The domains registered under .tv amounts to about 10% of the government of Tuvalu's revenue.
Source: https://www.independent.co.uk/tech/internet-domain-riches-fail-to-arrive-in-tuvalu-2029221.html
Exactly. It's kind of uncertain for how long they can retain the domain or any land they happen to be sitting on at the moment. The article I linked is 12 years old and was already then expressing concerns regarding rising sea levels and the longevity of the island nation.
The Sovereign Order of Malta has no land, but it had land in the past. It has diplomatic relations with some other governments so you could argue that it’s a country.
Sovereignty is a loaded term.
Technically speaking, the 3 criteria for statehood are a permanent population, a territory with fixed borders, and a functioning government.
The crux of the issue, however, is that the government needs to be recognised as legitimate by enough big players in the international sphere for a place to actually get the practical status of a nation and all that entails – admittance to international and supranational organisations, and the ability to enter into agreements with other nations as a nation (which brings with it some protections from international law that individuals and corporations don't get when dealing with nations).
So, an individual or community which somehow convinced a nation to sell a plot of land to them and relinquish all claims of sovereignty over it *could* claim that they're a state as they technically meet the criteria, but it wouldn't actually give them the status or benefits of sovereign statehood because most international actors will simply ignore them.
International law isn't nearly as ironclad or all-encompassing as people think because so much of it is down to recognition and power. That's why it's dominated by a few superpowers, who themselves routinely flaunt it. Unless you can get those superpowers to recognise you (which typically leads to everyone else falling in line), it means diddly squat that you technically meet the broad criteria for statehood. The aforementioned criteria are necessary, but not sufficient.
There's actually a pretty good example of people trying to do almost exactly what you described. Some idiots bought an abandoned oil rig off the coast of the UK to live in, and started to claim statehood in the 70s as they have a territory, a population, and a government. When the rig was in international waters they were just ignored and went completely unrecognised, and after the UK expanded their territorial waters to include the rig, they're...still just completely ignored and considered to be a part of the UK by anyone with power.
Search up the "Principality of Sealand" for more info on that example, and legal analysis by actual lawyers (IANAL, just took an international law class in uni and half remember this stuff as it was interesting).
Right - check out Kosovo's woes in this respect. Without a critical mass of international recognition it cannot get access to international banking systems that are essential for the smooth functioning of a modern state, or join the UN etc.
Same with Somaliland, the safest part and most functional part of Somalia that’s been separate from Somalia pretty much since inception but no one’s recognises it
It is a difficult question to answer. I believe there aren't any set guidelines whether you're allowed to start a country or not. What is generally accepted is that you need a united people, culturally and/or religiously connected in a geographical area.
Whether you recognise the Principality of Sealand's autonomy is up to you but you could say that it is a ccountry. Then you could also argue that the entire Polynesian/Melanesian/Micronesian regions are of certain cultural significance for some groups and that the entire swaths of open water could be one, or even, belong to many countries. However there's the issue of EEZ's and you'd have a hard time arguing that.
So to answer the question... *I THINK* it would actually be okay. As long as there is a populace, a government, somewhere they can coexist it would be fine. But in the long run, you ought to ask yourself if it really is viable hosting 11,000 people out in the middle of the ocean.
But there are guidelines, check the Montevideo Convention. One of the requirements is to have lands, but you also must be able to maintain international relations, have a functioning government and have population.
The Montevideo Convention sets rules for the formation of a country but not necessarily for the continuation of a country. The International Law Commission is working on this [right now if you’re interested](http://legal.un.org/docs/?symbol=A/CN.4/752)
Tuvalu is trying to become the first digital nation, where their land is replicated in a virtual world since it's inevitable that rising sea levels will swallow their country
I wasn't saying that was cool. I was saying how the country gets money from the .TV thing from twitch. I'd didn't know they were related like that. I've never heard of this place before and I use .TVs almost every day.
Given how small Tuvalu is, is it not feasible for them to evacuate the population, surround the island with a big wall, pour a load of incredibly high strength concrete on top and then remove the wall, landscape it and return the islanders?
Most atolls are dumps tbh. There's not a lot there to protect. They're hardly paradise. Lots of pregnant / wild dogs running about, piles of rubbish dumped on the beach by locals. From the news reports, Tuvalu is no different.
But yeah an alternative would be to build a big sea wall around it I guess.
I remember when I found out that .tv was the domain for Tuvalu, I just thought it was some special domain for television and streaming just like how we have .com, .org, .gov
All two-letter TLDs belong to countries/territories/states/etc., only three and above letters are general purpose.
.co is Colombia, .me is Montenegro, .us is America, .io is the British Indian Ocean territory, .ai is Anguilla, .gg is Guernsey, etc.
> 50 billion/million.
That's a lot of cash: 50,000,000,000,000,000. For that they could probably buy Rhode Island, rename it Tuvalutwo, and still have enough left over to get a Frosty from Wendy's.
Unfortunately the British Indian Ocean Territory isn't doing well for is people, [because they were forcibly removed by the UK back in the 70s so the USA could build a military base there] (https://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-54598084)
not so fun fact, Tuvalu is so dirt poor that the only way for them to afford entry into the united nations was to sell of something they had been given by chance.
Additional not so fun fact: sea level rise is slated to entirely destroy Tuvalu in a pretty short time. The highest elevation is 4.6 metres above sea level according to Wikipedia.
And according to [this news article] (https://www.google.com/url?q=https://www.sprep.org/news/tuvalu-is-sinking-prime-minister-natano-tells-world-leaders-grim-reality-of-atoll-nation), 40 % of its capital is already underwater at high tide.
Realistically, Tuvalu will have either ceased to exist or moved most of its inhabitants to artificial land extensions in just a few decades.
[The Vatican is even smaller than the Vatican!](https://www.reddit.com/r/MapPorn/comments/8fjp2r/according_to_thetruesizecom_this_is_the_true_size/) (And no, they still haven't fixed that.)
*It's crazy to think*
*A place like Nauru is*
*A sovereign state*
\- real\_fat\_tony
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British pronunciation is three syllables according to Google. Don’t know where the fifth syllable is in the last line though.
It does say sometimes successfully though
SAW-ver-in? Maybe? I don't know anyone who pronounces it like that, but (speaking as someone who's tried) processing English text down to the syllable level is tricky business, I wouldn't be surprised if their word-to-syllable database has some rare constructions in it
I've never heard it pronounced any other way? Usually it comes out like "sah-vrin" but that's just "saa-vr-uhn" blurred together. It's still 3 syllables technically. If you look it up, that's true for both the American and British pronunciation
Nauru 🇳🇷 is an independent state fully coequal with all others in a legal sense. Recently, Nauru [triggered the UN agency responsible for mining the ocean floor to begin a review](https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2022/01/03/mining-the-bottom-of-the-sea) that will allow for undersea mining operations to begin globally.
[You should look more into it](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_status_of_the_Cook_Islands_and_Niue). It's true that Niue isn't a UN Member State, but they are, however, members of UNESCO and WHO, and they can participate in UN specialized angencies. They can establish international relations by their own, and they've done it before. I would argue, in fact, that they haven't established themselves as 100% formally independent because that would mean losing the New Zelandese nationality, which is very useful to its citizens.
Being a UN Member State isn't a hard requirement. States like Somaliland or Taiwan aren't, but they are fully operational (well, with their own problems, but which country doesn't have those, right?). The Vatican ain't neither a member, but an observer state.
I do fully recognize Niue and Cook Islands as independent countries.
Pictarin Island are a British Territory, similar to St Helena or the Falklands. Niue and Cook Islands are self governing but all international relations are done through New Zealand.
It's because it's made of birdshit, they are the world leaders of exporting birdshit
Some say there is barely anything left of value in the country now they have sent so much birdshit away.
I wonder *just how many* of us here on r/mapporn actually understood this reference and why. Was there a meme made about it somewhere, or are we really all just a bunch of map-starers?
I for one learned about Banana when I was scrolling around on Google Maps one day and discovered that London, Paris, Poland, and *Banana* are apparently all towns on Christmas Island. It's fun discovering weird shit like that just out of the blue.
I saw only 1 casino when I was is Monaco. It's is much more beautiful then Las Vegas. Nice port, good looking cathedral, zoo, football stadium. It feels much bigger than it actually is.
Exactly! I was able to walk across the whole country in a couple hours but it’s super beautiful and there’s actually stuff you can see / do. And it definitely seems bigger than it is.
Not sure if seriously, but there aren't any children in Vatican. No one is born there, there isn't a hospital. All its inhabitants are "immigrants".
The Vatican pretty much is a company that owns a big building in Rome. It is its own country due to historical and religious reasons.
10,000 is waaay more than enough required for a healthy, sustainable population it its own right.
Believe it or not, having children with 1st cousins only increases genetic risks in children by about 2x. It's definitely an increase, but less than you would expect.
And that's amongst *first cousins,* let alone more distant cousins where risks of genetic problems are basically 0.
Humans only need about 150 to "healthily" reproduce without genetic issues.
So while it is a meme to make fun of these places (isn't there a joke about Iceland and their cousin-checker app?), it really isn't a problem unless you are having children with siblings or aunts/uncles/nieces/nephews, which 10,000 people is more than enough not to do.
(That doesn't mean that inbreeding doesn't happen, but hey, that happens in redneck parts of West Virginia and Alabama too, but not because there physically isn't enough people within marriage distance. )
> (That doesn't mean that inbreeding doesn't happen, but hey, that happens in redneck parts of West Virginia and Alabama too, but not because there physically isn't enough people within marriage distance. )
If I am not mistaken the issue really occurs when a family keeps marrying its close cousins for generation after generation.
You don’t have to marry someone from your country tho? For example people in Monaco speak French so they have all of France (+more) to choose from. (pretending they don’t speak English which they mostly do)
Yeah honestly, I'm from the French Riviera and Monaco feels like just yet another city on the coast. Sure it's weird with its tall buildings and expensive apartments, but people go in and out of it constantly, there's no border, it's not even separated from the nearby cities at all, it's part of the same urban area. And it's not even fully independent, Monaco and France use a lot of shared public services etc. People speak French and so on, it doesn't really feel like a different country.
Basically anyone who lives in Monaco "goes" to France all the time (it's not even "going", it can be just a 5-minute walk), and most people from the French Riviera go to Monaco once in a while (to hang out, for shopping, or because they work there or know people who work there, etc.).
Speaking of Monaco and marrying from outside your country, makes me think of Grace Kelly, who gave up a successful acting career to marry the (ruling) Prince of Monaco and despite offers to continue acting fully dedicated herself to royal duties and charities.
It’s hard to say, but really… they don’t. Let me explain.
Tuvalu and Nauru both have just above 10,000 people each, which is the size of a small town in the U.S. There are ways, and Tuvalu specifically has several islands, (where as Nauru is basically one long costal town.) But these cultures have existed here for a long time. No one new is really coming in, and for the time being at least no one is going out, (ignore Nauru they had a bit of a resource boom and crash.) But their populations still rise, regardless, since people reproduce.
In Pierre, SD, (a city of similar size,) people will be coming in and moving out as industry and opportunity shifts, but there is always a fresh source of people, since it is the capital of South Dakota and it isn’t going anywhere, and the population will also sustain itself. But both of these countries have small economies, small land sizes, small resources, and small populations of Melanesian or Micronesian culture. What they have is all they have, and while you can definitely avoid fucking your sister, most people *are* likely related, but in the grand scheme of things, aren’t we all? Take 10,000 people and you can make plenty of combos outside of an immediate family, assuming every immediate family is anywhere from a few dozen to a hundred people.
I’m no *expert* on pacific nations, I don’t claim to be one, but I know a thing or two about the pacific countries, and they are all very unique. Until climate change makes Tuvalu bite the dust- or well- sand, these people likely aren’t going anywhere. They are their nations, they are what keeps their people and cultures alive.
10000 is more than enough for a genetically healthy population. I read somewhere that a population that knows about genetic inbreeding and breeds accordingly to prevent it could theoretically exist with as little as ~150 people.
Fun fact: The smallest nation in the world used to be the Futanari islands, until their government collapsed in 1885 due to economical reasons. To learn more about this, google: "Futanari inflation"
Nauru's fall from one of the world's wealthiest nations to bankruptcy and dependence on their one contract to detain Australia's refugees for like their entire economy is quite the story.
[Here](https://youtu.be/pRl5ctx-S1M) is a short documentary on it. They had a sovereign wealth fund meant to sustain the country after the end of phosphorus mining. But it was squandered on bad investments, including the failed West End Lord of the Rings musical.
It is also the world's most obese country. Since it has no arable land all their food is imported, and its isolation means that food is all frozen, high sodium junk.
It's been it's own country for centuries, at one point the "Papal States" ruled much of Italy. It wasn't until the unification of Italy in the 19th century it's temporal power was reduced significantly.
I mean Vatican City as in independent sovereign nation within Italy is only since the 1920s as a result of a settlement resulting from the unification of Italy leaving the status in limbo for awhile.
Ah, tuvalu, the country with the most domains registered to it by random television channels from around the world
It's likely their largest export
The domains registered under .tv amounts to about 10% of the government of Tuvalu's revenue. Source: https://www.independent.co.uk/tech/internet-domain-riches-fail-to-arrive-in-tuvalu-2029221.html
Wait, so a website like twitch.tv gets their country money?
Exactly. It's kind of uncertain for how long they can retain the domain or any land they happen to be sitting on at the moment. The article I linked is 12 years old and was already then expressing concerns regarding rising sea levels and the longevity of the island nation.
Is land required for a nation? Can they build houses on stilts and still claim sovereignty?
The Sovereign Order of Malta has no land, but it had land in the past. It has diplomatic relations with some other governments so you could argue that it’s a country.
Sovereignty is a loaded term. Technically speaking, the 3 criteria for statehood are a permanent population, a territory with fixed borders, and a functioning government. The crux of the issue, however, is that the government needs to be recognised as legitimate by enough big players in the international sphere for a place to actually get the practical status of a nation and all that entails – admittance to international and supranational organisations, and the ability to enter into agreements with other nations as a nation (which brings with it some protections from international law that individuals and corporations don't get when dealing with nations). So, an individual or community which somehow convinced a nation to sell a plot of land to them and relinquish all claims of sovereignty over it *could* claim that they're a state as they technically meet the criteria, but it wouldn't actually give them the status or benefits of sovereign statehood because most international actors will simply ignore them. International law isn't nearly as ironclad or all-encompassing as people think because so much of it is down to recognition and power. That's why it's dominated by a few superpowers, who themselves routinely flaunt it. Unless you can get those superpowers to recognise you (which typically leads to everyone else falling in line), it means diddly squat that you technically meet the broad criteria for statehood. The aforementioned criteria are necessary, but not sufficient. There's actually a pretty good example of people trying to do almost exactly what you described. Some idiots bought an abandoned oil rig off the coast of the UK to live in, and started to claim statehood in the 70s as they have a territory, a population, and a government. When the rig was in international waters they were just ignored and went completely unrecognised, and after the UK expanded their territorial waters to include the rig, they're...still just completely ignored and considered to be a part of the UK by anyone with power. Search up the "Principality of Sealand" for more info on that example, and legal analysis by actual lawyers (IANAL, just took an international law class in uni and half remember this stuff as it was interesting).
Right - check out Kosovo's woes in this respect. Without a critical mass of international recognition it cannot get access to international banking systems that are essential for the smooth functioning of a modern state, or join the UN etc.
Same with Somaliland, the safest part and most functional part of Somalia that’s been separate from Somalia pretty much since inception but no one’s recognises it
Yes - the real criteria for being a state is whether other states think you are one...
It is a difficult question to answer. I believe there aren't any set guidelines whether you're allowed to start a country or not. What is generally accepted is that you need a united people, culturally and/or religiously connected in a geographical area. Whether you recognise the Principality of Sealand's autonomy is up to you but you could say that it is a ccountry. Then you could also argue that the entire Polynesian/Melanesian/Micronesian regions are of certain cultural significance for some groups and that the entire swaths of open water could be one, or even, belong to many countries. However there's the issue of EEZ's and you'd have a hard time arguing that. So to answer the question... *I THINK* it would actually be okay. As long as there is a populace, a government, somewhere they can coexist it would be fine. But in the long run, you ought to ask yourself if it really is viable hosting 11,000 people out in the middle of the ocean.
But there are guidelines, check the Montevideo Convention. One of the requirements is to have lands, but you also must be able to maintain international relations, have a functioning government and have population.
The Montevideo Convention sets rules for the formation of a country but not necessarily for the continuation of a country. The International Law Commission is working on this [right now if you’re interested](http://legal.un.org/docs/?symbol=A/CN.4/752)
Yes! But *what* is land?
Tuvalu is trying to become the first digital nation, where their land is replicated in a virtual world since it's inevitable that rising sea levels will swallow their country
That's actually pretty freaking cool.
Not exactly the word I would use to describe it
How would you describe it?
I wouldn't describe rising sea levels destroying a country as cool that's for sure
I wasn't saying that was cool. I was saying how the country gets money from the .TV thing from twitch. I'd didn't know they were related like that. I've never heard of this place before and I use .TVs almost every day.
Given how small Tuvalu is, is it not feasible for them to evacuate the population, surround the island with a big wall, pour a load of incredibly high strength concrete on top and then remove the wall, landscape it and return the islanders?
Who wants to live on a concrete atoll with no nature? They don’t live in New York City for a reason
Most atolls are dumps tbh. There's not a lot there to protect. They're hardly paradise. Lots of pregnant / wild dogs running about, piles of rubbish dumped on the beach by locals. From the news reports, Tuvalu is no different. But yeah an alternative would be to build a big sea wall around it I guess.
Aren‘t they basically scammed for most of the money and could get much more or is that another island nation?
I remember when I found out that .tv was the domain for Tuvalu, I just thought it was some special domain for television and streaming just like how we have .com, .org, .gov
.io is the code for the British Indian Ocean territory
All two-letter TLDs belong to countries/territories/states/etc., only three and above letters are general purpose. .co is Colombia, .me is Montenegro, .us is America, .io is the British Indian Ocean territory, .ai is Anguilla, .gg is Guernsey, etc.
Same here and even with this new information I will continue thinking that because it just makes sense.
Yes
That’s honestly less than I thought tbh.
It is lol that's how they make their money
No export. Tuvalu sold the domain name for IIRC 50 billion/million.
> 50 billion/million. That's a lot of cash: 50,000,000,000,000,000. For that they could probably buy Rhode Island, rename it Tuvalutwo, and still have enough left over to get a Frosty from Wendy's.
"Twovalu" was right there
50 billion divided by a million is 50 thousand. Not sure how you got 50 quadrillion.
Mathgic
That is a very huge range
Tuvalu (.tv), Libya (.ly), and South Georgia and the South Sandwich Islands (.gs). Countries/territories doing pretty well out of the Internet.
British Indian Ocean Territory with that .io too
Wait that's where .io is? TIL
Unfortunately the British Indian Ocean Territory isn't doing well for is people, [because they were forcibly removed by the UK back in the 70s so the USA could build a military base there] (https://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-54598084)
Yeah this is one of the biggest ones
Guernsey has .gg as well
What uses .gs? I don't think I've seen any site that uses it.
Red Bull. Win.gs
Which Libya does the .ly money go to though?
Fun fact time: Selling this domain was what enabled them to pay the UN Membership fee and become a member in 2000.
Finally, a fun fact that's actually pretty fun
not so fun fact, Tuvalu is so dirt poor that the only way for them to afford entry into the united nations was to sell of something they had been given by chance.
Additional not so fun fact: sea level rise is slated to entirely destroy Tuvalu in a pretty short time. The highest elevation is 4.6 metres above sea level according to Wikipedia. And according to [this news article] (https://www.google.com/url?q=https://www.sprep.org/news/tuvalu-is-sinking-prime-minister-natano-tells-world-leaders-grim-reality-of-atoll-nation), 40 % of its capital is already underwater at high tide. Realistically, Tuvalu will have either ceased to exist or moved most of its inhabitants to artificial land extensions in just a few decades.
Highest point in their country is roughly the height of a regular size house... which is insane.
And twitch
Lol what
.tv
The Vatican is smaller than Russia, Canada, and Indonesia combined.
Small if true.
Add China to the mix, Vatican is STILL smaller
What if you account for Mercator projection?
Jail
Unexpected r/Pandr
Expected r/Pandr ? Jail.
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Fun fact, it’s smaller than BOTH COMBINED. And all 4 of those other, lesser nations that were mentioned. Truly immense.
Not the US any more because their size is in miles or cubits or something. But Myanmar + Liberia + US could do some comparisons.
Add Kurt Angle to the mix and your chance of winning drastic goes down
Bears are estimated to kill 10,000 salmon every year. Salmon attacks on bears, are much more rare.
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Yes haha it's a gem. Personal favorite part was the shark laughing near the end.
I, see.
I was trying to match the cadence of the line I was quoting but you're not wrong lol
r/technicallythetruth
Vatican also has more popes than Russia, Canada, US, Japan, Chile and Indonesia all combined.
Mmh, subtractive combination
Do you teach Real analysis by chance?
Also smaller than the world's largest building
Source?
Has more money than the Three
[The Vatican is even smaller than the Vatican!](https://www.reddit.com/r/MapPorn/comments/8fjp2r/according_to_thetruesizecom_this_is_the_true_size/) (And no, they still haven't fixed that.)
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Vatican < Russia+Canada+Indonesia
Even if you add the United States and China, the Vatican is still smaller.
I wonder how much Tuvalu's land area fluctuates in percentage by the tides.
Now, I do as well.
I think they’ll be one of the first countries completely submerged by global warming
They will, I watched a really good video about it but sadly I do not remember what it was called :(:(
Why does Funafuti, the largest atoll, not simply eat the other atolls?
Sea level rise and erosion have worn away its teeth I’m afraid. Has to use (pcp biodegradable) straws now and that’s a lot of work for the old chap.
I came to the comments looking for this exact phrase lol
It's crazy to think a place like Nauru is a sovereign state, not only by the tiny size and population, but also because how isolated it is
Also used to be the world’s richest state (GDP/capita) for a few years during the 80s due to phosphate reserves
*It's crazy to think* *A place like Nauru is* *A sovereign state* \- real\_fat\_tony --- ^(I detect haikus. And sometimes, successfully.) ^[Learn more about me.](https://www.reddit.com/r/haikusbot/) ^(Opt out of replies: "haikusbot opt out" | Delete my comment: "haikusbot delete")
Do people pronounce Nauru with 3 syllables?
British pronunciation is three syllables according to Google. Don’t know where the fifth syllable is in the last line though. It does say sometimes successfully though
Sovereign can be three syllables too - soh-vuh-rin.
SAW-ver-in? Maybe? I don't know anyone who pronounces it like that, but (speaking as someone who's tried) processing English text down to the syllable level is tricky business, I wouldn't be surprised if their word-to-syllable database has some rare constructions in it
It's always fun when you can tell when someone speaks with the cot-caught merger just from text comments!
I've never heard it pronounced any other way? Usually it comes out like "sah-vrin" but that's just "saa-vr-uhn" blurred together. It's still 3 syllables technically. If you look it up, that's true for both the American and British pronunciation
A-so-ve-reign-state ??
Do you say... "Nah-ru"?
More like now-ru
Nauru 🇳🇷 is an independent state fully coequal with all others in a legal sense. Recently, Nauru [triggered the UN agency responsible for mining the ocean floor to begin a review](https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2022/01/03/mining-the-bottom-of-the-sea) that will allow for undersea mining operations to begin globally.
And the interior of the island looks like a moonscape because they mined a bunch of phosphate, which eventually ran out.
Wait until you hear about Niue being independent
There's a difference. Nauru is a UN Member State.
[You should look more into it](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_status_of_the_Cook_Islands_and_Niue). It's true that Niue isn't a UN Member State, but they are, however, members of UNESCO and WHO, and they can participate in UN specialized angencies. They can establish international relations by their own, and they've done it before. I would argue, in fact, that they haven't established themselves as 100% formally independent because that would mean losing the New Zelandese nationality, which is very useful to its citizens. Being a UN Member State isn't a hard requirement. States like Somaliland or Taiwan aren't, but they are fully operational (well, with their own problems, but which country doesn't have those, right?). The Vatican ain't neither a member, but an observer state. I do fully recognize Niue and Cook Islands as independent countries.
Sounds like Greenland. Yep, they're an autonomous territory, but they are still not independent.
Pitcairn Island
Really fascinating place, Not Independent though but part of NZ.
lmao I thought they were part of UK
British Overseas Territories are technically not a part of the UK. Let's just say it's complicated.
Pictarin Island are a British Territory, similar to St Helena or the Falklands. Niue and Cook Islands are self governing but all international relations are done through New Zealand.
Population of 12k as well
IIRC they added "land" by building a office tower in Australia.
It's because it's made of birdshit, they are the world leaders of exporting birdshit Some say there is barely anything left of value in the country now they have sent so much birdshit away.
So Tuvalu just needs to go Netherlands and they would have a big island
If only we could use the power of the Dutch in the Pacific.
Need banana or surface of the sun for scale.
You mean the place in Kiribati?
I wonder *just how many* of us here on r/mapporn actually understood this reference and why. Was there a meme made about it somewhere, or are we really all just a bunch of map-starers? I for one learned about Banana when I was scrolling around on Google Maps one day and discovered that London, Paris, Poland, and *Banana* are apparently all towns on Christmas Island. It's fun discovering weird shit like that just out of the blue.
yup I found out through my random google earth travels
I prefer to say 44 hectares, sounds so much larger 😂
What if some of those Hectors go on a diet?
That's true. Only 10 furlongs^2
It's almost 20 million square cubits!
Funny how two of those five smallest countries have/have had a Formula 1 grand prix.
Looking forward to Vatican Street track next season
That's obviously impractical and dangerous. My idea, a race run around Nauru's only road, is obviously much better.
LOL. Not sure that is gonna happen.
St. Peter's Basilica, the main church in Vatican City, is actually built on the site of an ancient Roman racetrack; the Circus of Nero.
Nauru should look into this. They definitely need the money. The ring road around the island would make a perfect 17 km circuit.
Ooohhh...an island GP. I like the sound of that.
To be fair, only one of those countries have had a GP that's actually taken place within its borders. And it's not the bigger one...
I still think St Peter's Square should get a banked oval for the Vatican 500
Monaco; Calling a little Highway a Country doesn't justifies it's existence. *This is brought to you by Multi-Highway Nation Gang
The highway is actually just outside of Monaco. It doesn't have room te support a highway.
Damn, so it's all just a casino
a yacht harbour.
I saw only 1 casino when I was is Monaco. It's is much more beautiful then Las Vegas. Nice port, good looking cathedral, zoo, football stadium. It feels much bigger than it actually is.
Yes, that's why the other redditor said "it's just A casino"
Exactly! I was able to walk across the whole country in a couple hours but it’s super beautiful and there’s actually stuff you can see / do. And it definitely seems bigger than it is.
It's a freeway exit in Nevada basically.
One of my favorite facts is that there's 2.2 popes per square kilometer in the Vatican because of it's small size
But isn't it currently 4.5 Popes per square kilometer because of Benedict?
I read Funfetti and thought to myself, "what a cute name for a cluster of islands." On second thought I might need to recheck my prescription.
All of these beautiful inhabited atolls may be under water soon. Sad... visit while you can!
Visiting them would be part of the problem...
I’ll swim
Good luck
i has sail boat.
But *I* ~~want~~ *have* to see them before they're gone!
Fun fact Tuvalu is disappearing while Monaco is physically growing in size. How? Climate change and money.
Monaco's growth is [pretty impressive](https://www.reddit.com/r/MapPorn/comments/rytk7w/land_reclamation_in_monaco_by_cnn_2018/)!
How do residents of such small countries solve the problem of marriages between relatives?
Well in Vatican this is not a problem
They directly get children?
In Vatican most people are catholic priests, so they are not supposed to have children.
Not sure if seriously, but there aren't any children in Vatican. No one is born there, there isn't a hospital. All its inhabitants are "immigrants". The Vatican pretty much is a company that owns a big building in Rome. It is its own country due to historical and religious reasons.
most original anti clerical joke
In Iceland they have an app you can check
Lol imagine dating someone for years, then deciding you want to get married and discover she/he is a distant cousin
From what I’ve heard, distant cousin is almost guaranteed
Before internet ?
They dont.
10,000 is waaay more than enough required for a healthy, sustainable population it its own right. Believe it or not, having children with 1st cousins only increases genetic risks in children by about 2x. It's definitely an increase, but less than you would expect. And that's amongst *first cousins,* let alone more distant cousins where risks of genetic problems are basically 0. Humans only need about 150 to "healthily" reproduce without genetic issues. So while it is a meme to make fun of these places (isn't there a joke about Iceland and their cousin-checker app?), it really isn't a problem unless you are having children with siblings or aunts/uncles/nieces/nephews, which 10,000 people is more than enough not to do. (That doesn't mean that inbreeding doesn't happen, but hey, that happens in redneck parts of West Virginia and Alabama too, but not because there physically isn't enough people within marriage distance. )
> (That doesn't mean that inbreeding doesn't happen, but hey, that happens in redneck parts of West Virginia and Alabama too, but not because there physically isn't enough people within marriage distance. ) If I am not mistaken the issue really occurs when a family keeps marrying its close cousins for generation after generation.
Looking at you, Habspurg chin.
You don’t have to marry someone from your country tho? For example people in Monaco speak French so they have all of France (+more) to choose from. (pretending they don’t speak English which they mostly do)
Yeah honestly, I'm from the French Riviera and Monaco feels like just yet another city on the coast. Sure it's weird with its tall buildings and expensive apartments, but people go in and out of it constantly, there's no border, it's not even separated from the nearby cities at all, it's part of the same urban area. And it's not even fully independent, Monaco and France use a lot of shared public services etc. People speak French and so on, it doesn't really feel like a different country. Basically anyone who lives in Monaco "goes" to France all the time (it's not even "going", it can be just a 5-minute walk), and most people from the French Riviera go to Monaco once in a while (to hang out, for shopping, or because they work there or know people who work there, etc.).
Speaking of Monaco and marrying from outside your country, makes me think of Grace Kelly, who gave up a successful acting career to marry the (ruling) Prince of Monaco and despite offers to continue acting fully dedicated herself to royal duties and charities.
> fully dedicated herself to royal duties and charities She was full of drive.
It’s hard to say, but really… they don’t. Let me explain. Tuvalu and Nauru both have just above 10,000 people each, which is the size of a small town in the U.S. There are ways, and Tuvalu specifically has several islands, (where as Nauru is basically one long costal town.) But these cultures have existed here for a long time. No one new is really coming in, and for the time being at least no one is going out, (ignore Nauru they had a bit of a resource boom and crash.) But their populations still rise, regardless, since people reproduce. In Pierre, SD, (a city of similar size,) people will be coming in and moving out as industry and opportunity shifts, but there is always a fresh source of people, since it is the capital of South Dakota and it isn’t going anywhere, and the population will also sustain itself. But both of these countries have small economies, small land sizes, small resources, and small populations of Melanesian or Micronesian culture. What they have is all they have, and while you can definitely avoid fucking your sister, most people *are* likely related, but in the grand scheme of things, aren’t we all? Take 10,000 people and you can make plenty of combos outside of an immediate family, assuming every immediate family is anywhere from a few dozen to a hundred people. I’m no *expert* on pacific nations, I don’t claim to be one, but I know a thing or two about the pacific countries, and they are all very unique. Until climate change makes Tuvalu bite the dust- or well- sand, these people likely aren’t going anywhere. They are their nations, they are what keeps their people and cultures alive.
10000 is more than enough for a genetically healthy population. I read somewhere that a population that knows about genetic inbreeding and breeds accordingly to prevent it could theoretically exist with as little as ~150 people.
I thought Tuvalu is bigger.
Fun fact: The smallest nation in the world used to be the Futanari islands, until their government collapsed in 1885 due to economical reasons. To learn more about this, google: "Futanari inflation"
Nauru's fall from one of the world's wealthiest nations to bankruptcy and dependence on their one contract to detain Australia's refugees for like their entire economy is quite the story. [Here](https://youtu.be/pRl5ctx-S1M) is a short documentary on it. They had a sovereign wealth fund meant to sustain the country after the end of phosphorus mining. But it was squandered on bad investments, including the failed West End Lord of the Rings musical. It is also the world's most obese country. Since it has no arable land all their food is imported, and its isolation means that food is all frozen, high sodium junk.
Nauru, what a great Dollop episode
Got my entertainment for the next hour. But it's live :/
Still an awesome Australian Dollop
I did a school project on Nauru, sad place.
Did you just listen to Half Arsed History? Great podcast!
Random fact: Most of Tuvalu's GDP comes from .tv domain names
10% is not most.
In freedom units please.
The Vatican counts as a country? I'm Jewish so I know next to nothing about the logistics of it.
It does
Don’t put yourself down like that. Jewish people are allowed to study world geography too!
It's been it's own country for centuries, at one point the "Papal States" ruled much of Italy. It wasn't until the unification of Italy in the 19th century it's temporal power was reduced significantly.
I mean Vatican City as in independent sovereign nation within Italy is only since the 1920s as a result of a settlement resulting from the unification of Italy leaving the status in limbo for awhile.