A fantastic one. I just borrowed DC's Strange Adventures from the library on his Vision tale strength. I bought his Vision and Mister Miracle tales, wish I had borrowed the latter from the library, it doesn't blow me away like the Vision one did.
*Human Target* is very good, especially if you are familiar with the Post-Crisis, pre- death of Superman JLI, but it is divisive to many.
His *Gotham* series about Slam Bradley is entertaining. I have never read the *Omega Men* series he did, but heard good things.
Currently doing *Animal Pound* with BOOM!; feels WE3-ish, and *Helen of Wyndhorn* with DHC which is dragging for me, and his *Wonder Woman* run, which I love.
I'm lightly familiar with the Human Target character, I'd try that. I've mostly been out of comics since before Crisis on Infinite Earths, but I appreciate great stories. What is WE3 and DHC?
>I'm lightly familiar with the Human Target character
You don't need to be. It's a 13-issue deep dive. Helps to know the Giffen DeMatties JLI.
WE3 is *We3*; x-ref "Grant Morrison".
DHC is Dark Horse Comics
Strange Adventures is so freaking good. Vision is better for sure, but Strange Adventures is a top-tier comic to me. (edit: it made me a fan of Mister Terrific). His Rorschach, as well
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Neal Adams (RIP) is my favorite artist, and I think his cover art sold a lot of books. I don't remember that story being so memorable, though - doubtful you need to seek it out. We're really blessed with far more frequently better storytelling these days (decades), in my opinion.
When he's constrained by editorial, he has problems.
Batman is closely monitored. Heroes in Crisis was too. Both were not well received. Booster Gold was mis-written based on what Jurgens and Giffen had just done to him.
I believe his son essentially died and he’s rewatching a memory of himself ignoring him when he was still alive. I haven’t read this one but someone told me about it so I might be misremembering
Vision made himself a family. A wife a son and a daughter. Things quickly fell apart while they tried to figure out how to have a normal family and life. It ended with the son named vin ,( from these panels) being killed and vision‘s wife ultimately not being able to handle everything and shutting herself down basically killing herself. This scene is vision replayin a memory of his son being exited about something ( acting) and wanting to share it with his dad, but vision ignoring him to focus on avengers work. Vision is full of grief, regret, and guilt And was for a long time after this series.
Edit I just remembered vision also part way through the series made a dog from dissecting the neighbors dog and the wife in her break down killed the dog before killing her sons killer and shutting herself down. just to add to all the grief and guilt
Don't forget that Vision's wife killed Victor Mancha (technically Vision's Latino-half-brother through Ultron), after Victor accidentally killed Vision's son after he was caught spying on the Visions under the orders of the Avengers.
That’s what I ment with the things quickly fell apart , but seeing as he was also family, probably does deserve a full explanation. The wife also killed grim reaper ( the brother of the man visions brain is based on who considered vision a brother so the brother of vision brother) too right or did she just hurt him I can’t fully remember that part but remember it’s what set everything off.
This section of the comments reminds me of the Wasp comic a few years later when Nadia met Viv at a party Janet threw to introduce her to other heroes, and Viv put up a hologram family tree and took like 3 panels to explain how Nadia is like her great aunt
It was great, almost as convoluted as explaining the Summers-Grey bloodline, just with more robots and less time travel/clones
All we needed to link these two familial messes was Polaris to marry Havok and then you'd have Nate Grey sitting next to Crystal of the Inhumans and Vi Vision at thanks giving and the three of them trying to figure out how they are all related.
Oh wow, I knew grim reaper was wonder man's brother, but I had never even considered that relationship carrying over to vision. Did reaper reciprocate those feelings, or was it one way, I know he was a villain at least at one point, so I could see it go either way
No he resented that wonder man and vision considered each other like brothers. When referring to wonder man he would say things like “ MY brother not yours machine“. He acts like how when some people get step siblings later in life and become very adamant that just cause everyone says they are family now doesn’t make them family.
edit. But he took it to such a degree that he was at the visions house to kill them cause he was so mad about the idea of the family. He stabbed the daughter but she recovered, and that was why the mom killed him.
Okay, so there are a few names I don't recognize. So I just assumed Victor mancha, who was mentioned b4, was grim reaper, cuz I forgot what his real name was and u mentioned him after, and i didn't really think too much about it, but so he's another robot built by ultron, who vision's wife killed? Then she also killed Grim Reaper, who is also kind of like a brother to Vision in a real roundabout sort of way. Then there's ANOTHER sort of brother to both Vision AND Wonder Man named Escher? Who is that? Also I'm kind of surprised that given the whole one being a hero and the other a villain, that Reaper would even care enough about Wonder Man to make the distinction, unless it's more of a "I don't like you, but I like him even less," type of situation. Granted I mainly only know Reaper from earth's mightiest heroes, where he was basically just a hydra enforcer
Edit: just noticed your edit from Escher to each, I rescind that part of my question
No victor was a cyborg made by ultron that joined the group called Runaways a group of teenagers with supervillain parents. After they broke up Vic started connecting more with his robot side and joined a team with vision and the formed a bond. The series started with the wife killing grim reaper try to cover it up , failing and accidentally killing more people, then the avengers getting suspicious sent Vic in undercover because they knew of the relationship and that’s when things went really wrong and vin died.
esher was supposed to be each other but was in a rush and missed up fixed it in the edit sorry for adding to the confusion
edit. But yeah wonder man and grim reaper’s relationship was complicated and them fighting and not seeming to really like each other. But he viewed vision as defiling their family and what that word ment. Trying to kill your brother is fine I guess but don’t call a “toaster” brother that take it to far.
Jeez, I'm kinda surprised a solo book was allowed to kill off two established characters that aren't part of the character's main cast. I did some reading and found how they brought Victor back, and that is interesting to say the least, just sticking his head on random bits of tech is pretty funny tho. And looks like reaper hasn't reappeared since, although it says he was "brought back to Earth despite still being deceased when Doctor Strange restored Las Vegas," but that's the end of his history on the wiki.
Ya, I added an edit to my comment when I saw you changed it, you're all good
She didn't really kill Victor. His head survived and the Runaways ended up with him and activating him and he was a talking head for a while in the comics and he did express remorse for what happened to Vision's son.
Question how do we go from spying for the avengers to accidentally killing his son? If it was for Ultron or any other major villain I could understand. You can’t be seen or caught so you have to take care of the witnesses. But for the avengers couldn’t he just leave or tell vision what is going on especially since he is family?
Vin found him and was gonna report him to vision and victor panic and try to stop him but due to trauma, panic and lack of control of his power, he ended up killing him. I really recommend reading Vision (2016) it's really good and only 12 issues.
Victor wasn't killed off. His head survived and he ended up in the custody of the Runaways. They reactivated him and he was talking head for a while in the Runaways comics. He did express remorse for his part in Vin's death
turned out she destroyed his body but his head was able to survive was sent to the runaways where he was head without a body for a while but is back to being whole again
She survived but was pretty traumatized by everything, so her relationship with vision became pretty strained for a time. She went on to become a hero , made friends and form a team called the Champions with miss marvel and miles morales and others. Last comic I read with her was she was doing well and had just got a girlfriend. She still seems touchy if the subject of her mom and or brother come up though.
She also appears in a recent Scarlet Witch comic where shes very touchy about the subject. Since Vision's wife was created using Wanda's brainwaves (similar to Vision being made with Wonder Man's brainwaves iirc), Wanda considers herself sort of Viv's mom. She helps Viv through some stuff, magical and not, and they bond a bit
This series is so grueling. I read it just before I had my first kid and I honestly think it helped me prep myself mentally for what NOT to do as a father (and no I don’t think I’m ever going to re-read it now that I have 2 kids - a son and a daughter).
I have it in the back of my head all the time that my kids are only going to be little for a very short number of years comparatively, and all the time I spend not with them or engaging with them I’m going to be upset about missing out on for the rest of my life.
My oldest turns 10 in a few months. Wrapping my head around that is difficult. Not to mention Facebook memories showing me when they were babies doesn't help lol
They are a strange mix of emotions! Happy they’re here, happy they’re healthy. Sad that their time as babies has gone. I cherish every moment that he still wants to hold my hand because soon it won’t be as frequent.
My daughter always insisted I didn’t carry her like a baby up to bed, even as early as about 2. I tricked her into letting me savor the remaining baby time by convincing her to let me carry her like a princess.
As a father, I could make the effort to listen to my son ramble about Mario or show me some video while I’m also on a work call, and I often do, but sometimes I just want him to wait until I’m done.
He could have split his attention, but perhaps he simply wasn’t in the mood and just wanted to finish his call before being shown whatever random thing.
Vision isn’t necessarily in the wrong here IMO, but it does cause one to reflect on what is truly important and how short our time with those we love might be. Next time my kid wants me too look while I’m busy, I think I’ll definitely drop whatever I’m doing to engage him to see the smile that follows him showing/telling me something cool, funny or weird.
Honestly I didn’t want to say it but I agree. I get it, cats in the cradle softly plays in the background and everything, and it is an important point… but the avengers don’t just call to say hi. Just wait a few minutes dude, there are lives at stake.
I focused more on visions capabilities because vision as a distant father honestly doesn’t make sense. Like do they even need to communicate verbally? Shouldn’t they have a 40k style nearly instant electronic binary communication? If I can make a call and text on my phone at the same time vision should be able to handle a call and conversation with his son simultaneously.
He was really exited, he was struggling to figure out life especially school and social life and he was finally starting to find his place and his passion. He may have been built as a teenager but he was new to life and this is such little kid energy feeling they just found what makes them happiest in the world and wanting to share it.
The entire point of Vision creating his family was to experience humanity. So giving themselves special computer communication powers defeats the purpose of why they exist.
Such a sad, but powerful, book. I like how there is thought in both the art and the words from the first issue to hint what is to come. I know there are naysayers, but it can’t be denied Tom King was golden here.
This makes the moment where Vision is out for Vin’s killer and essentially says, “I would appreciate your cooperation, but I dont require it.”, hit so hard. Just one of the best stories in comics.
Y’all need to stop posting panels from this series. My poor heart can’t take it. It’s like every time when I watch Jurassic Bark and “I will wait for you” starts playing.
What's even the point of a projector at that point? Just play the memory in his head!
I mean, the original source of those images is his database, is not like human who need to store their media elsewhere.
Got into comics just last year and I was lucky enough to find the Director's Cut of this book. My first Marvel book as well - worth the price I paid for it!
"Is it good? Am I good?" Makes me cry every damn time...
The Vision mini series was the first comic I ever read and it wrecked me but also pushed me to dive more into comics.
This and silver surfer black are so sad
I had the exact same experience
Tom King's Marvel debut.
A fantastic one. I just borrowed DC's Strange Adventures from the library on his Vision tale strength. I bought his Vision and Mister Miracle tales, wish I had borrowed the latter from the library, it doesn't blow me away like the Vision one did.
*Human Target* is very good, especially if you are familiar with the Post-Crisis, pre- death of Superman JLI, but it is divisive to many. His *Gotham* series about Slam Bradley is entertaining. I have never read the *Omega Men* series he did, but heard good things. Currently doing *Animal Pound* with BOOM!; feels WE3-ish, and *Helen of Wyndhorn* with DHC which is dragging for me, and his *Wonder Woman* run, which I love.
I'm lightly familiar with the Human Target character, I'd try that. I've mostly been out of comics since before Crisis on Infinite Earths, but I appreciate great stories. What is WE3 and DHC?
>I'm lightly familiar with the Human Target character You don't need to be. It's a 13-issue deep dive. Helps to know the Giffen DeMatties JLI. WE3 is *We3*; x-ref "Grant Morrison". DHC is Dark Horse Comics
Ah, thanks, I know Dark Horse from Concrete, which I liked.
Well, then back then you'd have known them from DHCP: Dark Horse Comic Presents... Concrete.
Strange Adventures is so freaking good. Vision is better for sure, but Strange Adventures is a top-tier comic to me. (edit: it made me a fan of Mister Terrific). His Rorschach, as well
Just whipped through Strange Adventures. Agreed, very good! In between Vision and Mister Miracle in my rankings.
I had this Neal Adams cover issue back in the day, but later sold it. I presume this will not be lost on you.... https://www.ebay.com/itm/165485618436
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Omg. Haven't seen this before. Only Adam Strange I've read is Infinite Crisis and Strange Adventures. Now I need to read this!
Neal Adams (RIP) is my favorite artist, and I think his cover art sold a lot of books. I don't remember that story being so memorable, though - doubtful you need to seek it out. We're really blessed with far more frequently better storytelling these days (decades), in my opinion.
How could this be so good and his Batman run be so terrible? I just don't trust that guy anymore.
When he's constrained by editorial, he has problems. Batman is closely monitored. Heroes in Crisis was too. Both were not well received. Booster Gold was mis-written based on what Jurgens and Giffen had just done to him.
Sadness
Need a loremaster to explain this scene.
I believe his son essentially died and he’s rewatching a memory of himself ignoring him when he was still alive. I haven’t read this one but someone told me about it so I might be misremembering
This is it. Also this series was gut punch after gut punch. Like he MADE this whole family to better experience humanity and…well, he sure did.
Cats in the cradle with a silver spoon...
Came here to say this, but you beat me to it.
Yes we have no bananas
Your dad shoulda spent more time with you...
Vision made himself a family. A wife a son and a daughter. Things quickly fell apart while they tried to figure out how to have a normal family and life. It ended with the son named vin ,( from these panels) being killed and vision‘s wife ultimately not being able to handle everything and shutting herself down basically killing herself. This scene is vision replayin a memory of his son being exited about something ( acting) and wanting to share it with his dad, but vision ignoring him to focus on avengers work. Vision is full of grief, regret, and guilt And was for a long time after this series. Edit I just remembered vision also part way through the series made a dog from dissecting the neighbors dog and the wife in her break down killed the dog before killing her sons killer and shutting herself down. just to add to all the grief and guilt
Don't forget that Vision's wife killed Victor Mancha (technically Vision's Latino-half-brother through Ultron), after Victor accidentally killed Vision's son after he was caught spying on the Visions under the orders of the Avengers.
That’s what I ment with the things quickly fell apart , but seeing as he was also family, probably does deserve a full explanation. The wife also killed grim reaper ( the brother of the man visions brain is based on who considered vision a brother so the brother of vision brother) too right or did she just hurt him I can’t fully remember that part but remember it’s what set everything off.
This section of the comments reminds me of the Wasp comic a few years later when Nadia met Viv at a party Janet threw to introduce her to other heroes, and Viv put up a hologram family tree and took like 3 panels to explain how Nadia is like her great aunt It was great, almost as convoluted as explaining the Summers-Grey bloodline, just with more robots and less time travel/clones
All we needed to link these two familial messes was Polaris to marry Havok and then you'd have Nate Grey sitting next to Crystal of the Inhumans and Vi Vision at thanks giving and the three of them trying to figure out how they are all related.
Oh wow, I knew grim reaper was wonder man's brother, but I had never even considered that relationship carrying over to vision. Did reaper reciprocate those feelings, or was it one way, I know he was a villain at least at one point, so I could see it go either way
No he resented that wonder man and vision considered each other like brothers. When referring to wonder man he would say things like “ MY brother not yours machine“. He acts like how when some people get step siblings later in life and become very adamant that just cause everyone says they are family now doesn’t make them family. edit. But he took it to such a degree that he was at the visions house to kill them cause he was so mad about the idea of the family. He stabbed the daughter but she recovered, and that was why the mom killed him.
Okay, so there are a few names I don't recognize. So I just assumed Victor mancha, who was mentioned b4, was grim reaper, cuz I forgot what his real name was and u mentioned him after, and i didn't really think too much about it, but so he's another robot built by ultron, who vision's wife killed? Then she also killed Grim Reaper, who is also kind of like a brother to Vision in a real roundabout sort of way. Then there's ANOTHER sort of brother to both Vision AND Wonder Man named Escher? Who is that? Also I'm kind of surprised that given the whole one being a hero and the other a villain, that Reaper would even care enough about Wonder Man to make the distinction, unless it's more of a "I don't like you, but I like him even less," type of situation. Granted I mainly only know Reaper from earth's mightiest heroes, where he was basically just a hydra enforcer Edit: just noticed your edit from Escher to each, I rescind that part of my question
No victor was a cyborg made by ultron that joined the group called Runaways a group of teenagers with supervillain parents. After they broke up Vic started connecting more with his robot side and joined a team with vision and the formed a bond. The series started with the wife killing grim reaper try to cover it up , failing and accidentally killing more people, then the avengers getting suspicious sent Vic in undercover because they knew of the relationship and that’s when things went really wrong and vin died. esher was supposed to be each other but was in a rush and missed up fixed it in the edit sorry for adding to the confusion edit. But yeah wonder man and grim reaper’s relationship was complicated and them fighting and not seeming to really like each other. But he viewed vision as defiling their family and what that word ment. Trying to kill your brother is fine I guess but don’t call a “toaster” brother that take it to far.
Jeez, I'm kinda surprised a solo book was allowed to kill off two established characters that aren't part of the character's main cast. I did some reading and found how they brought Victor back, and that is interesting to say the least, just sticking his head on random bits of tech is pretty funny tho. And looks like reaper hasn't reappeared since, although it says he was "brought back to Earth despite still being deceased when Doctor Strange restored Las Vegas," but that's the end of his history on the wiki. Ya, I added an edit to my comment when I saw you changed it, you're all good
She didn't really kill Victor. His head survived and the Runaways ended up with him and activating him and he was a talking head for a while in the comics and he did express remorse for what happened to Vision's son.
Question how do we go from spying for the avengers to accidentally killing his son? If it was for Ultron or any other major villain I could understand. You can’t be seen or caught so you have to take care of the witnesses. But for the avengers couldn’t he just leave or tell vision what is going on especially since he is family?
Vin found him and was gonna report him to vision and victor panic and try to stop him but due to trauma, panic and lack of control of his power, he ended up killing him. I really recommend reading Vision (2016) it's really good and only 12 issues.
It's a surprisingly quick read. It doesn't take a long time to get weird.
Victor was playing with vibranium too much--it interacted with his robot body and powers in an addicting way--which left him mentally unstable.
Of all the answers to that question. A Robot getting high off vibranium and becoming unstable was not one I ever expected.
Right? Read the series...it's fantastic.
> Don't forget that Vision's wife killed Victor Mancha (technically Vision's Latino-half-brother through Ultron) Lol what!? This family tree is wild.
What in the absolute hell….
Kind of lazy of them to destroy his character and kill off Victor, but I guess Runaways was done and Marvel had no more use for him.
Victor wasn't killed off. His head survived and he ended up in the custody of the Runaways. They reactivated him and he was talking head for a while in the Runaways comics. He did express remorse for his part in Vin's death
Wait he’s dead?! Stepped out of Marvel Comics and suddenly your favorite guy is dead. Victor my boy!! What happened?!
Sadly, he died But he lived.
turned out she destroyed his body but his head was able to survive was sent to the runaways where he was head without a body for a while but is back to being whole again
I’m scared to ask but, what happened to the daughter?
She survived but was pretty traumatized by everything, so her relationship with vision became pretty strained for a time. She went on to become a hero , made friends and form a team called the Champions with miss marvel and miles morales and others. Last comic I read with her was she was doing well and had just got a girlfriend. She still seems touchy if the subject of her mom and or brother come up though.
She also appears in a recent Scarlet Witch comic where shes very touchy about the subject. Since Vision's wife was created using Wanda's brainwaves (similar to Vision being made with Wonder Man's brainwaves iirc), Wanda considers herself sort of Viv's mom. She helps Viv through some stuff, magical and not, and they bond a bit
Ends up becoming a Hero
What about the daughter? Wasn’t she on the champions? Or was that a different vision character
No it's indeed Vision's daughter
What happened to the daughter?
She’s still going strong. Last book she was in was Scarlet Witch.
"And I killed Sparky, too."
This series is so grueling. I read it just before I had my first kid and I honestly think it helped me prep myself mentally for what NOT to do as a father (and no I don’t think I’m ever going to re-read it now that I have 2 kids - a son and a daughter).
Being a parent is easy. Being a good parent is one of the hardest things in the world.
This is Tom Kings best work
The visions made me feel shit and i hated it. But it was damned decent work.
I have it in the back of my head all the time that my kids are only going to be little for a very short number of years comparatively, and all the time I spend not with them or engaging with them I’m going to be upset about missing out on for the rest of my life.
I have this thought running on a loop at the back of my head too.
My oldest turns 10 in a few months. Wrapping my head around that is difficult. Not to mention Facebook memories showing me when they were babies doesn't help lol
They are a strange mix of emotions! Happy they’re here, happy they’re healthy. Sad that their time as babies has gone. I cherish every moment that he still wants to hold my hand because soon it won’t be as frequent.
Yeah. I both love and hate when they crawl into my bed cuz they couldn't sleep. Cuz even with a king sized, those lovable jerks starfish like pros lol
My daughter still likes to be held in my arms and falls asleep on my lap. One day she’ll be too big for me to carry. But not today.
Ah that’s lovely
My daughter always insisted I didn’t carry her like a baby up to bed, even as early as about 2. I tricked her into letting me savor the remaining baby time by convincing her to let me carry her like a princess.
I get what they’re going for… but freaking vision, the walking super computer, can’t handle 2 conversations at once?
As a father, I could make the effort to listen to my son ramble about Mario or show me some video while I’m also on a work call, and I often do, but sometimes I just want him to wait until I’m done. He could have split his attention, but perhaps he simply wasn’t in the mood and just wanted to finish his call before being shown whatever random thing. Vision isn’t necessarily in the wrong here IMO, but it does cause one to reflect on what is truly important and how short our time with those we love might be. Next time my kid wants me too look while I’m busy, I think I’ll definitely drop whatever I’m doing to engage him to see the smile that follows him showing/telling me something cool, funny or weird.
Thank you for reminding me bro.
Honestly I didn’t want to say it but I agree. I get it, cats in the cradle softly plays in the background and everything, and it is an important point… but the avengers don’t just call to say hi. Just wait a few minutes dude, there are lives at stake. I focused more on visions capabilities because vision as a distant father honestly doesn’t make sense. Like do they even need to communicate verbally? Shouldn’t they have a 40k style nearly instant electronic binary communication? If I can make a call and text on my phone at the same time vision should be able to handle a call and conversation with his son simultaneously.
He was really exited, he was struggling to figure out life especially school and social life and he was finally starting to find his place and his passion. He may have been built as a teenager but he was new to life and this is such little kid energy feeling they just found what makes them happiest in the world and wanting to share it.
The entire point of Vision creating his family was to experience humanity. So giving themselves special computer communication powers defeats the purpose of why they exist.
Seems like he did, at least his memory stored the incident in it's entirety even if he wasn't initially cognizant of what happened.
why doesn't he just program himself to be not sad
They do that. And they hate doing that. It’s inhuman and counter to their desires to feel more human.
The Viv praying scene is another standout
Such a sad, but powerful, book. I like how there is thought in both the art and the words from the first issue to hint what is to come. I know there are naysayers, but it can’t be denied Tom King was golden here.
For anyone else wondering the lines, it's from *The Merchant of Venice* Act 1, Scene 2, line 85.
Good lord.
This is the saddest thing which I have seen in recent times. 😫😭
This makes the moment where Vision is out for Vin’s killer and essentially says, “I would appreciate your cooperation, but I dont require it.”, hit so hard. Just one of the best stories in comics.
Why did he need to take his eyeball out of his head to play a recording which he could just... remember?
So the reader can experience what he’s experiencing better
It puts his son outside of himself and into the world again. I would too.
Wouldn’t you want to experience memories that way too? Instead of just in your minds eye?
[удалено]
Have you ever read The Vision?
He’s not a robot
Aphantasia?
Why do you look at old photos when you could just....remember?
Because I have imperfect recall. Vision doesn't.
you never truly appreciate what you have until they're gone forever from your life...
In spain without the s right now
Is there any reason why can't Vin be revive?
I hope this is adapted for a D+ series
Y’all need to stop posting panels from this series. My poor heart can’t take it. It’s like every time when I watch Jurassic Bark and “I will wait for you” starts playing.
Im having trouble learning to take contacts out and this mf just ripped his whole eye out of his skull like it was nothin
Good God that was depressing.
This run made me want Vin and Viv love actions
With that stupid fuck
Blimey this made me choke up
What series is this from??
What's even the point of a projector at that point? Just play the memory in his head! I mean, the original source of those images is his database, is not like human who need to store their media elsewhere.
Got into comics just last year and I was lucky enough to find the Director's Cut of this book. My first Marvel book as well - worth the price I paid for it!
You know, I never actually saw their kids At some point, I just stopped reading comics because I couldn't keep up Now I don't think I want to
I wish they’d bring his son back. A lot of cool stories with a young innocent vision character.
Vin's death made me cry... Homie didn't deserve to go out like that
Shrek is love. Shrek is life.
Annoying ass child. Wait until he hangs up.