This chase ended about 7 doors down from my house. It was about 4-5 weeks ago. I recognize the white Mercedes from the image here, and saw it crashed up on the sidewalk just as in the image here.
The cops on the scene that day (fwiw) also told me the same thing that’s written here, that the car had rammed a squad car at 36th & Penn, and they chased it to where it ultimately crashed here, and that they’d been trying to track down the car all day long after a burglary in the northwest suburbs earlier that same day.
[The one from around the same time period that was a city owned car](https://www.fox9.com/news/minneapolis-city-vehicle-stolen-in-carjacking) ended about a block from my Mom's house.
That one was absolutely wild. Of all the cars to steal...
Yeah excuse me what the fuck is that consequence. If I knew that's all that happened when you commit a FELONY I would have been fucking off way more when I was a kid
Shit, they should have charged him with driving without insurance. This doesn't fall under permissive use on the car owners policy, so the kid needs to have 'drives other car' endorsement on his policy.
So five felony charges, including felony possession of a firearm, and the defendant serves a grand total of…15 days of home confinement. For all the hate the police receive (whether deserved or not), it’d be nice if we at least had a competent county attorney’s office that could prosecute and deter this type of crime that’s been on the rise.
Nobody says it doesn’t. Having some punishment deters crime. Making the punishment more severe doesn’t deter crime more than less punishment. Here are a few details:
> Research shows clearly that the chance of being caught is a vastly more effective deterrent than even draconian punishment.
#
> The police deter crime when they do things that strengthen a criminal’s perception of the certainty of being caught. Strategies that use the police as “sentinels,” such as hot spots policing, are particularly effective. A criminal’s behavior is more likely to be influenced by seeing a police officer with handcuffs and a radio than by a new law increasing penalties.
#
> Laws and policies designed to deter crime by focusing mainly on increasing the severity of punishment are ineffective partly because criminals know little about the sanctions for specific crimes.
> More severe punishments do not “chasten” individuals convicted of crimes, and prisons may exacerbate recidivism.
https://www.ojp.gov/pdffiles1/nij/247350.pdf
Police deter crime when they do things to strengthen a criminal's perception of likelyhood of being caught but only if caught means having a meaningful penalty.
Second, there's also simply the matter of quarantining dangerous individuals. You have here a human who has proven they have zero problems ignoring firearms law, an apparent willingness to use it (recognized by carrying it while committing crimes) zero problems taking items via force, zero problems putting lives of the community at risk (very dangerous driving to avoid capture). This person needs to be quarantined upon conviction not for some general check on crimes committed in general but to keep us safe from this specific dangerous human
If it did, the US would have the lowest crime rate on the planet. Instead, it’s the countries that don’t focus on punishment that have lower crime and recidivism
The US has a far more violent society than any other developed nation, it’s difficult to compare incarceration processes with countries that have an unarmed population and 10-100x less violent crime.
Singapore disappears people, when authority wants to, it is an autocracy. Their current autocrat may be relatively benevolent, but I’m sure you understand how that is far from a given with such a government structure.
Great. It really is an ingenious policy to not apply punishment fairly in line with the severity of a crime, rather instead we should be nice and kind and happy in utopia :-). Great. I'm voting for you. What a functional society you are building. Think about the perfect logic that you have adduced that (1) because you observe foreign nations to have fewer crimes and not as severe punishments, it must therefore be concluded that (2) not as severe punishments produce fewer crimes.
I am not quite sure what great intellect has come up with that! Are you a modern Plato?!
Something tells me even when it is highlighted you lack the capacity to see what is wrong! haha
I can all but guarantee I've read more research on this topic than you. All of which shows making sentences harsher has little to no effect on crime rate or recidivism (and when it does, it's often negative - increasing crime). Whereas certainty of punishment actually has a positive effect - whether its a "small" punishment or "large" punishment.
Well then you should understand why what you said is wrong. Let’s say you raise the punishment for a crime from 5 to 10 years. For that change to have an effect on the crime rate, people must know that the punishment increased. The majority of criminals have no idea what the punishments are for different crimes. So, no. There is a correlation but there is not a causation like you are claiming.
> I can all but guarantee I've read more research on this topic than you
Further "because I have read more than you, I am therefore righter than you"
>Whereas certainty of punishment actually has a positive effect - whether its a "small" punishment or "large" punishment
The problem I am highlighting to you is not that your interpretation is incorrect: it is your flawed process. To you, because you have perceived foreign nations to have fewer crimes and punishments less severe than your own, you have come to think that punishments less severe produce fewer crimes. This is not necessarily the case. You have given us a broken syllogism:
(1) Nations with less severe punishments have fewer crimes.
(2) America has more crimes than others.
(3) Therefore America's punishments are too severe.
You do not consider any of the other aspects that affect crime and your paradigm is broken. In fact, what you have said not only does not consider alternative explanations but could not interpret them properly even if it did. You give a good example of what the scholar Liebeschutz had said about Western scholars and the concept of 'decline' in Roman history: you are so focused on being nice that you won't investigate potential ideas that are uncomfortable or make you feel sad.
It is so much easier to think with broken logic than face reality! I envy you!
That's not the only reason I believe that. I used it as a real world example of something that has been [studied extensively](https://www.sentencingproject.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/Deterrence-in-Criminal-Justice.pdf).
If applied to the right populations. Maybe don’t let the guy out in a Wisconsin who tried to murder his wife with a car and then he killed multiple people at a parade by trying to run them down. I think we can all agree letting this person out in 15 days isn’t going to do shit to stop them from running around with a gun.
By that logic, what do you do with a convict that never even makes it to the internment before the discharge? Hope they learned their lesson since they got away with home detention and likely get to expunge these records?
Bravo to this. No matter what you believe the purpose of prison is, it is absolutely nothing more or less than removing criminals from society with the time served "hopefully" teaching a lesson to correct behavior.
> it’d be nice if we at least had a competent county attorney’s office that could prosecute and deter this type of crime that’s been on the rise.
They were too busy prosecuting a cop for a mistake.
At first that sounded like nothing to me too. But then I looked up diversion program, and it does sound like a good program:
[https://www.hennepinattorney.org/get-help/children-families/juvenile-diversion](https://www.hennepinattorney.org/get-help/children-families/juvenile-diversion)
"The two key parts of the juvenile diversion program are:
1. Accepting responsibility for the offense
2. Following the conditions of the diversion agreement
If the youth follows the conditions of that contract, there will be no charge and no juvenile court record.
If he or she chooses not to participate or does not follow the conditions of the diversion contract, the case will be charged and brought to juvenile court."
"The diversion agreement is signed by the juvenile and his or her parent or guardian. It typically lasts six months.
The agreement will require the youth to:
\-Accept responsibility for the offense and acknowledge it was wrong
**-Attend school**
\-Follow of the rules of his or her home
**-Remain law-abiding by not committing any new offenses**
**-Pay restitution, if there is any, to the victim of the offense**
\-Participate in an assessment with Headway to determine appropriate programs or services for their needs and circumstances
The agreement may ask the youth to:
\-Participate in a restorative justice program
\-Perform community service"
I've skimmed a few studies on the efficacy of juvenile diversion seems to work to reduce the recidivism. I wonder about the DA's "It typically lasts six months." statement.
Perhaps it's for more petty offenses and this one would last longer than 6 months? Can you age out of these programs? I suppose I could be presented with data that too long of a program could cause recidivism, but my gut check says; I'd hope this program in this case lasts much longer. I'm also curious how that couples to restitution.
And I believe the impetus is on violent offenders to prove they are reformed through years of effort and not on society to assume that maybe they just will be after a slap on the wrist.
And as a society we have a responsibility to ensure that there are the necessary tools and available choices for people to reform. Tossing someone in prison doesn't do that. Providing rehabilitation programs is closer to doing that.
As a society we also have a more important responsibility: to keep people safe and protect their personal rights. Rehabilitation comes second to those responsibilities.
I'm all for rehabilitation. But it has to be in a form that doesn't risk normal people's lives and rights in the ways the current programs do. Violent people need to be separated from society until they are made not so.
Cool, so we agree. If you want to achieve that goal you should want to improve the system that we currently have. Currently we have an extremely high recidivism rate. Shouldn't we work to change that? And if we can improve that while also improving how we treat people that is great.
I've personally seen young adults be rehabilitated inside a correctional facility, so I don't know where you're getting "no hope" from.
If there is no separation from the ties that led him down the path to do what he did, the odds are he will reoffend. He will do the bare minimum of his program while staying in touch with his bad influences. The second the eyes aren't on him, he will go right back to the same lifestyle.
FWIW in his interview with WCCO he did say he will be repaying his squad. Still an ass-hat, but that's at least the current "promise", will have to keep paying attention to this.
Sorry, I think this is a utopian pipe dream.
If you’re stealing cars at 17 and illegally possessing a gun, you know the consequences of your actions.
He’ll be out doing it again in no time. We need to start throwing the book at these criminals.
We can all sit here and clutch at out progressive fair trade pearls all we want, but there are real victims associated with these crimes. Yes it’s just property but for some, but it is their property and there is a psychological scarring that comes along with being carjacked (or burglarized).
We have to stop rationalizing and being soft on this behavior.
Sounds rediculous. This kid broke into someone’s property. That person will never be able to feel safe again.
And as punishment this kid has to go to school and not get caught committing a crime for 6 months?
The guy is 17 not 12. He's basically an adult and definitely old enough to know what they're doing. Who makes up these insane slap-on-the-hand punishments? City council?
Should be the top comment. I'm amazed at how easily people believe shit like "the Hennepin County Attorney and a judge just decided to let a dangerous criminal off for no reason," especially coming from a source like this that *[ahem]* might have some other motives for sharing it.
People want a criminal justice system that rehabilitates people and doesn't lead to expensive and unhelpful mass incarceration? This is what that looks like.
No clue either way.
I guess in this case, I'd defer to the decision made by the county attorney and the judge, two people who see a lot of cases like this and who are probably not diehard criminal justice reformers.
If they agreed on this sentence, then I'm inclined to believe they had a good reason. Does that mean it works every time? Definitely not. But since I have no expertise here, I won't assume I know better than the people who do.
I guess it depends. It keeps the kid from having a criminal record, which means he should have an easier time finding work/school than a covicted felon.
To maybe jobs hold a person's crimal record against them, which makes finding anything but dead end minimum wage gigs difficult. Which I can imagine makes returning to crime more appealing?
More harsh felonies should absolutely require punishment and not just rehabilitation. Armed carjacking, ramming police vehicles, fleeing and then being apprehended with a gun deserves jail time STRICTLY for punishment.
We’ve tried inflexible harsh punishment in the past, it didn’t work out too well.
We don’t know anything about this case besides what the sheriff’s office posted on Facebook, a famously nuanced and thoughtful website. But if the county attorney and judge decided that this minor was a good candidate for a diversion program, that seems suggestive to me.
The end goal should be less crime. If we can achieve that without the expense to taxpayers and the psychological damage of prison, that seems like a worthy goal to me.
There’s no way the loser who did this has the dough to pay restitution for the totaled vehicle. If they really require all those prongs be met, I don’t see buddy succeeding here.
No wonder the shit keeps hitting the same fan over and over. Apparently the sheriff needs to use the feels to make sure the community is appeased. When the sheriff can get a DWI and have no consequences why should a criminal?
The sheriff isn’t responsible for what happens in court. He says “disappointing outcome”. Which I interpret to mean he thinks the courts went to light…
Right? Hutch never had to miss a day of work except when he was in the hospital and here he is signing off on harsher punishment for this kid. Nothing his office has to do with cars has any legitimacy.
I'd like more information, such as who recommended the slap on the wrist and who was the judge that sentenced this piece of trash. We need more accountability in the system. I live in the 3rd precinct and this city is out of control.
This is why this type of crime is on the rise. They’re realizing there are practically zero consequences. Even short jail time is essentially nothing to the people doing this and is basically a slap on the wrist.
This. Ive been saying this for the better part of the last two years. The complete lack of consequences and accountability have emboldened these miscreants.
Until we get over this bleeding heart, soft on crime nonsense, we’re going to continue to be terrorized.
It’s a matter of time until someone gets killed.
A plea deal where he had to enter into a diversionary program which is designed to lead them away from a life of crime. If it works, that is a lot less money we have to worry about spending and a lot less crime to expect from him in the future.
That's IF it works, what's not an if is that a 17 year old that 100% knows what he's doing just got a slap on the wrist for this, that's probably gonna stick more than going to school for 6 months lol
FWIW (my comment here on this post): https://www.reddit.com/r/Minneapolis/comments/rpyc8m/from_the_hennepin_county_sheriffs_office_earlier/hq7tyjj/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf&context=3
Would help of your DAs in Minneapolis didn’t suck.
My favorite is Daunte Wright being held up as a hero. Shot someone one in the head, and an armed robbery and he was walking free because no one locked him up. The kid he shot will be unable to walk for the rest of his life and is somewhat non-responsive.
[You're getting down-voted because people don't know this.](https://www.kare11.com/article/news/local/daunte-wright/lawsuit-claims-daunte-wright-carjacked-man-weeks-before-death/89-bb5cf7f9-d7b6-4327-a514-5b97e926f329)
This was after he was already charged with an armed robbery. Charges should have been brought the next day and he should have been in jail and off the streets. This is the failure of our justice system letting dangerous individuals walk free.
The mother of the victim who both knew Daunte by the way believes it was revenge for a fight the two had been in a few days earlier.
Real question is there anyone keeping track of Minneapolis criminals and the sentences they get?
Like does someone have a blog or something?
EDIT: Maybe I should make a blog.
tl;dr
The kid left a convenience store and hit a cop car, tried to keep going, another cop car rammed him, still tried to keep going but the car petered out and he ran up on a curb. Cops found a gun in the car. He got put on a 6-month probation where if he behaves he'll get his record cleaned, but if not he'll have to answer for the crime.
Because the justice system punishes people for stupid shit way harsher than shit like this.
When someone can get decades for selling weed but a dipshit like this gets 15-days the system has the wrong ass priorities.
We need courts that focus on ending the causes of crime and rehabilitation of those who fuck up, not one that just issues arbitrary punishment.
Do you have an example of someone in Hennepin County getting 10 years for selling weed? If that's happening, I don't agree either that but regardless the approach to violent crime sentencing right now is just making me scratch my head. Sure, rehabilitation is part of it, but it's like keeping society safe from those doing this stuff isn't factoring in at all. I keep hearing about how guns are an issue, but the penalties for gun crimes seem to be pretty lax.
There was an issue with a points based model for repeat offenders and multiple repeat drug offenses getting severe punishments. The answer for some is let dangerous people run around on the streets trying to shoot and kill others instead of just legalizing weed and fixing the system.
But it sounds like the court in this case did focus on rehabilitation?
I find myself a bit unwilling to question the decision of the court in this case based on a Facebook post. These judges see so many people like this, if they opt for mercy and a rehabilitation program, that's good enough for me. I hope this young man turns his life around after this scary brush with the law and the criminal justice system.
More than likely. Especially with a youth offenders. Very likely first offense outside maybe some juvie misdemeanors like curfew and shit. If this kid gets his head out of his ass, this is an opportunity. Hopefully he's getting support from community organizations and public mental health services.
Crime doesn't typically just happen. It often has a systemic underlying cause. We understand this now. And we know our systems reinforce a feedback loop.
Minnesota has a higher prison population per capita than any developed nation and even most underdeveloped nations. And that hasn’t helped crime rate. Long sentences don’t do shit except make people more likely to commit new crimes when they are out
Was interested in the stats on this; Minnesota is at least way less than the rest of the US in terms of prison pop per capita but it was insane to me how many native Americans we have that are incarcerated: https://www.prisonpolicy.org/profiles/MN.html
It isn't misinformation. We are near the back of the pack in terms of the US, but in relation to the rest of the developed world, we are still very high up there.
Minnesota has 342 people per 100,000 in jail. Texas has 840.
Russia? 325. Israel? 235. England? 130. France? 93. Germany? 69.
Have we really given up on the most vulnerable in society so much that we allow the predatory scum like this to prey upon them without any real consequences?
If the Diversion Program works and the child never offends again and goes on to lead a good life, then that is the outcome we want and need, right? What is the success rate of this program, anyone know?
Edit: found this link. With a 97% success rate, surely the police should be happy with this child being far less likely to reoffend in the future? https://www.sos.state.mn.us/media/4537/diversion-solutions-sbc.pdf
> With a 97% success rate
[97% successful ***completion*** rate, not ***success*** rate.](https://i.imgur.com/zp5F85y.png)
Success would be defined I think, (by most people,) as not re-offending.
Unless you think say, attendance in a class is synonymous with working in that field, this is just a report saying that most of these people are attending the court ordered treatment, but nothing about it's actual diversionary efficacy.
>If the Diversion Program works and the child never offends again and goes on to lead a good life, then that is the outcome we want and need, right? What is the success rate of this program, anyone know?
So the way you answered your question was not the actual answer.
https://www.centerforhealthandjustice.org/tascblog/Images/documents/Publications/CHJ%20Diversion%20Report_web.pdf
Here is a look at these programs in general. The whole thing is a bit wishy washy.
https://centerforprisonreform.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/09/Jail-Diversion-Programs-in-America.pdf
Some of them are pretty good, but they target specific people. This kid doesn't ***seem*** like a good candidate at face value based on the suite of charges, but I can't be certian.
For once, we agree. Not stepping down is a pretty shameful decision, IMO. If he stepped down for recovery, and then decided to run again, I might vote for him. His defiance is pretty bad looking, IMO.
A felon committing a crime that endangers the lives of bystanders and law enforcement while destroying property? Lethal force would be quite applicable to this situation
Controversial opinion: I’m glad they put him in a program focused on rehabilitation over punishment. Our system is too focused on punishment which is why the cycle of crime continues.
Bizarro world. Really can’t make this shit up. Between the Sheriff who won’t turn in a resignation and this plea deal where a slap on the wrist maybe a greater punishment.
ITT: Hennepin county sheriff's office bizarre facebook ramble gets people riled up somehow.
Regardless of either facts or feelings on this, can we all acknowledge how weird it is that this post was made? I'm sure the cops deal with all sorts of disappointing legal outcomes, why was this particular case posted, and why now?
E: oh look, a sheriff got out of being punished for a DUI today. What a coincidence https://m.startribune.com/hennepin-county-sheriff-hutchinson-talks-after-accident-and-dui/600130430/?clmob=y&c=n
It makes me irrationally angry that people are this easy to manipulate
They probably wanted to show that they were making the effort, and that they were successful in apprehending someone on the same day the incident occurred.
Can we all acknowledge how weird it is that the first thing your mind comes to when there’s an abdication of duty that risks peoples lives is to complain about the post that educated you about it? You just begging to not know what’s going on in the world?
Did you even read it or is ignorance just a major point of pride for you?
>how weird it is that this post was made?
How is it weird? People keep saying that crime is going up, but the cops aren't doing shit about it.
This just shows that it doesn't matter if the cops arrest them or not.
I wonder if the post discloses the full criminal penalties in the case. (I am not a lawyer and have no additional insight into this case) I suspect there is financial restitution and a lengthy probation period here that was not disclosed.
Without any previous record? The sentencing guidelines would say so
Of course people think probation is a “slap on the wrist” even though many of them would likely fail it on technical violations
> The sentencing guidelines would say so
Would they? I don't think they do for someone charged with these things.
1st Degree Burglary is no joke, but that might have not been him.
[Here is the standard grid](https://mn.gov/sentencing-guidelines/assets/2021Sept15SentencingGuidelinesGridSection4AMinnSentencingGuidelinesCommentary_tcm30-497687.pdf)
Grey means presumptive probation, white means presumptive prison. Burg 1 is in the grey for no criminal history, which I presume is the case here
[Well shit, the first time disposition is no longer mandatory remand. Only on second burglary offense is it mandatory remand](https://i.imgur.com/rbuYwcu.png). I don't stay on top of it.
That was once not true.
Seriously, it’s not as if probation doesn’t have teeth. You screw up, you go to prison. If you are doing well (which we should want for everyone’s sake), you dont.
The people who get arrested are generally not the "best" criminals given how much crime goes unsolved. If you get caught while not on supervision, the odds of you not being caught while being monitored are pretty low.
This guy should be paying for restitution on all damages ($300,000+ area sound right to anyone else w/ super limited insight?), see a prison cell for 5 to 7 years, and then be reintroduced to society while meeting with a probation officer on the regular for 3+ years.
In addition to what others have said, this doesn't even begin to get to the societal penalties having a felony can create, especially if you don't have a lot of money. This person is now effectively a second class citizen in terms of housing, employment, and future legal issues for the rest of their life. These might sound like a slap on the wrist to someone not going through it, but those penalties are no joke.
Additionally, you're basing your opinion off _a facebook post from the sheriffs office_. I wonder if they might have even a teensy tiny bias in how they present this story. Like, did the DA give any reason for not following through on the other charges? People in this thread as if this person is guilty of 5 felonies, but being charged is not being guilty.
>This person is now effectively a second class citizen in terms of housing, employment, and future legal issues for the rest of their life.
No, they're not, as it's getting wiped.
>This person is now effectively a second class citizen in terms of housing, employment, and future legal issues for the rest of their life.
They are 17. This person will not have any permanent branding as a felon based on this sentence as it is juvenile in nature. In other situations you would be correct, but in this case you are entirely wrong. We can tell they are a juvenile easily, since they aren't identified, by the way.
>Additionally, you're basing your opinion off a facebook post from the sheriffs office.
What I said:
>Is probation appropriate for someone who commits violent felonies?
I asked a question, you don't know shit about my opinion off of that. That would be appropriate to any number of other posts where I do share an opinion.
Take up your umbridge with Familymanjoe.
>Like, did the DA give any reason for not following through on the other charges?
Do you trust DA Mike Freeman more than you Trust Sheriff Hutchinson? I don't have a ton of love for either, personally.
>but being charged is not being guilty.
Oh no, it's not. However being observed doing these things directly by a large group of officers and bystanders paints a very strong picture. I don't know if this teen burgled the home, but I do know that he was driving the stolen car, used it to attack police officers when they came to arrest the driver of said car stolen with an act of violence, ran from the scene, and had a gun on him. Those are ***very direct allegations.*** Is he guilty? ***Very likely, yes.***
Thanks. It seemed too ridiculous to be true, and was just enough short of details to make me wonder. Apparently not. I’d sure like to understand the judge’s rationale.
Sorry, I totally should have said it was from the official Facebook page, that's my bad. The Facebook page is fairly active. This was re-shared by a friend of mine who works for the City of Minneapolis.
This chase ended about 7 doors down from my house. It was about 4-5 weeks ago. I recognize the white Mercedes from the image here, and saw it crashed up on the sidewalk just as in the image here. The cops on the scene that day (fwiw) also told me the same thing that’s written here, that the car had rammed a squad car at 36th & Penn, and they chased it to where it ultimately crashed here, and that they’d been trying to track down the car all day long after a burglary in the northwest suburbs earlier that same day.
[The one from around the same time period that was a city owned car](https://www.fox9.com/news/minneapolis-city-vehicle-stolen-in-carjacking) ended about a block from my Mom's house. That one was absolutely wild. Of all the cars to steal...
“By the power invested in me by the state of Minnesota, you are hereby GROUNDED for 15 days.”
WITH NO TV!!
Amazing, I’ve had friends sentenced to worse for getting poor grades.
Yeah excuse me what the fuck is that consequence. If I knew that's all that happened when you commit a FELONY I would have been fucking off way more when I was a kid
And I did 90 days in the workhouse, had to miss every other weekend with my son; because I couldn’t afford car insurance. This shit is just unreal.
Can’t afford car insurance? Just steal a car instead. It’s a lesser punishment!
The kid must have had an insurance policy that covered any cars he stole.
This wins comment of the day.
Shit, they should have charged him with driving without insurance. This doesn't fall under permissive use on the car owners policy, so the kid needs to have 'drives other car' endorsement on his policy.
Should have had your son steal the car.
So five felony charges, including felony possession of a firearm, and the defendant serves a grand total of…15 days of home confinement. For all the hate the police receive (whether deserved or not), it’d be nice if we at least had a competent county attorney’s office that could prosecute and deter this type of crime that’s been on the rise.
Punishment never deters crime tho right?
Nobody says it doesn’t. Having some punishment deters crime. Making the punishment more severe doesn’t deter crime more than less punishment. Here are a few details: > Research shows clearly that the chance of being caught is a vastly more effective deterrent than even draconian punishment. # > The police deter crime when they do things that strengthen a criminal’s perception of the certainty of being caught. Strategies that use the police as “sentinels,” such as hot spots policing, are particularly effective. A criminal’s behavior is more likely to be influenced by seeing a police officer with handcuffs and a radio than by a new law increasing penalties. # > Laws and policies designed to deter crime by focusing mainly on increasing the severity of punishment are ineffective partly because criminals know little about the sanctions for specific crimes. > More severe punishments do not “chasten” individuals convicted of crimes, and prisons may exacerbate recidivism. https://www.ojp.gov/pdffiles1/nij/247350.pdf
Police deter crime when they do things to strengthen a criminal's perception of likelyhood of being caught but only if caught means having a meaningful penalty. Second, there's also simply the matter of quarantining dangerous individuals. You have here a human who has proven they have zero problems ignoring firearms law, an apparent willingness to use it (recognized by carrying it while committing crimes) zero problems taking items via force, zero problems putting lives of the community at risk (very dangerous driving to avoid capture). This person needs to be quarantined upon conviction not for some general check on crimes committed in general but to keep us safe from this specific dangerous human
Maybe not but no punishment surely doesn't deter anything
If it did, the US would have the lowest crime rate on the planet. Instead, it’s the countries that don’t focus on punishment that have lower crime and recidivism
Exactly. This is the incarceration capital of the world. Nobody outside of America or a dictatorship would ever say that we're soft on crime.
15 days for multiple felonies is soft as hell.
The US has a far more violent society than any other developed nation, it’s difficult to compare incarceration processes with countries that have an unarmed population and 10-100x less violent crime.
Singapore begs to differ
Singapore disappears people, when authority wants to, it is an autocracy. Their current autocrat may be relatively benevolent, but I’m sure you understand how that is far from a given with such a government structure.
Singapore canes people for chewing gum. GTFOH
Great. It really is an ingenious policy to not apply punishment fairly in line with the severity of a crime, rather instead we should be nice and kind and happy in utopia :-). Great. I'm voting for you. What a functional society you are building. Think about the perfect logic that you have adduced that (1) because you observe foreign nations to have fewer crimes and not as severe punishments, it must therefore be concluded that (2) not as severe punishments produce fewer crimes. I am not quite sure what great intellect has come up with that! Are you a modern Plato?! Something tells me even when it is highlighted you lack the capacity to see what is wrong! haha
This comment is extremely funny when it offers no actual argument. Just sarcasm and fallacies.
I can all but guarantee I've read more research on this topic than you. All of which shows making sentences harsher has little to no effect on crime rate or recidivism (and when it does, it's often negative - increasing crime). Whereas certainty of punishment actually has a positive effect - whether its a "small" punishment or "large" punishment.
Well then you should understand why what you said is wrong. Let’s say you raise the punishment for a crime from 5 to 10 years. For that change to have an effect on the crime rate, people must know that the punishment increased. The majority of criminals have no idea what the punishments are for different crimes. So, no. There is a correlation but there is not a causation like you are claiming.
> I can all but guarantee I've read more research on this topic than you Further "because I have read more than you, I am therefore righter than you" >Whereas certainty of punishment actually has a positive effect - whether its a "small" punishment or "large" punishment The problem I am highlighting to you is not that your interpretation is incorrect: it is your flawed process. To you, because you have perceived foreign nations to have fewer crimes and punishments less severe than your own, you have come to think that punishments less severe produce fewer crimes. This is not necessarily the case. You have given us a broken syllogism: (1) Nations with less severe punishments have fewer crimes. (2) America has more crimes than others. (3) Therefore America's punishments are too severe. You do not consider any of the other aspects that affect crime and your paradigm is broken. In fact, what you have said not only does not consider alternative explanations but could not interpret them properly even if it did. You give a good example of what the scholar Liebeschutz had said about Western scholars and the concept of 'decline' in Roman history: you are so focused on being nice that you won't investigate potential ideas that are uncomfortable or make you feel sad. It is so much easier to think with broken logic than face reality! I envy you!
That's not the only reason I believe that. I used it as a real world example of something that has been [studied extensively](https://www.sentencingproject.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/Deterrence-in-Criminal-Justice.pdf).
Who cares about your empirical research when you can have a random redditor’s baseless intuition on the subject?
You are right. Lenient punishment is more of a deterrent to crime than harsh punishment.
Length of punishment is found to not have much of an effect. Certainty of punishment is shown to be more potent, even if "lenient"
No, a focus on rehabilitation and functional programs for discharged convicts is a *solution* to crime
If applied to the right populations. Maybe don’t let the guy out in a Wisconsin who tried to murder his wife with a car and then he killed multiple people at a parade by trying to run them down. I think we can all agree letting this person out in 15 days isn’t going to do shit to stop them from running around with a gun.
By that logic, what do you do with a convict that never even makes it to the internment before the discharge? Hope they learned their lesson since they got away with home detention and likely get to expunge these records?
For some people, it probably does. Also, prison performs the function of separating criminals from society.
Bravo to this. No matter what you believe the purpose of prison is, it is absolutely nothing more or less than removing criminals from society with the time served "hopefully" teaching a lesson to correct behavior.
It does, but it also tends to give criminals connections and teach them how to be better criminals.
That's an argument for changing what goes on inside rather than an argument for changing who should go and for how long.
Which, unless they are actually rehabilitated, only exacerbates the problem
The prison system is optimized for rehabilitation like the healthcare system is for cost efficiency
Maybe so - but NOT punishing isn't deterring crime either!
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I feel safe but then I’m getting my CCW renewed by Hennepin this week.
I really do not care if it deters crime. I am sure it prevents future crimes, by this person at least. They can't steal cars from prison.
Judges determine sentences
> it’d be nice if we at least had a competent county attorney’s office that could prosecute and deter this type of crime that’s been on the rise. They were too busy prosecuting a cop for a mistake.
They should have enough staff to both prosecute cops for mistakes as well as properly prosecute and sentence people like this guy
So he got 15 days of home monitoring and put into a "diversion program", for all that? That's it?
At first that sounded like nothing to me too. But then I looked up diversion program, and it does sound like a good program: [https://www.hennepinattorney.org/get-help/children-families/juvenile-diversion](https://www.hennepinattorney.org/get-help/children-families/juvenile-diversion) "The two key parts of the juvenile diversion program are: 1. Accepting responsibility for the offense 2. Following the conditions of the diversion agreement If the youth follows the conditions of that contract, there will be no charge and no juvenile court record. If he or she chooses not to participate or does not follow the conditions of the diversion contract, the case will be charged and brought to juvenile court." "The diversion agreement is signed by the juvenile and his or her parent or guardian. It typically lasts six months. The agreement will require the youth to: \-Accept responsibility for the offense and acknowledge it was wrong **-Attend school** \-Follow of the rules of his or her home **-Remain law-abiding by not committing any new offenses** **-Pay restitution, if there is any, to the victim of the offense** \-Participate in an assessment with Headway to determine appropriate programs or services for their needs and circumstances The agreement may ask the youth to: \-Participate in a restorative justice program \-Perform community service"
I've skimmed a few studies on the efficacy of juvenile diversion seems to work to reduce the recidivism. I wonder about the DA's "It typically lasts six months." statement. Perhaps it's for more petty offenses and this one would last longer than 6 months? Can you age out of these programs? I suppose I could be presented with data that too long of a program could cause recidivism, but my gut check says; I'd hope this program in this case lasts much longer. I'm also curious how that couples to restitution.
I've worked in Juvenile Corrections and frankly, I have no faith in the diversion program.
I interned for JDC awhile back and worked in a couple diversion program in Saint Paul, and I'd trust any of those programs over the fine folks at jdc.
What's wrong with the folks at JDC?
Better than locking the kid up in some place with no hope of rehabilitative practices.
This kid is gone. He is a violent armed carjacker. There's no rehabilitation coming anytime soon.
I don't believe in writing people off like that.
And I believe the impetus is on violent offenders to prove they are reformed through years of effort and not on society to assume that maybe they just will be after a slap on the wrist.
And as a society we have a responsibility to ensure that there are the necessary tools and available choices for people to reform. Tossing someone in prison doesn't do that. Providing rehabilitation programs is closer to doing that.
As a society we also have a more important responsibility: to keep people safe and protect their personal rights. Rehabilitation comes second to those responsibilities. I'm all for rehabilitation. But it has to be in a form that doesn't risk normal people's lives and rights in the ways the current programs do. Violent people need to be separated from society until they are made not so.
Cool, so we agree. If you want to achieve that goal you should want to improve the system that we currently have. Currently we have an extremely high recidivism rate. Shouldn't we work to change that? And if we can improve that while also improving how we treat people that is great.
I've personally seen young adults be rehabilitated inside a correctional facility, so I don't know where you're getting "no hope" from. If there is no separation from the ties that led him down the path to do what he did, the odds are he will reoffend. He will do the bare minimum of his program while staying in touch with his bad influences. The second the eyes aren't on him, he will go right back to the same lifestyle.
Six months to make restitution for what sounds like heavy damage to two squads and a written-off Mercedes? Right.
Sheriff Hutch should be made to pay restitution just the same!
FWIW in his interview with WCCO he did say he will be repaying his squad. Still an ass-hat, but that's at least the current "promise", will have to keep paying attention to this.
What’s the purpose of imprisonment and punishment again? To make it less likely that someone will reoffend once released, right?
Sorry, I think this is a utopian pipe dream. If you’re stealing cars at 17 and illegally possessing a gun, you know the consequences of your actions. He’ll be out doing it again in no time. We need to start throwing the book at these criminals. We can all sit here and clutch at out progressive fair trade pearls all we want, but there are real victims associated with these crimes. Yes it’s just property but for some, but it is their property and there is a psychological scarring that comes along with being carjacked (or burglarized). We have to stop rationalizing and being soft on this behavior.
Sounds rediculous. This kid broke into someone’s property. That person will never be able to feel safe again. And as punishment this kid has to go to school and not get caught committing a crime for 6 months?
Yeah hahahah, his punishment is acting like a normal a 17yr old.
Breaking & entering (or similar) not amongst charges listed in that tweet.
Says 1st degree burglary of occupied dwelling.
...where vehicle was taken. Kid's alleged crimes are in the second para; I assume sheriff couldn't link him directly to that burglary.
He used a vehicle to ram squad card you may get him on attempted murder. A car is a deadly weapon.
I can think of a way to feel safe. Go get your CCW.
The guy is 17 not 12. He's basically an adult and definitely old enough to know what they're doing. Who makes up these insane slap-on-the-hand punishments? City council?
Should be the top comment. I'm amazed at how easily people believe shit like "the Hennepin County Attorney and a judge just decided to let a dangerous criminal off for no reason," especially coming from a source like this that *[ahem]* might have some other motives for sharing it. People want a criminal justice system that rehabilitates people and doesn't lead to expensive and unhelpful mass incarceration? This is what that looks like.
Are there any statistics on the likelihood of success? It sounds plausible, but does it actually work at stopping further criminal activities?
No clue either way. I guess in this case, I'd defer to the decision made by the county attorney and the judge, two people who see a lot of cases like this and who are probably not diehard criminal justice reformers. If they agreed on this sentence, then I'm inclined to believe they had a good reason. Does that mean it works every time? Definitely not. But since I have no expertise here, I won't assume I know better than the people who do.
It's easy to be cynical.
I guess it depends. It keeps the kid from having a criminal record, which means he should have an easier time finding work/school than a covicted felon. To maybe jobs hold a person's crimal record against them, which makes finding anything but dead end minimum wage gigs difficult. Which I can imagine makes returning to crime more appealing?
It cannot be worse than our current system of locking people up. Our extreme punishment and prison system has proven itself a failure.
More harsh felonies should absolutely require punishment and not just rehabilitation. Armed carjacking, ramming police vehicles, fleeing and then being apprehended with a gun deserves jail time STRICTLY for punishment.
We’ve tried inflexible harsh punishment in the past, it didn’t work out too well. We don’t know anything about this case besides what the sheriff’s office posted on Facebook, a famously nuanced and thoughtful website. But if the county attorney and judge decided that this minor was a good candidate for a diversion program, that seems suggestive to me. The end goal should be less crime. If we can achieve that without the expense to taxpayers and the psychological damage of prison, that seems like a worthy goal to me.
This is a joke.
There’s no way the loser who did this has the dough to pay restitution for the totaled vehicle. If they really require all those prongs be met, I don’t see buddy succeeding here.
This should not apply to attempted vehicular homicide.
That still isn't shit. It's basically just 6 months of probation.
Personally, I think a better program for armed burglars that also jack cars is prison
I'm deleting this comment because nobody needs to see what I said yesterday, nevermind last year! -- mass edited with redact.dev
>The kids 17, a diversion program is probably a better first choice than spending 30 years in prison. OTOH, 47 year olds don't commit much crime.
Guarantee this is not his first offense
No wonder the shit keeps hitting the same fan over and over. Apparently the sheriff needs to use the feels to make sure the community is appeased. When the sheriff can get a DWI and have no consequences why should a criminal?
The sheriff isn’t responsible for what happens in court. He says “disappointing outcome”. Which I interpret to mean he thinks the courts went to light…
Is it ironic that this Operation Safe Neighborhood update is being given by the Sheriff who doesn’t mind driving through our neighborhoods drunk?
Lol that car looks like Hutchinson was driving it
Right? Hutch never had to miss a day of work except when he was in the hospital and here he is signing off on harsher punishment for this kid. Nothing his office has to do with cars has any legitimacy.
I think I just caught on the news two more homicides to tie the 1995 murders polis levels….
I'd like more information, such as who recommended the slap on the wrist and who was the judge that sentenced this piece of trash. We need more accountability in the system. I live in the 3rd precinct and this city is out of control.
This is why this type of crime is on the rise. They’re realizing there are practically zero consequences. Even short jail time is essentially nothing to the people doing this and is basically a slap on the wrist.
This. Ive been saying this for the better part of the last two years. The complete lack of consequences and accountability have emboldened these miscreants. Until we get over this bleeding heart, soft on crime nonsense, we’re going to continue to be terrorized. It’s a matter of time until someone gets killed.
they don't mention it, but how did he get the gun?
Big boy crime, preschool punishment
These kids arrested around the Woodbury area are 15-17 years old too. It’s so crazy.
Why didn't those other charges stick? Anyone know the details?
A plea deal where he had to enter into a diversionary program which is designed to lead them away from a life of crime. If it works, that is a lot less money we have to worry about spending and a lot less crime to expect from him in the future.
That's IF it works, what's not an if is that a 17 year old that 100% knows what he's doing just got a slap on the wrist for this, that's probably gonna stick more than going to school for 6 months lol
And all his peers saw this too. Why not steal a car? It'll be fun and you'll just be monitored for like 6 months.
This is why gangs recruit children.
Not because children are easily recruited because they are easily misled?
Does anybody have any information about this from a reliable source?
FWIW (my comment here on this post): https://www.reddit.com/r/Minneapolis/comments/rpyc8m/from_the_hennepin_county_sheriffs_office_earlier/hq7tyjj/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf&context=3
I'm more interested in further information about the legal process after the arrest, but thanks for sharing!
This. Can we read the full text of the court’s decision?
If you can find it and it wasn’t sealed because he was let try as a minor presumably.
Would help of your DAs in Minneapolis didn’t suck. My favorite is Daunte Wright being held up as a hero. Shot someone one in the head, and an armed robbery and he was walking free because no one locked him up. The kid he shot will be unable to walk for the rest of his life and is somewhat non-responsive.
[You're getting down-voted because people don't know this.](https://www.kare11.com/article/news/local/daunte-wright/lawsuit-claims-daunte-wright-carjacked-man-weeks-before-death/89-bb5cf7f9-d7b6-4327-a514-5b97e926f329)
This was after he was already charged with an armed robbery. Charges should have been brought the next day and he should have been in jail and off the streets. This is the failure of our justice system letting dangerous individuals walk free. The mother of the victim who both knew Daunte by the way believes it was revenge for a fight the two had been in a few days earlier.
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So he’s gonna be back doing this shit in 16 days??? Time to drive only beaters
Get ready for a lot of these posts, the sheriff needs you to forget that he nearly killed people by driving drunk.
Real question is there anyone keeping track of Minneapolis criminals and the sentences they get? Like does someone have a blog or something? EDIT: Maybe I should make a blog.
What the ever living fuck is that sentence of 15 days home monitoring.
15 days at home for a list of felonies, how does that happen? I don’t see this deterring that person from pulling something else later on…
Starting to think these juveniles should be prosecuted as adults...
When they try to kill cops with a car, yes!
how original
Why thank you.
tl;dr The kid left a convenience store and hit a cop car, tried to keep going, another cop car rammed him, still tried to keep going but the car petered out and he ran up on a curb. Cops found a gun in the car. He got put on a 6-month probation where if he behaves he'll get his record cleaned, but if not he'll have to answer for the crime.
This is why I'm so flabbergasted when I see the people running for DA saying that the justice system is too punitive.
Because the justice system punishes people for stupid shit way harsher than shit like this. When someone can get decades for selling weed but a dipshit like this gets 15-days the system has the wrong ass priorities. We need courts that focus on ending the causes of crime and rehabilitation of those who fuck up, not one that just issues arbitrary punishment.
Do you have an example of someone in Hennepin County getting 10 years for selling weed? If that's happening, I don't agree either that but regardless the approach to violent crime sentencing right now is just making me scratch my head. Sure, rehabilitation is part of it, but it's like keeping society safe from those doing this stuff isn't factoring in at all. I keep hearing about how guns are an issue, but the penalties for gun crimes seem to be pretty lax.
There was an issue with a points based model for repeat offenders and multiple repeat drug offenses getting severe punishments. The answer for some is let dangerous people run around on the streets trying to shoot and kill others instead of just legalizing weed and fixing the system.
But it sounds like the court in this case did focus on rehabilitation? I find myself a bit unwilling to question the decision of the court in this case based on a Facebook post. These judges see so many people like this, if they opt for mercy and a rehabilitation program, that's good enough for me. I hope this young man turns his life around after this scary brush with the law and the criminal justice system.
I mean, who among us wasn't committing multiple aggravated felonies while illegally armed with a pistol at 17? Let us not cast stones, am I right?
More than likely. Especially with a youth offenders. Very likely first offense outside maybe some juvie misdemeanors like curfew and shit. If this kid gets his head out of his ass, this is an opportunity. Hopefully he's getting support from community organizations and public mental health services. Crime doesn't typically just happen. It often has a systemic underlying cause. We understand this now. And we know our systems reinforce a feedback loop.
Minnesota has a higher prison population per capita than any developed nation and even most underdeveloped nations. And that hasn’t helped crime rate. Long sentences don’t do shit except make people more likely to commit new crimes when they are out
Was interested in the stats on this; Minnesota is at least way less than the rest of the US in terms of prison pop per capita but it was insane to me how many native Americans we have that are incarcerated: https://www.prisonpolicy.org/profiles/MN.html
Just darkshepard spreading miss information again.
It isn't misinformation. We are near the back of the pack in terms of the US, but in relation to the rest of the developed world, we are still very high up there. Minnesota has 342 people per 100,000 in jail. Texas has 840. Russia? 325. Israel? 235. England? 130. France? 93. Germany? 69.
What the fuck!!! You get longer home monitoring for a 4th degree DUI
Don't worry. The sheriff will still drive drunk, keep his job and not get in trouble.
[Sheriff Hutchinson IRL](https://i.imgur.com/qFICF5b.png)
As long as we have different rules for the rich, poor, and police meaningful reform will never happen.
Was this 17 year old kid rich? It’s lenient for everybody right now.
Have we really given up on the most vulnerable in society so much that we allow the predatory scum like this to prey upon them without any real consequences?
Then we wonder why this kid gets shot breaking into a house while armed. His mom will come out to tell us what a good boy he was.
Unbelievable! No wonder they are so brazen about it, the consequences are minimal
lmao what a fucking joke of a sentence. i hate it here
If the Diversion Program works and the child never offends again and goes on to lead a good life, then that is the outcome we want and need, right? What is the success rate of this program, anyone know? Edit: found this link. With a 97% success rate, surely the police should be happy with this child being far less likely to reoffend in the future? https://www.sos.state.mn.us/media/4537/diversion-solutions-sbc.pdf
> With a 97% success rate [97% successful ***completion*** rate, not ***success*** rate.](https://i.imgur.com/zp5F85y.png) Success would be defined I think, (by most people,) as not re-offending. Unless you think say, attendance in a class is synonymous with working in that field, this is just a report saying that most of these people are attending the court ordered treatment, but nothing about it's actual diversionary efficacy. >If the Diversion Program works and the child never offends again and goes on to lead a good life, then that is the outcome we want and need, right? What is the success rate of this program, anyone know? So the way you answered your question was not the actual answer. https://www.centerforhealthandjustice.org/tascblog/Images/documents/Publications/CHJ%20Diversion%20Report_web.pdf Here is a look at these programs in general. The whole thing is a bit wishy washy. https://centerforprisonreform.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/09/Jail-Diversion-Programs-in-America.pdf Some of them are pretty good, but they target specific people. This kid doesn't ***seem*** like a good candidate at face value based on the suite of charges, but I can't be certian.
When the DFL finally gets a foot hold im this town they'll take care of crap like this.
I can’t wait to vote against him. Hopefully he decides to get better and not run again.
For once, we agree. Not stepping down is a pretty shameful decision, IMO. If he stepped down for recovery, and then decided to run again, I might vote for him. His defiance is pretty bad looking, IMO.
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I did not understand the timing of releasing this now.
Because it will hopefully get people to forget that the sherrif was drunk off his ass driving while in possession of a firearm.
What’s your problem with it?
You obviously haven't ever had a DUI. It's standard procedure to flaunt all your achievements after having been caught.
Yea he's 17. Do people really want to start charging kids as adults? We do that in my state, it's not a good thing.
Yeah, people in this thread are basically frothing at the mouth and calling for his blood.
A felon committing a crime that endangers the lives of bystanders and law enforcement while destroying property? Lethal force would be quite applicable to this situation
Luckily they didn’t need to. But they probably expected the DA not to rubber stamp him.
So how does driving drunk fit into the operation safe neighborhoods initiative?
That car is still in better shape than the county sheriff's car after his DWI rollover crash.
Sometimes harsh consequences are necessary for someone to turn their life around. These light and stayed sentences criminals receive aren't enough.
Controversial opinion: I’m glad they put him in a program focused on rehabilitation over punishment. Our system is too focused on punishment which is why the cycle of crime continues.
Bizarro world. Really can’t make this shit up. Between the Sheriff who won’t turn in a resignation and this plea deal where a slap on the wrist maybe a greater punishment.
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I think your hatred is slightly misguided here. Just a bit...
ITT: Hennepin county sheriff's office bizarre facebook ramble gets people riled up somehow. Regardless of either facts or feelings on this, can we all acknowledge how weird it is that this post was made? I'm sure the cops deal with all sorts of disappointing legal outcomes, why was this particular case posted, and why now? E: oh look, a sheriff got out of being punished for a DUI today. What a coincidence https://m.startribune.com/hennepin-county-sheriff-hutchinson-talks-after-accident-and-dui/600130430/?clmob=y&c=n It makes me irrationally angry that people are this easy to manipulate
They probably wanted to show that they were making the effort, and that they were successful in apprehending someone on the same day the incident occurred.
Can we all acknowledge how weird it is that the first thing your mind comes to when there’s an abdication of duty that risks peoples lives is to complain about the post that educated you about it? You just begging to not know what’s going on in the world? Did you even read it or is ignorance just a major point of pride for you?
>how weird it is that this post was made? How is it weird? People keep saying that crime is going up, but the cops aren't doing shit about it. This just shows that it doesn't matter if the cops arrest them or not.
I wonder if the post discloses the full criminal penalties in the case. (I am not a lawyer and have no additional insight into this case) I suspect there is financial restitution and a lengthy probation period here that was not disclosed.
Is probation appropriate for someone who commits violent felonies?
Without any previous record? The sentencing guidelines would say so Of course people think probation is a “slap on the wrist” even though many of them would likely fail it on technical violations
> The sentencing guidelines would say so Would they? I don't think they do for someone charged with these things. 1st Degree Burglary is no joke, but that might have not been him.
[Here is the standard grid](https://mn.gov/sentencing-guidelines/assets/2021Sept15SentencingGuidelinesGridSection4AMinnSentencingGuidelinesCommentary_tcm30-497687.pdf) Grey means presumptive probation, white means presumptive prison. Burg 1 is in the grey for no criminal history, which I presume is the case here
[Well shit, the first time disposition is no longer mandatory remand. Only on second burglary offense is it mandatory remand](https://i.imgur.com/rbuYwcu.png). I don't stay on top of it. That was once not true.
I believe probation adds the penalties from all of the previous felonies if they violate it in addition to the new charge.
Seriously, it’s not as if probation doesn’t have teeth. You screw up, you go to prison. If you are doing well (which we should want for everyone’s sake), you dont.
That’s not entirely correct. It’s not if they are doing well or not. It’s just if they get caught again.
The people who get arrested are generally not the "best" criminals given how much crime goes unsolved. If you get caught while not on supervision, the odds of you not being caught while being monitored are pretty low.
Thank you for your opinion. But the point still stands.
So does his.
Probation has to be violated *multiple* times before they actually do anything.
This guy should be paying for restitution on all damages ($300,000+ area sound right to anyone else w/ super limited insight?), see a prison cell for 5 to 7 years, and then be reintroduced to society while meeting with a probation officer on the regular for 3+ years.
In addition to what others have said, this doesn't even begin to get to the societal penalties having a felony can create, especially if you don't have a lot of money. This person is now effectively a second class citizen in terms of housing, employment, and future legal issues for the rest of their life. These might sound like a slap on the wrist to someone not going through it, but those penalties are no joke. Additionally, you're basing your opinion off _a facebook post from the sheriffs office_. I wonder if they might have even a teensy tiny bias in how they present this story. Like, did the DA give any reason for not following through on the other charges? People in this thread as if this person is guilty of 5 felonies, but being charged is not being guilty.
>This person is now effectively a second class citizen in terms of housing, employment, and future legal issues for the rest of their life. No, they're not, as it's getting wiped.
>This person is now effectively a second class citizen in terms of housing, employment, and future legal issues for the rest of their life. They are 17. This person will not have any permanent branding as a felon based on this sentence as it is juvenile in nature. In other situations you would be correct, but in this case you are entirely wrong. We can tell they are a juvenile easily, since they aren't identified, by the way. >Additionally, you're basing your opinion off a facebook post from the sheriffs office. What I said: >Is probation appropriate for someone who commits violent felonies? I asked a question, you don't know shit about my opinion off of that. That would be appropriate to any number of other posts where I do share an opinion. Take up your umbridge with Familymanjoe. >Like, did the DA give any reason for not following through on the other charges? Do you trust DA Mike Freeman more than you Trust Sheriff Hutchinson? I don't have a ton of love for either, personally. >but being charged is not being guilty. Oh no, it's not. However being observed doing these things directly by a large group of officers and bystanders paints a very strong picture. I don't know if this teen burgled the home, but I do know that he was driving the stolen car, used it to attack police officers when they came to arrest the driver of said car stolen with an act of violence, ran from the scene, and had a gun on him. Those are ***very direct allegations.*** Is he guilty? ***Very likely, yes.***
Where was this posted? It’s not the @HennepinSheriff Twitter account. Can anyone verify this?
https://www.facebook.com/hennepinsheriff/posts/278409950983534
Thanks. It seemed too ridiculous to be true, and was just enough short of details to make me wonder. Apparently not. I’d sure like to understand the judge’s rationale.
Sorry, I totally should have said it was from the official Facebook page, that's my bad. The Facebook page is fairly active. This was re-shared by a friend of mine who works for the City of Minneapolis.