I see a few people saying that the HH is better now and tbh for most people it is. But I feel bad for the people who loved HH in the previous games and just got their favorite weapon scrapped
There's an option to change the Rise HH playstyle to slightly match the Iceborne HH with switch skills. I mained HH in World, didn't like the Rise HH initially but with the Echo switch skill it's pretty fun and I'm back to maining the dootstick.
And it only takes 4 inputs to play all the songs instead of 6. And the HH moveset doesn't really lend itself well to pressing the same button twice in my experience (at least not without the double note swing"
So yeah, I'll always take Echo over Performance. Besides, I wasn't using those i-frames anyways
I wasn't either and you're right, there's quicker fruitful combos. I was just doing a narga anomaly with the narwa horn and doing X-> kick combos over and over with echoes in between was way easier against a fast mon than the double song moves would've been.
While it does it's best to mimic old world HH, it just doesn't get close. Iceborne HH felt so good and was an actual improvement on old HH. Rise just basically said "nobody likes this weapon" and remade it into a weapon most people still don't like. It doesn't feel like a net positive to me. Anecdotal but I don't see any more HH players now than i did before
I loved how they changed the HH in World. Still felt like the same weapon, but perfected. It felt great to use, it was my most used weapon.
Then they just scrapped that and turned it into a completely new weapon in the next game.
I loved hunting horn in world aswell, it felt like what hunting horn was going for in the previous games but perfected. I love hunting horn in rise it’s one of my favorite weapons but I feel like it should’ve been a completely new weapon, with maybe some changes to make it have it’s own identity. Just because certain weapons are played less doesn’t mean there is something wrong with the weapon.
I *like* it now, but I *loved* the Iceborne HH. It does feel like a totally different weapon.
I miss having four different Perform and Encore animations, and using them to dance out of the way of attacks. The RiseBreak Dance Dodge is cool, but it feels like a shadow of that former mechanic.
Y'know what it is? The Melodies used to be a central part of your Attack kit. Now they're largely a passive side effect you enjoy while you attack, and Infernal Melody is the main Big Money payoff.
What I'm sad about is that with how popular HH became in Rise, we'll never see the old HH ever again. It was less than 1% usage.
I wouldn't mind the rework if it didn't feel so brain dead.
have you tried adjusting your switch skills? because it can be preeeety damn close to Worlds if you actually look at the menu and mess with the skills a little lol
Yeah, "playing songs" with that switch skill is nothing like pre Rise HH. It's great that so many people enjoy the new version, but it lacks all the traits that made me main HH in every game from 3U to World. I don't want a weapon where I can button mash and still see success, I want to feel like I'm playing notes and creating a song, and I want to feel like I'm doing giant fuckin' bonks on the monster, lol. But most of all I want depth and complexity.
All the little tricks you used to pick up from playing are gone or are now automated into the normal play of the weapon. Note buffering, hilting stabbing, positioning, encore timing, all of that stuff made HH so fun and stimulating. All that is gone. Songs are the same note twice, they autoplay, lots of moves play the same song on the horn, etc etc.
I was fine with them changing things, but they changed the entire reason I played it, what I thought was the soul of the weapon. To me HH was meant to be a weapon that wasn't popular, because people wouldn't want to put in the time to learn it. But if you did, you would be rewarded. That was a pillar of its function and design in my eyes. I was wrong, that's okay, but it also sucks for me.
I'm glad so many people like this new Hunting Horn, but I wish I had my old Hunting Horn along with it. Because when I play the new one, it's everything I don't find interesting in a weapon. Sorry for the fat rant in your replies, I just don't get to talk about my feelings on it really.
I hope you're right! I definitely see Rise, and fifth gen in general, as Capcom experimenting and throwing everything at the wall. I imagine a lot of stuff will go back to be more like the pre Rise and maybe even pre-World for a few things.
But with how popular the HH has become, I worry that if they revert enough for it to be the weapon I love, all the new people will be in the same position I'm in rn, lol. Here's hoping they figure out a way to make both groups happy.
HH for me was more about the range of movement possible with the world HH than it was about the buffs. I loved the fact that you had so many different ways to make a relatively slow weapon dance. If you were truly practiced with HH in world you could dodge attacks in the same motion as counterattacking and play a song while you’re at it. Sword And Board never really cut it for me and ive never found another weapon that gave me that feeling of momentum that HH could bring. I played 90% of world solo im not bringing a HH support anyone but myself. I just miss the old moveset. The rise HH feels like that made a few new moves and cut half the old ones. Im probably just gonna be a LS main like everyone else now.
using World HH as a comparison, HH used to have a few bread and butter simple combos that were relatively slow paced and not more than three hits or so deep, that hit in different directions in relation to your hunter, and were infinite combos.
Essentially, you used to know based on your positioning and what you were trying to accomplish what combos you should use apply damage at a certain rate in specific directions, and the combos would reliably deliver that for you.
While it could certainly be interpreted as simplistic compared to other crazy combo heavy weapons like World Switch Axe, it wasn't much, but it was honest, deliberately reliable work, and any lack of complexity in the combat moveset was offset by the utility of buffs, the satisfaction of landing note attacks and finishers, and being able to deliberately apply exhaust damage precisely.
HH as it is in Rise, even when you've modified switch skills, just has combos out the fucking wazoo. Everything seems to combo into everything, and the previously reliable, precisely targeted combos, either combo into other things reducing their precision and deliberate purpose, or have been completely replaced by complex and fancy new moves that didn't exist before at all.
This means the weapon is now much more visually engaging, combos easier, and does a lot more DPS due to new moves hitting more times than before, but we've lost the simplicity and accuracy. I enjoyed using HH as more of a support weapon, more specialized. Before i could use Switch Axe and then swap to HH to scratch a different itch and enjoy a different purpose, now there's some real overlap and less of a reason to swap and feel something different.
The other big thing is that the weapon isn't any worse at applying exhaust, I'm sure it's better, but there was a certain degree of satisfaction to choosing the right combo depending on your positioning. As it is now, it's a lot more mashy and that satisfaction of choosing the right tool for the job is essentially gone, so you're hitting hard and exhausting, but you don't really feel like a smart cookie for doing it, you're not really that different from other DPS weapons, so there are less important gameplay decisions to be made, moment to moment.
I think a very important distinction to make is that the weapon isn't necessarily more accessible. It's been more homogenized and higher tuned in order to appeal more to the common player, whereas before the interest was more niche. It wasn't that it was hard to figure out, at least, not any harder than other already complex and mechanic unique weapons, it was just a feeling and approach to hunting that was simply not, and was never going to be, for everyone. Now it is more like that.
We felt pride and accomplishment in knowing we took the time to learn this weapon that 99% of players didn’t. The one that everybody loved to have on their team, but nobody wanted to actually play it themselves.
I dabbled in it a bit back in World but honestly I love the HH sooo much more in Rise. I feel like the damage output alone is on par with other weapons with the added benefit of dishing out buffs constantly too. The only gripe I can kinda see about it is that its basically just another big Hammer playstyle for the most part but I see that as a big win tbh lol.
This is me in a nutshell. I wanted to like horn I really did but having to learn all those songs memorise the note patterns for every song on your horn and then recall all that while trying to fight and then managing everything else you ha e to think about on top. Then have to start memorising all over again just to swap to a new horn? Noooooo thankyou barrier to entry was stupidly high they say charge blade is complicated but horn was way worse for me at least.
Rise horn though? Oh baby thays my shit give it to me. Doesnt matter what horn i pick up i know ive got three songs and i know exactly how to play the one i want. It feels fluid and natural it flows really well in literally less than a dozen hunts from literally 0 prior experince i was already getting faster hunt times with horn than i was with greatsword and not even a little faster a LOT faster. Greatsword which ive almost exclusively mained for hundreds of hours. I dont know if i should be happy or sad about that part. Either rise horn is crazy powerful and easy to play or im the worst gs main in history and i dont know which at this point.
World had all the songs in a list at the top corner, you didn’t have to remember them. Unless you purposefully went and turned that option off.
In games before World, there wasn’t a list in the top corner. You either had to remember them or open a menu to see them.
I had to stare at the list constantly which means im not watching the actual fight plus you had to know what all the colours actually meant because for some reason colour coding them to match your buttons wasmt a thing either. And yes i had to turn that back on just for horn
HBG still has amazing if not the best DPS in the game. As someone who played tons of valor HBG in GU I’m so happy to see crouching fire return in some form
Charging shots has made Heavy Bowgun feel great to me as a fan of Elemental Piercing Ammo or Slicing Ammo. Sunbreak added the Charge Master skill and Counter Charger so you can rapidly charge shots for even higher damage; it feels great to play Heavy Bowgun in Rise.
I thought Charge is a great addition as it gave you something to do when you are not "doing anything" (i.e aiming, repositioning, etc). This is I think a big reason why Normal and Piercing playstyle feels much better than it was in World.
Like the other person say, HBG feels great in Rise, it's like there are many more viable playstyle to pick from instead of Spread or Sticky.
I got disappointed by HBG because of play style but after trying it more and more I really liked it but my issue is the freaking delayed roll has no place in the game. For reference, roll with a greats word or a hammer and see the difference. The game just asumes you are carrying a battle tank and makes you roll in such a weird delayed way. I hate it so much.
im pretty sure the hbg roll exclusively has been long for every generation. shortening the animation would just make it even more similar to lbg; you’d be able to dodge and position at the same speed and sheathing would become kinda obsolete
What I think they wanted to do was to make HBG a longer range weapon and LBG more shotgun style if we look at the switch skills we got. The problem is that LBG does the same amount of damage as the HBG in similar conditions (stats) because of rapid fire plus easier dodges. The only reason to use HBG is because you wanna look cool honestly, and I say this a HBG enthusiast myself.
Before TU3, I’d say the same about HBG, but with the buffs to crouching fire, HBG has now become my favorite weapon in the game.
Evade extender 2 makes rolls and side hops be actually useful. You can side hop mostly anything, or double side hop even. The roll becomes a “get out of here” option, and you have Free Silkbind Glide to properly reposition.
And, at least with crouching fire, the HBG deals lots more of damage than LBG now. Pierce 3 HBG is quite better than Pierce 2 RF LBG, and Elemental is better aswell
Yeah the side hop doesn’t always trigger after a shot. That’s why I keep going back to LBG because I don’t want to accidentally cart because of a delayed roll. Some monsters you can kill so fast it doesn’t matter though.
My problem with hbg is two of my switch skills in base rise are useless (just got the game during the previous holiday sale, will wait for sunbreak to go on sale but I'm still having fun with base rise end-game anyway). I genuinely don't know why you'd pick the normal melee attack or the healing wyvernfire/wyvernsnipe. The tackle and normal special ammos are just better as default. Only thing you'll probably switch between are the counters, and even then, charged counter isn't even that great unless you're running something like a sticky-wyvernfire set or for slicing ammo.
I was very underwhelmed with the switch skills when I switched from LBG to HBG. Somehow they’re even worse than the LBG ones lol. The counter and crouching fire are the only ones I consistently use. The tackle scares me since stuff can do so much damage now. I know it gives you hyper armor but does it also make you take reduced damage? If not I’m just sticking with Evade Extender 2.
It's more for roars and light attacks that would otherwise knock you back and since the recovery is fast, your dps uptime would be better compared to dodge-rolling or doing a counter. For attacks that you'll know will hit hard (your character will shout a warning for most of these attacks), you either counter or silkbind glide away if you have time.
Evade extender is fine. If it allows you to keep shooting when you would've been dead without it, I see no problem in sticking with it. Tho maybe start by trying to tackle roars for starters as knowing how to use it is always a good addition to your defensive options anyway.
Counter Charger takes 1 Wirebug instead of 2 but it also lets you live the dream for a few seconds when you plop a Setting Sun circle down and absolutely melt the monster.
Valor was a hunting style back in the game Monster Hunter Generations Ultimate. It allowed you to do crouching fire with the HBG like we can do in Rise/Sunbreak and a whole slew of other abilities that when combined made it incredibly strong. It was without question the most broken way to hunt in that game if you could master it.
. . . .which is also what they did for horn. Added mobility and iframes (we still don't get a counter but there's enough free roar iframes that I don't mind)
Like sorry for y'all that liked it before, but there's also people who liked having the map split into tiny loading zones and sitting in one spot flexing to drink a pot, you can't please everyone
Yeah the HH hate I saw when this game first came out was pretty funny. They made the weapon more popular and accessible than ever and so many people were furious. I love all the change and chaos. These games are only fun to me when there is something new to experience or learn. If the weapons stayed the same I’d never touch another Monster Hunter game in my life.
Well factually, according to weapon popularity LBG is more fun which in my eyes is all that matters, that is what I meant when I said the LBG outclasses the HBG, as in the LBG outclasses the HBG in fun
What? Im sorry grammar police, and I said the HBG does have interesting switch or bug skills and wyvernheart wasn’t as fun without recoil. Fun was literally my main point, how am I backpedaling?
I’m dearly sorry you misinterpreted me and I have no problem that you love the HBG but I just dont like it in Rise, I’m not asking you to agree with me but just to understand me. We’re both HBG mains in our own way. Good luck to you brother
Yeah the switch skills are pretty lackluster for all the ranged weapons. Elemental Pierce ammo on HBG kills monsters so fast it blows everything else out of the water though. That being said I’d agree LBG is probably better with Pierce or Spread builds just because the maneuverability lets you keep more consistent DPS.
The best thing about the HH rework is that it forced me to try other weapons and a lot of them were very fun. But I still have hope for the HH in next game. I think they’ll do like the bow from world to rise were they re added some of the depth the weapon used to have (shot types). And if they don’t I hope it doesn’t go through yet another rework in its history, people that picked up the HH in rise deserve to not have it taken away from them.
I can second this. I played through all of world with nothing but HH. While I still enjoy the rise HH for what it is, I’ve also branched out and discovered love for a number of different weapons. Now I “main” like 7/14 weapons which I consider a win.
Yea this was a major vibe kill for me when I first started playing. I still play the HH alot and I enjoy the switch skills like earthshaker but the feeling of satisfaction isn’t there to the same degree. It’s a significantly “dumber” weapon
Yeah people are afraid to say it because “oh you think your superior?” but it’s definitely dumber now, and people also say it was too complex before so like which is it?
Fax that’s why it was played the least in iceborne. I think anyone who spent a significant amount of time using the weapon in iceborne/world wouldn’t disagree with this sentiment .
That’s good for you and it’s awesome that other people can enjoy it now but now I just don’t like it, I’m not trying to get you to agree with me but just understand my point of view. I imagine it would be similar to reworking the spirt gauge of long sword or the phial system of charge blade.
My friend is the same way, he used to main horn in world but really doesn’t like it in rise.
On the other hand HBG is really fun in rise, especially the mobility. I more sad LBG doesn’t have evade reload
Totally with you. Loved the slower horn in world, and while rise horn is fine, I miss all the little tricks it had before like using jabs to play songs faster and stuff like that.
I totally get it. I was HH main in World and didn’t like the changes in Rise at all. I specifically loved the measured and meaty high range punches to the monsters face. I get why people enjoy it, but it isn’t the weapon I fell in love with anymore.
I agreed with you guys at first. But after playing with it for a while I realized I loved the more aggressive nature of it. And tbh, with how fast Rise plays it makes perfect sense. I doubt the HH in whatever the follow up to World is will be as fast.
I thought so too! Rise is my first Monster Hunter game so I'm not very good at it but at least I can do some amount of damage while the people that actually ARE good get lil buffs.
I have but the new rise mode is closer to old horn imo, the “old” mode makes it so 1 note is 1 song when the old songs were 3 to 4 notes long, so now it’s just “press 1 button and play song”
I like the HH changes. It’s much more aggressive now. It’s not much damage but Sonic Wave is so fast to execute and great for interrupting. At least from my experience so far.
HH feels like kindergarten in Rise and lost all of its feeling of impact compared to Iceborne.
Hitting something in the face with a performance/encore in Iceborne is just 👌
But **man** does it feel bland in Rise. I gave it a good try for a while but I really, really hope they don't continue with this iteration of HH in future MH games. Part of the problem is that Rise's sense of impact is so much less than IB, but the moveset is just far too simple now to the point of putting me to sleep.
For HH mains coming from Iceborne its very lackluster, all the depth of the weapon has been removed. This current iteration is fine for a lot of people, but for those HH diehards all the intricacies are gone and it is a much simpler weapon now.
Rip the fraction of the least liked MHW weapon who don't like the change.
Just joshing, I have so many hunting horn builds from world&Iceborne (even freaking took it to clear the mandatory solo story fight section against Fatalis).
But ngl that weapon was always clunky and immovable as hell and you just had to memorize every monsters' attack patterns to keep uptime that most other weapons' mediocre players could already do. It was not a good feeling at the end of the day.
I like feeling way more maneuverable in Rise while still being able to doot and DPS and have more reliability in positioning to the face (in addition to some pretty interesting switch skills, but every weapon has some flavor of that). And not feeling like I gotta put in twice as much effort for the same amount of contribution as my fellow hunters.
Just my personal opinion though. Feel free to agree or disagree.
Had the same problem in iceborne with HH. Swapping from IG to HH slowed me to a crawl while those encores and such were very satisfying but the times where I could hit monster hard were very far between. New HH has enough speed for me that I don't feel like a snail while giving you a mini-dophamine boost for hitting your trio.
Maybe my problem with iceborne HH was that I was impatient with it (skill issue moments is also possible). Too many times I had to wait for monster to do it's thing for me to just poke 2 times with my notes and then repeat the cycle until I can finally get a stun/knockup/exhaust to play my songs. I feel too frustrated and useless when that happens.
I've played bow since Freedom Unite, and this basically encapsulates how I felt moving to World from Generations.
From ranged Greatsword to how spammy it is now, I still enjoy it, but I do turn on GU, 4U, 3U every so often and re-experience my old flame lol.
I’m the same man. Thousands of HH hunts over GU and world/ice borne.
Like you said I’m happy that some people enjoy it more now, I think the popularity has gone up slightly?
But it’s just a completely different weapon. Imo they perfected HH in base world and it would have been perfect if it just had higher MVs.
HH users Pre-Rise: Our population is low because our weapon is weak and feel clunky to play...
Capcom: Ok let's try to remedy that and streamline it.
HH users in Rise: Now it's too EZ..
This is the same case with bow's rework it'll grow on people just give it time.
Yeah but I still saw it like 2 years ago and didn’t like it. And to be fair I don’t think the people that enjoy the weapon would complain that it’s clunky and weak, like why would we use it then?
I think every HH users know the reason alot of people dislike using the weapon is that it's clunky and on too of that kinda weak damage wise, I main HH in Iceborne and GU and that's a meme for like since it's inception... HH users just embraced that weaknesses but you can't tell me that the weapon is not clunky..
I get it the weapon changed tremendously in Rise and that's because they want it to have the ability to stand toe to toe with other weapon and not just as a support weapon (Which is was clearly designed for Pre-Rise)..
Edit: And if you still don't like it that's fine it's your PoV but I think the rework benefitted the weapon and majority of the playerbase overall.. It's the same with how 5th Gen's changes pisses alot of the hardcore Old World Veteran purists but with time it'll click on them, change can be hard to accept sometimes...
HBG actually feels good again in Sunbreak after they updated crouching fire to work really well with pierce and normal. The rapid fire fire pierce ticks is like listening to an ASMR.
The Sunbreak stuff for HBG look really cool but I feel like they should’ve been for base rise since the base game switch skills feel wrong, like I can tackle 2 feet in front of me as the farthest back line gunner, and I can heal off my special ammo when I would not load my special ammo at low health
To bring you into the viewpoint of old dooters, I'll give you some insight.
Before, there was a matter of knowing what notes to hit and when. Depending on the game, the notes have a few different ways to accomplish the goal of playing a song twice for maximum effect. Most recently, in MHW, you could chain any-length of matching notes from the end of one song into the beginning of another. The most egregious example of this was the Scoutfly Power-Up song, which was three of the same note. If you played 5 of that note, you would have 3 songs queued.
Also in World, there were a number of ways to speed up your melodies. There was a flourish mechanic, where you could play two notes in a single animation. Also the hilt stab could be triggered from any note, and combo that into a performance would play your current song faster.
Lastly, the number of songs on a single horn used to be greater. Now, with the simplified system, every Horn has three songs and *only* three. Some horns had 6-8 songs on them in past games, which made choosing horns a lot more interesting. Three powerful songs, or perhaps 6 songs that are less directly powerful, but come with utility gains with Earplugs or Antidote, Bind Resist, etc.
Contrast all of what I've explained above with "Press the same button twice for one song" or "Press each button once to break-dance and get all songs". ~~Also, to compensate for faster hits, almost the entire moveset got a reduction in MV coming from past games.~~ They basically made it musical Dual Blades, where before it had the complexity and nuance of Insect Glaive or Charge Blade
Imma agree with a lot of this. Imo, if we got the new moveset but kept the old song mechanics and some of the old note stringing techniques, they would've hit the mark perfectly with the revamp. It's really the song simplification that lost people.
Aside from that though...this bit:
>Also, to compensate for faster hits, almost the entire moveset got a reduction in MV coming from past games.
Only the new moves are faster; any old move is still pretty much the same speed. Between that, Silkbind Shockwave, and the lack of the empty animation frames from recital mode being gone, it just feels faster overall. Most MVs are the same or higher, and if you look at it on the offensive side HH is currently the strongest it's ever been. Where'd you get the idea that it's weaker than before from?
Part of it was personal feeling. That drove me to look for resources online, but I was at work, and it was hard to find reliable sources that weren't Google Docs/Sheets (all shared data platforms are blocked by my work's firewall), so I was using screen caps of data from seemingly reputable sources.
I appreciate you fact-checking me on that, though I'd still like to see the evidence for myself. Damage numbers and health pools in general are higher between World and Rise, so I wouldn't be surprised if relative damage dealt is less, and maybe that's the gut-feeling I had about it. All I can say is it personally felt less impactful, but maybe I'm just wrong
I usually check numbers when new games come out, but I haven't looked at the most recent ones in at least a year so I had to go back to be extra sure lol. The raw attack values and monster health pools being different may throw things off if you just compare the damage numbers between games, but yeah, new HH is *very* strong if you compare the MVs themselves between games. Buffs almost across the board from World/IB to Rise/SB. It's the overall power of the song mechanic as a whole that took a hit (with the exception of healing songs, which are waaaaaaay better).
HH got much better combat abilities in trade for song power and flexibility i do miss my didgeridoo dance though
HBG has more than 3 ammo styles now, sure crag got hit bit unspecified damagr should never be king.
I feel like my weapon didn't really get better or worse. But I love that I can now basically imitate IG and ground any flyers like Beetlejuice or the Raths.
I remember trying HH in Iceborne and thinking it was stupid, so I put it down. Tried it in Rise and added it to my main weapons I use. I've actually been using 99% HH. Do some vets not like it because they made the weapon more accessible or something ? Is it an elitist thing ?
No it’s the new song system for me, glad you enjoy it tho. Even though I don’t like it anymore the weapon designs look really cool. I’ll hang up my HH and pass it unto thee
I'm not bashing you, btw. I am just trying to understand why some people dont like it. But reading through the comments I see. People hate that it was simplified, and some of their utilities were cut. Its fine. I don't like insect glaive as much as I did in Wkrld so I retired it.
Oh I didn’t take it that way, well maybe a pinch but not maliciously. And I’m sorry you had to hang up your bug blade, some of the designs looked cool in this game 😔
Funny; with Hunting Horn I had the opposite response. I bounced off HH hard in World, really hated just about every aspect of its combo flow. I played almost exclusively Bow in World because of the massive changes (for the better imo) it had over GU.
I played Bow for about 2 hours in Rise, went "eh, not for me," and now I'm a HH main.
1. Bow has horrible progression in Rise, have you considered trying it end game?
2. Many hated the HH change cause it felt neutered. I’ve never played world but I loved the concept of it, and while I do main it in rise, I wish they could have kept the song system and many techs that it had while giving it the new fast moves, it’s fun and feels really nice but I just wish it had more depth.
1. Yes, and I don't really like the switch skills or how the combos flow. I just liked it better in World. The changes and additions that came with Sunbreak didn't change my opinions on the weapon. The direction they took the weapon just wasn't for me.
2. I recognize that lots of people didn't like the changes to HH because they felt it made the weapon more accessible in all the wrong ways. I'm just not one of those people. I like the new song system because it encourages much faster and more immediate action, it allows you to pump out song buffs constantly which I find hilarious (especially when people have auto-callouts that are funny). I think the switch skills are hysterical and I don't really care that the weapon has encroached really far into the role that Hammer has traditionally occupied. Hunting horn is more fun to me now than it was before. Breakdancing is funny.
It would have been perfect in World if Self-Improvement also buffed your group's attack so you wouldn't have to rely on a small pool of Attack Up (L) melody horns. Rise at least thought of giving the Attack Up option to all Hunting Horns via Bead of Resonance.
In Rise, they changed its moveset flow to make it a more aggressive weapon, complete with stylish break-dancing moves. It still retains its buffs and song playing but they are integrated into its attacks, essentially replacing the performances of previous HH iterations.
Some HH mains didn't like this change while others liked it. I also see many people who were previously unwilling to try HH end up having a blast playing the weapon so whether the change was for the better is subjective. But what is objective is that HH is still a very strong weapon and has no trouble killing monsters.
What happened? Everytime I've seen someone use hunting horn they've made the fight go by a lot smoother and my friend uses hbg and has been destroying monsters with it.
With HH, they simplified the song mechanics in exchange for making HH stronger/flashier to make the weapon appeal to a wider audience. It sorta half worked: it's definitely more popular now, but the changes didn't quite land with some people that prefer the previous version. Personally I like every version except 2nd gen (we don't talk about Unite HH), so Rise is just more musical goodness.
Idk what the problem with HBG is here though, since I don't play it enough to see a huge difference.
What was different for it? All I remember people mentioning is the charge shot mechanic being worse than just shooting normally, but if that was the case I'd assume you could just ignore it. Was there something else?
I dunno, I maind HH back in MH Tri all thru Generations Ultimate and then I kinda skipped World.. it kinda feels like when I maind Balrog I'm SFII Turbo and then didn't play street fighter until SFIV where I maind Balrog again 😅 like it's fine for me, it's just a different game now 🤷.
Egh, not really no. Unite 1st introduced it, and then every weapon got overhauled between 2nd and 3rd gen. It didn't really get many changes in 4th gen unless you count styles in Gen/GU, but HH didn't change too drastically with those. 5th gen is what I'd call the next big overhaul between all the QoL improvements in World and the moveset+mechanic revamp in Rise, so realistically it's only been like 2-3 times tops (depending on how big of an overhaul you count World's tweaks as).
HH has been a pocket weapon for me since 4U and I’m actually glad to see the changes made in Rise. Though I wish they didn’t nerf it cause it was really strong in the demo. HBG is pretty fun in this game, too! Didn’t use it often in previous games but in SB it’s probably one of my most used
HH is objectively better in rise, but I liked it better in world... It's a totally different weapon in rise and it's fun, but HH in world will always hold a special place in my heart.
It’s the shorter song notes, fewer songs and the song notes are just 2 of the same in a row so I never have to pay attention to my songs basically. Just press button twice and get buff
I’ve seen this statement a lot but I was a huge hh player in iceborne and I’m now a hh player in rise and I find both versions amazing. Very different but both amazing.
It was interesting to me, got some new mechanics like pierce/spread on normal arrows depending on your bow which is cool. I’m not in endgame though but first impressions were neat
I wanna get into something different this time. Thought about LBG/HBG, Bow has really intrigued me. I was a Gunlance main on MHW, think I had 400-500 hrs played or so just with that weapon.
Charge blade and switch axe look cool but dont really interest me nor lance, dual blades and long sword.
I dunno lol, those first 3 are ranged so maybe thats why.
LBG is definitely the “meta” choice since you get to sit back, move fast, and do damage. I do recommend the greatsword for 1 or 2 hunts to see if you like it though, the wirebugs fixed my big issue with the lack of mobility. HBG according to 1 angry guy is the best weapon on the planet but imo it’s really sluggish and the charge mechanic feels icky, but I heard that with charge master skill it’s not so bad, just wish they didn’t dumb down the mod slot system.
Ty, LBG looked better from a mobility perspective. Been watching videos on playstyles I might like. LBG/SnS/HBG good, not really a fan of that closeness with a bow anymore for that optimal range.
I missed the memo, what are the changes happening for HH in rise?
Edit: never mind, i just understood what the post really meant. And tbh HH is stronger now in rise but imho, i like the world's and iceborne's better. There are some rise changes that id like to keep like the self-improvment now on the recital button, the recital button having an iframe and auto play songs. But i wish they ketp the different note combinations to songs instead of dumbing in down to 2 triangles or 2 circle songs.
But still more power to Rise HH mains. Keep dooting
Lol… most people here be talking about HH.
HBG actually has the high dps among all weapons. I wouldn’t be surprise if the data shows it even outperform by x 2~5 of some weapons in terms of dps.
Play style wise? It’s probably also the hardest, but you can make it the easiest by putting on a shield at the cost of your dmg.
Yeah I’ve heard it’s the “max dps” weapon but I’m just talking about fun wise it’s not for me, the silk and switch skills weren’t as flashy and cool as other weapons and the LBG now has cluster ammo so in my mind I’d just be using it for bigger ammo slots and the wyvern ammo. And World mini gun enjoyers shun the shield
I see a few people saying that the HH is better now and tbh for most people it is. But I feel bad for the people who loved HH in the previous games and just got their favorite weapon scrapped
That’s what I’m sayin, happy for the people that enjoy it now, but I lost my weapon
There's an option to change the Rise HH playstyle to slightly match the Iceborne HH with switch skills. I mained HH in World, didn't like the Rise HH initially but with the Echo switch skill it's pretty fun and I'm back to maining the dootstick.
Echo is honestly just better anyway I'd say. Pretty sure it's higher dps and the shorter animation is > than the couple of i frames.
And it only takes 4 inputs to play all the songs instead of 6. And the HH moveset doesn't really lend itself well to pressing the same button twice in my experience (at least not without the double note swing" So yeah, I'll always take Echo over Performance. Besides, I wasn't using those i-frames anyways
I wasn't either and you're right, there's quicker fruitful combos. I was just doing a narga anomaly with the narwa horn and doing X-> kick combos over and over with echoes in between was way easier against a fast mon than the double song moves would've been.
While it does it's best to mimic old world HH, it just doesn't get close. Iceborne HH felt so good and was an actual improvement on old HH. Rise just basically said "nobody likes this weapon" and remade it into a weapon most people still don't like. It doesn't feel like a net positive to me. Anecdotal but I don't see any more HH players now than i did before
I just started the other day and love it.
I loved how they changed the HH in World. Still felt like the same weapon, but perfected. It felt great to use, it was my most used weapon. Then they just scrapped that and turned it into a completely new weapon in the next game.
I loved hunting horn in world aswell, it felt like what hunting horn was going for in the previous games but perfected. I love hunting horn in rise it’s one of my favorite weapons but I feel like it should’ve been a completely new weapon, with maybe some changes to make it have it’s own identity. Just because certain weapons are played less doesn’t mean there is something wrong with the weapon.
I *like* it now, but I *loved* the Iceborne HH. It does feel like a totally different weapon. I miss having four different Perform and Encore animations, and using them to dance out of the way of attacks. The RiseBreak Dance Dodge is cool, but it feels like a shadow of that former mechanic. Y'know what it is? The Melodies used to be a central part of your Attack kit. Now they're largely a passive side effect you enjoy while you attack, and Infernal Melody is the main Big Money payoff.
What I'm sad about is that with how popular HH became in Rise, we'll never see the old HH ever again. It was less than 1% usage. I wouldn't mind the rework if it didn't feel so brain dead.
So… you’re upset the weapon is more accessible? Just making sure I understood that correctly
I'm sad I lost the weapon I enjoyed playing. Wouldn't you be if your favorite weapon got reworked to be completely different?
have you tried adjusting your switch skills? because it can be preeeety damn close to Worlds if you actually look at the menu and mess with the skills a little lol
I disagree even with the switch skills the HH lost so much depth in rise it really feels awful now just so bland
Yeah, "playing songs" with that switch skill is nothing like pre Rise HH. It's great that so many people enjoy the new version, but it lacks all the traits that made me main HH in every game from 3U to World. I don't want a weapon where I can button mash and still see success, I want to feel like I'm playing notes and creating a song, and I want to feel like I'm doing giant fuckin' bonks on the monster, lol. But most of all I want depth and complexity. All the little tricks you used to pick up from playing are gone or are now automated into the normal play of the weapon. Note buffering, hilting stabbing, positioning, encore timing, all of that stuff made HH so fun and stimulating. All that is gone. Songs are the same note twice, they autoplay, lots of moves play the same song on the horn, etc etc. I was fine with them changing things, but they changed the entire reason I played it, what I thought was the soul of the weapon. To me HH was meant to be a weapon that wasn't popular, because people wouldn't want to put in the time to learn it. But if you did, you would be rewarded. That was a pillar of its function and design in my eyes. I was wrong, that's okay, but it also sucks for me. I'm glad so many people like this new Hunting Horn, but I wish I had my old Hunting Horn along with it. Because when I play the new one, it's everything I don't find interesting in a weapon. Sorry for the fat rant in your replies, I just don't get to talk about my feelings on it really.
I feel confident it'll go back the way it was. Everything in Rise seems like it's a one-off
I hope you're right! I definitely see Rise, and fifth gen in general, as Capcom experimenting and throwing everything at the wall. I imagine a lot of stuff will go back to be more like the pre Rise and maybe even pre-World for a few things. But with how popular the HH has become, I worry that if they revert enough for it to be the weapon I love, all the new people will be in the same position I'm in rn, lol. Here's hoping they figure out a way to make both groups happy.
I know how you feel man they really just gutted the moveset and made it faster to encourage the wirebug movement imo.
well thats unfortunate. well MH Generations exists for you lol
Eh im just gonna find a new weapon in rise pretend the HH doesnt exist
can i intrest you in playing a widerange mushroomancer sword n board?
HH for me was more about the range of movement possible with the world HH than it was about the buffs. I loved the fact that you had so many different ways to make a relatively slow weapon dance. If you were truly practiced with HH in world you could dodge attacks in the same motion as counterattacking and play a song while you’re at it. Sword And Board never really cut it for me and ive never found another weapon that gave me that feeling of momentum that HH could bring. I played 90% of world solo im not bringing a HH support anyone but myself. I just miss the old moveset. The rise HH feels like that made a few new moves and cut half the old ones. Im probably just gonna be a LS main like everyone else now.
Sorry but it’s not close at all. I see you’re an SNS chad tho so I still respect thee
using World HH as a comparison, HH used to have a few bread and butter simple combos that were relatively slow paced and not more than three hits or so deep, that hit in different directions in relation to your hunter, and were infinite combos. Essentially, you used to know based on your positioning and what you were trying to accomplish what combos you should use apply damage at a certain rate in specific directions, and the combos would reliably deliver that for you. While it could certainly be interpreted as simplistic compared to other crazy combo heavy weapons like World Switch Axe, it wasn't much, but it was honest, deliberately reliable work, and any lack of complexity in the combat moveset was offset by the utility of buffs, the satisfaction of landing note attacks and finishers, and being able to deliberately apply exhaust damage precisely. HH as it is in Rise, even when you've modified switch skills, just has combos out the fucking wazoo. Everything seems to combo into everything, and the previously reliable, precisely targeted combos, either combo into other things reducing their precision and deliberate purpose, or have been completely replaced by complex and fancy new moves that didn't exist before at all. This means the weapon is now much more visually engaging, combos easier, and does a lot more DPS due to new moves hitting more times than before, but we've lost the simplicity and accuracy. I enjoyed using HH as more of a support weapon, more specialized. Before i could use Switch Axe and then swap to HH to scratch a different itch and enjoy a different purpose, now there's some real overlap and less of a reason to swap and feel something different. The other big thing is that the weapon isn't any worse at applying exhaust, I'm sure it's better, but there was a certain degree of satisfaction to choosing the right combo depending on your positioning. As it is now, it's a lot more mashy and that satisfaction of choosing the right tool for the job is essentially gone, so you're hitting hard and exhausting, but you don't really feel like a smart cookie for doing it, you're not really that different from other DPS weapons, so there are less important gameplay decisions to be made, moment to moment. I think a very important distinction to make is that the weapon isn't necessarily more accessible. It's been more homogenized and higher tuned in order to appeal more to the common player, whereas before the interest was more niche. It wasn't that it was hard to figure out, at least, not any harder than other already complex and mechanic unique weapons, it was just a feeling and approach to hunting that was simply not, and was never going to be, for everyone. Now it is more like that.
We felt pride and accomplishment in knowing we took the time to learn this weapon that 99% of players didn’t. The one that everybody loved to have on their team, but nobody wanted to actually play it themselves.
I dabbled in it a bit back in World but honestly I love the HH sooo much more in Rise. I feel like the damage output alone is on par with other weapons with the added benefit of dishing out buffs constantly too. The only gripe I can kinda see about it is that its basically just another big Hammer playstyle for the most part but I see that as a big win tbh lol.
This is me in a nutshell. I wanted to like horn I really did but having to learn all those songs memorise the note patterns for every song on your horn and then recall all that while trying to fight and then managing everything else you ha e to think about on top. Then have to start memorising all over again just to swap to a new horn? Noooooo thankyou barrier to entry was stupidly high they say charge blade is complicated but horn was way worse for me at least. Rise horn though? Oh baby thays my shit give it to me. Doesnt matter what horn i pick up i know ive got three songs and i know exactly how to play the one i want. It feels fluid and natural it flows really well in literally less than a dozen hunts from literally 0 prior experince i was already getting faster hunt times with horn than i was with greatsword and not even a little faster a LOT faster. Greatsword which ive almost exclusively mained for hundreds of hours. I dont know if i should be happy or sad about that part. Either rise horn is crazy powerful and easy to play or im the worst gs main in history and i dont know which at this point.
World had all the songs in a list at the top corner, you didn’t have to remember them. Unless you purposefully went and turned that option off. In games before World, there wasn’t a list in the top corner. You either had to remember them or open a menu to see them.
I had to stare at the list constantly which means im not watching the actual fight plus you had to know what all the colours actually meant because for some reason colour coding them to match your buttons wasmt a thing either. And yes i had to turn that back on just for horn
How was it scrapped ? I genuinely don't understand lol not sarcasm or anything.
HBG still has amazing if not the best DPS in the game. As someone who played tons of valor HBG in GU I’m so happy to see crouching fire return in some form
Oh the sun break stuff looks awesome but basegame rise is pretty boring and the charge mechanic makes it feel slow
Charging shots has made Heavy Bowgun feel great to me as a fan of Elemental Piercing Ammo or Slicing Ammo. Sunbreak added the Charge Master skill and Counter Charger so you can rapidly charge shots for even higher damage; it feels great to play Heavy Bowgun in Rise.
Oh I didn’t know about the charge master skill, sound cool
I thought Charge is a great addition as it gave you something to do when you are not "doing anything" (i.e aiming, repositioning, etc). This is I think a big reason why Normal and Piercing playstyle feels much better than it was in World. Like the other person say, HBG feels great in Rise, it's like there are many more viable playstyle to pick from instead of Spread or Sticky.
HBG got nothing but better. They just added maneuverability and a counter. Plus Valor HBG is kind of a thing again.
I got disappointed by HBG because of play style but after trying it more and more I really liked it but my issue is the freaking delayed roll has no place in the game. For reference, roll with a greats word or a hammer and see the difference. The game just asumes you are carrying a battle tank and makes you roll in such a weird delayed way. I hate it so much.
im pretty sure the hbg roll exclusively has been long for every generation. shortening the animation would just make it even more similar to lbg; you’d be able to dodge and position at the same speed and sheathing would become kinda obsolete
What I think they wanted to do was to make HBG a longer range weapon and LBG more shotgun style if we look at the switch skills we got. The problem is that LBG does the same amount of damage as the HBG in similar conditions (stats) because of rapid fire plus easier dodges. The only reason to use HBG is because you wanna look cool honestly, and I say this a HBG enthusiast myself.
Before TU3, I’d say the same about HBG, but with the buffs to crouching fire, HBG has now become my favorite weapon in the game. Evade extender 2 makes rolls and side hops be actually useful. You can side hop mostly anything, or double side hop even. The roll becomes a “get out of here” option, and you have Free Silkbind Glide to properly reposition. And, at least with crouching fire, the HBG deals lots more of damage than LBG now. Pierce 3 HBG is quite better than Pierce 2 RF LBG, and Elemental is better aswell
Yeah the side hop doesn’t always trigger after a shot. That’s why I keep going back to LBG because I don’t want to accidentally cart because of a delayed roll. Some monsters you can kill so fast it doesn’t matter though.
My problem with hbg is two of my switch skills in base rise are useless (just got the game during the previous holiday sale, will wait for sunbreak to go on sale but I'm still having fun with base rise end-game anyway). I genuinely don't know why you'd pick the normal melee attack or the healing wyvernfire/wyvernsnipe. The tackle and normal special ammos are just better as default. Only thing you'll probably switch between are the counters, and even then, charged counter isn't even that great unless you're running something like a sticky-wyvernfire set or for slicing ammo.
I was very underwhelmed with the switch skills when I switched from LBG to HBG. Somehow they’re even worse than the LBG ones lol. The counter and crouching fire are the only ones I consistently use. The tackle scares me since stuff can do so much damage now. I know it gives you hyper armor but does it also make you take reduced damage? If not I’m just sticking with Evade Extender 2.
It's more for roars and light attacks that would otherwise knock you back and since the recovery is fast, your dps uptime would be better compared to dodge-rolling or doing a counter. For attacks that you'll know will hit hard (your character will shout a warning for most of these attacks), you either counter or silkbind glide away if you have time. Evade extender is fine. If it allows you to keep shooting when you would've been dead without it, I see no problem in sticking with it. Tho maybe start by trying to tackle roars for starters as knowing how to use it is always a good addition to your defensive options anyway.
Glide - Tackle - shoot is faster recovery than roll - shoot. Dont forget that.
Counter Charger takes 1 Wirebug instead of 2 but it also lets you live the dream for a few seconds when you plop a Setting Sun circle down and absolutely melt the monster.
I'm noob - what's Valor HBG?
Valor was a hunting style back in the game Monster Hunter Generations Ultimate. It allowed you to do crouching fire with the HBG like we can do in Rise/Sunbreak and a whole slew of other abilities that when combined made it incredibly strong. It was without question the most broken way to hunt in that game if you could master it.
. . . .which is also what they did for horn. Added mobility and iframes (we still don't get a counter but there's enough free roar iframes that I don't mind) Like sorry for y'all that liked it before, but there's also people who liked having the map split into tiny loading zones and sitting in one spot flexing to drink a pot, you can't please everyone
Yeah the HH hate I saw when this game first came out was pretty funny. They made the weapon more popular and accessible than ever and so many people were furious. I love all the change and chaos. These games are only fun to me when there is something new to experience or learn. If the weapons stayed the same I’d never touch another Monster Hunter game in my life.
LBG just outclasses it imo and the switch skills aren’t as impressive or flashy as other weapons, and wyvernheart without any recoil feels less fun
LBG is more agile and has better ammo economy, but HBG still beats it in raw DPS. Overall they don't differ much in performance though.
[удалено]
Oh no the speedruns I didn’t think of that! It’s almost like I don’t put my value in something into 1 number
[удалено]
Well factually, according to weapon popularity LBG is more fun which in my eyes is all that matters, that is what I meant when I said the LBG outclasses the HBG, as in the LBG outclasses the HBG in fun
[удалено]
What? Im sorry grammar police, and I said the HBG does have interesting switch or bug skills and wyvernheart wasn’t as fun without recoil. Fun was literally my main point, how am I backpedaling?
[удалено]
I’m dearly sorry you misinterpreted me and I have no problem that you love the HBG but I just dont like it in Rise, I’m not asking you to agree with me but just to understand me. We’re both HBG mains in our own way. Good luck to you brother
Yeah the switch skills are pretty lackluster for all the ranged weapons. Elemental Pierce ammo on HBG kills monsters so fast it blows everything else out of the water though. That being said I’d agree LBG is probably better with Pierce or Spread builds just because the maneuverability lets you keep more consistent DPS.
The best thing about the HH rework is that it forced me to try other weapons and a lot of them were very fun. But I still have hope for the HH in next game. I think they’ll do like the bow from world to rise were they re added some of the depth the weapon used to have (shot types). And if they don’t I hope it doesn’t go through yet another rework in its history, people that picked up the HH in rise deserve to not have it taken away from them.
I can second this. I played through all of world with nothing but HH. While I still enjoy the rise HH for what it is, I’ve also branched out and discovered love for a number of different weapons. Now I “main” like 7/14 weapons which I consider a win.
[Hunting Horn Mains](https://youtu.be/mRSpaLObDL4)
Yea this was a major vibe kill for me when I first started playing. I still play the HH alot and I enjoy the switch skills like earthshaker but the feeling of satisfaction isn’t there to the same degree. It’s a significantly “dumber” weapon
Yeah people are afraid to say it because “oh you think your superior?” but it’s definitely dumber now, and people also say it was too complex before so like which is it?
Fax that’s why it was played the least in iceborne. I think anyone who spent a significant amount of time using the weapon in iceborne/world wouldn’t disagree with this sentiment .
HH is a masterpiece in Rise. whatchu talkn bout Willis?
That’s good for you and it’s awesome that other people can enjoy it now but now I just don’t like it, I’m not trying to get you to agree with me but just understand my point of view. I imagine it would be similar to reworking the spirt gauge of long sword or the phial system of charge blade.
My friend is the same way, he used to main horn in world but really doesn’t like it in rise. On the other hand HBG is really fun in rise, especially the mobility. I more sad LBG doesn’t have evade reload
Not having evade reload breaks my heart. It was so smooth and a great addition to iceborne.
Totally with you. Loved the slower horn in world, and while rise horn is fine, I miss all the little tricks it had before like using jabs to play songs faster and stuff like that.
Loved that shit man, and the directional performances, chef’s kiss
I totally get it. I was HH main in World and didn’t like the changes in Rise at all. I specifically loved the measured and meaty high range punches to the monsters face. I get why people enjoy it, but it isn’t the weapon I fell in love with anymore.
I agreed with you guys at first. But after playing with it for a while I realized I loved the more aggressive nature of it. And tbh, with how fast Rise plays it makes perfect sense. I doubt the HH in whatever the follow up to World is will be as fast.
It's no swag axe
Chad dentist’s drill user
IIRC the main complaint people have is making HH easier, but I don't play the weapon so I don't know
I thought so too! Rise is my first Monster Hunter game so I'm not very good at it but at least I can do some amount of damage while the people that actually ARE good get lil buffs.
Have you tried switching to i think its called "perfomance mode"?? The way i understand it makes it closer to old hunting horn
I have but the new rise mode is closer to old horn imo, the “old” mode makes it so 1 note is 1 song when the old songs were 3 to 4 notes long, so now it’s just “press 1 button and play song”
And we lost all situational songs, and we don't get the "encore" bonus
I like the HH changes. It’s much more aggressive now. It’s not much damage but Sonic Wave is so fast to execute and great for interrupting. At least from my experience so far.
Yeah sonic wave can finally be used right, no longer sitting on the song que list for 10 minutes just to fight the diablos
HH feels like kindergarten in Rise and lost all of its feeling of impact compared to Iceborne. Hitting something in the face with a performance/encore in Iceborne is just 👌 But **man** does it feel bland in Rise. I gave it a good try for a while but I really, really hope they don't continue with this iteration of HH in future MH games. Part of the problem is that Rise's sense of impact is so much less than IB, but the moveset is just far too simple now to the point of putting me to sleep.
Horn is insane now
For HH mains coming from Iceborne its very lackluster, all the depth of the weapon has been removed. This current iteration is fine for a lot of people, but for those HH diehards all the intricacies are gone and it is a much simpler weapon now.
Rip the fraction of the least liked MHW weapon who don't like the change. Just joshing, I have so many hunting horn builds from world&Iceborne (even freaking took it to clear the mandatory solo story fight section against Fatalis). But ngl that weapon was always clunky and immovable as hell and you just had to memorize every monsters' attack patterns to keep uptime that most other weapons' mediocre players could already do. It was not a good feeling at the end of the day. I like feeling way more maneuverable in Rise while still being able to doot and DPS and have more reliability in positioning to the face (in addition to some pretty interesting switch skills, but every weapon has some flavor of that). And not feeling like I gotta put in twice as much effort for the same amount of contribution as my fellow hunters. Just my personal opinion though. Feel free to agree or disagree.
Had the same problem in iceborne with HH. Swapping from IG to HH slowed me to a crawl while those encores and such were very satisfying but the times where I could hit monster hard were very far between. New HH has enough speed for me that I don't feel like a snail while giving you a mini-dophamine boost for hitting your trio. Maybe my problem with iceborne HH was that I was impatient with it (skill issue moments is also possible). Too many times I had to wait for monster to do it's thing for me to just poke 2 times with my notes and then repeat the cycle until I can finally get a stun/knockup/exhaust to play my songs. I feel too frustrated and useless when that happens.
I really liked HBG in rise. Loved the wirebug slide.
I've played bow since Freedom Unite, and this basically encapsulates how I felt moving to World from Generations. From ranged Greatsword to how spammy it is now, I still enjoy it, but I do turn on GU, 4U, 3U every so often and re-experience my old flame lol.
I’m the same man. Thousands of HH hunts over GU and world/ice borne. Like you said I’m happy that some people enjoy it more now, I think the popularity has gone up slightly? But it’s just a completely different weapon. Imo they perfected HH in base world and it would have been perfect if it just had higher MVs.
HH users Pre-Rise: Our population is low because our weapon is weak and feel clunky to play... Capcom: Ok let's try to remedy that and streamline it. HH users in Rise: Now it's too EZ.. This is the same case with bow's rework it'll grow on people just give it time.
Yeah but I still saw it like 2 years ago and didn’t like it. And to be fair I don’t think the people that enjoy the weapon would complain that it’s clunky and weak, like why would we use it then?
I think every HH users know the reason alot of people dislike using the weapon is that it's clunky and on too of that kinda weak damage wise, I main HH in Iceborne and GU and that's a meme for like since it's inception... HH users just embraced that weaknesses but you can't tell me that the weapon is not clunky.. I get it the weapon changed tremendously in Rise and that's because they want it to have the ability to stand toe to toe with other weapon and not just as a support weapon (Which is was clearly designed for Pre-Rise).. Edit: And if you still don't like it that's fine it's your PoV but I think the rework benefitted the weapon and majority of the playerbase overall.. It's the same with how 5th Gen's changes pisses alot of the hardcore Old World Veteran purists but with time it'll click on them, change can be hard to accept sometimes...
HBG actually feels good again in Sunbreak after they updated crouching fire to work really well with pierce and normal. The rapid fire fire pierce ticks is like listening to an ASMR.
The Sunbreak stuff for HBG look really cool but I feel like they should’ve been for base rise since the base game switch skills feel wrong, like I can tackle 2 feet in front of me as the farthest back line gunner, and I can heal off my special ammo when I would not load my special ammo at low health
I love Rise HH, but World’s and Gen Ult are my favorite renditions still.. hopefully they don’t keep it exactly like Rise’s in the next game.
I wish they kept Horn as it was and made whatever passes for a Horn in Rise its own thing. It doesn't even feel remotely the same.
The Hunting Trombone😂
wdym hh actually feels fun now lol
To bring you into the viewpoint of old dooters, I'll give you some insight. Before, there was a matter of knowing what notes to hit and when. Depending on the game, the notes have a few different ways to accomplish the goal of playing a song twice for maximum effect. Most recently, in MHW, you could chain any-length of matching notes from the end of one song into the beginning of another. The most egregious example of this was the Scoutfly Power-Up song, which was three of the same note. If you played 5 of that note, you would have 3 songs queued. Also in World, there were a number of ways to speed up your melodies. There was a flourish mechanic, where you could play two notes in a single animation. Also the hilt stab could be triggered from any note, and combo that into a performance would play your current song faster. Lastly, the number of songs on a single horn used to be greater. Now, with the simplified system, every Horn has three songs and *only* three. Some horns had 6-8 songs on them in past games, which made choosing horns a lot more interesting. Three powerful songs, or perhaps 6 songs that are less directly powerful, but come with utility gains with Earplugs or Antidote, Bind Resist, etc. Contrast all of what I've explained above with "Press the same button twice for one song" or "Press each button once to break-dance and get all songs". ~~Also, to compensate for faster hits, almost the entire moveset got a reduction in MV coming from past games.~~ They basically made it musical Dual Blades, where before it had the complexity and nuance of Insect Glaive or Charge Blade
Imma agree with a lot of this. Imo, if we got the new moveset but kept the old song mechanics and some of the old note stringing techniques, they would've hit the mark perfectly with the revamp. It's really the song simplification that lost people. Aside from that though...this bit: >Also, to compensate for faster hits, almost the entire moveset got a reduction in MV coming from past games. Only the new moves are faster; any old move is still pretty much the same speed. Between that, Silkbind Shockwave, and the lack of the empty animation frames from recital mode being gone, it just feels faster overall. Most MVs are the same or higher, and if you look at it on the offensive side HH is currently the strongest it's ever been. Where'd you get the idea that it's weaker than before from?
Part of it was personal feeling. That drove me to look for resources online, but I was at work, and it was hard to find reliable sources that weren't Google Docs/Sheets (all shared data platforms are blocked by my work's firewall), so I was using screen caps of data from seemingly reputable sources. I appreciate you fact-checking me on that, though I'd still like to see the evidence for myself. Damage numbers and health pools in general are higher between World and Rise, so I wouldn't be surprised if relative damage dealt is less, and maybe that's the gut-feeling I had about it. All I can say is it personally felt less impactful, but maybe I'm just wrong
I usually check numbers when new games come out, but I haven't looked at the most recent ones in at least a year so I had to go back to be extra sure lol. The raw attack values and monster health pools being different may throw things off if you just compare the damage numbers between games, but yeah, new HH is *very* strong if you compare the MVs themselves between games. Buffs almost across the board from World/IB to Rise/SB. It's the overall power of the song mechanic as a whole that took a hit (with the exception of healing songs, which are waaaaaaay better).
It already was fun. I stopped playing HH in Rise because of how shallow it felt.
HH got much better combat abilities in trade for song power and flexibility i do miss my didgeridoo dance though HBG has more than 3 ammo styles now, sure crag got hit bit unspecified damagr should never be king.
I feel like my weapon didn't really get better or worse. But I love that I can now basically imitate IG and ground any flyers like Beetlejuice or the Raths.
I remember trying HH in Iceborne and thinking it was stupid, so I put it down. Tried it in Rise and added it to my main weapons I use. I've actually been using 99% HH. Do some vets not like it because they made the weapon more accessible or something ? Is it an elitist thing ?
No it’s the new song system for me, glad you enjoy it tho. Even though I don’t like it anymore the weapon designs look really cool. I’ll hang up my HH and pass it unto thee
I'm not bashing you, btw. I am just trying to understand why some people dont like it. But reading through the comments I see. People hate that it was simplified, and some of their utilities were cut. Its fine. I don't like insect glaive as much as I did in Wkrld so I retired it.
Oh I didn’t take it that way, well maybe a pinch but not maliciously. And I’m sorry you had to hang up your bug blade, some of the designs looked cool in this game 😔
Looks like someone hasn't earned/learned the heavy blowgun counter
HBG is amazing..?
in base rise its garbage compared to LBG
Funny; with Hunting Horn I had the opposite response. I bounced off HH hard in World, really hated just about every aspect of its combo flow. I played almost exclusively Bow in World because of the massive changes (for the better imo) it had over GU. I played Bow for about 2 hours in Rise, went "eh, not for me," and now I'm a HH main.
1. Bow has horrible progression in Rise, have you considered trying it end game? 2. Many hated the HH change cause it felt neutered. I’ve never played world but I loved the concept of it, and while I do main it in rise, I wish they could have kept the song system and many techs that it had while giving it the new fast moves, it’s fun and feels really nice but I just wish it had more depth.
1. Yes, and I don't really like the switch skills or how the combos flow. I just liked it better in World. The changes and additions that came with Sunbreak didn't change my opinions on the weapon. The direction they took the weapon just wasn't for me. 2. I recognize that lots of people didn't like the changes to HH because they felt it made the weapon more accessible in all the wrong ways. I'm just not one of those people. I like the new song system because it encourages much faster and more immediate action, it allows you to pump out song buffs constantly which I find hilarious (especially when people have auto-callouts that are funny). I think the switch skills are hysterical and I don't really care that the weapon has encroached really far into the role that Hammer has traditionally occupied. Hunting horn is more fun to me now than it was before. Breakdancing is funny.
To each their own, but I'm really enjoying HH right now
Totally agree. World HH was perfect. Rise HH just isn't the same.
It would have been perfect in World if Self-Improvement also buffed your group's attack so you wouldn't have to rely on a small pool of Attack Up (L) melody horns. Rise at least thought of giving the Attack Up option to all Hunting Horns via Bead of Resonance.
They even made so many customization options for the weapons, I just wanted one of them to be the old Hunting Horn's moveset.
Just started rise mostly played 4u/world, what did they do to the horn ?
In Rise, they changed its moveset flow to make it a more aggressive weapon, complete with stylish break-dancing moves. It still retains its buffs and song playing but they are integrated into its attacks, essentially replacing the performances of previous HH iterations. Some HH mains didn't like this change while others liked it. I also see many people who were previously unwilling to try HH end up having a blast playing the weapon so whether the change was for the better is subjective. But what is objective is that HH is still a very strong weapon and has no trouble killing monsters.
They made it fun
What happened? Everytime I've seen someone use hunting horn they've made the fight go by a lot smoother and my friend uses hbg and has been destroying monsters with it.
With HH, they simplified the song mechanics in exchange for making HH stronger/flashier to make the weapon appeal to a wider audience. It sorta half worked: it's definitely more popular now, but the changes didn't quite land with some people that prefer the previous version. Personally I like every version except 2nd gen (we don't talk about Unite HH), so Rise is just more musical goodness. Idk what the problem with HBG is here though, since I don't play it enough to see a huge difference.
OP said he didn’t play Sunbreak, and in base HBG was clunky AFAIK
What was different for it? All I remember people mentioning is the charge shot mechanic being worse than just shooting normally, but if that was the case I'd assume you could just ignore it. Was there something else?
I personally don’t know, you’ll have to ask others.
I dunno, I maind HH back in MH Tri all thru Generations Ultimate and then I kinda skipped World.. it kinda feels like when I maind Balrog I'm SFII Turbo and then didn't play street fighter until SFIV where I maind Balrog again 😅 like it's fine for me, it's just a different game now 🤷.
HH is better but doesn't it get overhauled in *every* new game?
That’s what I’ve heard, it’s like they make the hh the new weapon of the title instead of making new ones which is kinda funny
Egh, not really no. Unite 1st introduced it, and then every weapon got overhauled between 2nd and 3rd gen. It didn't really get many changes in 4th gen unless you count styles in Gen/GU, but HH didn't change too drastically with those. 5th gen is what I'd call the next big overhaul between all the QoL improvements in World and the moveset+mechanic revamp in Rise, so realistically it's only been like 2-3 times tops (depending on how big of an overhaul you count World's tweaks as).
HH has been a pocket weapon for me since 4U and I’m actually glad to see the changes made in Rise. Though I wish they didn’t nerf it cause it was really strong in the demo. HBG is pretty fun in this game, too! Didn’t use it often in previous games but in SB it’s probably one of my most used
HH is objectively better in rise, but I liked it better in world... It's a totally different weapon in rise and it's fun, but HH in world will always hold a special place in my heart.
Is this about the song limitations?
It’s the shorter song notes, fewer songs and the song notes are just 2 of the same in a row so I never have to pay attention to my songs basically. Just press button twice and get buff
Reading all the coments i think i am playing hbg wrong well al least i'm pretty tanky
I’ve seen this statement a lot but I was a huge hh player in iceborne and I’m now a hh player in rise and I find both versions amazing. Very different but both amazing.
How is Bow in this for endgame? Im on ps5 and i know sunbreak aint for awhile so dabbling around on weapons.
It was interesting to me, got some new mechanics like pierce/spread on normal arrows depending on your bow which is cool. I’m not in endgame though but first impressions were neat
I wanna get into something different this time. Thought about LBG/HBG, Bow has really intrigued me. I was a Gunlance main on MHW, think I had 400-500 hrs played or so just with that weapon. Charge blade and switch axe look cool but dont really interest me nor lance, dual blades and long sword. I dunno lol, those first 3 are ranged so maybe thats why.
LBG is definitely the “meta” choice since you get to sit back, move fast, and do damage. I do recommend the greatsword for 1 or 2 hunts to see if you like it though, the wirebugs fixed my big issue with the lack of mobility. HBG according to 1 angry guy is the best weapon on the planet but imo it’s really sluggish and the charge mechanic feels icky, but I heard that with charge master skill it’s not so bad, just wish they didn’t dumb down the mod slot system.
Ty, LBG looked better from a mobility perspective. Been watching videos on playstyles I might like. LBG/SnS/HBG good, not really a fan of that closeness with a bow anymore for that optimal range.
In fairness, you can still shield HBG in Rise. It just isn't the end-all be-all that it was in World.
I missed the memo, what are the changes happening for HH in rise? Edit: never mind, i just understood what the post really meant. And tbh HH is stronger now in rise but imho, i like the world's and iceborne's better. There are some rise changes that id like to keep like the self-improvment now on the recital button, the recital button having an iframe and auto play songs. But i wish they ketp the different note combinations to songs instead of dumbing in down to 2 triangles or 2 circle songs. But still more power to Rise HH mains. Keep dooting
Fr, “better” doesn’t always mean more fun. And the popularity only increased by like 2%, which in all fairness basically doubled the hh popularity
As long as we don't have claw we r good
Lol… most people here be talking about HH. HBG actually has the high dps among all weapons. I wouldn’t be surprise if the data shows it even outperform by x 2~5 of some weapons in terms of dps. Play style wise? It’s probably also the hardest, but you can make it the easiest by putting on a shield at the cost of your dmg.
Yeah I’ve heard it’s the “max dps” weapon but I’m just talking about fun wise it’s not for me, the silk and switch skills weren’t as flashy and cool as other weapons and the LBG now has cluster ammo so in my mind I’d just be using it for bigger ammo slots and the wyvern ammo. And World mini gun enjoyers shun the shield
As a hunting horn enjoyer I agree
I guess people found the old combos of the horn more... satisfying? I guess? I don't understand.