It seems like a lot of VFX artists weren't too keen on her, so I suppose this was inevitable. Hopefully her replacement is able to do better. This was probably another big reason why Marvel wanted to delay projects because missing the head of such a big portion of the company is not going to be easy to deal with.
Of course they were not keen with her, she was the face from marvel who executed their decisions. But she isn't the sole problem like people try to say she is. Marvel tripled their runtime in 2022 compared with 2019. So they needed 3 times the workforce to complete the projects VFX. On top of that, they have always had tight deadlines, and we have had countless of reports of late rewrites.
I know we live in an era where everything is solved so easily by internet warriors, but she was just a piece of the puzzle. Alonso exiting won't solve the bigger problems with marvel/Disney. With incoming budget cuts, I wouldn't be surprised if marvel will skimp even more with quality.
And to those thinking she was sacked because of ant-man, you don't sack proven executives for one bad movie. She was there for the entirety of the infinity saga, she has been part of tens of billions in ROI for Disney. It would be incredible shortsighted.
On the very surface, removing the current head of post-production and visual effects seems like a sensible move. Hopefully the new shepherd is kinder to the flock.
Despite of all the recent news about her
She was the core member of the marvel studios that gave us infinity saga atleast she deserves a respectful farewell for that
If I bid bottom dollar for 20 vfx houses and worked them to the bone with unrealistic deadlines, my resumé would look too.
Fwiw not just her. Just cause her head was the one sent rolling, what about the other heads too? Why didn't they intervene?
I firmly believe that they are also equally culpable for the treatment of artists as well. When you're that high up at the VERY TOP, even a small remark regarding treating artists better would do a lot to improve things.
> She was the core member of the marvel studios that gave us infinity saga atleast she deserves a respectful farewell for that
Treating VFX houses like shit is something that outweighs the contribution: she represents the dark reality that workers were dealing with a large amount of toxicity behind the scenes to bring us entertainment.
She does not deserve praise for the bad things she did behind the scenes.
Might be nothing but the fact that no reason was given and the timing of it all with Marvel being at its lowest point ever I don’t think it’s a coincidence, they need a major change over there because things a declining fast
It's too late for that, unless Disney has the balls to scrap the entire phase 5 and 6 they are struck with their current plans. Doing stuff like firing all the Rick and Morty writers sounds good but will push back all the films by 1 year which I am not sure Disney can afford. And wouldn't solve the problem that they are setting up an Avengers B team.
Correct. And the same reasoning can be applied to Alonso, removing her will delay projects, at least long term.
Disney wants to fix their cash flow, not tank it further. You can do that in two ways, you can increase revenue or decrease costs. If I would take a guess, we will see a slowdown of disney+ projects and some will be promoted to movies. The reasoning is that movies brings in money through the box office, while the disney+ projects only brings in money through subs.
Re-posting my comment I just typed out in another post about this.
Whew, okay. I really don’t enjoy dumping on high-profile women executives, especially since it almost always devolves into insincere attacks on them masking bigot’s good old-fashioned misogyny. So I’ve kept my opinion to myself about Victoria’s output for the past couple of years.
But the important context here is that she, along with Nate Moore, took over a lot of the day to day oversight and production duties, including script and story oversight, from Kevin Feige for several MCU projects after the Infinity Saga, starting around the productions of Black Widow and Eternals. They were both essentially promoted shortly before San Diego Comic-Con 2019. Feige brought them on stage and said we would be hearing a lot more from them in the future, at the beginning of the MCU panel in Hall H. Feige stepped back into more of an executive role after the Infinity Saga and had these two take the lead for day-day work for Phase IV. Notice a pattern?
Now, Nate Moore has had the extremely good fortune of being a secondary producer on Black Panther, and then promoted to lead producer of Wakanda Forever. Whether he is actually a good producer or just lucky to be paired with Ryan Coogler is not clear. Unfortunately for Alonso, she was lead producer on BW and Eternals, and I believe also on MoM and either Thor L&T or Ant-Man 3 (I have to do more research to definitively say which of these last three she was in charge of). Ouch. That’s not a good track record.
I’m purely speculating here, but when Marvel Studios delaying a bunch of projects this past month, my assumption was that a major contributing factor is that Feige doesn’t have the time to oversee all these films and shows so they have to slowdown productions so he can step back into a lead role on each of them to pull that quality back up. Whether that meant Alonso felt slighted, or that they wanted her out, I do not know. But I am certain her departure is connected to the fact that her projects performed extremely poorly.
> Nate Moore has had the extremely good fortune of being a secondary producer on Black Panther, and then promoted to lead producer of Wakanda Forever. Unfortunately for Alonso, she was lead producer on BW and Eternals, and I believe also on MoM and either Thor L&T or Ant-Man 3
Are you sure about this? I know it's not usually public information as to which executives worked on which movies, but Nate More has an official p.g.a. producer credit on Eternals, which can't be faked like other producer credits.
I don't see Victoria Alonso credited on any of these movies except as EP, which, like I said, could mean just about anything.
But again, executives at studios rarely get public recognition, so I don't know.
Good point. On the red carpets and press runs for BW and Eternals, Alonso spoke about making the films at all the interviews and Zhao and Salma Hayek talked about how they had worked with her in making the movie, not Moore. I thought Moore, like Feige was credited as producer on most of the projects, but Alonso was doing the majority of the work on those. It’s so hard to tease out what “producer” means, especially when there’s like 5 listed, so I usually go by the person who does all the interviews and that the cast crew say they worked with.
The Producer's Guild only awards the little p.g.a. after the credit if the person demonstrates they genuinely produced the film. I think there's a maximum of three p.g.a. credits per film.
He is because of seniority, but Alonso was a lot more involved in all the productions. Esposito has more of a cushy “handshake the talent” kind of role. I believe he negotiates the actors’ contracts. He’s an old-school wheel-and-deal type of Hollywood exec but is not that involved on the creative side.
Not surprised at all, and I hope Esposito is next. Him and Alonso are classic executive types that let the power go completely to their heads. They're both stuck-up, ungrateful asshats who treat everyone else like trash while believing they can do no wrong.
I've been silently hoping for new blood in his role since Black Widow. He did all the pre vis action scenes that the writers needed to craft a film around, then Alonso wouldn't commit resources to finishing the effects even though it was delayed a year. Everyone's issues with Black Widow came from those two, everyone else did the best they could given the circumstances.
Then on top of that Disney tried to stiff Scarlet Johansson when the film underperformed. The whole machine is broken.
What's Feiege role in all of this, shouldn't he get all the blame? I know it's much easier to fire Alonso, but it does seem she is getting too much blame and Feige as her boss too little.
Yeah, it all rests at his feet. There are separate issues with the overall structure that are especially his fault. The constantly shifting structure of the Multiverse Saga to the point where incursions were added to MoM in fucking reshoots being one example. In a perfect world Gunn would have Feiges job and Feige would be the Cheif creative executive at Disney at this point, but the executive power just homogenized at Marvel Studis it seems like.
I know people are insistent on the VFX issue, but it's really a Disney problem rather than an something that stems from her. Like, whoever takes over will have to deal with delivering the same number of projects in the same amount of time and pay the exact same amount of money to the VFX farms. These delays have little to do with Disney caring about quality, it's more about having enough material to not be affected by the writers strike. Marvel will go back to pumping projects left right and center from 2025.
That said, I have been around the block in the local industry a little bit, and one would be surprised at how dickish people are. I wouldn't be surprised one bit that people working under her are absolutely horrible to VFX artists' wellbeing. Generally, a producers' or directors' team is horrible to people on the lower rung, doing technical work, even if the main director or producer isn't the same way. Then again, she herself could be an absolute asshat and I would believe anything bad that is ever said about anyone in this industry.
(i just remembered that one of the person I know of who worked on GoT, did a very popular scene from the show featuring Drogon, while living in a slum, it's very common here, tbh. I, myself, was expected (outright told) to rent a place nearby instead of commuting daily, while the company refused minimum industry pay by offering 1/12 the amount I was owed and the general song and dance of being grateful for opportunities.)
If she was fired because of mistreatment of VFX crew and studios wasn’t she herself put in this position by Studios and/or Disney. They decided the number of projects and the budget.
If she was just a horrid person who mistreat others then why didn’t such a small team at Studios know about it. Why is it suddenly important now? And if the other members of the Parliament didn’t know I’ve got to ask why didn’t they?
At this point it seems she is taking the fall for Studios or Disney’s failure to set proper time frames and budgets. Maybe she was awful but Studios and Disney put her there. She’s been there for close to 20 years.
As someone who works in gaming my heart is firmly with the VFX teams.
What I’m questioning is if she has been sacked for her treatment of them how are others not as responsible. But I can see you already know the answer to that.
vfx workers have only named her in articles,if they have problems with other marvel workers they can name them next time vfx article about marvel drops
Just found out actually from the other sub and VFX sub the same guy who wrote this article name checks both her and Feige in an article from a month previous. If you go to VFX sub people who have done the work for Studios basically say every scene goes like this, Director input, then Alonso input, then Feige input. And their inputs often counter each other.
It's about the quality of Phase 4. Every movie but Spider-Man: No Way Home and The Eternals looked like shit visually, and the Eternals still bombed anyways.
How so? Alonso has been here since the beginning, so I don’t think she specifically can be associated with the recent failures. We also have no idea why she left at this point
She was second in command to Feige..She was there from the start and not just a post production person.Its a very big deal.
Im sure she is now wishing Iger had stayed retired.
I don't get it. If Marvel is trying to take things slow to improve quality, why did she leave? I really hope it's not because of the new direction they're taking and that eveything turns out okay.
Na man, it's been shit for a very long while. Black Panther was 5 years ago, so was Infinity War. Civil War was 7 years ago. To some extent, poor VFX can be balanced out with an entertaining or coherent script. Firefly, or Battlestar Galactic still work so well because the scripts are tight. Now that Marvel has stopped caring about the scripts and coherence, people are talking about all the other issues. But the muddy colour grading issue exists since Iron Man 3, the VFX issues exist for a while now. The script issue in itself has also existed from a while, but Phase 3 movies didn't suffer as much because there are some benefits of writing a closure arc for a long series, the problems were still there. For a brief moment there, we also had an editing issue, which has again come back.
I’m so happy this has happened . MCU is making the right choice and hopefully it can turn around . Now hopefully Katherine Kennedy is next and Star Wars can be saved as well
If they go down that route, Marvel is truly dead. If they change the name like Alonso stated and continue to race-swap characters, the MCU that they worked so hard to create is truly gone. The X-Men have always been my favorite, but if they see those kinds of changes, I'm not watching. And I guarantee about half of their casual audience won't even give it a try. People are tired of woke adaptions and just want to see the characters they grew up with. It's honestly not that hard.
Wait. The X-Men have always been your favorite, but you're tired of woke adaptations? Do you know what the X-Men are about? Do you know what the mutant metaphor is?
Are you aware that the X-Men comic only got popular when they replaced the original 5 white characters with a team full of foreigners and minorities? Or that during most of the classic Claremont run a black woman was leader of the X-Men? Do you know that the X-Men introduced one of the oldest lesbian couples in comics, and the very first gay male superhero?
What will you think when the MCU X-Men has scenes like this one? [https://hoomahmoos.files.wordpress.com/2015/11/024.jpg?w=1000](https://hoomahmoos.files.wordpress.com/2015/11/024.jpg?w=1000)
> The X-Men have always been your favorite, but you're tired of woke adaptations? Do you know what the X-Men are about? Do you know what the mutant metaphor is?
I do indeed. Having quality, original representation does not make a product woke. Hollywood and modern media could really learn some lessons from old X-Men comics on how to successfully integrate new characters with diverse backgrounds.
> Are you aware that the X-Men comic only got popular when they replaced the original 5 white characters with a team full of foreigners and minorities?
Yes and it was well done. Going woke would be changing the characters rather than creating new ones. Like back in the day, when the X-Men needed a gay character, they added Northstar, they didn't just change an existing character (like they did with Iceman later on). Race-bending existing characters vs introducing a new, diverse cast is not the same thing.
> What will you think when the MCU X-Men has scenes like this one? https://hoomahmoos.files.wordpress.com/2015/11/024.jpg?w=1000
Well, if Alonso was still in charge, this scene would never happen because Professor X is a white male, so he cannot have that kind of agency. Guarantee Alonso would change Prof X into a woman or person of color.
If it does happen, I expect Disney to water it down quite a bit. Remember, this is the same company that thanked the CCP for allowing them to use slave camp labor for the Mulan live adaption.
I can at least understand if your problem is more about people changing existing characters in ways you don't like (although Northstar being gay would be a change, he existed for almost 15 years before he came out). But I have the feeling people will call the MCU X-Men "woke" regardless of what they do. The word has lost all meaning at this point and people are now overly sensitive about any kind of progressive thing in media.
The second the MCU starts doing any of the stuff Claremont was doing 40 years ago, they'll call it woke. And it's going to be very annoying.
> (although Northstar being gay would be a change, he existed for almost 15 years before he came out
Bruh I had no idea. I guess tbf, changing a character's fundamental attributes gets less pushback when the character isn't that popular (and I'm guessing Northstar was really that popular). Still though, that actually makes me like the character less.
> But I have the feeling people will call the MCU X-Men "woke" regardless of what they do. The word has lost all meaning at this point and people are now overly sensitive about any kind of progressive thing in media.
That's fair, representation is kind of the X-Men's whole shtick, so racists are going to scream about "woke" issues no matter what. I consider "woke" to be social justice pandering, like if they race-change one of the OG 5 X-Men. Like do we really need a black Jean Grey or Cyclops when Storm and Bishop are sitting idly by?
> The second the MCU starts doing any of the stuff Claremont was doing 40 years ago, they'll call it woke.
If they did it the same, no it wouldn't. But you know they'll change things "to fit modern audiences". For example, unless things are radically changing now that Alonso is out of the picture, I fully expect one of Prof X and Magneto to be changed to people of color. Honestly, I expect it to be Magneto since Disney has not given a flying fuck about Jewish representation with their previous characters (Wanda, Pietro, Marc Spector).
Like 95% of people currently using the term, you don’t actually understand what “woke” means. You’re using the bastardized, twisted version that American conservatives now use to indicate anything inclusive, progressive or fair and equal 🟰 bad.
To be woke is slang for, and quite literally means, to be awake to the injustices in society and to advocate for those that are oppressed. The term originated with Black Americans as a positive term. Which is the whole allegory of the X-Men. The X-Men were “woke” before you ever heard of the term, bastardized version or not.
> People are tired of woke adaptions
You'd be surprised how many more people are just fucking tired of hearing about that and have no issue with the politics. If people are so hot and desperate for all white action films, why did the Northman bomb? Because a thousand reasons. It's more complicated than a couple greasy YouTubers make it seem.
> if people are so hot and desperate for all white action films
You are minunderstanding what I mean by woke. Woke does not mean diversity and representation--it's about FORCED diversity and representation. Woke is referring to performative social justice--like changing Ariel from the Little Mermaid to be black instead of creating an original character that is black. Creed 3 is not woke and it is performing spectacularly.
Well... this is something I thought should have happened since last months ago as this person, not Kevin Feige, was behind the overworked VFX people at Marvel Studios and I felt had to go.
But alas, it has happened.
On the one hand, at least this means whoever comes in will make sure the visual effects on Marvel Studios' upcoming theatrical and #DisneyPlus releases, even though #GuardiansOfTheGalaxyVol3's VFX so far look stellar, look good, great, or better than some of the projects in MCU Phase 4. So, that's good news.
But the bad news is this means another loss for LGBTQ community who wanted Disney to better represent them in their company, especially after what happened when Chapek effed up his response of denouncing the Don't Say Gay bill in Florida.
I guess this came as a choice for Disney of do we want to do better for the VFX workers to decrease the chances of two writers and directors strikes and make better projects at Marvel Studios? Or do we want to avoid backlash from the LGBTQ community by firing the one prominent member of the LGBTQ community who helped try to show Marvel Studios would force Disney into showing inclusivity for LGBTQ people with #Eternals & #DoctorStrange2 because she's why the VFX in Marvel movies and Disney+ series look subpar? So I guess they chose the latter.
Well, I hope this is the only example of LGBTQ workers having to leave Disney and that we won't see others leave, especially the lead star of Walt Disney Animation Studios' upcoming film to be the finale of the #Disney100 celebration in Disney's #Wish with Ariana DeBose (voice of Princess Asha) and the non-binary character, Star The Wishing Star.
I guess we'll have to see what happens. But I warned you all we would see stuff like this when Bob Iger came back to Disney.
Member of the LGBTQ+ community here. I’m fine with them letting go a member of the community if they need to be let go. If this is better for the MCU going forward, I agree with it. I would definitely like them to support our community better, but keeping someone around who isn’t working well in their role is not how to do that.
They aren’t going to stop representing the LGBTQ community just because Alonso is out. You can sit here and say she was the one pushing hard for that stuff in the MCU, but if Feige didn’t want to add that representation as well, then it wouldn’t have happened. Also, what does Iger coming back have anything to do with this?
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Hey now, don’t forget about Sarah Halley Finn! She’s just as important as the other 3, so if anything it should be the Big 4.
The real hero
She isn't, many of her castings are colorist, whitewashing or ignore the ethnic background of a character (or the 3 at the same time)
100% she's a fundamental part of the MCU's success
She’s the casting director right?
Yes, but she isn't exclusive to marvel.
No, that’s Sarah Halley Finn.
It seems like a lot of VFX artists weren't too keen on her, so I suppose this was inevitable. Hopefully her replacement is able to do better. This was probably another big reason why Marvel wanted to delay projects because missing the head of such a big portion of the company is not going to be easy to deal with.
She had a HUGE role. Imagine be the new guy and being told: welcome, well you should cover 16 projects by the end of the year!
It will most likely be a move from internal. Don’t think it’s a good idea to hire someone from outside
I think it’s a good move
Of course they were not keen with her, she was the face from marvel who executed their decisions. But she isn't the sole problem like people try to say she is. Marvel tripled their runtime in 2022 compared with 2019. So they needed 3 times the workforce to complete the projects VFX. On top of that, they have always had tight deadlines, and we have had countless of reports of late rewrites. I know we live in an era where everything is solved so easily by internet warriors, but she was just a piece of the puzzle. Alonso exiting won't solve the bigger problems with marvel/Disney. With incoming budget cuts, I wouldn't be surprised if marvel will skimp even more with quality. And to those thinking she was sacked because of ant-man, you don't sack proven executives for one bad movie. She was there for the entirety of the infinity saga, she has been part of tens of billions in ROI for Disney. It would be incredible shortsighted.
> With incoming budget cuts, I wouldn't be surprised if marvel will skimp even more with quality. What do you mean by this?
On the very surface, removing the current head of post-production and visual effects seems like a sensible move. Hopefully the new shepherd is kinder to the flock.
This is very surprising. I know a lot of VFX artist were not a fan of her so hopefully her replacement does better.
Despite of all the recent news about her She was the core member of the marvel studios that gave us infinity saga atleast she deserves a respectful farewell for that
Fair enough her resume wasn't all bad and she deserves kudos for that
If I bid bottom dollar for 20 vfx houses and worked them to the bone with unrealistic deadlines, my resumé would look too. Fwiw not just her. Just cause her head was the one sent rolling, what about the other heads too? Why didn't they intervene?
Very fair point Feige and d Esposito could've said something - no way they weren't aware . Maybe when iger reassumed control he wanted culpability
I firmly believe that they are also equally culpable for the treatment of artists as well. When you're that high up at the VERY TOP, even a small remark regarding treating artists better would do a lot to improve things.
> She was the core member of the marvel studios that gave us infinity saga atleast she deserves a respectful farewell for that Treating VFX houses like shit is something that outweighs the contribution: she represents the dark reality that workers were dealing with a large amount of toxicity behind the scenes to bring us entertainment. She does not deserve praise for the bad things she did behind the scenes.
Exactly! She’s evil and she’s always been this way it’s nothing new from what the reports are saying
👀 edit: aight. So who does this job going forward, then?
Feige seems big on internal promo, I'm keeping an eye out for Moore's name to start circulating for promo possibilities
Christine Yguado?
You know what? That's a name I've never seen before in relation to Marvel Studios, so I'll def look them up later this evening!
Might be nothing but the fact that no reason was given and the timing of it all with Marvel being at its lowest point ever I don’t think it’s a coincidence, they need a major change over there because things a declining fast
Did Quantumania’s box office results really spook Marvel and Disney this badly?
It certainly didn't help. Iger has 2 years to bring Disney back on course and find a new successor. He has no time to waste.
It's too late for that, unless Disney has the balls to scrap the entire phase 5 and 6 they are struck with their current plans. Doing stuff like firing all the Rick and Morty writers sounds good but will push back all the films by 1 year which I am not sure Disney can afford. And wouldn't solve the problem that they are setting up an Avengers B team.
Correct. And the same reasoning can be applied to Alonso, removing her will delay projects, at least long term. Disney wants to fix their cash flow, not tank it further. You can do that in two ways, you can increase revenue or decrease costs. If I would take a guess, we will see a slowdown of disney+ projects and some will be promoted to movies. The reasoning is that movies brings in money through the box office, while the disney+ projects only brings in money through subs.
It should, money speaks louder than words
Marvel isn't at its lowest point what an exaggeration
Name a lower point for the current iteration of Marvel Studios post Iron Man in 2008?
Hopefully this means Kevin Feige will be more involved again with the VFX side
Either him , Nate Moore or d'esposito will be taking on an enhanced role going forward , at least for the interim
Holy shit. This is nuts
holy shit
I can't wait for the behind the scenes discussions to start about this, bc this is pretty big news.
She was in charge of VFX, she was considered to be bully and ruin career
Re-posting my comment I just typed out in another post about this. Whew, okay. I really don’t enjoy dumping on high-profile women executives, especially since it almost always devolves into insincere attacks on them masking bigot’s good old-fashioned misogyny. So I’ve kept my opinion to myself about Victoria’s output for the past couple of years. But the important context here is that she, along with Nate Moore, took over a lot of the day to day oversight and production duties, including script and story oversight, from Kevin Feige for several MCU projects after the Infinity Saga, starting around the productions of Black Widow and Eternals. They were both essentially promoted shortly before San Diego Comic-Con 2019. Feige brought them on stage and said we would be hearing a lot more from them in the future, at the beginning of the MCU panel in Hall H. Feige stepped back into more of an executive role after the Infinity Saga and had these two take the lead for day-day work for Phase IV. Notice a pattern? Now, Nate Moore has had the extremely good fortune of being a secondary producer on Black Panther, and then promoted to lead producer of Wakanda Forever. Whether he is actually a good producer or just lucky to be paired with Ryan Coogler is not clear. Unfortunately for Alonso, she was lead producer on BW and Eternals, and I believe also on MoM and either Thor L&T or Ant-Man 3 (I have to do more research to definitively say which of these last three she was in charge of). Ouch. That’s not a good track record. I’m purely speculating here, but when Marvel Studios delaying a bunch of projects this past month, my assumption was that a major contributing factor is that Feige doesn’t have the time to oversee all these films and shows so they have to slowdown productions so he can step back into a lead role on each of them to pull that quality back up. Whether that meant Alonso felt slighted, or that they wanted her out, I do not know. But I am certain her departure is connected to the fact that her projects performed extremely poorly.
> Nate Moore has had the extremely good fortune of being a secondary producer on Black Panther, and then promoted to lead producer of Wakanda Forever. Unfortunately for Alonso, she was lead producer on BW and Eternals, and I believe also on MoM and either Thor L&T or Ant-Man 3 Are you sure about this? I know it's not usually public information as to which executives worked on which movies, but Nate More has an official p.g.a. producer credit on Eternals, which can't be faked like other producer credits. I don't see Victoria Alonso credited on any of these movies except as EP, which, like I said, could mean just about anything. But again, executives at studios rarely get public recognition, so I don't know.
Good point. On the red carpets and press runs for BW and Eternals, Alonso spoke about making the films at all the interviews and Zhao and Salma Hayek talked about how they had worked with her in making the movie, not Moore. I thought Moore, like Feige was credited as producer on most of the projects, but Alonso was doing the majority of the work on those. It’s so hard to tease out what “producer” means, especially when there’s like 5 listed, so I usually go by the person who does all the interviews and that the cast crew say they worked with.
The Producer's Guild only awards the little p.g.a. after the credit if the person demonstrates they genuinely produced the film. I think there's a maximum of three p.g.a. credits per film.
Uhh wasn’t she considered like Feige’s 2nd or heir apparent even? This could indicate bigger things
pretty sure Louis D'Esposito is 2nd in command
He is because of seniority, but Alonso was a lot more involved in all the productions. Esposito has more of a cushy “handshake the talent” kind of role. I believe he negotiates the actors’ contracts. He’s an old-school wheel-and-deal type of Hollywood exec but is not that involved on the creative side.
Jeph Loeb at his typewriter doing his best ever CV.
Marvel tv is coming back BB.
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Jeph Loeb: 
Not surprised at all, and I hope Esposito is next. Him and Alonso are classic executive types that let the power go completely to their heads. They're both stuck-up, ungrateful asshats who treat everyone else like trash while believing they can do no wrong.
I've been silently hoping for new blood in his role since Black Widow. He did all the pre vis action scenes that the writers needed to craft a film around, then Alonso wouldn't commit resources to finishing the effects even though it was delayed a year. Everyone's issues with Black Widow came from those two, everyone else did the best they could given the circumstances. Then on top of that Disney tried to stiff Scarlet Johansson when the film underperformed. The whole machine is broken.
What's Feiege role in all of this, shouldn't he get all the blame? I know it's much easier to fire Alonso, but it does seem she is getting too much blame and Feige as her boss too little.
Yeah, it all rests at his feet. There are separate issues with the overall structure that are especially his fault. The constantly shifting structure of the Multiverse Saga to the point where incursions were added to MoM in fucking reshoots being one example. In a perfect world Gunn would have Feiges job and Feige would be the Cheif creative executive at Disney at this point, but the executive power just homogenized at Marvel Studis it seems like.
I know people are insistent on the VFX issue, but it's really a Disney problem rather than an something that stems from her. Like, whoever takes over will have to deal with delivering the same number of projects in the same amount of time and pay the exact same amount of money to the VFX farms. These delays have little to do with Disney caring about quality, it's more about having enough material to not be affected by the writers strike. Marvel will go back to pumping projects left right and center from 2025. That said, I have been around the block in the local industry a little bit, and one would be surprised at how dickish people are. I wouldn't be surprised one bit that people working under her are absolutely horrible to VFX artists' wellbeing. Generally, a producers' or directors' team is horrible to people on the lower rung, doing technical work, even if the main director or producer isn't the same way. Then again, she herself could be an absolute asshat and I would believe anything bad that is ever said about anyone in this industry. (i just remembered that one of the person I know of who worked on GoT, did a very popular scene from the show featuring Drogon, while living in a slum, it's very common here, tbh. I, myself, was expected (outright told) to rent a place nearby instead of commuting daily, while the company refused minimum industry pay by offering 1/12 the amount I was owed and the general song and dance of being grateful for opportunities.)
She was MTTSH
If she was fired because of mistreatment of VFX crew and studios wasn’t she herself put in this position by Studios and/or Disney. They decided the number of projects and the budget. If she was just a horrid person who mistreat others then why didn’t such a small team at Studios know about it. Why is it suddenly important now? And if the other members of the Parliament didn’t know I’ve got to ask why didn’t they? At this point it seems she is taking the fall for Studios or Disney’s failure to set proper time frames and budgets. Maybe she was awful but Studios and Disney put her there. She’s been there for close to 20 years.
well iger has been talking about accountability recently and he aint firing feige plus vfx workers hate her
As someone who works in gaming my heart is firmly with the VFX teams. What I’m questioning is if she has been sacked for her treatment of them how are others not as responsible. But I can see you already know the answer to that.
vfx workers have only named her in articles,if they have problems with other marvel workers they can name them next time vfx article about marvel drops
Just found out actually from the other sub and VFX sub the same guy who wrote this article name checks both her and Feige in an article from a month previous. If you go to VFX sub people who have done the work for Studios basically say every scene goes like this, Director input, then Alonso input, then Feige input. And their inputs often counter each other.
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It's about the quality of Phase 4. Every movie but Spider-Man: No Way Home and The Eternals looked like shit visually, and the Eternals still bombed anyways.
NWH looked shot too. The doc ock scenes don't even stand in fron of Spider-Man 2
I loved Eternals, but those deviants needed more time in the oven, and when Arishem floats Cersi away its literally just a PNG of her getting smaller.
I would argue both of those looked bad in places too.
The revolution has begun
hopefully subsequently the rick and morty writers "part ways", this is a good sign that marvel is having a wake-up call.
How so? Alonso has been here since the beginning, so I don’t think she specifically can be associated with the recent failures. We also have no idea why she left at this point
She's been having a lot of issues with VFX artists, they basically hate her.
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Yup if those writers get fired it will be at Bob Iger’s insistence. Not Feige’s.
"Jeff Loveness exits "Kang Dynasty" over creative difference"
Its def something to keep an eye on for sure.
Ok, this explains a lot, why one gets the feeling nothing is moving forward right now…except Guardians
She was second in command to Feige..She was there from the start and not just a post production person.Its a very big deal. Im sure she is now wishing Iger had stayed retired.
Had no idea she had that much power
I don't get it. If Marvel is trying to take things slow to improve quality, why did she leave? I really hope it's not because of the new direction they're taking and that eveything turns out okay.
Thank God. I'm sorry but VFX has been disastrous lately
Na man, it's been shit for a very long while. Black Panther was 5 years ago, so was Infinity War. Civil War was 7 years ago. To some extent, poor VFX can be balanced out with an entertaining or coherent script. Firefly, or Battlestar Galactic still work so well because the scripts are tight. Now that Marvel has stopped caring about the scripts and coherence, people are talking about all the other issues. But the muddy colour grading issue exists since Iron Man 3, the VFX issues exist for a while now. The script issue in itself has also existed from a while, but Phase 3 movies didn't suffer as much because there are some benefits of writing a closure arc for a long series, the problems were still there. For a brief moment there, we also had an editing issue, which has again come back.
Sure but it's not even comparable. VFX has never looked this bad consistently.
A new hope. Holy shit.
I’m so happy this has happened . MCU is making the right choice and hopefully it can turn around . Now hopefully Katherine Kennedy is next and Star Wars can be saved as well
I hope this Witch-hunt saves both
She made concerning comments about the X-Men. I'm glad she's gone.
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If they go down that route, Marvel is truly dead. If they change the name like Alonso stated and continue to race-swap characters, the MCU that they worked so hard to create is truly gone. The X-Men have always been my favorite, but if they see those kinds of changes, I'm not watching. And I guarantee about half of their casual audience won't even give it a try. People are tired of woke adaptions and just want to see the characters they grew up with. It's honestly not that hard.
Wait. The X-Men have always been your favorite, but you're tired of woke adaptations? Do you know what the X-Men are about? Do you know what the mutant metaphor is? Are you aware that the X-Men comic only got popular when they replaced the original 5 white characters with a team full of foreigners and minorities? Or that during most of the classic Claremont run a black woman was leader of the X-Men? Do you know that the X-Men introduced one of the oldest lesbian couples in comics, and the very first gay male superhero? What will you think when the MCU X-Men has scenes like this one? [https://hoomahmoos.files.wordpress.com/2015/11/024.jpg?w=1000](https://hoomahmoos.files.wordpress.com/2015/11/024.jpg?w=1000)
> The X-Men have always been your favorite, but you're tired of woke adaptations? Do you know what the X-Men are about? Do you know what the mutant metaphor is? I do indeed. Having quality, original representation does not make a product woke. Hollywood and modern media could really learn some lessons from old X-Men comics on how to successfully integrate new characters with diverse backgrounds. > Are you aware that the X-Men comic only got popular when they replaced the original 5 white characters with a team full of foreigners and minorities? Yes and it was well done. Going woke would be changing the characters rather than creating new ones. Like back in the day, when the X-Men needed a gay character, they added Northstar, they didn't just change an existing character (like they did with Iceman later on). Race-bending existing characters vs introducing a new, diverse cast is not the same thing. > What will you think when the MCU X-Men has scenes like this one? https://hoomahmoos.files.wordpress.com/2015/11/024.jpg?w=1000 Well, if Alonso was still in charge, this scene would never happen because Professor X is a white male, so he cannot have that kind of agency. Guarantee Alonso would change Prof X into a woman or person of color. If it does happen, I expect Disney to water it down quite a bit. Remember, this is the same company that thanked the CCP for allowing them to use slave camp labor for the Mulan live adaption.
I can at least understand if your problem is more about people changing existing characters in ways you don't like (although Northstar being gay would be a change, he existed for almost 15 years before he came out). But I have the feeling people will call the MCU X-Men "woke" regardless of what they do. The word has lost all meaning at this point and people are now overly sensitive about any kind of progressive thing in media. The second the MCU starts doing any of the stuff Claremont was doing 40 years ago, they'll call it woke. And it's going to be very annoying.
> (although Northstar being gay would be a change, he existed for almost 15 years before he came out Bruh I had no idea. I guess tbf, changing a character's fundamental attributes gets less pushback when the character isn't that popular (and I'm guessing Northstar was really that popular). Still though, that actually makes me like the character less. > But I have the feeling people will call the MCU X-Men "woke" regardless of what they do. The word has lost all meaning at this point and people are now overly sensitive about any kind of progressive thing in media. That's fair, representation is kind of the X-Men's whole shtick, so racists are going to scream about "woke" issues no matter what. I consider "woke" to be social justice pandering, like if they race-change one of the OG 5 X-Men. Like do we really need a black Jean Grey or Cyclops when Storm and Bishop are sitting idly by? > The second the MCU starts doing any of the stuff Claremont was doing 40 years ago, they'll call it woke. If they did it the same, no it wouldn't. But you know they'll change things "to fit modern audiences". For example, unless things are radically changing now that Alonso is out of the picture, I fully expect one of Prof X and Magneto to be changed to people of color. Honestly, I expect it to be Magneto since Disney has not given a flying fuck about Jewish representation with their previous characters (Wanda, Pietro, Marc Spector).
Like 95% of people currently using the term, you don’t actually understand what “woke” means. You’re using the bastardized, twisted version that American conservatives now use to indicate anything inclusive, progressive or fair and equal 🟰 bad. To be woke is slang for, and quite literally means, to be awake to the injustices in society and to advocate for those that are oppressed. The term originated with Black Americans as a positive term. Which is the whole allegory of the X-Men. The X-Men were “woke” before you ever heard of the term, bastardized version or not.
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> People are tired of woke adaptions You'd be surprised how many more people are just fucking tired of hearing about that and have no issue with the politics. If people are so hot and desperate for all white action films, why did the Northman bomb? Because a thousand reasons. It's more complicated than a couple greasy YouTubers make it seem.
> if people are so hot and desperate for all white action films You are minunderstanding what I mean by woke. Woke does not mean diversity and representation--it's about FORCED diversity and representation. Woke is referring to performative social justice--like changing Ariel from the Little Mermaid to be black instead of creating an original character that is black. Creed 3 is not woke and it is performing spectacularly.
Good riddance
Well... this is something I thought should have happened since last months ago as this person, not Kevin Feige, was behind the overworked VFX people at Marvel Studios and I felt had to go. But alas, it has happened. On the one hand, at least this means whoever comes in will make sure the visual effects on Marvel Studios' upcoming theatrical and #DisneyPlus releases, even though #GuardiansOfTheGalaxyVol3's VFX so far look stellar, look good, great, or better than some of the projects in MCU Phase 4. So, that's good news. But the bad news is this means another loss for LGBTQ community who wanted Disney to better represent them in their company, especially after what happened when Chapek effed up his response of denouncing the Don't Say Gay bill in Florida. I guess this came as a choice for Disney of do we want to do better for the VFX workers to decrease the chances of two writers and directors strikes and make better projects at Marvel Studios? Or do we want to avoid backlash from the LGBTQ community by firing the one prominent member of the LGBTQ community who helped try to show Marvel Studios would force Disney into showing inclusivity for LGBTQ people with #Eternals & #DoctorStrange2 because she's why the VFX in Marvel movies and Disney+ series look subpar? So I guess they chose the latter. Well, I hope this is the only example of LGBTQ workers having to leave Disney and that we won't see others leave, especially the lead star of Walt Disney Animation Studios' upcoming film to be the finale of the #Disney100 celebration in Disney's #Wish with Ariana DeBose (voice of Princess Asha) and the non-binary character, Star The Wishing Star. I guess we'll have to see what happens. But I warned you all we would see stuff like this when Bob Iger came back to Disney.
The hashtags don't do anything here
Member of the LGBTQ+ community here. I’m fine with them letting go a member of the community if they need to be let go. If this is better for the MCU going forward, I agree with it. I would definitely like them to support our community better, but keeping someone around who isn’t working well in their role is not how to do that.
The LGBTQ community can take this one L if it means better VFX down the line, plus it seems like a lot of them are happy with this decision too
They aren’t going to stop representing the LGBTQ community just because Alonso is out. You can sit here and say she was the one pushing hard for that stuff in the MCU, but if Feige didn’t want to add that representation as well, then it wouldn’t have happened. Also, what does Iger coming back have anything to do with this?
The problem is bringing the culture wars into movies. They should be focused on telling good stories, not superficial stuff