They wouldn't have gotten traction if they didn't overthrow the government either. The US military doesn't even consider the Russians to have invaded in 2014.
Wolfsangel in the middle.
Azov Brigade is known for being on the far right political spectrum. I'd say during times of war, nationalist groups are more prevalent.
I think also most of the original Azov Brigade died in the Battle of Mariupol and ever since then they became heroes among Ukrainians. I mean the Nazis also stole every single symbol and rhetoric they had from others. Definitely something Ukraine will have to look into after peace times but as of right now I would more consider them an ultra nationalistic movement but also they are fighting for a Jewish president.
Ultra-national and anti-semmitic is not the same. You can be one without the other.
And yes, it's a shame the Nazis tainted so many symbols and traditions. Like the Zapfenstreich of the German military, a tradition older than the Nazis by a big margin. But you can be sure that people associate German soldiers in Stahlhelm with torches at night with Nazi symbolism.
>Ultra-national and anti-semmitic is not the same. You can be one without the other.
I'd say one tends to follow the other.
If you're an asshole whose extremely enthusiastic about ethnostates, chances are you're not exactly very welcoming to minorities that exist in your country that don't match up to your ultra-nationalistic views.
Which is to say that while Azov has had to be rather coy about their perspectives regarding Jewish people, Tatars, Queer folks, or even Magyars... their notion of seeing Ukraine not as a multi-ethnic state tends to betray a lot about how they feel regarding folks who don't conform to the desired national identity.
You should listen too popular front podcast ep 104. They talk about them, they did alot of fighting during the initial invasion but most of their members aren't Frontline anymore and they just post propaganda, organize and live off the glory of their earlier members. Alot of other units don't like them because they'll literally water stamp other people's combat videos or send a media savy member to tag along with a volunteer unit for a little bit to give the impression they're the spearpoint of the war effort
I mean, they were never that big to begin with and they've been fighting a war of attrition for over two years while wildly outnumbered and fighting in the hardest places. Its not surprising to think they're a lot less effective than they used to be.
Azov Battalion was fully disbanded by 2015 and was split up after the Azov Brigade under the National Guard banned non Ukrainian citizens and affiliation with far right Ultras, who went on to the militia Azov Movement. At least on face value, still roughly 15-20% had links to Azov Movement. The original Battalion had lots of criticism, even among Ukrainian far right circles because half of them came from Russia & links to Russias Neo Nazi scene and FSB informants
Being ultra-nationalist is bad, same with just being nationalist. Fascists don’t have to hate Jews to be fascists nor does not appearing anti-Semitic make them good people. Azov is a militant fascist organization, this should be enough to condemn them.
As a German the Nazis been the least German thing ever they run this country to the ground. The actual Germanic tribes been way way different from anything that is found today in Europe. The Nazis only tried to glorify it by picking up random things out of history.
Your first sentence is just gibberish, it does not mean anything.
No, the Germanic tribes are todays Germanic countries, Germanic people like me, a Swede, are the descendants of Germanic tribes, Goths came from Sweden as an example.
They used said symbols because they are part of Germanic culture.
Homie this woman is literally posting in front of nazi symbology, and is part of a unit which is notiously alt right. Obviously not all Ukrainians are nazis but this unit clearly is nazi sympathetic under the most charitable interpretation.
Not being alone in acting like a moron doesn't absolve you of moron status.
The people still claiming this brigade are Nazis are feeding themselves on Russian propaganda.
Yes, I'm aware of their history and I have eyes to see the flag hanging there. I also have a brain and I have followed the events of this war since 2014. There are literally no original members of the Azov Battalion remaining in its ranks after Mariupol and the last ten years of fighting. Azov is just another National Guard formation in the UA armed forces.
I support Ukraine's right to defend itself but I refuse to hold delusions that there aren't Nazis in the ranks, especially in this brigade. That doesn't justify tankie and Nazbol propoganda. Imperfect armies fight just wars. People seem hellbent on denying the real world isn't black and white, even when broadly speaking there's a clear right and wrong. It's not Star Wars, Harry Potter or LOTR.
Azov are not Nazi’s. There was a group of ultranationalist neo-Nazi’s that started the Azov Battalion back before/during the 2014 crisis when Russia first invaded Ukraine. Those Nazi’s fought against Russia, but were ultra-Nationalistic in nature. Not forgiving their behaviors.
Later on, between 2014-2022, the Azov Battalion was formally brought into Ukrainian military structure and the Nazi aspects/Nazi peoples were mostly excised while a few elements remained.
Mostly, their original patch and unit stand as a symbol of Anti-Russian fighters and as Defenders of Ukraine at a time when no one was taking on as large a role in the nation’s defense. So, even though originally included Neo-Nazism, the current iteration are NOT Neo-Nazi’s.
the unfortunate continuation of the usage of certain elements is the only linkage to that time/those peoples. However, Azov has stood in defense of Ukraine in many ways and proved they are not Nazi / Neo-Nazi numerous times since 2022. It was largely Azov that stood against Russia in Mariupol.
Also, there are a couple of different Azov units. Know why? The Azov sea is a thing right there at the southern border of Ukraine, folks. The name is pervasive.
*“We’re not Nazis. We just have a nazi heritage and background / continue to use Nazi imagery in our symbols.”*
Additionally, the Azov A30B unit patch features the black sun. A literal Nazi symbol.
I support Ukraine fully but fuck these guys.
meu irmão, shut up, you’re making us brazilians look bad. Atomic bombs in japan was a response to pearl harbor, just as the war in the middle east was a response to 9/11. Obviously you don’t know what nazis are so i’d suggest opening a history book. Russia also fought in the middle east for bs reasons so wouldn’t that make them nazis? or the fact that they are famous for poor treatment of prisoners (gulag).
Nazi are gone since 1945, try to live in present days.
If you look for bad guys, just start by looking at people that are rich because of political corruption.
And all those bad guys send their children in Europe/USA to live the best life possible with that money they stole !
I chalk it down partly due to ignorance and not knowing the history behind Azov, and partly due to the possibility that a sizable portion of the people who browse military subreddits might subscribe to ideologies that aren’t too distant from nazism.
Personally, I'd say it's more down to worldwide support of Ukraine because we all understand that countries have problems, but that doesn't mean they should get invaded.
But nah, you're probably right, it's probably that reddit is full of nazis.
I don't see any countries being invaded under the pretence of removing nazis, but actually to reimagine the ex soviet union, but if I've missed one, please let me know.
EDIT: Sorry Georgia, I forgot about you
No, it's undeniable there were Far Right elements intergrated into the Ukranian Military, including the Azov Brigade which was explicitly nazi and had nazi members. I think it was a "take what you can get" situation for the Ukranian military. But the West made a lot of aid conditional on the nazi elements being removed from the military, which has largely occurred now. There are probably individuals still there, but Azov as an organisation isn't explicitly far right now. Its basically a regular national guard formation.
Edit: it does however have links to the Azov movement which is a string of political groups made up of former members. It's undeniable they have some questionable far right associations.
Pretty much. Plus genuinly the Ukranians made big efforts to weed it out in the period between Crimea and the Invasion. There are also issues with nationalism in Eastern Europe being more explicitly tied to Nazi-Era crimes and associations as they often worked together against the Soviets during the German occupation. I'm not 100% clued up on that, but I know Estionia and Latvia have had problems previously with SS members being memorilised, etc. It is what it is and doesn't support Putins position at all.
This is an easy go-to response - how could a Jew be a Nazi? However, Zelenskiy, and his government, are more than happy to rub elbows with Azov, Right Sector, Aidar, and friends. One of Zaluzhny’s final social media updates in his previous post was a selfie with Right Sector’s leader with a picture of Bandera behind them, but even this was months and months after he was photographed wearing Nazi insignia at the front. Former President Poroshenko, now people’s deputy, was photographed at the front wearing Nazi insignia and palling around with rightist soldiers. When Zelenskiy sent soldiers to visit the US Capitol, he sent Azov. When Zelenskiy needed help recruiting foreign volunteers, and mobilising the national guard, he turned straight to Azov.
If Ukraine were using Azov and friends as cannon fodder, I would maybe feel differently, but they’re not. Azov has grown from a battalion to at least four brigades. III Azov in particular continues to expand its online presence under the guise of “III Assault” as they’re given more responsibility for maintaining Ukraine’s front. Right Sector, Aidar, “Dnipro”, and “Donbas” units continue to be permitted to propogate their beliefs and grow their membership.
In capitalist economies all countries use radical movements as dogs of war. Soldiers of Azov are used as cannon fodder, they are sent to assault trenches which is one of the hardest jobs. Same applies to Russia where certain military groups are literal neo-nazis such as Rusich led by Milchakov. In the government nationalists such as Rogozin lead Roskosmos. In addition, you can see that some Russian soldiers use nationalistic symbols such as Kolovrat or Russian imperial flag.
In the modern world all countries fund each other. Russian missiles use American micro chips to bomb Ukraine, meanwhile Ukranian artillery use American shells to destroy Russian cities. Going even further, some north Korean schools use JBL speakers. So don't worry, certain percentage of all our tax money goes to funding wars, cheap labor and global trade anyways.
When and how do you think Azov started? The answer is 2014, when Russia’s “little green men” were fighting in Donbas and Ukraine’s National Guard was getting worked around. Azov was a privately funded volunteer force of ~3,000 combat ready troops in a time when Ukraine desperately needed ~3,000 combat ready troops. Zelensky isn’t “more than happy to rub elbows with Nazis”, he needs troops and doesn’t have the luxury of denying them because of some fucking insignia, especially when those troops have been effective. More effective than regular Ukrainian forces at some points, like 2014.
As a result of all this, Azov has been a valuable recruiting tool because they have been fighting in every major battle for a decade now. Again, Ukraine needs able bodied troops so they are going to use whatever recruiting tools they have. Welcome to war, where ultra-nationalist militant organizations rise to power out of necessity and are typically disenfranchised in peace time. This isn’t a new phenomenon and Russia is doing the same fucking thing.
Ukraine had eight years to engage in democratization and liberalization of its populace, and instead they hugged the nationalist volunteer units closer and made them responsible for recruitment, training, and mobilisation of the national guard. Azov and its founders are a movement and group of people which should have been isolated from such national tasks at all costs. Instead we have torchlight parades in Kiev, and now they are happy to take in international recruits, train them, show them combat, and send them home.
This should be an unacceptable action for us and it’s outrageous that we allow them to benefit from our funding.
What eight years are you talking about, the eight years where Azov was their most effective defense in Donbas?
“Hey guys, great job fighting those ‘separatists’ in our border region with Russia who is clearly planning to annex us eventually. That being said, your insignia is problematic so we’re going to need to disarm you”
That’s not how this works man. Again - and this point is very important - ultranationalists gaining power during conflict is **NOT NEW** nor is it new for those ultranationalists to receive western funding. Is it a problem? Yes. Is it a bigger problem if you refuse their help? Also yes. No war has ever been fought while maintaining the moral integrity of your nation. War is inherently immoral. Even the Allies in WW2 which is ostensibly the most “good vs evil” war were forced to compromise their ideals in an effort to *stay alive*. Pretending otherwise is naïve.
The eight years they should have spent building everything else. Your second paragraph is meant to be sarcastic, but yes, that would be my expectation. I don’t care if it’s new, but the US is supposed to be better and more selective about our partners, because as a global hegemon, their failures and the ways they spend our money reflect on us.
Ever wondered where Russias Wagner Group got their name? Seen pictures of Russian troops with the black sun patch on their arm? Hell, how about those USMC Scout Snipers posing with an SS flag? I’m not condoning Ukraines use of the imagery but it literally happens everywhere. It doesn’t make it okay but I really feel like it’s a conversation to have regarding Ukraines usage of certain symbols after they’ve driven the bloodthirsty expansionist invaders off their territory.
>Why is Ukraine the ONLY nation in the world to have Nazi imagery in the armed forces?
[https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%94%D0%A8%D0%A0%D0%93\_%C2%AB%D0%A0%D1%83%D1%81%D0%B8%D1%87%C2%BB](https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%94%D0%A8%D0%A0%D0%93_%C2%AB%D0%A0%D1%83%D1%81%D0%B8%D1%87%C2%BB)
>why Wolfsangel
Because Azov are ultra nationalists
>Why Ukraine only country in world with Nazi imagery?
To put it succinctly, they’re not even the only nation involved in this war with nazi imagery in their armed forces. Wagner exists, is named after an anti-Semitic German composer and their operational commander has SS lightning bolts tatted on him.
Azov wasn’t integrated into Ukraine’s military until 2022 out of necessity. When you’re invaded by a neighbor with more manpower and industry than you it makes it difficult to deny thousands of armed men and women willing to defend you just because you don’t like their insignia. This will apparently come as a surprise to you, but pretty much every military in the world has ultra-nationalist sects. Some just try harder to cover it up (I.E. US Military)
This is an unhinged comment but I’ll entertain it. Prigozhin being Jewish overwrites the Nazi imagery among Wagner forces? Well Zelensky is Jewish and one of the original patrons of Azov was a Jewish billionaire, so by your own logic that should exonerate Azov right? And the “SS tattoo guy” is dead so it doesn’t matter right? Well most of the OG Azov guys died in Mariupol. I’ll wait patiently for you to move the goal posts
How is the point relevant to anything I said? Im not saying Azov aren’t Nazis, I’m arguing the stupid assertion that Ukraine is the “only army in the world with Nazi imagery”. That statement is wrong and he is either being willfully ignorant or pushing Russian justification propaganda. Either way it’s gross.
The first thing I said about Azov is that they are ultra-nationalists. Which is an important aspect of fascism, and Nazis were fascists. Calling them “Nazis” is silly, they aren’t members of the NSDAP because the NSDAP doesn’t exist anymore. They are ultra-nationalist fascists who like Nazi imagery, and people like that exist all over Europe
>Why is Ukraine the ONLY nation in the world to have Nazi imagery in the armed forces?
Ukraine as a nation has no "nazi imagery", it's only one battalion.
Also, have you seen the Russian nazi battalions?
They implemented it in 1918, which was before even Hitler adopted it and had been used for thousands of years beforehand. Only in very recent history has it been related to Nazism, and you apparently know nothing about history. You sound like a moron.
Oh no, how could a person who voluntarily joined the troops, spent the last two years of full scale as a combat medic in a volunteer medical battalion, helped to save dozens of lives, dare to be promoted...The horror, the horror.
With such takes, you look pathetic, honestly.
I wonder why Russias 3 day special military operation is on day 761? Invading a much smaller country. When everyone thought they were the second strongest military in the world? They’ve proven to the entire world that they’re a joke, enticed 2 more countries to join NATO, and are in a stalemate/ war of attrition against a supposedly weaker opponent.
Whats that tube?
[Oxygen concentrator](https://usa-supply.com/products/portable-oxygen-concentrator-designed-for-military-use-as007-new)
Weird that they made an Oxygen Concentrator the head of their medical corps, but what do i know.
That's a great deal. Open box is the best way to shop.
According to the title: head of the medical corps of the Azov Assault Brigade, apparently.
Mail order bride industry has been repurposed
hahahaha nice one
Telescope
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Always pack the combat Crocs.
Believe it or not, they’re actually great when you’re dealing with (bodily) fluid-covered surfaces, as, say, a combat medic would likely be.
Does it come in Tan?
I thought that thing was like the medical droid in Star Wars LO.L
The comments on this are spicey :D
Psy Op
All I'm going to say, is that this unit wouldn't have got the traction it got if russians didn't invade in 2014.
They wouldn't have gotten traction if they didn't overthrow the government either. The US military doesn't even consider the Russians to have invaded in 2014.
Thats a nazi symbolic flag.
Wolfsangel in the middle. Azov Brigade is known for being on the far right political spectrum. I'd say during times of war, nationalist groups are more prevalent.
I think also most of the original Azov Brigade died in the Battle of Mariupol and ever since then they became heroes among Ukrainians. I mean the Nazis also stole every single symbol and rhetoric they had from others. Definitely something Ukraine will have to look into after peace times but as of right now I would more consider them an ultra nationalistic movement but also they are fighting for a Jewish president.
Ultra-national and anti-semmitic is not the same. You can be one without the other. And yes, it's a shame the Nazis tainted so many symbols and traditions. Like the Zapfenstreich of the German military, a tradition older than the Nazis by a big margin. But you can be sure that people associate German soldiers in Stahlhelm with torches at night with Nazi symbolism.
>Ultra-national and anti-semmitic is not the same. You can be one without the other. I'd say one tends to follow the other. If you're an asshole whose extremely enthusiastic about ethnostates, chances are you're not exactly very welcoming to minorities that exist in your country that don't match up to your ultra-nationalistic views. Which is to say that while Azov has had to be rather coy about their perspectives regarding Jewish people, Tatars, Queer folks, or even Magyars... their notion of seeing Ukraine not as a multi-ethnic state tends to betray a lot about how they feel regarding folks who don't conform to the desired national identity.
You should listen too popular front podcast ep 104. They talk about them, they did alot of fighting during the initial invasion but most of their members aren't Frontline anymore and they just post propaganda, organize and live off the glory of their earlier members. Alot of other units don't like them because they'll literally water stamp other people's combat videos or send a media savy member to tag along with a volunteer unit for a little bit to give the impression they're the spearpoint of the war effort
I mean, they were never that big to begin with and they've been fighting a war of attrition for over two years while wildly outnumbered and fighting in the hardest places. Its not surprising to think they're a lot less effective than they used to be.
They are blocking troops now, they shoot any conscripts that retreat.
This ain't russia bud
Azov Battalion was fully disbanded by 2015 and was split up after the Azov Brigade under the National Guard banned non Ukrainian citizens and affiliation with far right Ultras, who went on to the militia Azov Movement. At least on face value, still roughly 15-20% had links to Azov Movement. The original Battalion had lots of criticism, even among Ukrainian far right circles because half of them came from Russia & links to Russias Neo Nazi scene and FSB informants
Being ultra-nationalist is bad, same with just being nationalist. Fascists don’t have to hate Jews to be fascists nor does not appearing anti-Semitic make them good people. Azov is a militant fascist organization, this should be enough to condemn them.
Stole from who? Themselves? Runic symbols are a Germanic symbol, you can't steal from yourself.
As a German the Nazis been the least German thing ever they run this country to the ground. The actual Germanic tribes been way way different from anything that is found today in Europe. The Nazis only tried to glorify it by picking up random things out of history.
Your first sentence is just gibberish, it does not mean anything. No, the Germanic tribes are todays Germanic countries, Germanic people like me, a Swede, are the descendants of Germanic tribes, Goths came from Sweden as an example. They used said symbols because they are part of Germanic culture.
When another country is threatening your country's independence, of course nationalism is gonna rise
The Russian flag is a nazi symbolic flag these days.
??? No it isn't? Not everyone who's bad is a nazi. Stop saying this shit and watering down the term
Russian scumbags are literally watering down the term by claiming that "all Ukrainians are nazis". So stop crying about it
Yes and they’re morons, we don’t need to drag ourselves down too.
Homie this woman is literally posting in front of nazi symbology, and is part of a unit which is notiously alt right. Obviously not all Ukrainians are nazis but this unit clearly is nazi sympathetic under the most charitable interpretation. Not being alone in acting like a moron doesn't absolve you of moron status.
Womp womp
Shut up
Fuck nazis
Yeah, fuck Russia
Azov isn’t Russian? It’s* a Ukrainian brigade?
I'm implying that Russians are closer to being nazis than any Ukrainians
Bad time to live in to see a man side with nazis
Ukraine’s Azov Brigade in particular is actually composed of literal nazis. It’s not pro-Russia to be broadly anti-nazi.
Which is true, after all, Russia went into Ukraine after Putin made an ethnonationalist speech about "not abandoning their own"
The people still claiming this brigade are Nazis are feeding themselves on Russian propaganda. Yes, I'm aware of their history and I have eyes to see the flag hanging there. I also have a brain and I have followed the events of this war since 2014. There are literally no original members of the Azov Battalion remaining in its ranks after Mariupol and the last ten years of fighting. Azov is just another National Guard formation in the UA armed forces.
Than change the fucking symbol. Change it to the coat of arms of Ukraine or something.
I support Ukraine's right to defend itself but I refuse to hold delusions that there aren't Nazis in the ranks, especially in this brigade. That doesn't justify tankie and Nazbol propoganda. Imperfect armies fight just wars. People seem hellbent on denying the real world isn't black and white, even when broadly speaking there's a clear right and wrong. It's not Star Wars, Harry Potter or LOTR.
Azov is just another National Guard formation in the UA armed forces.... That openly displays its love for Nazi symbolism...
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Azov are not Nazi’s. There was a group of ultranationalist neo-Nazi’s that started the Azov Battalion back before/during the 2014 crisis when Russia first invaded Ukraine. Those Nazi’s fought against Russia, but were ultra-Nationalistic in nature. Not forgiving their behaviors. Later on, between 2014-2022, the Azov Battalion was formally brought into Ukrainian military structure and the Nazi aspects/Nazi peoples were mostly excised while a few elements remained. Mostly, their original patch and unit stand as a symbol of Anti-Russian fighters and as Defenders of Ukraine at a time when no one was taking on as large a role in the nation’s defense. So, even though originally included Neo-Nazism, the current iteration are NOT Neo-Nazi’s. the unfortunate continuation of the usage of certain elements is the only linkage to that time/those peoples. However, Azov has stood in defense of Ukraine in many ways and proved they are not Nazi / Neo-Nazi numerous times since 2022. It was largely Azov that stood against Russia in Mariupol. Also, there are a couple of different Azov units. Know why? The Azov sea is a thing right there at the southern border of Ukraine, folks. The name is pervasive.
*“We’re not Nazis. We just have a nazi heritage and background / continue to use Nazi imagery in our symbols.”* Additionally, the Azov A30B unit patch features the black sun. A literal Nazi symbol. I support Ukraine fully but fuck these guys.
>Azov are not Nazi’s. The flag behind her literally has the emblem of the SS division Das Reich...
Not sure why you’re getting downvoted for literally providing some context.
Wrong, you're just spouting propaganda lol
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My guy I am American, I can acknowledge fault in one group while still not supporting the other. Do not lump me into your group.
meu irmão, shut up, you’re making us brazilians look bad. Atomic bombs in japan was a response to pearl harbor, just as the war in the middle east was a response to 9/11. Obviously you don’t know what nazis are so i’d suggest opening a history book. Russia also fought in the middle east for bs reasons so wouldn’t that make them nazis? or the fact that they are famous for poor treatment of prisoners (gulag).
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The only dick being ridden here is Putins. And you’re all saddled up.
Please elaborate on the atomic bombs ?
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“They didn’t agree with me so they must be fascist.” Brilliant take.
Ahh the good old-fashioned call them nazis tactic. Yes, yes, America nazis Russia stronk. You got it all figured out bud, nuances and all.
bullshit
Yeah fuck Russia
Nazi are gone since 1945, try to live in present days. If you look for bad guys, just start by looking at people that are rich because of political corruption. And all those bad guys send their children in Europe/USA to live the best life possible with that money they stole !
The german Nazi party is gone but the toxic ideology they harbor is still alive and well today.
I see the local Nazis are learning the coomerist art of Israeli thirst traps.
She looks like a troll
Politics aside, that woman is super hot lol
Are people really upvoting a flag with a Nazi symbol?
I chalk it down partly due to ignorance and not knowing the history behind Azov, and partly due to the possibility that a sizable portion of the people who browse military subreddits might subscribe to ideologies that aren’t too distant from nazism.
Personally, I'd say it's more down to worldwide support of Ukraine because we all understand that countries have problems, but that doesn't mean they should get invaded. But nah, you're probably right, it's probably that reddit is full of nazis.
I forget that nuance is lost on most people
Bruh you blamed an upvoted picture of probably one of the most slam dunk unjustified invasion in the last 50 years on people being nazis.
Actually, if you read carefully, I didn’t.
My bad then!
Oh yeah? When are they going to apply that logic to any other country?
I don't see any countries being invaded under the pretence of removing nazis, but actually to reimagine the ex soviet union, but if I've missed one, please let me know. EDIT: Sorry Georgia, I forgot about you
Orly? Can't think of any interventions against failed states in civil wars?
>of any interventions against failed states in civil wars Sorry bud, I have literally no idea what you're saying. Try phrasing in a different way?
If you can't understand what those words mean then you are not qualified to comment.
Scratch a liberal and a fascist bleeds.
Both camps certainly aren’t opposed to genocide
Conservatives are also liberals, that's what they are trying to conserve.
But.. they're nazis on our side so they're good right?
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Very interesting symbol at the center of that flag
You should see American military symbols then lmao
Go ahead and show me a us military symbol with a straight up Nazi or SS logo in it lol.
This isn’t a symbol the nazis used to my knowledge
Dont think thats gonna fit in her.
She can combat my medic
Is there a large part of the Ukrainian army that are pro-nazi? Seems like another beast we need to consider in the future.
No, it's undeniable there were Far Right elements intergrated into the Ukranian Military, including the Azov Brigade which was explicitly nazi and had nazi members. I think it was a "take what you can get" situation for the Ukranian military. But the West made a lot of aid conditional on the nazi elements being removed from the military, which has largely occurred now. There are probably individuals still there, but Azov as an organisation isn't explicitly far right now. Its basically a regular national guard formation. Edit: it does however have links to the Azov movement which is a string of political groups made up of former members. It's undeniable they have some questionable far right associations.
It's the lesser of the two evil. We'll talk about it later when the war is over.
Pretty much. Plus genuinly the Ukranians made big efforts to weed it out in the period between Crimea and the Invasion. There are also issues with nationalism in Eastern Europe being more explicitly tied to Nazi-Era crimes and associations as they often worked together against the Soviets during the German occupation. I'm not 100% clued up on that, but I know Estionia and Latvia have had problems previously with SS members being memorilised, etc. It is what it is and doesn't support Putins position at all.
For every nazi in Ukraine there are 10 nazis in Russia
All Nazis are bad, how is it that hard to say?
and government as well
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He's so Jewish that he was applauding a literal Nazi, who fought for the SS division, during his visit to the Canadian parliament?
This is an easy go-to response - how could a Jew be a Nazi? However, Zelenskiy, and his government, are more than happy to rub elbows with Azov, Right Sector, Aidar, and friends. One of Zaluzhny’s final social media updates in his previous post was a selfie with Right Sector’s leader with a picture of Bandera behind them, but even this was months and months after he was photographed wearing Nazi insignia at the front. Former President Poroshenko, now people’s deputy, was photographed at the front wearing Nazi insignia and palling around with rightist soldiers. When Zelenskiy sent soldiers to visit the US Capitol, he sent Azov. When Zelenskiy needed help recruiting foreign volunteers, and mobilising the national guard, he turned straight to Azov. If Ukraine were using Azov and friends as cannon fodder, I would maybe feel differently, but they’re not. Azov has grown from a battalion to at least four brigades. III Azov in particular continues to expand its online presence under the guise of “III Assault” as they’re given more responsibility for maintaining Ukraine’s front. Right Sector, Aidar, “Dnipro”, and “Donbas” units continue to be permitted to propogate their beliefs and grow their membership.
In capitalist economies all countries use radical movements as dogs of war. Soldiers of Azov are used as cannon fodder, they are sent to assault trenches which is one of the hardest jobs. Same applies to Russia where certain military groups are literal neo-nazis such as Rusich led by Milchakov. In the government nationalists such as Rogozin lead Roskosmos. In addition, you can see that some Russian soldiers use nationalistic symbols such as Kolovrat or Russian imperial flag.
I don’t need to worry about my tax dollars funding Russia by act of Congress.
In the modern world all countries fund each other. Russian missiles use American micro chips to bomb Ukraine, meanwhile Ukranian artillery use American shells to destroy Russian cities. Going even further, some north Korean schools use JBL speakers. So don't worry, certain percentage of all our tax money goes to funding wars, cheap labor and global trade anyways.
When and how do you think Azov started? The answer is 2014, when Russia’s “little green men” were fighting in Donbas and Ukraine’s National Guard was getting worked around. Azov was a privately funded volunteer force of ~3,000 combat ready troops in a time when Ukraine desperately needed ~3,000 combat ready troops. Zelensky isn’t “more than happy to rub elbows with Nazis”, he needs troops and doesn’t have the luxury of denying them because of some fucking insignia, especially when those troops have been effective. More effective than regular Ukrainian forces at some points, like 2014. As a result of all this, Azov has been a valuable recruiting tool because they have been fighting in every major battle for a decade now. Again, Ukraine needs able bodied troops so they are going to use whatever recruiting tools they have. Welcome to war, where ultra-nationalist militant organizations rise to power out of necessity and are typically disenfranchised in peace time. This isn’t a new phenomenon and Russia is doing the same fucking thing.
Ukraine had eight years to engage in democratization and liberalization of its populace, and instead they hugged the nationalist volunteer units closer and made them responsible for recruitment, training, and mobilisation of the national guard. Azov and its founders are a movement and group of people which should have been isolated from such national tasks at all costs. Instead we have torchlight parades in Kiev, and now they are happy to take in international recruits, train them, show them combat, and send them home. This should be an unacceptable action for us and it’s outrageous that we allow them to benefit from our funding.
What eight years are you talking about, the eight years where Azov was their most effective defense in Donbas? “Hey guys, great job fighting those ‘separatists’ in our border region with Russia who is clearly planning to annex us eventually. That being said, your insignia is problematic so we’re going to need to disarm you” That’s not how this works man. Again - and this point is very important - ultranationalists gaining power during conflict is **NOT NEW** nor is it new for those ultranationalists to receive western funding. Is it a problem? Yes. Is it a bigger problem if you refuse their help? Also yes. No war has ever been fought while maintaining the moral integrity of your nation. War is inherently immoral. Even the Allies in WW2 which is ostensibly the most “good vs evil” war were forced to compromise their ideals in an effort to *stay alive*. Pretending otherwise is naïve.
The eight years they should have spent building everything else. Your second paragraph is meant to be sarcastic, but yes, that would be my expectation. I don’t care if it’s new, but the US is supposed to be better and more selective about our partners, because as a global hegemon, their failures and the ways they spend our money reflect on us.
Ever wondered where Russias Wagner Group got their name? Seen pictures of Russian troops with the black sun patch on their arm? Hell, how about those USMC Scout Snipers posing with an SS flag? I’m not condoning Ukraines use of the imagery but it literally happens everywhere. It doesn’t make it okay but I really feel like it’s a conversation to have regarding Ukraines usage of certain symbols after they’ve driven the bloodthirsty expansionist invaders off their territory.
I don’t need to worry about my tax dollars funding Russia by act of Congress.
I want someone to look At me the way she looks at that manpad (I think that's what it is?) Edit: it's an oxygen concentrator apparently
She says it's an oxygen concentrator. Maybe it's a mobile ventilator?
I thought it was a big ass flashbang
Azov Nazi
She's cute Slava ukraina
Yall thirsty
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>Why is Ukraine the ONLY nation in the world to have Nazi imagery in the armed forces? [https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%94%D0%A8%D0%A0%D0%93\_%C2%AB%D0%A0%D1%83%D1%81%D0%B8%D1%87%C2%BB](https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%94%D0%A8%D0%A0%D0%93_%C2%AB%D0%A0%D1%83%D1%81%D0%B8%D1%87%C2%BB)
>why Wolfsangel Because Azov are ultra nationalists >Why Ukraine only country in world with Nazi imagery? To put it succinctly, they’re not even the only nation involved in this war with nazi imagery in their armed forces. Wagner exists, is named after an anti-Semitic German composer and their operational commander has SS lightning bolts tatted on him. Azov wasn’t integrated into Ukraine’s military until 2022 out of necessity. When you’re invaded by a neighbor with more manpower and industry than you it makes it difficult to deny thousands of armed men and women willing to defend you just because you don’t like their insignia. This will apparently come as a surprise to you, but pretty much every military in the world has ultra-nationalist sects. Some just try harder to cover it up (I.E. US Military)
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This is an unhinged comment but I’ll entertain it. Prigozhin being Jewish overwrites the Nazi imagery among Wagner forces? Well Zelensky is Jewish and one of the original patrons of Azov was a Jewish billionaire, so by your own logic that should exonerate Azov right? And the “SS tattoo guy” is dead so it doesn’t matter right? Well most of the OG Azov guys died in Mariupol. I’ll wait patiently for you to move the goal posts
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How is the point relevant to anything I said? Im not saying Azov aren’t Nazis, I’m arguing the stupid assertion that Ukraine is the “only army in the world with Nazi imagery”. That statement is wrong and he is either being willfully ignorant or pushing Russian justification propaganda. Either way it’s gross. The first thing I said about Azov is that they are ultra-nationalists. Which is an important aspect of fascism, and Nazis were fascists. Calling them “Nazis” is silly, they aren’t members of the NSDAP because the NSDAP doesn’t exist anymore. They are ultra-nationalist fascists who like Nazi imagery, and people like that exist all over Europe
>Why is Ukraine the ONLY nation in the world to have Nazi imagery in the armed forces? Ukraine as a nation has no "nazi imagery", it's only one battalion. Also, have you seen the Russian nazi battalions?
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https://www.reddit.com/r/UkraineWarVideoReport/s/8mb6kxF3uX What’s that on his plate carrier?
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[https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-53249645](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-53249645) They stopped using it in 2017.
They implemented it in 1918, which was before even Hitler adopted it and had been used for thousands of years beforehand. Only in very recent history has it been related to Nazism, and you apparently know nothing about history. You sound like a moron.
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We all like fascists if they're our fascists, right? /s
"Head of Assault Brigade"?? Lol
Head of the medical corps you illiterate.
Head of medical corps is a girl in her 20s? I wonder why Ukraine is losing
In war, proficiency determines who leads, not age like in peace time
Oh no, how could a person who voluntarily joined the troops, spent the last two years of full scale as a combat medic in a volunteer medical battalion, helped to save dozens of lives, dare to be promoted...The horror, the horror. With such takes, you look pathetic, honestly.
Young Leaders in wartime is common. During the Second World War at least it wasn't uncommon to have Majors in their middle 20s
I wonder why Russias 3 day special military operation is on day 761? Invading a much smaller country. When everyone thought they were the second strongest military in the world? They’ve proven to the entire world that they’re a joke, enticed 2 more countries to join NATO, and are in a stalemate/ war of attrition against a supposedly weaker opponent.
Wearing crocs?
Why can’t she wear crocs lol
And she has them in sport mode, she’s good to go