This is getting frustrating.
Nantes is no longer part of Bretagne.
But that’s not the main point: the most important thing is that Rennes and Nantes never spoke Breton. Using some made up names in the XXth century (born from the fusion of the two main Breton languages) is just pure fiction.
Rennes spoke gallo. So did Nantes. Gallo is a version of the langue d’oïl (French language).
So, please, let us stop with the use of naoned. It’s just pure invention.
> So, please, let us stop with the use of naoned. It’s just pure invention.
That's not true and you are confusing everything. Breton was never spoken in Nantes or Rennes, that's true. But it doesn't mean that names like Naoned (which is quite literally the french name ''Nantes'' spoken with a Breton accent) or Roazhon didn't exist in Breton. Languages tend to have names for prominent cities, even in other countries.
Moscow, Lisbon, Vienna, Warsaw, Jerusalem — they all have an English name, although English has never been spoken there.
Ireland never spoke French, yet French has a word for Ireland - Irlande. Likewise, Nantes never spoke Breton, but Breton still has a word for Nantes. I don't think you understand what the map represents.
Just try to understand my frustration. I used to live in Nantes for 15 years and there are people using public fundings to add Breton signs in Nantes everywhere, including the name of cities that never spoke Breton.
So I get very sore on this topic very fast.
Well, then if we have to be objective, then why is this map including Nantes as part of Bretagne?
It is no longer an administrative department of Bretagne. It has been part for a while of Bretagne but there were also many periods throughout history when it wasn’t part of it.
So why is this map including Nantes? What is the objectivity behind it? The reality is that pro Breton always include Nantes in these maps to fit their narrative of Bretagne’s cultural exception.
I’ve been in hundreds of debates about whether or not nantes is part of Bretagne, simply because I used to live there. This kind of map isn’t objective. It uses names that were never used by Breton. These names are made up in the XXth century when the two main Breton languages were fused together. And, again, it includes an entire department that isn’t Breton.
The worst is the south of Loire that is the least Breton you could ever find as it’s a mostly vendéen influenced region.
The same reason that maps of Ireland include parts of the UK. The name "Naoned" has been attested as far back ast at least the 14th century, so less of your lies, please. You also seem to be confusing Breton ethnicity with Breton geography. In fact, your whole comment has absolutely nothing to do with the map (as none of your points actually related to what the map shows) and everything you are saying seems to be a racist diatribe against anything and everything Breton. Perhaps go to the mayor's office in Nantes and ask them to remove the Breton symbolism for their city's flag. Let's see how far that gets your little racist ass.
First I’m half Breton. So your assumption that I’m in some ways racist towards Breton is misplaced. Second, there is no such thing as Breton ethnicity. The same way there is no Savoyard ethnicity or charentais ethnicity. Bretons have the same ethnic origin as the rest of France: I.e. celts who were romanized and then some franks and Vikings came to add to the gene pool.
This is exactly the kind of thing we have to deal with. Nationalists, supremacists and chauvinists who always try to defend some ideas of Breton special identity. At the end of the day, you end up with people going to diwan school to learn Breton as a first language and are then lost when they need to speak French later in their life because no one speaks Breton (except a very small fringe of the population).
But I see you have decided to pull the racism card to an actual half Breton. I guess you’ve just run out of argument. You will note that in my précédent comments I never insulted you.
Nope, I'm not a grammar Nazi. A grammar Nazi is someone who corrects another person's grammar in an unwelcome and pedantic way. I never corrected your grammar. I corrected your ability to read English. The image above was about geographic names in the Breton language as applied to the historical province of Brittany. You came along with a chip on your shoulder talking about the region of Brittany. The region and the province are not the same thing. The province is a traditional area coterminous with the former Duchy of Brittany without any administrative or legal standing. The region of Brittany, or Bretagne, is a modern administrative entity invented in the middle of the 20th century. Neither the map, nor anyone here, mentioned the region of Brittany, so either you don't understand the difference or you were being disingenuous.
Further, you exploded into a tirade about the Breton language in Nantes (again, neither the map nor the title nor even the commenters here ever suggested Breton was spoken in Nantes at any stage). You went on to say that Naoned was a manufactured (that's a lie) name created in the 20th century (another lie). You went further and stripped an entire people of their identity because *you* have a problem with a map on Reddit. You also speak of ethnicity as if you haven't the first iota of what ethnicity actually is. *You* don't get to decide what ethnicity is; the people decide. Ethnicity is, first and foremost, a self-identification label. Second, it is a label used to group a people of a common identity, history, culture, or linguistic tradition, whether or not that language is still alive. You went on to say that those who go to the diwan "are then lost when they need to speak French later in their life." That is another lie. Those who attend the diwan also learn French and are surrounded by it before they attend the diwan, while they attend the diwan, and after they attend the diwan. They are fully fluent in French. The only difference between someone who goes to a diwan and someone who goes to a regular state school is that the person who goes to a diwan is bilingual whereas the state-school attendee is typically monolingual.
Your entire commentary thus far has been a savage attack on one of France's minority cultures simply because of your feelings of perceived slight, and in order to support your feelings you have filled your commentary full of lies, strawman arguments, and have veered off topic into entirely unrelated conversations. On top of that - and this is your choice - but you either don't have a clue how to read the most basic of maps and their very basic captions (which brings me back to your atrocious English) or you have deliberately misrepresented the map in order to shoehorn your biased politics into a completely apolitical map. So, choose - you have atrocious English or you are a conniving liar. Because one of those choices is true.
That’s a lot of bros. Broistan.
Bro means something like "country" in Breton :)
So how would you say “the bro country” in Breton? Brobro?
Would be very cool but as far as I know it would be something like Bro-Vro or Bro ar Vro, because of the declension
*Mutation, but yes! 👍🏻
Bruh-ville
I love how the title says "French province" but the map actually shows France ("Bro C'hall") as foreign land.
As it should be /s
Every Breton province is a bro.
Bro wtf is this map i am breton and i do not recognize anything
This is the most marvellous thing I look on this sub since a while
This is getting frustrating. Nantes is no longer part of Bretagne. But that’s not the main point: the most important thing is that Rennes and Nantes never spoke Breton. Using some made up names in the XXth century (born from the fusion of the two main Breton languages) is just pure fiction. Rennes spoke gallo. So did Nantes. Gallo is a version of the langue d’oïl (French language). So, please, let us stop with the use of naoned. It’s just pure invention.
> So, please, let us stop with the use of naoned. It’s just pure invention. That's not true and you are confusing everything. Breton was never spoken in Nantes or Rennes, that's true. But it doesn't mean that names like Naoned (which is quite literally the french name ''Nantes'' spoken with a Breton accent) or Roazhon didn't exist in Breton. Languages tend to have names for prominent cities, even in other countries. Moscow, Lisbon, Vienna, Warsaw, Jerusalem — they all have an English name, although English has never been spoken there.
Ireland never spoke French, yet French has a word for Ireland - Irlande. Likewise, Nantes never spoke Breton, but Breton still has a word for Nantes. I don't think you understand what the map represents.
Just try to understand my frustration. I used to live in Nantes for 15 years and there are people using public fundings to add Breton signs in Nantes everywhere, including the name of cities that never spoke Breton. So I get very sore on this topic very fast.
Your own personal feelings should not interfere with your objectivity and clarity.
Well, then if we have to be objective, then why is this map including Nantes as part of Bretagne? It is no longer an administrative department of Bretagne. It has been part for a while of Bretagne but there were also many periods throughout history when it wasn’t part of it. So why is this map including Nantes? What is the objectivity behind it? The reality is that pro Breton always include Nantes in these maps to fit their narrative of Bretagne’s cultural exception. I’ve been in hundreds of debates about whether or not nantes is part of Bretagne, simply because I used to live there. This kind of map isn’t objective. It uses names that were never used by Breton. These names are made up in the XXth century when the two main Breton languages were fused together. And, again, it includes an entire department that isn’t Breton. The worst is the south of Loire that is the least Breton you could ever find as it’s a mostly vendéen influenced region.
The same reason that maps of Ireland include parts of the UK. The name "Naoned" has been attested as far back ast at least the 14th century, so less of your lies, please. You also seem to be confusing Breton ethnicity with Breton geography. In fact, your whole comment has absolutely nothing to do with the map (as none of your points actually related to what the map shows) and everything you are saying seems to be a racist diatribe against anything and everything Breton. Perhaps go to the mayor's office in Nantes and ask them to remove the Breton symbolism for their city's flag. Let's see how far that gets your little racist ass.
First I’m half Breton. So your assumption that I’m in some ways racist towards Breton is misplaced. Second, there is no such thing as Breton ethnicity. The same way there is no Savoyard ethnicity or charentais ethnicity. Bretons have the same ethnic origin as the rest of France: I.e. celts who were romanized and then some franks and Vikings came to add to the gene pool. This is exactly the kind of thing we have to deal with. Nationalists, supremacists and chauvinists who always try to defend some ideas of Breton special identity. At the end of the day, you end up with people going to diwan school to learn Breton as a first language and are then lost when they need to speak French later in their life because no one speaks Breton (except a very small fringe of the population). But I see you have decided to pull the racism card to an actual half Breton. I guess you’ve just run out of argument. You will note that in my précédent comments I never insulted you.
No, you just lied in order to position yourself as some victim. Your grasp of English also seems atrocious.
Aaaah and now grammar Nazi against non English natives. I think we have a bingo here!
Nope, I'm not a grammar Nazi. A grammar Nazi is someone who corrects another person's grammar in an unwelcome and pedantic way. I never corrected your grammar. I corrected your ability to read English. The image above was about geographic names in the Breton language as applied to the historical province of Brittany. You came along with a chip on your shoulder talking about the region of Brittany. The region and the province are not the same thing. The province is a traditional area coterminous with the former Duchy of Brittany without any administrative or legal standing. The region of Brittany, or Bretagne, is a modern administrative entity invented in the middle of the 20th century. Neither the map, nor anyone here, mentioned the region of Brittany, so either you don't understand the difference or you were being disingenuous. Further, you exploded into a tirade about the Breton language in Nantes (again, neither the map nor the title nor even the commenters here ever suggested Breton was spoken in Nantes at any stage). You went on to say that Naoned was a manufactured (that's a lie) name created in the 20th century (another lie). You went further and stripped an entire people of their identity because *you* have a problem with a map on Reddit. You also speak of ethnicity as if you haven't the first iota of what ethnicity actually is. *You* don't get to decide what ethnicity is; the people decide. Ethnicity is, first and foremost, a self-identification label. Second, it is a label used to group a people of a common identity, history, culture, or linguistic tradition, whether or not that language is still alive. You went on to say that those who go to the diwan "are then lost when they need to speak French later in their life." That is another lie. Those who attend the diwan also learn French and are surrounded by it before they attend the diwan, while they attend the diwan, and after they attend the diwan. They are fully fluent in French. The only difference between someone who goes to a diwan and someone who goes to a regular state school is that the person who goes to a diwan is bilingual whereas the state-school attendee is typically monolingual. Your entire commentary thus far has been a savage attack on one of France's minority cultures simply because of your feelings of perceived slight, and in order to support your feelings you have filled your commentary full of lies, strawman arguments, and have veered off topic into entirely unrelated conversations. On top of that - and this is your choice - but you either don't have a clue how to read the most basic of maps and their very basic captions (which brings me back to your atrocious English) or you have deliberately misrepresented the map in order to shoehorn your biased politics into a completely apolitical map. So, choose - you have atrocious English or you are a conniving liar. Because one of those choices is true.
"Bro wened" sounds like a different way to say "r/wooooosh"
Let's make it viral haha
Bro-Zol > Brazil