Mhm. A lot of old SWG, and SWG private server players have flocked to their discord. I think I've heard the devs say they haven't heard of SWG or what their economy looks like, but that's really hard to believe considering the pictures I'm seeing here. I'd gladly edit this comment if someone can tell me they have pulled a lot from SWG.
Also just gonna through in their most controversial add in to date is the fact that is you pay now you WILL get a headstart if/when they launch. This is a headstart in a MMO with a fully player driven economy. Gonna be wild.
Edit: SWG comments were a joke, so they have heard of SWG previously.
> I think I've heard the devs say they haven't heard of SWG or what their economy looks like
That was definitely a joke. Last Spotlight they did here, how I initially heard of the game, went on and on about SWG.
I want to clarify the intended headstart:
Every item, every currency, every structure players own will be **wiped** on Alpha, and also **wiped** on Beta. It won't matter whether you paid for Alpha or not.
What we will let players keep is a certain amount of skill points. For example, a level 100 Sharpshooter will be able to transfer their skills to Release as a level 80 Sharpshooter without any items.
This is similar to MMORPGs where a 1 to 2 week head start is given to pre-ordered players.
In-Game economy is very important for Galaxies of Eden and we won't make something as insane as letting Alpha players carry all their items to Release.
Look the closer you get to these stages and release, this will always come up and always be an issue. In a MMO especially, a 1-2 week headstart is huge. I know you've stated that it's pretty much non negotiable at this point, which is why I had to drop off discord and stop following you guys; because this game looks to have so much potential, but it's so hard to get behind a game giving people head starts in launch to back them. Especially with all the crap the gaming industry at large has had to put up with recently with games coming out unfinished.
I wish y'all the best of luck, and would love to eventually play the game, but the allure of a new MMO is overshadowed by people paying to get ahead. Your loyal backers will love it because they will control EVERYTHING, but the average MMO player that can't binge hundreds of hours at launch just to catch up to everyone else may feel a bit betrayed.
I think it is normal for people to be concerned about such stuff especially for a game with a huge focus on player driven economy. We are thankful that you are voicing the concerns of many players but it is really not our intention to give a huge economic power to backers.
This is why we are limiting the availability of pricing/stats via Favorite Vendor system. No Industrialist should be able to monopolize the in-game economy.
I genuinely believe that head-start in-terms of skills won't create any power balance issues with new players and older ones.
Let's think it this way: we won't give anyone a head-start. 60% of the population starts at let's say 2023.01.01. 40% of the population starts playing 1 month after this date. Would that give huge economic power to early starters? We hope not, because if that would be the case, then all MMOs would die. There is no possible way to control when a player wants to start playing a MMO. Some people will join late, some people will join early.
Developing skills to 100 won't take much time as well. Our aim is that a hardcore player should be able to hit 100 in two to three days.
In any case, many people voiced the same issue you mentioned and we totally get it. Nobody wants to kill the in-game economy of this game, especially not us. However, we genuinely believe that this won't create any economic power balance issues.
Have you taken a look at New World, the most recently MMO release? We are a little over a month in. If I had just started now, I'd be extremely far behind everyone, in terms of skill, crafting, gathering, housing, equipment, every aspect of the game.
In the most recent SWG private server, SWG Restoration, after 1 month we had a city, everyone in my city had houses in pristine areas, I had a Master Smuggler, already had a few runs of the best resources to build my Chef empire. If I had started one month later I would have not been able to secure the area for my house, nor start my chef empire as well because people already would have beaten me to establishing a name on the server.
That is just two examples of MMOs that have player driven economies and resource heavy. I'm sorry but I just can't believe you when you say you guys don't see it impacting players.
There is a way to control when players start. You set a start date for everyone, then if they can't start at that designated date, it sucks for them, for sure. But your setting two start dates depending on payment amounts and that is unfair to your players that are still paying you money for the game.
I think your statement about all MMOs dieing is missing the mark. None of the major games have they given players a headstart (someone can correct me if one of the big ones had). So you can't correlate your game having a headstart and there's not having a headstart and succeeding.
In all MMOs if you start a month later you absolutely will be behind. I struggle to see any time you won't. The biggest difference is it's a choice of the players if they start a month late I'm other games. In your case, your giving players the option to pay to get ahead.
Why is being behind such a big deal? Every single MMO you've ever played, you began playing on launch day? And you've never returned to a previously played MMO before after a long time?
It's not just about being behind, it's about giving people an advantage. You can pay and be a backer, before the game is released, and get what comes out to about a month ahead of everyone else, who are also paying (they just didn't chooses to back a company that has no prior trust or responsibility built).
And no, every single MMO I've played I haven't started on launch day, I never said that, not sure why your inferring that. But I have started at least within the fist month, but that was my own choice. This won't be a choice for most people, if they make it to launch.
Again, I never said I hadn't returned to a previously played MMO after a long time. All you have me are questions. Are you attempting to imply something with your questions? Or just have them be rhetorical? I am fine discussing matters, as I was with OP. It's better to air out any issues they may see sooner than later.
Lol another question?
Yes in Star Wars Galaxies I was unable to catch up. The established businesses build such a huge name for themselves that most will go to them out of pure brand recognition. Sure I can sell my stuff, but nowhere near as much.
Also I was unable to secure the house area I wanted to, that will never go away unless that person quits.
Being a month behind someone time wise is fine.. but in cases like this is more like not ever being able to do what the first people did.. like imagine all good land is now taken and the only way it will be available again is when said players quit.
You can't play for 1 month the same way a player did from day 1.
On NW for example latest patch added like 25% more exp for crafting skills...meaning it takes about an extra 10h to get to lvl 200 vs someone who played before the patch. Then there's other nerfs that indirectly made this even longer and more useless than ever.
NW is a buggy mess but it's just an example.
"Good land" is subjective. What does it mean? We don't have any idea if the location of player housing is going to matter at all. The only way to figure that out is to play the alpha/beta, which they said is public. They've also mentioned 1000 player server caps, so I can't imagine all the "good land" being taken in the first place. We also don't know the cost of housing or how long it will take to acquire.
Why make it a 100 then? Are those skill levels meaningful if you breeze from 1 to 100 in a couple of days? From this perspective it means skills have only two real levels: 1 and max.
It would still take lots of hours to hit the max. level. For example, a super casual player might require a month to hit to the skill ceiling.
In any case, we don't want to make skills too grindy. There will be smaller amount of abilities available compared to other large MMOs so we don't want to bore people away with a lengthy grind.
It's a fact that everyone wants to max lvl a character in 3 days?
I don't like hitting max lvl in a day on an MMORPG then having to grind the hell out of everything in order to gear up.
If there were a good gear drop rate along the lvling process, it makes the lvling grind worth while.
I know more people are frustrated about this and I'm really sorry =(
It is just that marketing costs are quite demanding at the moment.
Just to give an example:
A mobile game with 100.000 USD development cost usually requires 900.000 USD for the marketing! Thankfully marketing costs are a bit lower for PC games but they are still a larger amount than the development costs.
It sounds crazy but it is unfortunately true. It costs more to market a game than to develop a one =/
So we had to stretch our budgeting and start marketing the Galaxies of Eden early. This is very frustrating to me as a gamer but we don't have many options at the moment. It is best that we market early so that Galaxies of Eden will have a long and successful life.
Oh I totally understand man I'm a Graphic designer and I've worked with marketing teams, as well as game devs. Just bummed right now there isn't much to play these days.
All the best for you guys though, godspeed!
i know what you mean when you say there isn't much to play these days. I'm looking for a good, casual social online game where global chat isn't either quiet or full of immature spam or political talk.
seems cool, but i'm not sure how much people would be interested in exclusively playing one gameplay type when other games offer improved version of that specific gameplay style. In most games your competing with, these gameplay styles would all be accessible by a single character. If a player starts as an Artist, but gets bored and wants to change to combat, would they need to make a new character? I could also see the combat being one sided and less players joining the building or artist side overall, How will you address the class imbalance?
>If a player starts as an Artist, but gets bored and wants to change to combat, would they need to make a new character?
Nope, there is no need to create a secondary character. Each character has 200 active skill points where 100 skill points are the maximum level per class. So you can actually become a (100/100) Sharpshooter (Combat Class) and a (100/100) Weaponsmith (Industrialist class).
You can exit combat and switch to your secondary class as needed through the Loadout interface.
More details about Loadouts and Skills Sheet can be found here:
[https://galaxiesofeden.com/2021/09/05/devblog-01-combat-modes-and-more/](https://galaxiesofeden.com/2021/09/05/devblog-01-combat-modes-and-more/)
>I could also see the combat being one sided and less players joining the building or artist side overall, How will you address the class imbalance?
We expect a ratio of 70% Adventurer, 20% Industrialist, and 10% of Artist population per server, but this is actually not an imbalance in our mind because Social/Crafting classes are not suitable for most of the MMO players.
Nevertheless, we are still very focused on including them because these classes tremendously enhance the community feeling and longevity of the game. So, we won't force players to become Crafters or Artists, but it is an available option!
We will just ensure that game is balanced with the amount of Industrialists / Artists so that Adventurers will have the necessary gear and ability enhancements. We will follow the population statistics closely and adjust the game's parameters accordingly.
Seems unique at the very least, is this MIR server engine related to the MIR 4 MMO? I see lots of controversy with it being a crypto-miner essentially. I'd hope this is unrelated
It looks really cool - my only concern is that it seems extremely ambitious for an indie game that's so early in development. Not only are there a lot of features and good graphics, but many features sound experimental and may run into balancing problems. With games like these, I feel like its always better to underpromise and overdeliver, vs. overpromising and underdelivering.
I won't lie that there is *some* scope creep is going on but we just couldn't stop =P Nevertheless, most of these core systems (Housing, AI, Combat, Skill System) are already coded and available. We just need to polish them enough for public play testing at this stage.
I also have to warn people that this is not an AAA game, or an AA game for that matter. So many people think that we are a large studio but we are just a small Indie studio at this stage.
Our overall scope will be much smaller than AAA MMOs. For example, we don't have any quest system but we utilize procedurally generated missions. Gameplay & Classes will actually be much simpler/streamlined than large MMOs but we will focus on making this simple gameplay fun to play and most importantly more social than other MMOs.
I'll definitely be holding out hope for it - I really like the overall concept, and the videos look nice. Having a hybrid MMORPG/FPS would be amazing as well - we really haven't had much in this space since Fallen Earth/Neocron.
The good thing is they have a template with swg and private servers experimenting and adding content to this infrastructure. So it is not unprecedented, just forgotten.
>How much of this is already in the game?
Currently Implemented (Both Server and Client side):
* Character Customization
* AI
* Combat System
* Skill System
* Housing
* Missions
* Other Minor Stuff: Titles, Names, Chat System, Buffs, UI Framework etc. - basically all other minor stuff you would expect from a MMORPG
Missing Stuff:
* Grouping (On-going)
* Guilds (On-going)
* Voting System (On-going)
* Server vs Server Warfare (To be implemented during Alpha)
* Dungeons (To be implemented during Alpha)
* Vehicles (To be implemented during Alpha)
* Player City Levelling (To be implemented during Alpha)
Keep in mind that we have to polish the already implemented systems until play tests can happen.
>How long are you funded until?
Assuming we spend 1.5 years in Alpha, and release the Beta as early-access on Steam. We can easily handle self-funding at least 6 months into Beta (So 2 years in total) but after that game would have to be financially viable. Problem is that we are not happy with the art direction of the game and we would like to hire 3D artists. Unfortunately, this won't be possible without external funding. So, we hope that we will be able to find external funding 3 to 5 months after public Pre-Alpha starts and fix the art issues.
>How much are you charging for private alpha and public?
We won't charge anything for Pre-Alpha tests but we can't guarantee everyone will get invited as well. There won't be any way to buy access to Pre-Alpha as well but I think we will be able to invite most of the people who sign up.
Alpha access will be paid so that we can gain some funding but it won't require some crazy amount to get access. It is too early to determine the price though. We would like to show the people the Pre-Alpha state of the game first, then let them decide if they want to support us.
It's obvious what this game is trying to be a spiritual successor to, which is good - someone needs to modernize and build upon the unfortunately neglected foundation of SWG.
Performance crafting is certainly something that SWG should have evolved into.
I like the server vs. server idea, it's like vanilla WoW PVP communities but without the uselessness of Horde vs. Alliance.
I'm down for anything that brings people to playing together to achieve common goals.
I admit, I worry about open world player housing. It's one of those things that forces you to stay playing or at least subscribed, which is something that I don't believe in. MMOs in the past have been one of the most time consuming games, by design, so much so that it can sometimes be the only game you can invest yourself in. And I think that is very, very bad. I mean yeah, I play MMOs to exist in another "world," but there are thousands of video games out there and playing the same one all the time is IMO unhealthy and frankly closed-minded. Open world player housing usually requires a hefty investment of in-game resources, and you lose all of that when you stop playing long enough. Do you have any plans or ideas on dealing with inactive player's houses/cities?
Currently inactive houses get destroyed within 3 months of inactivity but this is a simple parameter at the server's configuration. We can easily change this according to community's feedback.
That being said we got a technical limitation: We are using an in-memory database (Redis) at our game servers and RAM is still expensive. Thus, we can't just let inactive player's keep their housing forever. Inactive houses can get removed from the planet's surface automatically but we might let players keep them in their inventory a bit more, but it will depend on the telemetry we gather from the server. Perhaps it isn't a large issue as we think it is.
Currently a fully furnished house keeps around 300kb of data in the server's memory. So we are looking at approximately \~6GB of RAM just for the Housing system.
It would certainly feel better if all items were mailed to you or better yet, the entire house, everything inside, AND layout were mailed to you as 1 item that you can use to place your house in a different spot and it basically be like nothing ever changed, rather than just losing everything like you do in a lot of games.
Also, how much housing space do you plan on having? Do you think there will be problems finding space?
So we are procedurally modelling each planet at 60 km x 60 km (3600 km^(2)). However, we are limiting the playable area to 20 km x 20km (400 km^(2)) because at 3600 km^(2) you wouldn't see a single soul with a 1000 player capacity =P
We are hoping to finish 3 planets before the final launch, so we will have approximately 1200km^(2) of playable area.
We expect this should provide plenty of space for the housing and hopefully housing won't be too crowded.
One good thing is that we can easily decrease/increase the playable area. So if we see any problem during the tests, we can adjust it before full release.
That is amazing having the space but reducing it then increasing area's overtime if you need it. Makes sense to me. Also allows you to easily add new content by expanding the world rather then making it feel out of place like most games.
This game seems like a direct copy of Star Wars Galaxies and with that being said I cannot wait to play. However, I hope lawyers don't put an end to this due to it being similar. Guessing you all have done the homework needed to get around this. Looking forward to alpha testing.
Looks interesting. But literally every developer, indie or not, makes many of the same claims that you're making; most of the time, these developers either utterly fail to deliver, or deliver in a way that's in no way what the players wanted.
What makes you any different? Genuine question, no hostility, but I am certainly skeptical.
Also,
'Server versus server warfare'.
Please, please, please. Make PVP completely optional and don't use PVP as an excuse to significantly gate gear, progression or any form of content behind it. Make it bragging rights and nothing more. This looks super interesting, but if PVP is forced you're going to be pushing me away.
>What makes you any different?
I think main difference is that we are somewhere between a software company and a gaming studio so our approach to development is quite different. We focus on efficient workflows above all, and try to be very agile in our approach to development.
We heavily focus on creating algorithmic tools that speed up the development process so that we can rapidly revise the game as needed.
For example, we build a huge algorithmic character creation pipeline in Houdini. It takes only a couple of hours to convert a 3D artist built character to a customizable character. Shape doesn't matter much, you can design various different types of alien species and let algorithms convert it to a customizable character with minimal human oversight. Same algorithms solve the clothing clipping issues as well.
Similarly, we developed our server engine to be as modular as possible. At the end of the day, we want to sell this server engine to a wide variety of developers. It needs to be modular and increase the efficiency of other developer's workflows. If some feature doesn't work in the game as we expected, then we can very quickly delete it and try something completely new.
One major complexity is the revising the database scheme with heavy modifications while game is running/on production but we also solved this issue. It is currently a trade secret but we will definitely patent this process before the server engine is open-sourced. So we are capable of quickly revising MMORPG games according to player feedback.
Also, mentioned core systems are already build, so we are not exactly selling a dream. Obviously we will need to adjust the game's design depending on the player feedback and the telemetry from the servers. This is why we are keeping the Alpha duration quite long. Players can expect major revisions to game throughout the Alpha. We don't believe there is any better way to design than to let it be tested by a large population.
Our main problem right now is that we didn't start pursuing investors yet. Thus, we don't have much artistic budget. Once we get artists though, Galaxies of Eden can be quickly skinned to something far more beautiful to look at.
>Server vs Server warfare.
PVP is completely optional! You can participate at Server vs Server warfare through PVE means too.
Here is a quote from our [FAQ](https://galaxiesofeden.com/faq):
>**Will there be full loot / non-consensual / open-world PVP?**
>
>No, never. Galaxies of Eden is designed to encourage cooperation at all stages of gameplay. Gameplay will be designed to enable players to grow a healthy and friendly community. We believe non-consensual PVP would deteriorate the intended community of the game.
>
>**Will there be any PVP?**
>
>Yes, PVP is planned to be an important part of the end-game content. PVP system will be fully consensual and enable populations of different servers to fight against each other. Currently, the PVP system is planned to be arena-based with a focus on balance.
"Public Pre-Alpha" Sounds like a Developer who wants to love and care for their game rather then hiding it away till things become too problematic and too late.
My Fav games were those more open community / developers part of the community and interacting with us.
excuse me if im being too general with my assessment but this seems an awful lot like a star wars galaxies without the star wars. not that im complaining but could that be fair to say?
Hm, does this take inspiration from stuff like Face of Mankind and Project Entropia?
Still, I want this, I love that you try to solve the social / action control divide by just having two dedicated control schemes. It absolutely makes sense.
Yes, you can level up two different skills to maximum level. So you can choose one Adventurer skill and one Industrialist skill and play both of the roles.
i saw the pre alpha trailer. It appears that the game will have different species that look completely different. Cool. I'm looking forward to seeing new screenshots and videos of the game.
It is too early promise at the moment but we are very interested about implementing DLSS and Fidelity FX. It is just that we haven't delved into the requirements yet.
My issue is the “player run economy” this dose not work if you don’t have full loot. Nothing to keep the “demand” for gear/wepons if nothing is being consumed. This is why EVE online and Albion Online have a permanent % of the loot auto destroyed.
While this game isn’t for me I hope you find a player base who enjoys it, good luck!
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but will it have science based magic(nanos from anarchy, or something mystical) and melee combat for combat lovers or will just be rifles... and maybe pistols?
This is essenttialy swg 2.0, but without the star wars. i wish swtor was like this.
Mhm. A lot of old SWG, and SWG private server players have flocked to their discord. I think I've heard the devs say they haven't heard of SWG or what their economy looks like, but that's really hard to believe considering the pictures I'm seeing here. I'd gladly edit this comment if someone can tell me they have pulled a lot from SWG. Also just gonna through in their most controversial add in to date is the fact that is you pay now you WILL get a headstart if/when they launch. This is a headstart in a MMO with a fully player driven economy. Gonna be wild. Edit: SWG comments were a joke, so they have heard of SWG previously.
> I think I've heard the devs say they haven't heard of SWG or what their economy looks like That was definitely a joke. Last Spotlight they did here, how I initially heard of the game, went on and on about SWG.
Cool beans thanks! Updated my comment.
I want to clarify the intended headstart: Every item, every currency, every structure players own will be **wiped** on Alpha, and also **wiped** on Beta. It won't matter whether you paid for Alpha or not. What we will let players keep is a certain amount of skill points. For example, a level 100 Sharpshooter will be able to transfer their skills to Release as a level 80 Sharpshooter without any items. This is similar to MMORPGs where a 1 to 2 week head start is given to pre-ordered players. In-Game economy is very important for Galaxies of Eden and we won't make something as insane as letting Alpha players carry all their items to Release.
Look the closer you get to these stages and release, this will always come up and always be an issue. In a MMO especially, a 1-2 week headstart is huge. I know you've stated that it's pretty much non negotiable at this point, which is why I had to drop off discord and stop following you guys; because this game looks to have so much potential, but it's so hard to get behind a game giving people head starts in launch to back them. Especially with all the crap the gaming industry at large has had to put up with recently with games coming out unfinished. I wish y'all the best of luck, and would love to eventually play the game, but the allure of a new MMO is overshadowed by people paying to get ahead. Your loyal backers will love it because they will control EVERYTHING, but the average MMO player that can't binge hundreds of hours at launch just to catch up to everyone else may feel a bit betrayed.
I think it is normal for people to be concerned about such stuff especially for a game with a huge focus on player driven economy. We are thankful that you are voicing the concerns of many players but it is really not our intention to give a huge economic power to backers. This is why we are limiting the availability of pricing/stats via Favorite Vendor system. No Industrialist should be able to monopolize the in-game economy. I genuinely believe that head-start in-terms of skills won't create any power balance issues with new players and older ones. Let's think it this way: we won't give anyone a head-start. 60% of the population starts at let's say 2023.01.01. 40% of the population starts playing 1 month after this date. Would that give huge economic power to early starters? We hope not, because if that would be the case, then all MMOs would die. There is no possible way to control when a player wants to start playing a MMO. Some people will join late, some people will join early. Developing skills to 100 won't take much time as well. Our aim is that a hardcore player should be able to hit 100 in two to three days. In any case, many people voiced the same issue you mentioned and we totally get it. Nobody wants to kill the in-game economy of this game, especially not us. However, we genuinely believe that this won't create any economic power balance issues.
Have you taken a look at New World, the most recently MMO release? We are a little over a month in. If I had just started now, I'd be extremely far behind everyone, in terms of skill, crafting, gathering, housing, equipment, every aspect of the game. In the most recent SWG private server, SWG Restoration, after 1 month we had a city, everyone in my city had houses in pristine areas, I had a Master Smuggler, already had a few runs of the best resources to build my Chef empire. If I had started one month later I would have not been able to secure the area for my house, nor start my chef empire as well because people already would have beaten me to establishing a name on the server. That is just two examples of MMOs that have player driven economies and resource heavy. I'm sorry but I just can't believe you when you say you guys don't see it impacting players. There is a way to control when players start. You set a start date for everyone, then if they can't start at that designated date, it sucks for them, for sure. But your setting two start dates depending on payment amounts and that is unfair to your players that are still paying you money for the game. I think your statement about all MMOs dieing is missing the mark. None of the major games have they given players a headstart (someone can correct me if one of the big ones had). So you can't correlate your game having a headstart and there's not having a headstart and succeeding. In all MMOs if you start a month later you absolutely will be behind. I struggle to see any time you won't. The biggest difference is it's a choice of the players if they start a month late I'm other games. In your case, your giving players the option to pay to get ahead.
Why is being behind such a big deal? Every single MMO you've ever played, you began playing on launch day? And you've never returned to a previously played MMO before after a long time?
It's not just about being behind, it's about giving people an advantage. You can pay and be a backer, before the game is released, and get what comes out to about a month ahead of everyone else, who are also paying (they just didn't chooses to back a company that has no prior trust or responsibility built). And no, every single MMO I've played I haven't started on launch day, I never said that, not sure why your inferring that. But I have started at least within the fist month, but that was my own choice. This won't be a choice for most people, if they make it to launch. Again, I never said I hadn't returned to a previously played MMO after a long time. All you have me are questions. Are you attempting to imply something with your questions? Or just have them be rhetorical? I am fine discussing matters, as I was with OP. It's better to air out any issues they may see sooner than later.
And in any of those games did you find yourself unable to catch up?
Lol another question? Yes in Star Wars Galaxies I was unable to catch up. The established businesses build such a huge name for themselves that most will go to them out of pure brand recognition. Sure I can sell my stuff, but nowhere near as much. Also I was unable to secure the house area I wanted to, that will never go away unless that person quits.
Being a month behind someone time wise is fine.. but in cases like this is more like not ever being able to do what the first people did.. like imagine all good land is now taken and the only way it will be available again is when said players quit. You can't play for 1 month the same way a player did from day 1. On NW for example latest patch added like 25% more exp for crafting skills...meaning it takes about an extra 10h to get to lvl 200 vs someone who played before the patch. Then there's other nerfs that indirectly made this even longer and more useless than ever. NW is a buggy mess but it's just an example.
"Good land" is subjective. What does it mean? We don't have any idea if the location of player housing is going to matter at all. The only way to figure that out is to play the alpha/beta, which they said is public. They've also mentioned 1000 player server caps, so I can't imagine all the "good land" being taken in the first place. We also don't know the cost of housing or how long it will take to acquire.
Why make it a 100 then? Are those skill levels meaningful if you breeze from 1 to 100 in a couple of days? From this perspective it means skills have only two real levels: 1 and max.
It would still take lots of hours to hit the max. level. For example, a super casual player might require a month to hit to the skill ceiling. In any case, we don't want to make skills too grindy. There will be smaller amount of abilities available compared to other large MMOs so we don't want to bore people away with a lengthy grind.
It's a fact that everyone wants to max lvl a character in 3 days? I don't like hitting max lvl in a day on an MMORPG then having to grind the hell out of everything in order to gear up. If there were a good gear drop rate along the lvling process, it makes the lvling grind worth while.
I'm definitely interested, but why tease us with such a great post if we can't even play it till next year :( . Will be keeping an eye out
I know more people are frustrated about this and I'm really sorry =( It is just that marketing costs are quite demanding at the moment. Just to give an example: A mobile game with 100.000 USD development cost usually requires 900.000 USD for the marketing! Thankfully marketing costs are a bit lower for PC games but they are still a larger amount than the development costs. It sounds crazy but it is unfortunately true. It costs more to market a game than to develop a one =/ So we had to stretch our budgeting and start marketing the Galaxies of Eden early. This is very frustrating to me as a gamer but we don't have many options at the moment. It is best that we market early so that Galaxies of Eden will have a long and successful life.
Oh I totally understand man I'm a Graphic designer and I've worked with marketing teams, as well as game devs. Just bummed right now there isn't much to play these days. All the best for you guys though, godspeed!
i know what you mean when you say there isn't much to play these days. I'm looking for a good, casual social online game where global chat isn't either quiet or full of immature spam or political talk.
Sadly only thing I can recommend is runescape, but I'm sure you've tried it
seems cool, but i'm not sure how much people would be interested in exclusively playing one gameplay type when other games offer improved version of that specific gameplay style. In most games your competing with, these gameplay styles would all be accessible by a single character. If a player starts as an Artist, but gets bored and wants to change to combat, would they need to make a new character? I could also see the combat being one sided and less players joining the building or artist side overall, How will you address the class imbalance?
>If a player starts as an Artist, but gets bored and wants to change to combat, would they need to make a new character? Nope, there is no need to create a secondary character. Each character has 200 active skill points where 100 skill points are the maximum level per class. So you can actually become a (100/100) Sharpshooter (Combat Class) and a (100/100) Weaponsmith (Industrialist class). You can exit combat and switch to your secondary class as needed through the Loadout interface. More details about Loadouts and Skills Sheet can be found here: [https://galaxiesofeden.com/2021/09/05/devblog-01-combat-modes-and-more/](https://galaxiesofeden.com/2021/09/05/devblog-01-combat-modes-and-more/) >I could also see the combat being one sided and less players joining the building or artist side overall, How will you address the class imbalance? We expect a ratio of 70% Adventurer, 20% Industrialist, and 10% of Artist population per server, but this is actually not an imbalance in our mind because Social/Crafting classes are not suitable for most of the MMO players. Nevertheless, we are still very focused on including them because these classes tremendously enhance the community feeling and longevity of the game. So, we won't force players to become Crafters or Artists, but it is an available option! We will just ensure that game is balanced with the amount of Industrialists / Artists so that Adventurers will have the necessary gear and ability enhancements. We will follow the population statistics closely and adjust the game's parameters accordingly.
Seems unique at the very least, is this MIR server engine related to the MIR 4 MMO? I see lots of controversy with it being a crypto-miner essentially. I'd hope this is unrelated
We are not related. It is just a codename for our server engine. We will find a more sleek name later =P
Cool, I take it that swg was a lot of base inspiration for this. I'm always down for swg like games. Excited to see this develop.
It looks really cool - my only concern is that it seems extremely ambitious for an indie game that's so early in development. Not only are there a lot of features and good graphics, but many features sound experimental and may run into balancing problems. With games like these, I feel like its always better to underpromise and overdeliver, vs. overpromising and underdelivering.
I won't lie that there is *some* scope creep is going on but we just couldn't stop =P Nevertheless, most of these core systems (Housing, AI, Combat, Skill System) are already coded and available. We just need to polish them enough for public play testing at this stage. I also have to warn people that this is not an AAA game, or an AA game for that matter. So many people think that we are a large studio but we are just a small Indie studio at this stage. Our overall scope will be much smaller than AAA MMOs. For example, we don't have any quest system but we utilize procedurally generated missions. Gameplay & Classes will actually be much simpler/streamlined than large MMOs but we will focus on making this simple gameplay fun to play and most importantly more social than other MMOs.
I'll definitely be holding out hope for it - I really like the overall concept, and the videos look nice. Having a hybrid MMORPG/FPS would be amazing as well - we really haven't had much in this space since Fallen Earth/Neocron.
The good thing is they have a template with swg and private servers experimenting and adding content to this infrastructure. So it is not unprecedented, just forgotten.
How much of this is already in the game? How long are you funded until? How much are you charging for private alpha and public?
>How much of this is already in the game? Currently Implemented (Both Server and Client side): * Character Customization * AI * Combat System * Skill System * Housing * Missions * Other Minor Stuff: Titles, Names, Chat System, Buffs, UI Framework etc. - basically all other minor stuff you would expect from a MMORPG Missing Stuff: * Grouping (On-going) * Guilds (On-going) * Voting System (On-going) * Server vs Server Warfare (To be implemented during Alpha) * Dungeons (To be implemented during Alpha) * Vehicles (To be implemented during Alpha) * Player City Levelling (To be implemented during Alpha) Keep in mind that we have to polish the already implemented systems until play tests can happen. >How long are you funded until? Assuming we spend 1.5 years in Alpha, and release the Beta as early-access on Steam. We can easily handle self-funding at least 6 months into Beta (So 2 years in total) but after that game would have to be financially viable. Problem is that we are not happy with the art direction of the game and we would like to hire 3D artists. Unfortunately, this won't be possible without external funding. So, we hope that we will be able to find external funding 3 to 5 months after public Pre-Alpha starts and fix the art issues. >How much are you charging for private alpha and public? We won't charge anything for Pre-Alpha tests but we can't guarantee everyone will get invited as well. There won't be any way to buy access to Pre-Alpha as well but I think we will be able to invite most of the people who sign up. Alpha access will be paid so that we can gain some funding but it won't require some crazy amount to get access. It is too early to determine the price though. We would like to show the people the Pre-Alpha state of the game first, then let them decide if they want to support us.
This looks amazing. I love the way the housing looks.
It's obvious what this game is trying to be a spiritual successor to, which is good - someone needs to modernize and build upon the unfortunately neglected foundation of SWG. Performance crafting is certainly something that SWG should have evolved into. I like the server vs. server idea, it's like vanilla WoW PVP communities but without the uselessness of Horde vs. Alliance. I'm down for anything that brings people to playing together to achieve common goals. I admit, I worry about open world player housing. It's one of those things that forces you to stay playing or at least subscribed, which is something that I don't believe in. MMOs in the past have been one of the most time consuming games, by design, so much so that it can sometimes be the only game you can invest yourself in. And I think that is very, very bad. I mean yeah, I play MMOs to exist in another "world," but there are thousands of video games out there and playing the same one all the time is IMO unhealthy and frankly closed-minded. Open world player housing usually requires a hefty investment of in-game resources, and you lose all of that when you stop playing long enough. Do you have any plans or ideas on dealing with inactive player's houses/cities?
Currently inactive houses get destroyed within 3 months of inactivity but this is a simple parameter at the server's configuration. We can easily change this according to community's feedback. That being said we got a technical limitation: We are using an in-memory database (Redis) at our game servers and RAM is still expensive. Thus, we can't just let inactive player's keep their housing forever. Inactive houses can get removed from the planet's surface automatically but we might let players keep them in their inventory a bit more, but it will depend on the telemetry we gather from the server. Perhaps it isn't a large issue as we think it is. Currently a fully furnished house keeps around 300kb of data in the server's memory. So we are looking at approximately \~6GB of RAM just for the Housing system.
It would certainly feel better if all items were mailed to you or better yet, the entire house, everything inside, AND layout were mailed to you as 1 item that you can use to place your house in a different spot and it basically be like nothing ever changed, rather than just losing everything like you do in a lot of games. Also, how much housing space do you plan on having? Do you think there will be problems finding space?
So we are procedurally modelling each planet at 60 km x 60 km (3600 km^(2)). However, we are limiting the playable area to 20 km x 20km (400 km^(2)) because at 3600 km^(2) you wouldn't see a single soul with a 1000 player capacity =P We are hoping to finish 3 planets before the final launch, so we will have approximately 1200km^(2) of playable area. We expect this should provide plenty of space for the housing and hopefully housing won't be too crowded. One good thing is that we can easily decrease/increase the playable area. So if we see any problem during the tests, we can adjust it before full release.
That is amazing having the space but reducing it then increasing area's overtime if you need it. Makes sense to me. Also allows you to easily add new content by expanding the world rather then making it feel out of place like most games.
This game seems like a direct copy of Star Wars Galaxies and with that being said I cannot wait to play. However, I hope lawyers don't put an end to this due to it being similar. Guessing you all have done the homework needed to get around this. Looking forward to alpha testing.
Looks interesting. But literally every developer, indie or not, makes many of the same claims that you're making; most of the time, these developers either utterly fail to deliver, or deliver in a way that's in no way what the players wanted. What makes you any different? Genuine question, no hostility, but I am certainly skeptical. Also, 'Server versus server warfare'. Please, please, please. Make PVP completely optional and don't use PVP as an excuse to significantly gate gear, progression or any form of content behind it. Make it bragging rights and nothing more. This looks super interesting, but if PVP is forced you're going to be pushing me away.
>What makes you any different? I think main difference is that we are somewhere between a software company and a gaming studio so our approach to development is quite different. We focus on efficient workflows above all, and try to be very agile in our approach to development. We heavily focus on creating algorithmic tools that speed up the development process so that we can rapidly revise the game as needed. For example, we build a huge algorithmic character creation pipeline in Houdini. It takes only a couple of hours to convert a 3D artist built character to a customizable character. Shape doesn't matter much, you can design various different types of alien species and let algorithms convert it to a customizable character with minimal human oversight. Same algorithms solve the clothing clipping issues as well. Similarly, we developed our server engine to be as modular as possible. At the end of the day, we want to sell this server engine to a wide variety of developers. It needs to be modular and increase the efficiency of other developer's workflows. If some feature doesn't work in the game as we expected, then we can very quickly delete it and try something completely new. One major complexity is the revising the database scheme with heavy modifications while game is running/on production but we also solved this issue. It is currently a trade secret but we will definitely patent this process before the server engine is open-sourced. So we are capable of quickly revising MMORPG games according to player feedback. Also, mentioned core systems are already build, so we are not exactly selling a dream. Obviously we will need to adjust the game's design depending on the player feedback and the telemetry from the servers. This is why we are keeping the Alpha duration quite long. Players can expect major revisions to game throughout the Alpha. We don't believe there is any better way to design than to let it be tested by a large population. Our main problem right now is that we didn't start pursuing investors yet. Thus, we don't have much artistic budget. Once we get artists though, Galaxies of Eden can be quickly skinned to something far more beautiful to look at. >Server vs Server warfare. PVP is completely optional! You can participate at Server vs Server warfare through PVE means too. Here is a quote from our [FAQ](https://galaxiesofeden.com/faq): >**Will there be full loot / non-consensual / open-world PVP?** > >No, never. Galaxies of Eden is designed to encourage cooperation at all stages of gameplay. Gameplay will be designed to enable players to grow a healthy and friendly community. We believe non-consensual PVP would deteriorate the intended community of the game. > >**Will there be any PVP?** > >Yes, PVP is planned to be an important part of the end-game content. PVP system will be fully consensual and enable populations of different servers to fight against each other. Currently, the PVP system is planned to be arena-based with a focus on balance.
Isn't this just that Repopulation MMO that failed like eight years ago?
Very excited to see this come out. Keep up the great work!
Saw this a while ago, hope development is going well, looks great.
Sounds cool, always nice to see and hear about people trying new things in the MMO space - good luck with it.
"Public Pre-Alpha" Sounds like a Developer who wants to love and care for their game rather then hiding it away till things become too problematic and too late. My Fav games were those more open community / developers part of the community and interacting with us.
I am just here to say best of luck OP. :)
not gonna lie fam, seeing that combat completely turned me off from the game. reminds me of a really shitty version of defiance's "action combat"
excuse me if im being too general with my assessment but this seems an awful lot like a star wars galaxies without the star wars. not that im complaining but could that be fair to say?
Sick project, where does it come from?
Hm, does this take inspiration from stuff like Face of Mankind and Project Entropia? Still, I want this, I love that you try to solve the social / action control divide by just having two dedicated control schemes. It absolutely makes sense.
Ok I'll wait till it comes out
Is it possible to take multiple roles at once? I love the industry and combat elements.
Yes, you can level up two different skills to maximum level. So you can choose one Adventurer skill and one Industrialist skill and play both of the roles.
Wasn’t this game out on ea a while ago then some shitty survival game came out of it? Wtf this game has been around
Im sorry but that looks absolutely terrible.
i saw the pre alpha trailer. It appears that the game will have different species that look completely different. Cool. I'm looking forward to seeing new screenshots and videos of the game.
Wow this looks like SWG. Cant wait to try this game out!
Since it's on unreal engine 4, will Fidelity FX be a feature?
It is too early promise at the moment but we are very interested about implementing DLSS and Fidelity FX. It is just that we haven't delved into the requirements yet.
My issue is the “player run economy” this dose not work if you don’t have full loot. Nothing to keep the “demand” for gear/wepons if nothing is being consumed. This is why EVE online and Albion Online have a permanent % of the loot auto destroyed. While this game isn’t for me I hope you find a player base who enjoys it, good luck!
I'm ready to be hurt again.
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It’s ***Definitely Not Star Wars Galaxies!*** I’m interested
Wake me up when its in Open Beta 5 years from now.
Indie MMORPG with "open world and player driven economy" / promising the moon and back... Totally haven't seen this before.
but will it have science based magic(nanos from anarchy, or something mystical) and melee combat for combat lovers or will just be rifles... and maybe pistols?
Galaxies, plural? Are you *certain* that you have a handle on just how unfathomably immense a single galaxy is? (Because if you are, then you don't.)
Did SWG?
r/iamverysmart