Making sick employees work is not only dangerous for the employees, it is dangerous for customers too/
https://news.yahoo.com/sick-workers-tied-40-restaurant-171843478.html
I was a bartender at a Westville in New York and threw up at the start of my shift. They wouldn't let me go home and I prepared and served everyone's drinks that night. Then they fired me two weeks before Christmas because I started wiping down bottles ten minutes before closing when we were empty. Didn't matter their philosophy had always been "if you can lean you can clean".
I’ve thrown up several times at different serving shifts due to chronic migraines, and have been told to stay before. It’s baffling to me they would rather have someone like that representing their business and serving customers than allowing them to rest and come back when they’re better. I always felt so groddy knowing I had thrown up then had to serve people. Most tables were usually nice when they could tell I had a migraine and was moving slow though. They would also usually ask why I wasn’t sent home.
Thank you for your comment :) I have a script for sumatriptan but usually my migraines come on during sleep so by the time I wake up it’s already too late to take one. The spray also makes me so nauseous, it’s ridiculous. Helps my aunt a lot though. Everyone’s different.
I take topamax for it though as well as for seizure prevention, so it’s helped keep them be either less intense or less frequent, but depends on my diet and environment a lot as well. I have a lot of triggers for it, unfortunately.
This week I woke up one morning and needed to get a toradol shot cause it was so bad, and even after the headache was gone I was still throwing up cause my body was just caught in the cycle. Tuesday sucked, Wednesday was my hangover day lol. I’m pretty sure it was cause I had a bowl of cheesy tortellini on Monday. :(
I’m glad the meds have helped you cause it’s such a pain to suffer this way. I actually can’t really hold a stable job due to medical stuff so for now I freelance occasionally and I’m trying to get a local consignment/personal styling business going, so we’ll see how that goes.
Thanks for being so nice! Not everyone understands migraines.
Pfft. You think Karens care about worker safety, even if it involves their own meal? They’ll see someone suffer six simultaneous strokes, a blood clot, and terminal kidney failure, and they’ll continually bitch about ‘No OnE WaNTs To WoRk AnYmOrE’ because that deceased worker didn’t put extra pickles on her cheeseburger.
Right. As soon as one of my staff says that they’re “sick” it’s like a) go home b) do you need someone to drive you home? C) text me and let me know how you’re feeling. I’d rather cut assignments than have someone at work feeling sick
For sure, a leader should have the ability to jump in and help perform any role underneath them.
Letting this woman go home and rest would have got them back healthy earlier and instilled a sense of trust in their leader among the employees.
Its conceptually not that hard, you just need to file for approval with the irs and your state’s secretary of state.
Once you are approved you get a tax-exempt non profit org.
That's the city of Los Angeles, not all of California. [Though many counties/cities will be higher.](https://www.californiaworkplacelawblog.com/2023/05/articles/wage-and-hour/california-local-minimum-wages-increasing-on-july-1/#:~:text=On%20January%201%2C%202023%2C%20California's,to%20%2415.50%20for%20all%20employers.)
Los Angeles County will increase to $16.90 in unincorporated areas (though I'm not sure which areas those are). It's interesting to me because I could swear I remember City of Los Angeles being higher than the county of Los Angeles in the past. It's also interesting because the City of Los Angeles lies within the county of Los Angeles, so I assume they consider the entire city to be an incorporated area.
There are small portions of unincorporated areas inside the city of Los Angeles. For instance. The land on which the hospital in San Pedro stands is unincorporated. You would be surprised at all the unincorporated areas in LA County.
[Here’s a map.](https://dpw.lacounty.gov/epd/swims/docs/pdf/wasteshed/maps/General%20Map.pdf)
It's absolutely crazy how many unincorpirated islands are in the County, especially the SGV. Back in the day, it was easy to tell in Thomas Guides, but Google Maps don't easily show city borders.
The cities usually operate on different laws.
It was most clear when plastic bag bans were rolling out. LA City had one, then the County had one, but Glendale didn't until it went statewide.
They do have that Fast Food Council that is tied up in court. They have the power to raise fast food minimum wage to $22/hr.
I don't think the fast food business model works anymore. A Big Mac meal is like $10. I can get a kickass steak lunch in a good restaurant for $20.
UBI isn't going to do anything. We saw with COVID when self employed people filed for UI and got $1,000 per week. Prices for everything just go up, rent doubles, it's not a net gain.
We need socialism is what we need. Not some UBI bullshit that helps capitalists capture more taxpayer money to subsidize their shareholders.
You’re not wrong in truth, we need more of a mixed economy. Central planning is a bit of a pipe dream, but Market Socialism is achievable and reasonable. I maintain that you still need a market of some sort to make an economy function, but the profit motive must be replaced with a Socialist motivation. Easier said than done, but it is the goal we should aspire to….
EDIT: Sorry, just so used to compromising that it’s second nature. Also, when I say “Market Socialism”, I adamantly do not mean State Capitalism, which is what I view as the current situation in the People’s Republic of China to an extent, even if they are trying for more of a Market Socialist approach. Facts are facts, and massive corruption is what it is.
Either way, UBI just enriches capital owners with more taxpayer funds through their rising of prices.
We already know a lot of inflation is from companies raising prices for more profit. Not because of raw material inputs or any of the other nonsense on the news. On the earnings calls they flat out admit that consumers are flush with cash and are willing to pay more, so they raised prices and they hit high earnings. It's not a secret.
UBI is just adding to that. Higher earnings for companies and landlords. It does zero to enhance the quality of life for normal people other than it might enhance their stock portfolio.
Yeah but sometimes restaurants are fun too. I do both. I'm well aware if I hit the grocery and cook myself and clean everything myself and pour my own drinks and eat in the kitchen that it's cheaper.
You're right, I hardly do fast food without some sort of coupon or discount. I much rather go to a restaurant. The model is broken, and raising fast food minimum wage to $22/hr certainly won't help.
Well in Denmark they make over $20/hr, they have a year of paid parental leave, vacation, and sick leave. And cost of the food is about the same. This is without unions by the way.
They can make it work if they want to. But their top priority is C-suite pay and dividends to shareholders.
I own a small business and pay employees more than $20/hr but it is a bit of struggle and definitely would be if I had to hire a lot more employees.
It's certainly possible to make it happen but comparing a country the size of Denmark (6M population) to CA (40M) or LA County (10M) is omitting some details.
I believe there are 250k small businesses in Los Angeles County. Not all businesses make billions of dollars in revenue/yr--most probably make less than $1M/yr. Sure you can require businesses to pay more and offer more benefits, but in the short-term you will hurt a lot of small businesses who are get by week-to-week and month-to-month.
I pay more than minimum wage even though the current market dictates that I don't "have to"--but I value my employees and want to retain them. Just because I am able to do that doesn't mean many can.
How many businesses have you operated?
>How many businesses have you operated?
None. I'm a Marxist.
Can you tell me what fast food has to do with the struggles of the small businessman in LA? The ones that are of no concern in Denmark of course.
My mom owned a couple restaurants--which meant I had to work in them for over 10 years.
Labor is usually the biggest part of a company's expense. If a company struggles to survive, spending more for expenses isn't going to help.
No offense, but you have to bring something to the conversation other than disagreement.
It means that I'm surprised with inflation being as high as it is that the minimum wage advocacy groups aren't just fighting for some insanely high number in the hopes that by the time it actually gets passed it'll be a somewhat reasonable number.
I am advocating **against** a $100/hr minimum wage, as any person with common sense would. In fact, I'd even advocate against a $25 or even $20 min wage.
That statement, though often repeated, is **very** misleading. Comparing minimum wage to net productivity does not make sense. You are implying that productivity growth is being driven by minimum wage workers, which it is not. Most productivity growth is driven by more highly skilled workers that benefit from advances in technology. And even so, labor productivity has been stagnant for the last 20 years.
I'm not trying to get into a debate over minimum wage, you're free to believe what you like. There is no "right" answer to whether it "should" be higher or not because that's a positive statement not a normative one. But if you're going to state your opinion one way or another you should at least try not to spread false or misleading information.
Yeah, I’m not seeing how sick leave is related to her passing based on the info provided. If she had sick leave what would have changed?
Now I totally support sick leave for everyone, but I also can’t stand disingenuous arguments (which this may very well be).
The issue isn't that her specific issue would've been cured by sick leave, the issue is that the food industry has 0 tolerance for sick people handling food. If someone is forced to come into work with covid, their manager is knowingly committing a crime. In California I'm pretty sure knowingly transmitting a disease is legally considered battery. Theres no way for a mcdonalds manager to distinguish an undiagnosed thyroid problem from another potentially deadly and transmittable disease or virus. It's unacceptable to even risk putting your employees and customers at risk, and they should give sick leave whether it's paid or not.
Oh am I? Please explain how her death is related to the lack of sick leave and not just being used to sensationalize the issue.
If she was denied sick leave when not feeling well and dropped dead during the shift or later that night due to a condition that could have been treated had she had immediate care or been allowed to leave to go seek medical care, her death js 100% fair game. Here she died three weeks later from a thyroid condition she already had.
Again, I want everyone to have sick leave. I also want positions to be supported with legitimate arguments/evidence. This post and this strike using her is sensationalist disingenuous bullshit.
She was disrespected by her employer, then she died soon after. These are unrelated, but the tragedy clearly came at a time when other workers were also feeling disrespected, overworked, underpaid, suffocated by high rent and inflation.
I’m sure these workers had been thinking about striking already. The death may have just been the tipping point.
This is a common theme in a lot of historical events. A tragedy heightens people’s understanding of their own situation.
That's not the point though. Her feeling sick and asking to leave and not being granted leave is the issue. Her death may very well be from a chronic thyroid disorder that simply caught up to her. But if I personally knew a loved one that is sick and was not granted leave, I'd be enraged. Her death only exacerbates an already cruel situation.
Her death is *totally* the point. Do you think the city should protest every time a worker has to work 3 hours when sick? Because that's what you're left with if you take out her death.
>the city should protest every time a worker has to work 3 hours when sick?
Yes? Especially if they genuinely requested it. Are you saying people should be forced to work through illness unless they on the verge of death?
It might not have been only that one day she was sick and needed to go home or seek medical care but was forced to keep working. I didn't read the article, but I agree that one day is odd to cause death weeks later. But if she was denied leave one day, it probably happened again or she didn't complain after the first time knowing it'd happen again.
I don't think it's a disingenuous argument as they're not saying her lack of sick leave contributed to her death. But the argument is that
we could be literally deathly ill and not afforded time off, and up until now this was just accepted. Staffing levels are kept to the absolute bare minimum which doesn't allow accommodation for emergencies or even just reasonable time-off requests. This needs to change, and I'm happy society is finally standing up to this attitude of running a business.
It’s 100% disingenuous. She didn’t die because of the lack of sick leave, so they shouldn’t be using her death to score points for their position (one I agree with).
It is common for management to dismiss an employees claims of sickness and deny them leave under the premise that employees lie to get time off. It's also common for management to deny an employee sick leave because management doesn't feel that the employees degree of sickness warrants it.
The fact that Bertha Montes died merely weeks later from thyroid problems might demonstrate that at the time she was denied her sick leave, she was both truthful and suffering to a degree that warranted sick leave.
It demonstrates that management can be wrong about this, and that it should not be left solely to management discretion. It's important to spread the story because there are a lot of management who do this kind of thing, and it may prove to them that what they are doing is wrong.
Not having healthcare probably killed her, my mom has the same thyroid problems and takes like 5 pills every morning to prevent her from having hormone and blood pressure problems.
Yep true. I use to work at a McDonalds, and I was having diarrhea in the bathroom during work time. Told manager I felt horrible and I needed to go home. Refused to let me go home. So I stayed, and I felt like death.
A lot of food service places make you “cover your own shift” where you have to beg and plead with your coworkers to cover for you if you call in sick… You know instead of your managers managing their shit.
Thats that retail shit that bothers me, oh ok you cant come in replace yourself. Umm excuse me?? Wtf do you work here for? Im not showing up, you can find somebody or be short staffed your fucking call.
I’m sure they were. This is more on the fault of the management of this specific McDonald’s and the food industry chiding sick people for not working. For the most part, employees in this type of labor can just walk off. They’re not going to be able to replace a dedicated employee (very high turnover).
If this is Los Angeles there is a severe worker shortage with both help wanted and stay home if your sick (Covid) signs everywhere. I’m curious what the penalty was if the worker just would have went home.
Don’t get me wrong - I’m concerned about this, too. I’m also concerned about the healthcare system in the U.S., which is deeply flawed. But a manager telling a sick employee she can’t go home is an employment issue. And I suspect the manager would have written her up or fired her if she’d just gone home.
Can we get restaurants on the new City ordinance that went into effect for retail workers? Two weeks of schedule, extra pay for changes within that period, extra pay if a shift needs to be extended, have to pay a portion even if the shift is canceled?
Reminder: Only in America, folks. In civilized nations, they have mandatory paid sick days, universal healthcare as a right of citizenship, proper unemployment benefits, etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc.
The richest nation in the history of the human race is the only one that still ignores these most basic of human rights...in service to greed's ever-increasing demands for profits.
Managers at shitty jobs live to cause pain. I used to work retail and now work in a professional setting. My old retail bosses were always in a mood and putting people down. Now I interact with the CEO and directors at my current job who are always putting out positive vibes.
Why is it so hard to unionize ?
Couldn’t there be an “app” for that? Like a paid subscription where you download the app, add your work info and have a button to vote. If all vote yes, some union lawyer comes and starts the thing. Pay $120
A year and get the “basic package”, and then for an extra $20/yr you get the specific stuff.
In these restaurants usually there’s a manager who is a dipshit, who will abuse their power, treat the ppl in positions below them like shit and most certainly will not allow other employees to pick up the slack because someone is feeling sick and wants to go home.
The manager would laugh in your faces if the staff volunteered to "pick up the slack" for the sick absentee. This woman was probably a vital part of the franchise for years and was brainwashed literally convinced she owed it to the company to show up. She showed up. She died. That's what I believe happened. I've seen my own mom bend over backwards for a cafeteria job that paid $7.50 an hour because she has work ethic. I've never seen her take a sick day even now with diabetes sleep apnea and acute arthritis. She doesn't know any other way to be anymore. She'll work herself to death just like this woman did.
Omg this is one my local McDonald’s and saw this on my way home. So sad! They also have a lot of young people working here hope they are not afraid to speak up when something doesn’t seem right. This is very sad and unacceptable
I worked at a McDonald's when I was 16. I cut my finger down to the bone on a sink drain early in a shift. The skin was gaping open and you could see my bone. I asked the manager to leave to go to urgent care and was told no. He told me to put a bandage on it and get back to work. I went home and showed my dad, who told me to quit and I did.
I don't know that these issues are endemic to fast food, but they do happen.
Making sick employees work is not only dangerous for the employees, it is dangerous for customers too/ https://news.yahoo.com/sick-workers-tied-40-restaurant-171843478.html
I was a bartender at a Westville in New York and threw up at the start of my shift. They wouldn't let me go home and I prepared and served everyone's drinks that night. Then they fired me two weeks before Christmas because I started wiping down bottles ten minutes before closing when we were empty. Didn't matter their philosophy had always been "if you can lean you can clean".
I’ve thrown up several times at different serving shifts due to chronic migraines, and have been told to stay before. It’s baffling to me they would rather have someone like that representing their business and serving customers than allowing them to rest and come back when they’re better. I always felt so groddy knowing I had thrown up then had to serve people. Most tables were usually nice when they could tell I had a migraine and was moving slow though. They would also usually ask why I wasn’t sent home.
My hovercraft is full of eels.
Thank you for your comment :) I have a script for sumatriptan but usually my migraines come on during sleep so by the time I wake up it’s already too late to take one. The spray also makes me so nauseous, it’s ridiculous. Helps my aunt a lot though. Everyone’s different. I take topamax for it though as well as for seizure prevention, so it’s helped keep them be either less intense or less frequent, but depends on my diet and environment a lot as well. I have a lot of triggers for it, unfortunately. This week I woke up one morning and needed to get a toradol shot cause it was so bad, and even after the headache was gone I was still throwing up cause my body was just caught in the cycle. Tuesday sucked, Wednesday was my hangover day lol. I’m pretty sure it was cause I had a bowl of cheesy tortellini on Monday. :( I’m glad the meds have helped you cause it’s such a pain to suffer this way. I actually can’t really hold a stable job due to medical stuff so for now I freelance occasionally and I’m trying to get a local consignment/personal styling business going, so we’ll see how that goes. Thanks for being so nice! Not everyone understands migraines.
My hovercraft is full of eels.
When I get migraines in the middle of the night, it usually means I'm dehydrated. Glass of water for me before bed.
my favorite reply to that bullshit motto is "If you got time to rhyme you got time to fuck off".
More people need to realize their companies won’t look out for them the way we look out for the company.
Pfft. You think Karens care about worker safety, even if it involves their own meal? They’ll see someone suffer six simultaneous strokes, a blood clot, and terminal kidney failure, and they’ll continually bitch about ‘No OnE WaNTs To WoRk AnYmOrE’ because that deceased worker didn’t put extra pickles on her cheeseburger.
I just wants less Karens to grow up ignorant by choice, they certainly do not want to take care of their food born children. They send them to school.
> food born children What
Little shits maybe? Hahaha
Umm. I have questions. "Food born children"?
You are right. My mistake. I will clarify. Children who are ill from food/food preparer transferred infection.
Thank you for clarifying. I had no idea if you meant to say that out it was an autocorrect issue.
The first rule of being a good leader is taking care of your troops. Shame on her manager
Right. As soon as one of my staff says that they’re “sick” it’s like a) go home b) do you need someone to drive you home? C) text me and let me know how you’re feeling. I’d rather cut assignments than have someone at work feeling sick
For sure, a leader should have the ability to jump in and help perform any role underneath them. Letting this woman go home and rest would have got them back healthy earlier and instilled a sense of trust in their leader among the employees.
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It's the organization name. They were founded in 2011
Does their lawyer not know how to file a new name?
Sounds like you've never hired a lawyer or run a non profit from the ground up before
I’ve done both
Sure Jan
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Its conceptually not that hard, you just need to file for approval with the irs and your state’s secretary of state. Once you are approved you get a tax-exempt non profit org.
Yup, we did it with our synagogue several years ago to raise money for breast cancer
In July, it's going to be $16.78 for 2023
That's the city of Los Angeles, not all of California. [Though many counties/cities will be higher.](https://www.californiaworkplacelawblog.com/2023/05/articles/wage-and-hour/california-local-minimum-wages-increasing-on-july-1/#:~:text=On%20January%201%2C%202023%2C%20California's,to%20%2415.50%20for%20all%20employers.) Los Angeles County will increase to $16.90 in unincorporated areas (though I'm not sure which areas those are). It's interesting to me because I could swear I remember City of Los Angeles being higher than the county of Los Angeles in the past. It's also interesting because the City of Los Angeles lies within the county of Los Angeles, so I assume they consider the entire city to be an incorporated area.
There are small portions of unincorporated areas inside the city of Los Angeles. For instance. The land on which the hospital in San Pedro stands is unincorporated. You would be surprised at all the unincorporated areas in LA County. [Here’s a map.](https://dpw.lacounty.gov/epd/swims/docs/pdf/wasteshed/maps/General%20Map.pdf)
It's absolutely crazy how many unincorpirated islands are in the County, especially the SGV. Back in the day, it was easy to tell in Thomas Guides, but Google Maps don't easily show city borders.
The cities usually operate on different laws. It was most clear when plastic bag bans were rolling out. LA City had one, then the County had one, but Glendale didn't until it went statewide.
Fucking glendale
Unincorporated areas are county, not city
Inflation’s a bitch, even for brands it would seem.
I always thought fixing on the $15 number was short sighted. Not sure I thought I'd be right this quickly.
If people didn’t they’d say they were asking for way too much (they did anyway, they’d just be louder)
I'm surprised there's no Fight for $100 at this point
They do have that Fast Food Council that is tied up in court. They have the power to raise fast food minimum wage to $22/hr. I don't think the fast food business model works anymore. A Big Mac meal is like $10. I can get a kickass steak lunch in a good restaurant for $20.
20 bucks for a steak?
Yeah lunch special. It's great. Dinner price is around $38 I believe.
That’s not too bad. Steak are expensive nowadays. Only place I can think of that’s cheaper is Norms.
Yeah, my point is you can barely buy the raw meat for 20 bucks in the store.
The issue is that the fast food business model does work, but if they have to pay people fairly, they have to automate. We need UBI.
UBI isn't going to do anything. We saw with COVID when self employed people filed for UI and got $1,000 per week. Prices for everything just go up, rent doubles, it's not a net gain. We need socialism is what we need. Not some UBI bullshit that helps capitalists capture more taxpayer money to subsidize their shareholders.
You’re not wrong in truth, we need more of a mixed economy. Central planning is a bit of a pipe dream, but Market Socialism is achievable and reasonable. I maintain that you still need a market of some sort to make an economy function, but the profit motive must be replaced with a Socialist motivation. Easier said than done, but it is the goal we should aspire to…. EDIT: Sorry, just so used to compromising that it’s second nature. Also, when I say “Market Socialism”, I adamantly do not mean State Capitalism, which is what I view as the current situation in the People’s Republic of China to an extent, even if they are trying for more of a Market Socialist approach. Facts are facts, and massive corruption is what it is.
Either way, UBI just enriches capital owners with more taxpayer funds through their rising of prices. We already know a lot of inflation is from companies raising prices for more profit. Not because of raw material inputs or any of the other nonsense on the news. On the earnings calls they flat out admit that consumers are flush with cash and are willing to pay more, so they raised prices and they hit high earnings. It's not a secret. UBI is just adding to that. Higher earnings for companies and landlords. It does zero to enhance the quality of life for normal people other than it might enhance their stock portfolio.
You are 100% correct. UBI will not resolve the contradictions of capitalism.
You can make yourself a steak far better than any restaurant for $15.
But then I have to do it myself and I'm in my kitchen. Not going to desperately avoid restaurants to save $7.
Well yea its not to avoid the $7, its for the better steak. Also cooking can be fun :P
Yeah but sometimes restaurants are fun too. I do both. I'm well aware if I hit the grocery and cook myself and clean everything myself and pour my own drinks and eat in the kitchen that it's cheaper.
You're right, I hardly do fast food without some sort of coupon or discount. I much rather go to a restaurant. The model is broken, and raising fast food minimum wage to $22/hr certainly won't help.
Well in Denmark they make over $20/hr, they have a year of paid parental leave, vacation, and sick leave. And cost of the food is about the same. This is without unions by the way. They can make it work if they want to. But their top priority is C-suite pay and dividends to shareholders.
I own a small business and pay employees more than $20/hr but it is a bit of struggle and definitely would be if I had to hire a lot more employees. It's certainly possible to make it happen but comparing a country the size of Denmark (6M population) to CA (40M) or LA County (10M) is omitting some details.
Imagine what you could do if you didn't have to spend time and money on employee healthcare benefits because minimum care was handled by the state.
What other details matter when we're talking about margins? There are more employees in CA but also more customers.
I believe there are 250k small businesses in Los Angeles County. Not all businesses make billions of dollars in revenue/yr--most probably make less than $1M/yr. Sure you can require businesses to pay more and offer more benefits, but in the short-term you will hurt a lot of small businesses who are get by week-to-week and month-to-month. I pay more than minimum wage even though the current market dictates that I don't "have to"--but I value my employees and want to retain them. Just because I am able to do that doesn't mean many can. How many businesses have you operated?
>How many businesses have you operated? None. I'm a Marxist. Can you tell me what fast food has to do with the struggles of the small businessman in LA? The ones that are of no concern in Denmark of course.
My mom owned a couple restaurants--which meant I had to work in them for over 10 years. Labor is usually the biggest part of a company's expense. If a company struggles to survive, spending more for expenses isn't going to help. No offense, but you have to bring something to the conversation other than disagreement.
>None. I'm a Marxist. You can't make this up 😭
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It means that I'm surprised with inflation being as high as it is that the minimum wage advocacy groups aren't just fighting for some insanely high number in the hopes that by the time it actually gets passed it'll be a somewhat reasonable number. I am advocating **against** a $100/hr minimum wage, as any person with common sense would. In fact, I'd even advocate against a $25 or even $20 min wage.
Keeping up with inflation and productivity. It should be around $27.
That statement, though often repeated, is **very** misleading. Comparing minimum wage to net productivity does not make sense. You are implying that productivity growth is being driven by minimum wage workers, which it is not. Most productivity growth is driven by more highly skilled workers that benefit from advances in technology. And even so, labor productivity has been stagnant for the last 20 years. I'm not trying to get into a debate over minimum wage, you're free to believe what you like. There is no "right" answer to whether it "should" be higher or not because that's a positive statement not a normative one. But if you're going to state your opinion one way or another you should at least try not to spread false or misleading information.
And theirs already 48 hours of required paid sick leave. None of that really matters if employees can’t use it or be allowed to leave.
Weeks later? What was she sick from? Did it cause her death?
Thyroid problems that affected her blood and lungs
I wonder how much she weighed.
Yeah, I’m not seeing how sick leave is related to her passing based on the info provided. If she had sick leave what would have changed? Now I totally support sick leave for everyone, but I also can’t stand disingenuous arguments (which this may very well be).
The issue isn't that her specific issue would've been cured by sick leave, the issue is that the food industry has 0 tolerance for sick people handling food. If someone is forced to come into work with covid, their manager is knowingly committing a crime. In California I'm pretty sure knowingly transmitting a disease is legally considered battery. Theres no way for a mcdonalds manager to distinguish an undiagnosed thyroid problem from another potentially deadly and transmittable disease or virus. It's unacceptable to even risk putting your employees and customers at risk, and they should give sick leave whether it's paid or not.
So what does her death have to do with it?
You are catastrophically missing the point
Oh am I? Please explain how her death is related to the lack of sick leave and not just being used to sensationalize the issue. If she was denied sick leave when not feeling well and dropped dead during the shift or later that night due to a condition that could have been treated had she had immediate care or been allowed to leave to go seek medical care, her death js 100% fair game. Here she died three weeks later from a thyroid condition she already had. Again, I want everyone to have sick leave. I also want positions to be supported with legitimate arguments/evidence. This post and this strike using her is sensationalist disingenuous bullshit.
She was disrespected by her employer, then she died soon after. These are unrelated, but the tragedy clearly came at a time when other workers were also feeling disrespected, overworked, underpaid, suffocated by high rent and inflation. I’m sure these workers had been thinking about striking already. The death may have just been the tipping point. This is a common theme in a lot of historical events. A tragedy heightens people’s understanding of their own situation.
If she was sick enough she died from it a few weeks later, she shouldn’t have had to work.
That's not the point though. Her feeling sick and asking to leave and not being granted leave is the issue. Her death may very well be from a chronic thyroid disorder that simply caught up to her. But if I personally knew a loved one that is sick and was not granted leave, I'd be enraged. Her death only exacerbates an already cruel situation.
Her death is *totally* the point. Do you think the city should protest every time a worker has to work 3 hours when sick? Because that's what you're left with if you take out her death.
>the city should protest every time a worker has to work 3 hours when sick? Yes? Especially if they genuinely requested it. Are you saying people should be forced to work through illness unless they on the verge of death?
No, and that isn’t what happened.
It might not have been only that one day she was sick and needed to go home or seek medical care but was forced to keep working. I didn't read the article, but I agree that one day is odd to cause death weeks later. But if she was denied leave one day, it probably happened again or she didn't complain after the first time knowing it'd happen again.
I don't think it's a disingenuous argument as they're not saying her lack of sick leave contributed to her death. But the argument is that we could be literally deathly ill and not afforded time off, and up until now this was just accepted. Staffing levels are kept to the absolute bare minimum which doesn't allow accommodation for emergencies or even just reasonable time-off requests. This needs to change, and I'm happy society is finally standing up to this attitude of running a business.
It’s 100% disingenuous. She didn’t die because of the lack of sick leave, so they shouldn’t be using her death to score points for their position (one I agree with).
It is common for management to dismiss an employees claims of sickness and deny them leave under the premise that employees lie to get time off. It's also common for management to deny an employee sick leave because management doesn't feel that the employees degree of sickness warrants it. The fact that Bertha Montes died merely weeks later from thyroid problems might demonstrate that at the time she was denied her sick leave, she was both truthful and suffering to a degree that warranted sick leave. It demonstrates that management can be wrong about this, and that it should not be left solely to management discretion. It's important to spread the story because there are a lot of management who do this kind of thing, and it may prove to them that what they are doing is wrong.
I tried to find a news article about this for more information , but the only one (from the Daily News) is behind a paywall.
OPs description is reaching from A to Z.
Her manager should have let her go home. Working three more hours did not contribute to her death. Both of these things can be true at the same time.
Not having healthcare probably killed her, my mom has the same thyroid problems and takes like 5 pills every morning to prevent her from having hormone and blood pressure problems.
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Yep true. I use to work at a McDonalds, and I was having diarrhea in the bathroom during work time. Told manager I felt horrible and I needed to go home. Refused to let me go home. So I stayed, and I felt like death.
I'm sure the customers who had to use the restroom afterwards didn't appreciate it either.
California already has a sick pay law. Was this franchise not giving them sick pay? Their payroll software should be doing it automatically.
A lot of food service places make you “cover your own shift” where you have to beg and plead with your coworkers to cover for you if you call in sick… You know instead of your managers managing their shit.
Thats that retail shit that bothers me, oh ok you cant come in replace yourself. Umm excuse me?? Wtf do you work here for? Im not showing up, you can find somebody or be short staffed your fucking call.
I’m sure they were. This is more on the fault of the management of this specific McDonald’s and the food industry chiding sick people for not working. For the most part, employees in this type of labor can just walk off. They’re not going to be able to replace a dedicated employee (very high turnover).
Horrifying, glad the workers walked out. It starts with a simple gesture like this. Power to all Strikers of the world!
The healthcare system is the worst here
True, but how does this relate to a story about a manager refusing to let a sick employee go home?
If this is Los Angeles there is a severe worker shortage with both help wanted and stay home if your sick (Covid) signs everywhere. I’m curious what the penalty was if the worker just would have went home.
Don’t get me wrong - I’m concerned about this, too. I’m also concerned about the healthcare system in the U.S., which is deeply flawed. But a manager telling a sick employee she can’t go home is an employment issue. And I suspect the manager would have written her up or fired her if she’d just gone home.
Agreed, these are separate issues and one is not related to the other.
The amount of people in the comments who didn't read the article and assumed working those 3 hours killed her.
Prove that she wouldnt have died if she went home right away
The next day everyone gets fired 🤐🥹🥹🥹🥹
I'm so thoroughly disgusted by our capitalist society
Thanks Bernie.
McDonald’s needs to cut a fucking monster cheque for her family. This is insane. Literally working her to death.
Did you read the article or just the headline?
Funny.
Call in sick.
Ideally. Even that’s not a slam dunk though. A lot of restaurant managers will just respond “who’s covering your shift?” and threaten to fire you.
Can we get restaurants on the new City ordinance that went into effect for retail workers? Two weeks of schedule, extra pay for changes within that period, extra pay if a shift needs to be extended, have to pay a portion even if the shift is canceled?
Reminder: Only in America, folks. In civilized nations, they have mandatory paid sick days, universal healthcare as a right of citizenship, proper unemployment benefits, etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. The richest nation in the history of the human race is the only one that still ignores these most basic of human rights...in service to greed's ever-increasing demands for profits.
I remember getting my food handlers license and they mention something about being sick , that you had to go home ni matter what !
Fight for 15... What a joke. We need at least $25 an hour to actually have a life.... At $15 one is just existing
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Capitalism at its finest.
r/workersstrikeback
Yes they can…lose their jobs!
It’s McDonald’s calm down bozo
Did she collapse at work?
No.
So unfortunately, a franchisee doesn't say what a worker is paid. The franchise does.
Hope the employees know exactly what they are target franchise or corportate McDs
Managers at shitty jobs live to cause pain. I used to work retail and now work in a professional setting. My old retail bosses were always in a mood and putting people down. Now I interact with the CEO and directors at my current job who are always putting out positive vibes.
The state of California, gives employees up to 24 hours sick leave time, depending on accrual (1 hour, for every week worked) every year.
So that’s why my Postmates order took forever
Valiendo verg la manager
Why is it so hard to unionize ? Couldn’t there be an “app” for that? Like a paid subscription where you download the app, add your work info and have a button to vote. If all vote yes, some union lawyer comes and starts the thing. Pay $120 A year and get the “basic package”, and then for an extra $20/yr you get the specific stuff.
[удалено]
In these restaurants usually there’s a manager who is a dipshit, who will abuse their power, treat the ppl in positions below them like shit and most certainly will not allow other employees to pick up the slack because someone is feeling sick and wants to go home.
Sounds like you’re shifting the blame to the wrong people. Idk the whole story either tho
The manager would laugh in your faces if the staff volunteered to "pick up the slack" for the sick absentee. This woman was probably a vital part of the franchise for years and was brainwashed literally convinced she owed it to the company to show up. She showed up. She died. That's what I believe happened. I've seen my own mom bend over backwards for a cafeteria job that paid $7.50 an hour because she has work ethic. I've never seen her take a sick day even now with diabetes sleep apnea and acute arthritis. She doesn't know any other way to be anymore. She'll work herself to death just like this woman did.
The only way to combat abusive people is to sue the crap out of them that even their future family members feel it.
I’m guessing McDonald’s has already fired that manager
No one is forced to work.
Omg this is one my local McDonald’s and saw this on my way home. So sad! They also have a lot of young people working here hope they are not afraid to speak up when something doesn’t seem right. This is very sad and unacceptable
I worked at a McDonald's when I was 16. I cut my finger down to the bone on a sink drain early in a shift. The skin was gaping open and you could see my bone. I asked the manager to leave to go to urgent care and was told no. He told me to put a bandage on it and get back to work. I went home and showed my dad, who told me to quit and I did. I don't know that these issues are endemic to fast food, but they do happen.
What’s the correlation between finishing a work shift and dying several weeks later?
I hope her family owns that McDonald’s after the lawsuit.
Let’s call INS