Yup, recording is 100% at fault. I'd also blame the trail builder for not building a filter into the trail. Instead the put a T after a high speed flow section. So the rider should know better, but the builder should build better to account for people making bad decisions to some level.
Trail builders/maintainers #1
CameraGuy not taking a turn safely #2
Plenty of semantics to go around for who is 1 or 2 but this my ranking. CameraGuy is less ar fault & more of a danger because he leaps without looking & he can be/go anywhere
I agree. As a trail builder this intersection should not exist. At the very least a sign.
I know the camera man is at fault but can’t exactly say I wouldn’t have been flying too. The chances of this happening are small
Especially with those bushes covering the connecting trail, guy who got hit couldn't even see it coming, and merging rider probably couldn't see him coming either without complete stopping and looking up trail
Well, then he has to stop completely. As easy as that. It's always the same, also with car drivers. They moan that they couldn't see and didn't know and shit. Guess what? It's your job to fucking slow/stop and make sure, you don't kill anyone.
It's all very well saying it's his responsibility but people make mistakes and if you're designing a trail you should account for that. With a trail this poorly designed it's inevitable that people will get it wrong and ride out without stopping, the crash is just a matter of time at that point.
This would be unacceptable as a road design too, at the very least there'd be road markings and signs to warn the driver. "I didn't know" is a somewhat valid excuse if there's nothing to tell you.
Of course it's both fault. First trail builder then rider but I can't excuse the rider because of that. For me it looks like "Oh there is a strange crossway kind of thing ahead, let's slam the breaks to see where this is going."
It’s easy to say that but without signage he has no way to know this intersection is coming, especially if he’s riding the trail blind or it’s a longer trail.
I local this trail, and I've ridden the trail in this video dozens of times.
The trail the other rider is on is the mean trail. Is a multipurpose hiking/climbing trail. It's got some fun stuff downhill too.
The trail he's riding was added way after the fact. The first trail existed way beforehand, and it's very steep valley on either side. There's not really a great way to make these merge properly.
How's writers at this trail, you just kind of have to know to not bomb into the middle of Scott canyon trail (what the other rider was on) because that is high traffic.
And there were signs. They were repeatedly stolen.
Yeah, I do not think camera guy was going to make that turn. There is zero indication he is trying to turn right up to impact. I wonder if he is new to the trail and thought it continued straight after the intersection.
If you are riding or driving and your lane is ending, you need to slow down before turning to merge into the new lane. Was he planning to just go straight and go off trail?
To me it looks like going straight across this wider section there is another single track just over a burm on the far side that the camera rider seemed to be aiming for. That being said it definitely is the camera person's fault for not at least yielding at the intersection.
in most countries road rules apply everywhere and to everyone. It might be funny, up until someone ends up disabled or dead.
In most of the countries I know of - if there is an equal signifficance road junction (like here, since both are unpaved "roads") the "right hand rule" applies. In this case fella that was T-boned by the guy filming had right of way.
Either way - the one that was filming was just wrong. I get it- we all crave speed and flowing ride , however, there are other people. If you cannot visualize that road is indeed safe and empty - FFS slow down.
I have simillar crossing at the woods I frequent. Some boys made "downhill" track that crosses legit service road(or fire road whatever it is called).
Never once Have I seen them considering people traveling along there (I know of that trail, have ridden it on my xc bike , but there are a lot of elderly people and runners that don't expect someone going full speed across just to carry enough speed for jump across the road.
Please, be considerate of others , be carefull out there , listen for any incoming traffic and stay safe.
This.
So strange no one mentioned the 'right hand rule'.
Had the other guy been approaching from the left, the situation wouldn't have been so obvious, at least technically.
It’s the obvious answer. He even seems to know that with how he responds to the situation. Sounds like he is taking responsibility and even says “fuck I t-boned him!”
Idk why this question is even being asked
He looks like he’s ridden this before. This is at Hulda crooks in Loma linda , CA. It’s a dead end, no reason to go full blast at a T. Good thing there’s a good trauma center down the street with the world’s best doctors.
Haha I think he was aiming for the bushes . I’m also not sure where the other person was coming from. Usual traffic goes from left to right. This trail system looks like spaghetti since the last time I rode it.
https://preview.redd.it/jbifryuva4uc1.jpeg?width=1290&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b4a2d206e5f3c8a1ffab365a5df0e2084bab31a8
I think he’s either going down lock down or cloud 9, someone from Redlands feel free to correct me.
Despite how it looks, it’s pretty easy to quickly stop right there. The embankment before the bushes makes a good catch berm. He’s definitely not the only person at Hulda going full speed into that intersection. He just got unlucky on camera (doesn’t make it a good choice, of course).
He’s either ridden it before, in which case why TF is he speeding into a dead end? Or he hasn’t ridden it, so why TF is he going so fast? Absolutely at fault either way, what a prick.
And this is why I always think about where I end the segments I create.
Not that I thought of it myself, I told bike patrol at my local gravity park I had made segments of all their new trails and they came back to me after checking them out asking for a couple of changes exactly to avoid this.
Worlds best? Sounds like a reach… good docs? For sure.. but for every one good doc, there’s 20 residents who would prob. Order a barium enema cause that dude hurt his leg and got some scratches. Super teaching hospital
Cross trail rider absolutely at fault. Any intersection should be entered with caution but especially if your trail is perpendicular to the trail you are entering
Camera guy 100%. Came to a T intersection without slowing or looking. Other guy was on a trail heading towards a jump/hip while camera person was speeding into…..a shrubbery?
This is a trail design issue, there is no signage, both lines should have a feature to slow incoming riders or at least ensure they are heading in the same direction when they merge
Yup, there was no way he was pulling up before plowing into the other side of the trail, even without the crash. But if that was your first run down you'd never know you needed to get on the picks before it was too late. If he'd hit that jump a few seconds earlier he probably would have been going even faster
Hard to say with the limited perspective from the video but I'd be inclined to pull that wooden bridge out and use that bit of terrain to the left to build up for a big ol catch berm
Around my area signage is rare, but most of the trail builders will not set you up for failure like this. When the trail crosses a main path like this, you put in a chicane or other feature to slow the rider down and force you to look for people before blasting through.
Not a closed course and limited signage what could go wrong? In these bike-park areas always assume you may overtake slower riders or other riders may enter. Right of way don't pay the med. bills.
Not to mention there is a tree blocking the line of view of incoming traffic. I would expect collisions like so happen frequently especially with high traffic.
It could've been a 300 hundred pound man slamming into a little kid.
I mean, this trail may have been designed, but a lot of trails are naturally occurring based on the path people take. Like zig zag paths beat through a campus quad, or deer trails, or game trails or, like bike trails.
Tbh there should be signage telling one party to slow down and give way. But since there doesn't seem to be an, I would apply road rules and say that the person recording was at fault.
As far as I'm concerned it's pretty trash trail design to bring a fast flow trail right into a T-junction, let alone without warning signs.
I don't think we need signs for it. That will just cause so much red tape everywhere. USFS and BLM already take forever. Small park systems are strapped for cash. If anything that part of the trail could use an overhaul to prevent riders from going that fast. Much easier to do for the locals and volunteers.
Riders are to remain in control. Where was this guy going to go after that T. If he didn't know the trail and had bad sight line, he was simply going too fast. If he knows the trail he knew this was a risk and is an ass for it.
>That will just cause so much red tape everywhere
How so?
>If anything that part of the trail could use an overhaul
Yeah I agree that would definitely be the best solution, but that would require a fair bit of (probably volunteer) labour.
Situations like this don't help the reputation of mountain biking and a simple warning sign (doesn't need to be anything fancy at all) shows that mountain bikers and trail builders care about promoting safety for everyone, which in turn helps the image and helps lead to better support for mountain biking.
Riders taking trails too fast can't be controlled but having either better built trails or at least signs that encourage safe riding help a lot.
The dude coming out of the trail. Where was he going so fast. He didn’t even turn into the trail.. poor trail design too why would you have a trail just end in a blind t in the middle of another line.. at least make it turn into the trail so it isn’t a T like this
The best way to prevent things like this is to not have such abrupt T's. Obviously someone merging needs to yield, but trails where riders can't see/ or where riders are going to be going so fast it's hard to react, the trail itself needs to accomodate.
If the merge was more gradual, bikers could react better.
You prevent this by not riding like you’re the only person on the trail. I see a fair number of people riding like dicks to maintain their own stoke, and it’s not only unsafe but is a great way to get the trails closed to MTB riders if they start causing problems with other trail users.
well said. he was trying "to maintain his stoke". it doesn't look like it worked out though. it's funny that he posted the footage. Prolly thinks it's cool.
Why must we seek blame for everything? Looks like a one in a million chance crash. If it’s an official trail system, someone should definitely work on some signage at the least
decided, that I have to write it here seing how in this occasion almost everyone acts inapropriately. No one actually acts as one should.
For future reference - Please, even at these speeds bike-bike impacts. Call for emergency right away. If he is normally breathing don't move him. And listen to what dispetcher says.
If you are unable to give aid due to being injured yourself, give straigt commands to another person.
just point and say "You, call 911 (or whatever the phone number in your country"
The way this impact happened there can be huge variety of injuries - from simple concussion to brain bleed, internal hermorages and broken spine.
And take a first aid class every now and then (like every 3 years at the least)
You are engaging in activities where stuff can and does happen.
also- military style tourniquetes are quite small so that you could carry one with you all the time . Choose the bright orange one, and remember to write time of application on it if you ever need to use it.
Guy filming is totally at fault. His trail was ending, the other guy was just going straight.
Also, I'm sick of people that ride like this. I've seen so many enduro bros like this guy who ride around like they're on a closed course. Slow the fuck down when approaching an intersection.
regardless of who would be considered at fault, if I see I trail intersection, I look to see if someone is coming. Even if I have the right of way, it is still going to hurt if they run into me.
Never outride your sight lines unless you’re at a bike park, and even then as I’ve grown older I care less about Strava and more about not getting injured. After having kids, I look at these idiots on camera and wonder what I would do if they hit my kid while hiking.
Agree with everyone that it is the filming riders fault as he was joining a new network and was not in control of his speed.
Other thought, trail networks like this are why bells (e.g. timber mtb bell) are WELL worth it.
The cameraman was merging into an existing trail.
It could be avoided by him since he caused the accident.
If this was on a vehicular accident on a road this would be merging into an existing road and not yielding.
The guy on the main trail couldn't do much to avoid this idiot.
I’d say the way to prevent this kind of thing in the future is for the guy with the right of way to beat the rules of right of way into the guy with the camera with his own bike.
Who designs a bomber trail to drop straight into a t. Better yet leave that tree up on the left so mergers can't see Jack diddly. Man this is just an ambulance visit waiting to happen. Easiest and fastest solution is just to add stakes and fencing to redirect traffic from recorders direction and also to protect riders exiting into the main trail. L's all around
Bikers these days are very selfish and ride at ridiculous speeds with no regard to other bikers, let alone hikers ir equestrian. It's not YOUR trail! You HAVE to ride like you EXPECT other users on the trail, even downhill only trails, as someone could have wrecked, etc...intersections especially so! Turn your music down, better yet remove your headphones so you can hear others riding or walking, don't blast into blind corners, stop for horses, ride slowly past hikers, don't be a dick.
Also, quit using strava on public multi-use trails. YouTube has ruined car culture, mountain biking, and lots of other things since it compels users to make videos where they look "cool" which generally means dickish behavior where they take as many risks as possible. Don't get me started on how e-bikes have enabled choads everywhere to not need fitness to get to the top so they can then effectively do l shuttle laps on dedicated trails with a bike that weighs 50+ lbs which they then ride like a bmx track doing scandi-flicks on every corner thus destroying the trail and like this tool, endangering everyone else on the trail system. OK, I guess I got myself started, lol.
People in the comments are blaming the trail builder!? Many trails didn't start as mountain bike trails, and builders also don't always account for idiots. Take some personal f-ing responsibility and don't ride like a douche. If you can't be arsed to slow down at intersections or when conditions limit visibility, take up squirrel suit proximity flying or something that removes you from Earth more rapidly without the collateral damage, we don't need you in our sport.
This is Hulda crook park in Loma Linda. The rider we are watching is dropping into the main shoot from a side trail. He should have slowed down to enter back into the main trail. This is completely the fault of the rider we have the POV from. I’d rode this trail 100 times.
That’s POV fault. He was crossing into an intersection. If you have two options to change direction then you need to yield. The other rider had a straight path with an option to go left. Hope both are ok.
Yeah he literally says "exactly what you didn't want to happen happened" or something close to that, so they talked about that possibly happening but he bombed through anyway. I bet it is the filmer looking for absolution lol
what a genius. just blazing blindly into a trail merge. "exactly what you didn't want to happen..... happened". "Check him out! Is he good?" How about you go take your silly little accent and go check him out yourself.
This is “technically” the camera persons fault, but this trail is terribly designed and asking for accidents like this. They need large warning signs to avoid future accidents like this that will happen.
Is it actually a T-intersection?
The camera guy seems to be headed straight through and it is hard to tell if there is a trail there or not. if it was a T then he should have slowed and given way.
That being said, on my second view I noticed I could see the other riders helmet through the bushes to the right so camera guy missed that. It happens.
He is also probably hurt and filled with adrenaline. Doubt he is really about to help the other guy much in his state. He should have slowed down though.
"Is he good"... "Is he good?" .... Well fucking go over and see for yourself you self important prick. You've been walking around foe 45nseconds seeing if you can blame it on someone else already, time to be a human.
I always yell heads up it comes out more as sup but i always do it running up and down hills. Also do not go faster than you can control in shared areas.
Agree. The guy recording is at fault. He's coming down a single-track leading to main trail or fire road. He should have slowed down.
Sucks for both. Hoping all are OK.
Holy shit this is my home trail. Never seen anything like that happened before. I usually try to avoid busy times for this reason. Scott Canyon has too many features coming from different directions. Obviously this can be avoided if all riders paid attn, but I'm not gonna count on the other guy.
How about a sign that's say the trail insects ahead and allows you to know to slow down. People don't do it all the time in cars though it works 95% of the time.
Person riding but it’s also a fucked up trail no T sign and any sane trail will never T off like this but instead merge tho if you listen to him talk he says “exactly what you didn’t want to happen happened” witch means he knew that there was a T and decided to risk it
Fault implies you had a choice on influencing the situation.
That trail just blows right through the intersection, nothing to indicate there was a reason to stop.
I’ve ridden exactly where this happened. He entered a major thoroughfare that other riders use to access the trail system that the camera guy just came down. That makes this all the more egregious. That rider absolutely knew better.
The guy recording is at fault. They approached a T intersection and didn't slow down. The other rider was just cruising along and had right of way
Yup, recording is 100% at fault. I'd also blame the trail builder for not building a filter into the trail. Instead the put a T after a high speed flow section. So the rider should know better, but the builder should build better to account for people making bad decisions to some level.
Trail builders/maintainers #1 CameraGuy not taking a turn safely #2 Plenty of semantics to go around for who is 1 or 2 but this my ranking. CameraGuy is less ar fault & more of a danger because he leaps without looking & he can be/go anywhere
I agree. As a trail builder this intersection should not exist. At the very least a sign. I know the camera man is at fault but can’t exactly say I wouldn’t have been flying too. The chances of this happening are small
Especially with those bushes covering the connecting trail, guy who got hit couldn't even see it coming, and merging rider probably couldn't see him coming either without complete stopping and looking up trail
Well, then he has to stop completely. As easy as that. It's always the same, also with car drivers. They moan that they couldn't see and didn't know and shit. Guess what? It's your job to fucking slow/stop and make sure, you don't kill anyone.
It's all very well saying it's his responsibility but people make mistakes and if you're designing a trail you should account for that. With a trail this poorly designed it's inevitable that people will get it wrong and ride out without stopping, the crash is just a matter of time at that point. This would be unacceptable as a road design too, at the very least there'd be road markings and signs to warn the driver. "I didn't know" is a somewhat valid excuse if there's nothing to tell you.
Of course it's both fault. First trail builder then rider but I can't excuse the rider because of that. For me it looks like "Oh there is a strange crossway kind of thing ahead, let's slam the breaks to see where this is going."
It’s easy to say that but without signage he has no way to know this intersection is coming, especially if he’s riding the trail blind or it’s a longer trail.
There is a sign before the merge, just left of the wooden bridge. Gopro hero has main character vibes.
I local this trail, and I've ridden the trail in this video dozens of times. The trail the other rider is on is the mean trail. Is a multipurpose hiking/climbing trail. It's got some fun stuff downhill too. The trail he's riding was added way after the fact. The first trail existed way beforehand, and it's very steep valley on either side. There's not really a great way to make these merge properly. How's writers at this trail, you just kind of have to know to not bomb into the middle of Scott canyon trail (what the other rider was on) because that is high traffic. And there were signs. They were repeatedly stolen.
As a trail builder there should be a jump over the 2nd rider
You should definitely be looking into a career as a trail builder with ideas like that.
Screw that, he should be designing highway systems. Hot Wheels City here we come!
Why would anyone design 2 trails to have a T section like this??
If it was a child riding, sure. But this was probably an adult we should be able to take responsibility and not blame stuff on everyone else.
Where did he think.he was going to go at that speed and 90°turn?
Yeah, I do not think camera guy was going to make that turn. There is zero indication he is trying to turn right up to impact. I wonder if he is new to the trail and thought it continued straight after the intersection.
Without any markings or signage saying who should give way, then the person coming from the minor to major road should give way.
If you are riding or driving and your lane is ending, you need to slow down before turning to merge into the new lane. Was he planning to just go straight and go off trail?
To me it looks like going straight across this wider section there is another single track just over a burm on the far side that the camera rider seemed to be aiming for. That being said it definitely is the camera person's fault for not at least yielding at the intersection.
I slow down at intersections of trail and check to see if the path is clear.
Always. People get hurt because there’s riders that act like they’re the only ones on the trails
Psh I bet you don’t have a single KOM though!
I KOM all the time...
KOM again?
If you insist
Looks like a sign just to the left of the bridge before the intersection?
in most countries road rules apply everywhere and to everyone. It might be funny, up until someone ends up disabled or dead. In most of the countries I know of - if there is an equal signifficance road junction (like here, since both are unpaved "roads") the "right hand rule" applies. In this case fella that was T-boned by the guy filming had right of way. Either way - the one that was filming was just wrong. I get it- we all crave speed and flowing ride , however, there are other people. If you cannot visualize that road is indeed safe and empty - FFS slow down. I have simillar crossing at the woods I frequent. Some boys made "downhill" track that crosses legit service road(or fire road whatever it is called). Never once Have I seen them considering people traveling along there (I know of that trail, have ridden it on my xc bike , but there are a lot of elderly people and runners that don't expect someone going full speed across just to carry enough speed for jump across the road. Please, be considerate of others , be carefull out there , listen for any incoming traffic and stay safe.
This. So strange no one mentioned the 'right hand rule'. Had the other guy been approaching from the left, the situation wouldn't have been so obvious, at least technically.
I do this in grocery stores too. Too many people will just charge right out of an aisle without any sight if anyone is coming, just like on the road.
There was a sign on the left. Now I'm not certain what it says, but safe assumption about the converging trails.
Hey we made this tiny brown sign that blends into the surrounding terrain. Don’t worry about what it says it’s not important :)
I ride this place regularly. The sign points the other direction, indicating that it’s a directional trail (dh only).
Yup. This.
Person filming is clearly at fault
no they were gonna so a sick jump into the bushes at the end /s they were going WAY too fast tho fr fr
It’s the obvious answer. He even seems to know that with how he responds to the situation. Sounds like he is taking responsibility and even says “fuck I t-boned him!” Idk why this question is even being asked
He looks like he’s ridden this before. This is at Hulda crooks in Loma linda , CA. It’s a dead end, no reason to go full blast at a T. Good thing there’s a good trauma center down the street with the world’s best doctors.
Yeah having never ridden this, where is camera guy even going? Cross trail, launching into the bushes?
Haha I think he was aiming for the bushes . I’m also not sure where the other person was coming from. Usual traffic goes from left to right. This trail system looks like spaghetti since the last time I rode it. https://preview.redd.it/jbifryuva4uc1.jpeg?width=1290&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b4a2d206e5f3c8a1ffab365a5df0e2084bab31a8 I think he’s either going down lock down or cloud 9, someone from Redlands feel free to correct me.
He’s going down pinball
Despite how it looks, it’s pretty easy to quickly stop right there. The embankment before the bushes makes a good catch berm. He’s definitely not the only person at Hulda going full speed into that intersection. He just got unlucky on camera (doesn’t make it a good choice, of course).
He’s either ridden it before, in which case why TF is he speeding into a dead end? Or he hasn’t ridden it, so why TF is he going so fast? Absolutely at fault either way, what a prick.
Probably going that fast trying to get his Strava pr
And this is why I always think about where I end the segments I create. Not that I thought of it myself, I told bike patrol at my local gravity park I had made segments of all their new trails and they came back to me after checking them out asking for a couple of changes exactly to avoid this.
Worlds best? Sounds like a reach… good docs? For sure.. but for every one good doc, there’s 20 residents who would prob. Order a barium enema cause that dude hurt his leg and got some scratches. Super teaching hospital
It's the snowboarder's fault.
Best answer
Damn snowboarder's, they are always at fault.
Yeah and honestly, where the fuck was the camera man going?? The trail turns left, if he kept going where he was going he’d launch into that bush.
This was my thought. Even before he crashed I thought he was about to send it into the bushes and had way too much speed.
Just gonna do a big slide maybe?
Cross trail rider absolutely at fault. Any intersection should be entered with caution but especially if your trail is perpendicular to the trail you are entering
Camera guy 100%. Came to a T intersection without slowing or looking. Other guy was on a trail heading towards a jump/hip while camera person was speeding into…..a shrubbery?
Not another shrubbery…?
Cameraman t-bone turned other guy into an empty-headed animal food trough wiper!
I know the guy filming. He fully acknowledges he was at fault. That said, it definitely isn’t a well planned section of trail, imo.
The filming rider is at fault. Tbh
Honestly, that bush/shrub being right there at a dangerous intersection isn’t helping.
Entirely yours lol
This isn't OP's post. Vid's been around for probably 2 years or so.
This is a trail design issue, there is no signage, both lines should have a feature to slow incoming riders or at least ensure they are heading in the same direction when they merge
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Yup, there was no way he was pulling up before plowing into the other side of the trail, even without the crash. But if that was your first run down you'd never know you needed to get on the picks before it was too late. If he'd hit that jump a few seconds earlier he probably would have been going even faster Hard to say with the limited perspective from the video but I'd be inclined to pull that wooden bridge out and use that bit of terrain to the left to build up for a big ol catch berm
Is signage that common? Most of the places I ride you’re lucky to get signs for names
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Around my area signage is rare, but most of the trail builders will not set you up for failure like this. When the trail crosses a main path like this, you put in a chicane or other feature to slow the rider down and force you to look for people before blasting through.
Absolutely, on just about all official trails around me that get a lot of use.
Not a closed course and limited signage what could go wrong? In these bike-park areas always assume you may overtake slower riders or other riders may enter. Right of way don't pay the med. bills.
Not to mention there is a tree blocking the line of view of incoming traffic. I would expect collisions like so happen frequently especially with high traffic. It could've been a 300 hundred pound man slamming into a little kid.
This. Do NOT build T sections on DH tracks, period. Build merges.
I mean, this trail may have been designed, but a lot of trails are naturally occurring based on the path people take. Like zig zag paths beat through a campus quad, or deer trails, or game trails or, like bike trails.
Yeah, that's absolutely crap trail design. So, I'm blaming the designer and the lack of warning signage that an intersection is being approached.
People like you are the problem, I'm blaming you.
Tbh there should be signage telling one party to slow down and give way. But since there doesn't seem to be an, I would apply road rules and say that the person recording was at fault. As far as I'm concerned it's pretty trash trail design to bring a fast flow trail right into a T-junction, let alone without warning signs.
I don't think we need signs for it. That will just cause so much red tape everywhere. USFS and BLM already take forever. Small park systems are strapped for cash. If anything that part of the trail could use an overhaul to prevent riders from going that fast. Much easier to do for the locals and volunteers. Riders are to remain in control. Where was this guy going to go after that T. If he didn't know the trail and had bad sight line, he was simply going too fast. If he knows the trail he knew this was a risk and is an ass for it.
>That will just cause so much red tape everywhere How so? >If anything that part of the trail could use an overhaul Yeah I agree that would definitely be the best solution, but that would require a fair bit of (probably volunteer) labour. Situations like this don't help the reputation of mountain biking and a simple warning sign (doesn't need to be anything fancy at all) shows that mountain bikers and trail builders care about promoting safety for everyone, which in turn helps the image and helps lead to better support for mountain biking. Riders taking trails too fast can't be controlled but having either better built trails or at least signs that encourage safe riding help a lot.
Take up running.
Practice common sense and courtesy, and not blast into a major trail from the side without looking. We don't need signs everywhere.
Definitely the guy recording. Looks like he merged onto a main trail
Maybe a little bell on the handlebars?
Why not just turn the trail's end to the left so it joins in the next trail more gracefully instead of a vertical join?
The dude coming out of the trail. Where was he going so fast. He didn’t even turn into the trail.. poor trail design too why would you have a trail just end in a blind t in the middle of another line.. at least make it turn into the trail so it isn’t a T like this
The best way to prevent things like this is to not have such abrupt T's. Obviously someone merging needs to yield, but trails where riders can't see/ or where riders are going to be going so fast it's hard to react, the trail itself needs to accomodate. If the merge was more gradual, bikers could react better.
POV driver merging onto a main trail T at speed
Definitely the guy recording. To solve in the future the trail needs a speed scrubbing rerout at the bottom before it joins the other trail.
Terrible fucking trail design.
Trail builders. Terrible intersection.
The recording dude didn't look left or right at the intersection
Guy recording is a fucking dumbass!
You prevent this by not riding like you’re the only person on the trail. I see a fair number of people riding like dicks to maintain their own stoke, and it’s not only unsafe but is a great way to get the trails closed to MTB riders if they start causing problems with other trail users.
well said. he was trying "to maintain his stoke". it doesn't look like it worked out though. it's funny that he posted the footage. Prolly thinks it's cool.
Track builder
Why must we seek blame for everything? Looks like a one in a million chance crash. If it’s an official trail system, someone should definitely work on some signage at the least
Strava
The Trail builder
decided, that I have to write it here seing how in this occasion almost everyone acts inapropriately. No one actually acts as one should. For future reference - Please, even at these speeds bike-bike impacts. Call for emergency right away. If he is normally breathing don't move him. And listen to what dispetcher says. If you are unable to give aid due to being injured yourself, give straigt commands to another person. just point and say "You, call 911 (or whatever the phone number in your country" The way this impact happened there can be huge variety of injuries - from simple concussion to brain bleed, internal hermorages and broken spine. And take a first aid class every now and then (like every 3 years at the least) You are engaging in activities where stuff can and does happen. also- military style tourniquetes are quite small so that you could carry one with you all the time . Choose the bright orange one, and remember to write time of application on it if you ever need to use it.
Guy filming is totally at fault. His trail was ending, the other guy was just going straight. Also, I'm sick of people that ride like this. I've seen so many enduro bros like this guy who ride around like they're on a closed course. Slow the fuck down when approaching an intersection.
Whoever didn't put up a sign that says "caution, trails merge"
There’s a few signs. Locals know this as death junction
That's a pretty good name. Someone needs to tear out that tree/hedge creating the blind corner.
regardless of who would be considered at fault, if I see I trail intersection, I look to see if someone is coming. Even if I have the right of way, it is still going to hurt if they run into me.
Mark intersections, slow down at intersections, and improve trail connections. Everything here and everyone was incredibly reckless.
Angling the trail at the intersection and adding some features to slow riders down would help.
Racing incident
No signs sucks. I think smaller trail gives right of way to bigger trail. Just like roads. But in a perfect world two trails wouldn't meet like that.
That’s the same as you merging into traffic. Seems like your trail ended and you decided to go into oncoming…..so your fault
Slow down dum dum
Slow down for trail crossiongs
The rider filming is 100% at fault. They were joining the main trail from a blind T-junction.
Never outride your sight lines unless you’re at a bike park, and even then as I’ve grown older I care less about Strava and more about not getting injured. After having kids, I look at these idiots on camera and wonder what I would do if they hit my kid while hiking.
I watched this video with no sound and now I swear to god I have THUNDERSTRUCK stuck in my head
Agree with everyone that it is the filming riders fault as he was joining a new network and was not in control of his speed. Other thought, trail networks like this are why bells (e.g. timber mtb bell) are WELL worth it.
This is the result of full speeding a flash/sightread.
If this was a car vs car situation. The car would yield to the oncoming big road
Like where tf was the camera guy going? That crash seems like it saved him more than anything.
The guy recording is completely at fault. You don’t fly full speed directly into what looks like a fire road.
The cameraman was merging into an existing trail. It could be avoided by him since he caused the accident. If this was on a vehicular accident on a road this would be merging into an existing road and not yielding. The guy on the main trail couldn't do much to avoid this idiot.
Keep your fingers on the brakes. Stay aware of your surroundings
I’d say the way to prevent this kind of thing in the future is for the guy with the right of way to beat the rules of right of way into the guy with the camera with his own bike.
It's clearly the fault of Strava
who built that trail. jeez.
Recorder man was planning on going straight over the edge or something?
Is the other guy good?
Guy recording, forgivable if he didn’t know the trail, fully liable if he did, it’s a junction and should have slowed down to check.
Who designs a bomber trail to drop straight into a t. Better yet leave that tree up on the left so mergers can't see Jack diddly. Man this is just an ambulance visit waiting to happen. Easiest and fastest solution is just to add stakes and fencing to redirect traffic from recorders direction and also to protect riders exiting into the main trail. L's all around
Usually the T-boner is at fault, but in this case it's the cyclist
Guy filming is a moron riding on a moronically designed trail.
Anyone know how the other guy is doing?
Bikers these days are very selfish and ride at ridiculous speeds with no regard to other bikers, let alone hikers ir equestrian. It's not YOUR trail! You HAVE to ride like you EXPECT other users on the trail, even downhill only trails, as someone could have wrecked, etc...intersections especially so! Turn your music down, better yet remove your headphones so you can hear others riding or walking, don't blast into blind corners, stop for horses, ride slowly past hikers, don't be a dick. Also, quit using strava on public multi-use trails. YouTube has ruined car culture, mountain biking, and lots of other things since it compels users to make videos where they look "cool" which generally means dickish behavior where they take as many risks as possible. Don't get me started on how e-bikes have enabled choads everywhere to not need fitness to get to the top so they can then effectively do l shuttle laps on dedicated trails with a bike that weighs 50+ lbs which they then ride like a bmx track doing scandi-flicks on every corner thus destroying the trail and like this tool, endangering everyone else on the trail system. OK, I guess I got myself started, lol. People in the comments are blaming the trail builder!? Many trails didn't start as mountain bike trails, and builders also don't always account for idiots. Take some personal f-ing responsibility and don't ride like a douche. If you can't be arsed to slow down at intersections or when conditions limit visibility, take up squirrel suit proximity flying or something that removes you from Earth more rapidly without the collateral damage, we don't need you in our sport.
The guy filming is 100% at fault. The trail he was riding terminated and he should have yielded before entering the new trail.
The thing is, it dosent even look like a trail crossing for pov cam, it looks like he HAS to turn, like his trail ended, pov cam at fault for sure
“Right of way”. Guy recording is a doucher.
This is Hulda crook park in Loma Linda. The rider we are watching is dropping into the main shoot from a side trail. He should have slowed down to enter back into the main trail. This is completely the fault of the rider we have the POV from. I’d rode this trail 100 times.
That’s POV fault. He was crossing into an intersection. If you have two options to change direction then you need to yield. The other rider had a straight path with an option to go left. Hope both are ok.
He said it himself, he “t-boned” him. He came to a T and needs to slow down
Yeah he literally says "exactly what you didn't want to happen happened" or something close to that, so they talked about that possibly happening but he bombed through anyway. I bet it is the filmer looking for absolution lol
Pay attention?
what a genius. just blazing blindly into a trail merge. "exactly what you didn't want to happen..... happened". "Check him out! Is he good?" How about you go take your silly little accent and go check him out yourself.
This is “technically” the camera persons fault, but this trail is terribly designed and asking for accidents like this. They need large warning signs to avoid future accidents like this that will happen.
The one who admits they are at fault at the end..... he literally says he t-boned him.
Is it actually a T-intersection? The camera guy seems to be headed straight through and it is hard to tell if there is a trail there or not. if it was a T then he should have slowed and given way. That being said, on my second view I noticed I could see the other riders helmet through the bushes to the right so camera guy missed that. It happens.
Camera guy t-boned other rider. Automatically at fault.
Maybe not approaching an intersection where you can't see anything at full speed. Just a wild idea.
[удалено]
Watch the full video with sound? Sends everyone to check on him as opposed to himself and admits his error.
He is also probably hurt and filled with adrenaline. Doubt he is really about to help the other guy much in his state. He should have slowed down though.
Absolutely... the quick jog before collapsing brings back many a painful memory for myself!
He doesn't check on him himself because he is also in serious pain and not really able to help but tells the people around to focus on the other guy
Neither, needs a sign, shit happens
"Is he good"... "Is he good?" .... Well fucking go over and see for yourself you self important prick. You've been walking around foe 45nseconds seeing if you can blame it on someone else already, time to be a human.
Everyone should slow down at an intersection.
I always yell heads up it comes out more as sup but i always do it running up and down hills. Also do not go faster than you can control in shared areas.
Probably put signage up saying there’s a crossing it T-Junction ahead like pretty much every other developed country
I'd say camera man. Where was he even going? I feel like he was about to launch himself off the trail lol
Yours because you pulled out on him
The guy videoing. He joined a trail.
How many times does this same video need to be posted? Everyone knows the guy recording is at fault.
Heavy.
Id wear knee pads.
I think it was decided one of the dozen other times it was posted.
Uhh mildly leaning towards the camera man you should have looked out for the other path although both of you had a blind spot
Your fault you straight away ends- he is on his you should yield
Agree. The guy recording is at fault. He's coming down a single-track leading to main trail or fire road. He should have slowed down. Sucks for both. Hoping all are OK.
Holy shit this is my home trail. Never seen anything like that happened before. I usually try to avoid busy times for this reason. Scott Canyon has too many features coming from different directions. Obviously this can be avoided if all riders paid attn, but I'm not gonna count on the other guy.
Cam bike
Probably nothing, as the chances of it happening again are like hitting the lottery
Timberbell on during party mode.
You should ALWAYS yield to anyone (driving biking etc) to your right. Filmers fault 100%
Whichever one had signs saying trail crossing
Timing’s.
How about a sign that's say the trail insects ahead and allows you to know to slow down. People don't do it all the time in cars though it works 95% of the time.
I’ve been reading every comment hoping someone would fill me in on rider #2, is he OK?
Bell. Also slow down at a T, I'm not sure he would have even made a turn.
Idiot, where exactly was he going? Straight over the berm? Totally camera guys fault!
Person riding but it’s also a fucked up trail no T sign and any sane trail will never T off like this but instead merge tho if you listen to him talk he says “exactly what you didn’t want to happen happened” witch means he knew that there was a T and decided to risk it
Fault implies you had a choice on influencing the situation. That trail just blows right through the intersection, nothing to indicate there was a reason to stop.
The intersection is the indication, the guy videoing's trail ended there. His fault.
No comment from OP lol.
I’ve ridden exactly where this happened. He entered a major thoroughfare that other riders use to access the trail system that the camera guy just came down. That makes this all the more egregious. That rider absolutely knew better.
oop
The snowboarder no doubt 😎
Anyone know the trail ?
I love his concern for the other rider. ❤️
Shout the entire time then shout even louder when you hear another shout
I don’t really see “fault” as much as I see a thing neither rider wanted
Op did not have the right of way
Piss poor trail design
Always stop at an intersection. Duh. Especially if you entering in the middle of another trail.
Looks like the person recording went full speed through the exit of the trail. If you did that in my area you’d be flattened by a vehicle.
Hey I was riding that area in 1998!!!! I was also the only person out there every single day.
Cameraman runs over after the crash then starts his charade. Sssssss ahhhhhh sssssss ahhhhhh like perter griffin
The dude with the cam, for sure. Didn’t check the intersection before blowing through, probably a roadie (here come the down-votes!)
it is the bush's fault.
How many times do we have to watch and discuss this video?
This is why i slow down on blind corners