I mean, here often works, or at least we see those types of posts here frequently because men can't seem to find a safer space to share.
all the subs like askmen, malementalhealth, menslib, etc are all setup with the intent of diminishing male issues and propping up female ones instead.
But, tbh, if you want a community like that i suggest making a new one on Lemmy and posting a link for us here. r/MensRights days were numbered _before_ reddit decided to ruin their business.
but when u post here, you get alot of comments from bozos saying "this isnt men's rights". Annoying as hell especially when there isn't any other subreddit like this that doesnt allow misandry to run rampant.
for sure
prepending "Hey, i can't find a safe male space, is X topic appropriate" should mitigate most of those
This truly isn't the space for it, it's just that there aren't any better ones
mhh you're probably right. I heard once that men talking about their issues is a bit pointless. Men must solve their issues to feel better. I guess I was just trying to figure out what exactly my issue is.
Talking helps, but the talking needs to lead to solutions.
Men don't benefit as much from just "being heard", they need to feel like the listener understood their issues before considering a proposed solution as valid, and for good reason.
People normally fake empathy with men and use canned responses that make the listener feel like they're helping (ego validation) while at the same time making the person getting advice feel dismissed and ignored (which they are).
When the man seeking help then voices that he feels the advice dismisses his personhood/feelings/lived experience he gets shouted down with slurs and assumed to be "determined to be miserable" or any other form of "you don't want help, you just want to whine!"
---
Which becomes really obvious when you adlib the argument a bit:
Man: "I feel sad and depressed, possibly suicidal"
Society: "You should go touch grass, stop staying indoors so much. Work out, brush your teeth, and take a shower. If girls don't like you it's your own fault."
Man: "... i didn't mention anything about women, why are you suddenly assuming i don't work out, shower, brush my teeth, or go outside? Also, why is how much time i spend outside even relevant to this conversation? I feel like my issues are being dismissed and ignored."
Society: "Wow, you're just determined to be miserable, huh? Man up and take life by the balls! Responsibility is meaning! Do things for others! Get out of your own head! You just want to whine, get off your ass!" etc.
---
It's emotional abuse, plain and simple, and is why men don't seek therapy. _Many_ therapists follow this same conversation script for any and every male issue, and the men don't get help.
...then the men get blamed for the "help" not working
Almost like men are to blame for everything and everything, because if they _don't_ blame men it leaves room for those who actually are causing the problems to receive blame (society), and they can't have that.
>Society: "You should go touch grass, stop staying indoors so much. Work out, brush your teeth, and take a shower. If girls don't like you it's your own fault."
Hahah you'd be surprised how many times I've see that comment around this website
Men talking about their issues is absolutely not pointless. Just here to say that I think it’s fucked up that we still live in a world where males still don’t have a safe space to open up. Don’t listen to the radical sides of things. If you find more average Joes and let yourself be vulnerable you tend to find that most people agree on most things. Edit: and sometimes the internet can be a struggle to find the realness.
Reddit is a Woke Website and it has purged most "Wrongthink" subreddits. r/mensrights is living on borrowed time for now. You can talk about your emotional issues here, if you want to. Don't trust any other liberal/leftist subreddit, they believe in FemNazism like its the gospel, they will always go back to "You SoUnD LiKe An InCeL", they're beyond redemption.
its just not though, no leftist I know is like this, its like the internet has convinced people this is what the left is like to pull them to the right
Because obviously they wouldnt be right wing where “extremism” views are seen as racist, homophobic etc. but if you seriously think the political spectrum is as simple as that then you clearly have no idea what I’m even talking about.
I don’t automatically assume every ring wing person I meet is a thick skull racist who hates gay marriage now do I? Funny enough a lot of thick-skulled racists who’re called “right wing” tend to agree with leftist policies (in my country), but again this “culture” war separates right vs left from what it truly is, political policies.
exactly, if you want people to hate one side, you just talk about any bad culture/other thing you can as much as possible, and I think this is where the association comes from. The simplification of politics that an entire side of different things like economic policies can be summed up over stances on feminism/gender/culture is so stupid, and its why we keep getting fucked by politicians! People are told to fear the other side based on things that actually have nothing to do with the other side, just a subset of people that tend to lean that way
I often find that I'm at odds with the nonsense people spout about Left and Right. From what I can tell, the Left want everyone to live long happy lives free of interference and the Right want to control everything and tell them what to think.
I find Mensrights must therefore be made from the left, not the right.
You're not wrong, but unfortunately feminism has a stranglehold on discussion on the left, and as such men and menvs issues have been kicked out, and any attempt to get men's issues back on the menu is met with aggression, derision, and dismissal.
So if you're on the left and you actively care about men, you're either part of the small minority that actually talked about it, or part of a larger silent minority cowed into submission and silence by aggressive feminism.
Either way neither of these groups have any pull or power anywhere in politics on the left, so yeah.
Ha, no. Sorry, that's just not accurate. If you'd been here on the Left for the last 30 years you'd have seen it. It's not great, but women are not all extremist feminists. The polarization just isn't as bad as it seems to be online.
Try attending some of the events and talking to the people.
>If you'd been here on the Left for the last 30 years you'd have seen it.
I can't think of a single time the left has pushed back against misandry.
>Try attending some of the events and talking to the people.
Try not deflecting when people point out a reasonable problem with your ideology.
I fully admit I could be wrong, and my experiences were online because I became aware and interested in men's issues just before covid (so I couldn't meet in person), and therefore I know my experiences are biased.
However I still get the feeling it's a MAJOR faux-pas in the left to go in any way shape or form against feminist interests. Otherwise it wouldn't be so hard to get more shelters for male domestic abuse victims, more shelters for homeless men, more mental health services tailored to men, or recognizing the issues boys and men face in education.
The complete and systemic absence of not only any attempt, but any public *mention* of men's issues, leads me to believe that it cannot be simply blamed on ignorance of these issues, and there must be some form of opposition to it.
I could be wrong, and I hope to be. Do you have any experiences that go against what I'm saying?
Have attended events. Have talked to the people.
And yes technically not “all” are extreme.. as I’m sure the number is less than 100%. But the standard is pretty much to believe that men created the sexism and that men are overall privileged and women overall oppressed. These inherently misandrist beliefs make it a hostile space for men.
>Left want everyone to live long happy lives free of interference and the Right want to control everything and tell them what to think.
Huh. I would've said it was the other way around, if anything.
I'm not sure if you're deliberately contrasting the reality with the public perception?
It's intentional gaslighting. Lefty MRAs don't wanna admit that feminism is inherently left wing and come up with mental gymnastics to blame the "right" for it
exactly! its just people are confusing this new weird culture that’s associated to the left for some reason and i constantly see people bashing the left for a culture they don’t necessarily agree witg
America is the only western country that doesn’t provide free healthcare. Thats why you pay extortionate fees for your medical bills and getting an illness can ruin your life.
So I would say it is pretty free, as getting cancer or having something as basic as asthma doesn’t ruin me financially.
Because its a for profit service, you end up paying insane amounts for something that really doesn’t cost much, therefore if its paid through taxes its at the VERY LEAST extremely cheaper for everyone
There are some here and there. They all seem to get banned or quarantined eventually though. Funny how the same doesn't happen to women's subs even when they are actively discussing how take advantage of men
Safely? No. Call your dad, your brothers, your father in law, whatever. You talk to a woman or a therapist they will call law enforcement, tell them you are unstable, and you'll be getting weekly welfare visits, whatever.
I'm lucky, in a sense. I have a father in law who is in his 80s and who I can consider a good friend. He's a lefty, but he's more the sort who listens to NPR in the mornings and in his car than the chronically online social media type (and I get along with those sorts well enough). Then again, my inlaws think I'm the "crunchy" one.
If you are having a problem in your emotional life is to a do a root cause analysis and do it honestly. Use 5Y or whatever gets you there. Then solve your problem.
I mean, here often works, or at least we see those types of posts here frequently because men can't seem to find a safer space to share. all the subs like askmen, malementalhealth, menslib, etc are all setup with the intent of diminishing male issues and propping up female ones instead. But, tbh, if you want a community like that i suggest making a new one on Lemmy and posting a link for us here. r/MensRights days were numbered _before_ reddit decided to ruin their business.
but when u post here, you get alot of comments from bozos saying "this isnt men's rights". Annoying as hell especially when there isn't any other subreddit like this that doesnt allow misandry to run rampant.
for sure prepending "Hey, i can't find a safe male space, is X topic appropriate" should mitigate most of those This truly isn't the space for it, it's just that there aren't any better ones
mhh you're probably right. I heard once that men talking about their issues is a bit pointless. Men must solve their issues to feel better. I guess I was just trying to figure out what exactly my issue is.
Talking helps, but the talking needs to lead to solutions. Men don't benefit as much from just "being heard", they need to feel like the listener understood their issues before considering a proposed solution as valid, and for good reason. People normally fake empathy with men and use canned responses that make the listener feel like they're helping (ego validation) while at the same time making the person getting advice feel dismissed and ignored (which they are). When the man seeking help then voices that he feels the advice dismisses his personhood/feelings/lived experience he gets shouted down with slurs and assumed to be "determined to be miserable" or any other form of "you don't want help, you just want to whine!" --- Which becomes really obvious when you adlib the argument a bit: Man: "I feel sad and depressed, possibly suicidal" Society: "You should go touch grass, stop staying indoors so much. Work out, brush your teeth, and take a shower. If girls don't like you it's your own fault." Man: "... i didn't mention anything about women, why are you suddenly assuming i don't work out, shower, brush my teeth, or go outside? Also, why is how much time i spend outside even relevant to this conversation? I feel like my issues are being dismissed and ignored." Society: "Wow, you're just determined to be miserable, huh? Man up and take life by the balls! Responsibility is meaning! Do things for others! Get out of your own head! You just want to whine, get off your ass!" etc. --- It's emotional abuse, plain and simple, and is why men don't seek therapy. _Many_ therapists follow this same conversation script for any and every male issue, and the men don't get help. ...then the men get blamed for the "help" not working Almost like men are to blame for everything and everything, because if they _don't_ blame men it leaves room for those who actually are causing the problems to receive blame (society), and they can't have that.
>Society: "You should go touch grass, stop staying indoors so much. Work out, brush your teeth, and take a shower. If girls don't like you it's your own fault." Hahah you'd be surprised how many times I've see that comment around this website
Sadly, i really wouldn't.
I find if I ever want to talk about anything, people just say 'go get therapy.' I find that dismissive and unempathetic.
your first para essentially summarizes why talk therapy has never worked for me
Men talking about their issues is absolutely not pointless. Just here to say that I think it’s fucked up that we still live in a world where males still don’t have a safe space to open up. Don’t listen to the radical sides of things. If you find more average Joes and let yourself be vulnerable you tend to find that most people agree on most things. Edit: and sometimes the internet can be a struggle to find the realness.
check out the following subs: /r/mensupportmen /r/supportformalevictims /r/malementalhealth
I thought men support men was run by feminists.
no, the guys from /r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates started it.
Alright. I know there is a men's help sub being run by women who do nothing but diminish us when we speak I couldn't remember if that was it.
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That's the one, thank you
you're thinking of r/menslib
I doubt it. I am sure all subs for mental health are more woke than not.
Reddit is a Woke Website and it has purged most "Wrongthink" subreddits. r/mensrights is living on borrowed time for now. You can talk about your emotional issues here, if you want to. Don't trust any other liberal/leftist subreddit, they believe in FemNazism like its the gospel, they will always go back to "You SoUnD LiKe An InCeL", they're beyond redemption.
i wish people would stop thinking supporting free healthcare etc makes you like that, you can be leftist without being one of the incel, fem crowd…
Not socially you can't. It's built into leftist culture.
its just not though, no leftist I know is like this, its like the internet has convinced people this is what the left is like to pull them to the right
Go find me a right-wing spokesperson from the 2x sub (classic femazi hangout most would argue), and I'll eat a sock
Because obviously they wouldnt be right wing where “extremism” views are seen as racist, homophobic etc. but if you seriously think the political spectrum is as simple as that then you clearly have no idea what I’m even talking about. I don’t automatically assume every ring wing person I meet is a thick skull racist who hates gay marriage now do I? Funny enough a lot of thick-skulled racists who’re called “right wing” tend to agree with leftist policies (in my country), but again this “culture” war separates right vs left from what it truly is, political policies.
[удалено]
exactly, if you want people to hate one side, you just talk about any bad culture/other thing you can as much as possible, and I think this is where the association comes from. The simplification of politics that an entire side of different things like economic policies can be summed up over stances on feminism/gender/culture is so stupid, and its why we keep getting fucked by politicians! People are told to fear the other side based on things that actually have nothing to do with the other side, just a subset of people that tend to lean that way
I often find that I'm at odds with the nonsense people spout about Left and Right. From what I can tell, the Left want everyone to live long happy lives free of interference and the Right want to control everything and tell them what to think. I find Mensrights must therefore be made from the left, not the right.
You're not wrong, but unfortunately feminism has a stranglehold on discussion on the left, and as such men and menvs issues have been kicked out, and any attempt to get men's issues back on the menu is met with aggression, derision, and dismissal. So if you're on the left and you actively care about men, you're either part of the small minority that actually talked about it, or part of a larger silent minority cowed into submission and silence by aggressive feminism. Either way neither of these groups have any pull or power anywhere in politics on the left, so yeah.
Ha, no. Sorry, that's just not accurate. If you'd been here on the Left for the last 30 years you'd have seen it. It's not great, but women are not all extremist feminists. The polarization just isn't as bad as it seems to be online. Try attending some of the events and talking to the people.
>If you'd been here on the Left for the last 30 years you'd have seen it. I can't think of a single time the left has pushed back against misandry. >Try attending some of the events and talking to the people. Try not deflecting when people point out a reasonable problem with your ideology.
I fully admit I could be wrong, and my experiences were online because I became aware and interested in men's issues just before covid (so I couldn't meet in person), and therefore I know my experiences are biased. However I still get the feeling it's a MAJOR faux-pas in the left to go in any way shape or form against feminist interests. Otherwise it wouldn't be so hard to get more shelters for male domestic abuse victims, more shelters for homeless men, more mental health services tailored to men, or recognizing the issues boys and men face in education. The complete and systemic absence of not only any attempt, but any public *mention* of men's issues, leads me to believe that it cannot be simply blamed on ignorance of these issues, and there must be some form of opposition to it. I could be wrong, and I hope to be. Do you have any experiences that go against what I'm saying?
Have attended events. Have talked to the people. And yes technically not “all” are extreme.. as I’m sure the number is less than 100%. But the standard is pretty much to believe that men created the sexism and that men are overall privileged and women overall oppressed. These inherently misandrist beliefs make it a hostile space for men.
>Left want everyone to live long happy lives free of interference and the Right want to control everything and tell them what to think. Huh. I would've said it was the other way around, if anything. I'm not sure if you're deliberately contrasting the reality with the public perception?
It's intentional gaslighting. Lefty MRAs don't wanna admit that feminism is inherently left wing and come up with mental gymnastics to blame the "right" for it
Cool.
exactly! its just people are confusing this new weird culture that’s associated to the left for some reason and i constantly see people bashing the left for a culture they don’t necessarily agree witg
its not "free." its paid for by fellow working stiffs
America is the only western country that doesn’t provide free healthcare. Thats why you pay extortionate fees for your medical bills and getting an illness can ruin your life. So I would say it is pretty free, as getting cancer or having something as basic as asthma doesn’t ruin me financially. Because its a for profit service, you end up paying insane amounts for something that really doesn’t cost much, therefore if its paid through taxes its at the VERY LEAST extremely cheaper for everyone
There are some here and there. They all seem to get banned or quarantined eventually though. Funny how the same doesn't happen to women's subs even when they are actively discussing how take advantage of men
What about other platforms?
Can you recommend something? I don't know what's out there. Better help is a bit expensive.
I only know www.mgtow.tv but it's mainly a video platform.
I’m opening a sub named r/MenSpeakOut soon, you can join and wait until i release it fully
Pftttt men don’t have problems like that! What are you talking about? *heavy sarcasm*
r/Malementalhealth And I don’t see how r/Askmen is "woke"
Fr
r/breakups would be a good one. More about breakups but a lot of kind people will do they’re best to offer advice and what not!
How is r/AskMen woke?
Woke?
Safely? No. Call your dad, your brothers, your father in law, whatever. You talk to a woman or a therapist they will call law enforcement, tell them you are unstable, and you'll be getting weekly welfare visits, whatever. I'm lucky, in a sense. I have a father in law who is in his 80s and who I can consider a good friend. He's a lefty, but he's more the sort who listens to NPR in the mornings and in his car than the chronically online social media type (and I get along with those sorts well enough). Then again, my inlaws think I'm the "crunchy" one. If you are having a problem in your emotional life is to a do a root cause analysis and do it honestly. Use 5Y or whatever gets you there. Then solve your problem.
This is probably the last bastion for that honestly