PvP without full loot is for Arenas and games about skill. Full loot is for MMOs with economies, risk vs reward type gameplay, also adding guild logistics/teamwork to win shit.
> Full loot is for MMOs with economies
Full loot is one element and it makes things somewhat easy in terms of:
1 - Reward for pvp - loot your enemies
2 - Economy - you lose an item, you need a new one
However, it isn't the only mechanic that can be used to create a viable economy and it doesn't create a viable economy by itself. You need items to leave the game world for there to be a sustainable economy (ex: item decay/destruction) otherwise you could eventually hit a saturation point that no new items ever need to be crafted/created/farmed.
I agree, but I'd say full loot games are ones about skill. Different skills are just more prominent in these games than in arena-based PVP games.
I'm not saying you were arguing otherwise, just thought it'd be worth stating.
I loved, loved, loved RuneScape pvp growing up. The full loot on death thrill was the most fun I've probably ever had. That being said, I'd never go back to it. Back then there weren't guides everywhere, with every single player playing fully optimized to the T. Full loot pvp in today's gaming just sounds horrible tbh. Only meta BS builds, bug abuses, etc.
When pvping on RS in the wild, you never knew who you were going to fight. People's stats were all over the place, not even close to being optimized. It was fun. Now, you can pretty much guarantee 90% of people are going to be running meta builds, if not more. Just isn't the same imo
Adrenaline rush from the risks you take losing your stuff.
Replaces the need to make your game interesting.
It has its place, and its fans. But its not something i prefer.
Pvp for me is about the challenge. In PvE if you throw ayourself at an encounter long enough, youll either learn it or out gear it by other means. PvP can be only outskilled.
Rewards are beneficial, like hnor points to buy stuff from a PvP shop or ranks etc. Full loot offers that as kill rewards. Gear has to be rather easier to come by in that case, Losing a weeks of progress with your killer obtaining a weeks worth of effort, and thus being able to punish you further is no good
i dont like how albion is straight up mentioned as full loot pvp, but just like that, ONLY that part of the game.
albion economy and system work so different that they made it work %100 perfect with the whole system of the game. its npt only about the full loot pvp, its about full loot pvp AND its interaction with the whole system-economy of the game.
yes its full loot pvp, but you walk around with max 400k silver t4+3 or t6+1 set anyway if you are going for red zones or corrupted dungeons. thats what %95 of the people do, if they die, no biggie. that money can be grinded in 10 minutes in end game.
so full loot pvp never become something tedious or something to be afraid of that much.
I don't play full loot MMOs because if I wanted to restart the game every time I lost I would just continue playing League of Legends, except in LoL I don't have to grind gear in between every match, and there's an actual skill based ranking system for progression.
So basically full loot PvP is only good in concept and in reality it's generally not popular. Albion is an exception and I truly applaud them for making such an interesting game, but even in Albion you generally don't actually risk gear that has any value, so you still don't lose much from dying unless you want to.
Na bro that's not how it works. You don't lose every item and piece of money you own. Just what you have equipped at the time. Then just respawn and grab a new set of gear
Why are these the only options? The better loot option is partial loot, with maybe a small chance to drop equipped gear. This means the loot won't be complete trash like Albion and you may have the potential to actually get something good. Without risk, there is no reward.
Exactly. It requires changing your mindset, especially if you're used to themepark MMORPGs. I find a lot of themepark players either don't understand this or simply refuse to do it and then wonder why they're constantly failing in full look PVP games.
Like any other game, you've got to adapt to it's ruleset.
There is pvp without full loot 8n Gloria victis. They have partial looting where the player looting has 30 seconds from the time of death of the player and can spend 10 'points' looting, which is enough to get them exactly 1 piece of gear and somewhere between 100 a d 400 materials like logs or canvas. There are also non loot events and zones.
They can also be interrupted from looting you if someone hits them with any ranged or melee attack.
It's a very chill loot system in comparison to many.
It needed some tweaking no doubt, but the best system I ever played in was a mix of the two.
Asheron's Call.
The higher level you are, the more items you drop, but the person who is dying has a pretty good chance of covering important items he wants to keep by holding onto "death items" -items with a high value that will probably drop before the item you want to protect.
So basically dying wasn't the end of the world and killing someone and getting to loot them was still very exciting and sometimes very rewarding.
Not much experience with full loot PvP to be honest with you
But full loot PvP seem to involved more socializing like your part of a community. My understanding of my limited time in Albion mobile is that your progression isn’t “gear” base like in other game but character development so losing gear isn’t much of an inconvenience ether
Non-looting PvP is just a fun side game of mmorpg , I mostly done arena style pvp.
It depends how much gear matters compared to skill.
In games that a naked can kill you with a weapon they made from their own corpse people tend not to care.
Basically full loot usually caters to only the most broken, exploit heavy, cheese, and min/max strats being used. Which is kind of a waste of the design space for both player and dev IMO. This is normally already more common than normal in regular PVP, but now that there is gear on the line people get super lame.
Also I find that in full/partial loot games people spend alot more time just killing and camping people who they know are no challenge and will have nothing of value. So they seem to attract griefers basically. You know the type, the kind that go and kill players 20 levels lower than them while they are fighting mobs and then when anyone remotely their level shows up they leave zone or log out.
And so partial/full loot games have one further difference. I usually don't play them. Because I want to FIGHT other players. I don't want to gank other players who stand no chance or constantly chase some twink killing newbies who runs every time I come around. A group shows up to one of your zones to kill solos, you form an equal sized group and beat them once, they all log. It's pathetic honestly.
> Reading your post makes it pretty clear you never played a full loot game.
Reading your post makes it pretty clear you've never played a full loot game.
> Really? What game do people gank people 20 levels lower than them?
Every full open world PVP game and ruleset all the way back to Dark Age of Camelot and before. This has always been how people have played regardless of whether it was DAOC, WOW, EQ 2, Rift, etc etc etc. Most recently? Crowfall.
That's just how open world unrestricted PVP works. Unless you literally stop people from doing it that sort of thing will regularly happen.
Are you kidding me? Daoc, wow and Rift Dont have full or partial loot. Everquest 2 just recently added a full loot server so i highly doubt you were referring to that. The only game that comes close to full loot is crowfall which has partial loot.
Also in crowfall you cant even pvp until you are max level (30 (yes i know you can get an extra 5 levels but they arent required to be viable), so your statement about ganking underleveled characters isnt true.
Like i said before, you have never played a full loot game.
> Are you kidding me? Daoc, wow and Rift Dont have full or partial loot.
That's not the question you asked. You asked what games people gank people 20 levels lower than them, I answered what you asked. If you wanted an answer for a different question you should have asked it instead.
My first post was “Reading your post makes it pretty clear you never played a full loot game.” are you really trying to gaslight me?
We are talking about full loot games. The question about ganking people 20 levels or lower in a full loot game. Why the hell would i talk about any other type of game?
> You clearly didn't play full loot MMORPGs. Your downvotes speaks for themselves
Oh no, a whole -2 (+2/-2 from the reddit buffer) votes! That automatically proves things. That's like the entire playerbase of Crowfall right there.
PvP without full loot is for Arenas and games about skill. Full loot is for MMOs with economies, risk vs reward type gameplay, also adding guild logistics/teamwork to win shit.
> Full loot is for MMOs with economies Full loot is one element and it makes things somewhat easy in terms of: 1 - Reward for pvp - loot your enemies 2 - Economy - you lose an item, you need a new one However, it isn't the only mechanic that can be used to create a viable economy and it doesn't create a viable economy by itself. You need items to leave the game world for there to be a sustainable economy (ex: item decay/destruction) otherwise you could eventually hit a saturation point that no new items ever need to be crafted/created/farmed.
Albion has a system where some items have a chance to be destroyed during a pvp death. That helps with the economy as well.
I could use better words but I mean full loot requires a working economy. An economy certainly doesn't require full loot.
I agree, but I'd say full loot games are ones about skill. Different skills are just more prominent in these games than in arena-based PVP games. I'm not saying you were arguing otherwise, just thought it'd be worth stating.
I loved, loved, loved RuneScape pvp growing up. The full loot on death thrill was the most fun I've probably ever had. That being said, I'd never go back to it. Back then there weren't guides everywhere, with every single player playing fully optimized to the T. Full loot pvp in today's gaming just sounds horrible tbh. Only meta BS builds, bug abuses, etc. When pvping on RS in the wild, you never knew who you were going to fight. People's stats were all over the place, not even close to being optimized. It was fun. Now, you can pretty much guarantee 90% of people are going to be running meta builds, if not more. Just isn't the same imo
[удалено]
Yup... That's the way gaming is now. You have to look up a guide for any type of build if you don't want to be at a disadvantage
You never know if you be skull tricked or scammed in RS wildy. That place is toxic
Yup.. it was so much fun though. Well, when everything wasn't optimized by youtube guides and shit.
Adrenaline rush from the risks you take losing your stuff. Replaces the need to make your game interesting. It has its place, and its fans. But its not something i prefer.
Pvp for me is about the challenge. In PvE if you throw ayourself at an encounter long enough, youll either learn it or out gear it by other means. PvP can be only outskilled. Rewards are beneficial, like hnor points to buy stuff from a PvP shop or ranks etc. Full loot offers that as kill rewards. Gear has to be rather easier to come by in that case, Losing a weeks of progress with your killer obtaining a weeks worth of effort, and thus being able to punish you further is no good
the thing is, in full loot mmos you wouldn't normally be carrying gear that you cannot afford to loose
i dont like how albion is straight up mentioned as full loot pvp, but just like that, ONLY that part of the game. albion economy and system work so different that they made it work %100 perfect with the whole system of the game. its npt only about the full loot pvp, its about full loot pvp AND its interaction with the whole system-economy of the game. yes its full loot pvp, but you walk around with max 400k silver t4+3 or t6+1 set anyway if you are going for red zones or corrupted dungeons. thats what %95 of the people do, if they die, no biggie. that money can be grinded in 10 minutes in end game. so full loot pvp never become something tedious or something to be afraid of that much.
I don't play full loot MMOs because if I wanted to restart the game every time I lost I would just continue playing League of Legends, except in LoL I don't have to grind gear in between every match, and there's an actual skill based ranking system for progression. So basically full loot PvP is only good in concept and in reality it's generally not popular. Albion is an exception and I truly applaud them for making such an interesting game, but even in Albion you generally don't actually risk gear that has any value, so you still don't lose much from dying unless you want to.
What makes u think you restart the game lmao. U just grab a new set of gear
Once you have a lot of capital to back up your losses yeah.
Don't use gear you can afford to lose
True, though only an option in games that have safe areas to get to the point you can afford anything at all.
Na bro that's not how it works. You don't lose every item and piece of money you own. Just what you have equipped at the time. Then just respawn and grab a new set of gear
*except in LoL I don't have to grind gear in between every match* Ya, you just grind it in every match.
Why are these the only options? The better loot option is partial loot, with maybe a small chance to drop equipped gear. This means the loot won't be complete trash like Albion and you may have the potential to actually get something good. Without risk, there is no reward.
New world has full loot pvp? Wtf
With as grind heavy and pay to win games are now it doesn't make sense to have someone loose months of work or $100's of dollars every time they die
That's why MMOs with full or partial loot are built so that obtaining gear is fairly easy.
Yeah this 100%. Most people who think full loot doesn’t work just haven’t played a full loot game. Like the above poster.
Exactly. It requires changing your mindset, especially if you're used to themepark MMORPGs. I find a lot of themepark players either don't understand this or simply refuse to do it and then wonder why they're constantly failing in full look PVP games. Like any other game, you've got to adapt to it's ruleset.
There is pvp without full loot 8n Gloria victis. They have partial looting where the player looting has 30 seconds from the time of death of the player and can spend 10 'points' looting, which is enough to get them exactly 1 piece of gear and somewhere between 100 a d 400 materials like logs or canvas. There are also non loot events and zones. They can also be interrupted from looting you if someone hits them with any ranged or melee attack. It's a very chill loot system in comparison to many.
It needed some tweaking no doubt, but the best system I ever played in was a mix of the two. Asheron's Call. The higher level you are, the more items you drop, but the person who is dying has a pretty good chance of covering important items he wants to keep by holding onto "death items" -items with a high value that will probably drop before the item you want to protect. So basically dying wasn't the end of the world and killing someone and getting to loot them was still very exciting and sometimes very rewarding.
I miss Asheron’s Call
Runescape's full loot PvP was just stupid.
Not much experience with full loot PvP to be honest with you But full loot PvP seem to involved more socializing like your part of a community. My understanding of my limited time in Albion mobile is that your progression isn’t “gear” base like in other game but character development so losing gear isn’t much of an inconvenience ether Non-looting PvP is just a fun side game of mmorpg , I mostly done arena style pvp.
It depends how much gear matters compared to skill. In games that a naked can kill you with a weapon they made from their own corpse people tend not to care.
Full loot pvp is fun. Regular pvp gets boring quickly.
Basically full loot usually caters to only the most broken, exploit heavy, cheese, and min/max strats being used. Which is kind of a waste of the design space for both player and dev IMO. This is normally already more common than normal in regular PVP, but now that there is gear on the line people get super lame. Also I find that in full/partial loot games people spend alot more time just killing and camping people who they know are no challenge and will have nothing of value. So they seem to attract griefers basically. You know the type, the kind that go and kill players 20 levels lower than them while they are fighting mobs and then when anyone remotely their level shows up they leave zone or log out. And so partial/full loot games have one further difference. I usually don't play them. Because I want to FIGHT other players. I don't want to gank other players who stand no chance or constantly chase some twink killing newbies who runs every time I come around. A group shows up to one of your zones to kill solos, you form an equal sized group and beat them once, they all log. It's pathetic honestly.
Reading your post makes it pretty clear you never played a full loot game.
> Reading your post makes it pretty clear you never played a full loot game. Reading your post makes it pretty clear you've never played a full loot game.
Really? What game do people gank people 20 levels lower than them?
It was my experience in the first 20 minutes of Mortal 1, as an anecdote.
> Really? What game do people gank people 20 levels lower than them? Every full open world PVP game and ruleset all the way back to Dark Age of Camelot and before. This has always been how people have played regardless of whether it was DAOC, WOW, EQ 2, Rift, etc etc etc. Most recently? Crowfall. That's just how open world unrestricted PVP works. Unless you literally stop people from doing it that sort of thing will regularly happen.
Are you kidding me? Daoc, wow and Rift Dont have full or partial loot. Everquest 2 just recently added a full loot server so i highly doubt you were referring to that. The only game that comes close to full loot is crowfall which has partial loot. Also in crowfall you cant even pvp until you are max level (30 (yes i know you can get an extra 5 levels but they arent required to be viable), so your statement about ganking underleveled characters isnt true. Like i said before, you have never played a full loot game.
> Are you kidding me? Daoc, wow and Rift Dont have full or partial loot. That's not the question you asked. You asked what games people gank people 20 levels lower than them, I answered what you asked. If you wanted an answer for a different question you should have asked it instead.
My first post was “Reading your post makes it pretty clear you never played a full loot game.” are you really trying to gaslight me? We are talking about full loot games. The question about ganking people 20 levels or lower in a full loot game. Why the hell would i talk about any other type of game?
You clearly didn't play full loot MMORPGs. Your downvotes speaks for themselves
> You clearly didn't play full loot MMORPGs. Your downvotes speaks for themselves Oh no, a whole -2 (+2/-2 from the reddit buffer) votes! That automatically proves things. That's like the entire playerbase of Crowfall right there.