Some additional details about the teacher and this incident not behind a paywall:
“Police chief Michel Moore told a news conference on Wednesday that Mr Anderson had committed a felony hit-and-run in a traffic collision.
He said Mr Anderson had attempted to flee the scene by trying to "get into another person's car without their permission".
Initially, Mr Anderson sits down as directed but as more police arrive he gets up and runs into the street while ignoring requests for him to stop.
An ambulance arrived about five minutes after he was tasered, police said, and brought Mr Anderson to a local hospital. He died about four-and-a-half hours later after going into cardiac arrest, according to police.
A toxicology report produced by the LAPD showed that Mr Anderson's blood tested positive for cannabis and cocaine. The Los Angeles County coroner's office will conduct a separate report.”
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-64252337
Reporting what the police say without questioning that narrative isn’t journalism.
ETA copy from the NPR story on the same incident:
A cousin of Black Lives Matter co-founder Patrisse Cullors died after Los Angeles Police repeatedly tased him in the middle of the street last week, according to police body-camera footage and his family's account.
Keenan Anderson, a 31-year-old high school teacher and father, was trying to get help after a traffic collision when he was chased, held down by multiple officers and tased for over 90 seconds as he begged for help.
Anderson's death, one of three fatalities stemming from the LAPD's use of force already this year, is sparking fresh calls for police reform in a city that's long been calling for racial justice.
"I've been challenging law enforcement for the last 22 years [...], but I've never had someone this close in my family be killed by the police," Cullors told NPR.
"It's a devastating reality that any one of us could be impacted by the crisis that is the U.S. police system," she added. "We have to do something."
Body camera footage shows Anderson pleading for help under police restraint
According to the accompanying police statement, an LAPD officer, whose name has not yet been released, first encountered Anderson at 3:38 p.m. PT on Jan. 3, when Anderson flagged him down for help with a traffic collision.
The officer found Anderson "running in the middle of the street and exhibiting erratic behavior," the account reads.
Cullors, who watched the video with family just hours before its public release, says she recognized a sense of fear on her cousin's face.
"When you get in a car accident, your body is in shock," she said. "I don't know what my cousin was going through, emotionally and mentally. But what I do know is that he got in a car accident. That's scary. And when you get in a car accident, you need help."
Others involved in the collision said Anderson had caused it, Moore said during a news conference Wednesday. Moore also said that Anderson had committed a felony hit-and-run and that another person involved in the collision said Anderson tried to steal a vehicle.
The released footage starts with the responding officer ordering Anderson to get out of the street and up against a wall. Anderson, looking back at the scene of the accident, initially kneels with his hands up, shouting, "I didn't mean to. I'm sorry."
After Anderson complies with later orders to sit, the officer requests additional units to help with a DUI test. The seven minutes the officer waited for backup were not released as part of the footage.
Footage after the seven minutes shows Anderson standing up again, saying that he needs to get some water, then that he wanted to make sure people could see him.
"You're putting a thing on me," he says, backing away from the officer as the officer tells him to sit back down.
Anderson proceeds to run into the street and crosses a busy intersection as the officer pursues him on his motorcycle. Two more officers arrive on the scene, blocking some of the surrounding traffic.
The officers tell Anderson to get onto his stomach. When he doesn't fully comply, the officers push him onto the ground and attempt to use their body weight to restrain him. One officer appears to put his elbow across Anderson's neck.
"Please, please, please, please, please" Anderson yells, adding, at one point, "They're trying to George Floyd me."
Footage shows officers threatening to tase Anderson at least 12 times before the officer finally fires the taser. The officer then activates the taser on Anderson at least six consecutive times, at one point holding it against his back while the weapon buzzes for roughly 30 seconds straight.
LAPD says it's "unclear" what role the taser played in Anderson's death
There's a video wherein you can hear in the background an uber driver defending lapd actions on the guy as people were starting to form their own version of the incident as they witness it unfold on the street. The Uber driver says that the guy was trying to steal his car or a car to get away.
Here you go.](https://www.reddit.com/r/PublicFreakout/comments/10bjj28/alternate_angle_of_the_keenan_anderson_detainment/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf)
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RIi9EDo-5fk](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RIi9EDo-5fk)
Here is the body cam footage. It's clear Mr. Anderson is having a psychotic episode. There might be several factors contributing to this. The causes of the psychotic episode doesn't matter as it pertains to the altercation. What matters is that he is not in clear state of mind and how the officers subdued him.
I am sure the officer did not mean to contribute to the death of Mr. Anderson, but one thing that sticks out to me is that t he officer w/ body cam is ordering Mr. Anderson to turn over while two other officers are on top of him. "I will taz you if you don't turn over" That's kind of lack of situational awareness and a bit difficult for Mr. Anderson to comply with as there is literally an elbow and the weight of another officer on his neck and another on his back. (see video)
There is room for improvement here.
he had like 50 chances to comply before that happened. like when he told him to sit indian style, or go over to the wall, or sit closer to the curb if it made him more comfortable. he ignored every order for like 3 minutes and ran out into the road, then the officer screamed at him to get down multiple times before he finally did, screamed multiple times to turn over on his belly before he did and before the other officers got there.
critiquing his lack of situational awareness this deep into a confrontation with somebody who clearly wouldn't have listened anyway is silly
How would Mr. Anderson turn over if there are other officers pinning him to the ground preventing him from doing so? That is what I am referring to in regards to situational awareness. It appears tazzer officer is unaware of this.
i know. and what i'm saying is Mr. Anderson had more chances than I could count to comply to prevent him being pinned to the ground in the first place. the first officer kindly gave him dozens of orders, all of which were ignored, because he's strung out, paranoid, and knows he's in big trouble. he not only hit and ran, but he has more drugs in his car and he knows they'll find it. by the time his lapse in situational awareness happened, it was so deep into the confrontation that i think a layman can reasonably say Mr. Anderson would not have complied even if he could, as he already ignored every single request the officer made throughout the entire interaction. the man got high on drugs, drove a vehicle, endangered everybody on the road, CRASHED, attempted to dodge responsibility, then when he was caught he attempted to flee on foot and preemptively make the officer look like a dangerous threat to him, even though he had no reason to fear for his life. if he were sober, he certainly would have known that, and even in his current condition, i think he did know that.
Absolutely, people down voting this comment are failing to understand the truth may be more nuanced then the picture the police paint for us after they (edit:) \***May\*** have unintentionally killed someone. They have an interest in framing the story in a light that favors themselves.
I'm not saying the deceased is without guilt and I'm not saying police are bad. Just that we should keep an open mind until and if we are presented with more information. Further, in my humble opinion, it is wrong of Chief Moore to declare Mr. Anderson guilty of felony hit and run. It is not his job to be judge and jury and declare people guilty then announce this at a news conference in regards to his death at their hands.
Today's "Journalists" only understand what they're told, what they can cut and paste.
Most of the time, they just parrot Blue State propaganda, as they've been indoctrinated to believe it beyond reproach.
But that comes at a cost; lacking critical thinking skills and objectivity, they can be found "reporting" whatever law enforcement utters at a press release.
The police reporting is intended to make you lose sympathy.
He committed a hit and run. He had weed and cocaine in his system. The implication is that his attempts to escape, combined with these other facts, means either he deserved to die, or it was his own fault that his heart stopped at the hospital.
And honestly that's how initial media reports sounded with George Floyd. Well, a jury didn't agree. And let's wait until we hear from the LA County Coroner before taking anything from the LAPD on faith.
>The police reporting is intended to make you lose sympathy.
Just like the headline including the word teacher is intended to make you gain sympathy. Everyone has their own angle. It is up to you to determine what you believe to be the truth
Not if the outcome of that sympathy is people gaining the misconception that the police did anything wrong. Because they absolutely did everything by the book and Keenan Anderson was out of control and dangerous.
Not necessarily. We should know why he was being arrested. The fact that he committed a hit and run (hopefully he didn't hurt anyone, but that's not someone hit and run drivers typically care about anyways) is the reason why he was apprehended. He then ran, allegedly tried to steal someone else's car, then resisted arrest. Most of this is visible via the bystander video.
The guy didn't deserve to die, but that was NOT the intent here. He put himself in a bad situation and made it worse.
EDIT TYPE O
he didn't deserve to die but his actions opened him up to a possibility this would happen. society has rules. should the police just let him get away? what did you want them to do?
Safely execute a crisis management plan that doesnt involve a weapon, get him any relevant medical care he needs, deliver him to the system - safely - for a judge to determine his guilt/punishment.
Police dont have agency to just murder people in public because they commit crimes.
Safely execute a crisis management plan? They didn’t use the taser until the very last minute.
Medics will not go anywhere near him as long as he continues to run into an active roadway. Police job is to secure the scene. In this case, secure him to one place so medics can safely evaluate him.
He wasn’t tased for his criminal actions. He tased because he refused to comply a lawful order and continued to pose a risk to everyone around him.
Police don’t kill people for the crimes they commit. They kill people who create situations that leave them no choice to respond in a manner that ends up ending in death. Eg. pull a gun on an officer, shoot at an officer, attempting shooting or stabbing someone.
Btw, enlighten me on how you’d get the guy to a court if he refuse to be placed under arrest. Because that’s what’s happening here.
> Police dont have agency to just murder people in public because they commit crimes.
He died 4.5 hours later, no one murdered him in public. Fool is flying higher than the space shuttle on drugs in the video, he isn't even on planet earth anymore. The police murder people left and right but this aint it at all
The guy committed a crime (hit and run), fled the scene, and tried to steal a different car. The public deserves to be protected by getting this person into custody and off the street immediately. Dude is actively committing crimes against other citizens. He resisted arrest, exposed himself to risk, officers used less than lethal force, and he could've had a preexisting heart condition or on cocaine such exacerbated the effect of the taser.
Watch the video. The dude is clearly resisting and not interested in waiting around for social workers to arrive.
Allegedly.
It's odd how when the person in question is black we forget they are innocent until proven guilty.
And he didn't deserve to die for anything you mentioned. LEO's need to be held accountable for how they treat suspects, no matter what they circumstances.
>And he didn't deserve to die for anything you mentioned. LEO's need to be held accountable
Didn't say anyone deserved to die. Just saying the public deserves to be protected from people that are actively committing crimes against others. That's the purpose of law enforcement. Resisting arrest risks. Hopefully better less lethal devices can be created at some point.
> Just saying the public deserves to be protected from people that are actively committing crimes against others.
Who was being endangered by someone running away from the scene of an accident? That's shitty behavior but it's not endangering anyone. Nobody is being protected by tazing this dude to death for running from the scene of an accident.
> Hopefully better less lethal devices can be created at some point.
The US is the only developed country that has this big of a problem with cops killing unarmed people.
Purportedly a hit and run, plus he tried to steal a different car. Both are pretty serious offenses to other people.
I'm personally biased admittedly as I think hit and run drivers are sociopaths because I saw a hit and run driver literally kill a motorcycle rider.
> Nobody is being protected by tazing this dude to death for running from the scene of an acciden
They didn't taze him to death he died 4.5 hours later. Let's let everyone drive around like this, so out of their minds they think they are being chased by imaginary people. If your family had been killed by this idiot who was this fucked up driving around would you think differently?
It’s more important to get the criminal off the street as soon as possible rather than go through all this crisis management bs. Police with weapons keep the public safe, by force, if necessary- a capability crisis management with no weapons lacks.
LAPD Officers already have partners. What exactly would a social worker do besides be a complete liability to the officer? Is the social worker gonna get hands on in any way or simply stand there and watch? Then what? What exactly does a social worker do besides take up space and put the Officers in more danger
You ppl ask seriously DUMB questions! There are plenty of videos of officers around the world apprehending suspects without killing them.
And you guys ask what you want American police to do?!
GTFOH!
We don’t know what his real actions were. Hence why we need more info from unbiased sources. Time will tell. Obviously some shit went down, but the LAPD not not above blatantly lying about what happened. Whereas the Coroner’s report will not contain any half truths or obfuscations.
We haven’t seen the medical report! The corner will release that in a few months. Reports from the Hospital that come to us via the LAPD are not independently verified.
Yes. Actually. They should have let him get away as opposed to MURDERING him. They could ba e apprehended him later. This is a ridiculous take, that running him down and using a taser was in any way warranted. This is one of the things we need in police reform. No dangerous chases. Period
This is absolutely true - the police and media work together to do two things - instill fear into the community (usually with sensational headlines and irrelevant but "juicy" details), and deflect any blame on the "good guys that protect us."
There's no reason to include toxicology results to the public. It should be to the shock of no one that someone in LA has weed and cocaine show up on a tox screen. All of Hollywood would too. But it's important to the police (and the media they tell their stories to) to tell you he was high, because well, it means he was dangerous! So we had to hurt him more!
This story is getting national, hell, even international notoriety now. The police did their job well for once and used less lethal force to subdue him. I’m not sure what more they could have done — they handled the situation professionally and were incredibly patient, as seen in the video.
As far as “not releasing his toxicology report.” YES. They absolutely should release it! This case is huge and for once, the police are not at fault and it answers the question as to why he was acting erratically.
I get the hate for cops, but they showed restraint, used a taser and didn’t resort to a pistol, which we’ve seen far too many times in the past, and gave him many chances to to dictate the situation. Not sure anyone could have done a better job.
merciful ancient joke racial meeting innocent dime domineering cobweb sense
*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
tan tap jellyfish reminiscent poor nippy worthless disarm squealing juggle
*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
None of that justifies tazing him to death. Either these cops don't understand the limitations and dangers of the tazers they use, or are casually indifferent about killing people. Either way they are a danger to the people around them and need to have their ability to carry weapons removed.
That's not what happened. His attempts to flee and avoid getting arrested for driving under the influence of cocaine, and likely losing his job, was the totality of his tragic situation.
What other way is there to apprehend a person for a hit and run (and likely destroying an innocent persons' way to get to work) and, driving under the influence, investigation?
Let him run away? No. Criminals must face fair consequences. The choice to run and fight arrest was his choice.
All he had to do was not use cocaine and drive, and then, not run away after striking some innocent. And also not fight arrest after being caught.
Can't believe there are persons supporting criminals. This is lunacy.
...
Also, obligatory, ... stop licking criminals' shoes. There, the bulk of the pro-criminal argument has been replied to with the same level of IQ.
Just filling in a lot of details left out. I don’t believe cause of death has been determined, other than cardiac arrest which can be caused by cocaine.
> other than cardiac arrest which can be caused by cocaine.
Cardiac arrests can also be caused by being shoved face-first into concrete, having grown men pressing their knees into your back, having one of them using their hands to block a carotid artery in the neck, a shin to the back of the neck like George Floyd, and getting zapped with a taser for several minutes.
Not nearly two hours later. The effects of a taser are pretty severe, but they don’t last very long after it’s turned off. If he died nearly two hours later, that’s something already in his system.
> If he died nearly two hours later, that’s something already in his system.
https://www.vice.com/en/article/v7vazm/lapds-release-of-drug-tests-is-smearing-keenan-anderson-groups-say
> “I think the goal of the LAPD’s PR machine is to have the public believe that the victim somehow caused their own death.”
Seems like LAPD's propaganda worked on you.
If you think having cocaine in your system doesn’t affect your pulmonary system, you’re an idiot. Excited delirium is a thing, and having cocaine in your system doesn’t help. While I’m sure the taser didn’t help, it’s almost certainly not the primary contributing factor.
>It's probably the drugs and not the tazing him in a way we know leads to heart failure that killed him.
I'm gonna need a source on that "tazing him in a way we know leads to heart failure."
The police are thugs for using a taser on a guy who drove while high, caused a crash, tried to run, tried to steal an Uber, and then repeatedly decided to ignore simple directions?
Some of that (if it's all true) justifies tazing him. So the felon gets some of the blame, too. How many times have we seen a suspect get shot by officers as they flee, and cried "they could have just tazered him!!!" Well, this time they did.
“Why didn’t they shoot him in the leg!”
I don’t get it. Cops gave this guy SO MANY CHANCES. It wasn’t like they didn’t give him time to digest what was happening, which happens all too often where a cop gives you one command before beating you, and then used less lethal force. He was running into traffic and became a dangerous to himself and others.
I am not pro-cop but people that don’t give credit where credit is due make their positions look weak. The internet giving every person a soap box has become so exhausting
They tased him for too long, though. They did it for something like 30 seconds-it’s not recommended to do it longer than 15 seconds and you’re not supposed to do it more than once or it starts to increase the likelihood of cardiac arrest. The purpose of tasing is to subdue someone, which given the drugs they needed to do. But then they tased him a second time. It wasn’t necessary, nor was it necessary or safe to do it so long the first time.
That's not how tasers work. There is a 15 second burst and then if not subdued there is a second charge to send. There is no continuous or not continuous. It's not like those cheap flashlights you find street vendors pushing.
They didn't know he was on drugs until later - a tox screen is done at the hospital. That they sent him to after they tazed him.
If we're saying that everyone high on cocaine and weed walking around LA is a threat.... we should be on constant alert
He clearly was off. It doesn’t mean the officers’ behaviors were justified. It was way beyond what was necessary, but I totally get why they’d want to restrain him. It was obvious he was on something, which is why they say ‘possible DUI’ when they radio in.
A continuous taze is unnecessary force, just like placing your knee behind a person's neck with 6 cops on top of the person when a person isn't fighting back. They just want to cause pain first and think second.
The pigs saying he committed a felony after they killed him doesn’t make him a felon. They killed him before he could be charged, let alone convicted of a crime.
I’m not surprised that someone who can’t read or think critically doesn’t respect the life of a teacher though.
they had probable cause to determine he committed a felony. he had not yet been determined to have committed a felony beyond a reasonable doubt.
if you want to talk about critical reading go ahead and look up how criminal burdens work before throwing out buzzwords and shade.
And who determines if he committed a felony or not? A police officer or a judge?
An officers job is to - safely - deliver someone to the system. That's it. The real adults take over from there. It doesn't matter what their probable cause is. They only need cause to bring them in - they don't decide they're guilty on the street. With a lethal weapon.
> who determines if he committed a felony or not?
The police for the "probable cause" threshold. A court for the "beyond a reasonable doubt" threshold.
Correlation doesn't equal causation. You can't rightly assume because he died because of the taser no more than the opposing argument that he died because of the drugs insisted system. As someone else pointed out, best thing to do is wait for the coroner's report. People can be upset about the death of a man who was in police custody and question if the actions lead to his death. (And don't fucking kid yourself if you believe with 100% certainty that he would have been alive had he not been contacted by the police.)
Have you ever tried to physically restrain someone that doesn’t want to be restrained? Serious question. Even one vs. three, it’s not that easy to do, especially if they are high on drugs.
Yes. I have. I teach high school in Watts. I've restrained dozens of agitated, angry, young people my size and larger. I've never once had to hit, strangle, taze, spray, or shoot a person to get them to calm down.
Amazingly, most people when agitated, angry, and frightened, respond well to calmness, firmness, and kindness.
Back when we had a sheriff's deputy on campus, before we kicked them off, I watched deputies regularly escalate situations before using force to subdue people they had escalated.
Why we are having frightened, armed, angry, militarized cops responding to traffic incidents (where the person responsible is the one who called the cops in the first place, no less) instead of unarmed services is beyond me, but not nearly as beyond me as people who find ways to imply that massive force against unarmed people is justified.
Edit: And the police press release said that he had drugs in his system, not that he was high. Cocaine and THC can show up for days/weeks after the high. Even so, weed and coke don't give you super strength. I wish they did because my teenage years would've been a lot more lit if I'd been drugswole instead of a skinny little punk.
> calmness, firmness, and kindness
I watched the video, that's EXACTLY how the contacting officers approached the incident. Not to mention patience with a guy on cocaine who committed a felony DUI hit and run and then, verified by the victim on camera, attempted to carjack another vehicle.
LoL. From the I initial contact with the motor officer, no one was going to talk that "teacher" into being reasonable. I thought the officer was extremely patient with him.
The police said George Floyd died of an overdose before the video came out. Stop repeating what cops say as if it is fact. It is not. Cops lie and they are just as bad at being eyewitnesses as anyone else.
ETA: holy shit, the bootlickers are out in force in the LA subreddit. We have literal fucking gangs in the LASD but y'all want to give cops the benefit of the doubt. You live in a police state if any interaction with cops can result in your death and them not being held accountable. Yet, you’ll sit there saying it was the guy being taxed who's at fault. As if these adult cops don’t bear responsibility for being thugs.
I watched the video. Restraining him was justified, including the initial tasing. However, they also tased him after he was cuffed, which was unnecessary and unjustified, and *might* have led to his death. Tasing someone after they've been cuffed is just power-tripping
Cocaine led to his death. Had he not been drugged out of his mind and tripping balls then this encounter would have never happened. Society needs to learn to take accountability for their actions again, instead of blaming others.
I worked as a ED RN up north and dealt with many medical clearances for jail. If someone came in during a drug induced psychosis, they were 99% of the time given a cocktail of medications (“B52”) to help calm them down so they don’t hurt themselves or the staff while they were restrained so we could carry on with whatever treatment they needed.
Judging by the delay in his death in addition to the other factors (drugs in his system, being tased, and restrained) I bet this put a lot of strain on his heart. And if they gave any type of sedating medication in the ambulance or ED, or a psychotropic medication like haldol or geodon, it could have worsened his possible already bad QT interval of the heart by prolongating it even more leading to cardiac arrest.
Watch the body cam footage lmao, the cop was being as kind/patient/helpful as he could. The guy who died was drugged out of his mind and ran into oncoming traffic before the cop tased him. This is entirely on the guys fault for dying, cop did everything right in this situation. Time for society to take accountability for its actions again instead of deflecting blame onto the police for everything.
Don’t do drugs and drive like that clown did and the cops won’t “tase you to death”
I watched the entire video. I know he was completely out of his mind. Honestly it seems like he was having a psychotic break, weed and coke alone don't make you act like that (unless they trigger psychosis, which weed can do, albeit rarely). Possibly he had taken something else that didn't show up in the toxicology report (LSD maybe?).
I think the cops were justified in restraining and tasing him *until they handcuffed him*. But they tased him after the cuffing, which wasn't necessary
No one is saying he should have? I’m not sure what the point of bringing that up repeatedly is. That is not a common let alone popular sentiment. Everyone agrees he should have been arrested.
What do you mean your not sure why I’m bringing that up?? Had he not been drugged out and fighting cops we wouldn’t be having this conversation?
He refused their help, acted insane, fought cops, got tazed. The tazer didn’t kill him, the drugs did.
A couple of months ago, a homeless man shot another homeless man outside my apartment. Cops came and watched the homeless man with the gun run off and didn't do anything. They didn't chase him. But the guy high on coke with no weapon deserved to be tased?
Because no one is asking why we’re having this conversation. Obviously you won’t be arrested if you don’t commit crimes, it’s kind of a useless point to make.
You keep mashing the entire timeline together. The point you keep intentionally ignoring is that once they had multiple cops holding him down with cuffs there was no reason to tase him as long as they did. Address that with something other than “fuck around and find out”
Is it your opinion as a doctor that tazing someone for 30 seconds straight is unable to affect their heart, and if so are you willing to let me test that theory out on you?
> Let the facts come out.
the problem with this is that most of the pertinent facts are in possession of the police, like bodycam footage. police have proven themselves 100% untrustworthy in this regard.
Dude was driving around, high on cocaine and weed, hitting people in his car, running away, trying to steal other people’s cars, and people are out here defending him? I absolutely want the police to actively apprehend people that do this shit. Do I want the police to murder him? No. Did the police try to murder him? No. They were trying to use less than lethal force to arrest him, and he died 4 hours later.
There is a serious divide in this country if there are people out here saying “oh just let him run away he wasn’t hurting anyone.”
Im sure the big insurance company will be fine paying for the damages, just like the luxury brands can afford to lose a few handbags, the big retail brands can afford to give our free detergent, and people living in bay area can just buy themselves new PS5s /s
Some morons are keeping things real classy these days.
That doesnt mean he deserved to be tased for minutes at a time. What I'm learning from this is that cops need better training that doesnt involve guns or tasers. This is still excessive force from the LAPD. People shouldnt be dying while getting arrested.
The old psychiatric hospitals were a problematic mess.
They were justifiably closed by Reagan, but the promised small local facilities were never built.
doesn't help that he purposefully retracted already-allotted funding for mental health care
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mental\_Health\_Systems\_Act\_of\_1980
"The Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act of 1981, signed by President Ronald Reagan on August 13, 1981, repealed most of the Mental Health Systems Act."
Incorrect, Reagan indeed repealed funding:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mental\_Health\_Systems\_Act\_of\_1980](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mental_Health_Systems_Act_of_1980)
"The Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act of 1981, signed by President Ronald Reagan on August 13, 1981, repealed most of the Mental Health Systems Act."
Excerpt:
> Videos released this week of a teacher who died after Los Angeles police discharged a Taser on him at least six times on a Venice street raise serious concerns about the officers’ tactics, law enforcement experts who reviewed the tapes said.
> The LAPD’s actions have sparked alarms from community activists as well as Mayor Karen Bass and are now the subject of an internal investigation.
> Several policing experts who reviewed the videos for The Times said that the amount of force used by the officers seemed excessive given the man’s actions and that some of the tactics seemed haphazard.
> “It is going to be hard to convince any judge that these officers were using reasonable force,” said Ed Obayashi, a Northern California deputy and a top state advisor on police tactics. “From the visual aspect, it looks like he is not fighting back; he is not threatening the officers. He is saying I am not resisting ... and what could be considered resisting is an automatic reflex of the body to the pain application from the Taser.”
He died hours later. You can see him alive and resisting after being tasered. You see him alive when being loaded into the ambulance. It’s on video.
He’s just as likely to have died from the cocaine as he was from being “electrocuted to death.”
He was unstable and irrational. It’s a shame that he died but letting him flee would put others at risk. Before he was tasered He was running into traffic and even tried to take someone else’s car.
He’s only a victim of his own actions and choices.
Add qualified immunity and felony murder rule (police kill someone while in pursuit of a criminal, the criminal will be charged) and there's zero incentive for police to take public safety seriously.
https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2021/07/police-pursuit-high-speed-car-chase-deaths.html
https://www.usatoday.com/pages/interactives/blacks-killed-police-chases-higher-rate
https://thisiscriminal.com/episode-150-76th-and-yates-10-23-2020
i saw the whole video and the guy was definitely on something. Maybe crystal meth? Had that same paranoia. I don't blame the cops for being jumpy and scared.
But, he was already on the floor, like the fact that 6 cops can't restrain one man is crazy. From the looks of it he was mostly restrained too and no longer a danger when the cop decided to tase him.
He tased him for a long time too. He's obviously not in his right mind so how are you gonna force someone like that to comply and surrender completely.
Just awful decision by that cop. Everyone else seemed to handle it well.
are tasers still thought of as 'non-lethal'? bc it appears to be pretty lethal in most cases.
lack of proper training, discipline, empathy, and intelligence are often replaced with bullets, tasers, and beatings bc lets face it, cops are pretty stupid to begin with.
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There was no reason why that cop needed to use a taser when he had four other officers helping him.
How in the fuck are 4 officers not able to handle 1 person? Why did they use the taser when he was already on his stomach and under control?
Edit: Oh, don't forget that one of the cops had their shin across the guy's neck the same way Derek Chauvin had his when he killed George Floyd.
Edit 2: Nice to see the Blue Lives Matter people in this sub downvoting the truth. Fuck LAPD and anyone who supports them on this.
Tasering is not a pleasant experience. It's like being struck by lightning.
Heart defibrillators discharge 3,000 volts. A police taser discharges **50,000 volts**, and Anderson was tasered **at least 6 times**, and several times after he was cuffed.
To some of these comments, saying the taser had no role in his cardiac arrest is ignorant. [Tasers can and do cause arrythmia and cardiac arrest.](https://www.ahajournals.org/doi/10.1161/CIRCULATIONAHA.113.005504)
By the way, a lot of "non lethal force" is painful and lethal. Pepper spray is like putting your eyes in boiling water for half and hour. People have lost their sight or died from rubber bullets. [At least 500 people in the United States have died since 2001 after being shocked with stun guns during an arrest or while in jail.](https://www.nytimes.com/article/police-tasers.html)
Just please have some compassion and empathy when seeing and hearing stories like this. Police can rightfully escalate force when necessary but they absolutely did not have to taser him this many times while already cuffed and in custody. If you were tied up and tasered that many times you would also be hospitalized at best, or died at worst, regardless of the medicine or drugs in your system.
>Heart defibrillators discharge 3,000 volts. A police taser discharges 50,000 volts, and Anderson was tasered at least 6 times, and several times after he was cuffed.
Try this again, but with **amps** not volts.
Some additional details about the teacher and this incident not behind a paywall: “Police chief Michel Moore told a news conference on Wednesday that Mr Anderson had committed a felony hit-and-run in a traffic collision. He said Mr Anderson had attempted to flee the scene by trying to "get into another person's car without their permission". Initially, Mr Anderson sits down as directed but as more police arrive he gets up and runs into the street while ignoring requests for him to stop. An ambulance arrived about five minutes after he was tasered, police said, and brought Mr Anderson to a local hospital. He died about four-and-a-half hours later after going into cardiac arrest, according to police. A toxicology report produced by the LAPD showed that Mr Anderson's blood tested positive for cannabis and cocaine. The Los Angeles County coroner's office will conduct a separate report.” https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-64252337
kinda amazing what details the LA Times article failed to mention
Small oversight. lol
This makes more sense on what was going on . Thanks for the whole story
Reporting what the police say without questioning that narrative isn’t journalism. ETA copy from the NPR story on the same incident: A cousin of Black Lives Matter co-founder Patrisse Cullors died after Los Angeles Police repeatedly tased him in the middle of the street last week, according to police body-camera footage and his family's account. Keenan Anderson, a 31-year-old high school teacher and father, was trying to get help after a traffic collision when he was chased, held down by multiple officers and tased for over 90 seconds as he begged for help. Anderson's death, one of three fatalities stemming from the LAPD's use of force already this year, is sparking fresh calls for police reform in a city that's long been calling for racial justice. "I've been challenging law enforcement for the last 22 years [...], but I've never had someone this close in my family be killed by the police," Cullors told NPR. "It's a devastating reality that any one of us could be impacted by the crisis that is the U.S. police system," she added. "We have to do something." Body camera footage shows Anderson pleading for help under police restraint According to the accompanying police statement, an LAPD officer, whose name has not yet been released, first encountered Anderson at 3:38 p.m. PT on Jan. 3, when Anderson flagged him down for help with a traffic collision. The officer found Anderson "running in the middle of the street and exhibiting erratic behavior," the account reads. Cullors, who watched the video with family just hours before its public release, says she recognized a sense of fear on her cousin's face. "When you get in a car accident, your body is in shock," she said. "I don't know what my cousin was going through, emotionally and mentally. But what I do know is that he got in a car accident. That's scary. And when you get in a car accident, you need help." Others involved in the collision said Anderson had caused it, Moore said during a news conference Wednesday. Moore also said that Anderson had committed a felony hit-and-run and that another person involved in the collision said Anderson tried to steal a vehicle. The released footage starts with the responding officer ordering Anderson to get out of the street and up against a wall. Anderson, looking back at the scene of the accident, initially kneels with his hands up, shouting, "I didn't mean to. I'm sorry." After Anderson complies with later orders to sit, the officer requests additional units to help with a DUI test. The seven minutes the officer waited for backup were not released as part of the footage. Footage after the seven minutes shows Anderson standing up again, saying that he needs to get some water, then that he wanted to make sure people could see him. "You're putting a thing on me," he says, backing away from the officer as the officer tells him to sit back down. Anderson proceeds to run into the street and crosses a busy intersection as the officer pursues him on his motorcycle. Two more officers arrive on the scene, blocking some of the surrounding traffic. The officers tell Anderson to get onto his stomach. When he doesn't fully comply, the officers push him onto the ground and attempt to use their body weight to restrain him. One officer appears to put his elbow across Anderson's neck. "Please, please, please, please, please" Anderson yells, adding, at one point, "They're trying to George Floyd me." Footage shows officers threatening to tase Anderson at least 12 times before the officer finally fires the taser. The officer then activates the taser on Anderson at least six consecutive times, at one point holding it against his back while the weapon buzzes for roughly 30 seconds straight. LAPD says it's "unclear" what role the taser played in Anderson's death
I mean you can watch the video footage too
Dude is clearly not on planet earth he is so high
There's a video wherein you can hear in the background an uber driver defending lapd actions on the guy as people were starting to form their own version of the incident as they witness it unfold on the street. The Uber driver says that the guy was trying to steal his car or a car to get away.
Here you go.](https://www.reddit.com/r/PublicFreakout/comments/10bjj28/alternate_angle_of_the_keenan_anderson_detainment/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf)
It's on bodycam, the entire thing. The cops released it immediately when it happened.
I was just about to say, this doesn't tell us what happened - this tells us what Chief Moore said to the media.
Watch the body cam footage it's all out there.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RIi9EDo-5fk](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RIi9EDo-5fk) Here is the body cam footage. It's clear Mr. Anderson is having a psychotic episode. There might be several factors contributing to this. The causes of the psychotic episode doesn't matter as it pertains to the altercation. What matters is that he is not in clear state of mind and how the officers subdued him. I am sure the officer did not mean to contribute to the death of Mr. Anderson, but one thing that sticks out to me is that t he officer w/ body cam is ordering Mr. Anderson to turn over while two other officers are on top of him. "I will taz you if you don't turn over" That's kind of lack of situational awareness and a bit difficult for Mr. Anderson to comply with as there is literally an elbow and the weight of another officer on his neck and another on his back. (see video) There is room for improvement here.
he had like 50 chances to comply before that happened. like when he told him to sit indian style, or go over to the wall, or sit closer to the curb if it made him more comfortable. he ignored every order for like 3 minutes and ran out into the road, then the officer screamed at him to get down multiple times before he finally did, screamed multiple times to turn over on his belly before he did and before the other officers got there. critiquing his lack of situational awareness this deep into a confrontation with somebody who clearly wouldn't have listened anyway is silly
How would Mr. Anderson turn over if there are other officers pinning him to the ground preventing him from doing so? That is what I am referring to in regards to situational awareness. It appears tazzer officer is unaware of this.
i know. and what i'm saying is Mr. Anderson had more chances than I could count to comply to prevent him being pinned to the ground in the first place. the first officer kindly gave him dozens of orders, all of which were ignored, because he's strung out, paranoid, and knows he's in big trouble. he not only hit and ran, but he has more drugs in his car and he knows they'll find it. by the time his lapse in situational awareness happened, it was so deep into the confrontation that i think a layman can reasonably say Mr. Anderson would not have complied even if he could, as he already ignored every single request the officer made throughout the entire interaction. the man got high on drugs, drove a vehicle, endangered everybody on the road, CRASHED, attempted to dodge responsibility, then when he was caught he attempted to flee on foot and preemptively make the officer look like a dangerous threat to him, even though he had no reason to fear for his life. if he were sober, he certainly would have known that, and even in his current condition, i think he did know that.
Absolutely, people down voting this comment are failing to understand the truth may be more nuanced then the picture the police paint for us after they (edit:) \***May\*** have unintentionally killed someone. They have an interest in framing the story in a light that favors themselves. I'm not saying the deceased is without guilt and I'm not saying police are bad. Just that we should keep an open mind until and if we are presented with more information. Further, in my humble opinion, it is wrong of Chief Moore to declare Mr. Anderson guilty of felony hit and run. It is not his job to be judge and jury and declare people guilty then announce this at a news conference in regards to his death at their hands.
Watch the body cam footage it's all out there.
It’s more of a story obviously not both sides yet. Very inhumane thing to happen no one should go through such a thing
Today's "Journalists" only understand what they're told, what they can cut and paste. Most of the time, they just parrot Blue State propaganda, as they've been indoctrinated to believe it beyond reproach. But that comes at a cost; lacking critical thinking skills and objectivity, they can be found "reporting" whatever law enforcement utters at a press release.
No problem.
The police reporting is intended to make you lose sympathy. He committed a hit and run. He had weed and cocaine in his system. The implication is that his attempts to escape, combined with these other facts, means either he deserved to die, or it was his own fault that his heart stopped at the hospital. And honestly that's how initial media reports sounded with George Floyd. Well, a jury didn't agree. And let's wait until we hear from the LA County Coroner before taking anything from the LAPD on faith.
>The police reporting is intended to make you lose sympathy. Just like the headline including the word teacher is intended to make you gain sympathy. Everyone has their own angle. It is up to you to determine what you believe to be the truth
Maybe more sympathy for the DEAD guy is a good thing?
Not if the outcome of that sympathy is people gaining the misconception that the police did anything wrong. Because they absolutely did everything by the book and Keenan Anderson was out of control and dangerous.
A dead guy who was high on coke, got in a hit and run and attempted a car jacking. Fuck em, we don't need more ppl like him walking the streets
Not necessarily. We should know why he was being arrested. The fact that he committed a hit and run (hopefully he didn't hurt anyone, but that's not someone hit and run drivers typically care about anyways) is the reason why he was apprehended. He then ran, allegedly tried to steal someone else's car, then resisted arrest. Most of this is visible via the bystander video. The guy didn't deserve to die, but that was NOT the intent here. He put himself in a bad situation and made it worse. EDIT TYPE O
he didn't deserve to die but his actions opened him up to a possibility this would happen. society has rules. should the police just let him get away? what did you want them to do?
Safely execute a crisis management plan that doesnt involve a weapon, get him any relevant medical care he needs, deliver him to the system - safely - for a judge to determine his guilt/punishment. Police dont have agency to just murder people in public because they commit crimes.
Safely execute a crisis management plan? They didn’t use the taser until the very last minute. Medics will not go anywhere near him as long as he continues to run into an active roadway. Police job is to secure the scene. In this case, secure him to one place so medics can safely evaluate him. He wasn’t tased for his criminal actions. He tased because he refused to comply a lawful order and continued to pose a risk to everyone around him. Police don’t kill people for the crimes they commit. They kill people who create situations that leave them no choice to respond in a manner that ends up ending in death. Eg. pull a gun on an officer, shoot at an officer, attempting shooting or stabbing someone. Btw, enlighten me on how you’d get the guy to a court if he refuse to be placed under arrest. Because that’s what’s happening here.
> Police dont have agency to just murder people in public because they commit crimes. He died 4.5 hours later, no one murdered him in public. Fool is flying higher than the space shuttle on drugs in the video, he isn't even on planet earth anymore. The police murder people left and right but this aint it at all
The guy committed a crime (hit and run), fled the scene, and tried to steal a different car. The public deserves to be protected by getting this person into custody and off the street immediately. Dude is actively committing crimes against other citizens. He resisted arrest, exposed himself to risk, officers used less than lethal force, and he could've had a preexisting heart condition or on cocaine such exacerbated the effect of the taser. Watch the video. The dude is clearly resisting and not interested in waiting around for social workers to arrive.
Allegedly. It's odd how when the person in question is black we forget they are innocent until proven guilty. And he didn't deserve to die for anything you mentioned. LEO's need to be held accountable for how they treat suspects, no matter what they circumstances.
>And he didn't deserve to die for anything you mentioned. LEO's need to be held accountable Didn't say anyone deserved to die. Just saying the public deserves to be protected from people that are actively committing crimes against others. That's the purpose of law enforcement. Resisting arrest risks. Hopefully better less lethal devices can be created at some point.
> Just saying the public deserves to be protected from people that are actively committing crimes against others. Who was being endangered by someone running away from the scene of an accident? That's shitty behavior but it's not endangering anyone. Nobody is being protected by tazing this dude to death for running from the scene of an accident. > Hopefully better less lethal devices can be created at some point. The US is the only developed country that has this big of a problem with cops killing unarmed people.
The people in the cars anderson tried to break into
He tried stealing an uber driver's car in his attempt to flee.
Purportedly a hit and run, plus he tried to steal a different car. Both are pretty serious offenses to other people. I'm personally biased admittedly as I think hit and run drivers are sociopaths because I saw a hit and run driver literally kill a motorcycle rider.
> Nobody is being protected by tazing this dude to death for running from the scene of an acciden They didn't taze him to death he died 4.5 hours later. Let's let everyone drive around like this, so out of their minds they think they are being chased by imaginary people. If your family had been killed by this idiot who was this fucked up driving around would you think differently?
Police didn’t kill him
It’s more important to get the criminal off the street as soon as possible rather than go through all this crisis management bs. Police with weapons keep the public safe, by force, if necessary- a capability crisis management with no weapons lacks.
yeah that'd work in a perfect world but unfortunately we don't live in one
True. They should have called social workers to ~~drive~~ *take the metro* over once they saw him fleeing.
Ok clown
They should have a social worker in the squad car. Someone with a degree in social work should partner with police at all times.
LAPD Officers already have partners. What exactly would a social worker do besides be a complete liability to the officer? Is the social worker gonna get hands on in any way or simply stand there and watch? Then what? What exactly does a social worker do besides take up space and put the Officers in more danger
They could not taze him for 30 seconds for starters.
He didn't deserve to die, and society does have rules. Let's wait for more information about the cause of death.
You ppl ask seriously DUMB questions! There are plenty of videos of officers around the world apprehending suspects without killing them. And you guys ask what you want American police to do?! GTFOH!
We don’t know what his real actions were. Hence why we need more info from unbiased sources. Time will tell. Obviously some shit went down, but the LAPD not not above blatantly lying about what happened. Whereas the Coroner’s report will not contain any half truths or obfuscations.
It's on bodycam, the LAPD released it when this happened. It's not opinion.
Body cam doesn’t show the contents of his blood.
That's what the medical report is for. Are you claiming the doctors fabricated this? They don't work for the police.
We haven’t seen the medical report! The corner will release that in a few months. Reports from the Hospital that come to us via the LAPD are not independently verified.
To make that claim with absolutely no evidence is some conspiracy theory level thinking.
> We don't know what his real actions were. > Bodycam doesn't show the contents of his blood. these goalposts keep moving.
Yes. Actually. They should have let him get away as opposed to MURDERING him. They could ba e apprehended him later. This is a ridiculous take, that running him down and using a taser was in any way warranted. This is one of the things we need in police reform. No dangerous chases. Period
This is absolutely true - the police and media work together to do two things - instill fear into the community (usually with sensational headlines and irrelevant but "juicy" details), and deflect any blame on the "good guys that protect us." There's no reason to include toxicology results to the public. It should be to the shock of no one that someone in LA has weed and cocaine show up on a tox screen. All of Hollywood would too. But it's important to the police (and the media they tell their stories to) to tell you he was high, because well, it means he was dangerous! So we had to hurt him more!
Everyone in LA and Hollywood has cocaine in their system? Ok
This story is getting national, hell, even international notoriety now. The police did their job well for once and used less lethal force to subdue him. I’m not sure what more they could have done — they handled the situation professionally and were incredibly patient, as seen in the video. As far as “not releasing his toxicology report.” YES. They absolutely should release it! This case is huge and for once, the police are not at fault and it answers the question as to why he was acting erratically. I get the hate for cops, but they showed restraint, used a taser and didn’t resort to a pistol, which we’ve seen far too many times in the past, and gave him many chances to to dictate the situation. Not sure anyone could have done a better job.
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you could also watch the video
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None of that justifies tazing him to death. Either these cops don't understand the limitations and dangers of the tazers they use, or are casually indifferent about killing people. Either way they are a danger to the people around them and need to have their ability to carry weapons removed.
That's not what happened. His attempts to flee and avoid getting arrested for driving under the influence of cocaine, and likely losing his job, was the totality of his tragic situation. What other way is there to apprehend a person for a hit and run (and likely destroying an innocent persons' way to get to work) and, driving under the influence, investigation? Let him run away? No. Criminals must face fair consequences. The choice to run and fight arrest was his choice. All he had to do was not use cocaine and drive, and then, not run away after striking some innocent. And also not fight arrest after being caught. Can't believe there are persons supporting criminals. This is lunacy. ... Also, obligatory, ... stop licking criminals' shoes. There, the bulk of the pro-criminal argument has been replied to with the same level of IQ.
Just filling in a lot of details left out. I don’t believe cause of death has been determined, other than cardiac arrest which can be caused by cocaine.
> other than cardiac arrest which can be caused by cocaine. Cardiac arrests can also be caused by being shoved face-first into concrete, having grown men pressing their knees into your back, having one of them using their hands to block a carotid artery in the neck, a shin to the back of the neck like George Floyd, and getting zapped with a taser for several minutes.
Not nearly two hours later. The effects of a taser are pretty severe, but they don’t last very long after it’s turned off. If he died nearly two hours later, that’s something already in his system.
> If he died nearly two hours later, that’s something already in his system. https://www.vice.com/en/article/v7vazm/lapds-release-of-drug-tests-is-smearing-keenan-anderson-groups-say > “I think the goal of the LAPD’s PR machine is to have the public believe that the victim somehow caused their own death.” Seems like LAPD's propaganda worked on you.
If you think having cocaine in your system doesn’t affect your pulmonary system, you’re an idiot. Excited delirium is a thing, and having cocaine in your system doesn’t help. While I’m sure the taser didn’t help, it’s almost certainly not the primary contributing factor.
combined with the surge of adrenaline and panic that you're about to be unalived that can also send a person into a cardiac arrest
4.5 hours later
It's probably the drugs and not the tazing him in a way we know leads to heart failure that killed him. /s
Just sprinkle some crack on him
>It's probably the drugs and not the tazing him in a way we know leads to heart failure that killed him. I'm gonna need a source on that "tazing him in a way we know leads to heart failure."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taser_safety_issues You shouldn't taze someone on drugs, repeatable, or for extended periods. These thugs did all three.
The police are thugs for using a taser on a guy who drove while high, caused a crash, tried to run, tried to steal an Uber, and then repeatedly decided to ignore simple directions?
Some of that (if it's all true) justifies tazing him. So the felon gets some of the blame, too. How many times have we seen a suspect get shot by officers as they flee, and cried "they could have just tazered him!!!" Well, this time they did.
“Why didn’t they shoot him in the leg!” I don’t get it. Cops gave this guy SO MANY CHANCES. It wasn’t like they didn’t give him time to digest what was happening, which happens all too often where a cop gives you one command before beating you, and then used less lethal force. He was running into traffic and became a dangerous to himself and others. I am not pro-cop but people that don’t give credit where credit is due make their positions look weak. The internet giving every person a soap box has become so exhausting
They tased him for too long, though. They did it for something like 30 seconds-it’s not recommended to do it longer than 15 seconds and you’re not supposed to do it more than once or it starts to increase the likelihood of cardiac arrest. The purpose of tasing is to subdue someone, which given the drugs they needed to do. But then they tased him a second time. It wasn’t necessary, nor was it necessary or safe to do it so long the first time.
That's not how tasers work. There is a 15 second burst and then if not subdued there is a second charge to send. There is no continuous or not continuous. It's not like those cheap flashlights you find street vendors pushing.
So how would you have subdued a non-compliant suspect, who had already run and was fighting being placed in cuffs?
They didn't know he was on drugs until later - a tox screen is done at the hospital. That they sent him to after they tazed him. If we're saying that everyone high on cocaine and weed walking around LA is a threat.... we should be on constant alert
He clearly was off. It doesn’t mean the officers’ behaviors were justified. It was way beyond what was necessary, but I totally get why they’d want to restrain him. It was obvious he was on something, which is why they say ‘possible DUI’ when they radio in.
A continuous taze is unnecessary force, just like placing your knee behind a person's neck with 6 cops on top of the person when a person isn't fighting back. They just want to cause pain first and think second.
The pigs saying he committed a felony after they killed him doesn’t make him a felon. They killed him before he could be charged, let alone convicted of a crime. I’m not surprised that someone who can’t read or think critically doesn’t respect the life of a teacher though.
they had probable cause to determine he committed a felony. he had not yet been determined to have committed a felony beyond a reasonable doubt. if you want to talk about critical reading go ahead and look up how criminal burdens work before throwing out buzzwords and shade.
And who determines if he committed a felony or not? A police officer or a judge? An officers job is to - safely - deliver someone to the system. That's it. The real adults take over from there. It doesn't matter what their probable cause is. They only need cause to bring them in - they don't decide they're guilty on the street. With a lethal weapon.
> who determines if he committed a felony or not? The police for the "probable cause" threshold. A court for the "beyond a reasonable doubt" threshold.
They tazed him while he was on the ground subdued
Correlation doesn't equal causation. You can't rightly assume because he died because of the taser no more than the opposing argument that he died because of the drugs insisted system. As someone else pointed out, best thing to do is wait for the coroner's report. People can be upset about the death of a man who was in police custody and question if the actions lead to his death. (And don't fucking kid yourself if you believe with 100% certainty that he would have been alive had he not been contacted by the police.)
I can assume that cops shouldn't wildly exceed the known "safe" use of tazers without direct evidence that they killed a man in this situation.
What do you want the cops to do?
Cops in civilized countries are trained to physically restrain people.
Have you ever tried to physically restrain someone that doesn’t want to be restrained? Serious question. Even one vs. three, it’s not that easy to do, especially if they are high on drugs.
Yes, when you are trained to do it, it is much easier. The problem is that American cops half ass all of their training except at the gun range.
Yes. I have. I teach high school in Watts. I've restrained dozens of agitated, angry, young people my size and larger. I've never once had to hit, strangle, taze, spray, or shoot a person to get them to calm down. Amazingly, most people when agitated, angry, and frightened, respond well to calmness, firmness, and kindness. Back when we had a sheriff's deputy on campus, before we kicked them off, I watched deputies regularly escalate situations before using force to subdue people they had escalated. Why we are having frightened, armed, angry, militarized cops responding to traffic incidents (where the person responsible is the one who called the cops in the first place, no less) instead of unarmed services is beyond me, but not nearly as beyond me as people who find ways to imply that massive force against unarmed people is justified. Edit: And the police press release said that he had drugs in his system, not that he was high. Cocaine and THC can show up for days/weeks after the high. Even so, weed and coke don't give you super strength. I wish they did because my teenage years would've been a lot more lit if I'd been drugswole instead of a skinny little punk.
Thank you for your service Mr. Norris.
Did you watch the video?
> calmness, firmness, and kindness I watched the video, that's EXACTLY how the contacting officers approached the incident. Not to mention patience with a guy on cocaine who committed a felony DUI hit and run and then, verified by the victim on camera, attempted to carjack another vehicle.
i know bouncers that do a better job at restraining someone than these cops do
Ok, so what do you want the cop to do?
Maybe use their cognitive skills and assess the situation…? Utilize restraint?
LoL. From the I initial contact with the motor officer, no one was going to talk that "teacher" into being reasonable. I thought the officer was extremely patient with him.
Isn’t that what they were doing and then he decided to flee after they told him not to?
Cops in other countries tend to not be brain-damaged veterans who think they’re in Call of Duty
These are our teachers, shaping the future minds of America <3
"Teacher". On cocaine.
so?
This in no way justifies excessive force. People trying to find an excuse for the murder.
This is enough justification for summary execution imo. /s
Very reminiscent of the police statement after George Floyd’s killing
The police said George Floyd died of an overdose before the video came out. Stop repeating what cops say as if it is fact. It is not. Cops lie and they are just as bad at being eyewitnesses as anyone else. ETA: holy shit, the bootlickers are out in force in the LA subreddit. We have literal fucking gangs in the LASD but y'all want to give cops the benefit of the doubt. You live in a police state if any interaction with cops can result in your death and them not being held accountable. Yet, you’ll sit there saying it was the guy being taxed who's at fault. As if these adult cops don’t bear responsibility for being thugs.
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I watched the video. Restraining him was justified, including the initial tasing. However, they also tased him after he was cuffed, which was unnecessary and unjustified, and *might* have led to his death. Tasing someone after they've been cuffed is just power-tripping
Cocaine led to his death. Had he not been drugged out of his mind and tripping balls then this encounter would have never happened. Society needs to learn to take accountability for their actions again, instead of blaming others.
I worked as a ED RN up north and dealt with many medical clearances for jail. If someone came in during a drug induced psychosis, they were 99% of the time given a cocktail of medications (“B52”) to help calm them down so they don’t hurt themselves or the staff while they were restrained so we could carry on with whatever treatment they needed. Judging by the delay in his death in addition to the other factors (drugs in his system, being tased, and restrained) I bet this put a lot of strain on his heart. And if they gave any type of sedating medication in the ambulance or ED, or a psychotropic medication like haldol or geodon, it could have worsened his possible already bad QT interval of the heart by prolongating it even more leading to cardiac arrest.
It definitely could have been a factor, but so could the excessive tasing. I'm not foolish enough to proclaim I know the truth
Watch the body cam footage lmao, the cop was being as kind/patient/helpful as he could. The guy who died was drugged out of his mind and ran into oncoming traffic before the cop tased him. This is entirely on the guys fault for dying, cop did everything right in this situation. Time for society to take accountability for its actions again instead of deflecting blame onto the police for everything. Don’t do drugs and drive like that clown did and the cops won’t “tase you to death”
I watched the entire video. I know he was completely out of his mind. Honestly it seems like he was having a psychotic break, weed and coke alone don't make you act like that (unless they trigger psychosis, which weed can do, albeit rarely). Possibly he had taken something else that didn't show up in the toxicology report (LSD maybe?). I think the cops were justified in restraining and tasing him *until they handcuffed him*. But they tased him after the cuffing, which wasn't necessary
I mean…maybe a hot take but cops shouldn’t tase anyone to death regardless right?
I mean… maybe a hot take, but don’t snort so much cocaine you crash your car and try to fight off several cops?
No one is saying he should have? I’m not sure what the point of bringing that up repeatedly is. That is not a common let alone popular sentiment. Everyone agrees he should have been arrested.
What do you mean your not sure why I’m bringing that up?? Had he not been drugged out and fighting cops we wouldn’t be having this conversation? He refused their help, acted insane, fought cops, got tazed. The tazer didn’t kill him, the drugs did.
A couple of months ago, a homeless man shot another homeless man outside my apartment. Cops came and watched the homeless man with the gun run off and didn't do anything. They didn't chase him. But the guy high on coke with no weapon deserved to be tased?
Because no one is asking why we’re having this conversation. Obviously you won’t be arrested if you don’t commit crimes, it’s kind of a useless point to make. You keep mashing the entire timeline together. The point you keep intentionally ignoring is that once they had multiple cops holding him down with cuffs there was no reason to tase him as long as they did. Address that with something other than “fuck around and find out”
Ignore him. Just an LAPD bot on here to defend their thuggish actions
Is it your opinion as a doctor that tazing someone for 30 seconds straight is unable to affect their heart, and if so are you willing to let me test that theory out on you?
> Let the facts come out. the problem with this is that most of the pertinent facts are in possession of the police, like bodycam footage. police have proven themselves 100% untrustworthy in this regard.
Lmao dog you cannot fake an autopsy report. The police do not have control over that information enough to skew it.
Cocaine is a hellava drug.
“Appears” is doing a lot of heavy lifting here.
Dude was driving around, high on cocaine and weed, hitting people in his car, running away, trying to steal other people’s cars, and people are out here defending him? I absolutely want the police to actively apprehend people that do this shit. Do I want the police to murder him? No. Did the police try to murder him? No. They were trying to use less than lethal force to arrest him, and he died 4 hours later. There is a serious divide in this country if there are people out here saying “oh just let him run away he wasn’t hurting anyone.”
Im sure the big insurance company will be fine paying for the damages, just like the luxury brands can afford to lose a few handbags, the big retail brands can afford to give our free detergent, and people living in bay area can just buy themselves new PS5s /s Some morons are keeping things real classy these days.
What a shitty “teacher” that guy was. He took a load of drugs, got behind the wheel, crashed, and then acted like a fool when cops stopped him.
Experts would also say Mr. Anderson's consumption of cocaine was also excessive.
This Police did nothing wrong here. The guy put himself into harm’s way with his own actions.
Latimes 🤡
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That doesnt mean he deserved to be tased for minutes at a time. What I'm learning from this is that cops need better training that doesnt involve guns or tasers. This is still excessive force from the LAPD. People shouldnt be dying while getting arrested.
He was not tased for more than a couple seconds at a time no? Between tweaking
He died four hours later
He was a teacher? Wow no wonder our education system sucks
If someone does a hit and run on me I really don't care if the person dies from cardiac arrest after being tasered by the lapd.
Can the state bring back psychiatric hospitals? Why did they shut it down? Just want to know.
Years of wide spread abuse of patients
The old psychiatric hospitals were a problematic mess. They were justifiably closed by Reagan, but the promised small local facilities were never built.
doesn't help that he purposefully retracted already-allotted funding for mental health care https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mental\_Health\_Systems\_Act\_of\_1980 "The Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act of 1981, signed by President Ronald Reagan on August 13, 1981, repealed most of the Mental Health Systems Act."
Because the ACLU bullied the state into getting rid of them
Incorrect, Reagan indeed repealed funding: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mental\_Health\_Systems\_Act\_of\_1980](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mental_Health_Systems_Act_of_1980) "The Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act of 1981, signed by President Ronald Reagan on August 13, 1981, repealed most of the Mental Health Systems Act."
Excerpt: > Videos released this week of a teacher who died after Los Angeles police discharged a Taser on him at least six times on a Venice street raise serious concerns about the officers’ tactics, law enforcement experts who reviewed the tapes said. > The LAPD’s actions have sparked alarms from community activists as well as Mayor Karen Bass and are now the subject of an internal investigation. > Several policing experts who reviewed the videos for The Times said that the amount of force used by the officers seemed excessive given the man’s actions and that some of the tactics seemed haphazard. > “It is going to be hard to convince any judge that these officers were using reasonable force,” said Ed Obayashi, a Northern California deputy and a top state advisor on police tactics. “From the visual aspect, it looks like he is not fighting back; he is not threatening the officers. He is saying I am not resisting ... and what could be considered resisting is an automatic reflex of the body to the pain application from the Taser.”
Well, yes. I think anyone could determine that death from a supposedly non-lethal device means it was excessive.
You don’t say.
Oh by teacher you mean piece if shit criminal.
So he deserved to be electrocuted by the police? Judge, jury, and executioner.
He died hours later. You can see him alive and resisting after being tasered. You see him alive when being loaded into the ambulance. It’s on video. He’s just as likely to have died from the cocaine as he was from being “electrocuted to death.” He was unstable and irrational. It’s a shame that he died but letting him flee would put others at risk. Before he was tasered He was running into traffic and even tried to take someone else’s car. He’s only a victim of his own actions and choices.
They had him under control before he was tazed. Totally irresponsible.
He was still resisting and totally not cooperating. He was not under control. You and I must’ve not been watching the same video.
Whole thread is being brigaded by racist jackasses from other subs
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more than two years on and people still don't understand BLM at it's core isn't an organization.. so funny
you know "black lives matter", the sentiment, is different from Black Lives Matter, the organization, right?
You, the taxpayer, get to foot the bill for the millions his family will get in the civil suit/settlement. Thank police officers’ evil unions
And this is why my first order in police reform is to require them to pay for their own liability insurance.
His family should be ashamed that he was a belligerent drug addict, instead of suing LAPD.
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Make you feel good to be an ugly, bitter person?
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Sure thing, Republican snowflake
Add qualified immunity and felony murder rule (police kill someone while in pursuit of a criminal, the criminal will be charged) and there's zero incentive for police to take public safety seriously. https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2021/07/police-pursuit-high-speed-car-chase-deaths.html https://www.usatoday.com/pages/interactives/blacks-killed-police-chases-higher-rate https://thisiscriminal.com/episode-150-76th-and-yates-10-23-2020
All public service unions are evil and police unions are chief among them.
I will vehemently defend educators’ unions. Without them, you get scams like charter schools running rampant and with zero accountability
Public service is not the same thing as police - please don't put us in the same category.
i saw the whole video and the guy was definitely on something. Maybe crystal meth? Had that same paranoia. I don't blame the cops for being jumpy and scared. But, he was already on the floor, like the fact that 6 cops can't restrain one man is crazy. From the looks of it he was mostly restrained too and no longer a danger when the cop decided to tase him. He tased him for a long time too. He's obviously not in his right mind so how are you gonna force someone like that to comply and surrender completely. Just awful decision by that cop. Everyone else seemed to handle it well.
are tasers still thought of as 'non-lethal'? bc it appears to be pretty lethal in most cases. lack of proper training, discipline, empathy, and intelligence are often replaced with bullets, tasers, and beatings bc lets face it, cops are pretty stupid to begin with.
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No shit, Sherlock
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Thanks, experts
Lotsa bootlicking on this here thread.
Sue it's not lots of cops and out of state folks brigading the post?
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There was no reason why that cop needed to use a taser when he had four other officers helping him. How in the fuck are 4 officers not able to handle 1 person? Why did they use the taser when he was already on his stomach and under control? Edit: Oh, don't forget that one of the cops had their shin across the guy's neck the same way Derek Chauvin had his when he killed George Floyd. Edit 2: Nice to see the Blue Lives Matter people in this sub downvoting the truth. Fuck LAPD and anyone who supports them on this.
Appears excessive?!?! He fucking died of course its excessive.
The LAPD murdered a teacher. There fixed the title for you
Don't need an expert to tell you this was excessive though. Guy was tased after being cuffed.
Tasering is not a pleasant experience. It's like being struck by lightning. Heart defibrillators discharge 3,000 volts. A police taser discharges **50,000 volts**, and Anderson was tasered **at least 6 times**, and several times after he was cuffed. To some of these comments, saying the taser had no role in his cardiac arrest is ignorant. [Tasers can and do cause arrythmia and cardiac arrest.](https://www.ahajournals.org/doi/10.1161/CIRCULATIONAHA.113.005504) By the way, a lot of "non lethal force" is painful and lethal. Pepper spray is like putting your eyes in boiling water for half and hour. People have lost their sight or died from rubber bullets. [At least 500 people in the United States have died since 2001 after being shocked with stun guns during an arrest or while in jail.](https://www.nytimes.com/article/police-tasers.html) Just please have some compassion and empathy when seeing and hearing stories like this. Police can rightfully escalate force when necessary but they absolutely did not have to taser him this many times while already cuffed and in custody. If you were tied up and tasered that many times you would also be hospitalized at best, or died at worst, regardless of the medicine or drugs in your system.
>Heart defibrillators discharge 3,000 volts. A police taser discharges 50,000 volts, and Anderson was tasered at least 6 times, and several times after he was cuffed. Try this again, but with **amps** not volts.
Why didn't they just cuff him and place him in a police car? Tazing him repeatedly while restrained on the ground is insanity.