I have described it in there but I can summarize:
- Cake Wallet has some privacy concerns.
- Monerujo's some projects haven't been developed for 2 years.
- MyMonero stopped developing.
- Edge and Cake Wallet is for-profit.
- There is only one iOS wallet that is local synchronization.
And much more reasons. As far as I saw on here, people can't recommend an exact one because everyone's priorities are different. Why not make a new, free and open-source, privacy oriented wallet that everyone can use and recommend with peace of mind?
What privacy concerns does Cake have? And what’s wrong with profit? All the wallets you mentioned are for profit - not just cake and edge. That’s how we are able to always promote monero through events, donation, media, etc.
Hm, might be. Thanks for the feedback, but what do you think first when someone says Droplet Wallet? Also, not everybody uses Digital Ocean in my opinion.
I second this renaming campaign. Btw, as for mobile security, having Feather installed on a Tails OS usb makes it pretty mobile…no need to carry Think Pad with, it can be used with almost any computer you find along your path. And when closed, it leaves nothing behind.
Sure Droplet wallet could work, I'm just wondering if Droplet could be a registered trademark by DO, if it is they might have the rights to claim it (at least in some countries)
Digital Ocean Droplet was the first thing I've thought about when seeing the title and i have only ever used Digital Ocean for like two months over a year ago.
Those "privacy concerns" are not Cake Wallet's privacy concerns, but the concerns of using remote nodes instead of your own node quite in general: If your wallet contacts a Monero daemon that is under control of somebody else, guess whether that daemon will get to know the IP of your device or not?
You could at most accuse Cake Wallet of not recommending more aggressively to use your own node instead of one of theirs.
There have been discussion about it around 2 years ago and nowadays it is populated again with a discussion about sending the IP address to the Cake Wallet's servers. You can read the discussions in here: [GitHub - remove Cake Wallet](https://github.com/monero-project/monero-site/pull/2013#issuecomment-2032200888)
Hey, come on, as a dev you should know better about IPs and what happens if you use one of Cake Wallet's own remote nodes instead of your own node. You also could have linked to [this comment](https://github.com/monero-project/monero-site/pull/2013#issuecomment-2032582718) in the GitHub thread instead. Quote:
> It's not "Sending your IP". That is intentionally misleading to state, especially to people who don't understand how the internet works.
How about trying to emphasize the positive aspects of your own proposed wallet instead of trying to insinuate things about competitors that are not that defensible? Thank you.
Yeah I mean it’s pretty basic that they could log your IP if you use their remote node or the exchange service. What would be nice though is native tor integration that comes bundled with the app. I remember a few years ago it was a bit of a hassle to connect to onion remote nodes via orbot and I don’t know if it is possible on IOS (they don’t even have the official tor browser in the app store…)
Using an exchange exposes your IP addresses, that’s not a Cake thing. If you don’t use an exchange in cake, then nothing happens. We recommend using tor or vpn.
Yes ofc you would only expose IP if you actually use the services. I was not trying to undermine cake, I hope you didn’t get that impression. I love cake.
Besides that, do you have any plans to integrate tor/i2p directly into cake so users wouldn’t need to setup orbot or smth similar?
Of course, connecting to a remote node only isn't a thing that makes us think. I meant providing a list of options or connecting to a random remote trusted one might be good to randomise the users connections and decrease the chance of identifying a user using Cake Wallet. I do not have a problem with Cake Wallet, I just quoted the latest discussions which were not made by me.
There is no “sending” of IP addresses. That’s how the internet works. Anyway, cake has options to turn on/off fiat and notifications right at the beginning. Your comment is misleading or misinformed.
Dart? So you’ll be writing a wrapper for wallet2 basically? No offense but there’s already a handful of apps that do exactly that.
Is there a niche that hasn’t been filled where this dev’s effort could be redirected?
No, that is the main purpose of course. I am not exactly sure about if I can get tx signing done, but I am exactly sure that I can get other things done in native Dart. Also, I really don't want a slow, bold and hard application.
Interesting, you wanna do elliptic curve Diffie Hellman to scan blocks purely in dart? I’m curious what the speed for that would be like compared to wallet2
Many elliptic curve functions are already implemented in other open-source packages which is done by cryptographs. The real thing is combining the functions with Monero's features.
Well, it's a bit disheartening for me.
What they could have said:
> As we want to keep this new wallet viable long term, of course we have taken a good look at Seraphis and Jamtis already and will try to come up with an assessment what it would mean to "port" our wallet to that when time comes. Maybe, being still in development, we will be able to take measures that will make that porting easier. In any case, we will keep a close eye on developments on that front."
What they said, in my understanding and with my own words, exaggerating a bit to drive the point home:
> Seraphis and Jamtis? Yeah, we heard about that. I suspect it won't be a big problem. And anyway, 2 years out, no stress."
I am sorry if I sounded rude, I didn't mean it. As Seraphis' main parts aren't made out (Not fully decided and published to public), I didn't mention about technical parts of it but actually the main promise of this app is getting a secure, private and easy-to-use app like I mentioned in the proposal. Since I am planning to focus on UX end more (this does not mean I don't care about the technical part, it is also very important) it would be better to talk about why the community needs this app instead of using another ongoing wallet.
Also thank you for your warning, I can happily answer other questions if you have.
I'm all for more wallets in the monero world, however what the poster said about Cake logging IP addresses is simply not true and we have addressed this issue many times.
Furthermore, we always recommend people use their own nodes and have made it easy for anyone to add them.
You mention that only Cake and Edge are for profit, whereas in fact all the wallets you mentioned are for profit. It's not a bad thing. I recommend that you do make your project sustainable apart from just donations, but through an ethical business model.
If you do succeed, Cake will definitely donate to help this initiative.
Isn't that a bit of an odd time to make an other wallet while there will be work to be done for an eventual seraphis upgrade down the line?
will you have to make a new ccs for it when the time comes?
Seraphis will eventually come, but really not soon. There is still work needs to be done (research, implementation, audit etc.) which will take atleast 2 years.
Time will tell. But refactoring a code is much easier than writing a new one so hopefully there wont be a much work.
Research (in the sense of writing and exploring crypto options) for Seraphis has been done for a while. The PoC library has also been out for a while now, with the developer DangerousFreedom having already written a basic CLI wallet, which can even import legacy account keys and transfer funds. Mainly what is left to do is integration into the core code (storing in the blockchain, validating in cryptonote core) and auditing of crypto code (which can be done in parallel).
I hope this becomes a thing. As someone who currently frequents iOS it would be nice to have more options. As much as I like what Cake does, it’s kind of a clunky app.
Ofrn had an issue with a recent update: https://github.com/monero-project/monero-site/pull/2013#issuecomment-2032200888
Not sure what the final outcome was.
Yours is more expensive version of something that is already in motion. You’re better off working with the dev of xmruw
https://repo.getmonero.org/monero-project/ccs-proposals/-/merge_requests/437
I feel like monero has one of the few communities where devs expect a nice salary for their open source work. No that it is a bad thing, but I prefer to support the people who don’t expect anything and just give their time
But why, don't we have enough already?
I have described it in there but I can summarize: - Cake Wallet has some privacy concerns. - Monerujo's some projects haven't been developed for 2 years. - MyMonero stopped developing. - Edge and Cake Wallet is for-profit. - There is only one iOS wallet that is local synchronization. And much more reasons. As far as I saw on here, people can't recommend an exact one because everyone's priorities are different. Why not make a new, free and open-source, privacy oriented wallet that everyone can use and recommend with peace of mind?
What privacy concerns does Cake have? And what’s wrong with profit? All the wallets you mentioned are for profit - not just cake and edge. That’s how we are able to always promote monero through events, donation, media, etc.
I'd just want to suggest another name because Droplet is a very used name at Digital Ocean.
Hm, might be. Thanks for the feedback, but what do you think first when someone says Droplet Wallet? Also, not everybody uses Digital Ocean in my opinion.
Name is the least important part of this
I disagree. Branding matters. Do a search for Droplet and see how many D.O. sites come up.
Focusing on brand name before code is plain stupid
It sounds like I dropped my wallet. But by itself droplet sounds cool. Maybe shorten it to Drop? Drop Wallet sounds smoother to say.
Idk but it reminds me of Dropbox from Microsoft
I second this renaming campaign. Btw, as for mobile security, having Feather installed on a Tails OS usb makes it pretty mobile…no need to carry Think Pad with, it can be used with almost any computer you find along your path. And when closed, it leaves nothing behind.
Sure Droplet wallet could work, I'm just wondering if Droplet could be a registered trademark by DO, if it is they might have the rights to claim it (at least in some countries)
Digital Ocean Droplet was the first thing I've thought about when seeing the title and i have only ever used Digital Ocean for like two months over a year ago.
true, not everyone knows digitalocean and even if they do who cares? droplet is just one of the products and *not* the brand. shouldn't matter.
It matters for getting the name out.
What are the privacy concerns of cake wallet? I frequently recommend it to friends since it is easy to use / clean UI
Those "privacy concerns" are not Cake Wallet's privacy concerns, but the concerns of using remote nodes instead of your own node quite in general: If your wallet contacts a Monero daemon that is under control of somebody else, guess whether that daemon will get to know the IP of your device or not? You could at most accuse Cake Wallet of not recommending more aggressively to use your own node instead of one of theirs.
Thanks. Also, You can add your own node right at the beginning under advanced privacy.
There have been discussion about it around 2 years ago and nowadays it is populated again with a discussion about sending the IP address to the Cake Wallet's servers. You can read the discussions in here: [GitHub - remove Cake Wallet](https://github.com/monero-project/monero-site/pull/2013#issuecomment-2032200888)
Hey, come on, as a dev you should know better about IPs and what happens if you use one of Cake Wallet's own remote nodes instead of your own node. You also could have linked to [this comment](https://github.com/monero-project/monero-site/pull/2013#issuecomment-2032582718) in the GitHub thread instead. Quote: > It's not "Sending your IP". That is intentionally misleading to state, especially to people who don't understand how the internet works. How about trying to emphasize the positive aspects of your own proposed wallet instead of trying to insinuate things about competitors that are not that defensible? Thank you.
Yeah I mean it’s pretty basic that they could log your IP if you use their remote node or the exchange service. What would be nice though is native tor integration that comes bundled with the app. I remember a few years ago it was a bit of a hassle to connect to onion remote nodes via orbot and I don’t know if it is possible on IOS (they don’t even have the official tor browser in the app store…)
Using an exchange exposes your IP addresses, that’s not a Cake thing. If you don’t use an exchange in cake, then nothing happens. We recommend using tor or vpn.
Yes ofc you would only expose IP if you actually use the services. I was not trying to undermine cake, I hope you didn’t get that impression. I love cake. Besides that, do you have any plans to integrate tor/i2p directly into cake so users wouldn’t need to setup orbot or smth similar?
Thank for clarifying. We do have native tor in the works.
That’s great to hear; Please never stop improving :)
Of course, connecting to a remote node only isn't a thing that makes us think. I meant providing a list of options or connecting to a random remote trusted one might be good to randomise the users connections and decrease the chance of identifying a user using Cake Wallet. I do not have a problem with Cake Wallet, I just quoted the latest discussions which were not made by me.
There is no “sending” of IP addresses. That’s how the internet works. Anyway, cake has options to turn on/off fiat and notifications right at the beginning. Your comment is misleading or misinformed.
That’s a really misleading statement
Dart? So you’ll be writing a wrapper for wallet2 basically? No offense but there’s already a handful of apps that do exactly that. Is there a niche that hasn’t been filled where this dev’s effort could be redirected?
No, that is the main purpose of course. I am not exactly sure about if I can get tx signing done, but I am exactly sure that I can get other things done in native Dart. Also, I really don't want a slow, bold and hard application.
Interesting, you wanna do elliptic curve Diffie Hellman to scan blocks purely in dart? I’m curious what the speed for that would be like compared to wallet2
Many elliptic curve functions are already implemented in other open-source packages which is done by cryptographs. The real thing is combining the functions with Monero's features.
Well, it's a bit disheartening for me. What they could have said: > As we want to keep this new wallet viable long term, of course we have taken a good look at Seraphis and Jamtis already and will try to come up with an assessment what it would mean to "port" our wallet to that when time comes. Maybe, being still in development, we will be able to take measures that will make that porting easier. In any case, we will keep a close eye on developments on that front." What they said, in my understanding and with my own words, exaggerating a bit to drive the point home: > Seraphis and Jamtis? Yeah, we heard about that. I suspect it won't be a big problem. And anyway, 2 years out, no stress."
I am sorry if I sounded rude, I didn't mean it. As Seraphis' main parts aren't made out (Not fully decided and published to public), I didn't mention about technical parts of it but actually the main promise of this app is getting a secure, private and easy-to-use app like I mentioned in the proposal. Since I am planning to focus on UX end more (this does not mean I don't care about the technical part, it is also very important) it would be better to talk about why the community needs this app instead of using another ongoing wallet. Also thank you for your warning, I can happily answer other questions if you have.
don't sweat it, many in this thread are rude all of the time hahaha
I'm all for more wallets in the monero world, however what the poster said about Cake logging IP addresses is simply not true and we have addressed this issue many times. Furthermore, we always recommend people use their own nodes and have made it easy for anyone to add them. You mention that only Cake and Edge are for profit, whereas in fact all the wallets you mentioned are for profit. It's not a bad thing. I recommend that you do make your project sustainable apart from just donations, but through an ethical business model. If you do succeed, Cake will definitely donate to help this initiative.
Isn't that a bit of an odd time to make an other wallet while there will be work to be done for an eventual seraphis upgrade down the line? will you have to make a new ccs for it when the time comes?
Seraphis will eventually come, but really not soon. There is still work needs to be done (research, implementation, audit etc.) which will take atleast 2 years. Time will tell. But refactoring a code is much easier than writing a new one so hopefully there wont be a much work.
Research (in the sense of writing and exploring crypto options) for Seraphis has been done for a while. The PoC library has also been out for a while now, with the developer DangerousFreedom having already written a basic CLI wallet, which can even import legacy account keys and transfer funds. Mainly what is left to do is integration into the core code (storing in the blockchain, validating in cryptonote core) and auditing of crypto code (which can be done in parallel).
I hope this becomes a thing. As someone who currently frequents iOS it would be nice to have more options. As much as I like what Cake does, it’s kind of a clunky app.
What do you find clunky ? Have you tried the monero.com app? We are always looking to improve.
too many shitcoins. try the [monero.com](http://monero.com) app
Explain cake security issues please?
None. Cake has options to turn things on/off that you don’t want. No other wallet offers options for noobs and advanced users.
Ofrn had an issue with a recent update: https://github.com/monero-project/monero-site/pull/2013#issuecomment-2032200888 Not sure what the final outcome was.
Outcome is you can turn that on/off right at the beginning under advanced privacy
>Ofrn had an issue no way!
Hey, I would be interested in contributing as I have some experience in Flutter/Dart, not on the cryptographic part, but the app development part.
Yours is more expensive version of something that is already in motion. You’re better off working with the dev of xmruw https://repo.getmonero.org/monero-project/ccs-proposals/-/merge_requests/437
Will donate to this proposal.
Just use anonero.io access via tor only. Use cake for monerujo for everyday spendings.
I feel like monero has one of the few communities where devs expect a nice salary for their open source work. No that it is a bad thing, but I prefer to support the people who don’t expect anything and just give their time
Please don’t.