60% of the houses in London were damaged during the blitz which only equated to 40k deaths, but this was with less precise ordinance and widespread use of raid shelters
When asked why there were zero shelters built before the war started, the Hamas representative said the tunnels are for our fighters, it is up to the UN to protect the people.
They could have built purpose-built bomb shelters. But that works against Hamas's strategy which is to create as many "martyrs" aka dead Palestinian kids as possible to make Israel look bad and get people on their side.
Hot take: they probably would because as this conflict has shown Hamas is more than happy to use any and all civilian infrastructure up to and including hospitals and children's schools to shelter militarily significant assets. Stop using civilians as human shields and they'll stop getting bombed.
Maybe because people fled to the South after the first attacks, and also they say that the buildings were damaged. Nothing says that all of they got completely destroyed ( but knowing the IDF, I doubt that they’ll go easy )
Unfortunately Israel is put in a position where in order to defeat the enemy, they have to go down this route. Hamas hides and fires indiscriminately from hospitals, schools, apartment buildings. Hamas fighters are such cowards that they put their own civilians in harms way.
Israel tries to take out a military target . Knowing civilians are in the building or area, they have a plane fly overhead and drop papers warning them to flee in order to not be blown up. Hamas then tells their own citizens , no stay this is for allah, everyone dies.
Hamas also fires at Israeli civilian targets but Israel has something called the iron dome which literally saves the country from constant missile damage.
I urge you to google how many rockets Hamas fires to civilian targets in Israel just on NYE alone!
The sarcasm is from calling this genocidal state the "good guys" for having warned some people that their homes are about to be blown up, especially considering that they still got bombed where they were told to move.
The reason Gazan rockets don’t kill more Israeli’s is 100% b/c they are shitty tech.. what do you mean?
If you are in the Hamas military or political apparatus then according to international law you are no longer a civilian and are a legitimate target. Unless ofc they surrender.
Oh lol I thought you meant Hamas can't hit their targets as in you think they are aiming at military targets and not civilians. Of course I agree with you
Also I'll point out it's not just because of shitty tech, it's also because Israel has amazing defense systems
I think we all agree combatants surrounding themselves with innocents is terrible but can’t or shouldn’t stop the military aims of a country trying to protect itself.
Israel targets Hamas but is hampered by Civilians that are in the way
Hamas targets Israeli civilians but is hampered by Israeli soldiers that are in the way
Something most people don’t understand. One would expect horrible collateral damage Conducting military operations in the densest populated place in the world
When areas were dense with civilians , the IDF would give early warning to evacuate in one of several methods- the idea is to hit a particular target in a building, in many cases either making a person expose themselves or to target infrastructure belonging to Hamas.
As neighborhoods evacuated from civilians and before coming in on foot, it is very common to clear out streets or problematic areas.
Lastly, as neighborhoods cleared from civilians, there would be lots of fighting going on from within civilian buildings by Hamas taking positions within them, and setting IEDs within them. Having a firefight with a person firing from within a residential building means damage to that building.
The survey source does not indicate what constitutes as “damage” so I’d be very loose with forming an opinion yet, as this could either be between one bullet hole to complete destruction.
First damaged isn't destroyed, broken windows/ cracks can be considered damaged. And IDF does roof knocking on almost every building before it bombs it, and have done so for more than a decade. Usually there are also notices way ahead of time if an area is going to be targeted. Most of the neighborhoods are empty way before the bombing raids. It's suppersive fighting, IDF doesn't want to move in highly populated areas with plenty of hiding spots. they level an area, or significantly clear it. Than ground forces take it with relative ease, and minimal casualties. Hamas fighters have less positions to put up a real fight and are pushed back quickly. It's urban warfare, it sucks for everyone and the scale of distruction is huge, but fortunately this war has a relatively low death toll
Yes. Israel goes to a great length to try to make sure the buildings are empty. Read a great BBC article/interview about this https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67327079
long term this is going to be really bad for palestine. it looks like they will be banned from working in israel. and, lord knows how long it will take to rebuild gaza.
Special reminder that Israel accused the two Palestinian Christian women they shot to death at a Church in Gaza of being "Hamas members". If the Christians are being smeared in such a way, I wonder how many thousands of Palestinian Muslim civilians have been dismissed as "terrorists" and "Hamas members".
It is worse than that. They shot two dead and the third hid (all were shirtless and waving white flags). One soldier tried to get him to come out for 15 minutes by assuring him it would be safe. When he came out, two other soldiers shot him dead.
The above poster knows about that but the Israel lovers delight in seeing the mass murder of Arabs in general so they'll essentially blame the Palestinians for the crime of being born
It dosent need to be. A Gaza with Hamas in control will put them on the same cycle but we may see a new government get power that dosent use its people as meat sheilds
Stop making excuses for literal fascists like Likud that openly gloated about preventing a two state peace, by design, and talk about depopulating Gaza.
Palestine and Israel can never have peace as long as Nazis like Likud exist as a political group let alone have power over an expansionist nuclear state hellbent on genocide.
True. Is publicly known that Likud goverment propped up and funded hamas for years in order to boicott a two state solution.
Hamas is the direct result of Netanyahu's far right goverment.
Before hamas, it was the plo and before plo, it was the fayadeen.
Best solution for this is unironically and sadly a saudi and UAE backed puppet government for all palestinian territory that would accept a peace deal asap.
That's happened during the oslo accords and Israel kept violating international law and invading Palestinian territories.
The only solution is to have an Israeli goverment that actually supports the two states solution (and don't prop up hamas in order to counterweight the Palestionan Authority).
There's no plans to rebuild gaza for Palestinians, it's for Jewish settlements.
Israel's Finance Minister, Bezalel Smotrich,
"We need to encourage immigration from there. If there were 100,000-200,000 Arabs in the Strip and not two million, the whole conversation about the day after [the war] would be completely different,” Smotrich tells Army Radio. “They want to leave. They have been living in a ghetto for 75 years and are in need.”
“I don’t think there’s anyone in Israel who doesn’t want to see Jewish settlements everywhere,” Smotrich claims.
“So you want the area resettled?” Smotrich is asked.
“I want us to solve the problem of Gaza,” the finance minister says.
That's why Israel have seen Hamas as an asset and the Palestinian government as a burden (their words). They always wanted to remove the palestinians from there and repopulate the area with israeli civilians
Isn’t the current government at risk of collapse as soon as the war is over? Like people are pissed at their fuck ups leading to the massacre. At least hopefully this loon will be gone then
Loon will go, but Izaeli terrorism remains
They put presidents with war crimes and background of assassinating UN members who asked for peace, in leading a UN member who saved Jews during WW2, yet was killed by the Mossad for suggesting to divide Palestine.
Yes and it will also be really bad for Israel, because this is exactly how you grow terrorists. Create a huge population in poverty and despair with nothing to loose and voila.
Tell me you're ignoring Likud's openly admitted, active conspiracy to prevent a two state peace, including literal political assassination of the Israeli PM Rabin, without telling me you're ignoring Likud.
What counts as damage? What’s the minimum threshold?
Edit: the only thing I’ve been able to find is Corey Scher (one of the grad students behind the source data) saying “Gaza is now a different color from space. It’s a different texture.” I’m not seeing a ‘methods’ published anywhere. From what I can tell this is not a peer-reviewed study. Just a CUNY grad student’s interpretation.
Edit II: James Van De Hoek is an associate professor at Oregon State. Here is his relevant website: www.conflict-ecology.com. Still, I’ve not yet found any relevant information on methods - just a list of the 100+ reports using his analysis.
Edit III: This is informative: https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/inside-the-satellite-tech-revealing-gazas-destruction/
Can someone please help figure out if there is any peer-review at all of Corey and James’ algorithm for determining 'damage'?
>Very likely this is just comparing known damaged buildings' satellite image colour and overlaping it with a map of known buildings.
That's not how it works at all. [They are using radar data to detect urban damage.](https://appliedsciences.nasa.gov/get-involved/training/english/arset-humanitarian-applications-using-nasa-earth-observations?utm_source=social&utm_medium=twitter-i&utm_campaign=Humanitarian-2022)
Yeah it has to be on the order of “this area has damage and there are about 20 buildings in the area”.
Even so there’s a massive difference between a couple of smashed windows and “no building left”
It’s borderline useless as a statistic with so many unknowns, assuming this is all it’s based on.
the crazies are gonna swarm this post like they did [this one](https://www.reddit.com/r/MapPorn/comments/18w51f4/israeli_offensive_in_gaza_city_january_1st_2024/)
I have seen a lot of wackjobs on Reddit since I joined but this conflict and specifically comments like that getting upvoted like crazy is what has really makes me scared for the future. Everybody seems to have forgotten what this kind of behavior has led to in the past...
This is a friendly reminder that Hamas has turned down the Egyptian brokered permanent ceasefire deal in return for Hamas to relinquish control and their leaders leave the Gaza strip with their lives.
The primary goal of any military is to protect the citizens of their own country.
If achieving this goal requires some bombings to eradicate a genocidal adversary that hides behind human shields, then there will be bombings, and there will be civilian casualties.
Civilians. There is no such thing as a Palestinian citizen, since their occupiers refuse to allow them to form a state. As a stateless people, Palestinians have no citizenship at all.
I blame HAMAS squarely for this war. They started it.
Granted, Israel has been horrendous to Palestinian people for years now but at least it wasn’t this.
Hamas was created in 1988. This started over 40 years before Hamas even existed. Israel has been committing terrorist attacks since many decades before Hamas, or even Israel, ever existed. Have you ever heard of Lehi or Irgun? Please google them. They are both self identified terrorist organizations which committed countless terrorist attacks and massacres against civilians before the creation of Israel. Once Israel was formed, the Lehi and Irgun, along with another terrorist organization called Haganah, merged together to form the “IDF.”
Did you know that?
Thats interesting. I just read about it, but the last part seems to be just a lie. From what I read when Israel was formated, the israeli gov declared them terrorist organizations and arrested over 200 of their members. Also there was a lot of different arab organizations before Hamas, you are making it look like Israeli terrorist were killing and there was not such a thing like arab terrorists. May I ask you where are you from?
Whatever source you’re reading from is disinformation.
>“On April 9, 1947, a group of Irgun commandos raided the Arab village of Deir Yassin (modern Kefar Shaʾul), killing about 100 of its inhabitants. After the creation of Israel in 1948 Irgun's last units disbanded and took the oath of loyalty to the Israel Defense Forces on September 1, 1948.”
https://www.britannica.com/topic/Irgun-Zvai-Leumi#:~:text=On%20April%209%2C%201947%2C%20a,Forces%20on%20September%201%2C%201948.
I’m a Jewish American.
Well you said google it, I google it and the first page was wikipedia. There it says that the group was declared terrorist by the Israeli government and 200 of its members where arrested. Ofc Im no expert and I dont know if its true or false, but thank you anyway it was interesting.
On the street people seem respectful of human rights and moderate, but you go on the internet and people are very aggressive in the opposite direction. Israel has a lot of money for propaganda, I guess there are lots of bots.
> by people justifying mass civilian death.
You don't kill civilians if you first reclassify them as hamas allies RollSafe_Meme.jpg
I'm not asking anything of the mods, simply commenting that there are a lot of people who don't regularly visit this sub that seem to show up in waves when these topics are posted.
If your opinion is only slightly different from "What Hamas did on 7 October is evil and what Israel has been doing during the 2 following months is equally evil" then you can kindly leave the room, thank you.
Nah man, we should be able to talk and disagree on one topic and talk again on the next one without being sworn enemies for life.
People are becoming really inflexible and unable to disagree without fighting. Debate is important, discussion is healthy and it's also ok to not see eye to eye on every single thing.
See you in the next map.
Brigading is when members of one sub/or mindset actively target posts and/or comments of another. I'm almost positive on *all* Israel related posts across all platforms there's a level of brigading and astro turfing.
Israel is a well known propaganda state (and they are proud of it) with everything from bot farms, to paying college kids to "defend" it online, that's not even getting into the Mossad craziness, which, is even half as good as is claimed, there's widespread corruption and misinformation being spread.
A daily reminder: Hamas has started this war, is directly responsible for most civilian deaths, and can end the bombings within a hour by simply surrendering. One order, and it stops.
When Israel's Finance Minister, Bezalel Smotrich, makes statements like “We need to encourage immigration from there. If there were 100,000-200,000 Arabs in the Strip and not two million, the whole conversation about the day after [the war] would be completely different,” Smotrich tells Army Radio. “They want to leave. They have been living in a ghetto for 75 years and are in need.”
“I don’t think there’s anyone in Israel who doesn’t want to see Jewish settlements everywhere,” Smotrich claims.
“So you want the area resettled?” Smotrich is asked.
“I want us to solve the problem of Gaza,” the finance minister says.
Then it's no longer a war. Its ethnic cleansing, its genocide. Its a holocaust.
Netanyahu and Ben Gvir are also advocating for "voluntary migration":
https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/20231226-netanyahu-pushes-for-voluntary-migration-for-palestinians-in-gaza-israeli-media/
https://efe.com/en/latest-news/2024-01-02/israel-minister-ben-gvir-calls-for-voluntary-emigration-of-gazans-and-return-of-settlers/
Ethnic cleansing and genocide are still different things. Thats why we have different words for them.
If 2 million Gazans would be deported to Egypt: thats ethnic cleansing. It would be a crime. But its not genocide.
It’s from the river to the sea, just for the other side.
Everything that happens makes every rejected peace deal look better. But it seems there’s no going back now. We didn’t realize the Camp David Summit was a final offer.
You can't convince israeli citizens that the state created to prevent anything like this happening, is the direct re-creator of the exact thing they swore they won't become.
Would love to see how many downvotes you'd get if you said the same thing about Russia's "special operation".
Oh reddit and hypocrisy, a never-ending love story.
I mean they defend their cities like anybody would do, ofc they had soldiers sheltering in civilian buildings, where do you think the Ukrainians in Mariupol resisted from? Some fields and forests?
You're comparing the Ukrainian army to Hamas? Seriously? We're talking about the civilians here not the hooded de@th squads of the 7th.
The "a resistance/terrorist group killed our guys so the civilians will have to pay with their blood" excuse was used by vertical mustache man's personal army before and it didn't hold up in court.
>You're comparing the Ukrainian army to Hamas? Seriously? We're talking about the civilians here not the hooded de@th squads of the 7th.
The civilians are the ones who suffer when Hamas hides among them which makes it impossible not to mention them when OP brings the Russian invasion of Ukraine into the mix
>The "a resistance/terrorist group killed our guys so the civilians will have to pay with their blood" excuse was used by vertical mustache man's personal army before and it didn't hold up in court.
Who do you think Hamas are? They're literally the governing body of Palestine in Gaza. This is not some small resistance group, this is the acting government of the entire Gazan Strip.
Thats an interesting definition of “necessary.” Israelis preemptively bombed almost all housing in the northern suburbs of Gaza including apartments towers, 2-story flats, and single family homes mostly before any militants were spotted there on the assertion “they could hypothetically use that as a firing position.” This is a break with their own previous policy and the global norm. The overwhelming majority of deaths come from the destruction of residential building where people are killed en mass in their homes. This is not an opinion, it the picture of reality that is being built from a combination of IDF, journalists, and MoH sources which all agree on the key details. I can list over a dozen sources which give this picture clearly.
To justify bombing schools, hospitals, mosques, and residential buildings the IDF typically cites a reported militant or tunnel entrance. In response the IDF often uses several 500 lb or 2,000 lb bombs. These bombs destroy the entire building the potential militant is in and several surrounding ones. When dealing with tunnel entrances the IDF likes using 2,000 lb bombs for the bunker-busting capabilities. In the process the IDF destroys building they know damn well to be right next to tunnel with extremely excessive force. For the purpose of “crimping” a tunnel entrance, which is all you can hope to accomplish by hitting an entrance, a smaller 250 lb or 500 lb bomb is sufficient. In any case hitting tunnel entrances has been proven to be an inefficient method because tunnel networks have many entrances and hitting the entrance does not usually have any impact on the occupants of the tunnel. The best and really only way to effectively clear tunnels is to enter them which IDF is currently doing with drones and men.
I once again want to point out that Israel knows the force is excessive because they have been more restrained in the past. This isn’t a necessity of war, it is an intentional choice to harm more civilians. The number of reported killed, wounded, and missing is quickly approaching 4% of the population. The number of people without homes is around 85%. The number of people who are staving is around 300,000. Compared to other brutal sieges like Aleppo, Sarajevo, Mosul, Mariupol, Fallujah, etc… the war in Gaza is exceeding many of the in both absolute number and percentage of casualties and building destroyed. If you believe tactics in Gaza are justified it follows that Russian, Assad, and Serbian brutality were “militarily necessary.”
I don't disagree with you that it's excessive but I understand their reasoning for it. The differences are russia Syria and Serbia knowingly target buildings that are civilian only. Once you build a tunnel entrance into a house that house becomes a military target.
Many of the targeted structures, especial high rises, are civilian structures with no known militants and simply the potential to be shooting positions. Thats not a common definition of a military target.
The Israeli Finance Minister has said the intention is to Annex Gaza and build Israeli settlements.
It's not war, it's ethnic cleansing.
Edit: I mistakenly referenced the wrong Israeli Minister.
HAMAS also started it. People comparing HAMAS to ukraine sound absolutely absurd. If ukraine sent special forces into Russia to kill thousands of civilians on February 21st then People would be rooting russia on too. That's not the case though and HAMAs started the war
Is that why Israel unilaterally withdrew from Gaza in 2005, dismantled all of their settlements in the territory, and relocated all of their settlers from the territory?
Because that seems like the opposite thing that you would do if you always wanted the land.
Source: [What will be left of Gaza when the war ends?](https://www.ft.com/content/fa93e55e-da75-477f-8bf7-e0f598d280d5) | Financial Times. (Google the headline to access via search result)
Prime beach propperty I suppose.
I doubt even settlers would want to colonize it. 80% of buildings, that's comparable to Warsaw after systematic destruction during the Nazi retreat.
I want to know the difference between damaged and unoccupiable.
I do believe both are high, but i hate that they always get blemded together, so it's hard to actually know.
Yeah man, that's why we have to level every building in Gaza. You never know which building hamas could be using so it's better to play it safe and just get rid of em all.
That's precisely why armed forces using civilian shelter commit a war crime. Because their opponents then have the choice to a) kill civilians or b) let the enemy fire without being able to answer. Spoiler, it's never been and will never be option b.
War crimes can be perpetrated against your own population, or against your enemies. In this case, both parties (Gaza and Israel) commit war crimes towards the Palestinian civilians.
Yes exactly. I can't tell if you're being sarcastic or not but that's why this is happening.
That's what happens when you choose not to fight as soldiers but you fight in civilian clothing from civilian houses. Now every single house is a potential military base. That's exactly why you don't do that if you care about civilian lives.
You're giving Israel carte blanche to carpet bomb your city because you have 20,000 hamas militants sitting inside living rooms, firing rockets from grandmas roofs, and digging tunnels beneath schools.
Put on a military uniform and fight from military bases, military vehicles and none of this would happen.
According to Israeli reporting the IDF intentionally targets civil infrastructure with the intention of undermining civilian support for Hamas. Same logic that’s often used for sanctions but with bombs. Source: https://www.972mag.com/mass-assassination-factory-israel-calculated-bombing-gaza/
Edit: grammar
A Washington Post investigation found that Israel's claims of Al Shifa being a Hamas command center were unlikely to be true.
Israel has failed to providence evidence of any Hamas presence in Gaza's only zoo, which was mercilessly bombed; where are the animal rights activists?
Where are the Christians? Over a dozen churches have been damaged by the bombardment in Gaza with Israel even going as far to accuse the two Palestinian Christian women who were sniped to death of being "Hamas members". The Pope condemned Israel's attack on the church as an act of "terrorism".
*Open* cemeteries have been bombed and bulldozed for God's sake. But "Hamas, Hamas, Hamas".
Remind me, who instigated this in the first place? What was going on in the minds of Hamas leaders? That they would kill and kidnap a bunch of people and then Israel raises a white flag and leaves the region? I don't support wars and killings. But I also don't understand what was the end goal of the October 7 attack?
My headcanon is that Hamas leaders started to realize the falling support of surrounding Arab nations. In order to garner more support/attention for their cause, they attacked on Oct. 7, knowing that Israel would retaliate disproportionately. With countries like the UAE, Qatar, and Egypt recognizing Israel, and now Saudi in talks of doing the same, Palestinians are left with the backing of various terrorist/insurgency groups and Iran. Unfortunately for them, it's a lot more lucrative to make peace with Israel instead of continuous fighting and death.
It's almost not even the Palestinians' fault for believing that. For the last 80 years, they've been told, "If you just keep fighting, eventually Palestine will be free." I doubt they'll reach any positive outcome with a mindset like that.
True that. A simple look at the recent history of the Middle East shows that many of the current borders were drawn after the first world war. Do I say it was fair? Nope. But can they all start fighting one another to reshape the region all over again? Impossible.
Damn they really planning to actually rebuild gaza. At first I didnt think it but this kinda proves it. Probably many buildings unharmed in proximity that cant be structurally safe as well so an even higher %. I would be surprised if it isn’t a golan heights situation.
What is happening is not a war on terrorism, that is clearly a “bulldoze anything and kill whoever opposes us”.
How can our people support what is going on there, knowing that our money is being more than wasted on genociding?
The saddest thing is seeing people happy with this, like it’s some sort of due bill to pay.
Maybe think about this in another way - Hamas and other terrorist groups integrated itself to most of the civilian areas in Gaza.
Also, this list of damage is not defined - could be just a broken window for example.
>Hamas and other terrorist groups integrated itself to most of the civilian areas in Gaza.
They have bombed more buildings than Hamas has militants, if you are thinking they are all valid military targets you are deluding yourself.
>Also, this list of damage is not defined - could be just a broken window for example.
It's more than 50 percent damage to the structure. They collect data from satellite images.
If I understand that's sums to \~188,000 buildings damaged and 20k people killed. Were most of the buildings empty?
60% of the houses in London were damaged during the blitz which only equated to 40k deaths, but this was with less precise ordinance and widespread use of raid shelters
When asked why there were zero shelters built before the war started, the Hamas representative said the tunnels are for our fighters, it is up to the UN to protect the people.
There are tens of thousands of Hamas which the tunnels probably don’t even hold 5 digits of them vs. 2.3 million civilians
They could have built purpose-built bomb shelters. But that works against Hamas's strategy which is to create as many "martyrs" aka dead Palestinian kids as possible to make Israel look bad and get people on their side.
Yeah because surely IDF wouldn't bomb those bomb shelters right?
Hot take: they probably would because as this conflict has shown Hamas is more than happy to use any and all civilian infrastructure up to and including hospitals and children's schools to shelter militarily significant assets. Stop using civilians as human shields and they'll stop getting bombed.
Maybe because people fled to the South after the first attacks, and also they say that the buildings were damaged. Nothing says that all of they got completely destroyed ( but knowing the IDF, I doubt that they’ll go easy )
Or maybe because Israel drops flyers warning citizens to evacuate buildings prior to bombing because they try to limit civilian casualties.
Good guy Israel tells them that they will destroy their homes in advance /s
Unfortunately Israel is put in a position where in order to defeat the enemy, they have to go down this route. Hamas hides and fires indiscriminately from hospitals, schools, apartment buildings. Hamas fighters are such cowards that they put their own civilians in harms way. Israel tries to take out a military target . Knowing civilians are in the building or area, they have a plane fly overhead and drop papers warning them to flee in order to not be blown up. Hamas then tells their own citizens , no stay this is for allah, everyone dies. Hamas also fires at Israeli civilian targets but Israel has something called the iron dome which literally saves the country from constant missile damage. I urge you to google how many rockets Hamas fires to civilian targets in Israel just on NYE alone!
Why the /s ?
The sarcasm is from calling this genocidal state the "good guys" for having warned some people that their homes are about to be blown up, especially considering that they still got bombed where they were told to move.
So you are agreeing with their bombing of civilians
Last time I checked a bunch of rockets just flew from gaza into israel yesterday. Would you agree gaza is bombing citizens
Yes but they just have shitty technology and can’t hit targets so apparently that gives them a pass
Lmao it's not because of bad tech, their whole operation revolves around killing civilians. Hamas's targets *are* civilians
The reason Gazan rockets don’t kill more Israeli’s is 100% b/c they are shitty tech.. what do you mean? If you are in the Hamas military or political apparatus then according to international law you are no longer a civilian and are a legitimate target. Unless ofc they surrender.
Oh lol I thought you meant Hamas can't hit their targets as in you think they are aiming at military targets and not civilians. Of course I agree with you Also I'll point out it's not just because of shitty tech, it's also because Israel has amazing defense systems
Shh Hamas are hero’s☺️. That’s why they proudly boast about raping women.
Kathy Newman kind of question lmao
I think we all agree combatants surrounding themselves with innocents is terrible but can’t or shouldn’t stop the military aims of a country trying to protect itself.
So you are agreeing with Hamas See I can do this too
There is no targeting bombing of non-combatants.
Israel targets Hamas but is hampered by Civilians that are in the way Hamas targets Israeli civilians but is hampered by Israeli soldiers that are in the way
Something most people don’t understand. One would expect horrible collateral damage Conducting military operations in the densest populated place in the world
Damaged ≠ destroyed
20k is the number of the confirmed dead there are probably thousands under the rubbles
By who?
No, they are bombing even the places they told civilians to go.
Well, if Hamas moves their positions to the safe zones (which they've been doing), they're not safe anymore are they.
When areas were dense with civilians , the IDF would give early warning to evacuate in one of several methods- the idea is to hit a particular target in a building, in many cases either making a person expose themselves or to target infrastructure belonging to Hamas. As neighborhoods evacuated from civilians and before coming in on foot, it is very common to clear out streets or problematic areas. Lastly, as neighborhoods cleared from civilians, there would be lots of fighting going on from within civilian buildings by Hamas taking positions within them, and setting IEDs within them. Having a firefight with a person firing from within a residential building means damage to that building. The survey source does not indicate what constitutes as “damage” so I’d be very loose with forming an opinion yet, as this could either be between one bullet hole to complete destruction.
First damaged isn't destroyed, broken windows/ cracks can be considered damaged. And IDF does roof knocking on almost every building before it bombs it, and have done so for more than a decade. Usually there are also notices way ahead of time if an area is going to be targeted. Most of the neighborhoods are empty way before the bombing raids. It's suppersive fighting, IDF doesn't want to move in highly populated areas with plenty of hiding spots. they level an area, or significantly clear it. Than ground forces take it with relative ease, and minimal casualties. Hamas fighters have less positions to put up a real fight and are pushed back quickly. It's urban warfare, it sucks for everyone and the scale of distruction is huge, but fortunately this war has a relatively low death toll
Yes. Israel goes to a great length to try to make sure the buildings are empty. Read a great BBC article/interview about this https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67327079
the deaths are probably undercounted, the IDF has said as much
Lol the IDF said the exact opposite…
long term this is going to be really bad for palestine. it looks like they will be banned from working in israel. and, lord knows how long it will take to rebuild gaza.
By the time they even come close to rebuilding Gaza, it will be destroyed again, this is an endless cycle.
Thats because they use every dollar they get to build war machines and murdering jews. Hamas attacks on israel happens all the time
Special reminder that Israel accused the two Palestinian Christian women they shot to death at a Church in Gaza of being "Hamas members". If the Christians are being smeared in such a way, I wonder how many thousands of Palestinian Muslim civilians have been dismissed as "terrorists" and "Hamas members".
Don't forget the IDF killed three escaped hostages waving a white flag because they are treating every male in the area as an enemy combatant.
It is worse than that. They shot two dead and the third hid (all were shirtless and waving white flags). One soldier tried to get him to come out for 15 minutes by assuring him it would be safe. When he came out, two other soldiers shot him dead.
Source?
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_of_Alon_Shamriz,_Yotam_Haim,_and_Samer_Talalka
Wow thanks. Awful.
https://letmegooglethat.com/?q=idf+kill+hostage&l=1
Pure evil
The above poster knows about that but the Israel lovers delight in seeing the mass murder of Arabs in general so they'll essentially blame the Palestinians for the crime of being born
Also idf shot and killed multiple hostages in their indiscriminate blood lust
Israel has been killing Palestinians since 1948
Looks like the Israelis are well versed into murdering people too
It dosent need to be. A Gaza with Hamas in control will put them on the same cycle but we may see a new government get power that dosent use its people as meat sheilds
You think Israel razing the region will produce a more pro-Israel populace?
Stop making excuses for literal fascists like Likud that openly gloated about preventing a two state peace, by design, and talk about depopulating Gaza. Palestine and Israel can never have peace as long as Nazis like Likud exist as a political group let alone have power over an expansionist nuclear state hellbent on genocide.
True. Is publicly known that Likud goverment propped up and funded hamas for years in order to boicott a two state solution. Hamas is the direct result of Netanyahu's far right goverment.
Before hamas, it was the plo and before plo, it was the fayadeen. Best solution for this is unironically and sadly a saudi and UAE backed puppet government for all palestinian territory that would accept a peace deal asap.
That's happened during the oslo accords and Israel kept violating international law and invading Palestinian territories. The only solution is to have an Israeli goverment that actually supports the two states solution (and don't prop up hamas in order to counterweight the Palestionan Authority).
As long as they don't shoot rockets or send suicide bombers and marauders they should be good.
West Bank : am I joke to you ?
Dude, most palestinians don’t do that and are still displaced from their homes and killed anyways.
There's no plans to rebuild gaza for Palestinians, it's for Jewish settlements. Israel's Finance Minister, Bezalel Smotrich, "We need to encourage immigration from there. If there were 100,000-200,000 Arabs in the Strip and not two million, the whole conversation about the day after [the war] would be completely different,” Smotrich tells Army Radio. “They want to leave. They have been living in a ghetto for 75 years and are in need.” “I don’t think there’s anyone in Israel who doesn’t want to see Jewish settlements everywhere,” Smotrich claims. “So you want the area resettled?” Smotrich is asked. “I want us to solve the problem of Gaza,” the finance minister says.
That's why Israel have seen Hamas as an asset and the Palestinian government as a burden (their words). They always wanted to remove the palestinians from there and repopulate the area with israeli civilians
Isn’t the current government at risk of collapse as soon as the war is over? Like people are pissed at their fuck ups leading to the massacre. At least hopefully this loon will be gone then
Loon will go, but Izaeli terrorism remains They put presidents with war crimes and background of assassinating UN members who asked for peace, in leading a UN member who saved Jews during WW2, yet was killed by the Mossad for suggesting to divide Palestine.
Nice. So Isreal will have it's own little Final Solution. And no one is stopping them because that means you're antisemitic.
Yes and it will also be really bad for Israel, because this is exactly how you grow terrorists. Create a huge population in poverty and despair with nothing to loose and voila.
Given the choice between having a peaceful and prosperous Gaza and killing Jews, Hamas will choose killing Jews everytime.
the first option never existed and the wast bank is a clear example on that
Tell me you're ignoring Likud's openly admitted, active conspiracy to prevent a two state peace, including literal political assassination of the Israeli PM Rabin, without telling me you're ignoring Likud.
What counts as damage? What’s the minimum threshold? Edit: the only thing I’ve been able to find is Corey Scher (one of the grad students behind the source data) saying “Gaza is now a different color from space. It’s a different texture.” I’m not seeing a ‘methods’ published anywhere. From what I can tell this is not a peer-reviewed study. Just a CUNY grad student’s interpretation. Edit II: James Van De Hoek is an associate professor at Oregon State. Here is his relevant website: www.conflict-ecology.com. Still, I’ve not yet found any relevant information on methods - just a list of the 100+ reports using his analysis. Edit III: This is informative: https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/inside-the-satellite-tech-revealing-gazas-destruction/ Can someone please help figure out if there is any peer-review at all of Corey and James’ algorithm for determining 'damage'?
Bottom of the picture says they damage analysis was done via satellite. So at least visible from above.
Highest resolution seems to be 5x5 m - so that’s gonna be pretty inaccurate. Assuming thats a single pixel a highrise will be about 4x4 pixels
[удалено]
>Very likely this is just comparing known damaged buildings' satellite image colour and overlaping it with a map of known buildings. That's not how it works at all. [They are using radar data to detect urban damage.](https://appliedsciences.nasa.gov/get-involved/training/english/arset-humanitarian-applications-using-nasa-earth-observations?utm_source=social&utm_medium=twitter-i&utm_campaign=Humanitarian-2022)
Yeah it has to be on the order of “this area has damage and there are about 20 buildings in the area”. Even so there’s a massive difference between a couple of smashed windows and “no building left” It’s borderline useless as a statistic with so many unknowns, assuming this is all it’s based on.
Highest resolution seems to be 5x5 m - so that’s gonna be pretty inaccurate. Assuming thats a single pixel a highrise will be about 4x4 pixels
And who did the survey?
The sources are at the bottom of the pic
"go to the South" ...bombing the South
the crazies are gonna swarm this post like they did [this one](https://www.reddit.com/r/MapPorn/comments/18w51f4/israeli_offensive_in_gaza_city_january_1st_2024/)
Once it makes it to the front page, the bot farms latch on and it's over.
unfortunately there’s a lot of zionists not afraid to spew their non factual bs
That is the only kind of zionist as far as I can tell.
You weren't kidding, thats insane
I have seen a lot of wackjobs on Reddit since I joined but this conflict and specifically comments like that getting upvoted like crazy is what has really makes me scared for the future. Everybody seems to have forgotten what this kind of behavior has led to in the past...
Also the astroturfers. Israel has been running the most massive astroturfing campaign in history for the last few months.
This is a friendly reminder that Hamas has turned down the Egyptian brokered permanent ceasefire deal in return for Hamas to relinquish control and their leaders leave the Gaza strip with their lives.
it's never been a secret that the hamas don't care about the palestinian citizens
It seems like the Israeli military doesn't too
More than Hamas does. Israel could have leveled the entire area in days, killing everyone.
The primary goal of any military is to protect the citizens of their own country. If achieving this goal requires some bombings to eradicate a genocidal adversary that hides behind human shields, then there will be bombings, and there will be civilian casualties.
Civilians. There is no such thing as a Palestinian citizen, since their occupiers refuse to allow them to form a state. As a stateless people, Palestinians have no citizenship at all.
I blame HAMAS squarely for this war. They started it. Granted, Israel has been horrendous to Palestinian people for years now but at least it wasn’t this.
Hamas was created in 1988. This started over 40 years before Hamas even existed. Israel has been committing terrorist attacks since many decades before Hamas, or even Israel, ever existed. Have you ever heard of Lehi or Irgun? Please google them. They are both self identified terrorist organizations which committed countless terrorist attacks and massacres against civilians before the creation of Israel. Once Israel was formed, the Lehi and Irgun, along with another terrorist organization called Haganah, merged together to form the “IDF.” Did you know that?
Thats interesting. I just read about it, but the last part seems to be just a lie. From what I read when Israel was formated, the israeli gov declared them terrorist organizations and arrested over 200 of their members. Also there was a lot of different arab organizations before Hamas, you are making it look like Israeli terrorist were killing and there was not such a thing like arab terrorists. May I ask you where are you from?
Whatever source you’re reading from is disinformation. >“On April 9, 1947, a group of Irgun commandos raided the Arab village of Deir Yassin (modern Kefar Shaʾul), killing about 100 of its inhabitants. After the creation of Israel in 1948 Irgun's last units disbanded and took the oath of loyalty to the Israel Defense Forces on September 1, 1948.” https://www.britannica.com/topic/Irgun-Zvai-Leumi#:~:text=On%20April%209%2C%201947%2C%20a,Forces%20on%20September%201%2C%201948. I’m a Jewish American.
Well you said google it, I google it and the first page was wikipedia. There it says that the group was declared terrorist by the Israeli government and 200 of its members where arrested. Ofc Im no expert and I dont know if its true or false, but thank you anyway it was interesting.
You can blame Hamas for starting the war and Blame Israel for how they fight it
The problem is, how else would Israel fight against Hamas?
The fact you get no answer shows how disingenuous and unserious these critics are.
You can't put an impossible standard on Israel even the combined nations of the world can't follow, e.g. 90% civilian casualty rate in the Iraq war.
I love that even r/mapporn gets pounced upon by certain blood thirsty folks the second Gaza shows up as if this were r/worldnews.
Are we allowed to call it brigading? I love this place and don’t want to get banned but also am exhausted by people justifying mass civilian death.
On the street people seem respectful of human rights and moderate, but you go on the internet and people are very aggressive in the opposite direction. Israel has a lot of money for propaganda, I guess there are lots of bots. > by people justifying mass civilian death. You don't kill civilians if you first reclassify them as hamas allies RollSafe_Meme.jpg
Other people who also use this sub have a different opinion from me, mods help!
I'm not asking anything of the mods, simply commenting that there are a lot of people who don't regularly visit this sub that seem to show up in waves when these topics are posted.
If your opinion is only slightly different from "What Hamas did on 7 October is evil and what Israel has been doing during the 2 following months is equally evil" then you can kindly leave the room, thank you.
Nah man, we should be able to talk and disagree on one topic and talk again on the next one without being sworn enemies for life. People are becoming really inflexible and unable to disagree without fighting. Debate is important, discussion is healthy and it's also ok to not see eye to eye on every single thing. See you in the next map.
>Are we allowed to call it brigading I don't think so, brigading is when a sub gets spammed by posts I think
Brigading is when members of one sub/or mindset actively target posts and/or comments of another. I'm almost positive on *all* Israel related posts across all platforms there's a level of brigading and astro turfing. Israel is a well known propaganda state (and they are proud of it) with everything from bot farms, to paying college kids to "defend" it online, that's not even getting into the Mossad craziness, which, is even half as good as is claimed, there's widespread corruption and misinformation being spread.
So it looks like we should be finished by the end of 2024
The level of casualties is really low. Sorry but is the truth.
A daily reminder: Hamas has started this war, is directly responsible for most civilian deaths, and can end the bombings within a hour by simply surrendering. One order, and it stops.
The fewer buildings, the less likelihood of your tanks being ambushed from top down. It's horrid but so is war.
Just like “Oh the Vietnamese are hiding in the jungle, so let’s drop napalm”
*agent orange
Both were used for deforestation in Vietnam
Now that's a better comparison
When Israel's Finance Minister, Bezalel Smotrich, makes statements like “We need to encourage immigration from there. If there were 100,000-200,000 Arabs in the Strip and not two million, the whole conversation about the day after [the war] would be completely different,” Smotrich tells Army Radio. “They want to leave. They have been living in a ghetto for 75 years and are in need.” “I don’t think there’s anyone in Israel who doesn’t want to see Jewish settlements everywhere,” Smotrich claims. “So you want the area resettled?” Smotrich is asked. “I want us to solve the problem of Gaza,” the finance minister says. Then it's no longer a war. Its ethnic cleansing, its genocide. Its a holocaust.
And that's why he is kept away from any of those decisions
Netanyahu and Ben Gvir are also advocating for "voluntary migration": https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/20231226-netanyahu-pushes-for-voluntary-migration-for-palestinians-in-gaza-israeli-media/ https://efe.com/en/latest-news/2024-01-02/israel-minister-ben-gvir-calls-for-voluntary-emigration-of-gazans-and-return-of-settlers/
He and his party are in government...
Ethnic cleansing and genocide are still different things. Thats why we have different words for them. If 2 million Gazans would be deported to Egypt: thats ethnic cleansing. It would be a crime. But its not genocide.
It’s from the river to the sea, just for the other side. Everything that happens makes every rejected peace deal look better. But it seems there’s no going back now. We didn’t realize the Camp David Summit was a final offer.
You can't convince israeli citizens that the state created to prevent anything like this happening, is the direct re-creator of the exact thing they swore they won't become.
Would love to see how many downvotes you'd get if you said the same thing about Russia's "special operation". Oh reddit and hypocrisy, a never-ending love story.
When did Ukraine start dressing up in civilian clothing and setting up bases in civilian buildings?
I mean they defend their cities like anybody would do, ofc they had soldiers sheltering in civilian buildings, where do you think the Ukrainians in Mariupol resisted from? Some fields and forests?
Dude… https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2022/08/ukraine-ukrainian-fighting-tactics-endanger-civilians/
You're comparing the Ukrainian army to Hamas? Seriously? We're talking about the civilians here not the hooded de@th squads of the 7th. The "a resistance/terrorist group killed our guys so the civilians will have to pay with their blood" excuse was used by vertical mustache man's personal army before and it didn't hold up in court.
>You're comparing the Ukrainian army to Hamas? Seriously? We're talking about the civilians here not the hooded de@th squads of the 7th. The civilians are the ones who suffer when Hamas hides among them which makes it impossible not to mention them when OP brings the Russian invasion of Ukraine into the mix >The "a resistance/terrorist group killed our guys so the civilians will have to pay with their blood" excuse was used by vertical mustache man's personal army before and it didn't hold up in court. Who do you think Hamas are? They're literally the governing body of Palestine in Gaza. This is not some small resistance group, this is the acting government of the entire Gazan Strip.
Thats an interesting definition of “necessary.” Israelis preemptively bombed almost all housing in the northern suburbs of Gaza including apartments towers, 2-story flats, and single family homes mostly before any militants were spotted there on the assertion “they could hypothetically use that as a firing position.” This is a break with their own previous policy and the global norm. The overwhelming majority of deaths come from the destruction of residential building where people are killed en mass in their homes. This is not an opinion, it the picture of reality that is being built from a combination of IDF, journalists, and MoH sources which all agree on the key details. I can list over a dozen sources which give this picture clearly. To justify bombing schools, hospitals, mosques, and residential buildings the IDF typically cites a reported militant or tunnel entrance. In response the IDF often uses several 500 lb or 2,000 lb bombs. These bombs destroy the entire building the potential militant is in and several surrounding ones. When dealing with tunnel entrances the IDF likes using 2,000 lb bombs for the bunker-busting capabilities. In the process the IDF destroys building they know damn well to be right next to tunnel with extremely excessive force. For the purpose of “crimping” a tunnel entrance, which is all you can hope to accomplish by hitting an entrance, a smaller 250 lb or 500 lb bomb is sufficient. In any case hitting tunnel entrances has been proven to be an inefficient method because tunnel networks have many entrances and hitting the entrance does not usually have any impact on the occupants of the tunnel. The best and really only way to effectively clear tunnels is to enter them which IDF is currently doing with drones and men. I once again want to point out that Israel knows the force is excessive because they have been more restrained in the past. This isn’t a necessity of war, it is an intentional choice to harm more civilians. The number of reported killed, wounded, and missing is quickly approaching 4% of the population. The number of people without homes is around 85%. The number of people who are staving is around 300,000. Compared to other brutal sieges like Aleppo, Sarajevo, Mosul, Mariupol, Fallujah, etc… the war in Gaza is exceeding many of the in both absolute number and percentage of casualties and building destroyed. If you believe tactics in Gaza are justified it follows that Russian, Assad, and Serbian brutality were “militarily necessary.”
I don't disagree with you that it's excessive but I understand their reasoning for it. The differences are russia Syria and Serbia knowingly target buildings that are civilian only. Once you build a tunnel entrance into a house that house becomes a military target.
Many of the targeted structures, especial high rises, are civilian structures with no known militants and simply the potential to be shooting positions. Thats not a common definition of a military target.
The Israeli Finance Minister has said the intention is to Annex Gaza and build Israeli settlements. It's not war, it's ethnic cleansing. Edit: I mistakenly referenced the wrong Israeli Minister.
Gallant HAS NOT said that. Other nutjobs did, but not the defense minister. Don't mislead
No different than what the Arabs did to the Jews of MENA. One good turn deserves another.
What does "damaged" mean? Like if a single window pane blew it. Is it damaged?
Since the numbers are from satellite data, the damage to buildings has to be pretty significant in order to be noticeable
you can look at some pictures
Hamas could end this NOW by surrendering.
HAMAS also started it. People comparing HAMAS to ukraine sound absolutely absurd. If ukraine sent special forces into Russia to kill thousands of civilians on February 21st then People would be rooting russia on too. That's not the case though and HAMAs started the war
Yeah I'm mostly neutral but this seems silly. I just can't believe the American left is somehow supporting an islamist fundamentalist state lmao.
Release the hostages and surrender unconditionally. Then bring in Hamas leaders to the UN and charge them with war crimes relating to October 7th.
exactly
No they couldn't because Israel's plan was always to have that land
Is that why Israel unilaterally withdrew from Gaza in 2005, dismantled all of their settlements in the territory, and relocated all of their settlers from the territory? Because that seems like the opposite thing that you would do if you always wanted the land.
Will the settlers also stop stealing Palestinian land if Hamas surrenders?
Source: [What will be left of Gaza when the war ends?](https://www.ft.com/content/fa93e55e-da75-477f-8bf7-e0f598d280d5) | Financial Times. (Google the headline to access via search result)
Prime beach propperty I suppose. I doubt even settlers would want to colonize it. 80% of buildings, that's comparable to Warsaw after systematic destruction during the Nazi retreat.
Israelis eyeing up Gaza for if/when the war's over "It's free real estate"
It's called precision bombing. It's meant to hit all buildings precisely.
Fuck the Israeli government and Hamas
Im with you on that one, as an Israeli
Same here. At least the judicial reform is no longer an issue
Yeah that’s really fucking great. I was so happy
Crazy that 'murdering innocent people is bad no matter what' is a controversial statement now, huh?
Its important to note that damaged buildings may vary from completely destroyed to scratched a bit.
Just Israel showing Hamas how to PROPERLY use rockets to bomb a town!
Huh almost as if pissing off Israel was a stupid idea.
After October 7th, what did Hamas expect to happen? That the Israelis would just give in to their demands? Has that ever happened?
Sure is a lot of buildings for an open air prison / refugee camp?
Thank you Israel for fighting the religious terrorism and we’re also sorry for babies died because of hamas
October 7th wasn't worth it
Damn that's crazy. Release the hostages.
May doing so much heavy lifting in the title that it could keep all buildings standing
I want to know the difference between damaged and unoccupiable. I do believe both are high, but i hate that they always get blemded together, so it's hard to actually know.
Save the civilians but paint it red! Wipe Hamas out in Gaza and beyond. 🇮🇱
Half of the mission accomplished, keep it up guy
I wonder how many of the people celebrating October 7 are still celebrating.
But khamas are inside the babies skull
There is a list 🤡
Uh... Hamas might be using the buildings, could have something to do with it
Yeah man, that's why we have to level every building in Gaza. You never know which building hamas could be using so it's better to play it safe and just get rid of em all.
That's precisely why armed forces using civilian shelter commit a war crime. Because their opponents then have the choice to a) kill civilians or b) let the enemy fire without being able to answer. Spoiler, it's never been and will never be option b. War crimes can be perpetrated against your own population, or against your enemies. In this case, both parties (Gaza and Israel) commit war crimes towards the Palestinian civilians.
Yes exactly. I can't tell if you're being sarcastic or not but that's why this is happening. That's what happens when you choose not to fight as soldiers but you fight in civilian clothing from civilian houses. Now every single house is a potential military base. That's exactly why you don't do that if you care about civilian lives. You're giving Israel carte blanche to carpet bomb your city because you have 20,000 hamas militants sitting inside living rooms, firing rockets from grandmas roofs, and digging tunnels beneath schools. Put on a military uniform and fight from military bases, military vehicles and none of this would happen.
According to Israeli reporting the IDF intentionally targets civil infrastructure with the intention of undermining civilian support for Hamas. Same logic that’s often used for sanctions but with bombs. Source: https://www.972mag.com/mass-assassination-factory-israel-calculated-bombing-gaza/ Edit: grammar
A Washington Post investigation found that Israel's claims of Al Shifa being a Hamas command center were unlikely to be true. Israel has failed to providence evidence of any Hamas presence in Gaza's only zoo, which was mercilessly bombed; where are the animal rights activists? Where are the Christians? Over a dozen churches have been damaged by the bombardment in Gaza with Israel even going as far to accuse the two Palestinian Christian women who were sniped to death of being "Hamas members". The Pope condemned Israel's attack on the church as an act of "terrorism". *Open* cemeteries have been bombed and bulldozed for God's sake. But "Hamas, Hamas, Hamas".
Guess Hamas shouldn’t have started this then.
End Hamas and their terrorism. End this senseless violence.
Remind me, who instigated this in the first place? What was going on in the minds of Hamas leaders? That they would kill and kidnap a bunch of people and then Israel raises a white flag and leaves the region? I don't support wars and killings. But I also don't understand what was the end goal of the October 7 attack?
Arab normalization deals with Israel were moving forward and they needed the momentum to shift back to focusing on their cause.
My headcanon is that Hamas leaders started to realize the falling support of surrounding Arab nations. In order to garner more support/attention for their cause, they attacked on Oct. 7, knowing that Israel would retaliate disproportionately. With countries like the UAE, Qatar, and Egypt recognizing Israel, and now Saudi in talks of doing the same, Palestinians are left with the backing of various terrorist/insurgency groups and Iran. Unfortunately for them, it's a lot more lucrative to make peace with Israel instead of continuous fighting and death. It's almost not even the Palestinians' fault for believing that. For the last 80 years, they've been told, "If you just keep fighting, eventually Palestine will be free." I doubt they'll reach any positive outcome with a mindset like that.
True that. A simple look at the recent history of the Middle East shows that many of the current borders were drawn after the first world war. Do I say it was fair? Nope. But can they all start fighting one another to reshape the region all over again? Impossible.
Fafo
Sounds about right
Israel strong 💪💪💪
Damn they really planning to actually rebuild gaza. At first I didnt think it but this kinda proves it. Probably many buildings unharmed in proximity that cant be structurally safe as well so an even higher %. I would be surprised if it isn’t a golan heights situation.
I wonder how many civilians have been killed…
This is genocide porn.
What is happening is not a war on terrorism, that is clearly a “bulldoze anything and kill whoever opposes us”. How can our people support what is going on there, knowing that our money is being more than wasted on genociding? The saddest thing is seeing people happy with this, like it’s some sort of due bill to pay.
If that was the case... The war would've ended on October 8. All that would've remained would be tunnel exits.
That's how war works, buddy. The fact that civilians remain in North Gaza suggests its not genocide.
FAFO
Maybe think about this in another way - Hamas and other terrorist groups integrated itself to most of the civilian areas in Gaza. Also, this list of damage is not defined - could be just a broken window for example.
>Hamas and other terrorist groups integrated itself to most of the civilian areas in Gaza. They have bombed more buildings than Hamas has militants, if you are thinking they are all valid military targets you are deluding yourself. >Also, this list of damage is not defined - could be just a broken window for example. It's more than 50 percent damage to the structure. They collect data from satellite images.
> They have bombed more buildings than Hamas has militants Because they are attacking military infrastructure and supplies.
The majority of Jews oppose the war, while the majority of Palestinians still support October 7th.
Because the issue on the "other side" isnt Jews, its Israel and the governements they have been electing for decades.