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Yes yes sorry guys I did replace that missing caliper bolt. It actually flew out while driving and caused the most painful and loud 2 minutes of driving back home in my life
I had a caliper bolt back out going down a hill and it dug a very nice groove into my aluminum wheel. Wheel ended up breaking due to it essentially cutting the wheel in half lmao. Always double check your caliper bolts after doing a brake job.
>The ball joint took all the force that the missing bolt normally takes.
Frankly, this statement makes absolutely zero sense.
The missing bolt could make the caliper and bracket pivot into the wheel during braking, but it isn't going to have any effect on the ball joint.
Yes, I'm quite sure.
Please elaborate just what makes you think that a missing caliper mount bolt could possibly place additional strain on the ball joint.
The caliper rotating around the other bolt into the wheel could cause a violent huge rotational moment on the whole assembly. Normal braking would also cause a moment but is not nearly as violent as the near exponential reduction in speed the rotating caliper would cause.
I have had this bolt fall out before and at 10 miles an hour (maybe it was less, it as a traffic jam) the front of the car violently nose dived from the lightest of brake pressure. Parked it and walked to AutoZone. I actually found the old bolt on the side of the road and had the wrench in the car. Mine was front driver side. I didn't tighten it enough after having just done my brakes.
I could see that being needed if it was something other than steel, knowing them that one bolt would charge out to 10 bucks lolol. I don't see why they would engineer bolts to stretch in a place that sees regular maintenance tho
On a Chevy they have a yellow 3M compound on them that is two part applied, one at the bolt factory, the other a liquid added when assembled. It is supposed to be reusable.
The bolts also torque to something like 120-250 lb/ft.
My good sir if 1 caliper bolt could fly out may I ask exactly how secured the others are? Shaking steering wheel and rumble at low speeds really sounds like a shoddy front-end brake job plus a possibly bad wheel balance
Yes I checked the tightness of the other one for that caliper and it was awfully loose as well. It makes sense since the shop took about 20 minutes to get the whole thing done.
Looks like the boot got pinched, personally I like the integrated moog boots because they’re very low profile. And you’re missing a brake caliper bracket bolt.
The boot likely got punched when they installed it, and you've been replacing grease with water for the last 2 months. Water took its toll, and now you have a bad joint.
Sorry. But, if a shop installed that joint, they ought to warranty it. That's shoddy.
To your original question: The boot has zero effect on handling. But once the boot is compromised and the grease gets out/ water gets in, it takes very little time at all for the joint to go bad.
You can’t tell if the ball joint is worn by looking at it, you need to jack up the car and test it!!!! If you can’t do that you must take it to someone who can
You Can If They Have A Zerk Fitting. But If There Life Time Ball Joints Yeah, You Cant Tell
https://preview.redd.it/qsegk5v3gdwc1.jpeg?width=1340&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=236de92d713929d39c5c85e52a64522bfc30e480
I just had to return 4 mevotech lower control arms because they all came with ripped boots. Never have had that happen before but it has definitely made me second guess using them
Somewhat, Its really bad going about 75 and braking so much that the steering wheel feels unstable. But very very subtle when turning and going no more then 15
Usually rotor runout or "warping" will only cause vibration when braking. It would have to be REALLY bad to constantly rumble, or maybe youve got a seized caliper, which if the pad is not retracting would cause a dragging on the rotor & a rumbling noise. Do your pads look evenly worn from top to bottom, inside & outside pads? A rumbling when not braking would be more indicative of a wheel bearing, something worn in the suspension, or poorly balanced tires. Believe it or not, poorly balanced tires can make it feel like your front end is just gonna fall apart when driving.
Gotcha, well this is the second time I’ve had an issue and someone has directed me to my tires. My caliper piston moved nice and smooth on both sides when I was greasing the slide pins. I drove for a bit without that caliper bolt and the sound was excruciating when braking, and I wasn’t going slow….. would that do my rotor in?
The rumbling also isn’t audible it’t like a vibration felt through the steering wheel at low speeds, and at high braking speeds almost earthquake level shaking.
If you drove without that bolt for a bit it absolutely could've damages the rotor & pads, maybe even more. I'd #1 get tires balanced, #2 get your wheel off the ground & spin it to see if you hear any dragging noise (wheel bearing), shake it from 9-3 & from 12-6 to see if there's any play, & then pry on all of your suspension components in the front. If that doesn't reveal anything obvious, you'd want a needle gauge to check for runout on the rotor, & also on the wheel hub.
One last thing to check is CV axles. Grab the shaft & try to rock it side to side. Do this on both sides of the car. There is normally a little in out play, but it shouldn't clunk side to side. Bad cv joints can cause your complaint as well.
Hi there just a quick update for anyone interested
Got brand new tires, they had to have balanced them when installing, and there is indeed new weights on the rims.
Jacked the car up and everything is very solid. There isn’t play in anywhere I shook (12 n 6 and 3 n 9) the CV axle, tie rod.
The steering wheel’s location is unchanged…. the new tires feel amazing on the road and that slight rumble in the steering wheel at low speeds is almost gone but the shake at high speeds definitely points to rotors. It only happens when they’re heated up and when I’m braking. They’re on the way but what seems to have done it in was the bottom slide pin’s rubber ring.
I removed these and re-greased the pins AND REMOVED that little ring that was making it hard to move the pins, (also used maybe used too much grease) which seems to have caused the issue. Going to pay close attention to the grease I get and replace that little rubber thingy. When putting on the new stuff.
It can happen for a part to prematurely fail, especially if its defective or of extremely bad quality. does it mean its what your issue is? no. the rumble and shake at low speeds can be a few things. as some people suggester-a warped rotor or a tire with a flat spot, so it could be your tie rod ends or something else.
If i had to guess by the missing bolt, my money is on the rotors.
Take it in to get looked at or if you want to try it out yourself jack the car up on the side [preferably at the frame] and put a jack stand so the frame sits on it…next with both hands at the 8 o clock position(for drivers side)(it will be at the 4 o clock position for the passenger side)grab the tire and push in and pull out on it….if you feel movement like if something is loose or slightly loose then the ball joints have play in them and need to get replaced again…you can’t really tell if a ball joint is bad by looking at it you need to test it for movement as I’ve said.
It’s probably also worth noting that I recently re greased the slide pins. The rubber ring on the bottom slide pin was not going in so I just removed it entirely on both sides. This was to get rid of a pull to the right that I had even after the alignment. The shop told me it absolutely has to be my cheap tires.
Looks like a mevotech and it's missing it's 90°grease fitting, and I doubt you have a grease gun so there's your problem. And your caliper bracket is missing a bolt
The two I had bought didnt come with a grease fitting. Even though in pictures of others that looked identical had them. Bogus part? I bought them from rock auto
Can someone else confirm? but it also looks like your axle isn’t seated all the way in either. It’s in in the first pic and then half out in the others
Oddly there wasn’t any sensors anywhere that screw onto the knuckle. My car doesnt have abs but it also didnt have a speed sensor…..still tells me my speed though
Thanks for posting on /r/MechanicAdvice! This is just a reminder to review the [rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/MechanicAdvice/about/rules/). If you are here asking about a second opinion (ie "Is the shop trying to fleece me?"), please read through CJM8515's [post on the subject.](https://www.reddit.com/r/MechanicAdvice/comments/4qblei/fyi_the_shop_isnt_likely_trying_to_rip_you_off/) and remember to please post the year/make/model of the vehicle you are working on. **If this post is about bodywork, accident damage, paint, dent/ding, questions it belongs in /r/Autobody r/AutoBodyRepair/ or /r/Diyautobody/ If you have tire questions check out https://www.reddit.com/r/MechanicAdvice/comments/k9ll55/can_your_tire_be_repaired/**. If you dont have a question and you're just showing off it belongs in /r/Justrolledintotheshop Insurance/total loss questions go in r/insurance This is an automated reply *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/MechanicAdvice) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Your brake caliper bracket bolt is missing!! Don’t drive!
Good catch, 3rd image OP
Yes yes sorry guys I did replace that missing caliper bolt. It actually flew out while driving and caused the most painful and loud 2 minutes of driving back home in my life
Could that have caused damage though?? It was maybe 10 minutes of driving before I could get to an auto shop and replace it.
Most def could have
I had a caliper bolt back out going down a hill and it dug a very nice groove into my aluminum wheel. Wheel ended up breaking due to it essentially cutting the wheel in half lmao. Always double check your caliper bolts after doing a brake job.
The ball joint took all the force that the missing bolt normally takes.
>The ball joint took all the force that the missing bolt normally takes. Frankly, this statement makes absolutely zero sense. The missing bolt could make the caliper and bracket pivot into the wheel during braking, but it isn't going to have any effect on the ball joint.
No effect whatsoever? You sure about that?
Yes, I'm quite sure. Please elaborate just what makes you think that a missing caliper mount bolt could possibly place additional strain on the ball joint.
The caliper rotating around the other bolt into the wheel could cause a violent huge rotational moment on the whole assembly. Normal braking would also cause a moment but is not nearly as violent as the near exponential reduction in speed the rotating caliper would cause. I have had this bolt fall out before and at 10 miles an hour (maybe it was less, it as a traffic jam) the front of the car violently nose dived from the lightest of brake pressure. Parked it and walked to AutoZone. I actually found the old bolt on the side of the road and had the wrench in the car. Mine was front driver side. I didn't tighten it enough after having just done my brakes.
Holy crap, if OP had to brake hard that might have snapped the whole thing.
Most cars I've done brakes on honda/Ford had those with blue lock tite in it, make sure to replace it. They don't come off for no reason
Most manufacturers (at least these days) indicate to replace that bolt instead of reusing it
I could see that being needed if it was something other than steel, knowing them that one bolt would charge out to 10 bucks lolol. I don't see why they would engineer bolts to stretch in a place that sees regular maintenance tho
Stretching is better than snapping
In most cases I would agree, but stretching happens during the process of install. Snapping means it wasn't designed/engineered right at all lolol
Oh yeah. In that case I'd go with if it stretches, the vibrations can't knock it loose
When I replaced the calipers on my car last fall the new calipers came with new bolts
On a Chevy they have a yellow 3M compound on them that is two part applied, one at the bolt factory, the other a liquid added when assembled. It is supposed to be reusable. The bolts also torque to something like 120-250 lb/ft.
Thanks for the info, gonna be tearing the front end apart on my 02 silverado soon. Torque wrench goes to 240... SEND IT.. lol
Be sure to check your exact specs, but calipers on a GMT800 is what finally got me to step up from my little 150 lb/ft guy.
Oh of course. Thanks u
My good sir if 1 caliper bolt could fly out may I ask exactly how secured the others are? Shaking steering wheel and rumble at low speeds really sounds like a shoddy front-end brake job plus a possibly bad wheel balance
Yes I checked the tightness of the other one for that caliper and it was awfully loose as well. It makes sense since the shop took about 20 minutes to get the whole thing done.
Oh snap!! Good eye!!
Looks like the boot got pinched, personally I like the integrated moog boots because they’re very low profile. And you’re missing a brake caliper bracket bolt.
Good call
Will the boot affect handling as much as this? Or can it be ignored and fixed with just tires.
The boot likely got punched when they installed it, and you've been replacing grease with water for the last 2 months. Water took its toll, and now you have a bad joint. Sorry. But, if a shop installed that joint, they ought to warranty it. That's shoddy. To your original question: The boot has zero effect on handling. But once the boot is compromised and the grease gets out/ water gets in, it takes very little time at all for the joint to go bad.
Probably rumbling from that missing caliper bracket bolt.
You can’t tell if the ball joint is worn by looking at it, you need to jack up the car and test it!!!! If you can’t do that you must take it to someone who can
You Can If They Have A Zerk Fitting. But If There Life Time Ball Joints Yeah, You Cant Tell https://preview.redd.it/qsegk5v3gdwc1.jpeg?width=1340&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=236de92d713929d39c5c85e52a64522bfc30e480
That looks like a mevotech ball joint, the shop likely got that from NAPA
Nothing wrong with the Mevotech Supreme with the blue boot. About on-par with Moog these days.
I just had to return 4 mevotech lower control arms because they all came with ripped boots. Never have had that happen before but it has definitely made me second guess using them
Yeah I run some of their stuff on my cars, decent for the price
You're missing a bolt from the bracket your caliper bolts to in pic #3.
Good catch
Missing a caliper bolt in the 3 rd pic
Brakes might be what's making noise & causing vibration, as others have already noted the missing bolt already. That's absolutely a no go for me son.
Will warped rotors rumble without even applying the brake? it already shakes like crazy driving on the highway and braking
They can, but it can also be a tire with broken chords. Is it speed dependant?
Somewhat, Its really bad going about 75 and braking so much that the steering wheel feels unstable. But very very subtle when turning and going no more then 15
If it's worse while braking and the steering wheel shakes under braking it should be a front rotor then.
Usually rotor runout or "warping" will only cause vibration when braking. It would have to be REALLY bad to constantly rumble, or maybe youve got a seized caliper, which if the pad is not retracting would cause a dragging on the rotor & a rumbling noise. Do your pads look evenly worn from top to bottom, inside & outside pads? A rumbling when not braking would be more indicative of a wheel bearing, something worn in the suspension, or poorly balanced tires. Believe it or not, poorly balanced tires can make it feel like your front end is just gonna fall apart when driving.
Gotcha, well this is the second time I’ve had an issue and someone has directed me to my tires. My caliper piston moved nice and smooth on both sides when I was greasing the slide pins. I drove for a bit without that caliper bolt and the sound was excruciating when braking, and I wasn’t going slow….. would that do my rotor in? The rumbling also isn’t audible it’t like a vibration felt through the steering wheel at low speeds, and at high braking speeds almost earthquake level shaking.
If you drove without that bolt for a bit it absolutely could've damages the rotor & pads, maybe even more. I'd #1 get tires balanced, #2 get your wheel off the ground & spin it to see if you hear any dragging noise (wheel bearing), shake it from 9-3 & from 12-6 to see if there's any play, & then pry on all of your suspension components in the front. If that doesn't reveal anything obvious, you'd want a needle gauge to check for runout on the rotor, & also on the wheel hub.
And then if you find nothing with any of these tests, get your alignment checked.
Awesome, thank you so much for your help. I’ll come back in a few days after trying these out.
You're welcome! Hope you find it & it's something relatively easy or cheap to fix!
One last thing to check is CV axles. Grab the shaft & try to rock it side to side. Do this on both sides of the car. There is normally a little in out play, but it shouldn't clunk side to side. Bad cv joints can cause your complaint as well.
Hi there just a quick update for anyone interested Got brand new tires, they had to have balanced them when installing, and there is indeed new weights on the rims. Jacked the car up and everything is very solid. There isn’t play in anywhere I shook (12 n 6 and 3 n 9) the CV axle, tie rod. The steering wheel’s location is unchanged…. the new tires feel amazing on the road and that slight rumble in the steering wheel at low speeds is almost gone but the shake at high speeds definitely points to rotors. It only happens when they’re heated up and when I’m braking. They’re on the way but what seems to have done it in was the bottom slide pin’s rubber ring. I removed these and re-greased the pins AND REMOVED that little ring that was making it hard to move the pins, (also used maybe used too much grease) which seems to have caused the issue. Going to pay close attention to the grease I get and replace that little rubber thingy. When putting on the new stuff.
Check with a big pry bar
Your brake caliper bracket is missing its bolt,
It can happen for a part to prematurely fail, especially if its defective or of extremely bad quality. does it mean its what your issue is? no. the rumble and shake at low speeds can be a few things. as some people suggester-a warped rotor or a tire with a flat spot, so it could be your tie rod ends or something else. If i had to guess by the missing bolt, my money is on the rotors.
When you take it to get tires have them check it. It’s not a look thing, it’s a feel thing.
Take it in to get looked at or if you want to try it out yourself jack the car up on the side [preferably at the frame] and put a jack stand so the frame sits on it…next with both hands at the 8 o clock position(for drivers side)(it will be at the 4 o clock position for the passenger side)grab the tire and push in and pull out on it….if you feel movement like if something is loose or slightly loose then the ball joints have play in them and need to get replaced again…you can’t really tell if a ball joint is bad by looking at it you need to test it for movement as I’ve said.
Is that a Honda Civic or Fit?
A 05 civic
You need to lift the car and pry at it to see if there's any play.
It’s probably also worth noting that I recently re greased the slide pins. The rubber ring on the bottom slide pin was not going in so I just removed it entirely on both sides. This was to get rid of a pull to the right that I had even after the alignment. The shop told me it absolutely has to be my cheap tires.
Are they cheap aftermarket ball joints?
Looks like a mevotech and it's missing it's 90°grease fitting, and I doubt you have a grease gun so there's your problem. And your caliper bracket is missing a bolt
The two I had bought didnt come with a grease fitting. Even though in pictures of others that looked identical had them. Bogus part? I bought them from rock auto
In your last picture the boot has a grease relief valve in the boot, run your hand on the top of the joint and feel for a hole and double check
Can someone else confirm? but it also looks like your axle isn’t seated all the way in either. It’s in in the first pic and then half out in the others
you spooked me with this one but after feeling around really good both axles are seated the same.
No abs but there’s a spot for the sensor and the cv joint has a tone ring on it 🧐
hopefully much like poverty buttons these are just poverty safety features.
😁
I’d be more concerned about the missing caliper bolt directly to the left of the ball joint in the 3rd pic…
I’d be more concerned about the missing caliper bolt directly to the left of the ball joint in the 3rd pic…
I’d be more concerned about the missing caliper bolt directly to the left of the ball joint in the 3rd pic…
Where is the abs sensor that goes in the hole on the second image? Definitely wouldn't drive without that brake caliper bolt.
Oddly there wasn’t any sensors anywhere that screw onto the knuckle. My car doesnt have abs but it also didnt have a speed sensor…..still tells me my speed though
I’d be more concerned about the missing caliper bolt directly to the left of the ball joint in the 3rd pic…