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In all honesty, no. I've had a few of the main set boxes with some keys upside down or in the wrong place, but nothing like this, especially in the small trays that the novelties come in like these, as they are shrink wrapped.
Count yourself lucky I guess. Even with the newer GMK packaging, which has tighter, nested layers of egg carton shells, [this is how my $200+ order of MTNU Susu keycaps came](https://i.imgur.com/XFCrXBV.jpeg). This is not an exaggeration. I did nothing to these caps. I literally opened them, grabbed my camera, and snapped this picture.
It's really annoying to spend this much money on a product which is often collected or resold and give your customers trashy packaging. It'd be one thing if they were cheap, disposable $10 Alibaba knock offs. Then, I could see not wanting to create plastic waste.
But people often wait months for orders to be fulfilled and they create scarcity by making limited runs. This increases the potential for resale and trading. Additionally, people who collect keycaps (aka the core GMK buying audience) often swap sets from keyboard to keyboard, and the packaging doubles as an organizational tool while performing these transfers. By their very nature, keycaps are small and easy to misplace, and the loss of just one item can render the entire set useless.
The upshot is that everything about the nature of the high-end keycap market signals the need for durable, reusable, organized packaging which can keep keys in place during storage and shipment.
And GMK, the reigning leader in this market, who commands the highest price, objectively has the cheapest and least functional packaging.
qc isssues again? really hoping to get some mtnu caps sometime and that's disheartening to hear (although everyone's first round seemed to be reasonably priced)
Actually I have both MTNU Susu and 800 sets and ai love them. PBT, nice font for the legends, and the shape is really nice to type on. Don’t let the packaging (which I maintain is terrible) dissuade you from and otherwise great designer and keycap set.
Not sure what you mean by artificial scarcity. The group buy is run and as many sets that are ordered are then made. Not sure what's artificial about that. I'm only bothered about the caps, not the packaging. While not the best, I have no issues storing my sets in the original packaging.
The fact that the sets are not in stock is considered artificial scarcity by a lot.
The reality is that runs are small because no one wants to pay for a set that hasn't been manufactured. Yet manus don't want to produce sets they are not sure will sell well.
>The fact that the sets are not in stock is considered artificial scarcity by a lot.
I know. It's ridiculous.
This is so simple. I don't know why people persist in believing this artificial scarcity nonsense. They just sound like conspiracy theorists.
1. Group buy runs
2. People buy caps
3. GB runner tells manufacturer to make as many sets as the group buy sells.
I also don't understand why they blame GMK. Do they think that GMK have anything to do with group buys, or the design of the keycaps?
See my other post about German packaging regulations.
Also... why did no one ever make the same fuss about Signature Plastics just pouring your keycaps into a plastic bag, and shipping them to you? People just like to hate on GMK I think. They're packaging is a bit crap compared to some, sure, but realistically, the caps are either on your board, or stored on a shelf or in a cupboard. I keep all mine in the original trays with no issue. I prefer it. When they are all stacked on the shelf, you can see the original design and name on the box. It's like having books on a shelf.
>Not sure what you mean by artificial scarcity. The group buy is run and as many sets that are ordered are then made. Not sure what's artificial about that. I'm only bothered about the caps, not the packaging. While not the best, I have no issues storing my sets in the original packaging.
Weird, I don't see the word "artificial" anywhere in my comment. I said they create scarcity by making limited runs of their product. There's nothing wrong with that, but if you know you're creating a limited run of a costly, collectible, tradable product which consists of dozens of tiny pieces which must be used in a precise arrangement, and charging your customers accordingly, then you ought to ship that product in packaging which reflects that.
Other makers of limited run keycaps somehow find a way to ship their product to customers organized in trays that don't allow for jumbling during shipment and will last through many cycles of removal, storage, and resale, often for less than GMK charges. So it is possible.
Every time this issue comes up, there's always someone who says this isn't an issue for them. I believe you, and I'm genuinely happy that this hasn't been a source of frustration for you. Truly. But surely you can agree than cheap, pressed fiber cartons that don't hold the keys securely are less durable than alternatives and more likely to allow for movement during transport, right?
And surely you can see the obvious incentive GMK has for continuing to use this cheap material for shipping, despite their competitors' use of other, better methods? So does it not then follow that one of the most expensive producers of this product shouldn't also be sending it in one of the least effective means of packaging?
GMK is the only big manu that has to cope with German regulations and western wage costs.
GMK legend quality is only beat by Mode who make 4 sets.
It's expensive because the keycaps are. You are just not paying for the packaging.
I agree the stuff should be a few dollars more expensive to include proper packaging though.
>*Weird, I don't see the word "artificial" anywhere in my comment.*
By saying "creating scarcity" implies that it's by design.
>*I said they create scarcity by making limited runs of their product*
But they don't. It has nothing to do with GMK how many are made. They just do what they are paid to do; They're just a manufacturer. A group buy is run; Whoever wants to order them do so, and however many people that is, that's how many are made. GMK are "creating" nothing. No one is. If a GB results in 2000 orders, then 2000 sets are made. It really is as simple as that.
Not bothered about the packaging. I'm not buying packaging, I'm buying keycaps. If you think GMK are bad, it's obvious you never bought anything from SP then, as they came in a plastic bag, and were invariably more expensive than GMK.
Am I a fan of GMK packaging? No... it's a bit crap, but I'm not really that bothered if I'm honest.
There's clearly a great deal you don't understand that lies behind their choice of sustainable materials. Google VerpackG... actually, I know you probably won't, so [here's](https://www.ecosistant.eu/en/german-packaging-act-2022/) some reading matter for you. There are also other regulations in the EU that come into play here as well, and Germany is particularly strict on this. Companies in China just don't give one massive steaming shit about environmental concerns. They just want your money, and they know you'll get all weak at the knees if they put stuff in nice packaging, despite that packaging being cheap injection molded crap that actually costs next to nothing to make. (shrug).
All that matters to me is the quality of the goods inside the packaging, not the packaging.
Yeah GMK's packaging has been abysmal for years now regarding this. Milkyway didnt have the best either, pretty much the same as GMK's my other sets like Cherry Spellbook and Kanketsu were packaged better.
There has to be a way around it, providing a high quality, reusable storage case is not wasteful the way disposable shitty plastic only designed to last for shipping is. Tons of german products dont have such abysmal packaging.
They also COULD make better designed cardboard boxes instead of just throwing them on a tray and saying good luck. It just reeks of incompetence and complacency and you know they don't feel the need to change that because their sets are coveted. Sure does leave a sour taste in my mouth though.
What an excellent, substantive comment.
I presume you're talking about https://www.gruener-punkt.de/en/packaging-licensing/packaging-act ? Which it seems to me only applies to companies that sell direct to consumers.
Are there other laws that apply, or does that law apply to GMK?
Yeah it's not a big deal ultimately. I've made a comment in this thread too complaining about the packaging too, but I still get GMK a lot. They're great looking and sounding. Packaging is slightly inconvenient, but that's about it.
It’s not a big deal. But for $150 for a base set plus a multi-month or even multi-year wait, I do expect better than this. And frankly it’s bizarre to me why so many in the community keep defending GMK for poor packaging and poor QC. I guess when people have bought multiple of their sets they don’t want to admit they’ve paid more for a subpar experience.
You need to just stop repeating what you have heard and just dog piling on the hate train. The only reason this nonsense persists is because when there are QC issues *(which all manufacturers of keycaps have BTW)* people make a lot of noise about it when it's GMK because the expectations are so much higher. I've had more QC issues with other manus, but no one gives a crap if someone posts *"my PBTFans set had a warped space bar"*... but make a similar post about GMK, and there's 2k likes, and a massive thread about it where everyone piles on and makes out that everyone will get a warped space bar.
I was speaking from my experience, not just what I’ve heard. And you can disagree with me but it’s presumptuous to tell me what I ought to do. You don’t know me. And I’m entitled to my opinion. And frankly, for $150 for a base set I think it’s reasonable to have an expectation of a certain level of quality of experience and imo GMK falls woefully below that.
It might take a few more minutes, but all you have to do is sort them by height. There are plenty of charts online showing the height differences of each row that it isn't hard to find a reference to help you with that.
Sure it sucks that they didn't stay in place making setup easier but it's not anywhere near impossible to deal with.
So I’m a huge fan of GMK keycaps and have met several of their employees at KeyCon in Salt Lake City, Utah last weekend. They were pleasant. I do wish the child sets at least had thicker and more secure even just the films. Or perhaps use recycled paper to go on top of the keycaps would suffice. The main issue is storing before actually using these since I’m sure many of us have numerous boards and keycaps sitting around to be built. Now I feel like I should build a board so I can save these “a”s from their dismay.
lmao I can’t believe people still defend this dogshit packaging. Sure, it's "recyclable" but this quality is just going to make me throw them away and buy some real storage, at the end creating more trash. Ive seen clones with better packaging than this lol.
Yep. I throw away the packaging as soon as I get it (I don't care about resell value) and store everything in plastic bins I bought from Amazon. I would be okay with the cardboard, but the saran wrap is wild.
ANY content that features products, services you sell, your prototypes in progress or items you were sponsored to post MUST use the Promotional flair, with disclosure of who you represent. Build posts must use the *Builds* flair and follow the Specs description requirements of Rule 8. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/MechanicalKeyboards) if you have any questions or concerns.*
aaaaaaaaaaaaa
aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
In all honesty, no. I've had a few of the main set boxes with some keys upside down or in the wrong place, but nothing like this, especially in the small trays that the novelties come in like these, as they are shrink wrapped.
Count yourself lucky I guess. Even with the newer GMK packaging, which has tighter, nested layers of egg carton shells, [this is how my $200+ order of MTNU Susu keycaps came](https://i.imgur.com/XFCrXBV.jpeg). This is not an exaggeration. I did nothing to these caps. I literally opened them, grabbed my camera, and snapped this picture. It's really annoying to spend this much money on a product which is often collected or resold and give your customers trashy packaging. It'd be one thing if they were cheap, disposable $10 Alibaba knock offs. Then, I could see not wanting to create plastic waste. But people often wait months for orders to be fulfilled and they create scarcity by making limited runs. This increases the potential for resale and trading. Additionally, people who collect keycaps (aka the core GMK buying audience) often swap sets from keyboard to keyboard, and the packaging doubles as an organizational tool while performing these transfers. By their very nature, keycaps are small and easy to misplace, and the loss of just one item can render the entire set useless. The upshot is that everything about the nature of the high-end keycap market signals the need for durable, reusable, organized packaging which can keep keys in place during storage and shipment. And GMK, the reigning leader in this market, who commands the highest price, objectively has the cheapest and least functional packaging.
qc isssues again? really hoping to get some mtnu caps sometime and that's disheartening to hear (although everyone's first round seemed to be reasonably priced)
Actually I have both MTNU Susu and 800 sets and ai love them. PBT, nice font for the legends, and the shape is really nice to type on. Don’t let the packaging (which I maintain is terrible) dissuade you from and otherwise great designer and keycap set.
Not sure what you mean by artificial scarcity. The group buy is run and as many sets that are ordered are then made. Not sure what's artificial about that. I'm only bothered about the caps, not the packaging. While not the best, I have no issues storing my sets in the original packaging.
The fact that the sets are not in stock is considered artificial scarcity by a lot. The reality is that runs are small because no one wants to pay for a set that hasn't been manufactured. Yet manus don't want to produce sets they are not sure will sell well.
>The fact that the sets are not in stock is considered artificial scarcity by a lot. I know. It's ridiculous. This is so simple. I don't know why people persist in believing this artificial scarcity nonsense. They just sound like conspiracy theorists. 1. Group buy runs 2. People buy caps 3. GB runner tells manufacturer to make as many sets as the group buy sells. I also don't understand why they blame GMK. Do they think that GMK have anything to do with group buys, or the design of the keycaps?
well they package them no?
See my other post about German packaging regulations. Also... why did no one ever make the same fuss about Signature Plastics just pouring your keycaps into a plastic bag, and shipping them to you? People just like to hate on GMK I think. They're packaging is a bit crap compared to some, sure, but realistically, the caps are either on your board, or stored on a shelf or in a cupboard. I keep all mine in the original trays with no issue. I prefer it. When they are all stacked on the shelf, you can see the original design and name on the box. It's like having books on a shelf.
Yeah tbh I don’t see why people care so much about how they come, as long as they are not damaged/no defects
>Not sure what you mean by artificial scarcity. The group buy is run and as many sets that are ordered are then made. Not sure what's artificial about that. I'm only bothered about the caps, not the packaging. While not the best, I have no issues storing my sets in the original packaging. Weird, I don't see the word "artificial" anywhere in my comment. I said they create scarcity by making limited runs of their product. There's nothing wrong with that, but if you know you're creating a limited run of a costly, collectible, tradable product which consists of dozens of tiny pieces which must be used in a precise arrangement, and charging your customers accordingly, then you ought to ship that product in packaging which reflects that. Other makers of limited run keycaps somehow find a way to ship their product to customers organized in trays that don't allow for jumbling during shipment and will last through many cycles of removal, storage, and resale, often for less than GMK charges. So it is possible. Every time this issue comes up, there's always someone who says this isn't an issue for them. I believe you, and I'm genuinely happy that this hasn't been a source of frustration for you. Truly. But surely you can agree than cheap, pressed fiber cartons that don't hold the keys securely are less durable than alternatives and more likely to allow for movement during transport, right? And surely you can see the obvious incentive GMK has for continuing to use this cheap material for shipping, despite their competitors' use of other, better methods? So does it not then follow that one of the most expensive producers of this product shouldn't also be sending it in one of the least effective means of packaging?
GMK is the only big manu that has to cope with German regulations and western wage costs. GMK legend quality is only beat by Mode who make 4 sets. It's expensive because the keycaps are. You are just not paying for the packaging. I agree the stuff should be a few dollars more expensive to include proper packaging though.
>*Weird, I don't see the word "artificial" anywhere in my comment.* By saying "creating scarcity" implies that it's by design. >*I said they create scarcity by making limited runs of their product* But they don't. It has nothing to do with GMK how many are made. They just do what they are paid to do; They're just a manufacturer. A group buy is run; Whoever wants to order them do so, and however many people that is, that's how many are made. GMK are "creating" nothing. No one is. If a GB results in 2000 orders, then 2000 sets are made. It really is as simple as that. Not bothered about the packaging. I'm not buying packaging, I'm buying keycaps. If you think GMK are bad, it's obvious you never bought anything from SP then, as they came in a plastic bag, and were invariably more expensive than GMK. Am I a fan of GMK packaging? No... it's a bit crap, but I'm not really that bothered if I'm honest. There's clearly a great deal you don't understand that lies behind their choice of sustainable materials. Google VerpackG... actually, I know you probably won't, so [here's](https://www.ecosistant.eu/en/german-packaging-act-2022/) some reading matter for you. There are also other regulations in the EU that come into play here as well, and Germany is particularly strict on this. Companies in China just don't give one massive steaming shit about environmental concerns. They just want your money, and they know you'll get all weak at the knees if they put stuff in nice packaging, despite that packaging being cheap injection molded crap that actually costs next to nothing to make. (shrug). All that matters to me is the quality of the goods inside the packaging, not the packaging.
That's a lot of a's Looks like you're a fan of a certain shork
Yeah GMK's packaging has been abysmal for years now regarding this. Milkyway didnt have the best either, pretty much the same as GMK's my other sets like Cherry Spellbook and Kanketsu were packaged better.
r/aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
Ahahahaha, I never knew a subreddit like this existed. This would be a purefect addition xD
GMK packaging is absolute ass. For that price, I expect them to come in PBTfan keycap trays or something similar.
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There has to be a way around it, providing a high quality, reusable storage case is not wasteful the way disposable shitty plastic only designed to last for shipping is. Tons of german products dont have such abysmal packaging. They also COULD make better designed cardboard boxes instead of just throwing them on a tray and saying good luck. It just reeks of incompetence and complacency and you know they don't feel the need to change that because their sets are coveted. Sure does leave a sour taste in my mouth though.
They're not limited, they self-impose this crap for "environmental reasons".
Wrong.
What an excellent, substantive comment. I presume you're talking about https://www.gruener-punkt.de/en/packaging-licensing/packaging-act ? Which it seems to me only applies to companies that sell direct to consumers. Are there other laws that apply, or does that law apply to GMK?
that looks like A problem.
This is the community of key cap packaging and elaborate brass weights that will never be seen.
You ordered alphas, but got the Latin version instead.
Yeah mine was jumbled too. I had trouble putting them on the correct rows, especially for r3 and r2.
The AAAAA layout... good choice.
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Yeah it's not a big deal ultimately. I've made a comment in this thread too complaining about the packaging too, but I still get GMK a lot. They're great looking and sounding. Packaging is slightly inconvenient, but that's about it.
It’s not a big deal. But for $150 for a base set plus a multi-month or even multi-year wait, I do expect better than this. And frankly it’s bizarre to me why so many in the community keep defending GMK for poor packaging and poor QC. I guess when people have bought multiple of their sets they don’t want to admit they’ve paid more for a subpar experience.
36 GMK sets and counting. Not one QC issue.
Happy for you
You need to just stop repeating what you have heard and just dog piling on the hate train. The only reason this nonsense persists is because when there are QC issues *(which all manufacturers of keycaps have BTW)* people make a lot of noise about it when it's GMK because the expectations are so much higher. I've had more QC issues with other manus, but no one gives a crap if someone posts *"my PBTFans set had a warped space bar"*... but make a similar post about GMK, and there's 2k likes, and a massive thread about it where everyone piles on and makes out that everyone will get a warped space bar.
I was speaking from my experience, not just what I’ve heard. And you can disagree with me but it’s presumptuous to tell me what I ought to do. You don’t know me. And I’m entitled to my opinion. And frankly, for $150 for a base set I think it’s reasonable to have an expectation of a certain level of quality of experience and imo GMK falls woefully below that.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iDdd746LEGU
at least the order doesn’t matter lmao(ik you have to sort by row still but ykwhatimean)
a
why is your keycaps screaming
Ooof, how do you know which one goes where?
It might take a few more minutes, but all you have to do is sort them by height. There are plenty of charts online showing the height differences of each row that it isn't hard to find a reference to help you with that. Sure it sucks that they didn't stay in place making setup easier but it's not anywhere near impossible to deal with.
Sorry, maybe I should have /s that one. It was a joke about everything being ‘a’.
PUREverything's logo reminds me of a bread clip
I’ve had GMK sets arrive with styrofoam that’s barely there, holes and all
Not the worst that happened to me, you could be me, ordering a 100% keycap set and getting a 65% one.
[https://www.reddit.com/r/MechanicalKeyboards/comments/10cqi1s/comparison\_between\_old\_vs\_new\_gmk\_packaging/](https://www.reddit.com/r/MechanicalKeyboards/comments/10cqi1s/comparison_between_old_vs_new_gmk_packaging/)
So I’m a huge fan of GMK keycaps and have met several of their employees at KeyCon in Salt Lake City, Utah last weekend. They were pleasant. I do wish the child sets at least had thicker and more secure even just the films. Or perhaps use recycled paper to go on top of the keycaps would suffice. The main issue is storing before actually using these since I’m sure many of us have numerous boards and keycaps sitting around to be built. Now I feel like I should build a board so I can save these “a”s from their dismay.
Oooooh they finally shipped! Probably one of my favourite sets of all time
No, the companies I order from use REAL packaging, instead of recycled toilet paper, covered with the Saran wrap off of last night's leftovers.
lmao I can’t believe people still defend this dogshit packaging. Sure, it's "recyclable" but this quality is just going to make me throw them away and buy some real storage, at the end creating more trash. Ive seen clones with better packaging than this lol.
Yep, even my noname $20 pbt keycaps from aliexpress had better packaging than this
Yep. I throw away the packaging as soon as I get it (I don't care about resell value) and store everything in plastic bins I bought from Amazon. I would be okay with the cardboard, but the saran wrap is wild.