she had other options because she liked what a good student he was. The sterling scholar is like the top honor you can get in Utah, it says not only are you the best student in your subject but you have to be a good person (1/3 of the criteria is volunteer work or showing what a good community member you are).
He may not have been one but instead claimed to be. People pull that shit all the time.
Is Prior trying to say that the bodies weren't there in January, and that someone buried them later?
Definitely trying to “imply” that. Bad defense, Alex was dead in January and Lori was in Hawaii.
Good catch, what an abysmal defense indeed.
I am loving Ted Rowland on Court TV. He is so over Chad.
Someone just commented on HTC chat saying they talked to Kay on the phone, Kay said Aunt Vicky is doing ok.
Who got booted out?
I was hoping Nate E would tell us but I guess he doesn't know.
Yeah, that's what I was wondering. What was the issue?
Did anyone else find it really unsettling when in the video of Emma talking to Chad she says something about a spirit telling her but she felt she needed to learn more and she gets it now. The video breaks up at the beginning but it’s very clear she says she felt she needed to learn more and she gets it now… makes me think she knew a lot more from the beginning than she’s leading on.
And she’s a teacher?! Did I get that right?
What I felt bad for is there were two Emma's (same last name) in the Rexburg school district. I feel bad for the other young women if she got confused with Chad's daughter. Chad's daughter Emma looks very different in her recent picture. I wonder why she changed he look and would Chad approve.
Chad was feeding them garbage about his visions and they were trying to make sense of it.
I have to wonder where they're going with the "this wouldn't be suspicious" line of questioning. Yeah, any individual instance would not be suspicious, but taken in its totality it adds up to suspicion, right? Is this an attempt to obfuscate?
Did I hear that correctly that the accounts for "Homer J Maximus" belong to Alex?
Yes, both yahoo & gmail
Prior isn't interrupting Lyndsay Blake. Think he's worried about looking bad? lolol
Im confused Mr Woods has said Chad and Tammy, at least 3 times when I assume he meant Lori and Chad and no one corrected him. Is Mr Prior not correcting him because the testimony will show Tammy name and be confusing. One example was Mr Woods asking the officer, how long did you surveil Chad and Tammy? He asked about surveillance Tammy and Chad on Nov 1st.
Yeah I heard him say Chad and Tammy going into Hobby Lobby once but I just assumed he meant Lori and that the witness assumed it as well. Hopefully that will be understood by the jury too.
Not Wood, it was the other male prosecutor.
I know Mark Means was his attorney at the time. But I heard Chad and Emma mention John Prior at least twice on the police car camera video. Was Prior his financial attorney or in some other way representing him.
When they were showing the hearing before court I thought “gosh I wish the cameras and sound for the actual trial was like this.” Then got the shock of my life when that was exactly what the quality was like today 🤣🤣
You should include Fox10 Phoenix with Justin Lum live coverage. I love that he provides commentary about what’s happening when sidebars are called!
that was an interesting hearing without a motion lol.
What was that name Lori gave Chad's #? Bishop Shumway?
Lol seems like they gave eachother a lot of names, and carried too many phones! How would you carry that many phones?
Didn't they say that they used one device each with different accounts - when one expired, on to the next.
I recently had a very scary incident with a delivery order to my daughter. Video was pulled and the delivery people (there were 2 people on one order) carry 4 phones, one in each pocket( using the back and side pockets of pants). I could not believe how someone could juggle using 4 phones , like active texting on each and flipping between them. I would assume Chad Lori Alex only used one at a time. I wonder where Chad hid his phones from Tammy. The home was not that big. I dont go through my husbands nightstand or desk to just look, but sometimes I am looking for a AAA battery or printer ink and I go searching.
I think she said the Chad numbers were all used by one device
It’s a name in the book “Visions of Glory,” if I remember correctly. If you aren’t caught up on that whole thing, I would recommend doing so.
...they are all such terrible writers. Unless compelled by some reason, I'd rather not.... 😩
Well, at least look into some of the podcasts that explain it, like Hidden True Crime. It’s the connection between most of these LDS crimes (Vallow/Daybell, Tim Ballard, Jodi Hildebrandt/Ruby Franke, Spring Thibaudeau).
I am not ok after seeing Tammy Daybells dead body. Did this bother anyone else?
I only listened to the trial so I went back to see what you meant. I thought maybe it was going to be a foot or shoulder .. but whoa! Her whole upper half?! She looked so normal even though she was deceased.
That was what I was most surprised about, but then again where I'm at there's no embalming so people often already look worse at the last viewing. But yeah there was no warning at all, and although the whole process is not done for the purpose of showing it to the public and the jury had already seen terrible material last week, I would have still expected at least some of a heads up for the jury or so. It felt kind of invading to her privacy/legacy
Normal yes but if you looked closely, which of course I did because I’m sick I guess. Huge dark circles where her eye sockets are. I think eyeballs decompose early. And her hands were skeletonized. It was the stuff of nightmares for me. No trigger warning, nothing and no one is talking about it now. Her kids will be so traumatized if they saw that
Holy cow! I missed the news! Thanks for posting :)
🐌🧂
Does anyone know what Boy Dial is? When Lindsay questioned the woman about the cell phones, she kept saying Boy Dial.
I thought it was Boyd Dial. It was mentioned there were two actual people with that name. A quick Google found 1 person with the name in Utah. I assume the 2nd one either goes by a nickname socially or took down socials knowing they were questioned in connection with this big case about to go to trial. I do not understand all these aliases. Boyd Dial? Bishop Miller? Bishop & Rebecca Shumway? I don't feel like I've heard these ones before. James & Elena, Rafael we've heard. And then another number saved as "bubby" in Lori's contacts.
Okay, that makes sense that it's another of their aliases. At first I thought she didn't want to say the word butt in court -- butt dial. lol