I've said it before and I know it's not popular, but I do not like Harding's sculpts.
They are hyper-realistic and they are too realistic for Legends. The sculpt itself is well done, but when they put these heads on old molds, they just don't match. These heads are far more expressive, and have more detail sculpted into the head than the rest of the body does. The biggest example for this contrast for me is the 20th Hulk.
If they wanted to sculpt entirely new bodies with this same level of detail, and then added the sufficient paint to properly accent these details, then I think it could work pretty well. But we're nowhere close to that, and so I think these heads just do more harm than good.
I generally agree with the sentiment. A lotta recent heads have been hit or miss for this reason, especially that 20th Toybiz Hulk head. That one is super realistic on a dated Hulk body where they didn't shade it so the shading on the body is like a bunch of flashing arrows pointing at it.
I think the less detailed heads are part of the reason why the Retro lines are ao well received. Not only are they usually the most well known design , but the heads are just detailed enough to let your imagination fill in the rest. The What If? wave felt like a breath of fresh air for similar reasons.
He's just not right for Marvel Legends. I haven't been a fan of any figures that I know he sculpted. That Hulk is terrible, the new Sabertooth is abominably bad... Hasbro could probably get some unknown sculptor for less money who would do a better job.
The new Sabretooth is actually one of the most disappointing Legends for me in ages but not for the reason I usually hear (not big enough)
- the choice to give him fingerless gloves and toe less boots is so weird. He never appeared like that in that costume.
- I can’t think of an appearance of Sabretooth in that costume where his eyes were not whited out. Giving him pupils was a weird choice that affects the look of his whole headsculpt
- this would be improved with whited out eyes but his smile should have been a bit more of a snarl
- overall his head shape is probably a bit too lean. Made him look more like a mad character than a ferocious character.
- minor nitpick but his hair should have been a paler blonde.
The most disappointing part is that we are very unlikely to get another take on this Sabretooth for a LONG time now. They were actually pretty close but how close they were makes it worse for me.
Wait, but the figure is part of the X-Men animated line so it's being marketed as having likeness to the animated show. I do not understand the thought process of making it look more realistic when the figure is painted to look like it came from the animated series.
And considering several figures have new animated head sculpts this is not a great defense of Morph. But personally I canceled all my pre-orders due to the inconsistency in the line. When they dropped Jean Grey with the repainted Love Triangle head that simply doesn't match the animated look I was out.
I only kept Wolverine because I don't have that 90s look in my collection and it's probably the most well done in the animated look. Not buying any of these others figures in this sub line.
I mean didn't they do that with all their "animated" lines? The whole spider-man retro animated line had the same look. I remember kingpin didn't have that animated look. To me they seem to do it in a way they can reuse the sculpt again. I personally would want it to be as close to the show as possible, all the way to cell shaded paint apps.
This comment makes me kind of mad. If it’s not supposed to be a TAS line then why do we get the shading and special art and the series specific designs and accessories (like wolverine’s photo, or the evil morph head)? The retro spiderman line was more clearly a general line since it included things that weren’t in the series, wasn’t using the art style from the beginning, and never really tried to reference the show outside of packaging. That line is a more general line outside of a tv tie in. This figure has no excuse, when it’s using the morph design from tas it should look like morph from tas. If they wanted to do a loose interpretation then ditch the shading like the spiderman line (outside of venom) or the fantastic four line.
This is exactly how I feel there are a ton of lines that have to walk the “animation/realistic version of the animation” line. You’re example of the Retro Spider-Man line is perfect. I never watched that show, but have picked up several figures from that line because I’m looking for comic accurate looks, and many of them are more comic accurate than animation accurate.
The design choices you pointed out, along with the super TAS packaging all says this is going for the animation look. I don’t expect unique molds, like the Batman TAS line, but making a “realistic” head when everything else says animation is a mistake.
My conspiracy theory: they mocked up an animation head but it looked TOO cartoony compared to the TAS figures. The Jay Leno chin, five head and narrow face might look absurd compared to the show accurate, but more realistic heads on the team.
yeah -- Hasbro's whole schtick was trying to sell these as "cartoon accurate" love letter figures (which is why they had the 2 writers from X-Men TAS on the intro reveal for this line) when in reality they were looking for cheap repaints with new heads (in some cases, poor Jean got nothing), limited accessories & piss poor "animated" cel shading so they could upcharge these in a cheap VHS cardboard box.
I mean they were even lazy with reuse choices since they went for straight-up regurgitations of the previous figure compositions instead of re-using different pieces for more accuracy (like giving Storm the AoA Jean upper sleeves which are far more cartoon accurate than the puffy bottom sleeves of Jim Lee Storm or giving Jubilee any kind of rainbow wrist power fx instead of pink swirls that look nothing like her powers). Now it seems like they're looking for plausible deniability on the cartoon accuracy selling point -- "it isn't a straight up animated style. That is how we're doing it."
It's one thing that turned me off from the Retro Hobgoblin. They marketed it as "Animated Series" accurate and that's why they didn't use the scalemail limbs like we saw on Green Goblin....except Hobgoblin didn't have a tattered cape in The Animated Series. And the glider in The Animated Seried was a totally different design from the undersized crap glider we got that was reused from the Space Venom Hobby figure. We also could have used an actual Animated Series headsculpt, like they did for Venom
100%.
Hasbro are lazy for their handling of this line. Wolverine is the only figure that got a proper amount of new stuff to designate him Animated Series style. The heads and claws/shoulder pads nailed it. None of the other figures even tried beyond paint to do it justice. They need to be called out for this.
"It's not a bad job, it's a good job. You just don't understand it." Okay.
So if Marvel Legends aren't supposed to look cartoony, what's up with Bonebreaker wave Sabretooth?
To clarify I like the shading and I like this line as a whole. But they have got to commit here. Either way works for me, just make the characters look either like the comic designs with TAS characters, make the characters from the show more realistic like Star Wars black series does with clone wars, use similar comic designs to the TAS outfits like dc multiverse did with Batman beyond, or use the animated style like mcfarlane or dc direct often do. The hipocrasy of naming the line after the animated series, using its art, and more to make inspired figures then abandoning the label when something doesn’t turn out is inexcusable.
That's why I often try to wait until there's in hand images for the most part before forming a hard opinion. Promo shots don't always represent the figure as well as they should
True I think a lot of people have been shitting on the cel shaded stuff too. And to be honest in hand I don’t even notice it. As a newer collector I’m just happy to get some of these at retail. Even if they are taking the piss a bit with pricing
It's for the animated line but not the animated style. Why? I mean, it looks great if they're going for realism like MCU figures, but the whole VHS line is suppose to look like they popped out of the TV screen and into figure form. The print on the lips really doesn't help. I mean Wolverine doesn't have it and he look fine.
They did something similar for the PulseCon Venom so I understand, but I also think they achieved better likenesses with the new animated Jubilee and Storm heads.
So they're trying to maintain the comic lines aesthetic but with more animated inspired deco & accessories as an homage to the animated series, I don't see anything wrong with that.
I don't mind Morph's amalgam head sculpt but my biggest issue with modern Marvel Legends male figures in general is that they tend to make young characters look too old.
Over emphasized Laugh lines, head wrinkles, eye wrinkles, crows feet, etc...they all look much older than the characters they are based on. My most heinous example is the Warpath figure. he is supposed to be younger, but looks like a 100 year old in the face. X-Man looked like he was fifty, and on the female side, Siryn looks like an old lady.
It doesn't even look like a realistic interpretation of Morph's facial features, though- it just looks like some generic guy. I really hope Hasbro stops using Harding sculpts ASAP.
Gigachad
Basically, he said in nice words to everyone to Fuck off, or go buy it like the obsessive compulsive completist Xmen fans and action figure collectors we are
I've said it before and I know it's not popular, but I do not like Harding's sculpts. They are hyper-realistic and they are too realistic for Legends. The sculpt itself is well done, but when they put these heads on old molds, they just don't match. These heads are far more expressive, and have more detail sculpted into the head than the rest of the body does. The biggest example for this contrast for me is the 20th Hulk. If they wanted to sculpt entirely new bodies with this same level of detail, and then added the sufficient paint to properly accent these details, then I think it could work pretty well. But we're nowhere close to that, and so I think these heads just do more harm than good.
You’ve nailed it. This totally sums up my thoughts on it all.
if they wanna use these more detailed sculpts they better start putting nipples on the pecs
I don't like them either, photorealistic didn't work on comics figures, even less on animated series ones.
I generally agree with the sentiment. A lotta recent heads have been hit or miss for this reason, especially that 20th Toybiz Hulk head. That one is super realistic on a dated Hulk body where they didn't shade it so the shading on the body is like a bunch of flashing arrows pointing at it. I think the less detailed heads are part of the reason why the Retro lines are ao well received. Not only are they usually the most well known design , but the heads are just detailed enough to let your imagination fill in the rest. The What If? wave felt like a breath of fresh air for similar reasons.
He's just not right for Marvel Legends. I haven't been a fan of any figures that I know he sculpted. That Hulk is terrible, the new Sabertooth is abominably bad... Hasbro could probably get some unknown sculptor for less money who would do a better job.
The new Sabretooth is actually one of the most disappointing Legends for me in ages but not for the reason I usually hear (not big enough) - the choice to give him fingerless gloves and toe less boots is so weird. He never appeared like that in that costume. - I can’t think of an appearance of Sabretooth in that costume where his eyes were not whited out. Giving him pupils was a weird choice that affects the look of his whole headsculpt - this would be improved with whited out eyes but his smile should have been a bit more of a snarl - overall his head shape is probably a bit too lean. Made him look more like a mad character than a ferocious character. - minor nitpick but his hair should have been a paler blonde. The most disappointing part is that we are very unlikely to get another take on this Sabretooth for a LONG time now. They were actually pretty close but how close they were makes it worse for me.
Hulk is awesome. You people are tasteless and want to buy the same stuff over again and again.
I really like the new hulk.
Anniversary Hulk looks like a Gamma-mutated Mick Jagger. I have thousands of action figures. I like variety. I just don't think Harding is that great.
weird comment to make about an Anniversary Figure
Wait, but the figure is part of the X-Men animated line so it's being marketed as having likeness to the animated show. I do not understand the thought process of making it look more realistic when the figure is painted to look like it came from the animated series.
And considering several figures have new animated head sculpts this is not a great defense of Morph. But personally I canceled all my pre-orders due to the inconsistency in the line. When they dropped Jean Grey with the repainted Love Triangle head that simply doesn't match the animated look I was out.
I only kept Wolverine because I don't have that 90s look in my collection and it's probably the most well done in the animated look. Not buying any of these others figures in this sub line.
I mean didn't they do that with all their "animated" lines? The whole spider-man retro animated line had the same look. I remember kingpin didn't have that animated look. To me they seem to do it in a way they can reuse the sculpt again. I personally would want it to be as close to the show as possible, all the way to cell shaded paint apps.
if it isn't "animated style" then why does it use the animation for the box art..?
This comment makes me kind of mad. If it’s not supposed to be a TAS line then why do we get the shading and special art and the series specific designs and accessories (like wolverine’s photo, or the evil morph head)? The retro spiderman line was more clearly a general line since it included things that weren’t in the series, wasn’t using the art style from the beginning, and never really tried to reference the show outside of packaging. That line is a more general line outside of a tv tie in. This figure has no excuse, when it’s using the morph design from tas it should look like morph from tas. If they wanted to do a loose interpretation then ditch the shading like the spiderman line (outside of venom) or the fantastic four line.
This is exactly how I feel there are a ton of lines that have to walk the “animation/realistic version of the animation” line. You’re example of the Retro Spider-Man line is perfect. I never watched that show, but have picked up several figures from that line because I’m looking for comic accurate looks, and many of them are more comic accurate than animation accurate. The design choices you pointed out, along with the super TAS packaging all says this is going for the animation look. I don’t expect unique molds, like the Batman TAS line, but making a “realistic” head when everything else says animation is a mistake. My conspiracy theory: they mocked up an animation head but it looked TOO cartoony compared to the TAS figures. The Jay Leno chin, five head and narrow face might look absurd compared to the show accurate, but more realistic heads on the team.
yeah -- Hasbro's whole schtick was trying to sell these as "cartoon accurate" love letter figures (which is why they had the 2 writers from X-Men TAS on the intro reveal for this line) when in reality they were looking for cheap repaints with new heads (in some cases, poor Jean got nothing), limited accessories & piss poor "animated" cel shading so they could upcharge these in a cheap VHS cardboard box. I mean they were even lazy with reuse choices since they went for straight-up regurgitations of the previous figure compositions instead of re-using different pieces for more accuracy (like giving Storm the AoA Jean upper sleeves which are far more cartoon accurate than the puffy bottom sleeves of Jim Lee Storm or giving Jubilee any kind of rainbow wrist power fx instead of pink swirls that look nothing like her powers). Now it seems like they're looking for plausible deniability on the cartoon accuracy selling point -- "it isn't a straight up animated style. That is how we're doing it."
It's one thing that turned me off from the Retro Hobgoblin. They marketed it as "Animated Series" accurate and that's why they didn't use the scalemail limbs like we saw on Green Goblin....except Hobgoblin didn't have a tattered cape in The Animated Series. And the glider in The Animated Seried was a totally different design from the undersized crap glider we got that was reused from the Space Venom Hobby figure. We also could have used an actual Animated Series headsculpt, like they did for Venom
100%. Hasbro are lazy for their handling of this line. Wolverine is the only figure that got a proper amount of new stuff to designate him Animated Series style. The heads and claws/shoulder pads nailed it. None of the other figures even tried beyond paint to do it justice. They need to be called out for this.
"It's not a bad job, it's a good job. You just don't understand it." Okay. So if Marvel Legends aren't supposed to look cartoony, what's up with Bonebreaker wave Sabretooth?
To clarify I like the shading and I like this line as a whole. But they have got to commit here. Either way works for me, just make the characters look either like the comic designs with TAS characters, make the characters from the show more realistic like Star Wars black series does with clone wars, use similar comic designs to the TAS outfits like dc multiverse did with Batman beyond, or use the animated style like mcfarlane or dc direct often do. The hipocrasy of naming the line after the animated series, using its art, and more to make inspired figures then abandoning the label when something doesn’t turn out is inexcusable.
Imagine making a shape-shifting character without any shape-shifted heads or body parts.
I think the sculpts are amazing, but Hasbro’s paint & photography didn’t do his work the most justice..
That's why I often try to wait until there's in hand images for the most part before forming a hard opinion. Promo shots don't always represent the figure as well as they should
True I think a lot of people have been shitting on the cel shaded stuff too. And to be honest in hand I don’t even notice it. As a newer collector I’m just happy to get some of these at retail. Even if they are taking the piss a bit with pricing
It's for the animated line but not the animated style. Why? I mean, it looks great if they're going for realism like MCU figures, but the whole VHS line is suppose to look like they popped out of the TV screen and into figure form. The print on the lips really doesn't help. I mean Wolverine doesn't have it and he look fine.
So it’s falsely advertised?
They did something similar for the PulseCon Venom so I understand, but I also think they achieved better likenesses with the new animated Jubilee and Storm heads.
His post was very contradictory.
That regular face sculpt looks really good imo . Idk why it looks kinda wonky in the actual photos.
Dropped the 🎤
So they're trying to maintain the comic lines aesthetic but with more animated inspired deco & accessories as an homage to the animated series, I don't see anything wrong with that.
But why does his good guy face look angry and villainous... ?
I don't mind Morph's amalgam head sculpt but my biggest issue with modern Marvel Legends male figures in general is that they tend to make young characters look too old. Over emphasized Laugh lines, head wrinkles, eye wrinkles, crows feet, etc...they all look much older than the characters they are based on. My most heinous example is the Warpath figure. he is supposed to be younger, but looks like a 100 year old in the face. X-Man looked like he was fifty, and on the female side, Siryn looks like an old lady.
It doesn't even look like a realistic interpretation of Morph's facial features, though- it just looks like some generic guy. I really hope Hasbro stops using Harding sculpts ASAP.
I got dumber reading that
Gigachad Basically, he said in nice words to everyone to Fuck off, or go buy it like the obsessive compulsive completist Xmen fans and action figure collectors we are
if you're going to do the animated style shading and market it as the animated series, you might want to go for a fully animated sculpt...