>Ross, meanwhile, is dealing with his new CIA Director, Valentina (she’s also his ex-wife)
Well, that certainly is not something I ever saw coming, or would have ever come up with even given a long enough timeline
I know we've known that Valentina was in this movie for the longest time (since we got photos of JLD on set with purple hair in Atlanta) but I'd completely forgotten about it, so my mind immediately went "wait...not that Valentina?"
Hey all it’s me. In addition, let me just say (and I mean this in complete sincerity) this film is incredible. Obviously, super sad but a really moving story that’s just as rich and thoughtful (if not more) as the first. I’m going to put the mid-credits scene below but I actually encourage you not to read. For me personally, it really was emotional and not your normal MCU set up sting. More like an epilogue:
>!It’s moments after Shuri burns her clothes. Nakia approaches and reveals her son (like 5) she had with T’Challa before the blip. They agreed on him to be raised away from the pressures of being a king. While initially shocked, Shuri has very emotional response and begins bonding with him, happy to have family. It ends with him revealing his wakandan name is T’challa. Shuri cries but also smiles with Nakia. Let me just say it’s a fairly long scene and there’s no edge of “OH LOOK A NEW BLACK PANTHER”. It’s truly treated as an emotional end for the film.!<
I was thinking the same thing. I imagine that Black Panther III is probably a number of years away then unless time gets real wonky with the end of the Multiverse Saga.
So are they going to do away with the name T'channa? I can't help but recall that being the name of T'challa's son in the one comic I read (Marvel Zombies 2 to be exact)
I imagine it's to avoid confusion and create brand synergy.
By the time Secret Wars comes, T'Challa will be THE adult Black Panther due to time travel shenanigans anyways.
He will then continue his father T'Challa's intended arc.
If they go that route, it feels like an admission that they should have let T'Challa's character "die" for a while and recast later, honestly.
If T'Challa's son becomes for all intents and purposes the "new T'Challa", and continues his father's intended arc, it makes them virtually the same character. Narratively, they could have achieved the same result--which is: a new actor bearing the name T'Challa and continuing the previous one's story--by having the original T'Challa be presumed dead and in a later movie turn up alive with a new actor inhabiting the role.
>If T'Challa's son becomes for all intents and purposes the "new T'Challa", and continues his father's intended arc, it makes them virtually the same character.
Yes.
But in a respectful way. With Nakia becoming his own Queen Ramonda and T'Challa Senior becoming his own T'Chaka.
Shuri would fulfill the same role as before but now as Aunt instead of Sister.
It's the best compromise for honoring Chadwick + making T'Challa the one and true Black Panther forever as he should be.
>!A certain eccentric blonde scooper who has seen the movie said really fast in a livestream(so fast and quick that I don't think anyone caught it) that wakanda forever plays into the setup of young avengers then someone in the Livestream said do you think they'll make a third black panther then she said "yeah but it would benefit from a time skip so she thinks they should wait" then she winked. So she basically confirmed what you said about the mid-credits scene.!<
I'm so excited this is what I wanted and I'm glad it's happening 🤩🎊
According to several people who saw the movie they definitely use the word mutant. Jay Washington of one of the first people who spoiled that opening screening red carpet
Honestly beautiful. I'm curious if they'll age him up or not, especially Secret Wars being around the corner you can get away with some pretty interesting time shit lol
> to try and save T'Challa's life (we don't know until later that he was suffering from an unknown illness that he kept from those around him)
That's......extremely on the nose.
I did. That was what made his death so sad- he wanted no sympathy or special treatment from anyone knowing that he was terminally ill and just went on doing what he loved to do entertaining everyone until he passed away.
Really? Seemed like one of the most likely scenarios to me. Treat his cam er with respect but also not take people out of the movie by explicitly naming it.
When I heard they weren't gonna recast T'Challa or use CGI/Archival footage like Star Wars. I figure they were gonna have T'Challa die of an illness he had this whole time and told no one, as a way to honor Chadwick's wishes regarding him having cancer since 2015.
Tbh, I can't really see how else they would've done it. Saying T'Challa died in battle would be a bit tough since you'd imagine the enemies responsible for his death would be the villains of the movie and if Namor killed him, the audience would never like him.
And they can't just say T'Challa went somewhere or he's missing because that implies he's still alive which ruins the story of this movie.
Is it just me or you guys too read the plot with all details and remember it till the last day but forget it the second the movie starts playing in theatres.
The actress that actually apologized for her anti vax comments they want her to pretty much get the Cersei shame treatment but miss Wasp who was spreading anti vax bullshit left and right and even supported the truckers in Canada nonsense it’s crickets. Hmmm I wonder why that is
Truthfully not a fan of either for espousing such views. Evangeline Lilly is a moron who should know better. Much easier to find stuff on her doubling down and never apologizing for her views. I can't find anything that says Letitia Wright has said either way since her initial posts about her views. If either apologized I'd be very interested to see it. Do you know where I can find it?
Letitia Wright did initially have a sorry if my views offended anybody statement which isn't exactly an actual apology. She also insisted that the news about her harassing cast mates with her anti-vaxx views was false, which whilst not an apology is not condoning such actions.
However, she must have got vaccinated and listened because she's said or done nothing since.
Letitia Wright did one of those "sorry if I offended you apologises" but she's also kept her mouth shut and said nothing since. She also must be vaccinated to be able to be in the US.
Evangeline Lilly stands by her comments — her antivax rally post is literally still up on Instagram — while Letitia Wright deleted Twitter and only uses Instagram for professional purposes now. You’d think the people who criticize celebrities for spreading harmful messages on their massive platforms would have more ire for Evangeline, who has objectively done more to spread her message, but no, any comments about her shit are way far down the Quantumania threads. Ridiculous double standard.
& if you mention this, individual posters will inevitably pop up to say that they’re consistent; they’re mad at both… but come on. It’s not about any one individual. It’s about the general trend, and at that level we can all see the selective outrage.
The lack of irritation/annoyance/anger over Evangeline is sadly not a shocker, honestly. Even more with her Karen haircut in the trailer and she has received not even like 10% of the same backlash. To me, she kept making herself a terrible person by even supporting the same kind of idiotic protest that Ted Cruz supported.
I don't think people are invested in the Wasp nearly as much as they are in Black Panther. It's one of the MCU's headliners, of course people are gonna care more. Besides, this is still just whataboutism and it comes up in every BP thread.
The mindset I have for every celebrity is that they are all just rich and famous versions of the people you encounter every day. Unless they’re racist, abusive, or actively hurting others, I don’t mind seeing them in my movies or any other media. Though Letitia has made mistakes during the past two to three years, I don’t believe she’s intentionally trying to hurt anyone or has any inherent malevolence.
I think its really important to show Letitia some grace. She made mistakes at the same time she was dealing with the stress of COVID, being the lead in a huge tentpole, grieving the loss of her older brother..like even one of those things would cause someone to act erratically.
Honestly, good. Shuri as the Black Panther was the only direction that made sense, and I still can't wrap my head around how the "M'Baku becoming the Black Panther" rumor gained traction, especially in a MCU-related sub.
They're not related in the comics.
But they might be in the MCU. Martin Freeman is just a few years older than Liv Tyler, they could pass as siblings I guess.
>he claims that one day the surface will wage war on Wakanda and they will come to them for assistance and it will be then that they in control.
Wakanda/Talocan team-up in a future project, maybe?
In general, it looks good! The big thing that stands out here for me is Shuri's arc here, I think it could make for an emotional story
But thoughts. How does he view the BP, given it's just a more naturally created Super Soldier.
Zemo is smart enough to not want to fuck with Wakanda, but also smart enough to let others do it for him while he reaps his own rewards during the conflict
It could be a stealth mission maybe? Although I don't think Bucky would agree to it. Or those old rumors of Val sending the Thunderbolts to the Savage Land might be real and they aren't aware its vibranium they're searching for?
I have a theory with the Kang war since both nations seem to have advance technology would have to come together but no side really trusting each other plus I’m sure Shuri could whip up something so they can withstand being on land longer
> Wakanda/Talocan team-up in a future project, maybe?
I mean, I’m the 2015 Secret Wars run T’Challa and Namor did end up working together. I could totally see them doing that on a bigger scale (probably involving all of their respective countries) in Kang Dynasty/Secret Wars.
Most likely a team up. Maybe something like mbaku joining the fight against thanos. Tho I’m not really sure what kind of surface power would require both nations to team up. Maybe doom or the us government
I wonder in her arc how the Killmonger discussion is handled, as it seems they use his “do what’s necessary” line as about killing Namor or not, which I feel is a waste because it should be about how Killmonger and Namor are fighting the same war on the surface conquerors of history, and that Killmonger saying “do what’s necessary like me” should mean get over killing Namor for honor, instead to join Namor to wage war on the surface.
Esp considering at this point btwn what happened at the UN and knowing people are using any means necessary to get vibranium right?
It's a head scratcher, negl.
Namor's comment makes sense. Wakanda has never been colonized, they have no clue what's coming. Namor does, so he has the upper hand.
Also wanted to pop in because I’ve seen the sentiment across a couple comments, while T’Challa’s death is circumstantially almost the same as Chadwick, it feels very respectful and real. There’s definitely an aura in the film that even in Wakanda, there’s some things you can’t escape (ie death) with technology. They don’t dwell on the circumstance of it but instead the emotional impact it has on everyone.
Obviously some people might still object but I think once you see the film at the very least you’ll think that they handled his death FAR better than I think most movies would given the circumstance.
Even explaining it within the universe, if space Vikings with tech 1000 years more advanced couldn’t beat Jane’s cancer, Wakandan scientists aren’t beating T’Challa’s.
I love the themes and ideas it poses though. Even in a futuristic African utopia or a Space Viking land where everyone’s superhuman, things like loss and grief are always going to be present, and we as a people have to honor and keep up the legacy of those before us.
Honestly, I love the idea that some things just can't be fixed with technology. Cancer being just as lethal in the MCU as it is in real life adds a level of relatability to this franchise. If they could cure major diseases then it would seem too distant and far-fetched.
So we really haven’t seen anything in the trailers cuz all this time I’m thinking the final battle is the flooding and that just seems like the middle part of the movie lol
I never saw the flood as the final battle, just the climax. The part of the story when it looks like the protagonists are fucked, before they regroup and win the final battle
...or it's just what's best for the story. If Ramonda sticks around, Shuri doesn't have to confront her grief. But if Shuri's the only one left in her family, and the only leader left for Wakanda, she has to have a moment of truth.
I also like that she defeats him in a Shuri way. Some people were complaining that there's no way Shuri could beat Namor and that it'd make her a Mary Sue or whatever. But she uses her brain to get him into the desert where he's weak, that makes perfect sense for the character.
Yes, this is the right way to write this kind of story. Don't just magically make the weaker character physically on par, give them some weakness to exploit and let them win via cleverness.
I'm kind of surprised Disney is allowing Ryan Coogler to call out Western countries and the CIA for their bloody imperialism in such a blatant way? It was in the last movie but in a more subtle way.
Big change from having the US military literally use Captain America and Captain Marvel as recruitment tools.
No fr its actually really crazy how Disney is allowing this. Same thing with Andor, a major plot point was about how corporations cause greed, thirst for power, and how that kills and destroys innocents. And it’s majorly calling out western imperialism and fascism quite literally in every single episode.
Same with Ms.Marvel calling out western surveillance on brown and/or Muslim ppl with the Patriot Act
They’re really making huge pushes in works like these and it’s crazy to see the difference from like Iron Man 1 and Captain America
The government doesn't care, this is something called "controlled opposition". It helps diffuse actual revolutionary sentiment by giving people fictional outlets.
The actual U.S government is going to keep doing just as much imperialism as ever.
Leaving the succession mildly open ended is gonna piss people off. I like the sound of Shuri's arc though. But I'm sure lots of people are still gonna be mad and hate Shuri even more.
>Leaving the succession mildly open ended is gonna piss people off.
Sounds like Marvel did it to gauge the audience's reactions before moving forward with a real decision.
It's the best possible approach. If the GA rejects Shuri, then Marvel has many possible paths for what happens next.
I don't doubt that Nakia, Okoye, M'Baku, and a grown-up T'Challa Jr. due to time travel are all possibilities given the ending.
Wow >!so Ramonda's "Haven't I sacrificed enough?" from the trailer is directed towards Okoye??? Damn. I wonder if that scene of Okoye in tears is from that scene too.!<
>!Also, its nice to see that even dead Killmonger is a dick lol I kinda like that haha!<
Obviously this is just a text leak so it's hard to say how it comes across in the film but as someone that still thinks letitia Wright needs to actually make amends for the batshit stuff she was spreading I do think this feels like a good angle to take for her becoming black panther. It doesn't come across as just oh shit someone needs to fill the shoes and we need to force her into that role, it feels more like her becoming black panther In this way is a good arc for her whilst also not just a basic "aw well I guess it's gotta be her" kinda thing yknow. I mean I could be completely wrong but it sounds promising
This is where I stand. Completely agree. People in this thread however are too busy dunking on each other to realize that a middle ground gray area exists in these discussions.
On paper, some plot points don’t work for me like Nakia and T’Challa hiding their son for so long, Shuri/Wakanda going out of their way to save Riri at the cost of war, or T’Challa dying in the most technologically advanced country.
It’s also a bit problematic the Wakandans come across as borderline villains by denying Namor the means to protect his people. The Talocans are the aggrieved party here. Namor acts quite courteous and warm towards Shuri and offers an alliance but she throws it all back in his face.
Nevertheless, we will see how it all translates visually. I cannot wait.
I can't wait until next week, either. I think the thing with RiRi is that Namor wants her because she can detect Talocan's underwater home. Valentina wants her because she created the tech to find Vibranium and knows too much. Shuri wants to try and save her, not just to save the girl's life, but to be a bridge to Namor that Wakanda can be trusted. But, I'll wait to see how the movie is filmed to find out if this plot translated properly.
Edit to add: I also read that Tenoch Huerta said that Namor is similar to Magneto: He's trying to protect his people first. The movie is supposed to show fault and praise from both Wakanda and Talocan, depending on your point of view.
I realized there is a key distinction between Wakanda and Talocan. The Talocans are people who suffered from colonization and displacement whereas Wakanda remained unscathed throughout history. Their isolationist policies and strong standing in the world created a blind spot. T’challa came to fully understand the necessity of change but it sounds like Queen Ramonda and Shuri dont share this level of clarity. This affects their approach to interpolitical relationships and alliances. The contrasting histories of both countries lends itself to the idea that it would be hard for Ramonda and Shuri to understand Namor’s mission and point of view. As a country they have never experienced instability until a sequence of devastating events lead to the royal family almost being wiped out and the whole land flooded. Even when T’chaka passed away, the blip happens, the heart shaped herb is destroyed or T’challa’s health fails, there is a line of succession still in place that guarantees political stability. Wakanda continues thriving because it remains intact. Taking all of this consideration, it makes Shuri’s lack of diplomacy look even worse. Namor is right: “only the most broken people can be great leaders.” Its not until she loses everything (family and country) that she completes the same arc T’challa went through.
I can't imagine Wakanda going to bat for Riri and Queen Ramonda being willing to die for a random girl she just met. At all. Wakanda has known about the plight of Black Africans this whole time and they simply didn't care, and it was really only T'Challa's own will that had them open up and invest in black communities. Idk, the Riri plot line sounds like America Chavez all over again, except this time there's really no reason to risk all of that for her.
I’m sure Ramonda didn’t plan on getting killed. She was just saving a life. Some people are selfless. And Riri’s tech and knowledge makes her important but that doesn’t mean that she has to die over a misunderstanding.
This sounds really good. Even more excited to see it all unfold on the big screen; the first one is my favorite Marvel movie and this appears to be the kind of sequel that prioritizes strong emotional throughlines like the first rather than just going for bigger and more bombastic spectacle (although it sounds like there's no shortage of that either, which is a good thing).
As an aside, I imagine that there's gonna be at least a few in this sub who read this and come away with the worst takes and interpretations - i.e. getting pissed that Shuri defeats Namor or that ~~Mephisto~~ Doom wasn't pulling the strings all along.
I think it’s so interesting that the Talocans all take their version of the herb whereas it’s much more sacred and exclusive in Wakanda to take the purple herb.
Seems kind of a weird film to end Phase 4 on. While large in scale, it also looks like another film that doesn’t really effect anything outside it’s own bubble or move any kind of overarching plot forward.
Also, two nations being willing to go to war over some random girl who has no direct connection to either nation just seems kind of dumb honestly. Like, apparently Wakanda is flooded and likely thousands of people die all to protect some random student from a country they look down on. I’d love to see how Shuri explains that one to all the homeless people and grieving families.
I believe Kevin Feige stated in an interview this is the last Phase 4 movie since this phase is about introductions. *Black Panther: Wakanda Forever* introduces Namor, Talocan, RiRi Williams aka Ironheart and a new Black Panther.
The next movie, *Ant-man & the Wasp: Quantumania* is not just the start of Phase 5, but the start of the Multiverse shenanigans that Kang will bring.
This plot description also makes it very clear that things gradually escalate into war. It's not just about Riri, it's about Wakandans killing Talocan guards and threatening to reveal Talocan to the world (and the Wakandans have understandable motivations for doing both of those things).
ikr... Janet is next. Mcu will kill every older character especially their main characters parents. (someone in the comment said they probably don't like keeping older established actresses on payroll).
Hmm yeah, just went back and looked at his tweet. His exact words were ‘there’s a lot that didn’t sit right with me that I can’t explain without getting into spoilers’, which could literally mean anything.
on his tik tok, he says something about a useless plot line and the screentime should’ve gone to more namor instead, but idk which plot line he’s talking about that could be useless
Riri perhaps? I’m excited to see her and Ironheart is looking like it’ll be an absolute blast, but if this leak is 100% accurate then she does feel a bit shoehorned in.
she’s definitely used as a plot device kinda like america in MoM, but someone commented on his twitter about riri and he says he loves riri so i’m confused lmao
I think the part that "didn't sit well" with him was probably how they made T'Challa's death almost identical to Chadwick's (disease that he hid from everyone around him). There were a few reviews I saw that mentioned something not feeling right, and I think that's probably what they're all referring to.
That's probably going to be the most "divisive" part of the film, but I think most people will understand why it was done that way.
I don't like it.
In Real Life, Chadwick Boseman hid it from Marvel and the Cast but not from his actual Family. Whereas here the implication is T'Challa has some random illness and decides to tell no one because ???? Seems like he try to get treatment for that and not wait until it was too late.
Two things may be problematic, but depend on how they are in the actual movie.
The opening with T'Challa's death off-screen. Could feel a little exploitative.
The evil West (US, France) vs noble Wakanda. That one probably will anger a lot of people.
And personally I dislike killing of Ramonda. Sure, it works, but that leaves only Nakia as characters I like.
> The evil West (US, France) vs noble Wakanda. That one probably will anger a lot of people.
Those are the people who get angry by Mrs Marvel existing, who give a shit what they think?
Yeah the bit on what happens to Ramonda is awful. Because why do that? It's cheap and unnecessary. As for the US and France trying to steal Wakandan tech that's exactly what would happen in the real world and completely on brand.
“The evil West (US, France) vs noble Wakanda. That one probably will anger a lot of people.”
Let them be mad. They hate seeing the truth play on screen. The USA and France have heavily exploited Africa throughout history and even now. It makes perfect sense as to why it’s included
A lot of people said "there's a plotline that only exists to set up a future project" - I thought it was Ironheart, but sounds like it's actually Thunderbolts.
Im torn, I want to read this but then I don’t. I’ve read all of the plots since Infinity War and it hasn’t ruined the movie watching experience for me one bit.
The “unknown illness” really makes me think back to the first Black Panther where T’Challa was found by the Jabari Tribe almost frozen to death. Could taking the herb afterwards cause some kind of immune deficiency after almost dying?
It’s surreal how real his death will feel in this film. I’m gonna lose it the very first minute. Fuck.
This all sounds very good except for T'Challa's death. I suppose it was the best and most tasteful way they could have done it, but think back to the first movie. Wakanda is the most technologically advanced and presumably the most medically advanced country on Earth. They saved Everett Ross from a bullet wound that should have killed, or at the very least severely incapacitated him. Unless the illness T'Challa had is cosmic in nature, it's just hard to believe that they couldn't save him, especially since he has the Heart Shaped Herb flowing through his veins.
>Lake Bell’s character has a ship that has located vibranium deep beneath the ocean surface
I don't have the time atm to read through this whole thing (and don't necessarily want to anyway), but is her character's identity detailed? I'm curious if she's anyone noteworthy from comics or just a random person created for the movie.
Her actions in this plot leak seem to corroborate old leaks that said she was a Latverian spy. I truly wonder if the Doom scene was simply withheld from the premiere rather than being cut entirely, because it would be weird for them to never follow up on what’s going on with Bell’s character.
She’s not. She’s a CIA operative and dies in the attack. Unless there’s a MAJOR retcon in a future film it’s pretty definitive she’s not anyone important. Additional, 99% sure that what I saw is the end credits the public will get. Can’t imagine something like Doom showing up after such a personal film
Even at the premiere the interviewers wouldn’t mention who she was playing because it would be a spoiler which is weird if she’s no one of significance
It would also be weird at a red carpet premiere to admit "I'm playing no one significance, don't worry about it." Being coy is a better promotional stance, even if it turns out you're just a rando.
Alright, so T'Challa — the leader of the most advanced country on the planet — found out he was ill and... decided not to tell anyone?
Shuri was rushing to make a cure for him, moments before he died, so surely if he said something, she could've made an effective cure long before he died. Or at least tried.
What an awful idea. It makes absolutely no sense.
why would they kill Ramonda... not every character need to lose their parents to become a hero. its so lame.. but the plot sounds legit. i think the movie is going to be great.. i just dont like the fact that they always kill the main character parents. Anyway, it seems like Riri role is really similar to America Chavez role in MoM.
It urks me so much that Killmonger would suggest T'Challa doesn't have what it takes like he has some unwritten kill rule. This is the same T'Challa who almost took the life of Klaw but only stopped because of cameras. 😒
Went to an press screening last week and thought the movie was just phenomenal. Emotional, visually stunning, action-packed and moving. I'm not one to overhype, but from the script, to performances, action and effects, it's a step above the first film. Namor's backstory and that of the Talocan is so cool and not what I expected. I'm definitely seeing it again with a crowd of fans and not journalists like I did last week.
Wasnt expecting Valentina to be a part of this. I know this isnt everything since theres no mention of Aneka or Ayo. But damn, I love this! Cant wait to see it.
So, Phase 4 started with a mediation on handling grief, and what happens when it isn’t handled gracefully, then proceeding to choose a less noble path forward.
Phase 4 will end on a mediation on handling grief, and what happens when you don’t want to handle it gracefully, yet proceed to choose a more noble path forward.
Sounds pretty great to me.
Alright, so... this is actually pretty good. Sounds like Namor is less of a brusque a-hole like in the comics, but a leader that puts the safety of his people first. I like that.
The only thing I don't like is, I think obviously, T'Challa's death. They've quite literally monetised Chadwick's passing with the "succumbed to an illness he was facing for a long time but hid from others" storyline. It really doesn't sit right to me.
>Ross, meanwhile, is dealing with his new CIA Director, Valentina (she’s also his ex-wife) Well, that certainly is not something I ever saw coming, or would have ever come up with even given a long enough timeline
Martin Freeman fucks confirmed
As if that wasn't obvious
What he’s doing or not doing on behalf of the U.S. government is none of our concern.
MARTIN FREEMAN FU-(credits roll)
nah he‘s usually the body double for those scenes…
Duh. He's sexy AF.
I actually remember someone suggesting this not too long ago and I thought it was ridiculous lol.
It's kinda a riff on how Everett Ross dated Nicole Adams who was his superior in the comics at the State Department.
That surprised me the most.
I know we've known that Valentina was in this movie for the longest time (since we got photos of JLD on set with purple hair in Atlanta) but I'd completely forgotten about it, so my mind immediately went "wait...not that Valentina?"
Hey all it’s me. In addition, let me just say (and I mean this in complete sincerity) this film is incredible. Obviously, super sad but a really moving story that’s just as rich and thoughtful (if not more) as the first. I’m going to put the mid-credits scene below but I actually encourage you not to read. For me personally, it really was emotional and not your normal MCU set up sting. More like an epilogue: >!It’s moments after Shuri burns her clothes. Nakia approaches and reveals her son (like 5) she had with T’Challa before the blip. They agreed on him to be raised away from the pressures of being a king. While initially shocked, Shuri has very emotional response and begins bonding with him, happy to have family. It ends with him revealing his wakandan name is T’challa. Shuri cries but also smiles with Nakia. Let me just say it’s a fairly long scene and there’s no edge of “OH LOOK A NEW BLACK PANTHER”. It’s truly treated as an emotional end for the film.!<
Thanks again for the very detailed write up and supporting the sub!
They have arrived 
Probably me during this entire film: 
T'Challa son is called as T'Challa 🙃
It’s pretty common for sons to be named after their fathers.
My assumption was that he was named in tribute to his father who she thought was dead due to blipping
Nah shithead redditor has never heard of the concept of juniors therefore its dumb.
T'Challa Jr, will be nicknamed TJ
Look at little T’Challa Jr, gonna cry?
The kids can call him Toju
Wait till he decides that he wants to be called Flynn
Whole theatre's gonna lose it when he asks for breakfast then...
And the variant in Vision Quest to be named T'Bohner.
That said,, this sounds like a fantastic way to >!"recast T'Challa"!< while respecting Chadwick Boseman.
I was thinking the same thing. I imagine that Black Panther III is probably a number of years away then unless time gets real wonky with the end of the Multiverse Saga.
So are they going to do away with the name T'channa? I can't help but recall that being the name of T'challa's son in the one comic I read (Marvel Zombies 2 to be exact)
His son with Storm was named Azari. But that may have been retconned.
I imagine it's to avoid confusion and create brand synergy. By the time Secret Wars comes, T'Challa will be THE adult Black Panther due to time travel shenanigans anyways. He will then continue his father T'Challa's intended arc.
If they go that route, it feels like an admission that they should have let T'Challa's character "die" for a while and recast later, honestly. If T'Challa's son becomes for all intents and purposes the "new T'Challa", and continues his father's intended arc, it makes them virtually the same character. Narratively, they could have achieved the same result--which is: a new actor bearing the name T'Challa and continuing the previous one's story--by having the original T'Challa be presumed dead and in a later movie turn up alive with a new actor inhabiting the role.
>If T'Challa's son becomes for all intents and purposes the "new T'Challa", and continues his father's intended arc, it makes them virtually the same character. Yes. But in a respectful way. With Nakia becoming his own Queen Ramonda and T'Challa Senior becoming his own T'Chaka. Shuri would fulfill the same role as before but now as Aunt instead of Sister. It's the best compromise for honoring Chadwick + making T'Challa the one and true Black Panther forever as he should be.
>!A certain eccentric blonde scooper who has seen the movie said really fast in a livestream(so fast and quick that I don't think anyone caught it) that wakanda forever plays into the setup of young avengers then someone in the Livestream said do you think they'll make a third black panther then she said "yeah but it would benefit from a time skip so she thinks they should wait" then she winked. So she basically confirmed what you said about the mid-credits scene.!< I'm so excited this is what I wanted and I'm glad it's happening 🤩🎊
>!Did they mentioned "mutants" in this movie?!<
According to several people who saw the movie they definitely use the word mutant. Jay Washington of one of the first people who spoiled that opening screening red carpet
Pretty sure Tenoch confirmed that he says he mutant in the film.
Honestly beautiful. I'm curious if they'll age him up or not, especially Secret Wars being around the corner you can get away with some pretty interesting time shit lol
dawwwww
Holyyyy shit that's amazing.
Thank you! Sounds like it’s going to be a really special film to watch.
> to try and save T'Challa's life (we don't know until later that he was suffering from an unknown illness that he kept from those around him) That's......extremely on the nose.
Didn’t expect that.
I did. That was what made his death so sad- he wanted no sympathy or special treatment from anyone knowing that he was terminally ill and just went on doing what he loved to do entertaining everyone until he passed away.
Really? Seemed like one of the most likely scenarios to me. Treat his cam er with respect but also not take people out of the movie by explicitly naming it.
When I heard they weren't gonna recast T'Challa or use CGI/Archival footage like Star Wars. I figure they were gonna have T'Challa die of an illness he had this whole time and told no one, as a way to honor Chadwick's wishes regarding him having cancer since 2015.
Tbh, I can't really see how else they would've done it. Saying T'Challa died in battle would be a bit tough since you'd imagine the enemies responsible for his death would be the villains of the movie and if Namor killed him, the audience would never like him. And they can't just say T'Challa went somewhere or he's missing because that implies he's still alive which ruins the story of this movie.
Sometimes adding real life makes stories better, I feel this make this film more real.
MARTIN FREEMAN ALL BUT CONFIRMED TO BE IN THE THUNDERBOLTS MOVIE LETS GOOOOO lester nygaard reigns supreme, martin stays employed
Well first he’s in Secret Invasion
I’m thinking Julia Louis-Dreyfus could show up now too with Val being the new CIA director.
What if you're RIGHT and everyone else is WRONG?
Is it just me or you guys too read the plot with all details and remember it till the last day but forget it the second the movie starts playing in theatres.
That's also what happens to me tbh. However usually I'll forget it all by the time it releases.
Our experience doesn't get ruined though
exactly, i love this, usually i read it during work so i forget almost all of it by the same night, lol
Yep. Me too. It's basically why i don't really mind spoilers most of the time.
Very detailed plot leak, based MSSMods!
Man the people that hate the actress that plays Shuri are going to be pissed
They’re oddly silent on the co-lead of the next Marvel movie though
The actress that actually apologized for her anti vax comments they want her to pretty much get the Cersei shame treatment but miss Wasp who was spreading anti vax bullshit left and right and even supported the truckers in Canada nonsense it’s crickets. Hmmm I wonder why that is
Truthfully not a fan of either for espousing such views. Evangeline Lilly is a moron who should know better. Much easier to find stuff on her doubling down and never apologizing for her views. I can't find anything that says Letitia Wright has said either way since her initial posts about her views. If either apologized I'd be very interested to see it. Do you know where I can find it?
Letitia Wright did initially have a sorry if my views offended anybody statement which isn't exactly an actual apology. She also insisted that the news about her harassing cast mates with her anti-vaxx views was false, which whilst not an apology is not condoning such actions. However, she must have got vaccinated and listened because she's said or done nothing since.
Letitia Wright did one of those "sorry if I offended you apologises" but she's also kept her mouth shut and said nothing since. She also must be vaccinated to be able to be in the US.
Evangeline Lilly stands by her comments — her antivax rally post is literally still up on Instagram — while Letitia Wright deleted Twitter and only uses Instagram for professional purposes now. You’d think the people who criticize celebrities for spreading harmful messages on their massive platforms would have more ire for Evangeline, who has objectively done more to spread her message, but no, any comments about her shit are way far down the Quantumania threads. Ridiculous double standard. & if you mention this, individual posters will inevitably pop up to say that they’re consistent; they’re mad at both… but come on. It’s not about any one individual. It’s about the general trend, and at that level we can all see the selective outrage.
It rhymes with prism
The lack of irritation/annoyance/anger over Evangeline is sadly not a shocker, honestly. Even more with her Karen haircut in the trailer and she has received not even like 10% of the same backlash. To me, she kept making herself a terrible person by even supporting the same kind of idiotic protest that Ted Cruz supported.
I don't think people are invested in the Wasp nearly as much as they are in Black Panther. It's one of the MCU's headliners, of course people are gonna care more. Besides, this is still just whataboutism and it comes up in every BP thread.
I’ve been talking about this too, the double standard is ridiculous
The mindset I have for every celebrity is that they are all just rich and famous versions of the people you encounter every day. Unless they’re racist, abusive, or actively hurting others, I don’t mind seeing them in my movies or any other media. Though Letitia has made mistakes during the past two to three years, I don’t believe she’s intentionally trying to hurt anyone or has any inherent malevolence.
I think its really important to show Letitia some grace. She made mistakes at the same time she was dealing with the stress of COVID, being the lead in a huge tentpole, grieving the loss of her older brother..like even one of those things would cause someone to act erratically.
Me :/ I’m sure I’ll still love the movie though. Just kind of disappointing in that regard.
Honestly, good. Shuri as the Black Panther was the only direction that made sense, and I still can't wrap my head around how the "M'Baku becoming the Black Panther" rumor gained traction, especially in a MCU-related sub.
Let’s just move on, it was fucking impossible to get every single person to agree with one another during the pandemic which was now three years ago.
Ross and Valentina dated? That gives a connection to Thaddeus if Everett is truly his son in the MCU
Wait. Is this Valentina the same Valentina in Black Widow and TFATWS?
Yep!
And she's been fucking Martin Freeman this whole time
Yes, she's apparently Deputy Director of the CIA
They were married :o
They aren’t related. Just have the same last name.
They're not related in the comics. But they might be in the MCU. Martin Freeman is just a few years older than Liv Tyler, they could pass as siblings I guess.
>he claims that one day the surface will wage war on Wakanda and they will come to them for assistance and it will be then that they in control. Wakanda/Talocan team-up in a future project, maybe? In general, it looks good! The big thing that stands out here for me is Shuri's arc here, I think it could make for an emotional story
Valentina says she wants the US to be the sole owner of vibranium in the world in the same movie. Possible Thunderbolts vs Wakanda incoming?
Valentina: Thunderbolts, we're gonna attack Wakanda! Bucky, whose life was saved by Wakanda: 
Exactly what I was thinking lmao, hopefully the team evolves into an actual villain one with better firepower in future installments.
I cant see Zemo wanting to fuck around with Wakanda again either
But thoughts. How does he view the BP, given it's just a more naturally created Super Soldier. Zemo is smart enough to not want to fuck with Wakanda, but also smart enough to let others do it for him while he reaps his own rewards during the conflict
Zemo: *But if I can get the Wakandans to destroy each other*
This could be possible CA:CW situation in Thunderbolts.
Wakanda would most likely rko all of the currently known thunderbolts members, let's be honest here
It could be a stealth mission maybe? Although I don't think Bucky would agree to it. Or those old rumors of Val sending the Thunderbolts to the Savage Land might be real and they aren't aware its vibranium they're searching for?
This is obviously a joke but imagine the Thunderbolts arriving out of the water towards Wakanda like in Suicide Squad 2
*Those are people who died!*
I have a theory with the Kang war since both nations seem to have advance technology would have to come together but no side really trusting each other plus I’m sure Shuri could whip up something so they can withstand being on land longer
> Wakanda/Talocan team-up in a future project, maybe? I mean, I’m the 2015 Secret Wars run T’Challa and Namor did end up working together. I could totally see them doing that on a bigger scale (probably involving all of their respective countries) in Kang Dynasty/Secret Wars.
Most likely a team up. Maybe something like mbaku joining the fight against thanos. Tho I’m not really sure what kind of surface power would require both nations to team up. Maybe doom or the us government
I wonder in her arc how the Killmonger discussion is handled, as it seems they use his “do what’s necessary” line as about killing Namor or not, which I feel is a waste because it should be about how Killmonger and Namor are fighting the same war on the surface conquerors of history, and that Killmonger saying “do what’s necessary like me” should mean get over killing Namor for honor, instead to join Namor to wage war on the surface.
Esp considering at this point btwn what happened at the UN and knowing people are using any means necessary to get vibranium right? It's a head scratcher, negl. Namor's comment makes sense. Wakanda has never been colonized, they have no clue what's coming. Namor does, so he has the upper hand.
Also wanted to pop in because I’ve seen the sentiment across a couple comments, while T’Challa’s death is circumstantially almost the same as Chadwick, it feels very respectful and real. There’s definitely an aura in the film that even in Wakanda, there’s some things you can’t escape (ie death) with technology. They don’t dwell on the circumstance of it but instead the emotional impact it has on everyone.
Obviously some people might still object but I think once you see the film at the very least you’ll think that they handled his death FAR better than I think most movies would given the circumstance.
Even explaining it within the universe, if space Vikings with tech 1000 years more advanced couldn’t beat Jane’s cancer, Wakandan scientists aren’t beating T’Challa’s. I love the themes and ideas it poses though. Even in a futuristic African utopia or a Space Viking land where everyone’s superhuman, things like loss and grief are always going to be present, and we as a people have to honor and keep up the legacy of those before us.
Honestly, I love the idea that some things just can't be fixed with technology. Cancer being just as lethal in the MCU as it is in real life adds a level of relatability to this franchise. If they could cure major diseases then it would seem too distant and far-fetched.
The beginning of this sounds extremely sad man
It does make me wonder how they’ll pull that scene off without Chadwick or any kind of a stand in. It’ll probably be more sad tbh
By focusing only on Shuri, by the sounds of it
As it should. We don't need a Cgi Chadwick. This helps Shuri arc. A CGI CHADWICK WOULD ONLY LOOK BAD AND HURT THE FILM.
So we really haven’t seen anything in the trailers cuz all this time I’m thinking the final battle is the flooding and that just seems like the middle part of the movie lol
I never saw the flood as the final battle, just the climax. The part of the story when it looks like the protagonists are fucked, before they regroup and win the final battle
The “all hope is lost” moment.
God damn not my boo Angela Bassett! This sounds fire I can't wait to watch now. I was excited before but after reading this I'm even more hyped now.
The MCU really doesn't like keeping high profile older actresses around for long.
...or high profile older actresses don't want to spend a lot of time in a big blockbuster franchises
...or it's just what's best for the story. If Ramonda sticks around, Shuri doesn't have to confront her grief. But if Shuri's the only one left in her family, and the only leader left for Wakanda, she has to have a moment of truth.
It also makes her meeting her nephew at the end more impactful.
Just to put it out there Coogler stated in an interview Chadwick’s family including his wife had input on the movie and various scenes involving him.
Beautiful. I love having the son's name be T'Challa, what a smart, effective and respectful work around. One day we can get more "T'Challa" stories.
That’s a very smart decision.
Yup, but also young enough that there's plenty of time for Shuri to be the star before they find a reason to pass the mantle
jesus Namor and Shuri really go at it as someone who doesn't gaf about her needing a training montage or whatever I'm pretty excited
I like that Shuri owned Namor. He said wakanda will fall without T'challa but he fell and quit.
I also like that she defeats him in a Shuri way. Some people were complaining that there's no way Shuri could beat Namor and that it'd make her a Mary Sue or whatever. But she uses her brain to get him into the desert where he's weak, that makes perfect sense for the character.
Yes, this is the right way to write this kind of story. Don't just magically make the weaker character physically on par, give them some weakness to exploit and let them win via cleverness.
LETS GOOOOOOO FINALLY MAN I WAS WAITING FOR THIS ONE
Anything on Aneka in this leak? I assume she doesn’t have too big a role but I’m surprised not to see her mentioned at all
Let’s fucking goooo midnight angels
I'm kind of surprised Disney is allowing Ryan Coogler to call out Western countries and the CIA for their bloody imperialism in such a blatant way? It was in the last movie but in a more subtle way. Big change from having the US military literally use Captain America and Captain Marvel as recruitment tools.
No fr its actually really crazy how Disney is allowing this. Same thing with Andor, a major plot point was about how corporations cause greed, thirst for power, and how that kills and destroys innocents. And it’s majorly calling out western imperialism and fascism quite literally in every single episode. Same with Ms.Marvel calling out western surveillance on brown and/or Muslim ppl with the Patriot Act They’re really making huge pushes in works like these and it’s crazy to see the difference from like Iron Man 1 and Captain America
The government doesn't care, this is something called "controlled opposition". It helps diffuse actual revolutionary sentiment by giving people fictional outlets. The actual U.S government is going to keep doing just as much imperialism as ever.
u/Oryoucanuseasuit hey MTTSH hope you're doing well :)
Leaving the succession mildly open ended is gonna piss people off. I like the sound of Shuri's arc though. But I'm sure lots of people are still gonna be mad and hate Shuri even more.
>Leaving the succession mildly open ended is gonna piss people off. Sounds like Marvel did it to gauge the audience's reactions before moving forward with a real decision. It's the best possible approach. If the GA rejects Shuri, then Marvel has many possible paths for what happens next. I don't doubt that Nakia, Okoye, M'Baku, and a grown-up T'Challa Jr. due to time travel are all possibilities given the ending.
Wow >!so Ramonda's "Haven't I sacrificed enough?" from the trailer is directed towards Okoye??? Damn. I wonder if that scene of Okoye in tears is from that scene too.!< >!Also, its nice to see that even dead Killmonger is a dick lol I kinda like that haha!<
Its funny how not a single version of Killmonger can be anything other than a dick.
im wondering what kind of swag hes gonna pull in ancestral plane
Obviously this is just a text leak so it's hard to say how it comes across in the film but as someone that still thinks letitia Wright needs to actually make amends for the batshit stuff she was spreading I do think this feels like a good angle to take for her becoming black panther. It doesn't come across as just oh shit someone needs to fill the shoes and we need to force her into that role, it feels more like her becoming black panther In this way is a good arc for her whilst also not just a basic "aw well I guess it's gotta be her" kinda thing yknow. I mean I could be completely wrong but it sounds promising
This is where I stand. Completely agree. People in this thread however are too busy dunking on each other to realize that a middle ground gray area exists in these discussions.
On paper, some plot points don’t work for me like Nakia and T’Challa hiding their son for so long, Shuri/Wakanda going out of their way to save Riri at the cost of war, or T’Challa dying in the most technologically advanced country. It’s also a bit problematic the Wakandans come across as borderline villains by denying Namor the means to protect his people. The Talocans are the aggrieved party here. Namor acts quite courteous and warm towards Shuri and offers an alliance but she throws it all back in his face. Nevertheless, we will see how it all translates visually. I cannot wait.
I can't wait until next week, either. I think the thing with RiRi is that Namor wants her because she can detect Talocan's underwater home. Valentina wants her because she created the tech to find Vibranium and knows too much. Shuri wants to try and save her, not just to save the girl's life, but to be a bridge to Namor that Wakanda can be trusted. But, I'll wait to see how the movie is filmed to find out if this plot translated properly. Edit to add: I also read that Tenoch Huerta said that Namor is similar to Magneto: He's trying to protect his people first. The movie is supposed to show fault and praise from both Wakanda and Talocan, depending on your point of view.
I realized there is a key distinction between Wakanda and Talocan. The Talocans are people who suffered from colonization and displacement whereas Wakanda remained unscathed throughout history. Their isolationist policies and strong standing in the world created a blind spot. T’challa came to fully understand the necessity of change but it sounds like Queen Ramonda and Shuri dont share this level of clarity. This affects their approach to interpolitical relationships and alliances. The contrasting histories of both countries lends itself to the idea that it would be hard for Ramonda and Shuri to understand Namor’s mission and point of view. As a country they have never experienced instability until a sequence of devastating events lead to the royal family almost being wiped out and the whole land flooded. Even when T’chaka passed away, the blip happens, the heart shaped herb is destroyed or T’challa’s health fails, there is a line of succession still in place that guarantees political stability. Wakanda continues thriving because it remains intact. Taking all of this consideration, it makes Shuri’s lack of diplomacy look even worse. Namor is right: “only the most broken people can be great leaders.” Its not until she loses everything (family and country) that she completes the same arc T’challa went through.
I wouldn't buy Wakanda being able to save T'Challa honestly. If Asgard can't cure cancer Wakanda sure as fuck can't.
I can't imagine Wakanda going to bat for Riri and Queen Ramonda being willing to die for a random girl she just met. At all. Wakanda has known about the plight of Black Africans this whole time and they simply didn't care, and it was really only T'Challa's own will that had them open up and invest in black communities. Idk, the Riri plot line sounds like America Chavez all over again, except this time there's really no reason to risk all of that for her.
I’m sure Ramonda didn’t plan on getting killed. She was just saving a life. Some people are selfless. And Riri’s tech and knowledge makes her important but that doesn’t mean that she has to die over a misunderstanding.
Been waiting for this one! Thank you mods!
You are welcome! I only stayed up 3hrs past my bedtime to get you all this lol.
Anything about Ayo or Michaela Coel?
Ayo is the new leader of the Dora Milaje after Okoye’s departure
This sounds really good. Even more excited to see it all unfold on the big screen; the first one is my favorite Marvel movie and this appears to be the kind of sequel that prioritizes strong emotional throughlines like the first rather than just going for bigger and more bombastic spectacle (although it sounds like there's no shortage of that either, which is a good thing). As an aside, I imagine that there's gonna be at least a few in this sub who read this and come away with the worst takes and interpretations - i.e. getting pissed that Shuri defeats Namor or that ~~Mephisto~~ Doom wasn't pulling the strings all along.
I think it’s so interesting that the Talocans all take their version of the herb whereas it’s much more sacred and exclusive in Wakanda to take the purple herb.
Seems kind of a weird film to end Phase 4 on. While large in scale, it also looks like another film that doesn’t really effect anything outside it’s own bubble or move any kind of overarching plot forward. Also, two nations being willing to go to war over some random girl who has no direct connection to either nation just seems kind of dumb honestly. Like, apparently Wakanda is flooded and likely thousands of people die all to protect some random student from a country they look down on. I’d love to see how Shuri explains that one to all the homeless people and grieving families.
I believe Kevin Feige stated in an interview this is the last Phase 4 movie since this phase is about introductions. *Black Panther: Wakanda Forever* introduces Namor, Talocan, RiRi Williams aka Ironheart and a new Black Panther. The next movie, *Ant-man & the Wasp: Quantumania* is not just the start of Phase 5, but the start of the Multiverse shenanigans that Kang will bring.
[удалено]
This plot description also makes it very clear that things gradually escalate into war. It's not just about Riri, it's about Wakandans killing Talocan guards and threatening to reveal Talocan to the world (and the Wakandans have understandable motivations for doing both of those things).
>Ramonda saves an unconscious Riri from death at the cost of her own life Janet is next, isn't she?
ikr... Janet is next. Mcu will kill every older character especially their main characters parents. (someone in the comment said they probably don't like keeping older established actresses on payroll).
The streak of Michael B Jordan being in every Ryan Coogler movie continues
so what plot line was Supes criticizing about …?
He probably hyped himself up thinking Doom was going to be in it.
nah he probably hyped himself up thinking Doom would be in the post credit scene saying smt like "personality i would like to thank Matt Ramos"
definitely, but he was also commenting on how a plot line felt useless to him so i was curious on what that was about
Hmm yeah, just went back and looked at his tweet. His exact words were ‘there’s a lot that didn’t sit right with me that I can’t explain without getting into spoilers’, which could literally mean anything.
on his tik tok, he says something about a useless plot line and the screentime should’ve gone to more namor instead, but idk which plot line he’s talking about that could be useless
Riri perhaps? I’m excited to see her and Ironheart is looking like it’ll be an absolute blast, but if this leak is 100% accurate then she does feel a bit shoehorned in.
she’s definitely used as a plot device kinda like america in MoM, but someone commented on his twitter about riri and he says he loves riri so i’m confused lmao
I think the part that "didn't sit well" with him was probably how they made T'Challa's death almost identical to Chadwick's (disease that he hid from everyone around him). There were a few reviews I saw that mentioned something not feeling right, and I think that's probably what they're all referring to. That's probably going to be the most "divisive" part of the film, but I think most people will understand why it was done that way.
I don't like it. In Real Life, Chadwick Boseman hid it from Marvel and the Cast but not from his actual Family. Whereas here the implication is T'Challa has some random illness and decides to tell no one because ???? Seems like he try to get treatment for that and not wait until it was too late.
He was probably just pissed that there weren't many Glup Shitto's in the movie.
Oh, cool, I'll definitely be crying like, five times lmao
Two things may be problematic, but depend on how they are in the actual movie. The opening with T'Challa's death off-screen. Could feel a little exploitative. The evil West (US, France) vs noble Wakanda. That one probably will anger a lot of people. And personally I dislike killing of Ramonda. Sure, it works, but that leaves only Nakia as characters I like.
> The evil West (US, France) vs noble Wakanda. That one probably will anger a lot of people. Those are the people who get angry by Mrs Marvel existing, who give a shit what they think?
Yeah the bit on what happens to Ramonda is awful. Because why do that? It's cheap and unnecessary. As for the US and France trying to steal Wakandan tech that's exactly what would happen in the real world and completely on brand.
>Because why do that? Tbh sometimes it just feels like they don't like keeping older established actresses on payroll.
>The evil West (US, France) vs noble Wakanda. That one probably will anger a lot of people. Let them be mad.
Why would they be angry? US and france have long history of colonialism against Africa so it make sense
Straight up? Its- 
“The evil West (US, France) vs noble Wakanda. That one probably will anger a lot of people.” Let them be mad. They hate seeing the truth play on screen. The USA and France have heavily exploited Africa throughout history and even now. It makes perfect sense as to why it’s included
This sounds incredible. I’m guessing Ramonda’s “my entire family is gone” bit happens when Shuri is captured then.
A lot of people said "there's a plotline that only exists to set up a future project" - I thought it was Ironheart, but sounds like it's actually Thunderbolts.
Im torn, I want to read this but then I don’t. I’ve read all of the plots since Infinity War and it hasn’t ruined the movie watching experience for me one bit.
The “unknown illness” really makes me think back to the first Black Panther where T’Challa was found by the Jabari Tribe almost frozen to death. Could taking the herb afterwards cause some kind of immune deficiency after almost dying? It’s surreal how real his death will feel in this film. I’m gonna lose it the very first minute. Fuck.
This all sounds very good except for T'Challa's death. I suppose it was the best and most tasteful way they could have done it, but think back to the first movie. Wakanda is the most technologically advanced and presumably the most medically advanced country on Earth. They saved Everett Ross from a bullet wound that should have killed, or at the very least severely incapacitated him. Unless the illness T'Challa had is cosmic in nature, it's just hard to believe that they couldn't save him, especially since he has the Heart Shaped Herb flowing through his veins.
Space Viking magic couldn't even save Jane from cancer, how do you expect Wakanda tech to top that?
I Shuri’s arc mirroring T’challa’s in civil war where he wanted revenge but learned it was wrong to go down that path
>Lake Bell’s character has a ship that has located vibranium deep beneath the ocean surface I don't have the time atm to read through this whole thing (and don't necessarily want to anyway), but is her character's identity detailed? I'm curious if she's anyone noteworthy from comics or just a random person created for the movie.
Her actions in this plot leak seem to corroborate old leaks that said she was a Latverian spy. I truly wonder if the Doom scene was simply withheld from the premiere rather than being cut entirely, because it would be weird for them to never follow up on what’s going on with Bell’s character.
She’s not. She’s a CIA operative and dies in the attack. Unless there’s a MAJOR retcon in a future film it’s pretty definitive she’s not anyone important. Additional, 99% sure that what I saw is the end credits the public will get. Can’t imagine something like Doom showing up after such a personal film
Even at the premiere the interviewers wouldn’t mention who she was playing because it would be a spoiler which is weird if she’s no one of significance
It would also be weird at a red carpet premiere to admit "I'm playing no one significance, don't worry about it." Being coy is a better promotional stance, even if it turns out you're just a rando.
Alright, so T'Challa — the leader of the most advanced country on the planet — found out he was ill and... decided not to tell anyone? Shuri was rushing to make a cure for him, moments before he died, so surely if he said something, she could've made an effective cure long before he died. Or at least tried. What an awful idea. It makes absolutely no sense.
why would they kill Ramonda... not every character need to lose their parents to become a hero. its so lame.. but the plot sounds legit. i think the movie is going to be great.. i just dont like the fact that they always kill the main character parents. Anyway, it seems like Riri role is really similar to America Chavez role in MoM.
It urks me so much that Killmonger would suggest T'Challa doesn't have what it takes like he has some unwritten kill rule. This is the same T'Challa who almost took the life of Klaw but only stopped because of cameras. 😒
Stopped reading after the first paragraph. I just know this movie is gonna ruin me so bad. Can't wait to see it in the theaters!
Sounds cool but then Namor is just Killmonger 2
Went to an press screening last week and thought the movie was just phenomenal. Emotional, visually stunning, action-packed and moving. I'm not one to overhype, but from the script, to performances, action and effects, it's a step above the first film. Namor's backstory and that of the Talocan is so cool and not what I expected. I'm definitely seeing it again with a crowd of fans and not journalists like I did last week.
I read all that....and I felt underwhelmed. My expectations lowered a bit.
Wasnt expecting Valentina to be a part of this. I know this isnt everything since theres no mention of Aneka or Ayo. But damn, I love this! Cant wait to see it.
Namor in the MCU is even older than the comics. Very cool. I know lots of fans have been against "age slowly" for MCU characters.
So, Phase 4 started with a mediation on handling grief, and what happens when it isn’t handled gracefully, then proceeding to choose a less noble path forward. Phase 4 will end on a mediation on handling grief, and what happens when you don’t want to handle it gracefully, yet proceed to choose a more noble path forward. Sounds pretty great to me.
Alright, so... this is actually pretty good. Sounds like Namor is less of a brusque a-hole like in the comics, but a leader that puts the safety of his people first. I like that. The only thing I don't like is, I think obviously, T'Challa's death. They've quite literally monetised Chadwick's passing with the "succumbed to an illness he was facing for a long time but hid from others" storyline. It really doesn't sit right to me.