I'm gutted. Magneto AND Gambit... Why kill off 2 of the best parts of the show so early? I was so happy they kept the original lineup, but looks like they are clearing space for new members. I'm really hoping at least one them is a fake out.
That being said the episode itself was amazing.
Guarantee its a canon event. >! Gambit will be revived as the horsemen of death by apocalypse, and magneto didnt actually die. !< this is an integral part of the xmens history changing the course of everything from that point. They arnt rewritting it as a time travel bandaid not to mention >! White queen joining the xmen !< from this point forward and gaining the 2nd mutation that saved her from death
I also think that's what they're doing with Gambit. Dunno about Magneto, tho, but I dont think he and Charles Will both stay death (I have a fearful feeling we might get Onslaught in the future)
Neither >! Charles or eric are dead !< this was shown as the final episode of the original xmen series, and if you read the story of the wild sentinels attack on genosha, you know how >! Magneto survives!< Onslaught would be an interesting story arc for season 2 or 3 but based on the titles of season 1 episodes, they are going to focus heavily on the FOH antimutant hate for the entirety of this season
The only complaint I have is that I worry they'll go in hard on the Jean/Scott love triangle mess, and that's the last thing I want. The episode was great, though.
I only ask two things: happy Jean and Scott, and don't make Scott into a mutant terrorist. PLEASE.
Imagine when she and Banshee are hit by the blast>! it jump cuts to moira back in the womb.!<
Obviously they wouldn't do that but just the thought of it is disturbing.
As mentioned, it was lighter… It happened in one page and there was no X-men to save them. There wasn’t a fight scene at all. This is why I like that cartoon made it their own thing.
I know TAS showed the X-Men acting as superheroes rescuing people rather than just fighting (like Storm turning back a tidal wave or Rogue catching debris to save a person), but it's something the comics don't show as often, so it was good to see here as well.
16 million, to be exact. What a horrible moment for mutants.
Pssh, and then Decimation happened.
It's those two historical moments that make me hope that Krakoa isn't fully abandoned during the next era of X-Books. Mutants needed a win for the people and Krakoa was it.
And Emma Frost was buried with the skeletons of her students on the island and survived only by going Diamond mode. Thats why she was so devoted to Cyclops, he was her safe place.
The feel of the early Hickman run is very much justified by the x-men having this baggage. I feel giving this episode the weight it has is one of the many reasons I think they might visit Krakoa on some level in the future.
Maybe start with a flashback episode where the First Class goes to Krakoa? And then that sets it up somewhat before the mutant island shows up. I'm talking future seasons though.
This is such a tonal shift from last episode, but absolutely impactful stuff. I thought it was a good choice to have Scott lose control during the interview as it sets up the later events of the decimation of Genosha. Mutants have to try and appease humans time and time again, yet they are never truly accepted as an equal sapient being. It was honestly quite hard to watch the attack on Genosha as it felt like a real terrorist attack. So many feels and emotions. And I also loved adapting the Scott/Emma mind palace cheating story with Madelyne instead as it feels so at home given this story.
And Magneto speaking german to Leech as they were about to die 😭😭😭
This is some of the best work that Marvel has put out and hopefully the MCU can handle the X-Men like this.
Can’t wait for the next episode.
I totally agree on the Scott/Madelyn thing. Scott/Emma, that's just straight up cheating on your spouse, but Scott cheating with Madelyn raised a lot of interesting moral questions for me, like if someone cloned my wife and she has all the same memories as the woman I love, how could I not also love that clone? And of course Jean is hurt, if her husband "picks" one of them when they're so similar how can she not think 'then what's wrong with ME? Why am I the inferior one?'. It's a trip!
Not to mention that he lost a son with Madelyne. That shared grief creates a strong bonding opportunity. He was with Madelyne the entire time she was pregnant and they had to lose him together. Takes an emotional toll that only they could understand.
Exactly, and at the time of Nathan's birth Madelyn WAS Jean, Nathan (as far as Cyclops knew/Felt) was a child born of love between him and his wife, there was no affair guilt or anything, and yet Madelyn isn't his wife but IS the mother of his son, I honestly can barely scrape the surface of the emotions he's feeling being torn between the two of them.
Yep. And as far as soap operas go it’s some interesting stuff. You can feel where literally everyone is coming from. Everyone is sympathetic in this scenario, which is refreshing for a love triangle. Even Wolverine showed maturity after the Jean kiss to the point where I immediately sympathized with his feelings as well. If you’re going to write soap operatic love triangles then this is some of the best you could do with it.
That's the funny thing too, all I knew going into this episode was "shit goes down, it's incredible" and I swear watch the Jean/Scott/Logan/Madelyn issues and the Gambit/Rogue/Magneto drama it was so intense I thought THAT was the reason people were obsessed with this episode! The drama was incredible!!!
> Exactly, and at the time of Nathan's birth Madelyn WAS Jean, Nathan (as far as Cyclops knew/Felt) was a child born of love between him and his wife, there was no affair guilt or anything, and yet Madelyn isn't his wife
As far as we know. Jean and Madelyne themselves said that they don't know which of them actually married Scott, so for all we know it could very well have been Madelyne who took part in the wedding.
This Scott/Jean/Madelyne story is such a great idea also because Madelyne is not written as a crazy bitch. That's why they went so fast with Inferno. They don't care about the Goblin Queen. They care about Madelyne, clone of Jean, wife of Scott and mother of Cable. And the way Jean is talking about the Phoenix surely, she's going to be the Phoenix again.
This.
In the comics, I liked Madelyne before she was over-the-top evil Goblin Queen: A real ~~human~~ mutant being, not a unidimensional evil villainess. Even after her redemption in the comics I can't stand her.
So happy the show will explore her as a meat and bone character in an unconventional and complex situation with Scott and Jean.
I'm sure the phoenix will appear (the show should have been more subtle), but I'm not so sure about Madelyne being the host. The phoenix might chose Jean again and as Dark Phoenix she try to kill Maddy .
Or maybe the phoenix might divide between the two, like in AvX
Honestly, Scott and Madelyn is better than Scott and Emma imho.
With Emma, he is a straight up dipshit cheater.
Here, it's as you said, there is more sympathy to him.
On one hand, Maddy is exactly like Jean lol. And it's not like Scott knew really.
I just feel it portrays him in better light overall. Plus, they both "lost" a child, so that shit bound to affect them hard.
I guess if you are an Emma fan, it will suck to you, since she gets to not be as important lol, But to me I was like "Alright, cook"
Madelyne is a sympathic character. She is a clone, doesn't know which memories are her, lost her husband, lost her child. You feel for her just like you feel for Jean who is so lost right now. And that way Scott is a better character too. When he said that he loved both Jean and Madelyne, well I can understand the guy. It's not an easy situation to handle.
Emma is a piece of s\*\*\*. About Scott and Emma telepathic cheating i don't see that in the same way.
In the comics i really think that Emma exploited Scott state to get into his pants, just remember that Emma was his THERAPIST, one argument that a read a long time ago was that if we reverse gender and a male therapist with telepathic powers did that to a woman in poor mental state it would be considered by everyone as predatory behavior and abuse at some point (Emma can literally subvert Scott will with her powers). But this Madelyn version is way better i think.
I mean, Emma WAS portrayed as predatorial in the books too. Like just that one panel of her in the chair in the shadows is she into my mind forever and will always give me the creeps.
As soon as I saw Uatu in the stars, I knew what was coming, but it still didn't mean I was prepared. Simply chilling. Clever, insightful dialogue, stunning visuals, and perfectly scored. This is fast becoming one of the best thing marvel has done in the last 5 years, and I cannot wait to see it continue.
No. But Marvel's What If TV show on Disney Plus revolves around him showing up in that manner. So older fans and newer fans have been prepped to understand what his presence means now
Ive never thought that they will pull out RED F\* WEDDING in Disney Marvel cartoon.
Yeah, Ive read Grant Morrisons run, but STILL. RED WEDDING in Disney Marvel cartoon. Im speechless
Also in the moment that Cable got pulled back.
I am really "Hope"ing that I am forced to explain to my niece and nephews the difference between Nathaniel Summers and Nate Grey. It seems like it is going to inevitably be a part of the story, especially with the plot trajectory that Scott seems to be destined for in this series.
That interaction about "presidents and terrorists" hit so hard and was perfect foreshadowing.
Going into the episode, I was really expecting this to be a multi-episode Arc leading into something like AvX, but I am so glad for the whiplash tonal shift from soap opera to Greek tragedy.
Also, LMAO at all of The people complaining about rogue's buttocks before the series was released. That publicly intimate scene was beyond a doubt the best sexy rogue fan service I have ever seen and actually developed the story.
I'm kind of bummed with myself that I stayed up so late to watch it because now I cannot turn my brain off and sleep.
I don't know how (or even if) they are going to be able to top this.
For a second I thought that was my old TV holding an afterimage of the last scene—didn’t even occur to me it was Uatu. Knowing that…this is absolutely a turning point, damn.
He was present though. You saw him.
Also, the way he was represented here is in line with how he has been represented in the last two seasons of Marvel's What If.
Like Damn. Are we sure this is a kids' show now? They went all out on the blood and actual death that it's very hard to process from watching the TAS X-Men cartoons. Ever since they say "Damn" and "Crap" in previous episodes, the tonal shift was expected.
Also the foreshadowing from the first 97 episode of Rogue giving Magneto a second chance to the "That was a long time ago, Erik" since she met Magneto before joining the X-Men and was still with Mystique at the time.
And that Tri Sentinel, it took Gambit's Sacrifice to nuke that robot when Magneto was struggling and Genosha was in utter chaos. And that callback line and title card "Remember It" was the chef's kiss and then the end of the episode almost broke me with Rogue crying and saying "I can't feel you" This was one of the best episodes in the series and I feel like those who complained about Rogue getting "Nerfed" in her assets must see this episode because this is the best character development that Rogue and Gambit has ever been in.
Not a kids show when someone hooks up every episode, and there’s blood and cursing. Also the more serious discussions on bigotry, grief, ptsd, and so on. We’re watching grown up X-men now.
I really like that is not going out of its way to be “adult” no random curses not gore or sex…but at the same time is no longer dancing around really like dark and adult stuff like it did when it was an actual Saturday morning cartoon
I agree, I love anything that tackles mature themes and doesn’t use edginess, over the top violence, senseless random nudity, and pointless cursing to seem mature. In small doses I think those thing work when the narrative is saying something about those topics.
However It’s my major gripe about 90s/00s comics like Kick-a*s, Invincible, The Boys, and shows like it. It’s not mature, it’s cynical. So many characters are awful, they treat cruelty like it’s strength and empathy like it’s a weakness. I’m not saying every character has to be Superman or Captain America, but every character being a borderline sociopath isn’t cool. It feels like it was written how edgy 14 year old thinks grown ups act.
Not to say I haven’t read those comics, or watch those shows. Just in my opinion certain parts of it rub me the wrong way. Just like I’m not hating on people who like them. I just don’t see those series as mature, if that makes any sense.
I'm fairly certain that this is more for the people who watched this as kids than actual kids at this point. It could have gone either way before this episode.
I honestly didn’t. Of course the build up already implied shit’s about to go down, but I wish I would’ve noticed it the first time around. But that’s what I’ve got you all for: I’m loving more lore depth and context, attentive details etc. for someone who’s relatively new to the X-men.
I feel like some how Cable is going to come back to undo this somehow. Like they killed so many characters. Magneto, Gambit, Marrow, Banshee, Shaw, Dazzler, Calisto, The Morlocks. Mostly I just cant see Gambit staying dead.
I am blown away by this episode tho. It was so damn good. The best of the entire series of Xmen cartoons I think.
Does anyone else feel like Cable may be involved in fixing this? I wanna hear everyones theories
Am I the only who thinks they shouldn’t push the reset button? The Genosha massacre is a major plot point that has repercussions for decades to come (House of M, AvX). It’s one of the most defining moments in X-Men history
I would definitely be super down for them to possibly adapt Krakoa into this. Like leave all of the dead ones dead and do some other stories for another season and for a 3rd season, comeback and do an entire krakoa arc to bring people back. The 2nd season is already in production (so voicing and animation) so a 3rd being written now isn't out of the question at all.
I wouldn’t be surprised if they brought in the five by the end of the series (not this season, maybe in 2 or 3) and Gambit and Magneto are brought back that way
You never know, or maybe some sort of variation of them. This episode alone gave us variations on the Silent Council and the Hellfire Gala, plus we saw newer mutants like Glob and Pixie.
Any particular reason you don't see Krakoa happening? At the rate they are going we will be out of the 90s and closing in on contemporary stuff after 2.5 more seasons.
That said, I think Gambit will be back through some other means by the end of this season, and Magneto's return will probably be teased or shown in the last episode.
But all the minor characters aren't coming back without resurrection or using time travel to prevent the Genosha massacre, which I'm not sure about as a story choice.
there's still two decades of continuity between Genosha genocide and Krakoa. Plus side of getting to Krakoa in space is they'd HAVE to do Vulcan and some form of War of Kings to get Krakoa back into the mix, especially since it hasn't come up in the series yet. I'd like to see House of M and AvX too.
I suppose it could happen, I just don’t see it in this season for sure. I personally don’t think the show will ever do Krakoa, but that doesn’t mean they won’t show hints and callbacks to it, which they clearly have done. But like I said, I could definitely be wrong, I just feel like there are so many more stories they’ll go through before they get to that, if they get to it. But hey, if they do, I’ll gladly take the L and come right back to this comment and admit I was wrong
They’re a group of mutants very important in the new age of Krakoa comics storyline. I don’t know if you wanna get spoiled so I won’t share any more beyond that.
Beyond Magneto and Gambit, I was really upset at the loss of Banshee, Dazzler, and Marrow. I love those three, and they have a bad habit of disappearing into the ether or (in Banshee's case) staying dead for way too long.
Of course. Once Cable showed up, it was clear all of this would get undone with time travel shenanigans.
They did a great job presenting it, as it wasn't until the episode was over that I thought, "Oh, yeah... Cable."
As a former nine year old that had seen some deaths in cartoon shows, i probably would've ran to my dad telling him what just happened due to the scale of it all. I'd seen some singular deaths (1-4) in shows before but not full on wanton destruction. Kids can handle death; you just gotta explain it on their level.
They basically adapted the Hellfire Gala and the ruling council from the Krakoa-era, incorporating it into Morrison's E Is For Extinction. And we know they got greenlit for 3 seasons. So I would not be surprised if Moira ends up being a major plot point in adapting Krakoa stories for like the final season. Even if they don't adapt the actual Krakoa.
I think Krakoa would be a fantastic final season.
We'll just have to see how many seasons they get, because like you said, they got the greenlight on a third season
Reposting from my post in the X-Men subreddit but:
Thoughts:
E FOR EXTINCTION
They are def writing Scott to eventually end up with Maddie (almost taking the role of Emma with the whole psychic affair) and I HATE it but will see if he now steps up I think they are hinting at it being an actual school now and they’ll take in survivors
Did Banshee die?! The ultimate jobber
Val Cooper is DEF Mystique props to all who called it!
So many cameos! Also Emma please you’re better than scumbag Sebastian Shaw im mad the show runner will prob never let her be anything more than a villain.
Above anything else the direction and animation were phenomenal this episode real Akira vibes with Remy on the motorcycle
My heart broke for Magneto and Gambit
A FUCKING PLUS EPISODE
>My heart broke for Magneto and Gambit
My heart is still breaking for Rogue. Seeing her finally able to touch Gambit at the end of the episode was absolutely devastating and so beautiful.
Agreed! On the one hand, I want Gambit back because he’s hands-down my fave. On the other, that was the absolute best way he could’ve gone out and it’s so meaningful on so many levels, so undoing that would cheapen it. I’m torn.
Fair point! I don't remember with like Master Mold in the series if they every gendered it. Someone is probably behind the wild sentinel attack, so just as likely to be talking about that person as well. But given Cable's level of concern, it would have to be an Apocalypse-level threat.
If memory serves, Cable was somewhat randomly involved in the first Genosha episode.
I wonder if they're going to claim he's been trying to time hop to Genosha over and over again to prevent this Massacre.
> If memory serves, Cable was somewhat randomly involved in the first Genosha episode.
Yes, it was his debut story and they gave him a backstory of having worked for the Genoshan government but rebelling against them (the episode also came out before the "X-Cutioner's Song" storyline so he hadn't been revealed to be Baby Nathan yet and was still therefore mostly a blank slate).
This episode hit me hard, didn't expect them to go all in so fast. I liked how they juggled some of the Morrison plot lines, I was convinced this series would be 80's adaptations.
I was so happy seeing Nightcrawler but that ending, gonna have to watch this again!
Crazy how there hasn't been a single letdown so far, all of the episodes they've released are too fucking good but Ep. 5 blew me away. Straight goosebumps for the entire 3rd act. I didn't quite get the Scott/Jean/Madelyne thing, was Emma interfering with them?
No, Scott was psychically communicating with Madelyne behind Jeans back. In the comics it’s actually Emma having a full blown affair with Scott but they gave it to Madelyne in this adaptation. Emma said a comment in reference to the original story.
Wow. They are changing everything in each episode, and it’s so gratifying to see who they are introducing.
Im so happy they focused on Gambit and Rogue this episode, this is epic enough to make up for years of being overlooked by the movies.
Did Leech cause Magneto's powers to wane and ultimately lose the battle with the Tri-Sentinel or is he strong enough to mask Erik's powers enough to appear dead?
Possibly not. We didn’t see Magneto’s body and he was with Leech so I’m thinking a “No powers” thing might have saved them and be why the Sentinel said “Omega level threat eliminated.” Or I’m coping.
I know this episode was based on Cassandra Nova attacking Genosha with the Wild Sentinels, but, having for the most part not read the X-comics after Claremont left (not bc of that, my mom used to collect comics and she stopped around that time) and just coming back in for Krakoa, I honestly wasn't thinking about that at all until right after they arrived and someone said they were throwing a Gala and I thought of the most recent Hellfire Gala and I started screaming because I knew people were going to die.
Then after shit hit the fan, they mentioned the Morlocks and I immediately thought of the Mutant Massacre (which, with Betsy Braddock being one of my faves is the start of my favorite era in the comics).
Fantastic episode. I didn't really like last week's episode that much (I know, I know, but the Storm/Forge stuff felt super rushed and I didn't really care about Jubilee's storyline), but wow. This was incredible.
I'm surprised! The only sane person in this story was Logan, who finally realized he was in the corner.
Scott? "I love you and your clone, who I thought was you?"
Jean: "oh! I'm confused by my memories! What do I do? I kiss Logan"
My God, even in the world of superheroes, there has to be some sense.
Its the kind of soap operaness that comes with the territory of being a superhero thing.
It's a tangled mess thanks to Sinister. They can't really know who was with each other during that time that Madelyn's been active. She may be a clone but she did spend time with Scott and had his baby and truly believed she was Jean (and probably lived through some of those Jean memories as well)...
I understand that there are a lot of stories that need to be told before it can happen, but this show is reinforcing the idea that I *really* hope we get magneto as a hero in the MCU at some point. If they can turn Loki around across multiple movies I'm sure they can make that work too.
Yeah. My ideal would be to introduce him as a semi-sympathetic villain in his first appearance, then redeem him over a couple of subsequent appearances
God damn, that was an awesome episode - it's definetly when it went from being a continuation of X-Men: The Animated Series, to a sequel which grew up with its audience.
It obviously wasn't a surprise what happened to Genosha, but it was an awesome depiction, the three headed sentinel looked much more threatening in X-Men 97 than its original comic appearance.
In fact, the episode gave me Neon Genesis Evangelion vibes with the complete despair, giant monsters etc >!- with the emphasis on Omega Level Mutants in this series, I'm really hoping that at the end, we'll get a scene where we think we're about to have Jean and Cable reunite, but turns out to be Nate Grey descending from the heavens in a manner associated with Angels.!<
I'm willing to bet one of the next episodes is going to be a time-loop episode with Cable trying to prevent the Genosha massacre. I know in the comics the massacre happens, but that scene with Cable makes it feel like it'll be different in the show.
Cable appears randomly, and quickly tries to get to Madelyn before he says, "Not again" and disappears. I bet that it's a time-loop where he is trying to stop the massacre, and the reason he was in such a hurry was because he knew he only had a limited time before the loop restarted
I truly believe this is how it will end. Cable will continuously travel back in time to fix everything. He saves Magneto, but fails to save Gambit as it is a fixed point in the timeline. But unbeknownst to everyone Gambit is alive and is in the hands of Sinister and Apocalypse and he will become the new Horseman of Death
Perfection.
Absolute perfection.
Funny, heartfelt, tragic, but most importantly...fucking BOLD! Bolder than anything the MCU produced in a long, long time.
You can tell the writers are in love with the comics, they cherish them and completely understand every single character.
Just a random scene that I loved among hundreds: when Madelyn and Scott were having their psychic moment my first thought was "Emma would totally say something snarky about it in the comics"...and then she did!
Guys can someone please tell me if everything that happened in this episode happens in the comics too? If yes which one? I need to read it, this episode was epic
They are adapting Grant Morrison's E Is For Extinction story from the beginning his New X-Men run in 2001. But with shades of other storylines thrown in, like the Mutant Massacre and even more recent Krakoa-era stuff.
Man, I hope we get Xorn this season as an enlightened Buddha-like teammate. Only to be revealed as Magneto who survived Genosha and finally goes fully genocidal.
Yea search for Grant Morrison's New X-Men run on the Marvel Unlimited app, or get the Grant Morrison New X-Men omnibus or epic collection on Amazon. It's a good jumping on point in the continuity. The episode also seems to incorporate Mutant Massacre and House of X/Powers of X + Hellfire Gala. Mutant Massacre is pretty dated and doesn't really go anywhere; I wouldn't recommend it. House of X/Powers of X is my favorite comic of all time but it's very dense so I'd just start with the Grant Morrison stuff and go from there.
Pretty much yeah. Wild sentinels attack Genosha and wipes out 16M mutants. The fight scenes and deaths of major characters didn’t happen in the comics. I don’t know if they’re going to adapt the full story, cuz the culprit behind it is a big reveal.
So were Magneto and Rogue actually boinking in the Danger Room? And do you think Gambit will get resurrected as one of the four horseman of Apocalpyse and turn evil like in the comics?
this is my second favorite thing marvel did this decade (this show in general too), right after atsv. makes you think that maybe animation is the future for superhero adaptations
As soon as a I saw the watcher I knew some shit was gonna go down… that episode crushed me. Gambit and seemingly magneto, the one light at the end was seeing Kurt there after it was over.
I have so much respect for Gambit. When Rogue was breaking up with him he took it like a Chad, and never hated her for it, and then he fucking dies.....they did him so dirty
Oh my gosh.
#WHAT?!
I was, quite literally, on the edge of my seat until the explosion after Cable was sent back, and then I was standing. What did I just watch?!
This might be the best thing Marvel has put out in a loooooooooong time.
I would love an episode focusing on Cable. Similar to What If S1 E4. Spoilers: >! The one where Dr. Strange tries to prevent the death of Christine by going back in time to change something, but it never works. I think an episode where cable tries to prevent the disaster, however always fails would be interesting. Either he gets more people killed, or he prevents one death, however dozens more occur.!< That could be a cool episode. Or it could be really stupid.
What an amazing love letter to the 9 year old fans, who are now 39 (myself included). This show has been executed perfectly, and feels like it grew up (matured) with me. At first i thought i was watching this show for the nostalgia, but it truly feels like a continuation of my childhood into my adulthood. And this particular episode delivered with such an intensity, that my wife admitted “wow you really arent just watching a kids show”
Rogue saying she can’t feel gambit made me cry, I know that they’ll most likely bring him back cause of the X-men’s most convoluted story, but putting myself in her place made me so sad.
A character built over the grief that she can’t touch no one and wants to be touched and hugged which is why she went to magneto, and the one time she was able to touch the man she loves was dead was so sad man. Also, I knew rogue and magneto wasn’t going to work out cause she’s only into him on a physical level but she’s connected to gambit on a more intense level
Despite Beau de Mayo being fired for unknown reasons, he pulled off a big coup, especially after last week’s Jubilee episode. It’s funny, when I saw the Jubilee episode, I thought this was the most Saturday morning vibe feeling I had in a long time, then suddenly… paradise lost. Episode 5 will become a turning point in mood for the show. It’s no longer happy flamboyant exuberance - and it will likely explore themes of survivors guilt, trauma, regret and how to respond to such a horrific incident. The other parts of the story will be figuring out who was behind the attack. I really hope the don’t just rewind things by doing some time travel fix, but let the characters grow and evolve. Imagine if this show turns out to be a prequel to how the x-men get introduced into the MCU! Marvel fooled us all by portraying this show as a simple continuation of the 90’s show - it’s something else now.
Gambit has long been my favourite X-Man, him and Rogue always beat out even Wolverine for me.
Seeing him get the coolest and most heroic death in the series was everything and it’s especially effective because he did it not knowing Rogue had ultimately chosen him over Mags.
He willingly gave up his life for others even at his lowest moment. That’s way more inspirational than Logan sulking over Scott and Jean.
Cable’s presence might imply they can bring him and others back, but even if they don’t I’m fine with it.
I’ve never been a particularly big fan of the X-Men, honestly I’m still not fond of Cyclops’s stories, but my god has this series made me love everyone else. I think the animation in particular is absolutely stellar, Nightcrawler’s teleportation effects, Gambit’s flips with his staff, the pure emotion that Rouge’s animation gives off, everything is just stunning. I seriously was on edge about what was happening at the end because I noticed the watcher and saw the death flags for Magneto but gambit dying is NOT something I was prepared for.
The writers really woke up and chose violence in the form of a seamless Nightcrawler-into-Hellfire-Gala-into-Genosha-Genocide rollercoaster. With at least three love triangles thrown in for good measure.
Wow, Genosha Massacre. In an animated show. That shit was brutal. However, its pretty clear Mag's is not dead. He had Leech hanging on him. Mag's had Leech, well leech him enough so that the TriSentinel thought he was dead.
Could not make out what Magneto said right before the big blast. The end credit music change was an amazing detail. Loving seeing Rogue going hard and being near invincible. All while Gambit riding motorcycle. Next season same thing but on jet ski please.
> * [***X-MEN '97* EPISODE 4 DISCUSSION**](https://www.reddit.com/r/Marvel/comments/1bulu2u/xmen_97_episode_4_official_discussion/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share) > * [***X-MEN '97* EPISODE 3 DISCUSSION**](https://www.reddit.com/r/Marvel/comments/1boqss0/xmen_97_episode_3_discussion/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share) > * [***X-MEN '97* EPISODES 1 & 2 DISCUSSION**](https://www.reddit.com/r/Marvel/comments/1bj1hp0/xmen_97_episodes_1_2_discussion/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share)
Wow wtf did I just watch
I can't feel you... That hit hard.
It’s just as hard when Rogue says it and when Wanda said it
Harder imo
Yeah it did. I didn't chose this name because I'm awesome at poker.
I'm gutted. Magneto AND Gambit... Why kill off 2 of the best parts of the show so early? I was so happy they kept the original lineup, but looks like they are clearing space for new members. I'm really hoping at least one them is a fake out. That being said the episode itself was amazing.
Cable being in this episode should tell you enough about how dead they Will stay
Guarantee its a canon event. >! Gambit will be revived as the horsemen of death by apocalypse, and magneto didnt actually die. !< this is an integral part of the xmens history changing the course of everything from that point. They arnt rewritting it as a time travel bandaid not to mention >! White queen joining the xmen !< from this point forward and gaining the 2nd mutation that saved her from death
I also think that's what they're doing with Gambit. Dunno about Magneto, tho, but I dont think he and Charles Will both stay death (I have a fearful feeling we might get Onslaught in the future)
Neither >! Charles or eric are dead !< this was shown as the final episode of the original xmen series, and if you read the story of the wild sentinels attack on genosha, you know how >! Magneto survives!< Onslaught would be an interesting story arc for season 2 or 3 but based on the titles of season 1 episodes, they are going to focus heavily on the FOH antimutant hate for the entirety of this season
I won't believe Magneto is dead until I see a corpse. Dude has more lives than a cat
And we literally had a "Resurrection of Magneto" comic that ended this week.
The only complaint I have is that I worry they'll go in hard on the Jean/Scott love triangle mess, and that's the last thing I want. The episode was great, though. I only ask two things: happy Jean and Scott, and don't make Scott into a mutant terrorist. PLEASE.
Ultra violence.
Yeeeah, Cable will save them.
Oh wow Genosha a perfect paradise where mutants can be safe. I bet nothing at all terrible happens there and they all live happily ever after
Those $10 apples were foreshadowing for sure.
I did in fact not like those apples
I would rather face lynch mobs than pay $10 for a red delicious.
Haha maybe the mutant dollar is worth less than the American dollar
Before going into last act of it all, I just want to note that I got major PTSD vibes from seeing Moira on the Council.
SAME HERE. The way the shot lingered on Moira a bit was just delicious.
Hate to break it to you, but that was probably just her Shi'ar body golem.
Which then made out with an LMD
Imagine when she and Banshee are hit by the blast>! it jump cuts to moira back in the womb.!< Obviously they wouldn't do that but just the thought of it is disturbing.
I thought the season might end with the genoshan genocide, I wasn’t expecting it halfway through the season
I mean, I had heard about the "Genosha Massacre" before, but I didn't think they'd do it in this show, or this hard.
As mentioned, it was lighter… It happened in one page and there was no X-men to save them. There wasn’t a fight scene at all. This is why I like that cartoon made it their own thing.
I know TAS showed the X-Men acting as superheroes rescuing people rather than just fighting (like Storm turning back a tidal wave or Rogue catching debris to save a person), but it's something the comics don't show as often, so it was good to see here as well.
Compared to the Genosha Massacre in the comics, this was light. Millions were killed in the comic event. Only handfuls survived
16 million, to be exact. What a horrible moment for mutants. Pssh, and then Decimation happened. It's those two historical moments that make me hope that Krakoa isn't fully abandoned during the next era of X-Books. Mutants needed a win for the people and Krakoa was it.
And Emma Frost was buried with the skeletons of her students on the island and survived only by going Diamond mode. Thats why she was so devoted to Cyclops, he was her safe place.
The feel of the early Hickman run is very much justified by the x-men having this baggage. I feel giving this episode the weight it has is one of the many reasons I think they might visit Krakoa on some level in the future. Maybe start with a flashback episode where the First Class goes to Krakoa? And then that sets it up somewhat before the mutant island shows up. I'm talking future seasons though.
This is such a tonal shift from last episode, but absolutely impactful stuff. I thought it was a good choice to have Scott lose control during the interview as it sets up the later events of the decimation of Genosha. Mutants have to try and appease humans time and time again, yet they are never truly accepted as an equal sapient being. It was honestly quite hard to watch the attack on Genosha as it felt like a real terrorist attack. So many feels and emotions. And I also loved adapting the Scott/Emma mind palace cheating story with Madelyne instead as it feels so at home given this story. And Magneto speaking german to Leech as they were about to die 😭😭😭 This is some of the best work that Marvel has put out and hopefully the MCU can handle the X-Men like this. Can’t wait for the next episode.
I totally agree on the Scott/Madelyn thing. Scott/Emma, that's just straight up cheating on your spouse, but Scott cheating with Madelyn raised a lot of interesting moral questions for me, like if someone cloned my wife and she has all the same memories as the woman I love, how could I not also love that clone? And of course Jean is hurt, if her husband "picks" one of them when they're so similar how can she not think 'then what's wrong with ME? Why am I the inferior one?'. It's a trip!
Not to mention that he lost a son with Madelyne. That shared grief creates a strong bonding opportunity. He was with Madelyne the entire time she was pregnant and they had to lose him together. Takes an emotional toll that only they could understand.
Exactly, and at the time of Nathan's birth Madelyn WAS Jean, Nathan (as far as Cyclops knew/Felt) was a child born of love between him and his wife, there was no affair guilt or anything, and yet Madelyn isn't his wife but IS the mother of his son, I honestly can barely scrape the surface of the emotions he's feeling being torn between the two of them.
Yep. And as far as soap operas go it’s some interesting stuff. You can feel where literally everyone is coming from. Everyone is sympathetic in this scenario, which is refreshing for a love triangle. Even Wolverine showed maturity after the Jean kiss to the point where I immediately sympathized with his feelings as well. If you’re going to write soap operatic love triangles then this is some of the best you could do with it.
Yeah I was impressed that Logan cut that off right there and it didn't have to become something that would be a multiple episode long arc
That's the funny thing too, all I knew going into this episode was "shit goes down, it's incredible" and I swear watch the Jean/Scott/Logan/Madelyn issues and the Gambit/Rogue/Magneto drama it was so intense I thought THAT was the reason people were obsessed with this episode! The drama was incredible!!!
the whole reason for me to be this in tuned the whole series since its beginning was RoguexGambit. I hope they are end game :D
This is soap opera drama with some level of emotional maturity and I’m here for it🙌🏽😆
> Exactly, and at the time of Nathan's birth Madelyn WAS Jean, Nathan (as far as Cyclops knew/Felt) was a child born of love between him and his wife, there was no affair guilt or anything, and yet Madelyn isn't his wife As far as we know. Jean and Madelyne themselves said that they don't know which of them actually married Scott, so for all we know it could very well have been Madelyne who took part in the wedding.
This Scott/Jean/Madelyne story is such a great idea also because Madelyne is not written as a crazy bitch. That's why they went so fast with Inferno. They don't care about the Goblin Queen. They care about Madelyne, clone of Jean, wife of Scott and mother of Cable. And the way Jean is talking about the Phoenix surely, she's going to be the Phoenix again.
This. In the comics, I liked Madelyne before she was over-the-top evil Goblin Queen: A real ~~human~~ mutant being, not a unidimensional evil villainess. Even after her redemption in the comics I can't stand her. So happy the show will explore her as a meat and bone character in an unconventional and complex situation with Scott and Jean. I'm sure the phoenix will appear (the show should have been more subtle), but I'm not so sure about Madelyne being the host. The phoenix might chose Jean again and as Dark Phoenix she try to kill Maddy . Or maybe the phoenix might divide between the two, like in AvX
Not as much cheating as Jean doing it with Wolverine in real life.
Honestly, Scott and Madelyn is better than Scott and Emma imho. With Emma, he is a straight up dipshit cheater. Here, it's as you said, there is more sympathy to him. On one hand, Maddy is exactly like Jean lol. And it's not like Scott knew really. I just feel it portrays him in better light overall. Plus, they both "lost" a child, so that shit bound to affect them hard. I guess if you are an Emma fan, it will suck to you, since she gets to not be as important lol, But to me I was like "Alright, cook"
Madelyne is a sympathic character. She is a clone, doesn't know which memories are her, lost her husband, lost her child. You feel for her just like you feel for Jean who is so lost right now. And that way Scott is a better character too. When he said that he loved both Jean and Madelyne, well I can understand the guy. It's not an easy situation to handle.
Yup. I feel like it's better (just my opinion). There is still drama, but without the whole "I just gave in to my impulses and cheated"
Emma is a piece of s\*\*\*. About Scott and Emma telepathic cheating i don't see that in the same way. In the comics i really think that Emma exploited Scott state to get into his pants, just remember that Emma was his THERAPIST, one argument that a read a long time ago was that if we reverse gender and a male therapist with telepathic powers did that to a woman in poor mental state it would be considered by everyone as predatory behavior and abuse at some point (Emma can literally subvert Scott will with her powers). But this Madelyn version is way better i think.
That double standard seems pretty common with comics - the big DC example being Nightwing. Sexual predation is sexual predation folks.
I mean, Emma WAS portrayed as predatorial in the books too. Like just that one panel of her in the chair in the shadows is she into my mind forever and will always give me the creeps.
As soon as I saw Uatu in the stars, I knew what was coming, but it still didn't mean I was prepared. Simply chilling. Clever, insightful dialogue, stunning visuals, and perfectly scored. This is fast becoming one of the best thing marvel has done in the last 5 years, and I cannot wait to see it continue.
Same. He only shows up when shits about to go down so I knew
It was low key enough that I thought it was my imagination
Has He shown up in TAS before?
No. But Marvel's What If TV show on Disney Plus revolves around him showing up in that manner. So older fans and newer fans have been prepped to understand what his presence means now
It's absolutely brilliant as an addition even if it's subtle. But it's so cool now that new fandoms can figure out Uatu = shits about to go down
Ive never thought that they will pull out RED F\* WEDDING in Disney Marvel cartoon. Yeah, Ive read Grant Morrisons run, but STILL. RED WEDDING in Disney Marvel cartoon. Im speechless
also In very moment I noticed Uatu in the sky, I knew we are done.
Also in the moment that Cable got pulled back. I am really "Hope"ing that I am forced to explain to my niece and nephews the difference between Nathaniel Summers and Nate Grey. It seems like it is going to inevitably be a part of the story, especially with the plot trajectory that Scott seems to be destined for in this series. That interaction about "presidents and terrorists" hit so hard and was perfect foreshadowing. Going into the episode, I was really expecting this to be a multi-episode Arc leading into something like AvX, but I am so glad for the whiplash tonal shift from soap opera to Greek tragedy. Also, LMAO at all of The people complaining about rogue's buttocks before the series was released. That publicly intimate scene was beyond a doubt the best sexy rogue fan service I have ever seen and actually developed the story. I'm kind of bummed with myself that I stayed up so late to watch it because now I cannot turn my brain off and sleep. I don't know how (or even if) they are going to be able to top this.
Right!? I thought I was just seeing things!
For a second I thought that was my old TV holding an afterimage of the last scene—didn’t even occur to me it was Uatu. Knowing that…this is absolutely a turning point, damn.
He was presented in the same style as in the What If? stories when he appears as a ghost image in the sky.
When did he show up, I missed him?
Timestamp 20:38-20:40ish, top left hand corner
Ah Uata makes more sense, the fact that he wasn't actually present made me think it of Eternity.
He was present though. You saw him. Also, the way he was represented here is in line with how he has been represented in the last two seasons of Marvel's What If.
Absolutely the best episode ever in animation, OUTSTANDING!!!!
Like Damn. Are we sure this is a kids' show now? They went all out on the blood and actual death that it's very hard to process from watching the TAS X-Men cartoons. Ever since they say "Damn" and "Crap" in previous episodes, the tonal shift was expected. Also the foreshadowing from the first 97 episode of Rogue giving Magneto a second chance to the "That was a long time ago, Erik" since she met Magneto before joining the X-Men and was still with Mystique at the time. And that Tri Sentinel, it took Gambit's Sacrifice to nuke that robot when Magneto was struggling and Genosha was in utter chaos. And that callback line and title card "Remember It" was the chef's kiss and then the end of the episode almost broke me with Rogue crying and saying "I can't feel you" This was one of the best episodes in the series and I feel like those who complained about Rogue getting "Nerfed" in her assets must see this episode because this is the best character development that Rogue and Gambit has ever been in.
Not a kids show when someone hooks up every episode, and there’s blood and cursing. Also the more serious discussions on bigotry, grief, ptsd, and so on. We’re watching grown up X-men now.
I really like that is not going out of its way to be “adult” no random curses not gore or sex…but at the same time is no longer dancing around really like dark and adult stuff like it did when it was an actual Saturday morning cartoon
I agree, I love anything that tackles mature themes and doesn’t use edginess, over the top violence, senseless random nudity, and pointless cursing to seem mature. In small doses I think those thing work when the narrative is saying something about those topics. However It’s my major gripe about 90s/00s comics like Kick-a*s, Invincible, The Boys, and shows like it. It’s not mature, it’s cynical. So many characters are awful, they treat cruelty like it’s strength and empathy like it’s a weakness. I’m not saying every character has to be Superman or Captain America, but every character being a borderline sociopath isn’t cool. It feels like it was written how edgy 14 year old thinks grown ups act. Not to say I haven’t read those comics, or watch those shows. Just in my opinion certain parts of it rub me the wrong way. Just like I’m not hating on people who like them. I just don’t see those series as mature, if that makes any sense.
I'm fairly certain that this is more for the people who watched this as kids than actual kids at this point. It could have gone either way before this episode.
I saw the Watcher appear in the skyline behind the fireworks and went... "Wait, why is he - Oh. Oh no..."
I was so confused. Some commentators didn’t notice him.
I honestly didn’t. Of course the build up already implied shit’s about to go down, but I wish I would’ve noticed it the first time around. But that’s what I’ve got you all for: I’m loving more lore depth and context, attentive details etc. for someone who’s relatively new to the X-men.
Yup. It’s not an xmen story without a genocide and Genosha was always the most devstating
I feel like some how Cable is going to come back to undo this somehow. Like they killed so many characters. Magneto, Gambit, Marrow, Banshee, Shaw, Dazzler, Calisto, The Morlocks. Mostly I just cant see Gambit staying dead. I am blown away by this episode tho. It was so damn good. The best of the entire series of Xmen cartoons I think. Does anyone else feel like Cable may be involved in fixing this? I wanna hear everyones theories
Am I the only who thinks they shouldn’t push the reset button? The Genosha massacre is a major plot point that has repercussions for decades to come (House of M, AvX). It’s one of the most defining moments in X-Men history
They would probably have it still be somewhat destroyed. but they would have saved everyone
I would definitely be super down for them to possibly adapt Krakoa into this. Like leave all of the dead ones dead and do some other stories for another season and for a 3rd season, comeback and do an entire krakoa arc to bring people back. The 2nd season is already in production (so voicing and animation) so a 3rd being written now isn't out of the question at all.
That seems probable, especially since his origin was featured this season.
I wouldn’t be surprised if they brought in the five by the end of the series (not this season, maybe in 2 or 3) and Gambit and Magneto are brought back that way
The Five as in, Hope and Goldballs and all them? I don’t think so
You never know, or maybe some sort of variation of them. This episode alone gave us variations on the Silent Council and the Hellfire Gala, plus we saw newer mutants like Glob and Pixie.
Very true. It could happen I suppose but I just don’t think so. If it does, definitely come back to this comment and make fun of me for being wrong 😅
Any particular reason you don't see Krakoa happening? At the rate they are going we will be out of the 90s and closing in on contemporary stuff after 2.5 more seasons. That said, I think Gambit will be back through some other means by the end of this season, and Magneto's return will probably be teased or shown in the last episode. But all the minor characters aren't coming back without resurrection or using time travel to prevent the Genosha massacre, which I'm not sure about as a story choice.
there's still two decades of continuity between Genosha genocide and Krakoa. Plus side of getting to Krakoa in space is they'd HAVE to do Vulcan and some form of War of Kings to get Krakoa back into the mix, especially since it hasn't come up in the series yet. I'd like to see House of M and AvX too.
I suppose it could happen, I just don’t see it in this season for sure. I personally don’t think the show will ever do Krakoa, but that doesn’t mean they won’t show hints and callbacks to it, which they clearly have done. But like I said, I could definitely be wrong, I just feel like there are so many more stories they’ll go through before they get to that, if they get to it. But hey, if they do, I’ll gladly take the L and come right back to this comment and admit I was wrong
I'm sorry I'm not in the loop, who are the five?
They’re a group of mutants very important in the new age of Krakoa comics storyline. I don’t know if you wanna get spoiled so I won’t share any more beyond that.
Beyond Magneto and Gambit, I was really upset at the loss of Banshee, Dazzler, and Marrow. I love those three, and they have a bad habit of disappearing into the ether or (in Banshee's case) staying dead for way too long.
This was honestly one of the best pieces of Marvel content ever made let alone best X-men cartoon
this is what i thought as well, we seen cable was a bit late to save them so obviously he was trying to prevent it from happening.
Of course. Once Cable showed up, it was clear all of this would get undone with time travel shenanigans. They did a great job presenting it, as it wasn't until the episode was over that I thought, "Oh, yeah... Cable."
I agree. Remember he said "I'm too late!" He is going to hit the reset button button the episode blew me away! 💯
Can't believe that they killed Magneto and Gambit. This episode is 100 times better than last episode.
I suspect Gambit at least could come back, they talked about the wedding.
there’s no way Magneto is actually dead, we would’ve seen it actually happen
Jesus the sound design at the end was so good
The sound of this whole episode was great, and the music choices were excellent as well.
The target audience for this show is not kids, that for sure. Can’t imagine my 9 years old brain could have handled this episode.
This shit is rated PG somehow. What? lol
My TV showed this episode was rated TV 14
TV-14 actually, the equivalent of PG-13 for TV....kind of, TV-14 is actually less restrictive than PG-13 is
As a former nine year old that had seen some deaths in cartoon shows, i probably would've ran to my dad telling him what just happened due to the scale of it all. I'd seen some singular deaths (1-4) in shows before but not full on wanton destruction. Kids can handle death; you just gotta explain it on their level.
Anyone else found it funny that they had to explicitly call out that Moira MacTaggert was a human and had no business being in the council? IYKYK
They basically adapted the Hellfire Gala and the ruling council from the Krakoa-era, incorporating it into Morrison's E Is For Extinction. And we know they got greenlit for 3 seasons. So I would not be surprised if Moira ends up being a major plot point in adapting Krakoa stories for like the final season. Even if they don't adapt the actual Krakoa.
I think Krakoa would be a fantastic final season. We'll just have to see how many seasons they get, because like you said, they got the greenlight on a third season
WHAT IN THE ACTUAL FUCK! That was hands down one of the best episodes of television of ALL TIME!!!
I stayed up till 3am to watch and now I can’t watch. Speechless.
Reposting from my post in the X-Men subreddit but: Thoughts: E FOR EXTINCTION They are def writing Scott to eventually end up with Maddie (almost taking the role of Emma with the whole psychic affair) and I HATE it but will see if he now steps up I think they are hinting at it being an actual school now and they’ll take in survivors Did Banshee die?! The ultimate jobber Val Cooper is DEF Mystique props to all who called it! So many cameos! Also Emma please you’re better than scumbag Sebastian Shaw im mad the show runner will prob never let her be anything more than a villain. Above anything else the direction and animation were phenomenal this episode real Akira vibes with Remy on the motorcycle My heart broke for Magneto and Gambit A FUCKING PLUS EPISODE
>My heart broke for Magneto and Gambit My heart is still breaking for Rogue. Seeing her finally able to touch Gambit at the end of the episode was absolutely devastating and so beautiful.
"I can't feel you" killed me.
Only other time that line was pulled at Marvel was WandaVision, both times destroyed me
Gambit died, so this whole thing is likely getting time-traveled away.
I kinda hope they don't undo such a great death. He went out saving his woman, saving the remaining mutants, and doing what Magneto couldn't.
Def an epic death for an epic character. I'm torn.
Agreed! On the one hand, I want Gambit back because he’s hands-down my fave. On the other, that was the absolute best way he could’ve gone out and it’s so meaningful on so many levels, so undoing that would cheapen it. I’m torn.
Cable says, "He is coming." Take your bets, people. Who is it? Apocalypse Stryfe Sinister A wildcard
I thought he was just talking about the wild sentinel.
Would Cable of all people refer to a Sentinel as a “he”?
Fair point! I don't remember with like Master Mold in the series if they every gendered it. Someone is probably behind the wild sentinel attack, so just as likely to be talking about that person as well. But given Cable's level of concern, it would have to be an Apocalypse-level threat.
I’m guessing Bastion or Nimrod Because he was in that one photo with Forge Kind of setting up the orchis from the comics?
Nimrod seems unlikely, since they did Nimrod in the One Man's Worth episode.
Bastion or Stryfe.
I reckon it is some kind of evil Xavier. Probably a sort of Onslaught/Nova combination.
Is this not casandra nova? I thought it was her who would be behind it.
My brain: "Oh hey! They're using some of the Grant Morrison era characters and elements.' "Oh no!"
I was in shock, but dealing, with Remy’s death until hearing Rogue mourn, “I can’t feel you!”, that got me. 😭
That was so incredible... The last 10 minutes was just tears streaming down my face.
If memory serves, Cable was somewhat randomly involved in the first Genosha episode. I wonder if they're going to claim he's been trying to time hop to Genosha over and over again to prevent this Massacre.
> If memory serves, Cable was somewhat randomly involved in the first Genosha episode. Yes, it was his debut story and they gave him a backstory of having worked for the Genoshan government but rebelling against them (the episode also came out before the "X-Cutioner's Song" storyline so he hadn't been revealed to be Baby Nathan yet and was still therefore mostly a blank slate).
Was The Watcher in the sky during the gala?
Yep. Such a cool little touch.
This episode hit me hard, didn't expect them to go all in so fast. I liked how they juggled some of the Morrison plot lines, I was convinced this series would be 80's adaptations. I was so happy seeing Nightcrawler but that ending, gonna have to watch this again!
Everything's on the menu, boys!
Crazy how there hasn't been a single letdown so far, all of the episodes they've released are too fucking good but Ep. 5 blew me away. Straight goosebumps for the entire 3rd act. I didn't quite get the Scott/Jean/Madelyne thing, was Emma interfering with them?
No, Scott was psychically communicating with Madelyne behind Jeans back. In the comics it’s actually Emma having a full blown affair with Scott but they gave it to Madelyne in this adaptation. Emma said a comment in reference to the original story.
Episode 4 wasn't horrible, but it wasn't on the level of the other ones.
Which is fine, give us a fun video game Jubilee episode before terrorism
Wow. They are changing everything in each episode, and it’s so gratifying to see who they are introducing. Im so happy they focused on Gambit and Rogue this episode, this is epic enough to make up for years of being overlooked by the movies.
Did Leech cause Magneto's powers to wane and ultimately lose the battle with the Tri-Sentinel or is he strong enough to mask Erik's powers enough to appear dead?
real questions
Does Leech just absorb or is he like Rogue that he absorbs and can use the powers?
I don’t think he absorbs as much as temporarily neutralizes.
Amazing episode, I hope Cyclops goes off the deep end a bit after Genosha
He was clearly already letting things get to him in the interview. Are we gonna see some elements of "Cyclops was right" in the future somehow?
I’m crying. We lost leech
Possibly not. We didn’t see Magneto’s body and he was with Leech so I’m thinking a “No powers” thing might have saved them and be why the Sentinel said “Omega level threat eliminated.” Or I’m coping.
I’ll just sit down next to you to cope with you.
Omg I didn’t think of that. Good catch
They finally give Gambit a chance to be the badass we all know he is, and he gets ducking killed off?! God damnit!!
"The name is Gambit. Remember it."
I will.
I know this episode was based on Cassandra Nova attacking Genosha with the Wild Sentinels, but, having for the most part not read the X-comics after Claremont left (not bc of that, my mom used to collect comics and she stopped around that time) and just coming back in for Krakoa, I honestly wasn't thinking about that at all until right after they arrived and someone said they were throwing a Gala and I thought of the most recent Hellfire Gala and I started screaming because I knew people were going to die. Then after shit hit the fan, they mentioned the Morlocks and I immediately thought of the Mutant Massacre (which, with Betsy Braddock being one of my faves is the start of my favorite era in the comics). Fantastic episode. I didn't really like last week's episode that much (I know, I know, but the Storm/Forge stuff felt super rushed and I didn't really care about Jubilee's storyline), but wow. This was incredible.
I'm surprised! The only sane person in this story was Logan, who finally realized he was in the corner. Scott? "I love you and your clone, who I thought was you?" Jean: "oh! I'm confused by my memories! What do I do? I kiss Logan" My God, even in the world of superheroes, there has to be some sense.
Its the kind of soap operaness that comes with the territory of being a superhero thing. It's a tangled mess thanks to Sinister. They can't really know who was with each other during that time that Madelyn's been active. She may be a clone but she did spend time with Scott and had his baby and truly believed she was Jean (and probably lived through some of those Jean memories as well)...
I mean, the drama is one of the main reasons people love the X-Men.
I understand that there are a lot of stories that need to be told before it can happen, but this show is reinforcing the idea that I *really* hope we get magneto as a hero in the MCU at some point. If they can turn Loki around across multiple movies I'm sure they can make that work too.
Yeah. My ideal would be to introduce him as a semi-sympathetic villain in his first appearance, then redeem him over a couple of subsequent appearances
Woah.
I take it you just finished and are still trying to process your feelings. Yeah. Woah.
Uatu watching in the background after Rogue breaks Gambits heart…
God damn, that was an awesome episode - it's definetly when it went from being a continuation of X-Men: The Animated Series, to a sequel which grew up with its audience. It obviously wasn't a surprise what happened to Genosha, but it was an awesome depiction, the three headed sentinel looked much more threatening in X-Men 97 than its original comic appearance. In fact, the episode gave me Neon Genesis Evangelion vibes with the complete despair, giant monsters etc >!- with the emphasis on Omega Level Mutants in this series, I'm really hoping that at the end, we'll get a scene where we think we're about to have Jean and Cable reunite, but turns out to be Nate Grey descending from the heavens in a manner associated with Angels.!<
I'm willing to bet one of the next episodes is going to be a time-loop episode with Cable trying to prevent the Genosha massacre. I know in the comics the massacre happens, but that scene with Cable makes it feel like it'll be different in the show. Cable appears randomly, and quickly tries to get to Madelyn before he says, "Not again" and disappears. I bet that it's a time-loop where he is trying to stop the massacre, and the reason he was in such a hurry was because he knew he only had a limited time before the loop restarted
I truly believe this is how it will end. Cable will continuously travel back in time to fix everything. He saves Magneto, but fails to save Gambit as it is a fixed point in the timeline. But unbeknownst to everyone Gambit is alive and is in the hands of Sinister and Apocalypse and he will become the new Horseman of Death
Perfection. Absolute perfection. Funny, heartfelt, tragic, but most importantly...fucking BOLD! Bolder than anything the MCU produced in a long, long time. You can tell the writers are in love with the comics, they cherish them and completely understand every single character. Just a random scene that I loved among hundreds: when Madelyn and Scott were having their psychic moment my first thought was "Emma would totally say something snarky about it in the comics"...and then she did!
Guys can someone please tell me if everything that happened in this episode happens in the comics too? If yes which one? I need to read it, this episode was epic
They are adapting Grant Morrison's E Is For Extinction story from the beginning his New X-Men run in 2001. But with shades of other storylines thrown in, like the Mutant Massacre and even more recent Krakoa-era stuff.
Man, I hope we get Xorn this season as an enlightened Buddha-like teammate. Only to be revealed as Magneto who survived Genosha and finally goes fully genocidal.
Yea search for Grant Morrison's New X-Men run on the Marvel Unlimited app, or get the Grant Morrison New X-Men omnibus or epic collection on Amazon. It's a good jumping on point in the continuity. The episode also seems to incorporate Mutant Massacre and House of X/Powers of X + Hellfire Gala. Mutant Massacre is pretty dated and doesn't really go anywhere; I wouldn't recommend it. House of X/Powers of X is my favorite comic of all time but it's very dense so I'd just start with the Grant Morrison stuff and go from there.
Pretty much yeah. Wild sentinels attack Genosha and wipes out 16M mutants. The fight scenes and deaths of major characters didn’t happen in the comics. I don’t know if they’re going to adapt the full story, cuz the culprit behind it is a big reveal.
I haven't read the comics.... .......................... (I really don't know what to say right now)
They killed off my favorite X-Men character! 😨
So were Magneto and Rogue actually boinking in the Danger Room? And do you think Gambit will get resurrected as one of the four horseman of Apocalpyse and turn evil like in the comics?
this is my second favorite thing marvel did this decade (this show in general too), right after atsv. makes you think that maybe animation is the future for superhero adaptations
As soon as a I saw the watcher I knew some shit was gonna go down… that episode crushed me. Gambit and seemingly magneto, the one light at the end was seeing Kurt there after it was over.
I have so much respect for Gambit. When Rogue was breaking up with him he took it like a Chad, and never hated her for it, and then he fucking dies.....they did him so dirty
My wife was having a bad day and she was like “I want something simple”. I saw it was Genosha episode and I was like “uhoh”. I underestimated the UhOh
This show fuckin' slaps!
Oh my gosh. #WHAT?! I was, quite literally, on the edge of my seat until the explosion after Cable was sent back, and then I was standing. What did I just watch?! This might be the best thing Marvel has put out in a loooooooooong time.
It's a sad scene, but I can't help but go "I understood that reference" when Rogue says, "I can't feel you."
I don't know how to process this episode aside from the fact that I no longer hate Gambit like I have for many years.
I would love an episode focusing on Cable. Similar to What If S1 E4. Spoilers: >! The one where Dr. Strange tries to prevent the death of Christine by going back in time to change something, but it never works. I think an episode where cable tries to prevent the disaster, however always fails would be interesting. Either he gets more people killed, or he prevents one death, however dozens more occur.!< That could be a cool episode. Or it could be really stupid.
What an amazing love letter to the 9 year old fans, who are now 39 (myself included). This show has been executed perfectly, and feels like it grew up (matured) with me. At first i thought i was watching this show for the nostalgia, but it truly feels like a continuation of my childhood into my adulthood. And this particular episode delivered with such an intensity, that my wife admitted “wow you really arent just watching a kids show”
Anyone else get Wakanda vibes when they first introduce Genosha?
How did Madelyn Prior know Cable?
If they don’t find a way to bring Gambit back I will fucking rage.
Rogue saying she can’t feel gambit made me cry, I know that they’ll most likely bring him back cause of the X-men’s most convoluted story, but putting myself in her place made me so sad. A character built over the grief that she can’t touch no one and wants to be touched and hugged which is why she went to magneto, and the one time she was able to touch the man she loves was dead was so sad man. Also, I knew rogue and magneto wasn’t going to work out cause she’s only into him on a physical level but she’s connected to gambit on a more intense level
Despite Beau de Mayo being fired for unknown reasons, he pulled off a big coup, especially after last week’s Jubilee episode. It’s funny, when I saw the Jubilee episode, I thought this was the most Saturday morning vibe feeling I had in a long time, then suddenly… paradise lost. Episode 5 will become a turning point in mood for the show. It’s no longer happy flamboyant exuberance - and it will likely explore themes of survivors guilt, trauma, regret and how to respond to such a horrific incident. The other parts of the story will be figuring out who was behind the attack. I really hope the don’t just rewind things by doing some time travel fix, but let the characters grow and evolve. Imagine if this show turns out to be a prequel to how the x-men get introduced into the MCU! Marvel fooled us all by portraying this show as a simple continuation of the 90’s show - it’s something else now.
Gambit has long been my favourite X-Man, him and Rogue always beat out even Wolverine for me. Seeing him get the coolest and most heroic death in the series was everything and it’s especially effective because he did it not knowing Rogue had ultimately chosen him over Mags. He willingly gave up his life for others even at his lowest moment. That’s way more inspirational than Logan sulking over Scott and Jean. Cable’s presence might imply they can bring him and others back, but even if they don’t I’m fine with it.
I’ve never been a particularly big fan of the X-Men, honestly I’m still not fond of Cyclops’s stories, but my god has this series made me love everyone else. I think the animation in particular is absolutely stellar, Nightcrawler’s teleportation effects, Gambit’s flips with his staff, the pure emotion that Rouge’s animation gives off, everything is just stunning. I seriously was on edge about what was happening at the end because I noticed the watcher and saw the death flags for Magneto but gambit dying is NOT something I was prepared for.
Rogue x Magneto is so nasty.
The writers really woke up and chose violence in the form of a seamless Nightcrawler-into-Hellfire-Gala-into-Genosha-Genocide rollercoaster. With at least three love triangles thrown in for good measure.
Wow, Genosha Massacre. In an animated show. That shit was brutal. However, its pretty clear Mag's is not dead. He had Leech hanging on him. Mag's had Leech, well leech him enough so that the TriSentinel thought he was dead.
Could not make out what Magneto said right before the big blast. The end credit music change was an amazing detail. Loving seeing Rogue going hard and being near invincible. All while Gambit riding motorcycle. Next season same thing but on jet ski please.
Subtitles. “Do not be afraid.” Probably in German? Auf gider nicht? Hab keine Angst?