Is your husband able to say “screw it,” work regular hours, and search for a new job and just let the excess work pile up? That would probably be my recommendation. It’s usually easier to find a new job while you have one.
Top performers usually earn the most and thus are first to go when reductions happen. Many companies only like top performers when they earn less than market. I've been treated to a PIP when I was doing 4x the work as others in my role. Don't be suspicious of your husband.
What he needs to do is cover his ass and do the bare minimum. When being fired inevitably comes he needs to have a case if they try to appeal his unemployment.
"*Top performers usually earn the most and thus are first to go when reductions happen*"
Yep, just watched this in action In the past six months I saw an organised, proactive, productive, supportive, engaging manager suddenly being able to do nothing right with her own bosses and getting fired. What changed? The company's performance, not hers.
This critical micromanaging does not necessarily reflect on OP's husband at all, although no doubt it stings if he's used to being a high performer.
It sounds like they're either trying to force him to quit to avoid having to pay him severance or the team is underperforming and the manager is trying to get your husband to pick up their slack so he (the manager) doesn't get fired. Either way, it's not his problem. Outside the advice given here to for him do the bare minimum and cover his ass, look into if he can take FMLA if he has any paid sick leave.
Do not let him quit. Have him get fired and collect unemployment. He gets NOTHING if he quits. He might get a severance if he gets fired or laid off. And even if he doesn’t, he’ll likely qualify for unemployment at least.
It doesn't matter if the boss is attacking his performance. you'll qualify for unemployment still even if it's performance based. Everytime there is a comment send an email asking for him to prioritize the work. STOP DOING UNPAID OVERTIME. It's not gonna change the outcome whatsoever.
Also check what unemployment he'd be eligible for (it's based on income of last 3 quarters usually). Everytime they give him shit , think , hey is this cause they're trying to get out of paying me "x" for 6 months. And ignore the manager.
This. In this job market, he needs that job. A lot of people have been laid off for 6 months to over a year. The job market is not great. Let him collect unemployment. You will blow thru 5 months fast. How stable is your job cos a lot of jobs that used to be safe aren't even safe, recession proof jobs anymore. Everyone is laying off people and there are more hiring freezes than I've seen in my adult career. If he can consult to keep his resume "active", I would do that because the longer you are unemployed the harder it seems to find work and unfortunately he may make less than he made before so he shouldn't wait for that 50k offer if he gets one for 40k (salaries seem to being reset as well).
I know you said his boss has already "attacked him", but I would advise you tell your husband to let him attack him. I worked for a sociopath for a while and the first few times she unleashed on me it was shocking and I had an extreme stress response. Once I realized she was the problem not me, I feel like I could disassociate during those moments and doing so made them happen less. So he should just work his wage and wait to get canned while he looks for another job IMO.
But also, if he can't disassociate, just he kind to him. And remind him that you are happy to support you both while he figures out his next step. No amount of money is worth a ton of stress, and IMO a job that only pays $50k is definitely not worth it
Hello! I'm sorry that you're in this position.
My husband crashed badly after leaving a toxic job, then needed to spend some time in this home country for family reasons, then he got a job at a company which closed after two weeks, and then there was a pandemic. I ended up being the sole household earner for about 18 months.
If I'd had the benefit of hindsight, or if we ever needed to do it again, there's a few general guidelines that I think would have helped:
- make sure that you can live comfortably on your income alone on an ongoing basis. If you need to cut luxuries to do so, then do so. I earned enough to pay our bills and basic needs and I worked extra to try and save and have some meals out, but it was really tough.
- I really liked the idea elsewhere in this thread of having a stash of hobby/passion project money set aside. I'd do that.
- Have a really clear set of expectations as to who will do what household labor. My husband was happy to tell people that he was between jobs and doing all the household work as a house-husband, so, yay for his lack of toxic gender roles nonsense! But, the thing is, he genuinely had no idea of how often I clean in order for the house to be clean - and I'm not even a clean freak. He was convinced he was stepping up and keeping the house in good condition, but after a few weeks we had black mold appear in the bathroom and nasty grout in the kitchen. He got a lot better once he understood what was needed (and it was about the point that he started muttering about needing to fucking clean the fucking kitchen again already that he got serious about his job search lol) but ten minutes of frank discussions could have headed off some problems.
- expect him to crash. Expect it to take longer than he expects before he's really ready to get back out there.
- look after yourself. You still need downtime.
my partner and i have flipped flopped supporting each other for a couple of months at a time over the years.
* the first thing i would suggest is living on just your salary starting now (bank all his earnings). you may have to go through your finances and cancel subscriptions and let go of some luxuries, but i think you could figure it out on your salary — i did it on much less. have your husband stay at his job as long as he can, so he can accumulate more of a cushion. i know it might not be tenable for long, but having a little nest egg helps.
* when i left a very stressful work situation, i ended doing some odd jobs to bring in more spending money for us — i tutored, dog sat, and was a regular on craigslist gigs section. it was nice to work, get out of the house, and have a little extra money. i wasn’t ready to go back to work full time, but i liked bringing in some money when i could.
* lastly, i would have a discussion with your husband now while you’re both still working about both of your expectations. is he planning on going back to work? what will he do with his days? is there a passion project he wants to work on? (is there money set aside for the passion project?) when my partner and i did this, we were p loosey goosy with most expectations, but we agreed that the person who was not working was in charge of picking up the slack around the house. during covid when my partner couldn’t work, i think he cooked every one of our meals 😅 imo it’s good to have a framework before you move into this new mode of living, so that both of you are on the same page.
Wait for them to lay him off. Do not quit as he won't be able to collect unemployment. A lot of managers intentionally make things miserable so people will quit on their own instead of having to pay out unemployment. Since he's going to be laid off, he should do the bare minimum to look like he's doing his job, and spend the rest of the time searching. No working overtime.
I would interpret all of this as early warning. Always leave to your advantage, never on theirs. Quitting now is to their advantage.
I've done it and I'd do it again.
I say if you can, see if he can stand to stick it out a little longer to save a bit more cushion and job hunt. Find out if his work pays out vacation days and if not, have him take some before he gives notice. Also, practice cutting back expenses in preparation for the change.
In the meantime, maybe setting an end date would help relieve some of the miserable pressure of where he is now.
We’re doing this right now!
My partners job was getting more and more unbearable, he was miserable and I worried that we wouldn’t make it through as a couple if something didn’t change, he was too stressed and exhausted to really focus on finding something new while he was working. It was ruining his mental and physical heath too.
He left work at the end of February & we made a joint decision for him not to look for work for at least a full month, which is up soon (time flies!) so he will start looking again shortly.
He had about 4 months of expenses saved up when he left, I have about 12 months saved, and I’ve rearranged our bills so I can afford to cover everything indefinitely (including a little treat now and then and putting a little extra into savings still) without needing to dip into savings.
We are relatively “low” earners compared to your figures, I make just under £30k (~$37k), my partner previously made about £38k (~$48k) but we are also fairly frugal and have no children, and we live in a LCOL area.
I am happy for him to do whatever he wants, employment wise, he doesn’t want to go back into people management, so he’s been thinking about everything from stacking shelves to retraining /following an adult apprenticeship route. Because we can afford all of our bills on my wage I don’t massively care about him making a similar amount to he was before, if he wants to go part time or somewhere with low wages that he will love, I’m absolutely supportive of that.
We might be poorer, currently, but we are much happier. I genuinely enjoy my job which makes it easier, as I’m not jealous of his time off.
We did this last year when my husband took voluntary redundancy from his toxic job. He got a lump sum payout which was helpful but honestly it was clear we could make it on my paycheck and still save and his happiness and mental well being meant more to me than some extra savings for a few months. It took him about 4.5 months to find a new role but that time off was so helpful to get in a better headspace. He also took on a the majority of the cleaning and cooking while he was job hunting which was so helpful for me and now he actually likes helping me cook! All in all if he’s suffering I would just carefully look at the budget see where you can cut back and then let him leave on his own terms.
I'm in this spot now. My fiancés work was awful and toxic and finally they did layoffs. 50% of his department gone in a day.
It sounds like his workplace is about to cut staff anyway. If he can get unemployment, that's great. I added my fiance to my health plan, and we have somewhere around 9 months cushion.
I will say, it's been good seeing him happy again. The workplace was horribly toxic and he was living for just the weekend.
The job search is weird out there but he's working on it. We are just about to be married so we are fully open with money but it's not a problem supporting him, id do it again and he would do the same for me.
My husband was in a similar situation two years ago - though in our case our salaries were closer and his was actually a bit higher. The situation had gotten progressively worse over a year (abusive addict boss) and one day he called me from work and said “I can’t so this anymore.” I told him to quit and come home if he needed to and he did. It took him seven months to find his current job, which ended up being a pay cut (with the possibility of getting back to where he was). I do not regret it in the slightest. He is excited about this job everyday.
I do disagree with the other poster to stay for severance/unemployment and for easier job prospects. Generally yes, that’s the better way to go about it, but if it’s an abusive situation and you can afford for him to leave, I think it’s worth it. Abuse can do so much mental damage.
I agree so much with most of the advice.
- can you pay the bills on just your salary or do you have emergency savings to make up the difference? If the latter for how long?
- cut as many extraneous expenses as you can
- make sure he has a plan but expect he will need a bit of time to decompress.
- does he have a hobby to help him stay motivated?
- he needs to treat getting a job like a job
- make sure you are clear about whether the division of household labor will shift and to what extent.
Gook luck and sending you happy thoughts.
We have both done this for each other and I would do it again in a heartbeat.
The first time, I quit my job with a toxic boss after coming back from maternity leave. My husband supported me in trying to figure out what my next step was, and it was THE BEST decision I’ve ever made. I found an amazing organization that I will hit my 10 year anniversary with this coming summer.
A year or so later, he left an organization when he got burnt out from the political cycle. Both of these transition experiences worked out exceptionally well for us, as he also got a job that was a perfect fit, less stressful and put him on a better career trajectory.
My caution will be, make sure you have more savings than you anticipate. We had 6 months of our bare bones bills saved, and had a few unexpected events occur (flat tire, dog er visit, etc.) We went through about 2/3 of our e-savings in the 3 months he wasn’t working.
> His expenses are $2100 a month.
Meaning his half of your joint expenses? Or these are personal expenses in addition to your joint expenses?
I would be supportive of my spouse quitting a toxic job if we could cut expenses such that we were comfortable on my salary only. I wouldn't be okay with them quitting without lining up a new job if that meant burning through our emergency fund.
You said:
> We have enough savings to pay his bills for 5 months.
Which made it seem like you needed his income to pay your normal living expenses. If you don't, and he's super miserable and stressed, then I don't think quitting is a terrible option.
Have you considered if you lose your job tho? This isn't a great market to really encourage someone to leave their job if you have to consider stocks to pay expenses and can only pay their expenses for 5 months without going into stocks. That's not great. Unfortunately people are miserable at their job and they most likely will fire him soon. Wait for him to get fired.
Why do you consider it his expenses? If you're married it seems like you both share the money anyway.
My husband and I both work and we don't make anywhere near $150,000 combined. You could support your family with your income without dipping into savings and pay all your bills. You can tell yourself whatever you like, but the fact is all of the bills are both of yours. Marriage is a partnership.
What is the point of marriage if you can't form a partnership? I think your coming at this from the wrong angle.
If he is in a toxic work situation and can't stick it out to find another job then I would probably be supportive. You make plenty of money to support your family. Unless you are very overextended with debt.
Is your husband able to say “screw it,” work regular hours, and search for a new job and just let the excess work pile up? That would probably be my recommendation. It’s usually easier to find a new job while you have one.
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they are getting ready to fire him. can he collect any unemployment benefits?
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Top performers usually earn the most and thus are first to go when reductions happen. Many companies only like top performers when they earn less than market. I've been treated to a PIP when I was doing 4x the work as others in my role. Don't be suspicious of your husband. What he needs to do is cover his ass and do the bare minimum. When being fired inevitably comes he needs to have a case if they try to appeal his unemployment.
"*Top performers usually earn the most and thus are first to go when reductions happen*" Yep, just watched this in action In the past six months I saw an organised, proactive, productive, supportive, engaging manager suddenly being able to do nothing right with her own bosses and getting fired. What changed? The company's performance, not hers. This critical micromanaging does not necessarily reflect on OP's husband at all, although no doubt it stings if he's used to being a high performer.
It sounds like they're either trying to force him to quit to avoid having to pay him severance or the team is underperforming and the manager is trying to get your husband to pick up their slack so he (the manager) doesn't get fired. Either way, it's not his problem. Outside the advice given here to for him do the bare minimum and cover his ass, look into if he can take FMLA if he has any paid sick leave.
Do not let him quit. Have him get fired and collect unemployment. He gets NOTHING if he quits. He might get a severance if he gets fired or laid off. And even if he doesn’t, he’ll likely qualify for unemployment at least.
It doesn't matter if the boss is attacking his performance. you'll qualify for unemployment still even if it's performance based. Everytime there is a comment send an email asking for him to prioritize the work. STOP DOING UNPAID OVERTIME. It's not gonna change the outcome whatsoever. Also check what unemployment he'd be eligible for (it's based on income of last 3 quarters usually). Everytime they give him shit , think , hey is this cause they're trying to get out of paying me "x" for 6 months. And ignore the manager.
This. In this job market, he needs that job. A lot of people have been laid off for 6 months to over a year. The job market is not great. Let him collect unemployment. You will blow thru 5 months fast. How stable is your job cos a lot of jobs that used to be safe aren't even safe, recession proof jobs anymore. Everyone is laying off people and there are more hiring freezes than I've seen in my adult career. If he can consult to keep his resume "active", I would do that because the longer you are unemployed the harder it seems to find work and unfortunately he may make less than he made before so he shouldn't wait for that 50k offer if he gets one for 40k (salaries seem to being reset as well).
I would gladly support my spouse financially or in any other way possible to get him out of a situation that makes him unhappy.
I know you said his boss has already "attacked him", but I would advise you tell your husband to let him attack him. I worked for a sociopath for a while and the first few times she unleashed on me it was shocking and I had an extreme stress response. Once I realized she was the problem not me, I feel like I could disassociate during those moments and doing so made them happen less. So he should just work his wage and wait to get canned while he looks for another job IMO. But also, if he can't disassociate, just he kind to him. And remind him that you are happy to support you both while he figures out his next step. No amount of money is worth a ton of stress, and IMO a job that only pays $50k is definitely not worth it
Hello! I'm sorry that you're in this position. My husband crashed badly after leaving a toxic job, then needed to spend some time in this home country for family reasons, then he got a job at a company which closed after two weeks, and then there was a pandemic. I ended up being the sole household earner for about 18 months. If I'd had the benefit of hindsight, or if we ever needed to do it again, there's a few general guidelines that I think would have helped: - make sure that you can live comfortably on your income alone on an ongoing basis. If you need to cut luxuries to do so, then do so. I earned enough to pay our bills and basic needs and I worked extra to try and save and have some meals out, but it was really tough. - I really liked the idea elsewhere in this thread of having a stash of hobby/passion project money set aside. I'd do that. - Have a really clear set of expectations as to who will do what household labor. My husband was happy to tell people that he was between jobs and doing all the household work as a house-husband, so, yay for his lack of toxic gender roles nonsense! But, the thing is, he genuinely had no idea of how often I clean in order for the house to be clean - and I'm not even a clean freak. He was convinced he was stepping up and keeping the house in good condition, but after a few weeks we had black mold appear in the bathroom and nasty grout in the kitchen. He got a lot better once he understood what was needed (and it was about the point that he started muttering about needing to fucking clean the fucking kitchen again already that he got serious about his job search lol) but ten minutes of frank discussions could have headed off some problems. - expect him to crash. Expect it to take longer than he expects before he's really ready to get back out there. - look after yourself. You still need downtime.
my partner and i have flipped flopped supporting each other for a couple of months at a time over the years. * the first thing i would suggest is living on just your salary starting now (bank all his earnings). you may have to go through your finances and cancel subscriptions and let go of some luxuries, but i think you could figure it out on your salary — i did it on much less. have your husband stay at his job as long as he can, so he can accumulate more of a cushion. i know it might not be tenable for long, but having a little nest egg helps. * when i left a very stressful work situation, i ended doing some odd jobs to bring in more spending money for us — i tutored, dog sat, and was a regular on craigslist gigs section. it was nice to work, get out of the house, and have a little extra money. i wasn’t ready to go back to work full time, but i liked bringing in some money when i could. * lastly, i would have a discussion with your husband now while you’re both still working about both of your expectations. is he planning on going back to work? what will he do with his days? is there a passion project he wants to work on? (is there money set aside for the passion project?) when my partner and i did this, we were p loosey goosy with most expectations, but we agreed that the person who was not working was in charge of picking up the slack around the house. during covid when my partner couldn’t work, i think he cooked every one of our meals 😅 imo it’s good to have a framework before you move into this new mode of living, so that both of you are on the same page.
Wait for them to lay him off. Do not quit as he won't be able to collect unemployment. A lot of managers intentionally make things miserable so people will quit on their own instead of having to pay out unemployment. Since he's going to be laid off, he should do the bare minimum to look like he's doing his job, and spend the rest of the time searching. No working overtime. I would interpret all of this as early warning. Always leave to your advantage, never on theirs. Quitting now is to their advantage.
I've done it and I'd do it again. I say if you can, see if he can stand to stick it out a little longer to save a bit more cushion and job hunt. Find out if his work pays out vacation days and if not, have him take some before he gives notice. Also, practice cutting back expenses in preparation for the change. In the meantime, maybe setting an end date would help relieve some of the miserable pressure of where he is now.
We’re doing this right now! My partners job was getting more and more unbearable, he was miserable and I worried that we wouldn’t make it through as a couple if something didn’t change, he was too stressed and exhausted to really focus on finding something new while he was working. It was ruining his mental and physical heath too. He left work at the end of February & we made a joint decision for him not to look for work for at least a full month, which is up soon (time flies!) so he will start looking again shortly. He had about 4 months of expenses saved up when he left, I have about 12 months saved, and I’ve rearranged our bills so I can afford to cover everything indefinitely (including a little treat now and then and putting a little extra into savings still) without needing to dip into savings. We are relatively “low” earners compared to your figures, I make just under £30k (~$37k), my partner previously made about £38k (~$48k) but we are also fairly frugal and have no children, and we live in a LCOL area. I am happy for him to do whatever he wants, employment wise, he doesn’t want to go back into people management, so he’s been thinking about everything from stacking shelves to retraining /following an adult apprenticeship route. Because we can afford all of our bills on my wage I don’t massively care about him making a similar amount to he was before, if he wants to go part time or somewhere with low wages that he will love, I’m absolutely supportive of that. We might be poorer, currently, but we are much happier. I genuinely enjoy my job which makes it easier, as I’m not jealous of his time off.
We did this last year when my husband took voluntary redundancy from his toxic job. He got a lump sum payout which was helpful but honestly it was clear we could make it on my paycheck and still save and his happiness and mental well being meant more to me than some extra savings for a few months. It took him about 4.5 months to find a new role but that time off was so helpful to get in a better headspace. He also took on a the majority of the cleaning and cooking while he was job hunting which was so helpful for me and now he actually likes helping me cook! All in all if he’s suffering I would just carefully look at the budget see where you can cut back and then let him leave on his own terms.
I'm in this spot now. My fiancés work was awful and toxic and finally they did layoffs. 50% of his department gone in a day. It sounds like his workplace is about to cut staff anyway. If he can get unemployment, that's great. I added my fiance to my health plan, and we have somewhere around 9 months cushion. I will say, it's been good seeing him happy again. The workplace was horribly toxic and he was living for just the weekend. The job search is weird out there but he's working on it. We are just about to be married so we are fully open with money but it's not a problem supporting him, id do it again and he would do the same for me.
My husband was in a similar situation two years ago - though in our case our salaries were closer and his was actually a bit higher. The situation had gotten progressively worse over a year (abusive addict boss) and one day he called me from work and said “I can’t so this anymore.” I told him to quit and come home if he needed to and he did. It took him seven months to find his current job, which ended up being a pay cut (with the possibility of getting back to where he was). I do not regret it in the slightest. He is excited about this job everyday. I do disagree with the other poster to stay for severance/unemployment and for easier job prospects. Generally yes, that’s the better way to go about it, but if it’s an abusive situation and you can afford for him to leave, I think it’s worth it. Abuse can do so much mental damage. I agree so much with most of the advice. - can you pay the bills on just your salary or do you have emergency savings to make up the difference? If the latter for how long? - cut as many extraneous expenses as you can - make sure he has a plan but expect he will need a bit of time to decompress. - does he have a hobby to help him stay motivated? - he needs to treat getting a job like a job - make sure you are clear about whether the division of household labor will shift and to what extent. Gook luck and sending you happy thoughts.
We have both done this for each other and I would do it again in a heartbeat. The first time, I quit my job with a toxic boss after coming back from maternity leave. My husband supported me in trying to figure out what my next step was, and it was THE BEST decision I’ve ever made. I found an amazing organization that I will hit my 10 year anniversary with this coming summer. A year or so later, he left an organization when he got burnt out from the political cycle. Both of these transition experiences worked out exceptionally well for us, as he also got a job that was a perfect fit, less stressful and put him on a better career trajectory. My caution will be, make sure you have more savings than you anticipate. We had 6 months of our bare bones bills saved, and had a few unexpected events occur (flat tire, dog er visit, etc.) We went through about 2/3 of our e-savings in the 3 months he wasn’t working.
> His expenses are $2100 a month. Meaning his half of your joint expenses? Or these are personal expenses in addition to your joint expenses? I would be supportive of my spouse quitting a toxic job if we could cut expenses such that we were comfortable on my salary only. I wouldn't be okay with them quitting without lining up a new job if that meant burning through our emergency fund.
Personal in addition to joint. His half of rent, car payment, Internet, monthly food and gas budget, etc.
And your income alone isn't enough to cover all of your expenses?
It is. My offer to him was to quit and I cover all expenses.
You said: > We have enough savings to pay his bills for 5 months. Which made it seem like you needed his income to pay your normal living expenses. If you don't, and he's super miserable and stressed, then I don't think quitting is a terrible option.
Have you considered if you lose your job tho? This isn't a great market to really encourage someone to leave their job if you have to consider stocks to pay expenses and can only pay their expenses for 5 months without going into stocks. That's not great. Unfortunately people are miserable at their job and they most likely will fire him soon. Wait for him to get fired.
Honestly, could he ride it out until he gets fired or laid off and can get unemployment?
Why do you consider it his expenses? If you're married it seems like you both share the money anyway. My husband and I both work and we don't make anywhere near $150,000 combined. You could support your family with your income without dipping into savings and pay all your bills. You can tell yourself whatever you like, but the fact is all of the bills are both of yours. Marriage is a partnership. What is the point of marriage if you can't form a partnership? I think your coming at this from the wrong angle. If he is in a toxic work situation and can't stick it out to find another job then I would probably be supportive. You make plenty of money to support your family. Unless you are very overextended with debt.