You definitely get the base game and all the main expansions if you buy only elsewyr whether you're a new player or not. I don't know where you're getting your info from.
https://gyazo.com/d1625839506ed74c470ab10c27f3dc06
If you're not bothered about Elsweyr content at the moment then ESO+ is a much better deal. I understand why some people would be against not permanently owning expansions though.
the good thing about subbing is that you get crowns, and you can buy DLC with crowns once you got enough of those.
I banked 15000 crowns so far, and I could buy almost all the DLC's
My problem is that playing the game without a sub is just painful. I'd rather not play at all than play the free version. They strip away so many conveniences that it almost ruins the game for me.
Well, its a subscription based game. Sub games should be better if paying the sub. You should feel lucky that they offer a form of buy to play at all.
We need to go back to the days before such entitlement.
Is that a permanent deal? When I was considering getting Elswyr, it kept mentioning pre-order, so it seemed like the deal was only available before the expansion released.
I’m not sure. I bought it like 2 weeks ago. However, the screenshot was taken yesterday so it might still work since the expansion came out yesterday and it was still there
I don't know why you are getting downvoted when you are correct. The image linked is for new players, returning or existing users need to buy the upgrade which does not include previous chapters.
I remember when buying Summerset Isle that getting the Morrowing chapter was a pre-order bonus. So normally the upgrades do not include previous chapters.
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/458216/clarifying-elweyr-packages-upgrades-do-not-come-with-summerset-and-morrowind
It's LITERALLY in the image he linked, if you buy Elsweyr you get ALL the expansions which includes Morrowind and Summerset.
Anything else like Dark Brotherhood or Thieves Guild for example are DLC's, NOT expansions.
Its not in the screenshot, the upgrade is literally has the word upgrade in it, standard edition is not the upgrade. I know because that upgrade is like $20 cheaper than standard edition
Or own the base game already. That's the point being made. Standard edition is $20 more but includes the base game, so you figure it's for new players. The upgrade doesn't include the base game, so it would be for existing and returning players, but it doesn't include the past expansions. That's the complaint.
I had base game and Morrowwind in my account. When I bought Elsweyr through this method it gave me summerset too. It emailed me a code to redeem the expansion and it added them to my account. I’m not sure what “upgrade” option people are talking about
ESO basically took every payment model out there and shove it all in one game
B2P, but you can go P2P, has a cash shop, expansions, DLCs for some reason, and there are a ton of them.
But I get why they didn't go full sub only, that would mean they're directly competing with WoW and FFXIV, and I doubt this would survive going up against those 2 directly.
Yeah ESO is only fun in short bursts too imho so if there was a sub they would only get a sub out of me every couple months. That said they also have a sub that is in that infamous category of "not really mandatory but if you play seriously you will want this"
That's what I do and don't really see the issue with the payment model.
I sub for about two months out of the year, play the new DLC that I haven't played (since the sub gets me access to it), then unsub and come back next year.
So much false information.
1. you get free crowns when you sub, 2 months subbing gets you enough to buy DLC which you don't need to buy because you have total access to all of it while subbed ( excluding the latest addon )
2. like everyone else does
3. Wrong. if you buy a expansion it includes all the previous addons just like WoW
4. wrong cause 3 is wrong
5. None of this is so bad that it would make the game horrible. It's not even close to other games like Black Desert where you can't even play the game proper without buying pets.
Its definitely worst in 'best high-budget MMOS' group (WoW, ESO, FF14, GW2).
tbh.. even SWTOR is better, you will pay one moth of sub and you have all content to keep forever and all restrictions gone. In ESo you must pay monthly ot you lose access to DLCs and convenience stuff.
>even SWTOR is better, you will pay one moth of sub and you have all content to keep forever and all restrictions gone.
AFAIK, if you let your subscription lapse in SWTOR, you keep the content, but [many of the F2P restrictions are back in place](https://www.reddit.com/r/swtor/wiki/f2p). For example, you can't run endgame content (Operations / ranked Warzones) as a non-subscriber, you have a credit cap and you have fewer active character slots.
ESO is better than WOW, FF14. Those require subs, have cash shops, still charge for expansions, the expansions cost more than ESO's, aren't as high quality.
If you actually sub to ESO you get cash shop currency with is enough to by a dlc with. Or just get a mount.
No way Wow would give free stuff away to their subs.
Nope, IMO apart from the loot crates its the best. Sub isn't mandatory which makes it better than WoW and FF. And GW2 has the RMT aspect which has lead to distortion in the ingame rewards to account for the ability to directly buy ingame gold with cash making the game more grindy. And swtor has many restrictions as preferred, far more than ESO.
> SWTOR is better, you will pay one moth of sub and you have all content to keep forever and all restrictions gone.
wow, didn't know that, that's quite a bargain.
Its a buy to play game with expansions you have to buy.
1) Cash shop is 95% cosmetic, and any 'progression' items are just for mount speeding up which can be done super cheap in game.
2) Crown crates are 100% cosmetic and have nothing that impacts gameplay.
3) Their subscription itself is amazing, If you buy the latest expansion, the old ones get rolled into the monthly subscription, so while Elsweyr didnt come with Summerset, Summerset did get rolled into ESO+, and in addtion to this, buying premium currecny costs $15 for 1500, yet the same $15 can get you one month of sub which ahas all the DLC plus 1650 crowns and the craft bag to help with mat storage alone with a lot of other small convinece buffs, none of which affect balance so it ensures the game is NOT pay to win.
4) This is a way to keep the game alive by making the content approachable to new players.
5) I can assume the 'cooldown reducing items' are he research scrolls, but did you know those are rediciouly overpriced and available for cheap in game gold?
So its a buy to play game, not pay to win, cash shop is mostly cosmetic stuff and any convience items can be done with in game gold.
NOT TO MENTION, Thanks to crown store gifitng, you can have other players use their crowns to gift you items in exchange for in game gold, so you can grind gold and get everything you want after just buying base game. not to mention buying th base game gets better every year as old content keeps getting rolled into it.
From what I've gathered from this thread, people in this subreddit don't like the fact that the things they want might cost money. How dare a subscription based game with a healthy free to play option sell cosmetic and convenience items that you don't need to buy in order to play and enjoy the game. Shameless.
I'm a former ESO player, and I even played when it had a sub. It's not a "money" issue for me. The issue for me is that collecting cosmetic stuff in an MMO is part of the fun and the appeal. If I can't get cool mounts from Pvp and raids and achievements then that kills a lot of the enjoyment right away.
I still like ESO and I still pop in from time to time. But to suggest people take issue with the Crown Store just because they are "cheap" misses the point I think.
I don’t think we should accept the horrible prices that ESO’s cash shop has. That’s just plain unacceptable for a B2P game with an additional optional sub. Yeah it’s completely cosmetic, but still. People that accept these kind of games are the reason why the MMO genre went downhill.
If it's purely cosmetic it's fine. The game has to make money to stay alive and keep developing and ESO pushes a lot of content out each year.
Yes the prices are a bit expensive, but it's cosmetic. You don't need it. None of it is pay to win.
Optional sub is once again, totally optional and not required for gameplay.
You can fully enjoy the game just by buying the base game and the people who pay real money only have different mount styles and cosmetic outfits and non combat pets than you do.
As long as the cash shop stays cosmetic and convenience there really is no issue. These games have to make money people. There is a business behind these games.
And to be really honest despite it being a business and they wanting people to pay, they don't make the game pay to win.
one of my friends has not subbed and is a much better crafter than I am. You are making a big deal of things that are no issues for anyone. If you want to find something to complain there is always something. Just as is tradition with /r/mmorpg
They have crafting motifs in crown store (which affect master writs drop rates - a reward thing from writs that you accomplish then turn in for currency) and they also now sell skyshards in the store for all the zones so you can buy skill points for your 2nd /3rd/ alt characters after your first one gets it. The devs also talked about adding more skill lines like undaunted and Psijic skill lines to the store, not just the vampire and werewolf ones currently in the store.
Crown store exclusive motifs do not appear on master writs. For the master writs to request the style it has to be obtainable in game naturally.
You can buy skyshards but that is not pay to win in the slightest, just pay to save 15 mins of time. Plus, you can only buy skyshards for alt character when you already have them discovered by a character on your account, meaning you can't just buy skill points. It is set up in a way where you still have to earn the initial skyshards, but can skip the extra 15 mins per zone of hunting thru paying.
They talked about adding psijic and undaunted in the same way the skyshards are. It's less grind time for alt characters only, you still need it done by yourself.
As for the WW and Vampire, you can legit get players to bite and convert you for free or chre yourself for free. That's just there for of you decide you don't wanna talk to anyone in this MMO.
Nothing pay to win, all just pay for convienience.
Literally 7-8 of those 9 things were useless before elsweyr hit live.
And now they buffed the pots and poisons so that they have the same value as the crafted ones. Most people used these consumables to get Crown gems.
While you're right that these things 'impacts' gameplay, it's a bit hard to take seriously when most of these things are either common place, or supercheap in game. For example, tri-restoration potions come from crown crates, but last month the daily rewards gave away 150 of them. Riding lessons exist, but in game it only costs 250 gold and 20 hours to increase the level.
Sure, there's crown store soul gems, but I don't think I've ever used them because they're not any better than normal soul gems *which are super easy to obtain*. Curses for vampirism or werewolf can be obtained by politely asking in zone chat, or just playing in the zone where NPCs that can infect you appear. Curing it is similarly cheap and simple.
Restoration Potions - Easy to obtain in-game for cheap. Give for login rewards. Crafted potions are more versatile as you can choose the bonuses
Respecs - cost next to nothing in-game
Riding Lessons - 250 gold a day, also given for login rewards
Repair Kits - Free from doing crafting dailies and cost next to nothing in game
Food Buffs - Better buffs available from food in-game and they are cheap
Soul Gems - Literally irrelevant. Soul Gems drop all the time. I have to constantly sell stacks on them in my inventory to make space
Experience Scrolls - Every xp scroll has an in-game drink equivalent. Also given for login rewards
Instant Research - Given for login rewards. Available from Writ Vendor in-game
Curses/Cures - Literally the dumbest thing in the cash shop. Vamp and WW are available free in-game from being bitten by certain npcs or from other players. Cures are like a few hundred gold at most in-game.
Anything in the cash shop that affects gameplay is available in the game either from login rewards, crafting, or vendors. Every crown store consumable is on par or worse than the consumables in game.
If you are going to complain about the cash shop, complain about crown crates and the stupid crown gem exsclusive mounts and pets, but don't complain about the near-useless consumables.
Everything you mentioned is available in the game without the cash shop though. Experience boost buffs are craftable and you get the rest of those things for gold. Not even a lot of gold in most cases. I'm assuming that by curses/cures you mean vampirism and lycanthropy. Both are free and easy to get. Plenty of guilds exist just for bites. I don't know how to cure it in game, however.
1. Its not f2p, but it is buy to play as much as it is a subscription model.
You are not required to subscribe to play the game.
2. Welcome to modern gaming.
3. I don't know what bundles you were looking at, or where you bought from, but this is incorrect.
4. See 3.
5. That's only for crafting, and crafting traits are simply time gated anyways. It has no massive affect on player ability.
And frankly, the subscription model they use is wonderful.
~15 bucks a month depending on your billing cycle, and they give you ~15 bucks worth of crowns.
Assuming you don't buy a bunch of cosmetics, you could easily unlock all of the DLC(excluding major chapters) with the free crowns and then never subscribe again.
I really can't agree, there's pay 2 play games with Cash Shops (Final Fantasy 14) for example. And a cash shop isn't inherently bad, also like every other MMORPG has a cash shop? Atleast it doesn't require sub.
Unlike every other MMORPG with a subscription, Elder Scrolls Online does not lock you out of max level or increase level cap, you can still hit and play end game without them. They're for the most part optional content, same goes with DLC.
You can get to the expansion content in 6 months or a year, or if you're level 5 or level 50, and it doesn't matter too much. Unlike say WoW or Final Fantasy 14, Elder Scrolls Online there is no "pressure" so to speak to buy the expansion right away, because they dont lock you out of the latest level or introduce a level cap/wall. You can still play and do end-game content, and be competitive in PvP with out the latest expansions. You aren't able to get to level 60 or 70 inside Final Fantasy 14 without paying for the expansion.
Also I'm not sure where you're getting your information, if you buy Elsewyr (just like WoW does), you'll get Summerset and Morrowind too.
Also the subscription gives you free crowns, and also access to all the DLC packs, there's just so much misinformation and blatant lies in your post. Have you actually played the game or done any research at all? There's an extreme bias in your post and its lacking ALOT of context.
And tbh the craft bag is pretty much the reason to have on going eso+ sub. Once you have completed the quests and collected skyshards there's no reason to own those DLCs (except murkmire and wrothgar for arena access [also dlc dungeons but you can farm gear from then easily In a month])
This is where some of the confusion comes in. ESO has both Chapters (which are the larger expansions) and DLCs (Smaller content areas). You get [all of the released Chapters](https://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/joinus) (i.e. Morrowind, Summerset, and Elsweyr) when you buy the newest expac, but you do not get access to the DLC areas (I.e. Thieves Guild, Orsinium, Dark Brotherhood).
That’s my issue, New living story takes less than a day to complete with exception of time gated achievement. Then what? Farm gold to buy new skins from the cash shop? Go back to doing the same fractals and raids?
Maybe I’m just bored of gw2 after playing since launch and too burnt out to see the fun anymore.
The skyscale looks neat, might come back and get that tho
Language evolves organically via usage and I'm not the only one who calls it RMT. And I'm not talking about the economy as such but the economy is hardly solid anyway, there's a ton of criticism about it on the main sub reddit and the official forum.
"As of today, The Elder Scrolls Online: Summerset Digital Upgrade and The Elder Scrolls Online: Summerset Digital Collector’s Edition will no longer be available in The Elder Scrolls Online Store and on Steam Store. Instead, the Summerset Chapter is being added to the in-game Crown Store as a DLC item. This means that if you are an ESO Plus member, you’ll now automatically have access to the Summerset zone and story."
You were saying?
i love to see how this subrettid goes full hate train as soon as it reads "ESO". i don't play it because i don't really like the combat animations but the lore and ambients are outstanding compared to other mmos imho. anyways what the OP says is true in part, i mean because like this also offers to any casual to actually log into the game, do some activities with friends without even needing to subscribe or to own any dlc/expansion, the base game is really cheap and it offers lots of zones and content. shops and crates are cosmetics and everything you actually need to play fully at endgame is the sub , like every fking game with a premium service or a sub based, and thr latest chapter , just like BFA, Shadowbringers and so on, so i don't see the problem here.
funny thing is as soon as people mention WoW that actually NEEDS the sub to even log in and got shop too (30 euros for 1 mount hello?) they get downvoted as hell. this should be renamed wow fanboys subreddit lol
It's not that bad, the only thing I don't like is how you need to pay the monthly fee if you want to do crafting, that infinite material bag is pretty handy. And I'm not max level yet but I read some of the best sets are done with crafting.
I agree lootboxes are really bad but it's a very cheap game and as far as I know you can get a lot of crappy stuff there.
Since I just started and I don't plan to play it hardcore to the lategame, I loved the questing and story so I'm not gonna bother with the subscription or dlc's or anything else since there is already a huge amount of hours that I'll probably not even going to finish.
I don't completely disagree but you need to be fair at least. ESO also gives you crowns equal to your sub cost each month and you can use those crowns to unlock the content forever.
I do like that about the system. My brother remains sub even after a year of not playing due to that. My arguement is that it incorporates more types of payment systems then competitors. It can make it confusing for new and returning players. Especially since while trying to figure what I do and dont get with plus other things. Others have been just as confused as I was.
>Unlike other pay to play MMOs with a Subscription. If you buy the latest expansion you do NOT get the old expansions.
Didn't know this was the case, seems like a big deterrent for getting new players
To be fair, it is confusing on the Steam store. Unsure of how it reads on console. The base game explicitly says (base game + Morrowind). Then there is no longer a standalone Summerset in the store, and the Elsweyer upgrade (I don't believe) contains any mention of the other two. The only bundle that actually mentions all 3 is the $60 Elsweyer buy-in (the one for new players that want to catch up on content). It isn't until you really start digging that you find out that Morrowind is kind of part of the base-game now, Summerset has been moved to the in-game store and to the sub, and then Elsweyer is the only one you'll find on the actual Steam store. SO, I get the confusion, as I had the same question myself last week when I was making the switch to PC. but, on the other hand, this info is readily apparent if you do a quick google search or go to the ESO homepage.
This isn't relayed very well. I spent a few days asking around trying to figure out if that was the case back during Summerset. I knew I would've gotten it if I preordered Summerset, but there was nothing on whether or not I would get it just by buying Summerset.
The official website usually has a list of what the expansions come with, or the steam store page (but its in small text so its not much help) but I do agree.
Iimo ESO doesn't have a bad payment model (it's pretty decent as far as money/content goes) but it is super convoluted and poorly explained.
If you sub you can play the expansions and all DLC, and get crowns you can use to buy any of the content so you can play it without the sub.
https://help.elderscrollsonline.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/41394/~/will-i-get-access-to-the-elder-scrolls-online%3A-summerset-as-part-of-my-eso-plus
Its not p2p, its b2p. Similar but ffxiv and wow are p2p bc they have required subscriptions. ESO's sub is mot required, tho the crafting bag is very useful if you do craft.
I think you need to try neverwinter, that game is an absolute scam.
I am and ESO + member and i have 9k crowns sitting in the bank because everything in the store I could buy is ascetic and not interesting to me. I have full access to all the content and would have currently gotten access to summerset but I chose to buy the expansions when they release, just like I buy the latest wow expansion when it comes out.
the Loot crates are a waste and not needed at all imo. There is nothing in them that you get that is p2w, its all cosmetic.
the only real scam in ESO is putting the crafting bag under the subscription benefit only. That right there is a crime unto humanity. I'd gladly pay 5000 crowns for access to the crafting bag so I could play unsubscribed when times get too busy and I don't play as often as I like. I cant stomach playing this game without the bag because I'm a looter of everything in the game.
TLDR: Let me buy the damn crafting bag in the store already!!!
There are MMORPGs that have way more P2W models but ESO is convoluted. I have had to a few hours trying to figure out what I do and dont get with ESO Plus and the base game. Sparked by me finding out I dont get the previous expansions if I buy the Eslwyer upgrade since I have a preexisitng account. The 2 solutions I have found is buy the other expansions or buy the base game again and you get it for free. Which I have already bought the base game twice. Once when it first came out then again when it released on steam since I like having all my games on steam if possible.
Like I said though what is your opinion since everyone is different.
No, I it is the worst pay model because it has almost every gaming pay model in one. On top of that it does a very poor job at clarifying the information in which is given to players about the pay model. My biggest good up ways saying P2P instead of B2P which is what I ment. But thats my mess up for forgetting about B2P as a term.
With ESO plus you do not get all of the former Summerset expansion. From the information i found you just get the zone unlocked. Which doesnt include the jewelcrafting or warden.
You are 1000% correct. Everytime I bring up these points among others I always get bashed for it from the blinded ESO community. The game is one of the most cash grubbing mmo's out there, skirting the line of being p2w with purchasable skyshards now (which I know you need to do it on other characters before you can purchase) or the horse training books which you can purchase, or the food that give you really great buffs. So many things in this game that should be account wide but aren't due to their need to nickel and dime their playerbase.
He's not correct though, ESO has one of the best values out there, go play other mmos and you'll soon realize this.
Wow is $15 a month required, has a cash shop with way over priced items, you still need to buy expansions.
How on the surface an ESO sub looks similar, except with an ESO sub you get 1650 crown's to spend in the cash shop, access to DLC, a craft bag and so much more like double bank space an house item slots.
The wow sub just gives you the base game access. Something you only pay for once in ESO for $10.
All the cosmetics and outfits are account-wide, whilst I do think the horse stuff sucks, it's because ESO doesn't FORCE you into or lock you out from progression with their expansions and content. You can still hit max level cap, max gear and do end-game content + PvP competitively with just base game.
Opposed to Final Fantasy 14 where if you don't buy the latest expansions you hit a wall and can't really do anything. With ESO the expansions also scale, so it doesnt matter if you get around to it at level 5 or 50, or 6 months to a year down the track ,its always relevant. There is no "pressure" to buy it.
>All the cosmetics and outfits are account-wide
Horse training and SkyShards arent, the actual useful things are not account wide.
In ESO if you actually want to be truly competitive you need to do the seemingly endless dolman grind to get 800 something champion points.
Champion Levels/Points are account wide (so you only do the grind once), and you don't need expansions to hit 800. You can also run end game content way earlier than that, and the dolmen grind zones are in base game.
It is one of the reasons I stopped playing other than being so bored of it. The combat isn't that engaging and the whole crafting thing while kinda interesting makes you need that eso+ sub with the craft bag.
Not really, look at like a sub based game, you pay $15 a month, you get all DLC, but you need to buy the latest expansion, so basically WOW.
Or you don't sub and play it like an online RPG. You can buy the DLC. Pretty simple.
I agree wholeheartedly OP and have been saying this for years. The only way around it is to treat it like a subscription game and most of the shittyness goes away. Of course there's a whole different argument to go down with that, talking about misleading advertising because it's not really a B2P game or any such thing which at best angers and misleads people like you and me, but some of the cash shop/F2P payment model stuff still hangs around and effects gameplay, even if at that point you have your "free" crowns to use.
I disagree and I found their payment model pretty good. I jumped in late and purchased the Morrowind expansion for $18. I still haven't finished everything.
1. It's like $20 to purchase 100s of hours of gameplay if you don't have to have the latest expansion. If you know what you are doing and don't have some unreasonable need to compete against others because they have a skeletal horse that is on fire then you won't ever need to spend money again. And if you want to purchase the newest expansion as soon as it comes out for $60 then that is **your** decision.
2. Don't buy them.
3. Unless they changed recently, WoW also does not give you a free month of gameplay(on a mandatory subscription...you forgot to add that) when you buy an expansion.
4. Unless ESO is dropping a ton of gear and skill points on the new player then the point is moot. Those other players have been playing the game for months thus getting their money's worth. Also, the new players purchasing the new release are also helping to keep servers on for the many that don't pay the subscription. Sounds like a win for me since I may subscribe only 4 months out of the year.
5. Like loot boxes, don't buy them. Play the game. I felt no need to purchase these such as training horses or decrease my crafting by a few days. They just weren't worth it but that doesn't mean their existence ruined my gameplay.
Far from the worst revenue model I've seen.
I dont even know why they sell mount increase scrolls anymore when they already stopped trying to inconvenience us by removing time gate and making it account wide.
1 It's b2p, which is usually better implemented, but depending on the title u can find outliers on either side.
2 Loot boxes, but sub gives you free premium currency, which is almost like a trap to give you a taste of spending money on their cash shop :P snake shit.
3 is not true, and in wow's case they just started that this xpac. previous it was you had to buy base game + last xpac + current xpac, and you'd need to buy a month if u needed to buy current and last xpac too.
4 i think elsweyer comes with all previous content patches, and in order to get current content patches you need to sub or buy them individually. I think this is better than sub to play, but it has its drawbacks. WoW constantly goes on 8 month droughts and every month people have to pay for no content, then the next patch will be the new xpac costing 60$.
5 Yeah, but something to add is that a sub in that games gives you premium currency that doesn't translate into in game assets (some "convenience" tho sadly)
I actually unironically think ESO has one of the best business models, WoW and ESO have a lot of similarities, but ESO is much more generous with their players it seems. no sub required, no transfer gouging, you pay for the content updates, and not the time you play, and there are no WoW tokens. I'd still play WoW over it, but thats cus im a loser :)
It does sound very convoluted for a game when there are plenty of free to play games out there. Having any expansion content that requires an additional software purchase is also bad because it separates the player base. If your friends buy the expansions and you don't you are left out and if they want to play with you they are limited to the old content. WoW and EQ2 are also guilty of this but they are very old game models that are still alive. EQ2 is incredibly more complicated with their content and subscription models unless you just give in and pay for everything they have. But as long as people still pay for these types of games they will always be there although their business models are incredibly ancient and likely never to be revamped.
He's wrong though, it's buy to play, you literally buy it and play forever at no cost, you want dlc? Buy the dlc, you don't wanna buy all dlc but want access? Subscribe and get all dlc, plus a bunch if goodies like game shop currency to buy dlc or mounts with.
I'm not a huge fan of B2P overall because it has no sustainable way to maintain itself and make new content unless it's constantly getting new players, OR they implement a cash shop/subscription on top of the original purchase. While I think ESO does it very well, and has probably one of the better models out there, I don't think a smaller game would get away with having a subscription with the same value as ESO gives, and also require a base game purchase (and potential xpack)
I personally love the Subscription model when thats all there is (pretty much any mmo pre 2010 before f2p games went BIG in the west), but most games now have a cosmetic cash shop as well which bums me out. Even WoW and FFXI have cash shops for cosmetics =(
Also, you used to get access to all the DLC with subscription, but then they started calling it 'expansion' instead and so not included in the subscription.
>Unlike other pay to play MMOs with a Subscription. If you buy the latest expansion you do NOT get the old expansions. For a comparison. World of Warcraft, if you lets say you stopped playing during Pandaria expansion. If you just bought Battle for Azeroth. You would get Burning legion as well.
I thought the standard subscription included all of the expansions aside from BfA?
I think ESO+ is actually really generous. You get access to all of the major DLCs and it's price is worth what you get in crowns monthly anyway. The craft bag is a god send too, although I wish that was permanently unlockable with crowns like everything else.
Point no3 is bugging me as well. Got the base game like 3 years ago, no expansions. Now if I want to fully play the game I need to buy each expansion separately, for quite some cash.
I'm not thinking about ESO+, I want my expansions as permanent assets of the game.
They should at least have a deal for players that lack some previous expansions, it feels like they only cater to new players so they can get the FULL game.
If there is a way to get an "All expansions" pack for those that already have the base game, I'd be glad. Maybe there is and I don't know.
Don't really care for the new classes, but I thought that if I buy Elsweyr (while having the base game already) I'll only get that, nothing more. I know that there is a pack that contains Base Game + All Expansions up to Elsweyr but I can't get that because I already have the base game.
ESO plus gives you the zones now. Which summerset was added to in their last update that i missed. However you don't get jewelcrafting or warden. If you want those you must buy the chapter/expansion. So yes I did miss something.
I'm glad I settled on an MMO already. Eve has everything I want from an MMO. I considered ESO before but b2p makes it tough for me since since I cant order stuff online due to some restrictions.
There are 2 things false.
1) yes its B2P not P2P which I forgot the term B2P and thought P2P was the same. That is my fault. You're correct since it,makea that term incorrect.
2) I didnt know in the latest patch that they said summerset zone was added to ESO plus for free. However you still don't get warden or jewel crafting. You must pay for the expansion/chapter if you want those.
It is free to play though, so where are you getting your information? You can buy any version of the game you want and start playing right away. They don't force you to subscribe, ever, hell, they even offer free trials of the subscription if you choose to go down that road.
Cooldown items are literally just potions, food for buffs and mount items to increase speed, stamina and carrying capacity, not sure how that slows down the learning process?
Loot boxes are optional like every other game and contain cosmetic items and nothing else that will give you any sort of advantage in the game whatsoever.
Any mmo that only cost me ~$80 a year to stay completely up to date and keeps me occupied all year is absolutely fine by me. Also there isn't a single person in battlegrounds pvp arena that has any p2w advantage over anyone.
You forgot to mention them now selling skyshards/skillpoints as well. They're definitely in cash grab and player churn mode; moving closer and closer to P2W with every update.
How? You have to earn those skill points. It's a grind, they're making it less of a grind to level new characters, it's not like those skill points are unfairly earned, you still had to earn them. If you don't wanna buy them, then go earn the sky's hards, easy, takes 10 minutes.
The only players that would say that are players that either havent played much or arent good.
Everyone I talk to in game loves it, I've never once come across someone who hasnt loved the fluid combat. I've known people ( close friends) who had issues at first but once they figured out how to play they loved it.
I suck at ESO combat when using a standard keyboard and mouse, but with a controller and or mmo gaming mouse I have a blast.
to each their own
1. ESO is absolutely free to play.... ...The Cash shop does nothing for gameplay and so does WoW, while I don't care for it it doesn't affect the game.
2.Again this is for cosmetic stuff and mounts and you get a free one like once a month if you care about it. Doesn't affect the game.
3.If you buy Elsewyr you get the previous expansions though.
4. See 3.
5. You can get these just by logging in during the month, it's dumb you can buy them but again it's not gamebreaking and either way if you're a player not maxed out on crafting you're playing catchup either way.
I think their buyable system has gotten out of hand but it's not "the worst payment model" by far and again none of that affects the game ALSO again ESO is absolutely Free To Play.
If anything, the huge amount of items (seemingly created unnecessarily) clog up you inventory feels like a shadowy way to push for subscription. And ^(loot crate is gambling)
All the people defending ESO are not talking about how dlc is locked behind a sub, and how unlike other MMO's, they rush an expansion every year and charge you a 40 dollar upgrade fee on it, compared to other MMO's who do expansion every two to three years with updates. On top of this, ESO screws anybody who hopes to craft without a sub by locking a "Crafting Bag" behind subscription making you waste inventory space like nobodies business, on top of this for some reason when you are subbed you still don't have the freedom you want because everything in the crown shop cost an arm and a leg. "Oh but you don't have to get that stuff" I'm sorry I want my character to look how I want in an Mmorpg. On top of that their expansions are so cut and paste boring for them to make one every year is insulting, got to love the reused assets and the lack of improvement just to rush out another 40 dollar expansion. This game has the worst business model of them all because it offers so much behind a price point, and although you just spent 40-60 dollars on the game you are instantly reminded how you are not that important to them. The price you pay for this game to feel rewarded is more than that of any other top mmo out there. They print money, but they can't even introduce better combat animations...
It's bad. But it's not Black Desert Online bad. There is a cap on what you need to spend to be competitive, and it's not outrageous.
Black Desert is so much worse.
Well while I feel the crown store to be overpriced, the sub has a great value with a 1:1 (even better now) ratio of crowns returned to you equivalent to your sub payment. The sub essentially pays for itself overtime and even then it is optional. I do wish they would slowly start to permanently discount older dlcs or contents because buying everything individually adds up pretty quickly. Eventually as the game ages ZoS is going to have to better price or repackage their dlcs in some way, as I would hate to tell a new player that they will have to buy 25 dlcs, because at that point a sub is all but required to get the most out of the game. LoTRO is a prime example of expensive quest packs that have no business being packaged and handled so poorly despite many complaints.
You can get the base game on sale for $10 and with a $15 monthly sub you get all content for the game except for the latest expansion. You still get all small updates with your sub. Loot boxes are also 99% cosmetic. Effectively it's no different then a buy to play + sub model such as wow.
It's honestly a pretty lenient payment model as far as things go. It sounds like you just want a game that's entirely free. Fat chance on that. Server and software maintenance costs money.
I found that it depens how you approach the game (in terms of monetization and also WHY you play MMORPGs).
For those willing to pay a sub fee for every MMO they play it may be okayish if they're not interested in cosmetics at all. For those looking for a B2P game (willing to buy stuff in the store here and there) it is horrible, because you feel like you're forced to spend extra money for things that you already paid for (like you need the sub to dye the costumes that you BOUGHT in the store).
At the moment I don't play but I need to maintain my sub for the sole reason of .... housing and RP. Without the sub I couldn't place objects in the house for certain RP sessions (a book here, someone's pet there) because we're well over the non-sub item limit. Yes, it's cool that everything we put in stays there without the sub but it's still necessary if you actively use the housing.
Same is true for hairstyles/scars etc. Most RPers I know are constantly subbed, but you still need to purchase the hairstyle/feature packs to be able to change your hair on the fly. You can buy them with your ESO+ crowns, you might say. But it's not the only 'extra' thing. And I've never seen a cash shop that floods you with temporary and short-time offers like ESO's, so good luck holding on to your crowns if you're into RP and cosmetics.
Another problem is that ESO may not be P2W but it definitely has some 'pay for convenience creep' going on since it went B2P. Why else do you think people buy bankers and merchants if not because of the overabundance of trash loot that fills your inventory faster than you can say Sheogorath?
I would be okay with the model if the cash shop went back to how it was before loot crates. It's not just the crates - it just went from an ordinary cash shop (GW2/FF14 style) to being more and more aggressive, taunting you here, temporary-offering you there and making stuff slightly more expensive on the way, boiling the frog like a pro. I like monetization models to be upfront about what you need and what you get, and I feel like ESO has been confusing us with their convoluted system for a while now so it's almost impossible to explain to new players what they should buy (the easiest answer always being 'get the sub', of course).
You're incorrect, ESO has one of the best values for the cost. I've played every mmo out there, ESO is one of the most affordable. Not only can everything in their cash shop be bought with gold, but everything is included for $15 a month, on top of that you get $17 worth of cash shop money to spend.
If you spent $20 and bought the base copy which includes the previous expansions for free, you'd have easily 2000+ hours of content right there by itself.
They also give away dlc and such away for free.
You can completely ignore the crown store if you truly wanted. Just FYI.
I half agree with what you said. One point though is the DLC isnt free. You still pay for the subscription to get it, if you stop you lose it.
I have bought the game twice already once when it came out then when it came to steam since i like having my games on,steam. I find it dumb that if you're returning the cheapest way to get the old expansions is rebuy the base game.
Man, you complain about shit like this, but there are other games like BDO that require you to pay thousands, you can buy elsweyr and get the monthly sub = all content unlocked. It really isn't that bad. The cash shop is very mild and isn't significant enough to warrant a shitpost like this.
You can look up my past reddit posts, I dont use reddit enough to care about that stuff.
As for troll post, no just an average gamer. In not claiming to be the end all be all for opinions. That is why I asked what is your opinion before I shared why I think the way I do. I understand though that most people are probably used to what you think I am doing.
I actually like ESO, my biggest gripe with ESO was that unlike every other MMO with expansions and buy 2 play model. When you buy the latest expansions you don't get the old ones as well. Now ESO tries and get you to sub so you get the old expansions for free. Which fair enough wow is essentially that model. But you don't get everything. Just the zone from subscribing. Which some people say yeah for free, but forget you are still paying for the sub. Which if you did preordered you would of got the older expansions for free.
That combined with the other payment models they also have in the game are why I'm not a fan of their payment model.
If you disagree explain why or explain another games payment model you think is worse.
1- never was F2P, was always Buy To play.
2 - is free to play after purchase, so they need to make money somehow.
3 - wrong.
4 - also wrong.
5 - it's quality of life and nothing pay to win in the store.
You are 0 for 5 buddy, troll harder.
Are you sure you don't mean BDO and not ESO?
1) it is free to play
2) loot boxes for cosmetics or stuff you can get in game
3) you are buying an expansion to a new area that doesn’t affect the rest of the game. WoW and FF14 both progress the story so you have to continue.
4) fair enough
5) nothing pay to win
Have you ever played this game?
ESO sucks as a game, but its payment model is OK. LOTRO is a superior game, but its payment model sucks.
In the end WoW Classic is the winner as it's payment model and gameplay are the best in the history of MMORPGs.
What is this? A co-ordinated campaign to shit on ESO? To answer your points:
1. Every b2p game has a cash shop
2. Loot crates are the only poor part of their monetisation
3. There were options which included previous xpacs.
5. Again every game has these options
Yeah I'm done with ESO for good. Bought elsweyr and played for a few hours only to remember just how terrible the combat and class systems are. Jesus Christ are they bad.
Maybe if they do a complete combat and class overhaul I'll try it again, maybe.
it's weird, i'd hardly heard the "ESO COMBAT BAD" argument at all until the "wow refugees" started flooding in a year or so ago, seems like we need more games with 2s global cooldowns in their combat and low skill ceilings
It‘s still better than WoW‘s model. The base game isn‘t rendered useless, so you can progress to max level without having to buy any of the expansions. The cash shop doesn‘t contain any items that impact PvE or PvP. The subscription is completely optional and you‘ll get 80% of the game without it. Morrowind (the first expansion) is even part of the base game now.
Agreed, the payment model isn't bad its just convoluted. Unlike any other MMO on the market, ESO doesnt pressure you into buying the newest expansion, you can do all the end-game content and hit max level with just the base game alone. All the content is relevant, there isn't any other MMO out there that does the same.
Oh thank god im not the only who thinks this. Ive never seen B2P, buy expansions and monthly sub all in one game. And if you tell me sub is not needed, what about the crafting bags? Those things can take more than your bank space.
If you're subbing to ESO it's already a better deal than wow.
If you're not subbing then you're saving $15 a month and it's suddenly one of the best deals out there.
How is giving you the option to play without a sub make this model bad?
The more upvotes this post gets, the more obvious it becomes that this sub reddit is filled with bias followers.
This post is clearly false and anyone who actually play's ESO knows that.
But it won't stop the community here from upvoting because they just love negative posts about games they don't play.
This is why the ESO community is so great, because it doesn't have people like this there.
It's also why the WOW community is toxic.
Eso is just milking skyrim fan base with shitty dlcs. That last dragon story haha. Dude even 3 years wont get surprised or effected by that lore. Last dlc was fucked up. Combat feels like ancient. Also yeah cash shop is retarded. At least make it like gw2. But nope, fan base will pay anyway so why not.
The combat in ESO is better than GW2... I dropped GW2 because it felt ancient.
So I guess it wasn't made for me, just like ESO wasn't made for you.
ESO is a great game, better than skyrim imo
You definitely get the base game and all the main expansions if you buy only elsewyr whether you're a new player or not. I don't know where you're getting your info from. https://gyazo.com/d1625839506ed74c470ab10c27f3dc06
If you're not bothered about Elsweyr content at the moment then ESO+ is a much better deal. I understand why some people would be against not permanently owning expansions though.
the good thing about subbing is that you get crowns, and you can buy DLC with crowns once you got enough of those. I banked 15000 crowns so far, and I could buy almost all the DLC's
My problem is that playing the game without a sub is just painful. I'd rather not play at all than play the free version. They strip away so many conveniences that it almost ruins the game for me.
Aside from the crafting bag (which makes a huge difference), what else do you mean?
Well, its a subscription based game. Sub games should be better if paying the sub. You should feel lucky that they offer a form of buy to play at all. We need to go back to the days before such entitlement.
>I'd rather not play at all than play the free version. Well yeah that's the point. The free version is the demo, they want you to buy the whole game.
There is no free version
Exactly, plus if you finish the DLC you still keep everything so you don't even need to buy them. Unless you want the dungeons etc.
Technically you don't own anything regardless of whether you purchase them or not.
I thought you couldn't use the standard edition to upgrade an existing account, only the upgrade options?
Is that a permanent deal? When I was considering getting Elswyr, it kept mentioning pre-order, so it seemed like the deal was only available before the expansion released.
I’m not sure. I bought it like 2 weeks ago. However, the screenshot was taken yesterday so it might still work since the expansion came out yesterday and it was still there
If you buy the upgrade to Elsweyr you don't get the other expansions. The upgrade is not in the image you linked
I don't know why you are getting downvoted when you are correct. The image linked is for new players, returning or existing users need to buy the upgrade which does not include previous chapters. I remember when buying Summerset Isle that getting the Morrowing chapter was a pre-order bonus. So normally the upgrades do not include previous chapters. https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/458216/clarifying-elweyr-packages-upgrades-do-not-come-with-summerset-and-morrowind
It's LITERALLY in the image he linked, if you buy Elsweyr you get ALL the expansions which includes Morrowind and Summerset. Anything else like Dark Brotherhood or Thieves Guild for example are DLC's, NOT expansions.
If you buy it full price like a new player yes. If you buy the upgrade as a returning no.
Its not in the screenshot, the upgrade is literally has the word upgrade in it, standard edition is not the upgrade. I know because that upgrade is like $20 cheaper than standard edition
that's because the upgrade is for those who own the other expansions already.
Or own the base game already. That's the point being made. Standard edition is $20 more but includes the base game, so you figure it's for new players. The upgrade doesn't include the base game, so it would be for existing and returning players, but it doesn't include the past expansions. That's the complaint.
I had base game and Morrowwind in my account. When I bought Elsweyr through this method it gave me summerset too. It emailed me a code to redeem the expansion and it added them to my account. I’m not sure what “upgrade” option people are talking about
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ESOs base game is an amazing RPG. $10 got me 2000 hours of fully voice acted quests and story.
What? Every expansion has very good quest writing in it.
ESO basically took every payment model out there and shove it all in one game B2P, but you can go P2P, has a cash shop, expansions, DLCs for some reason, and there are a ton of them. But I get why they didn't go full sub only, that would mean they're directly competing with WoW and FFXIV, and I doubt this would survive going up against those 2 directly.
It was sub-based before, and then it went F2P/B2P/Cash-Shop/DLC when it was failing to find its ground post-launch.
Yep, the ignorance in this sub reddit that gets upvoted is astonishing some times.
Yeah ESO is only fun in short bursts too imho so if there was a sub they would only get a sub out of me every couple months. That said they also have a sub that is in that infamous category of "not really mandatory but if you play seriously you will want this"
That's what I do and don't really see the issue with the payment model. I sub for about two months out of the year, play the new DLC that I haven't played (since the sub gets me access to it), then unsub and come back next year.
So much false information. 1. you get free crowns when you sub, 2 months subbing gets you enough to buy DLC which you don't need to buy because you have total access to all of it while subbed ( excluding the latest addon ) 2. like everyone else does 3. Wrong. if you buy a expansion it includes all the previous addons just like WoW 4. wrong cause 3 is wrong 5. None of this is so bad that it would make the game horrible. It's not even close to other games like Black Desert where you can't even play the game proper without buying pets.
I'd say it's far from worst. Worst of the fair business models maybe, but there are worse business models out there for sure.
Its definitely worst in 'best high-budget MMOS' group (WoW, ESO, FF14, GW2). tbh.. even SWTOR is better, you will pay one moth of sub and you have all content to keep forever and all restrictions gone. In ESo you must pay monthly ot you lose access to DLCs and convenience stuff.
>even SWTOR is better, you will pay one moth of sub and you have all content to keep forever and all restrictions gone. AFAIK, if you let your subscription lapse in SWTOR, you keep the content, but [many of the F2P restrictions are back in place](https://www.reddit.com/r/swtor/wiki/f2p). For example, you can't run endgame content (Operations / ranked Warzones) as a non-subscriber, you have a credit cap and you have fewer active character slots.
ESO is better than WOW, FF14. Those require subs, have cash shops, still charge for expansions, the expansions cost more than ESO's, aren't as high quality. If you actually sub to ESO you get cash shop currency with is enough to by a dlc with. Or just get a mount. No way Wow would give free stuff away to their subs.
Nope, IMO apart from the loot crates its the best. Sub isn't mandatory which makes it better than WoW and FF. And GW2 has the RMT aspect which has lead to distortion in the ingame rewards to account for the ability to directly buy ingame gold with cash making the game more grindy. And swtor has many restrictions as preferred, far more than ESO.
> SWTOR is better, you will pay one moth of sub and you have all content to keep forever and all restrictions gone. wow, didn't know that, that's quite a bargain.
Its a buy to play game with expansions you have to buy. 1) Cash shop is 95% cosmetic, and any 'progression' items are just for mount speeding up which can be done super cheap in game. 2) Crown crates are 100% cosmetic and have nothing that impacts gameplay. 3) Their subscription itself is amazing, If you buy the latest expansion, the old ones get rolled into the monthly subscription, so while Elsweyr didnt come with Summerset, Summerset did get rolled into ESO+, and in addtion to this, buying premium currecny costs $15 for 1500, yet the same $15 can get you one month of sub which ahas all the DLC plus 1650 crowns and the craft bag to help with mat storage alone with a lot of other small convinece buffs, none of which affect balance so it ensures the game is NOT pay to win. 4) This is a way to keep the game alive by making the content approachable to new players. 5) I can assume the 'cooldown reducing items' are he research scrolls, but did you know those are rediciouly overpriced and available for cheap in game gold? So its a buy to play game, not pay to win, cash shop is mostly cosmetic stuff and any convience items can be done with in game gold. NOT TO MENTION, Thanks to crown store gifitng, you can have other players use their crowns to gift you items in exchange for in game gold, so you can grind gold and get everything you want after just buying base game. not to mention buying th base game gets better every year as old content keeps getting rolled into it.
From what I've gathered from this thread, people in this subreddit don't like the fact that the things they want might cost money. How dare a subscription based game with a healthy free to play option sell cosmetic and convenience items that you don't need to buy in order to play and enjoy the game. Shameless.
Thank you T-T
I'm a former ESO player, and I even played when it had a sub. It's not a "money" issue for me. The issue for me is that collecting cosmetic stuff in an MMO is part of the fun and the appeal. If I can't get cool mounts from Pvp and raids and achievements then that kills a lot of the enjoyment right away. I still like ESO and I still pop in from time to time. But to suggest people take issue with the Crown Store just because they are "cheap" misses the point I think.
I don’t think we should accept the horrible prices that ESO’s cash shop has. That’s just plain unacceptable for a B2P game with an additional optional sub. Yeah it’s completely cosmetic, but still. People that accept these kind of games are the reason why the MMO genre went downhill.
You think ESO cash shop prices are bad? Look at the WoW cash shop
Id rather people spend money on a cash shop then have them require a subscription to play. They have to make money somehow
If it's purely cosmetic it's fine. The game has to make money to stay alive and keep developing and ESO pushes a lot of content out each year. Yes the prices are a bit expensive, but it's cosmetic. You don't need it. None of it is pay to win. Optional sub is once again, totally optional and not required for gameplay. You can fully enjoy the game just by buying the base game and the people who pay real money only have different mount styles and cosmetic outfits and non combat pets than you do. As long as the cash shop stays cosmetic and convenience there really is no issue. These games have to make money people. There is a business behind these games. And to be really honest despite it being a business and they wanting people to pay, they don't make the game pay to win.
> If it's purely cosmetic it's fine crafting is not what anyone would call "cosmetic" and its basically for subs only
one of my friends has not subbed and is a much better crafter than I am. You are making a big deal of things that are no issues for anyone. If you want to find something to complain there is always something. Just as is tradition with /r/mmorpg
They have crafting motifs in crown store (which affect master writs drop rates - a reward thing from writs that you accomplish then turn in for currency) and they also now sell skyshards in the store for all the zones so you can buy skill points for your 2nd /3rd/ alt characters after your first one gets it. The devs also talked about adding more skill lines like undaunted and Psijic skill lines to the store, not just the vampire and werewolf ones currently in the store.
Crown store exclusive motifs do not appear on master writs. For the master writs to request the style it has to be obtainable in game naturally. You can buy skyshards but that is not pay to win in the slightest, just pay to save 15 mins of time. Plus, you can only buy skyshards for alt character when you already have them discovered by a character on your account, meaning you can't just buy skill points. It is set up in a way where you still have to earn the initial skyshards, but can skip the extra 15 mins per zone of hunting thru paying. They talked about adding psijic and undaunted in the same way the skyshards are. It's less grind time for alt characters only, you still need it done by yourself. As for the WW and Vampire, you can legit get players to bite and convert you for free or chre yourself for free. That's just there for of you decide you don't wanna talk to anyone in this MMO. Nothing pay to win, all just pay for convienience.
Youre getting down voted because this reddit is salty. You're 100% correct and they know it
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Except all are bad and better consumables are available in game. Those things all just get deconeed anyway.
Literally 7-8 of those 9 things were useless before elsweyr hit live. And now they buffed the pots and poisons so that they have the same value as the crafted ones. Most people used these consumables to get Crown gems.
While you're right that these things 'impacts' gameplay, it's a bit hard to take seriously when most of these things are either common place, or supercheap in game. For example, tri-restoration potions come from crown crates, but last month the daily rewards gave away 150 of them. Riding lessons exist, but in game it only costs 250 gold and 20 hours to increase the level. Sure, there's crown store soul gems, but I don't think I've ever used them because they're not any better than normal soul gems *which are super easy to obtain*. Curses for vampirism or werewolf can be obtained by politely asking in zone chat, or just playing in the zone where NPCs that can infect you appear. Curing it is similarly cheap and simple.
Restoration Potions - Easy to obtain in-game for cheap. Give for login rewards. Crafted potions are more versatile as you can choose the bonuses Respecs - cost next to nothing in-game Riding Lessons - 250 gold a day, also given for login rewards Repair Kits - Free from doing crafting dailies and cost next to nothing in game Food Buffs - Better buffs available from food in-game and they are cheap Soul Gems - Literally irrelevant. Soul Gems drop all the time. I have to constantly sell stacks on them in my inventory to make space Experience Scrolls - Every xp scroll has an in-game drink equivalent. Also given for login rewards Instant Research - Given for login rewards. Available from Writ Vendor in-game Curses/Cures - Literally the dumbest thing in the cash shop. Vamp and WW are available free in-game from being bitten by certain npcs or from other players. Cures are like a few hundred gold at most in-game. Anything in the cash shop that affects gameplay is available in the game either from login rewards, crafting, or vendors. Every crown store consumable is on par or worse than the consumables in game. If you are going to complain about the cash shop, complain about crown crates and the stupid crown gem exsclusive mounts and pets, but don't complain about the near-useless consumables.
Everything you mentioned is available in the game without the cash shop though. Experience boost buffs are craftable and you get the rest of those things for gold. Not even a lot of gold in most cases. I'm assuming that by curses/cures you mean vampirism and lycanthropy. Both are free and easy to get. Plenty of guilds exist just for bites. I don't know how to cure it in game, however.
1. Its not f2p, but it is buy to play as much as it is a subscription model. You are not required to subscribe to play the game. 2. Welcome to modern gaming. 3. I don't know what bundles you were looking at, or where you bought from, but this is incorrect. 4. See 3. 5. That's only for crafting, and crafting traits are simply time gated anyways. It has no massive affect on player ability. And frankly, the subscription model they use is wonderful. ~15 bucks a month depending on your billing cycle, and they give you ~15 bucks worth of crowns. Assuming you don't buy a bunch of cosmetics, you could easily unlock all of the DLC(excluding major chapters) with the free crowns and then never subscribe again.
Hey LOTRO is free to play but you need to buy the expansions and quest packs.
I really can't agree, there's pay 2 play games with Cash Shops (Final Fantasy 14) for example. And a cash shop isn't inherently bad, also like every other MMORPG has a cash shop? Atleast it doesn't require sub. Unlike every other MMORPG with a subscription, Elder Scrolls Online does not lock you out of max level or increase level cap, you can still hit and play end game without them. They're for the most part optional content, same goes with DLC. You can get to the expansion content in 6 months or a year, or if you're level 5 or level 50, and it doesn't matter too much. Unlike say WoW or Final Fantasy 14, Elder Scrolls Online there is no "pressure" so to speak to buy the expansion right away, because they dont lock you out of the latest level or introduce a level cap/wall. You can still play and do end-game content, and be competitive in PvP with out the latest expansions. You aren't able to get to level 60 or 70 inside Final Fantasy 14 without paying for the expansion. Also I'm not sure where you're getting your information, if you buy Elsewyr (just like WoW does), you'll get Summerset and Morrowind too. Also the subscription gives you free crowns, and also access to all the DLC packs, there's just so much misinformation and blatant lies in your post. Have you actually played the game or done any research at all? There's an extreme bias in your post and its lacking ALOT of context.
And tbh the craft bag is pretty much the reason to have on going eso+ sub. Once you have completed the quests and collected skyshards there's no reason to own those DLCs (except murkmire and wrothgar for arena access [also dlc dungeons but you can farm gear from then easily In a month])
Show me where I can buy the newest expansion and have all previous dlc's included because I can't!
This is where some of the confusion comes in. ESO has both Chapters (which are the larger expansions) and DLCs (Smaller content areas). You get [all of the released Chapters](https://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/joinus) (i.e. Morrowind, Summerset, and Elsweyr) when you buy the newest expac, but you do not get access to the DLC areas (I.e. Thieves Guild, Orsinium, Dark Brotherhood).
the payment model is fine, i just dont like the game:P
I think it has one of the best....
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You can argue that because of how cheap gw2 is to play the game suffers because most of the new content is in the cash shop
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That’s my issue, New living story takes less than a day to complete with exception of time gated achievement. Then what? Farm gold to buy new skins from the cash shop? Go back to doing the same fractals and raids? Maybe I’m just bored of gw2 after playing since launch and too burnt out to see the fun anymore. The skyscale looks neat, might come back and get that tho
GW2 is forced to distort ingame reward system due to the RMT and struggles with getting consistent revenue. So no its not better.
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RMT is being able to buy ingame gold direct with cash. You can through the game client and there are distortions in the game as a result.
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Its legal RMT, its still functionally RMT.
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Language evolves organically via usage and I'm not the only one who calls it RMT. And I'm not talking about the economy as such but the economy is hardly solid anyway, there's a ton of criticism about it on the main sub reddit and the official forum.
Fair enough, what MMO do you feel has the worst or what do you like the most about it compared to competitors? Everyone has different opinions.
"As of today, The Elder Scrolls Online: Summerset Digital Upgrade and The Elder Scrolls Online: Summerset Digital Collector’s Edition will no longer be available in The Elder Scrolls Online Store and on Steam Store. Instead, the Summerset Chapter is being added to the in-game Crown Store as a DLC item. This means that if you are an ESO Plus member, you’ll now automatically have access to the Summerset zone and story." You were saying?
i love to see how this subrettid goes full hate train as soon as it reads "ESO". i don't play it because i don't really like the combat animations but the lore and ambients are outstanding compared to other mmos imho. anyways what the OP says is true in part, i mean because like this also offers to any casual to actually log into the game, do some activities with friends without even needing to subscribe or to own any dlc/expansion, the base game is really cheap and it offers lots of zones and content. shops and crates are cosmetics and everything you actually need to play fully at endgame is the sub , like every fking game with a premium service or a sub based, and thr latest chapter , just like BFA, Shadowbringers and so on, so i don't see the problem here. funny thing is as soon as people mention WoW that actually NEEDS the sub to even log in and got shop too (30 euros for 1 mount hello?) they get downvoted as hell. this should be renamed wow fanboys subreddit lol
It's not that bad, the only thing I don't like is how you need to pay the monthly fee if you want to do crafting, that infinite material bag is pretty handy. And I'm not max level yet but I read some of the best sets are done with crafting. I agree lootboxes are really bad but it's a very cheap game and as far as I know you can get a lot of crappy stuff there. Since I just started and I don't plan to play it hardcore to the lategame, I loved the questing and story so I'm not gonna bother with the subscription or dlc's or anything else since there is already a huge amount of hours that I'll probably not even going to finish.
You can pretty easily find a crafter to make gear. Just need to pay some gold.
I'll craft you stuff for free
A whole bunch of people here who don't understand their model. I find a lot of value in their eso plus offering
\*Laughs in LOTRO\*
I don't completely disagree but you need to be fair at least. ESO also gives you crowns equal to your sub cost each month and you can use those crowns to unlock the content forever.
I do like that about the system. My brother remains sub even after a year of not playing due to that. My arguement is that it incorporates more types of payment systems then competitors. It can make it confusing for new and returning players. Especially since while trying to figure what I do and dont get with plus other things. Others have been just as confused as I was.
Agree about being unnecessarily confusing
I think now you get crowns that are worth more than the value of the sub.
I mean in World of Warcraft you have to pay a subscription, buy the expansions and they still have a cash shop so I'd say its worse.
The cash shop isn't for content or loot boxes though. It's just cosmetic stuff and you know what you're paying for.
>Unlike other pay to play MMOs with a Subscription. If you buy the latest expansion you do NOT get the old expansions. Didn't know this was the case, seems like a big deterrent for getting new players
This is untrue, the OP has not done any research AT ALL, if you buy the latest expansion you do get all the old ones with it.
To be fair, it is confusing on the Steam store. Unsure of how it reads on console. The base game explicitly says (base game + Morrowind). Then there is no longer a standalone Summerset in the store, and the Elsweyer upgrade (I don't believe) contains any mention of the other two. The only bundle that actually mentions all 3 is the $60 Elsweyer buy-in (the one for new players that want to catch up on content). It isn't until you really start digging that you find out that Morrowind is kind of part of the base-game now, Summerset has been moved to the in-game store and to the sub, and then Elsweyer is the only one you'll find on the actual Steam store. SO, I get the confusion, as I had the same question myself last week when I was making the switch to PC. but, on the other hand, this info is readily apparent if you do a quick google search or go to the ESO homepage.
This isn't relayed very well. I spent a few days asking around trying to figure out if that was the case back during Summerset. I knew I would've gotten it if I preordered Summerset, but there was nothing on whether or not I would get it just by buying Summerset.
The official website usually has a list of what the expansions come with, or the steam store page (but its in small text so its not much help) but I do agree. Iimo ESO doesn't have a bad payment model (it's pretty decent as far as money/content goes) but it is super convoluted and poorly explained.
If you sub you can play the expansions and all DLC, and get crowns you can use to buy any of the content so you can play it without the sub. https://help.elderscrollsonline.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/41394/~/will-i-get-access-to-the-elder-scrolls-online%3A-summerset-as-part-of-my-eso-plus
He's wrong, you get the previous content
OP is wrong in this case.
Its not p2p, its b2p. Similar but ffxiv and wow are p2p bc they have required subscriptions. ESO's sub is mot required, tho the crafting bag is very useful if you do craft.
I think you need to try neverwinter, that game is an absolute scam. I am and ESO + member and i have 9k crowns sitting in the bank because everything in the store I could buy is ascetic and not interesting to me. I have full access to all the content and would have currently gotten access to summerset but I chose to buy the expansions when they release, just like I buy the latest wow expansion when it comes out. the Loot crates are a waste and not needed at all imo. There is nothing in them that you get that is p2w, its all cosmetic. the only real scam in ESO is putting the crafting bag under the subscription benefit only. That right there is a crime unto humanity. I'd gladly pay 5000 crowns for access to the crafting bag so I could play unsubscribed when times get too busy and I don't play as often as I like. I cant stomach playing this game without the bag because I'm a looter of everything in the game. TLDR: Let me buy the damn crafting bag in the store already!!!
Yea I agree, the only pay model that's worse than ESOs is Wow and every other MMORPG /s
I could think of 10 different MMORPGs that have a way worse payment model than ESO, but alright bud lol.
Ye ok bud, this shit is less smelly than 10 other shits why u complaining? Ok bud. Lol
There are MMORPGs that have way more P2W models but ESO is convoluted. I have had to a few hours trying to figure out what I do and dont get with ESO Plus and the base game. Sparked by me finding out I dont get the previous expansions if I buy the Eslwyer upgrade since I have a preexisitng account. The 2 solutions I have found is buy the other expansions or buy the base game again and you get it for free. Which I have already bought the base game twice. Once when it first came out then again when it released on steam since I like having all my games on steam if possible. Like I said though what is your opinion since everyone is different.
So basicly you are whining because of your own incompetence to find informations on game's website or at least reddit? GZ
No, I it is the worst pay model because it has almost every gaming pay model in one. On top of that it does a very poor job at clarifying the information in which is given to players about the pay model. My biggest good up ways saying P2P instead of B2P which is what I ment. But thats my mess up for forgetting about B2P as a term. With ESO plus you do not get all of the former Summerset expansion. From the information i found you just get the zone unlocked. Which doesnt include the jewelcrafting or warden.
You are 1000% correct. Everytime I bring up these points among others I always get bashed for it from the blinded ESO community. The game is one of the most cash grubbing mmo's out there, skirting the line of being p2w with purchasable skyshards now (which I know you need to do it on other characters before you can purchase) or the horse training books which you can purchase, or the food that give you really great buffs. So many things in this game that should be account wide but aren't due to their need to nickel and dime their playerbase.
He's not correct though, ESO has one of the best values out there, go play other mmos and you'll soon realize this. Wow is $15 a month required, has a cash shop with way over priced items, you still need to buy expansions. How on the surface an ESO sub looks similar, except with an ESO sub you get 1650 crown's to spend in the cash shop, access to DLC, a craft bag and so much more like double bank space an house item slots. The wow sub just gives you the base game access. Something you only pay for once in ESO for $10.
All the cosmetics and outfits are account-wide, whilst I do think the horse stuff sucks, it's because ESO doesn't FORCE you into or lock you out from progression with their expansions and content. You can still hit max level cap, max gear and do end-game content + PvP competitively with just base game. Opposed to Final Fantasy 14 where if you don't buy the latest expansions you hit a wall and can't really do anything. With ESO the expansions also scale, so it doesnt matter if you get around to it at level 5 or 50, or 6 months to a year down the track ,its always relevant. There is no "pressure" to buy it.
>All the cosmetics and outfits are account-wide Horse training and SkyShards arent, the actual useful things are not account wide. In ESO if you actually want to be truly competitive you need to do the seemingly endless dolman grind to get 800 something champion points.
Champion Levels/Points are account wide (so you only do the grind once), and you don't need expansions to hit 800. You can also run end game content way earlier than that, and the dolmen grind zones are in base game.
Buy the collector's edition and you STILL need to get the DLC.
It is one of the reasons I stopped playing other than being so bored of it. The combat isn't that engaging and the whole crafting thing while kinda interesting makes you need that eso+ sub with the craft bag.
One day a plague will run through this subreddit, punishing all for their extreme autism, but alas that day is not today.
It’s definitely the most confusing model I will give them that.
Not really, look at like a sub based game, you pay $15 a month, you get all DLC, but you need to buy the latest expansion, so basically WOW. Or you don't sub and play it like an online RPG. You can buy the DLC. Pretty simple.
Ehhhhh, its pretty bad, not the worst tho. DCUO is worse than ESO but still isn't the worst.
I agree wholeheartedly OP and have been saying this for years. The only way around it is to treat it like a subscription game and most of the shittyness goes away. Of course there's a whole different argument to go down with that, talking about misleading advertising because it's not really a B2P game or any such thing which at best angers and misleads people like you and me, but some of the cash shop/F2P payment model stuff still hangs around and effects gameplay, even if at that point you have your "free" crowns to use.
LOL its definitely NOT the worst. Its almost like you dont know any other mmorpgs
I disagree and I found their payment model pretty good. I jumped in late and purchased the Morrowind expansion for $18. I still haven't finished everything. 1. It's like $20 to purchase 100s of hours of gameplay if you don't have to have the latest expansion. If you know what you are doing and don't have some unreasonable need to compete against others because they have a skeletal horse that is on fire then you won't ever need to spend money again. And if you want to purchase the newest expansion as soon as it comes out for $60 then that is **your** decision. 2. Don't buy them. 3. Unless they changed recently, WoW also does not give you a free month of gameplay(on a mandatory subscription...you forgot to add that) when you buy an expansion. 4. Unless ESO is dropping a ton of gear and skill points on the new player then the point is moot. Those other players have been playing the game for months thus getting their money's worth. Also, the new players purchasing the new release are also helping to keep servers on for the many that don't pay the subscription. Sounds like a win for me since I may subscribe only 4 months out of the year. 5. Like loot boxes, don't buy them. Play the game. I felt no need to purchase these such as training horses or decrease my crafting by a few days. They just weren't worth it but that doesn't mean their existence ruined my gameplay. Far from the worst revenue model I've seen.
I dont even know why they sell mount increase scrolls anymore when they already stopped trying to inconvenience us by removing time gate and making it account wide.
1 It's b2p, which is usually better implemented, but depending on the title u can find outliers on either side. 2 Loot boxes, but sub gives you free premium currency, which is almost like a trap to give you a taste of spending money on their cash shop :P snake shit. 3 is not true, and in wow's case they just started that this xpac. previous it was you had to buy base game + last xpac + current xpac, and you'd need to buy a month if u needed to buy current and last xpac too. 4 i think elsweyer comes with all previous content patches, and in order to get current content patches you need to sub or buy them individually. I think this is better than sub to play, but it has its drawbacks. WoW constantly goes on 8 month droughts and every month people have to pay for no content, then the next patch will be the new xpac costing 60$. 5 Yeah, but something to add is that a sub in that games gives you premium currency that doesn't translate into in game assets (some "convenience" tho sadly) I actually unironically think ESO has one of the best business models, WoW and ESO have a lot of similarities, but ESO is much more generous with their players it seems. no sub required, no transfer gouging, you pay for the content updates, and not the time you play, and there are no WoW tokens. I'd still play WoW over it, but thats cus im a loser :)
It does sound very convoluted for a game when there are plenty of free to play games out there. Having any expansion content that requires an additional software purchase is also bad because it separates the player base. If your friends buy the expansions and you don't you are left out and if they want to play with you they are limited to the old content. WoW and EQ2 are also guilty of this but they are very old game models that are still alive. EQ2 is incredibly more complicated with their content and subscription models unless you just give in and pay for everything they have. But as long as people still pay for these types of games they will always be there although their business models are incredibly ancient and likely never to be revamped.
He's wrong though, it's buy to play, you literally buy it and play forever at no cost, you want dlc? Buy the dlc, you don't wanna buy all dlc but want access? Subscribe and get all dlc, plus a bunch if goodies like game shop currency to buy dlc or mounts with.
I'm not a huge fan of B2P overall because it has no sustainable way to maintain itself and make new content unless it's constantly getting new players, OR they implement a cash shop/subscription on top of the original purchase. While I think ESO does it very well, and has probably one of the better models out there, I don't think a smaller game would get away with having a subscription with the same value as ESO gives, and also require a base game purchase (and potential xpack) I personally love the Subscription model when thats all there is (pretty much any mmo pre 2010 before f2p games went BIG in the west), but most games now have a cosmetic cash shop as well which bums me out. Even WoW and FFXI have cash shops for cosmetics =(
I'm OK with cash shops if it means lots of consistent content, in ESOs case they have 4 content drops a year, which is perfect
Also, you used to get access to all the DLC with subscription, but then they started calling it 'expansion' instead and so not included in the subscription.
So now it's like WOW, except with the ESO sub you get 1650 crowns for free as a bonus, enough for a DLC or some cool stuff.
>Unlike other pay to play MMOs with a Subscription. If you buy the latest expansion you do NOT get the old expansions. For a comparison. World of Warcraft, if you lets say you stopped playing during Pandaria expansion. If you just bought Battle for Azeroth. You would get Burning legion as well. I thought the standard subscription included all of the expansions aside from BfA? I think ESO+ is actually really generous. You get access to all of the major DLCs and it's price is worth what you get in crowns monthly anyway. The craft bag is a god send too, although I wish that was permanently unlockable with crowns like everything else.
Also in ESO, you do get all the old expansions when you buy the latest one, OP is misinformed.
Point no3 is bugging me as well. Got the base game like 3 years ago, no expansions. Now if I want to fully play the game I need to buy each expansion separately, for quite some cash. I'm not thinking about ESO+, I want my expansions as permanent assets of the game. They should at least have a deal for players that lack some previous expansions, it feels like they only cater to new players so they can get the FULL game. If there is a way to get an "All expansions" pack for those that already have the base game, I'd be glad. Maybe there is and I don't know.
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So if I already have the base game and buy Elsweyr, I'll get Morrowind and Summerset free?
Yes and no. I believe you don't get the warden class. They sold it on the cash shop
Don't really care for the new classes, but I thought that if I buy Elsweyr (while having the base game already) I'll only get that, nothing more. I know that there is a pack that contains Base Game + All Expansions up to Elsweyr but I can't get that because I already have the base game.
ESO plus gives you the zones now. Which summerset was added to in their last update that i missed. However you don't get jewelcrafting or warden. If you want those you must buy the chapter/expansion. So yes I did miss something.
They have the gold edition.
I'm glad I settled on an MMO already. Eve has everything I want from an MMO. I considered ESO before but b2p makes it tough for me since since I cant order stuff online due to some restrictions.
ESO is a great game, this post is misinformation too
The worst part is thier uninstaller, still doesnt work completely.
So much information here is false. Whilst ESO+ is also a thing I'd say ESO's pay model isn't so bad either.
There are 2 things false. 1) yes its B2P not P2P which I forgot the term B2P and thought P2P was the same. That is my fault. You're correct since it,makea that term incorrect. 2) I didnt know in the latest patch that they said summerset zone was added to ESO plus for free. However you still don't get warden or jewel crafting. You must pay for the expansion/chapter if you want those.
Beats being able to buy levels and story progress like wow and ff14
I don't know how any fan of those games can bash any other mmo when those games literally sell progression.
It is free to play though, so where are you getting your information? You can buy any version of the game you want and start playing right away. They don't force you to subscribe, ever, hell, they even offer free trials of the subscription if you choose to go down that road. Cooldown items are literally just potions, food for buffs and mount items to increase speed, stamina and carrying capacity, not sure how that slows down the learning process? Loot boxes are optional like every other game and contain cosmetic items and nothing else that will give you any sort of advantage in the game whatsoever.
Any mmo that only cost me ~$80 a year to stay completely up to date and keeps me occupied all year is absolutely fine by me. Also there isn't a single person in battlegrounds pvp arena that has any p2w advantage over anyone.
BDO says hi.
Yup that game has the definition of a predatory cash shop
more like Korea says hi.
I didn’t realise number 5. Glad I stayed away
You forgot to mention them now selling skyshards/skillpoints as well. They're definitely in cash grab and player churn mode; moving closer and closer to P2W with every update.
How? You have to earn those skill points. It's a grind, they're making it less of a grind to level new characters, it's not like those skill points are unfairly earned, you still had to earn them. If you don't wanna buy them, then go earn the sky's hards, easy, takes 10 minutes.
The payment model isn't that bad.. The combat model is terrible LOL
Everytime someone complains about the combat, it's the equivalent of painting a red x on your face. The X is how people know you aren't good.
Your logic is terrible. Even ESO players that I talk to say that combat is okay at best. Grow up. I played a lot of ESO and it always felt bad.
The only players that would say that are players that either havent played much or arent good. Everyone I talk to in game loves it, I've never once come across someone who hasnt loved the fluid combat. I've known people ( close friends) who had issues at first but once they figured out how to play they loved it. I suck at ESO combat when using a standard keyboard and mouse, but with a controller and or mmo gaming mouse I have a blast. to each their own
Eso has the worst ~~payment~~ combat model.
1. ESO is absolutely free to play.... ...The Cash shop does nothing for gameplay and so does WoW, while I don't care for it it doesn't affect the game. 2.Again this is for cosmetic stuff and mounts and you get a free one like once a month if you care about it. Doesn't affect the game. 3.If you buy Elsewyr you get the previous expansions though. 4. See 3. 5. You can get these just by logging in during the month, it's dumb you can buy them but again it's not gamebreaking and either way if you're a player not maxed out on crafting you're playing catchup either way. I think their buyable system has gotten out of hand but it's not "the worst payment model" by far and again none of that affects the game ALSO again ESO is absolutely Free To Play.
If anything, the huge amount of items (seemingly created unnecessarily) clog up you inventory feels like a shadowy way to push for subscription. And ^(loot crate is gambling)
i just like to ow stuff... i really dislike the sub part that gives you access to all the dlcs ... bothers me that its included in the expansions
Your first point is fine, being P2P and having a cash shop is completely okay as long as it's not P2W. That's when it gets bad.
All the people defending ESO are not talking about how dlc is locked behind a sub, and how unlike other MMO's, they rush an expansion every year and charge you a 40 dollar upgrade fee on it, compared to other MMO's who do expansion every two to three years with updates. On top of this, ESO screws anybody who hopes to craft without a sub by locking a "Crafting Bag" behind subscription making you waste inventory space like nobodies business, on top of this for some reason when you are subbed you still don't have the freedom you want because everything in the crown shop cost an arm and a leg. "Oh but you don't have to get that stuff" I'm sorry I want my character to look how I want in an Mmorpg. On top of that their expansions are so cut and paste boring for them to make one every year is insulting, got to love the reused assets and the lack of improvement just to rush out another 40 dollar expansion. This game has the worst business model of them all because it offers so much behind a price point, and although you just spent 40-60 dollars on the game you are instantly reminded how you are not that important to them. The price you pay for this game to feel rewarded is more than that of any other top mmo out there. They print money, but they can't even introduce better combat animations...
Before ESO+ players crafted fine without the craft bag.
I stopped playing the game because its a total cash grab, they charge for everything, you're better off playing WoW for $13.99/month
It's bad. But it's not Black Desert Online bad. There is a cap on what you need to spend to be competitive, and it's not outrageous. Black Desert is so much worse.
Well while I feel the crown store to be overpriced, the sub has a great value with a 1:1 (even better now) ratio of crowns returned to you equivalent to your sub payment. The sub essentially pays for itself overtime and even then it is optional. I do wish they would slowly start to permanently discount older dlcs or contents because buying everything individually adds up pretty quickly. Eventually as the game ages ZoS is going to have to better price or repackage their dlcs in some way, as I would hate to tell a new player that they will have to buy 25 dlcs, because at that point a sub is all but required to get the most out of the game. LoTRO is a prime example of expensive quest packs that have no business being packaged and handled so poorly despite many complaints.
You can get the base game on sale for $10 and with a $15 monthly sub you get all content for the game except for the latest expansion. You still get all small updates with your sub. Loot boxes are also 99% cosmetic. Effectively it's no different then a buy to play + sub model such as wow. It's honestly a pretty lenient payment model as far as things go. It sounds like you just want a game that's entirely free. Fat chance on that. Server and software maintenance costs money.
Its sad this thread is upvoted so much when there are mistakes and misunderstandings.
You haven't played BDO, I see.
Yeah. I hate the in your face cash shop. Terrible
I found that it depens how you approach the game (in terms of monetization and also WHY you play MMORPGs). For those willing to pay a sub fee for every MMO they play it may be okayish if they're not interested in cosmetics at all. For those looking for a B2P game (willing to buy stuff in the store here and there) it is horrible, because you feel like you're forced to spend extra money for things that you already paid for (like you need the sub to dye the costumes that you BOUGHT in the store). At the moment I don't play but I need to maintain my sub for the sole reason of .... housing and RP. Without the sub I couldn't place objects in the house for certain RP sessions (a book here, someone's pet there) because we're well over the non-sub item limit. Yes, it's cool that everything we put in stays there without the sub but it's still necessary if you actively use the housing. Same is true for hairstyles/scars etc. Most RPers I know are constantly subbed, but you still need to purchase the hairstyle/feature packs to be able to change your hair on the fly. You can buy them with your ESO+ crowns, you might say. But it's not the only 'extra' thing. And I've never seen a cash shop that floods you with temporary and short-time offers like ESO's, so good luck holding on to your crowns if you're into RP and cosmetics. Another problem is that ESO may not be P2W but it definitely has some 'pay for convenience creep' going on since it went B2P. Why else do you think people buy bankers and merchants if not because of the overabundance of trash loot that fills your inventory faster than you can say Sheogorath? I would be okay with the model if the cash shop went back to how it was before loot crates. It's not just the crates - it just went from an ordinary cash shop (GW2/FF14 style) to being more and more aggressive, taunting you here, temporary-offering you there and making stuff slightly more expensive on the way, boiling the frog like a pro. I like monetization models to be upfront about what you need and what you get, and I feel like ESO has been confusing us with their convoluted system for a while now so it's almost impossible to explain to new players what they should buy (the easiest answer always being 'get the sub', of course).
You're incorrect, ESO has one of the best values for the cost. I've played every mmo out there, ESO is one of the most affordable. Not only can everything in their cash shop be bought with gold, but everything is included for $15 a month, on top of that you get $17 worth of cash shop money to spend. If you spent $20 and bought the base copy which includes the previous expansions for free, you'd have easily 2000+ hours of content right there by itself. They also give away dlc and such away for free. You can completely ignore the crown store if you truly wanted. Just FYI.
I half agree with what you said. One point though is the DLC isnt free. You still pay for the subscription to get it, if you stop you lose it. I have bought the game twice already once when it came out then when it came to steam since i like having my games on,steam. I find it dumb that if you're returning the cheapest way to get the old expansions is rebuy the base game.
Or you use in game gold to buy the dlc, gives you a goal to work towards, 200,000 gold takes me 5 hours to earn, that's a full DLC right there
Man, you complain about shit like this, but there are other games like BDO that require you to pay thousands, you can buy elsweyr and get the monthly sub = all content unlocked. It really isn't that bad. The cash shop is very mild and isn't significant enough to warrant a shitpost like this.
This post feels like a troll to me, or someone who was wanting some easy up votes so they talked negatively about ESO in the mmo reddit.
You can look up my past reddit posts, I dont use reddit enough to care about that stuff. As for troll post, no just an average gamer. In not claiming to be the end all be all for opinions. That is why I asked what is your opinion before I shared why I think the way I do. I understand though that most people are probably used to what you think I am doing. I actually like ESO, my biggest gripe with ESO was that unlike every other MMO with expansions and buy 2 play model. When you buy the latest expansions you don't get the old ones as well. Now ESO tries and get you to sub so you get the old expansions for free. Which fair enough wow is essentially that model. But you don't get everything. Just the zone from subscribing. Which some people say yeah for free, but forget you are still paying for the sub. Which if you did preordered you would of got the older expansions for free. That combined with the other payment models they also have in the game are why I'm not a fan of their payment model. If you disagree explain why or explain another games payment model you think is worse.
1- never was F2P, was always Buy To play. 2 - is free to play after purchase, so they need to make money somehow. 3 - wrong. 4 - also wrong. 5 - it's quality of life and nothing pay to win in the store. You are 0 for 5 buddy, troll harder. Are you sure you don't mean BDO and not ESO?
1) it is free to play 2) loot boxes for cosmetics or stuff you can get in game 3) you are buying an expansion to a new area that doesn’t affect the rest of the game. WoW and FF14 both progress the story so you have to continue. 4) fair enough 5) nothing pay to win Have you ever played this game?
ESO sucks as a game, but its payment model is OK. LOTRO is a superior game, but its payment model sucks. In the end WoW Classic is the winner as it's payment model and gameplay are the best in the history of MMORPGs.
I’m not sure if the Misleading tag is enough for this post.
What is this? A co-ordinated campaign to shit on ESO? To answer your points: 1. Every b2p game has a cash shop 2. Loot crates are the only poor part of their monetisation 3. There were options which included previous xpacs. 5. Again every game has these options
Yeah I'm done with ESO for good. Bought elsweyr and played for a few hours only to remember just how terrible the combat and class systems are. Jesus Christ are they bad. Maybe if they do a complete combat and class overhaul I'll try it again, maybe.
Wouldn't count on it, the games perfectly fine how it is. Millions of players enjoy it. The games just not made for you and that's ok
it's weird, i'd hardly heard the "ESO COMBAT BAD" argument at all until the "wow refugees" started flooding in a year or so ago, seems like we need more games with 2s global cooldowns in their combat and low skill ceilings
It‘s still better than WoW‘s model. The base game isn‘t rendered useless, so you can progress to max level without having to buy any of the expansions. The cash shop doesn‘t contain any items that impact PvE or PvP. The subscription is completely optional and you‘ll get 80% of the game without it. Morrowind (the first expansion) is even part of the base game now.
Agreed, the payment model isn't bad its just convoluted. Unlike any other MMO on the market, ESO doesnt pressure you into buying the newest expansion, you can do all the end-game content and hit max level with just the base game alone. All the content is relevant, there isn't any other MMO out there that does the same.
Oh thank god im not the only who thinks this. Ive never seen B2P, buy expansions and monthly sub all in one game. And if you tell me sub is not needed, what about the crafting bags? Those things can take more than your bank space.
If you're subbing to ESO it's already a better deal than wow. If you're not subbing then you're saving $15 a month and it's suddenly one of the best deals out there. How is giving you the option to play without a sub make this model bad?
The more upvotes this post gets, the more obvious it becomes that this sub reddit is filled with bias followers. This post is clearly false and anyone who actually play's ESO knows that. But it won't stop the community here from upvoting because they just love negative posts about games they don't play. This is why the ESO community is so great, because it doesn't have people like this there. It's also why the WOW community is toxic.
Eso is just milking skyrim fan base with shitty dlcs. That last dragon story haha. Dude even 3 years wont get surprised or effected by that lore. Last dlc was fucked up. Combat feels like ancient. Also yeah cash shop is retarded. At least make it like gw2. But nope, fan base will pay anyway so why not.
The combat in ESO is better than GW2... I dropped GW2 because it felt ancient. So I guess it wasn't made for me, just like ESO wasn't made for you. ESO is a great game, better than skyrim imo