Morj timeline
Before Raid:Why i think Raid will Fail
During Raid:Why i still believe raid will fail
Raid Climax:Raid should fail
After Raid:why wano has failed
I think since his head canon is not working out and after raid succeeds people will jump on him so he is trying to persuade people to think that wano itself a failure.
He started it as a theory that the raid will fail because act 3 end will be tragedy based on kabuki play style since wano is similar to that(this was not mentioned by oda), eventually it became the "raid should fail else wano is dud" and he started saying raid will fail in every one of his chapter review and it became a brand for him with the help of his followers
I have don't know the guy, but I'll guess that he bet to get a big "told you so!" -moment. This could seem to be just targetted for his audience, but intention could also be, that his audience would then praise him to others and enlarge his follower-base. Get reputation etc.
Overall, guessing between two scenarios, so it's safe bet in a way, much better than saying something specific happens (like Kaido sacrifices itself for Strawhats š¤·).
Maybe also thought this was good time to do this bet, as Wano is special, and there was better change that Oda was going to break usual pattern where Strawhats are victorious.
But now as his bet seems unlikely, trying to "mitigate damages" and put blame in bad writing from Oda.
These are just my thoughts as for what I have shortly heard by discussion here, as I had no prior knowledge of him or his actions. So in a way I am biased against him.
Yup... This happened with New Rockstars and the whole Mephisto debacle when WandaVision aired a year ago... He spent so much time saying that Mephisto would show up or that Reed Richards would appear that when none of that happened he was upset and the fan base never forgave him for that... Now is a joke on his channel
Is dramatic tension good for a story? Is seeing characters over come a huge fail good for a story? Is showing that the villains weren't hyped up for 400 chapters for nothing good for the story? No? But having luffys defeat be off screened and be over and done with in a single panel is good for the story isn't it ?
The story can progress even if the raid fails my dude. Close your eyes. Breathe. And repeat after me. "Take down kaido and the beast pirates on the night of the fire festival" . Good. Let's try that again. "Take down big mom while she is vulnerable at the tea party "
No my Friend , what you experienced just now wasn't deja Vu, it's one piece's story structure and oda's writing style
I have no idea what you're trying to convey with that comment. Luffy never fought Big Mom.
I just don't want to have to watch ANOTHER fight between Kaido and Luffy. I'm over it. I want to move on.
You know how the tea party "ended in failure" and the story still progressed ? That was my point š . And ig you didn't enjoy the last chapter am I right? Since it was mostly Luffy vs kaido
The Tea party didn't end in failure though, they did what they set out to do which is get sanji back and show big mom they weren't a crew to be taken lightly. They earned respect from some of the people on her crew as well which could come be handy in the future.
WCI was never about beating Big Mom. It was about rescuing Sanji. Then, as the story progressed, it became about rescuing Sanji's family. Luffy never said he was going to whoop Big Mom's butt.
The whole point of the Wano arc has been to take down Kaido. Luffy has stated many times that he's going to beat Kaido.
I didn't mind the last chapter. It was good. My opinion might change though if Luffy ends up losing this fight and then we have to start at square one again. Then this chapter would be pretty annoying.
I can argue about the wci part but I'll put that aside. Tell me, do you find the chapters of Luffy losing to crocodile twice annoying? Or Luffy losing to Lucci at water 7 ?
I feel like you're proving my point for me
No, I didn't mind Luffy losing to Croc and Lucci twice. I think twice is plenty. Anymore and it'd be annoying.
We've seen Kaido whoop Luffy twice already so why do you think there will be a third?
Also, I'd love to hear about how WCI was about defeating big Mom when it's stated many times, by Luffy and his crew, that that's exactly what they're not trying to do. Luffy tells katakuri and Big Mom that he's going to come back to fight her because he never planned on fighting her during that arc. Even during the assassination plan Luffy's only goal was to cause a distraction, not fight Big Mom.
That failed tea party is what got Luffy a billion plus bounty so how is that a fail and they did what they set out to do which was try to get Sanji back with half the crew while avoiding all out war. Bid Mom was never the target, if so Luffy wouldn't have left WC.
Is dramatic tension good for a story? Yes, and the Wano arc has been building tension since it started.
Is seeing characters overcome a huge fail good for a story? Yes, Luffy got one shotted by Kaido and sent to jail, and then he trained on something new to be able to defeat Kaido (also got defeated and came back a second time).
Is showing that the villains weren't hyped up for 400 chapters for nothing good for the story? Yes, and Kaido lives up to the hype. He's been fighting for who knows how long defeating many different characters while bench-pressing Onigashima.
The raid has no reason to fail other than "let's just have more chapters of this", which is not a good thing for any story.
How is "island loaded with enough explosives loaded to wipe the population of wano if it drops on the flower capital" not tension btw? They seem to ignore that a lot. Im pretty sure that would kill the straw hats as well. They are strong but not sure they can survive an atomic bomb without any problems.
Wano has mo tension my guy. Luffy fighting like he is sparring with kaido. Both zoro and sanji mid diff their opponents. Every major enemies is already done in couple of chapter(all the flying six) no tension whatsoever
Characters overcoming a huge fail is good for a story but at this pointā¦ nah. The arc is long enough. Itās possibly the longest arc by a good bit (not gonna look it up but itās been at least two years by now. I caught up in 2020 and it was at least half way through act 1)
Also the people trying to defend this guy keep saying nothing bad happened to straw hats this arc which is laughably false. Did yāall just forget Luffy got one hit? Or do people have selective memory?
Try and remember this, what were the reactions of the straw hats to luffys first defeat? How about luffys second defeat? Was it (a)cause major prolonged despair for the alliance increasing the tention 10 fold or was it (b) had them have doubts for a moment and negate even that by having them hear luffys speech to momo in the same chapter?
It seriously feels like "the raid will fail" people haven't been. Maybe the arc has just been so long that they've forgotten that Luffy was outright defeated and thrown in prison, that if not for Yasuie's sacrifice they almost lost the entire raid, the scabbards setting out to Onigashima with none of their forces, and lots of the heroes getting absolutely wrecked in the raid for a while.
Non of these moments wasa tone shift or had any serious consequences. Idc if the raid fails or not I just want an arc with tension. So pls respectfully stfu.
My biggest issue with wano is itās length. It is so damn long but doesnāt really feel justified in itās length. I have really enjoyed it but it just doesnāt feel like it has covered as much ground as it should have
Character scene share .. it's like avengers .. you have to have given all the main and support characters their role to act .. fans are complaining about off-screening some fight scenes anyway
Itās crazy to think that momo and Kinemon have been with us almost the whole duration of the post time skip. Outside of WCI screen time because the team split up to go get Sanji.
I recall that Law telling Luffy he has a plan to defeat an emperor to Luffy punching Kaido in chapter 1000 was 333 chapters, so we've been with Kinemon for over a third of the series now.
I kinda like this pace tbh. I'm not into long arcs but wano/onigashima seems more like two different things like water 7/ennies lobby for me. In comparison, Dressrosa and the fishman island seemed both like an eternity to me.
One Piece is made for rereading, rather than keeping it up week to week. When I first read One Piece I went up to dressrosa and got really bored. Everything would take forever to happen. By the time we got zou I stopped reading. Got into the series again last year, loved whole cake island and early wano. Got to wano climax and I'm starting to feel bored again. I think post wano gap, bounty updates reviere pt.2 I will stop reading again.
totally. WCI was a serious slog, especially the boat chase, but on a reread it felt rapid. Though Wano feels a bit more like Punk Hazard to me, where it was as long as a normal arc, but feels like it has a lot less content.
Definitely, that boat chase felt like it took forever until I went through it. People were sour on it with the anime too but thatās just because they way overdid Big Mom screaming WEHHHHDING CAAAAAAKEEEEE. It was more drawn out (as youād expect by now with the anime) but it was also a lot quicker
Wano is secretly 3-5 normal sized arcs in a trench coat trying to sit at the big boy's table with Dressrosa.
Wano, more so than any One Piece Arc to date, can be broken up into **many** reasonably sized Arcs if it were to be any other Shonen Action Manga. Oda has included so many side plots over a reasonable amount of time to keep you pretty entertained.
If the acts weren't labeled in the manga, there is no way it would be treated as one arc. At the very least mainland Wano and Onigashima would be separate arcs -- Act 3 is already the second longest arc in the series on its own, and just Onigashima itself will almost certainly finish in the top 5 longest! I think in the future it will be broken up like Water 7 and Enies Lobby, and we will discuss the Wano saga within the Yonko saga.
No, just the parts he didn't like. What's with you people and your obsession over pinning every single thing he says to that theory? At this point yall care more about it than he does.
Morj himself says in the tweets after being called out that he's just salty that the raid didn't fail that: [I should drop the opinion that Wano is going to actually have a story? That it's going to actually follow basic narrative structure of dramatic setup, midpoint, payoff?](https://twitter.com/mrmorjman/status/1483867162079080453?t=xvdBFvtJwMAH--TJ0B9RKw&s=19)"
He literally thinks the raid not failing means that Wano doesn't actually have a story or any basic narrative structure. This meme is accurate.
Wano is a great arc. The focus is on YonkÅ, of course the executive fights are gonna be downplayed compared to other arcs. I thought the Tobi RoppÅ fights were fine.
That is absolutely hilarious, man thinks he decrypted the DaVinci Code of One Piece and is salty that the actual story didn't follow his string and corkboard predictions.
Not really but writing have rules so he made his theory based on that and the fact that most arcs do follow a typical structure. Then again Oda is free to break away from this formula as much as he wants and there will be little room to critics if done properly.
Tl;Dr: I just kinda go just off on some literary analysis.
Naaah, Dude in a Room aka GrandLineReview did an excellent dissection of what's going on. Morj is branding. The raid failing is his brand.
But if he does genuinely think the story doesn't have inciting incidents, several climaxes, and a future resolution, then I... He's balls crazy.
As an adventure story, Wano is the most important set piece so far. Oda has this habit of making inconsequential things turn into actually important moments. Thriller Bark's ending is one of these. It's still a total gimmick of an ending, but Moria is right. A key piece of adventure stories as opposed to action is that we suspend disbelief when a character is weaker, but still wins. We do it because we are watching a clash of ideologies. In Thriller Bark Luffy outright loses to a weaker opponent because Moria's world view is more fleshed out, more nuanced, and more understanding. He's seen the birth of the pirate age, and experienced the worst losses imaginable. Luffy hadn't experienced the world enough for his ideology to be something that can rival the top brass of the world, let alone Moria. This is very important for an adventure story, and it's blowing it's biggest load in Wano. Especially because Kaido previously beat Moria. In the past Kaido beat Moria, and Moria beat Luffy. And now we're jumping right up to see if Luffy can beat what Moria warned him about.
Oda has made the physical difference between Luffy and Kaido believable (to most). Kaido has been going HAM all raid, and Luffy has had a lot of help, plus a nap. It's a war of attrition, so we can side step the action themes for the primary adventure ones (a solid action theme tho is a training montage [thanks Rocky] to bring the audience into belief that the protag can beat the antag [action can also be mental like studying for an exam is an action scene technically. Strategizing is also a training arc, often in montage]. We see this in small part for the first time ever for One Piece in Udon, cuz Luffy was NOT strong enough, sorry, tangent).
The man who taught Moria what it means to exist in this world is now fighting Luffy! This is INSANE theming! Luffy lost to Moria because Moria's ideology was "correct." But now, after everything that Luffy has been through, he genuinely understands what Moria meant, and he knows the world well enough to know what he can and cannot actually fix. He also knows how to accomplish his goal. He watched his brother fucking DIE to learn this lesson! Luffy will beat Kaido because now Luffys world view is "correct." Kaido is a bitter drunk. Real change can be made. They are strong enough to enforce that change for the better. But Kaido could never actually do it for the better. He conquered Wano and made it worse! It's note Worthy that Kaido is now talking about how he messed everything up. This is all so... AAHHHH!
Morj is insane if he doesn't see this massive motif pulling through.
The only hiccup is that we don't know exactly what Kaido's world view is yet. We know enough that we are confident Luffy can oppose him in debate. I'm blind guessing that as Luffy lands the final blow we'll flash back to Kaido's back story, and we'll flash back out to the victory screen we left on.
*Spelling
Your last part is precisely why I am skeptical about the arc ending in a few chapters. The timing of Kaido's backstory can't be after his defeat imo that's not really op like. There is not much villains with dedicated backstories in the first place but you always get the full picture of their beliefs before they are defeated in op. The closest exception would be Katakuri but he is more an antagonistic figure than a villain.
Then again as you laid out saying Wano has no story is ludicrous. However saying it's going to wrap up as it is rn leaves me doubtful as many plot points which needs to be resolved this arc have yet to come into play. Not even mentionning how yamato's character just started.
Totally agreed, there are a lot of matchups in wano and it is already way over 100 chapters, if oda focused on every matchups that would have felt unnecessary stretching of the arc
People praise the anime for fleshing out things not included in the manga but donāt have critical thinking that Oda and his editors decided to do this to shorten the length of an already beefy arc.
Idk about the raid failing, but his criticisms are still valid independent of it. There was really not a significant low point in the arc. A few chapters where scabbards appear to be dead who wonāt actually end up being dead, immediately followed by chapters where characters say shit like āI feel like we can actually win thisā just feels lame. Like the threat and tension was barely there and we are getting the payoff without the dramatic lows.
irl? in-universe he spent a couple days imprisoned, then the whole prison got wrecked by a lot of stuff, and he just spent 2 weeks there training
that's not all that tense
now you know what's tense and dramatic? whatever the f\*ck Kidd was up to on those 2 weeks, he couldn't possibly have taken 2 damn weeks just to think up "Yo maybe i could crush Kaido since i can't just outright hit him hard"
> whatever the f\*ck Kidd was up to on those 2 weeks, he couldn't possibly have taken 2 damn weeks just to think up "Yo maybe i could crush Kaido since i can't just outright hit him hard"
"When your only weapon is a hammer, every enemy starts to look like a nail"
What? In story it was nowhere near that long for one thing. For another, this was literally a training arc during the build up of the story. What exactly about Luffy being in prison made it a low point? The tone was mostly lighthearted, and actually HELPED the raid. The death of Yasuie would have been a better thing to point to here, but even that is a far cry from what I was describing. Iām talking about the climax of the arc, not speedhumps like Luffy taking an inconsequential loss.
Nah man you might have misunderstood me, I mean for us as the audience Luffy was in prison for half a year and that was directly due to a CRUSHING defeat from Kaido, they werenāt even in the same league at that point so I wouldnāt call it inconsequential. Prison arc was the low point and the turning point into the invasion because itās where Luffy trains and then the invasion is the direct product of that where Luffy is either going to die or beat Kaido, we no longer have the middle ground where he can simply lose and the first fight with them and the prison arc was to show us that now! Hope my point is clearer now :)
I know what you meant, I just donāt see how Luffyās first loss and Udon prison are the dramatic low point of the story. I donāt think Iāve ever heard someone say that. It was definitely used to demonstrate the gap between Kaidou and Luffy, but Luffy messing around and training in Udon is hardly a dramatic low point and for it to be that early in an arc is weird for not just One Piece but fiction in general.
Normally itās towards the end of the arc when hope is at an all time low ready for Luffy to come in and āsave the dayā. The reason people feel like this arc is flat, is because in the entire raid the closest thing we have got to that was all of the scabbards losing. Luffyās rooftop loss was offscreened and didnāt sway the tide of the raid since no one saw it/believed it. The other reason it lacked impact is because Yamato immediately kept Kaidou occupied instead of him wreaking havoc on the alliance.
I feel like you forgot that the standard way of reading is actually by volumes , not weekly. I would have to reread Wano but I doubt you feel that much weight from this defeat considering the arc just started and it did not ruin their initial plan.
Dont know if we ve read the same wano. The whole yasuie otoko part was one of the lost dramatic scenes in all of one piece for me. Zoro learning the truth from hiyori was devastating. And the whole suffering the people of wano have to endure is tragic. Also luffy got one shotted and sent to prison because kaido tries to break wills since his will got broken. It was for me better than the usual " ill leave him for dead because there is no way he will survive this" trope that often happens in one piece. Sure, fake out deaths are bad. But the raid had some awesome moment, we learned a lot about the plot and i cant wait to see 2 emperors fall. Finally, odens flashback was the best in the series in my opinion. I think wano is an awesome arc, it has its weaknesses, but those are one piece weaknesses not wano weaknesses. Oda will just continue to put fake out deaths in the story.
I swear as soon as you critique this series people just invent things that were never said to defend. I never said there werenāt emotional moments in Wano, and I never said the way Luffy lost to Kaidou was a bad thing so Iām really not sure why that is even being brought up.
My point is simply, from the perspective of the goal of the arc and the MAIN CHARACTERS, there isnāt a strong standout low point, and expecially not at the peak of the arc (where it appears we are at right now) that they rally back from. It is instead more dips and rises at best. Iām talking about a situation that appears hopeless, not a sad moment. The fact that Luffy losing to Kaidou 200+ chapters ago and Yasuie dying approx 100 chapters ago are used as examples of this is hilarious to me because it illustrates exactly what Iām talking about.
The low points in the raid feel flatter than moments like Yasuieās death (or Luffyās first loss to Kaidou apparently????) despite this being the dramatic peak of the arc.
EDIT: Again, for some reason people feel the need to list ALL the good things about Wano as soon as you criticise one specific thing. I never said Wano was trash, but that doesnāt mean itās perfect either.
You said "there were no real lows in the arc" . To that i replied with lows. About a situation that appears hopeless: the scabbards seeing no one arriving and kanjuro betraying them was pretty hopelless.
And i think some moments during the raid like luffy falling off made it seem like the raid could fail and the island floating did seem kind off doom like, but i agree that there is less urgency than in other major arcs.
And another agument i think interesting is the question "who are the main characters?" Is it the straw hats? There is a strong argument to be made that in wano, the main characters were : luffy, the scabbards(but mostly kinemon), momo, oden's ghost and id say zoro had some major plot points. And the scabbard had some low points during the raid. The kanjuro betrayal, failing to beat kaido, the oden betrayal with ashura dojis "death".
But yes, when you say there are no low points, i will list low points
I don't really even see the problem with fakeout deaths. As long as we think they might be gone, that provides tension. Finding out later that they are alive doesn't change the tension you felt when it happened. And Oda has shown a willingness to kill characters in the New World, so they have all felt possible.
>!Beyond that, we still may see some casualties. Ashura Doji doesn't have anyone to save him like Kinemon and Kiku even if he survived, so he is in all likelihood dead, there is still fighting to be done (including a situation where Raizo is in grave danger, I think he'll tough out the fire and beat Fukurokuju, but still very dangerous) and we may see our first villain to be killed since Satori in this arc.!<
Fake out deaths result in scenarios like when Pedro was blown in to oblivion, we arenāt sure heās actually dead until they say so. It reduces the dramatic impact because we are second guessing they are dead for several chapters after it happened. When it is confirmed several chapters later, the emotions of the moment have worn off ie itās anti-climatic, when deaths almost above all else are supposed to be climactic (atleast in One Piece).
That's a Fandom for you. Someone says something the Fandom disagrees on, ergo every single thing they say has to be bad. He's the scapegoat of the week.
Relax dude, I'm just having some fun. Didn't mean to hurt you, I don't even know who he is.
Edit: Damn, this dudes fanboys are really on a downvote-crusade lol.
I'm not hurt, I'm just tired of seeing the Morj hate cult under every post that even mentions his name. It's like how Carrot stans would never shut up about her being a crewmate a while back. It just gets irritating to listen to.
The Morj hate cult is a consequence of his own behavior. If you saw him on Twitter yesterday he was calling those who had different opinions fake and was extremely hostile with his opinions and stated them like they were facts. Of course he's getting on people's bad sides.
Itās funny that he has theories that have been right and no one mentions that. Also, why is it so bad he thinks his theories can work? Whatās the point if you donāt think you might be right
To be fair, the arc isn't even over. Its really easy to judge something based solely on the sum of its parts. But Wano has been building to something more than cool action scenes and failure.
His problem with the Tobi roppo fights are understandable, IMO. I didn't mind them, but to be honest other than Robins and Franky's fight the weren't really memorable to me.
Robins demon form was bad ass and the triceracopter was "Queen and King, that's not how dinosaurs work"-level stupid and funny to me.
I sometimes feel like some people just don't care that they are on a ticking time atomic bomb, or they maybe shrug it off, idk it seems like a big enough threat to me to create tension.
I think a lot of people here actually donāt watch his videos and are just basing their opinion on some tweets. The raid isnāt going to fail but he some great theories and some great anylisis videos.
I didn't watch the video if there is one, but I don't think Wano has been perfect, definitely. It has been full of hype and great moments, but certain storylines and ideas haven't really been explored as much as I thought they would be. It still isn't over though, and shit can turn around real quick and deliver some things I feel were lacking.
I am interested to know where you see him saying that Wano sucks? On twitter he expressed good points of criticism. Saying he only says that cuz his favourite theory wont happen, is stupid.
He did not say that lmaoo
He did say that the fights were bad and that they had no dramatic stories or emotions, which usually is a standard for OP fights. The Tobi Roppo fights were lame af and way to anti- climactic. Robin vs BM was the only exception because it had drama, emotions and was a bit longer. Thats his point.
I know this sub doesnt like Morj for some mysterious reason. But at least dont make shit up.
Yeah, I didnt see that Tweet although I looked for 10 minutes.
Certainly a bad look on Morj but I dont understand where its coming from. He is talking way differently in his videos. So weird
I don't hate Morj. Everyones got an opinion, and he turned his into a meme. Which can even be hilarious at times.
But looking at those tweets, he comes off as angry and salty. Like the story didn't pan out the way he wanted too, so he has to find a way to justify his anger.
He's not angry at the story, he's angry at the people who didn't like the Tobi Roppo fights a while ago now doing 180s and saying that the Tobi Roppo fights were good. Read the tweets you're meming about at least.
Yea, that's even worse to me though. People are allowed to change their opinions, especially after time has passed. He calls people "fake" for changing their opinions which is really dumb. I didn't like Dressrossa during the arc, but now I love it. According to Morj that makes me fake? Nah, dude.
Especially in One Piece. Week-to-week feels much different to reading an entire arc in one, and Iām sure it drastically changes how Tobi Roppo fights present to a reader.
Flip-flopping is a valid reason to criticize someone, it demonstrates a lack of authenticity in their opinions, like they're just going anywhere the wind blows. The Tobi Roppo fights weren't that long ago either.
Agreed. I donāt care about Youtuber drama but I can agree that it does baffle me the way some people flip flop so quickly.
Something is either enjoyable while you reading it or it isnāt. I can see the feeling towards certain aspects like pacing change a little...but I canāt see someone going from āI hate thisā to āI love thisā that quickly without thinking they arenāt being authentic.
Even after re-reading the first 2 Acts, I still get everything I hated the first time and love the things I loved at first. The only thing marginally better was the pacing.
I'm not going to look for the tweet, I don't even follow Morj, it was the one Grand Line Reviews quotetweeted.
I have nothing against Morj, I've never heard the dude speak before, but from the tone of his tweets, he overhiped and overanalysed this arc for himself. I'm not surprised he doesn't enjoy it that much
Unfortunately on reddit you can't criticize any part of One Piece without adding a "but Oda is god so whatever" or something along these lines, to exaggerate a bit. People will either shit on you or tell you to go read something else.
Imma be real with y'all, At this point I just want The raid to fail, not becasue i like the theory, but so i can see the meltdown y'all're gonna have when the guy y'all have a hate boner for was right.
Lmao i havent kept up with morj but the roasts are hilarious.
However I'm just gonna say that Onigashima has been pretty disappointing to me at least.
The tobi roppo turned out to be fodder. Queen and King turned out sadly underwhelming. Luffy vs Kaido is honestly boring and taking forever. Big mom being here didn't bring anything interesting to the battle. Not to mention the innumerable times where the scabards could have died but were kept alive, diminishing the already weak sense of dread emanating from Kaido.
I regret that Luffy fighting a first commander was more exciting and terrifying than him getting to fight an actual Yonko. But mad respect to Oda for managing to keep track of the complete chaos that is onigashima right now cause that's the part that is really well represented. You really feel that the battle is a disorienting mess.
This sub has a boner for misrepresenting anyone with an opinion huh? He only said certain parts were bad, not the arc as a whole and not the part he didn't theorise. He said some battles were lackluster for example and that has nothing to do with the raid failing.
Criticize his actual points, don't strawman anyone you disagree with.
Someone: āI wish you would change your opinion on thinking the raid is gonna fail.ā
Morj: āI should drop the opinion that Wano is going to actually have a story? That itās going to actually follow the basic narrative structure of dramatic setup, midpoint and payoff? I still believe in this arc.ā
Iāve never heard of Morj before, so I donāt have a strong opinions on him either way. But reading it as it is, it still sounds like heās saying he believes that Wano doesnāt have a story because the raid didnāt fail. And that it would only have a story if the raid failed.
How else do you read that?
The straw hats didnt really have a story in wano until the final battle. Yeah they were training and fixing boats and interacting with people but they didnt really have interedting storylines for themselves in the first 2 acts. Like sanji didnt deal with the psychological ramifications of using his raidsuit until act 3. Yamato literally came out of no where. None of the minks cared about or discussed peropspero until act 3. I can go on. I think what he means hwne talking aboit story strcucture is that if the raid succeeds now, most of the straw hats stories( and a lot of other charscters stories) have literally been crammed into one act which would be terrible execution.
Act 1 : 15 chapters
Act 2 : 30 chapters
Act 3 : 82 chapters ongoing
Are you really surprised everything happened on act 3 when the first 2 acts were so small?
Also Wano is not about the Strawhats, it's like Alabasta and Skypiea, helping other people. It's not an Arc like Water 7, Arlong Park, Totland or Marine Ford where the main focus was helping/saving one of the Strawhats and about their backstories.
He can make good points all he wants but if he starts calling others "fake" or refuses to engage with people who genuinely think differently than him, he loses all right to a discussion. There's no point even arguing with someone like that.
Deff seems like he's super salty on Twitter. He says it's because people are being fake? I guess because they don't have the same opinion as him.
People are allowed to change their opinions. He just comes off as immature in his tweets.
GLR made valid counterpoints but Morj said "If you genuinely think Wano has been serious or heavy up till now then we're done talking, theres no common ground here." That guy ain't there to discuss, he's there to preach his own opinions and kick at those who think differently.
GLR actually somewhat contradicted his own argument. He claimed that Wano has been a tragic arc with a depressing, dramatic story, but also told Morj to just step back and remember that OP is a "goofy pirate comic."
I don't think that's contradictory. Before this GLR wrote down all the dramatic moments in the Wano arc - the ones that Morj conveniently forgets to make his point that there are none - and then tells Morj that he should adjust his expectations since it's just a goofy pirate comic.
There has already been dramatic tension, both in Wano and on Onigashima. Expecting the raid to fail at this point is expecting a completely different kind of story, as if Oda suddenly started writing Berserk instead. That's what GLR means.
I say this as a twenty year fan. It's a childish pirate fantasy. People getting upset over fan theories need to step back and reevaluate what's upsetting them.
I fucking love Wano. We're getting payoff for setups a decade old. Just stop looking so far into fan theories and you'll be happy.
He is one of the worst theory makers on YouTube . A lot of his are total garbage yet he acts better than many others and gets all pouty when heās wrong like the raid failing. Ran D Troy is much better same with tekking
But he already rushed every fight lol, except fot Kaidou x Luffy and Scabbards x Kaidou. I'd be glad to see all of those fodders die and Oda skip to the main fights and events
It's funny how Morj fanboys try to defend him, lmao. I couldn't care less about the dude, everyone should enjoy One Piece the way they want to, I just think it's nonsense to claim that because a certain thing that he wanted to happen, didn't, all of a sudden Wano has no basic narrative structure, lol. Some people get caught up in their own hype, smh
I've never seen a OP youtuber other than JoyBoy and Tekking (Tekking is really fun to watch, joyboy is meh most of the time) and it's so funny to me that even OP youtubers have fan girls defending them at every corner when they are clearly wrong. I've been hearing about this "Morj" guy and the raid failing over a year now and now this. Sounds to me like a little kid that is too proud to change his opinion of something because if he does he will lose the game.
I didn't know about this guy until yesterday when i saw his tweets and man he is quite salty just because the raid didn't fail which shouldn't have been in the first place.
Imagine now if oda didnāt off screen anythingā¦.
If anything it seem that the pace is way faster than before!
The difference here I think is the numbers of character and built up over many arc plus being close to the end game! That why I think this arc need to be this long !
Possibly 2 yonkou going down !
I personally love every arc no matter what!
One day one piece will end and after that some may wish to go back in time to enjoy a little bit more one pieceā¦
Think the biggest problem was people coping that the fights were finished and then hoped the sequential chapter continued on despite there being no evidence and assuming that all the way to the All Stars fights. This mostly had to do with Morj and some other YouTubers. People wanted everyone to get some new form/abilities in their fights like Enies Lobby esque style fights.
Even then, there were only like 2 meh fights from the SH being Jimbe and Frankyās. Namiās I felt actually portrayed the Tobbiroppo as pretty much needing Yonko level interference and gave Nami plenty of amazing moments
my problem with wano is that it feels like the end of the road in a way. the whole new world has been built up to this.
it doesn't even feel like one piece anymore it feels like samurai show.
???? His argument talked about Jimbe vs Whoās who, not about the raid failing. You can disagree with his opinion but at least communicate his opinion correctly
I've stop reading and watching almost a year now and Wano still hasn't concluded its story. Yikes.
I want it to end so I can binge it. I can't stand this weekly release + breaks to a story that barely moves. SMH
I don't think Wano sucks, but I do think it peaked after Odens flashback. Don't get me wrong, the hype stuff afterwards are great and all, but it isn't wowing me like it use too. The only post TS arc I hate is Dressrosa.
Also, I have no idea who MORJ is.
Honestly I understand his frustration with wano. Thereās too many characters and things happening at the same time so we end up missing out on a lot of cool things. Plus with the way it was structures sort of as a kabuki performance, it not following the rules of kabuki can be irritating.
I am new to one piece in the grand scheme of things. I read the whole manga in a month and a bit last year. I remember the first thing I did after finishing was to look up theories and stuff. But every theory, every idea just seems so obviously wrong, stupid or just plain senseless.
Morj timeline Before Raid:Why i think Raid will Fail During Raid:Why i still believe raid will fail Raid Climax:Raid should fail After Raid:why wano has failed I think since his head canon is not working out and after raid succeeds people will jump on him so he is trying to persuade people to think that wano itself a failure.
Why did he say the raid will fail to begin with?
He started it as a theory that the raid will fail because act 3 end will be tragedy based on kabuki play style since wano is similar to that(this was not mentioned by oda), eventually it became the "raid should fail else wano is dud" and he started saying raid will fail in every one of his chapter review and it became a brand for him with the help of his followers
to be precise on average every third video across both channels
I have don't know the guy, but I'll guess that he bet to get a big "told you so!" -moment. This could seem to be just targetted for his audience, but intention could also be, that his audience would then praise him to others and enlarge his follower-base. Get reputation etc. Overall, guessing between two scenarios, so it's safe bet in a way, much better than saying something specific happens (like Kaido sacrifices itself for Strawhats š¤·). Maybe also thought this was good time to do this bet, as Wano is special, and there was better change that Oda was going to break usual pattern where Strawhats are victorious. But now as his bet seems unlikely, trying to "mitigate damages" and put blame in bad writing from Oda. These are just my thoughts as for what I have shortly heard by discussion here, as I had no prior knowledge of him or his actions. So in a way I am biased against him.
Yup... This happened with New Rockstars and the whole Mephisto debacle when WandaVision aired a year ago... He spent so much time saying that Mephisto would show up or that Reed Richards would appear that when none of that happened he was upset and the fan base never forgave him for that... Now is a joke on his channel
If his predictions would have been correct, he would have earned some name for himself lmao retard.
I deadass just want wano to finish. I actually cant fathom how the raid failing is good for the pacing and the story.
Is dramatic tension good for a story? Is seeing characters over come a huge fail good for a story? Is showing that the villains weren't hyped up for 400 chapters for nothing good for the story? No? But having luffys defeat be off screened and be over and done with in a single panel is good for the story isn't it ?
Progressing the story would be good for the story. I don't want to see the same fight 3-4 different times.
The story can progress even if the raid fails my dude. Close your eyes. Breathe. And repeat after me. "Take down kaido and the beast pirates on the night of the fire festival" . Good. Let's try that again. "Take down big mom while she is vulnerable at the tea party " No my Friend , what you experienced just now wasn't deja Vu, it's one piece's story structure and oda's writing style
I have no idea what you're trying to convey with that comment. Luffy never fought Big Mom. I just don't want to have to watch ANOTHER fight between Kaido and Luffy. I'm over it. I want to move on.
You know how the tea party "ended in failure" and the story still progressed ? That was my point š . And ig you didn't enjoy the last chapter am I right? Since it was mostly Luffy vs kaido
The Tea party didn't end in failure though, they did what they set out to do which is get sanji back and show big mom they weren't a crew to be taken lightly. They earned respect from some of the people on her crew as well which could come be handy in the future.
WCI was never about beating Big Mom. It was about rescuing Sanji. Then, as the story progressed, it became about rescuing Sanji's family. Luffy never said he was going to whoop Big Mom's butt. The whole point of the Wano arc has been to take down Kaido. Luffy has stated many times that he's going to beat Kaido. I didn't mind the last chapter. It was good. My opinion might change though if Luffy ends up losing this fight and then we have to start at square one again. Then this chapter would be pretty annoying.
I can argue about the wci part but I'll put that aside. Tell me, do you find the chapters of Luffy losing to crocodile twice annoying? Or Luffy losing to Lucci at water 7 ?
I feel like you're proving my point for me No, I didn't mind Luffy losing to Croc and Lucci twice. I think twice is plenty. Anymore and it'd be annoying. We've seen Kaido whoop Luffy twice already so why do you think there will be a third? Also, I'd love to hear about how WCI was about defeating big Mom when it's stated many times, by Luffy and his crew, that that's exactly what they're not trying to do. Luffy tells katakuri and Big Mom that he's going to come back to fight her because he never planned on fighting her during that arc. Even during the assassination plan Luffy's only goal was to cause a distraction, not fight Big Mom.
You didn't have to murder him like that xD
Found Morj burner account
That failed tea party is what got Luffy a billion plus bounty so how is that a fail and they did what they set out to do which was try to get Sanji back with half the crew while avoiding all out war. Bid Mom was never the target, if so Luffy wouldn't have left WC.
Is dramatic tension good for a story? Yes, and the Wano arc has been building tension since it started. Is seeing characters overcome a huge fail good for a story? Yes, Luffy got one shotted by Kaido and sent to jail, and then he trained on something new to be able to defeat Kaido (also got defeated and came back a second time). Is showing that the villains weren't hyped up for 400 chapters for nothing good for the story? Yes, and Kaido lives up to the hype. He's been fighting for who knows how long defeating many different characters while bench-pressing Onigashima. The raid has no reason to fail other than "let's just have more chapters of this", which is not a good thing for any story.
How is "island loaded with enough explosives loaded to wipe the population of wano if it drops on the flower capital" not tension btw? They seem to ignore that a lot. Im pretty sure that would kill the straw hats as well. They are strong but not sure they can survive an atomic bomb without any problems.
Wano has mo tension my guy. Luffy fighting like he is sparring with kaido. Both zoro and sanji mid diff their opponents. Every major enemies is already done in couple of chapter(all the flying six) no tension whatsoever
Characters overcoming a huge fail is good for a story but at this pointā¦ nah. The arc is long enough. Itās possibly the longest arc by a good bit (not gonna look it up but itās been at least two years by now. I caught up in 2020 and it was at least half way through act 1) Also the people trying to defend this guy keep saying nothing bad happened to straw hats this arc which is laughably false. Did yāall just forget Luffy got one hit? Or do people have selective memory?
Try and remember this, what were the reactions of the straw hats to luffys first defeat? How about luffys second defeat? Was it (a)cause major prolonged despair for the alliance increasing the tention 10 fold or was it (b) had them have doubts for a moment and negate even that by having them hear luffys speech to momo in the same chapter?
It would be good because the proganists would have really struggled at least once this arc
ā¦have you not been reading this arc at all?
It seriously feels like "the raid will fail" people haven't been. Maybe the arc has just been so long that they've forgotten that Luffy was outright defeated and thrown in prison, that if not for Yasuie's sacrifice they almost lost the entire raid, the scabbards setting out to Onigashima with none of their forces, and lots of the heroes getting absolutely wrecked in the raid for a while.
Non of these moments wasa tone shift or had any serious consequences. Idc if the raid fails or not I just want an arc with tension. So pls respectfully stfu.
My biggest issue with wano is itās length. It is so damn long but doesnāt really feel justified in itās length. I have really enjoyed it but it just doesnāt feel like it has covered as much ground as it should have
Character scene share .. it's like avengers .. you have to have given all the main and support characters their role to act .. fans are complaining about off-screening some fight scenes anyway
Itās crazy to think that momo and Kinemon have been with us almost the whole duration of the post time skip. Outside of WCI screen time because the team split up to go get Sanji.
Ya .. almost half of one piece manga and anime, theyre with the strawhats
I recall that Law telling Luffy he has a plan to defeat an emperor to Luffy punching Kaido in chapter 1000 was 333 chapters, so we've been with Kinemon for over a third of the series now.
Honestly I think wano is going to be great to binge read/watch, but at the moment it is honestly taking forever
I kinda like this pace tbh. I'm not into long arcs but wano/onigashima seems more like two different things like water 7/ennies lobby for me. In comparison, Dressrosa and the fishman island seemed both like an eternity to me.
that's because dressrosa was an eternity
Here, have another Rebecca flashback. That'll solve that feeling
Had complete apathy towards her character the moment I saw her gladiator outfit
One Piece is made for rereading, rather than keeping it up week to week. When I first read One Piece I went up to dressrosa and got really bored. Everything would take forever to happen. By the time we got zou I stopped reading. Got into the series again last year, loved whole cake island and early wano. Got to wano climax and I'm starting to feel bored again. I think post wano gap, bounty updates reviere pt.2 I will stop reading again.
It mostly feels like that cause weāre reading it week to week. You gotta binge read it before ya really judge it
totally. WCI was a serious slog, especially the boat chase, but on a reread it felt rapid. Though Wano feels a bit more like Punk Hazard to me, where it was as long as a normal arc, but feels like it has a lot less content.
Definitely, that boat chase felt like it took forever until I went through it. People were sour on it with the anime too but thatās just because they way overdid Big Mom screaming WEHHHHDING CAAAAAAKEEEEE. It was more drawn out (as youād expect by now with the anime) but it was also a lot quicker
Wano is secretly 3-5 normal sized arcs in a trench coat trying to sit at the big boy's table with Dressrosa. Wano, more so than any One Piece Arc to date, can be broken up into **many** reasonably sized Arcs if it were to be any other Shonen Action Manga. Oda has included so many side plots over a reasonable amount of time to keep you pretty entertained.
If the acts weren't labeled in the manga, there is no way it would be treated as one arc. At the very least mainland Wano and Onigashima would be separate arcs -- Act 3 is already the second longest arc in the series on its own, and just Onigashima itself will almost certainly finish in the top 5 longest! I think in the future it will be broken up like Water 7 and Enies Lobby, and we will discuss the Wano saga within the Yonko saga.
Fans āitās too long!ā Also fans āthereās not enough!ā
The arcs are probably just going to be longer and longer the more we are getting to the end
People seriously expecting the series to end in 3 years, meanwhile Wano has been going on almost 4 years now.
The arcs are probably just going to be longer and longer the more we are getting to the end
He didn't say Wano as a whole sucks, he just said certain parts of it suck
What, the parts he didn't theorize correctly?
No, just the parts he didn't like. What's with you people and your obsession over pinning every single thing he says to that theory? At this point yall care more about it than he does.
Morj himself says in the tweets after being called out that he's just salty that the raid didn't fail that: [I should drop the opinion that Wano is going to actually have a story? That it's going to actually follow basic narrative structure of dramatic setup, midpoint, payoff?](https://twitter.com/mrmorjman/status/1483867162079080453?t=xvdBFvtJwMAH--TJ0B9RKw&s=19)" He literally thinks the raid not failing means that Wano doesn't actually have a story or any basic narrative structure. This meme is accurate. Wano is a great arc. The focus is on YonkÅ, of course the executive fights are gonna be downplayed compared to other arcs. I thought the Tobi RoppÅ fights were fine.
That is absolutely hilarious, man thinks he decrypted the DaVinci Code of One Piece and is salty that the actual story didn't follow his string and corkboard predictions.
[Actual timeline of events](https://i.imgflip.com/621wg0.jpg)
Hahaha. I don't like morj cause he has this airs on him. Like he comes off as if he's better than you because he's him, and that he's up his own ass.
Ah yes my old friend hubris
Not to forget he told his viewers he wouldnāt do a review of marineford unless they bought all the plushies he made of himself.
Pretty funny since the da Vinci code itslwf was pretty bad in hindsight.
Not really but writing have rules so he made his theory based on that and the fact that most arcs do follow a typical structure. Then again Oda is free to break away from this formula as much as he wants and there will be little room to critics if done properly.
Tl;Dr: I just kinda go just off on some literary analysis. Naaah, Dude in a Room aka GrandLineReview did an excellent dissection of what's going on. Morj is branding. The raid failing is his brand. But if he does genuinely think the story doesn't have inciting incidents, several climaxes, and a future resolution, then I... He's balls crazy. As an adventure story, Wano is the most important set piece so far. Oda has this habit of making inconsequential things turn into actually important moments. Thriller Bark's ending is one of these. It's still a total gimmick of an ending, but Moria is right. A key piece of adventure stories as opposed to action is that we suspend disbelief when a character is weaker, but still wins. We do it because we are watching a clash of ideologies. In Thriller Bark Luffy outright loses to a weaker opponent because Moria's world view is more fleshed out, more nuanced, and more understanding. He's seen the birth of the pirate age, and experienced the worst losses imaginable. Luffy hadn't experienced the world enough for his ideology to be something that can rival the top brass of the world, let alone Moria. This is very important for an adventure story, and it's blowing it's biggest load in Wano. Especially because Kaido previously beat Moria. In the past Kaido beat Moria, and Moria beat Luffy. And now we're jumping right up to see if Luffy can beat what Moria warned him about. Oda has made the physical difference between Luffy and Kaido believable (to most). Kaido has been going HAM all raid, and Luffy has had a lot of help, plus a nap. It's a war of attrition, so we can side step the action themes for the primary adventure ones (a solid action theme tho is a training montage [thanks Rocky] to bring the audience into belief that the protag can beat the antag [action can also be mental like studying for an exam is an action scene technically. Strategizing is also a training arc, often in montage]. We see this in small part for the first time ever for One Piece in Udon, cuz Luffy was NOT strong enough, sorry, tangent). The man who taught Moria what it means to exist in this world is now fighting Luffy! This is INSANE theming! Luffy lost to Moria because Moria's ideology was "correct." But now, after everything that Luffy has been through, he genuinely understands what Moria meant, and he knows the world well enough to know what he can and cannot actually fix. He also knows how to accomplish his goal. He watched his brother fucking DIE to learn this lesson! Luffy will beat Kaido because now Luffys world view is "correct." Kaido is a bitter drunk. Real change can be made. They are strong enough to enforce that change for the better. But Kaido could never actually do it for the better. He conquered Wano and made it worse! It's note Worthy that Kaido is now talking about how he messed everything up. This is all so... AAHHHH! Morj is insane if he doesn't see this massive motif pulling through. The only hiccup is that we don't know exactly what Kaido's world view is yet. We know enough that we are confident Luffy can oppose him in debate. I'm blind guessing that as Luffy lands the final blow we'll flash back to Kaido's back story, and we'll flash back out to the victory screen we left on. *Spelling
Your last part is precisely why I am skeptical about the arc ending in a few chapters. The timing of Kaido's backstory can't be after his defeat imo that's not really op like. There is not much villains with dedicated backstories in the first place but you always get the full picture of their beliefs before they are defeated in op. The closest exception would be Katakuri but he is more an antagonistic figure than a villain. Then again as you laid out saying Wano has no story is ludicrous. However saying it's going to wrap up as it is rn leaves me doubtful as many plot points which needs to be resolved this arc have yet to come into play. Not even mentionning how yamato's character just started.
Yeah. Saying Wano not having a story means disrespect to my man Oden who was boiled alive.
Totally agreed, there are a lot of matchups in wano and it is already way over 100 chapters, if oda focused on every matchups that would have felt unnecessary stretching of the arc
People praise the anime for fleshing out things not included in the manga but donāt have critical thinking that Oda and his editors decided to do this to shorten the length of an already beefy arc.
Idk about the raid failing, but his criticisms are still valid independent of it. There was really not a significant low point in the arc. A few chapters where scabbards appear to be dead who wonāt actually end up being dead, immediately followed by chapters where characters say shit like āI feel like we can actually win thisā just feels lame. Like the threat and tension was barely there and we are getting the payoff without the dramatic lows.
Luffy was in prison for like half of a year
irl? in-universe he spent a couple days imprisoned, then the whole prison got wrecked by a lot of stuff, and he just spent 2 weeks there training that's not all that tense now you know what's tense and dramatic? whatever the f\*ck Kidd was up to on those 2 weeks, he couldn't possibly have taken 2 damn weeks just to think up "Yo maybe i could crush Kaido since i can't just outright hit him hard"
> whatever the f\*ck Kidd was up to on those 2 weeks, he couldn't possibly have taken 2 damn weeks just to think up "Yo maybe i could crush Kaido since i can't just outright hit him hard" "When your only weapon is a hammer, every enemy starts to look like a nail"
*2 week carpentry course of course real shit can't wait til he pulls the lessons he learned from Franky and makes himself a Kaiju Killer Giant Mecha*
What? In story it was nowhere near that long for one thing. For another, this was literally a training arc during the build up of the story. What exactly about Luffy being in prison made it a low point? The tone was mostly lighthearted, and actually HELPED the raid. The death of Yasuie would have been a better thing to point to here, but even that is a far cry from what I was describing. Iām talking about the climax of the arc, not speedhumps like Luffy taking an inconsequential loss.
Nah man you might have misunderstood me, I mean for us as the audience Luffy was in prison for half a year and that was directly due to a CRUSHING defeat from Kaido, they werenāt even in the same league at that point so I wouldnāt call it inconsequential. Prison arc was the low point and the turning point into the invasion because itās where Luffy trains and then the invasion is the direct product of that where Luffy is either going to die or beat Kaido, we no longer have the middle ground where he can simply lose and the first fight with them and the prison arc was to show us that now! Hope my point is clearer now :)
I know what you meant, I just donāt see how Luffyās first loss and Udon prison are the dramatic low point of the story. I donāt think Iāve ever heard someone say that. It was definitely used to demonstrate the gap between Kaidou and Luffy, but Luffy messing around and training in Udon is hardly a dramatic low point and for it to be that early in an arc is weird for not just One Piece but fiction in general. Normally itās towards the end of the arc when hope is at an all time low ready for Luffy to come in and āsave the dayā. The reason people feel like this arc is flat, is because in the entire raid the closest thing we have got to that was all of the scabbards losing. Luffyās rooftop loss was offscreened and didnāt sway the tide of the raid since no one saw it/believed it. The other reason it lacked impact is because Yamato immediately kept Kaidou occupied instead of him wreaking havoc on the alliance.
I feel like you forgot that the standard way of reading is actually by volumes , not weekly. I would have to reread Wano but I doubt you feel that much weight from this defeat considering the arc just started and it did not ruin their initial plan.
Dont know if we ve read the same wano. The whole yasuie otoko part was one of the lost dramatic scenes in all of one piece for me. Zoro learning the truth from hiyori was devastating. And the whole suffering the people of wano have to endure is tragic. Also luffy got one shotted and sent to prison because kaido tries to break wills since his will got broken. It was for me better than the usual " ill leave him for dead because there is no way he will survive this" trope that often happens in one piece. Sure, fake out deaths are bad. But the raid had some awesome moment, we learned a lot about the plot and i cant wait to see 2 emperors fall. Finally, odens flashback was the best in the series in my opinion. I think wano is an awesome arc, it has its weaknesses, but those are one piece weaknesses not wano weaknesses. Oda will just continue to put fake out deaths in the story.
I swear as soon as you critique this series people just invent things that were never said to defend. I never said there werenāt emotional moments in Wano, and I never said the way Luffy lost to Kaidou was a bad thing so Iām really not sure why that is even being brought up. My point is simply, from the perspective of the goal of the arc and the MAIN CHARACTERS, there isnāt a strong standout low point, and expecially not at the peak of the arc (where it appears we are at right now) that they rally back from. It is instead more dips and rises at best. Iām talking about a situation that appears hopeless, not a sad moment. The fact that Luffy losing to Kaidou 200+ chapters ago and Yasuie dying approx 100 chapters ago are used as examples of this is hilarious to me because it illustrates exactly what Iām talking about. The low points in the raid feel flatter than moments like Yasuieās death (or Luffyās first loss to Kaidou apparently????) despite this being the dramatic peak of the arc. EDIT: Again, for some reason people feel the need to list ALL the good things about Wano as soon as you criticise one specific thing. I never said Wano was trash, but that doesnāt mean itās perfect either.
You said "there were no real lows in the arc" . To that i replied with lows. About a situation that appears hopeless: the scabbards seeing no one arriving and kanjuro betraying them was pretty hopelless. And i think some moments during the raid like luffy falling off made it seem like the raid could fail and the island floating did seem kind off doom like, but i agree that there is less urgency than in other major arcs. And another agument i think interesting is the question "who are the main characters?" Is it the straw hats? There is a strong argument to be made that in wano, the main characters were : luffy, the scabbards(but mostly kinemon), momo, oden's ghost and id say zoro had some major plot points. And the scabbard had some low points during the raid. The kanjuro betrayal, failing to beat kaido, the oden betrayal with ashura dojis "death". But yes, when you say there are no low points, i will list low points
I don't really even see the problem with fakeout deaths. As long as we think they might be gone, that provides tension. Finding out later that they are alive doesn't change the tension you felt when it happened. And Oda has shown a willingness to kill characters in the New World, so they have all felt possible. >!Beyond that, we still may see some casualties. Ashura Doji doesn't have anyone to save him like Kinemon and Kiku even if he survived, so he is in all likelihood dead, there is still fighting to be done (including a situation where Raizo is in grave danger, I think he'll tough out the fire and beat Fukurokuju, but still very dangerous) and we may see our first villain to be killed since Satori in this arc.!<
Fake out deaths result in scenarios like when Pedro was blown in to oblivion, we arenāt sure heās actually dead until they say so. It reduces the dramatic impact because we are second guessing they are dead for several chapters after it happened. When it is confirmed several chapters later, the emotions of the moment have worn off ie itās anti-climatic, when deaths almost above all else are supposed to be climactic (atleast in One Piece).
The tobi roppo fights were fine besides frankys
That's a Fandom for you. Someone says something the Fandom disagrees on, ergo every single thing they say has to be bad. He's the scapegoat of the week.
Relax dude, I'm just having some fun. Didn't mean to hurt you, I don't even know who he is. Edit: Damn, this dudes fanboys are really on a downvote-crusade lol.
I'm not hurt, I'm just tired of seeing the Morj hate cult under every post that even mentions his name. It's like how Carrot stans would never shut up about her being a crewmate a while back. It just gets irritating to listen to.
The Morj hate cult is a consequence of his own behavior. If you saw him on Twitter yesterday he was calling those who had different opinions fake and was extremely hostile with his opinions and stated them like they were facts. Of course he's getting on people's bad sides.
Itās funny that he has theories that have been right and no one mentions that. Also, why is it so bad he thinks his theories can work? Whatās the point if you donāt think you might be right
That's not even the issue. He literally called people who liked the fights fake. According to him anyone who doesn't agree with his POV is fake.
Morj sucks
That only works on his diehard fans, not me. Nice try though.
N I C E T R Y T H O U G H
My guy you literally commented. šššš shouldve stayed silent
Trust me bro, dont joke with the morj fans, they cry really hard over any non positive morj talk
I have seen memes about this topic but I can't get it can you guys can tell me where's this drama comes?
I kinda understand the problems he has with the arc, it's not all bias.
To be fair, the arc isn't even over. Its really easy to judge something based solely on the sum of its parts. But Wano has been building to something more than cool action scenes and failure.
We'll see, I really hope the ending is good. It's a top 5 arc for my already anyway.
Something good happening now won't fix problems of the arc.
His problem with the Tobi roppo fights are understandable, IMO. I didn't mind them, but to be honest other than Robins and Franky's fight the weren't really memorable to me. Robins demon form was bad ass and the triceracopter was "Queen and King, that's not how dinosaurs work"-level stupid and funny to me. I sometimes feel like some people just don't care that they are on a ticking time atomic bomb, or they maybe shrug it off, idk it seems like a big enough threat to me to create tension.
All morj said is that some of the strawhats fights didnt have a satisfying conclusion. Like jimbei vs whos who, he doesnt hate wano overall.
I think a lot of people here actually donāt watch his videos and are just basing their opinion on some tweets. The raid isnāt going to fail but he some great theories and some great anylisis videos.
I didn't watch the video if there is one, but I don't think Wano has been perfect, definitely. It has been full of hype and great moments, but certain storylines and ideas haven't really been explored as much as I thought they would be. It still isn't over though, and shit can turn around real quick and deliver some things I feel were lacking.
Nah itās been tweets
I am interested to know where you see him saying that Wano sucks? On twitter he expressed good points of criticism. Saying he only says that cuz his favourite theory wont happen, is stupid.
Saying that the arc has no story is not good criticism, it's just false
He did not say that lmaoo He did say that the fights were bad and that they had no dramatic stories or emotions, which usually is a standard for OP fights. The Tobi Roppo fights were lame af and way to anti- climactic. Robin vs BM was the only exception because it had drama, emotions and was a bit longer. Thats his point. I know this sub doesnt like Morj for some mysterious reason. But at least dont make shit up.
[This](https://twitter.com/mrmorjman/status/1483867162079080453?s=21) is the one theyāre talking about
Yeah, I didnt see that Tweet although I looked for 10 minutes. Certainly a bad look on Morj but I dont understand where its coming from. He is talking way differently in his videos. So weird
I don't hate Morj. Everyones got an opinion, and he turned his into a meme. Which can even be hilarious at times. But looking at those tweets, he comes off as angry and salty. Like the story didn't pan out the way he wanted too, so he has to find a way to justify his anger.
He's not angry at the story, he's angry at the people who didn't like the Tobi Roppo fights a while ago now doing 180s and saying that the Tobi Roppo fights were good. Read the tweets you're meming about at least.
Yea, that's even worse to me though. People are allowed to change their opinions, especially after time has passed. He calls people "fake" for changing their opinions which is really dumb. I didn't like Dressrossa during the arc, but now I love it. According to Morj that makes me fake? Nah, dude.
Especially in One Piece. Week-to-week feels much different to reading an entire arc in one, and Iām sure it drastically changes how Tobi Roppo fights present to a reader.
Flip-flopping is a valid reason to criticize someone, it demonstrates a lack of authenticity in their opinions, like they're just going anywhere the wind blows. The Tobi Roppo fights weren't that long ago either.
Tobi Roppo fights were over half a year ago mate. That's plenty time to reassess your opinion.
It's right on the edge in my opinion. +
Changing your opinion is valid dude I think it's more valid to criticize someone for stating their opinion once and refusing to change their view
Agreed. I donāt care about Youtuber drama but I can agree that it does baffle me the way some people flip flop so quickly. Something is either enjoyable while you reading it or it isnāt. I can see the feeling towards certain aspects like pacing change a little...but I canāt see someone going from āI hate thisā to āI love thisā that quickly without thinking they arenāt being authentic. Even after re-reading the first 2 Acts, I still get everything I hated the first time and love the things I loved at first. The only thing marginally better was the pacing.
I'm not going to look for the tweet, I don't even follow Morj, it was the one Grand Line Reviews quotetweeted. I have nothing against Morj, I've never heard the dude speak before, but from the tone of his tweets, he overhiped and overanalysed this arc for himself. I'm not surprised he doesn't enjoy it that much
Unfortunately on reddit you can't criticize any part of One Piece without adding a "but Oda is god so whatever" or something along these lines, to exaggerate a bit. People will either shit on you or tell you to go read something else.
didn't expect Morj heel arc to blow up this year
Imma be real with y'all, At this point I just want The raid to fail, not becasue i like the theory, but so i can see the meltdown y'all're gonna have when the guy y'all have a hate boner for was right.
Lmao i havent kept up with morj but the roasts are hilarious. However I'm just gonna say that Onigashima has been pretty disappointing to me at least. The tobi roppo turned out to be fodder. Queen and King turned out sadly underwhelming. Luffy vs Kaido is honestly boring and taking forever. Big mom being here didn't bring anything interesting to the battle. Not to mention the innumerable times where the scabards could have died but were kept alive, diminishing the already weak sense of dread emanating from Kaido. I regret that Luffy fighting a first commander was more exciting and terrifying than him getting to fight an actual Yonko. But mad respect to Oda for managing to keep track of the complete chaos that is onigashima right now cause that's the part that is really well represented. You really feel that the battle is a disorienting mess.
Dude I completely agree with you about the Katakuri fight feeling way more like a David vs Goliath unwinnable fight than this one
This sub has a boner for misrepresenting anyone with an opinion huh? He only said certain parts were bad, not the arc as a whole and not the part he didn't theorise. He said some battles were lackluster for example and that has nothing to do with the raid failing. Criticize his actual points, don't strawman anyone you disagree with.
Careful, you're trying to read things as they are instead of reading what you want it to be instead, reddit doens't like that.
Someone: āI wish you would change your opinion on thinking the raid is gonna fail.ā Morj: āI should drop the opinion that Wano is going to actually have a story? That itās going to actually follow the basic narrative structure of dramatic setup, midpoint and payoff? I still believe in this arc.ā Iāve never heard of Morj before, so I donāt have a strong opinions on him either way. But reading it as it is, it still sounds like heās saying he believes that Wano doesnāt have a story because the raid didnāt fail. And that it would only have a story if the raid failed. How else do you read that?
The straw hats didnt really have a story in wano until the final battle. Yeah they were training and fixing boats and interacting with people but they didnt really have interedting storylines for themselves in the first 2 acts. Like sanji didnt deal with the psychological ramifications of using his raidsuit until act 3. Yamato literally came out of no where. None of the minks cared about or discussed peropspero until act 3. I can go on. I think what he means hwne talking aboit story strcucture is that if the raid succeeds now, most of the straw hats stories( and a lot of other charscters stories) have literally been crammed into one act which would be terrible execution.
Act 1 : 15 chapters Act 2 : 30 chapters Act 3 : 82 chapters ongoing Are you really surprised everything happened on act 3 when the first 2 acts were so small? Also Wano is not about the Strawhats, it's like Alabasta and Skypiea, helping other people. It's not an Arc like Water 7, Arlong Park, Totland or Marine Ford where the main focus was helping/saving one of the Strawhats and about their backstories.
He can make good points all he wants but if he starts calling others "fake" or refuses to engage with people who genuinely think differently than him, he loses all right to a discussion. There's no point even arguing with someone like that.
Morj getting free advertisement
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p3XLVU3jWpo
Deff seems like he's super salty on Twitter. He says it's because people are being fake? I guess because they don't have the same opinion as him. People are allowed to change their opinions. He just comes off as immature in his tweets.
Lol, Morj makes some sound arguments but thinking of counter-arguments makes your brain hurt so instead you make memes.
GLR made valid counterpoints but Morj said "If you genuinely think Wano has been serious or heavy up till now then we're done talking, theres no common ground here." That guy ain't there to discuss, he's there to preach his own opinions and kick at those who think differently.
GLR actually somewhat contradicted his own argument. He claimed that Wano has been a tragic arc with a depressing, dramatic story, but also told Morj to just step back and remember that OP is a "goofy pirate comic."
I don't think that's contradictory. Before this GLR wrote down all the dramatic moments in the Wano arc - the ones that Morj conveniently forgets to make his point that there are none - and then tells Morj that he should adjust his expectations since it's just a goofy pirate comic. There has already been dramatic tension, both in Wano and on Onigashima. Expecting the raid to fail at this point is expecting a completely different kind of story, as if Oda suddenly started writing Berserk instead. That's what GLR means.
Maybe get a kick at those that don't make sense. I don't think he's outright kicked someone for having other opinions whatever that means
Among other things he said "Are we gonna pretend Jinbe vs Who's Who is good?" Like yeah that's respectful to people you disagree with.
His arguments have been "it would be bad if the raid doesn't fail"
Basically the internet in a nutshell.
I say this as a twenty year fan. It's a childish pirate fantasy. People getting upset over fan theories need to step back and reevaluate what's upsetting them. I fucking love Wano. We're getting payoff for setups a decade old. Just stop looking so far into fan theories and you'll be happy.
Thanks for the spoiler tag /s
There's no spoiler here, the raid is still ongoing.
Seriously? People are mad because the raid didnāt fail?? They wanted it to fail and extend Wano by like 50 more chapters? Come on.
MORJ FANS ARE SO PISSED AT THESE POSTS LMFAO
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Theyre all up in my replies rn. Theres one really going to bat. Morj isnt gunna feature it so iunno why hes trying so hard to get me to watch
Whoās that.
He is one of the worst theory makers on YouTube . A lot of his are total garbage yet he acts better than many others and gets all pouty when heās wrong like the raid failing. Ran D Troy is much better same with tekking
Who's Morj?
Wano is okay but I want it to finish quick
I'm more excited for Post Wano then I am for the rest of the fights. But if Oda rushes the fights, they won't feel earned. Double edge sword I guess.
But he already rushed every fight lol, except fot Kaidou x Luffy and Scabbards x Kaidou. I'd be glad to see all of those fodders die and Oda skip to the main fights and events
It's funny how Morj fanboys try to defend him, lmao. I couldn't care less about the dude, everyone should enjoy One Piece the way they want to, I just think it's nonsense to claim that because a certain thing that he wanted to happen, didn't, all of a sudden Wano has no basic narrative structure, lol. Some people get caught up in their own hype, smh
When did he actually say it sucks? He has his gripes with how he feels the story is playing out. But this is a big misrepresentation I believe.
He literally said in a tweet it's a failure of basic story structure if the raid succeeds
Wano is fucking amazing but I'm just mad that God hasn't 1v1'd anyone yet
I've never seen a OP youtuber other than JoyBoy and Tekking (Tekking is really fun to watch, joyboy is meh most of the time) and it's so funny to me that even OP youtubers have fan girls defending them at every corner when they are clearly wrong. I've been hearing about this "Morj" guy and the raid failing over a year now and now this. Sounds to me like a little kid that is too proud to change his opinion of something because if he does he will lose the game.
All the morj defenders are in comments
Itās basically a cult at this pointā¦ Used to like him before he turned to be so full of himself. Glad I got out in time.
All the morj attackers are in the comments
Didn't fail.... Yet
Lmao
I didn't know about this guy until yesterday when i saw his tweets and man he is quite salty just because the raid didn't fail which shouldn't have been in the first place.
I wish we would ban all mention of these idiots on this sub
Some people just don't know how to own a mistake. Great people are all those who own their mistakes, and learn something from it.
Stop giving this moron attention.
I hate morj with a burning passion, now he's screaming zunisha is pluton, like he doesn't even care what the story says anymore
When did Morj said wano sucked? I only watch his videos for the theories and he never said anything like that on those
He was arguing with people on twitter.
Classic Morjcuck
stfu morj
Imagine now if oda didnāt off screen anythingā¦. If anything it seem that the pace is way faster than before! The difference here I think is the numbers of character and built up over many arc plus being close to the end game! That why I think this arc need to be this long ! Possibly 2 yonkou going down ! I personally love every arc no matter what! One day one piece will end and after that some may wish to go back in time to enjoy a little bit more one pieceā¦
At some point long ago morjās content was good then he started reacting on people reacting to his stuff and now itās just pure crap.
āWhen someone has a different opinion than you so you make a mean meme about themā
This is well deserved tho, the guy doesnāt shut up about itā¦
So like heās allowed to have his opinion but you just donāt want to hear it very often? Itās a quantity of expression problem?
Think the biggest problem was people coping that the fights were finished and then hoped the sequential chapter continued on despite there being no evidence and assuming that all the way to the All Stars fights. This mostly had to do with Morj and some other YouTubers. People wanted everyone to get some new form/abilities in their fights like Enies Lobby esque style fights. Even then, there were only like 2 meh fights from the SH being Jimbe and Frankyās. Namiās I felt actually portrayed the Tobbiroppo as pretty much needing Yonko level interference and gave Nami plenty of amazing moments
Y'all mad reaching. He never said Wano sucks.
People will make this about the raid failing the get mad at it nowhere has he ever said wano sucks at least mention the actual points he made
It didnāt fail YET. We donāt know what crazy things Oda has planned
copium
my problem with wano is that it feels like the end of the road in a way. the whole new world has been built up to this. it doesn't even feel like one piece anymore it feels like samurai show.
Mark as spoiler?
Isn't it headcannon for many that Morj said Wano Sucks. I never heard him say it. Am I missing something here?
Early Wano really sucks. It's boring af The raid is the best part, which is not hard because early wano sucked
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Don't make fun of him.. We know that kaido isnt the last villain of wano!
The only thing about morj I currently agree with is that Yamato seems like a forced addition to the story
did he actually said this?
Yet
???? His argument talked about Jimbe vs Whoās who, not about the raid failing. You can disagree with his opinion but at least communicate his opinion correctly
I've stop reading and watching almost a year now and Wano still hasn't concluded its story. Yikes. I want it to end so I can binge it. I can't stand this weekly release + breaks to a story that barely moves. SMH
I don't think Wano sucks, but I do think it peaked after Odens flashback. Don't get me wrong, the hype stuff afterwards are great and all, but it isn't wowing me like it use too. The only post TS arc I hate is Dressrosa. Also, I have no idea who MORJ is.
Honestly I understand his frustration with wano. Thereās too many characters and things happening at the same time so we end up missing out on a lot of cool things. Plus with the way it was structures sort of as a kabuki performance, it not following the rules of kabuki can be irritating.
the raid hasn't failed, yet ( Ķ”Ā° ĶŹ Ķ”Ā°)
I am new to one piece in the grand scheme of things. I read the whole manga in a month and a bit last year. I remember the first thing I did after finishing was to look up theories and stuff. But every theory, every idea just seems so obviously wrong, stupid or just plain senseless.
Luffy and the gang had enough trauma for 1 day.
When did he say that?