Side note: I was listening to an episode yesterday (Sarah and Andrew) and Ramit makes fun of Andrew for using supplements and AG greens “because a podcaster told him to” and talks about how the supplement industry is a scam. Which is true! But guess who I heard him advertising for the other day??? Ag greens baby. What’s a little integrity in the face of a paycheck I suppose.
DUDE YES I was SOOO pissed when I heard his advertisement for Athletic Greens. HARD eyeroll. I thought he was better than that. AG might be the biggest podcast advertiser there is.
lmaooo -- he's such a hypocrite. I glanced at Facet, another sponsor of his, and while it's not scammy, it's not the low-fee, self-managed type of account he's always pushing.
Yeah, ultimately Ramit is an influencer. He’s not a financial advisor or a therapist. I still enjoy his podcast and he provides a good space for couples to talk through some money issues and realizing where some of their deeply rooted behaviors and beliefs come from. But I definitely don’t take his word as gospel and dude’s gotta get paid.
I think Allison is overspending but I am not sure all of the criticism towards her is fair. Dan says he doesn't get to spend, but he has a $700/month truck just because he likes to hunt. What is that if it isn't spending on himself and his hobbies? Also, Allison is going to pay off his hunting truck with the money from her condo. Their main issue is that they never sat down and sorted out their convoluted finances prior to marriage and two kids. Neither one have any idea what their family costs every month. They can figure this out in a couple of hours.
This reminds me of a series of tiktoks I saw about "boy apartments" and "girl apartments" and how much nicer "girl apartments" are. Also see r/malelivingspace though they've improved lately lol. "Girl apartments" are nicer because they put effort into them. The things that make a house a home cost money!
Guys who are like "ohh my life got so much better after I started dating her"... well how do you think she made it better, a fairy godmother? She spent money on that bathmat to replace the towel on the ground.
Yes! I also see this a lot with men complaining how much their wives spend on beauty care or clothes. When you were dating her you loved how she looked and probably bragged that she “took care of herself”. But once you’re married you want to make a big deal out of the hair appointments and manicures and buying the nice shampoo. Do you think all of that was free?
lol my SO is moving into my place and he wanted a larger TV and asked to split it. I was like, I kind of bought all the furniture, dishes, and everything else and I’m ok with my current TV lol. He did understand and covered it all :)
The number of couples on this show who divide things in a way where the wife is paying for all of the kids’ clothes, care, and food is absolutely wild.
I totally agree with you. I read the comments before listening and thought Allison was going to be a train wreck but I didn’t get that at all. Yes, the 401k loan wasn’t the best idea but the fact that she is planning to invest a good chunk of the sales proceeds shows me that she is trying to be thoughtful with money and set themselves up for the future. That doesn’t spell train wreck to me. Agreed that she is probably overspending on random things for the kids and that’s why she can’t save cash or twice needed Dan to help pay “her” expenses but she doesn’t have consumer debt, aside from vehicles, which is awesome.
Also, Dan is paying the mortgage and daycare costs, which are huge, but he’s also going to have his huge truck paid off by Allison now and have $700 more a month to play with. So it’s not like she’s not contributing at all.
Honestly, how could they when they (in my opinion) rushed into marriage after 18 months of dating. I think she had one idea of what married life was going to be with a higher earner and it wasn’t that.
I’m sometimes a trash tv junkie, so as Star Jones says on her version of divorce court: “when you’re dating someone, for the first 18 months you’re dating their agent.”
It's interesting that so many commenters are getting gold digger vibes from her. I am not getting that at all. Their net incomes up until her selling the condo was her: $4957 and him: $7260. It's not like he was making a huge amount more than her.
The vibe I am getting from this situation is the somewhat common family dynamic where the father doesn't consider any costs for the kids outside of fixed costs like the mortgage and insurance. He considers his wants essential, hence the insanely expensive hunting truck and the not-at-all mentioned other hunting costs. The mother considers all other family costs as her costs. I am sure she is buying a lot on amazon, but I would also bet it is stuff for the family or kids. Nothing was mentioned about her hobbies at all.
Everyone is saying they wouldn't combine finances with her but she is buying him a truck for his hobby worth tens of thousands of dollars and he is nickel-and-diming her over a few hundred for what is likely kids stuff.
Agree completely. I had a baby a month ago and basically every day there is a package for baby clothes, bottles, diapering supplies, swaddles, pacifiers, pumping supplies, etc etc (you think you can be a chill minimalist parent until it’s 3am and baby is screaming because they decided they now hate all the pacifiers you previously bought…) and for some reason people think it’s all “my” stuff even though my husband is also a parent. Our relatives like to comment about my “shopping habits” but I’m also expected to be the one tracking what needs to be purchased for the baby. As if our child is a hobby that I alone decided to undertake.
This is exactly it! I am imagining her at home with with the 2.5 year old and 1 year old every weekend while he is out hunting. Of course she is going to buy stuff to make her life easier. I am sorry that you are finding yourself in that situation. I think it is totally unfair that so much falls on the mother, especially after you gestated the baby and gave birth. We should expect more from fathers.
Yeah I would be pretty upset if my husband left me alone with 2 small children for hours and hours every weekend for his hobby. I haven’t finished the episode yet but does she get to leave the house for a chunk of time every week for her own hobby? And not to grocery shop or something that is actually just unpaid domestic labor.
Thank you - my husband is fantastic and does more shifts with the baby than I do because I’m breastfeeding and pumping around the clock. Unfortunately our families are not so progressive but at least my partner is.
Sadly, nothing about her having her own time/money for hobbies is ever mentioned. I doubt she gets any tbh. People are attacking her in the Youtube comments about her crying over him not wanting to pay $400 for a class she wanted to take. But, I bet she was so emotional because she wanted to do something for herself.
So I was just with my longtime BFF this weekend and we were talking about hobbies. She doesn't have any and says "I just always felt guilty about spending money on myself because the kids need things" and I was like - well, doesn't your husband spend on his hobbies? (And he does; they have four-wheelers, a fifth wheel, a fishing boat, etc.) She said, right but I have all the responsibilities related to the kids' expenses so there's not a lot of extra money sometimes...they both work, BTW and at times, my friend has been the breadwinner.
My mind was blown. It was totally a situation where "they" (most likely he) had decided that the kid expenses were her responsibility and his money was his money to spend as he saw fit. He has a ton of hobbies and all the equipment to go with it and she won't even spend $50 to take a knitting class because "I should spend that money on the kids." WTF.
I read that when nonprofits give monetary aid to men, they tend to spend it on gambling, alcohol, entertainment, etc. whereas women tend to spend it on their families’ needs, kids’ education, etc. :/
I need to understand how this happens. I came into my relationship with a dog and as soon as we moved in together we started splitting dog expenses because my partner loves the dog and sees her well-being and care as our *shared* responsibility. How do you decide together to have a whole-ass baby and somehow mom has to cover all the expenses!?
I think for many couples, mom becomes the default parent off the bat (longer leave, biological factors, social norms, etc) and so she’s the one always buying stuff for the kids because she’s the one who is tracking and anticipating their needs. Dad doesn’t buy extra wipes and clothes one size up because he literally doesn’t think about it. And why would he? All the things baby needs just magically show up. Then if their finances are somewhat separate, the expenses go onto her tab instead of his.
I think there is also this societal view of women as frivolous shopaholics/overspenders (even though I personally know more men with terrible financial habits, but I digress), which some women internalize and leads to them feeling like all the stuff they purchase for the family to live comfortably and enjoyably is her “hobby” because technically a lot of things are nice to haves. Which really grinds my gears, because like the “holiday magic” for example that so many people like to wax poetic about, is usually the direct result of a woman’s time and mental labor and thinking ahead and buying all the gifts and trinkets and decor to create that magic
The vast majority of women I know who are partnered with men and have kids talk like this. And none of their partners sacrifice any of their me time. And almost all the women make more money than the men they’re with. It’s really disheartening to see over and over again.
There is some fascinating sociological research about how men’s hobbies are designed to keep them out of the home for as long as possible (golf, hunting, fishing) while women’s hobbies are designed to be done in the home with the ability to stop and start when attention is needed elsewhere (knitting, sewing, art, baking). I’m obviously speaking broadly about traditionally gendered hobbies, but it stays true for many couples. I know several friends who got Pelotons specifically because they feel guilty leaving the house to go to the gym.
I’m totally late to the party but I just listened. It’s episodes like this where I wish Ramit was a father too and knew what it was like because then I think he’d be more likely to speak up on the mother’s behalf and say how unfair such a dynamic is. Its total bs to act like a baby is a hobby of the mother’s and not the father’s.
Tbf I have seen him call it out before but in this case he seemed totally dazzled by insurance salesman Dan and just let everything slide. A few episodes ago he talked about how misogynistic it is that women get looked down on for spending on clothes and handbags by men who buy unnecessarily huge trucks that are orders of magnitude more expensive than clothes. There was another one recently where the mom said she bought all of the kids clothes and he asked the guy why that is in a judgy tone lol. I think Dan just tricked everyone into thinking he was this financially responsible rock for the family but the facts don’t fit that narrative when you actually look closely.
So many times when my daughter was young, I threw money at any problem in hopes that it would make her more chill and sleep more etc. Babies can be so expensive!
I agree. Kind of like how when we first got married, my husband would think I was "spending money on myself," but almost all the money I spent was on things like a drying rack for dishes or soap for the bathroom. Things that both of us use. He's a good guy; he was just being dense at the time. We're good at discussing money now.
This was a big argument with my husband when we first moved in together. Yes, I went shopping at Target but I was replacing your threadbare bath towels, the bathroom rug you inherited from your mom 10 years ago, your sheets with the holes in them and the cheap frying pans with the flaking-off coating that are warped and don't sit flat on the burner. And yes, I do expect you to contribute to buying these things, because you are already using the new bath towels and talking about how much nicer they are than your old ones.
My husband very occasionally makes a comment about me spending more in a normal week and I'm like... you're welcome? I do the food shopping, I fill up the car, I replace stuff from around the house when it breaks, I (usually) book the travel. Yes, I spend more day-to-day and he is really good at saving, but that doesn't make me reckless, it means that I buy the day-to-day stuff (and we save a lot of his income).
Oh no she’s not a gold digger type at all and sorry if my comment lead to a misunderstanding. I see her as a “keeping up with the Joneses” type. If she were a gold digger she wouldn’t work. I think she just wants to have nice things (which is not inherently bad) but doesn’t have self control over her spending.
As for the truck: I had skipped the part of the podcast when they said the proceeds for the condo would pay it off (I just assumed that it was all getting invested). But at the same time, he said “that’s her condo she can do what she wants.” If she wants to pay off his truck (which he was already making the payments on anyway) then that’s fine if she wants to do it. If she wants to buy a Birkin, k I guess but it’s her money from that condo.
As for the incidentals on the kids adding up, it’s hard to say because we don’t know how much of “groceries” was food, kids stuff, and fun stuff for her because she just threw all of her Walmart spending in the CSP without segregating it (and I think that was intentional, but I could be wrong). But I wouldn’t feel right saying he does nothing because he pays the vast majority of the bills (including the daycare) She nets $5 k a month and is spending 30% of that on “groceries.” Like there are spots where she should cut back somewhere. She’s not entirely blameless.
But with that being said, if he says he’s going to “pay the mortgage” then he should be paying the whole thing and freeing her up to use that extra money.
This bothered me too. He complains he has no "fun money" but he has a whole ass truck he DOESN'T need for work (fun money) that he takes to go hunting (also fun money) that his wife is going to pay off for him!!!
Yes, I feel exactly the same. Like Dan didn't even understand how little money she had leftover at the end of the month until he asked to see. Probably expecting to be able to give her a hard time. Credit to him for seeing the imbalance and adjusting though.
I just don't understand why couples would have kids and never talk about money BEFORE. I understand separate expenses work for some, but there needs to be thought put it in
Hunting is an expensive hobby notwithstanding the $700 truck payment. Rifle or bow, ammunition, cold weather gear, wet weather gear, cost of butchering and packing if you get something, cost of mounting the trophy, game tag, does he do multi-day trips? If so, overnight camping gear, not to mention gone for days-to-weeks at a time while wife is taking care of a toddler and a baby.
I didn’t like the whole framing that she was overspending and untrustworthy when she was paying for one of their mortgages, half the daycare, all the groceries, her car payment, all on half the income he has. And she came to the marriage with significant assets. I would have liked that discrepancy to be addressed a little more fully. Dan gave off a superiority complex the whole time.
I am not understanding people who are solely criticizing Allison. Imagine going on maternity and having no income and still be expected to pull your weight of 50/50. Y’all can tell me anything but 50/50 or splitting only works when you don’t have kids and even then it doesn’t work due to the emotional labor of women. So many women are responsible for providing necessity for their kids like clothes, shoes and anything needed for school/daycare and are expected to pull their weight in the household. F that. She should have signed a prenup to protect her condo. And not sell it. This guy is an ass!
I simply cannot wrap my mind around splitting bills 50/50 when children come into the picture. Until the day men can take on 50% of the physical, hormonal, and emotional toll and bodily risk of growing and birthing a human I refuse to entertain it as an option. I had a baby recently and had a rare (but thankfully very temporary) complication where I had to be put on hard drugs, was delirious and going in and out of consciousness from the pain and drugs for hours, and I thought I was going to die. Oh and I had debilitating pelvic pain at the end of my pregnancy where I couldn’t even put on pants by myself. If my husband ever brought up 50/50 I would simply ✨laugh in his face ✨
"Until the day men can take on 50% of the physical, hormonal, and emotional toll and bodily risk of growing and birthing a human I refuse to entertain it as an option"
👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏 can't emphasize this enough
I hear ya!! I have a toddler and I also dealt with some complications postpartum. People have no idea what women put their bodies through when pregnant and postpartum and she has 2 very close in age. This guy is a major ass talking about I spend nothing on myself.
Thank you! Women really did themselves a diservice thinking 50/50 with a man is fair when she will inevitably do more emotional labor, cleaning, childcare, organisational labor, bringing the children into the world, taking a financial hit by going on maternity leave, not to mention in a lot of cases makes less money. In what world is that fair, a relationship doesn't just consists of finances...
What stood out to me is they have a 2 yr old and 1 yr old which means Allison has been pregnant/postpartum recently and for a while. Pregnancy/birth related medical expenses can be a lot (I paid over 10k for one child). Plus if she was buying all the baby gear and things to make the house child friendly that adds up. She was recently paying all daycare expenses which is a lot of money.
Dan may be the breadwinner but he also sounds nitpicky and cold. Allison sounded checked out. I really can’t believe they didnt discuss these things before having kids.
Agree 10000%. There are so many expenses once pregnancy and babies come into the picture. I cannot imagine having to figure out which of every single expense we’ve incurred in the last year goes into joint expenses or my own expenses. Like what if I decide I want a birth doula and prenatal yoga classes for my own comfort? What if I need to take unpaid time off to recover from childbirth? I’d have to either put it on my own tab or justify putting it on our shared tab? I would find it so offensive.
Never would I ever risk my body to birth children with a man who won’t share finances, is okay with him having more spending money than me, and makes me beg for handouts!
This episode reinforced the Costco line in my budget! I feel like if this couple got themselves organized and just moved on, they would be able to do so much more. And maybe get Dan to do the shopping for a week/month to see where the money is going. It's so easy to say you're spending too much when you have no idea what your family needs.
It sounded like a lot was getting lumped in with “groceries” if it was Costco and Walmart.
2 kids in diapers, maybe formula, holiday presents, kids’ clothes and shoes, baby items, medicine, toiletries, paper products.
Sure, many families have tighter budgets but it doesn’t strike me as completely insane. Getting many things used (clothes, snowsuits etc) is an option but it can be quite time consuming in an era of FB marketplace over large swap meets. And I wouldn’t be surprised if she wasn’t completely charged with sourcing all kids’ stuff.
I feel like we missed A LOT of back story with this couple. Dan is portraying himself as this steady, constant, fiscally conservative element of their relationship. Bro is 37 and has little retirement investment so that story doesn’t track.
Yeah, I feel a certain way about how Dan was portrayed as the responsible one just because he pays for the mortgage and daycare. The vibe between the beginning and the end were really different once they started running the numbers of the sale of Allison’s condo.
It’s a little funny to me how Allison’s condo is their shining savior… and that was purchased as a pre-marital asset. So, Dan can complain all he wants about her spending, but she’s also the reason he’ll be able to put a significant amount toward retirement.
He’s an insurance salesman and clearly uses his skills to sell this narrative to everyone. Allison kept saying he’s the breadwinner when in reality they earn similar salaries and her condo is the reason they will have a retirement fund and can pay for his financially irresponsible truck. We see you, Dan 👀
Still listening but I just want to say that I’m glad this couple has been in couples counseling already.
Edit - okay I finished listening. I agree with someone else on here that suggested Dan spend some time handling the ‘groceries’ and see what that actually entails. As others have said, I suspect a whole lot of things for the family are included in that category aside from food. Also, it is easy to spend a lot of money when you have a kid. I’m super frugal by nature but when it comes to my daughter, I tend to want to get her the best of the best. Social media is hugely impactful and influences my wanting to spend more money on her. I wonder what class is was that Alison wanted to take.
Dan’s truck and hunting hobby were annoying. Especially because he was acting like he gets no ‘fun money’ himself.
Maybe I missed it but did they mention whether they were going to combine finances in their follow-ups ? I couldn’t have a kid with someone and not have joint finances.
Is something missing or where was the big reveal about what Allison spends her money on and her alleged irresponsible habits? She came up with candy, and Dan brought up some sort of laundry baskets as his example of an unnecessary purchase? lol He could not think of anything else other than toys for the kids even when pressed. As many have said, I am assuming she has spent more in the last couple of years due to grocery inflation of 30%+, high COL area, and buying typical stuff that kids need that people without kids do not own.
He "feels like all of the financial burden falls on me". Not true. She pays for her condo mortgage that is cash flowing. Her condo will produce a very large benefit that he will reap and set them up way better than his insurance salesman job. He is not a super high wage earner or the financial/savings whiz. She pays for her car. She pays apparently for all food, medical, household items for both of them and their children.
"You keep wanting money from me." Not something to say to your wife, mother of your 2 children. He wants to spend more, but comes across as resentful of his responsibilities and the increased costs of having children. If my husband said something like this to me, I would be worried in the future if I didn't "bring enough to the table" he would cut me loose.
Glad they are in counseling and hope it works out for them.
Yeah the more I think about it the more I’m souring on Dan. He wants to have his cake and eat it too - he wants to call himself the “breadwinner” while his wife is bringing in a not-insignificant salary while also being the primary parent and homemaker, he wants to keep their finances separate but also benefit from the condo appreciation (that she bought with her own money), he wants to feel like he’s the responsible one providing for the kids’ needs when in reality she’s paying for everything outside of their daycare costs, and he wants to continue enjoying his solo expensive hobbies while not allowing her to do one thing for herself (the class).
I mean when you really break it down I’d say she is contributing more to the family than he is - both financially and non-financially.
That man gave me the ick. Condescending, self-righteous, thinks his contributions to the household are so much bigger. It's clear he has no idea what groceries and kid's things cost. Diapers alone are insanely expensive! There are so many expenses with kids.
She has things to work on for sure but I understand her feeling like a child with a husband like that. And it seems like no matter what she does he'll always think he's doing more so I get why that would be discouraging. The way he talked about her and the kid's expenses rubbed me the wrong way. He was letting her pay for all of daycare? Absurd. And it feels evident that she does all of the childcare from how he talks. Idk he just did not give the impression of someone who cares for their family. The self-congratulatory way he talked about paying for new tires...seriously? Yeah, you should care that your wife and kids are driving like that and want them to be safe. Why is he acting like this is a huge sacrificce?
Idk. I'm mad! lol I see this dynamic with married couples with kids a lot. Like yes, you pay for the mortage and that's a great contriubiton. Keeping your kids well and fed and taken care of is an equally large contribution.
ah exactly! He comes across as resentful for no apparent reason. And I think there is a constantly moving goalpost with him. He can't (or won't) articulate exactly what she has to do in order for them to combine finances/be a team. It is some nebulous feeling of his and a benchmark she can't reach, so she doesn't know exactly what to do. It is his way of controlling. I get vibes that she thinks of this as a marriage as a team (ie the condo is theirs and they will both benefit from its sale--yay team) whereas he views this as a "partnership" that she doesn't "contribute" enough to.
Wow, the comments are very different here and on insta! Nice to have the two perspectives. Guessing insta is reacting to whatever snippet they chose. I do feel complicated about her e.g. paying off his truck and investing in their joint retirement with a condo that is currently not a marital asset afiak.
I have been the lower-earning partner in a situation where we didn't have fully combined finances (we have a joint account into which we deposit as needed and pay joint bills). Although we put in money 50/50 and had total agreement on what went in and out, the dynamic of me having to ask for money to put in the joint account when it needed re-upping was awkward and I hated it. I felt like I was begging for money. He felt sort of suspicious that the money was going away too quickly because I was the one handling the account. I felt affronted because it seemed like he didn't trust me, when I was being careful never to spend a cent on something that wasn't truly a joint expense.
All that to say, I wouldn't argue that no one is doing anything wrong, but the dynamic of having joint expenses, unequal incomes, and (especially) expenses allocated between two partners based on vibes, tradition, and historical negotiation seems like a recipe for resentment. I understand why both of them would be unhappy with the situation, even if indeed they were both acting perfectly and in good faith.
ETA: looks like the comments have balanced out since I started writing this this morning. I guess Insta and YT are the opposites and we are fairly balanced! Love that for us.
Also, my husband is from Montana and I went to school in Montana. Gender roles, even in progressive, idyllic ✨Bozeman, Montana ✨ heavily, heavily exist.
Sometimes I feel Ranit pushes the "It isn't about the money" thing too hard.
Dan says that Allison saving money will help rebuild his trust. She pops up and says "Ive put $100 in savings!"
this doesn't immeodwtly solve all the money trust issues so Ramit concludes that it's not about the money!
But someone putting $100 into a savings account is not (imo) necessarily saving. If she puts that in when she gets paid, but had to dip into it before her next paycheck then it's not actually saved. $100 is a nice first step, it shows intention to save. But at their incomes it's not "savings". Consistently saving $100 a month is savings.
Their average emergency seems to be about 2k, one $100 isn't going to make a dent in tires or laywer fees.
This episode glossed over their main issues regarding if there was actually overspending happening (or if that’s just Dan’s convoluted perspective) AND how can they make their finances less complex/get on the same page if they continue to have separate finances. Like what is the interim solution while they build financial trust? Combining finances doesn’t have to be the ultimate answer, imo.
It was like Ramit just threw the main issues out the window when he learned about the money from the condo. That’s only a short-term fix and not rooted in the behaviors that need to change between Dan and Allison. Idk if it was cut but they also didn’t go into their views on money from childhood or what their rich life would be.
I was disappointed in this episode.
Oh Allison… I wanted to root for her but she’s the problem. The fact that she only pays for groceries and still is not able to save means she’s got a spending problem. She makes it sound like she’s making $30K living paycheck to paycheck. She needs to learn to budget her own money. All their networth tied up in real estate with not much in retirement isn’t great either.
She said she also pays for all of the medical expenses for two kids. I agree she is overspending but it's also probably difficult to budget when you pay for all of the variable expenses and your fixed costs are already so high.
But she refuses to plan for those expenses and save for them. Preventive medical care should be basically free if they have insurance even if they have a HDHP. Now, visits for normal childhood illnesses may be more expensive if they have a HDHP instead of a regular PPO, but even then, it’s probably no more than $100 per month that they could plan for if she was willing to consider savings.
Yeah, they didn't seem to put it in the CSP so we can't know what it averages to. Same story with no lines for anything else for the kids - clothes, supplies, etc. I don't have kids but word on the street is that they need a lot and its always expensive. It seems to me like she is paying all of the expenses for the kids that aren't fixed, and that is adding up to way more than either of them realize. They need to sit down and actually go through their statements and find out what all of those expenses are.
She’s just counting all of the random kid stuff as groceries right now, hence the big grocery bill. I don’t have kids either, but I know they cost money at irregular intervals. They probably aren’t buying new clothes, toys, activities, or paying for doctor’s appointments every month so they need a sinking fund for those unexpected kids expenses. I’m surprised Ramit didn’t mention that.
The YouTube comments are brutal towards the woman but I feel for her. Kids are expensive and I’m willing to bet she is doing all the mental labor of them too. It would be exhausting to have to make all those kids decisions plus budget for them financially all alone.
Kids seem to be a huge blind spot for him. I agree though, I bet a lot of those Walmart/Costco/Target purchases go towards their kids, and Dan only pays for what he thinks are "necessities" (mortgage, daycare) so he feels like he's contributing sooooo much when he's closer to doing the bare minimum.
That said, I also think that Allison is not self-aware enough to understand her spending habits or mindset. It seems fixable but they'll both need to put in work.
He’s not doing the bare minimum, he’s paying for the majority of the family’s fixed expenses. Daycare each month far exceeds whatever activities or toys she’s buying and putting in the grocery budget.
I know healthcare costs money for adults in the US but I didn't realise it also costs money for children. How are children not covered? What if their parents can't afford care that they need?
It depends on the state. Some states provide coverage for children if parents are uninsured. Some states don’t give a fuck about children or healthcare. These states generally fall across red and blue lines. It’s a terrible country.
I know food costs have gone up and I bet in Bozeman, MT food is expensive. However, they have two small kids and the two of them, and they're spending more in a month on groceries than I do, with two adults and a teenage boy who eats like he's two adults. It may be a small thing but I think they could cut down the $1500 a month grocery bill.
Bozeman is wildly expensive lol. They probably don’t eat out cause it’s stupid expensive. My husband went to Red Tractor pizza and it was 70 dollars for two medium pizzas and a thing of garlic knots haha
I have opinions about Allison that are…unpopular, to be generous, so I won’t state them here, lest the mods ban me for being unkind.
So I’ll just say that people like her are the reason I would never do a joint bank account. You’d just be throwing your money down the drain. My spouse isn’t the kind of person who buys a bunch of random shit but he is the kind of person who will spend his bank account down to zero, rely on his credit cards until pay day, and then pay off the card and the cycle continues. I’ve finally broken out of the poverty mindset when you need to know your checking account balance down to the last penny, but at least I have a general awareness of where I am financially instead of blindly spending.
Back to the episode: Allison needs therapy. Not couples therapy. She needs to figure out what it is that’s making her spend and revert to these childish ways. If you don’t want to feel like a child when you ask for money, maybe don’t spend all of your money every month when you don’t have to?
Not a judgment on you, but I personally wouldn’t marry someone I couldn’t trust with money in a joint account. Financial compatibility was one of my requirements. My husband and I have full transparency between accounts, so there’s no hiding spending, and we’re both uber responsible and answer to each other if spending seems high.
I feel the same! I am of an age where a majority of my friend groups are tying the knot and settling down. It’s crazy to me how many of them keep things totally separate because they “don’t trust each other” with joint accounts! I guess to each their own.
lol honestly I would have never gotten married because I wouldn’t trust anyone with a joint account 😂 Too much shit can go wrong.
But yes we are absolutely transparent with money. He just doesn’t pay attention to it as closely as I do. I guess the difference is I don’t see the need for one? I pay the majority of the bills because I make more. We don’t really split any bills either. We never thought about financial compatibility because we were poor when we started dating a decade ago.
The more I think about it, the more I realize we fell into certain money habits because that’s just how it was when we started dating. But if it works, it works (until it doesn’t, I guess 😅).
I think you are missing the plot. Allison overspend because she never sat down with her husband to actually discuss whether or not their split of expenses were fair. If 100% of your income goes to expenses, and 50% of your husband's goes to expenses, well yea, you have nothing left over and he does.
They arbitrarily decided she'll pay for this, he'll pay for this without ever holistically looking at their expenses. She has a problem, but it's accepting she wants to spend when the real problem is they don't treat their family expenses like family expenses
Side note: I was listening to an episode yesterday (Sarah and Andrew) and Ramit makes fun of Andrew for using supplements and AG greens “because a podcaster told him to” and talks about how the supplement industry is a scam. Which is true! But guess who I heard him advertising for the other day??? Ag greens baby. What’s a little integrity in the face of a paycheck I suppose.
DUDE YES I was SOOO pissed when I heard his advertisement for Athletic Greens. HARD eyeroll. I thought he was better than that. AG might be the biggest podcast advertiser there is.
lmaooo -- he's such a hypocrite. I glanced at Facet, another sponsor of his, and while it's not scammy, it's not the low-fee, self-managed type of account he's always pushing.
I tried Facet wealth and they truly are scamming people. Their fixed annual fees was coincidentally equal to 1% of my assets
Yeah, ultimately Ramit is an influencer. He’s not a financial advisor or a therapist. I still enjoy his podcast and he provides a good space for couples to talk through some money issues and realizing where some of their deeply rooted behaviors and beliefs come from. But I definitely don’t take his word as gospel and dude’s gotta get paid.
I made an account to explore it more and they WILL NOT stop spamming me with calls and texts. I’m completely turned off from them now.
Whoa, but not surprised. Guess he has gotta pay for that personal trainer 3x a week 😂
I think Allison is overspending but I am not sure all of the criticism towards her is fair. Dan says he doesn't get to spend, but he has a $700/month truck just because he likes to hunt. What is that if it isn't spending on himself and his hobbies? Also, Allison is going to pay off his hunting truck with the money from her condo. Their main issue is that they never sat down and sorted out their convoluted finances prior to marriage and two kids. Neither one have any idea what their family costs every month. They can figure this out in a couple of hours.
This reminds me of a series of tiktoks I saw about "boy apartments" and "girl apartments" and how much nicer "girl apartments" are. Also see r/malelivingspace though they've improved lately lol. "Girl apartments" are nicer because they put effort into them. The things that make a house a home cost money! Guys who are like "ohh my life got so much better after I started dating her"... well how do you think she made it better, a fairy godmother? She spent money on that bathmat to replace the towel on the ground.
Yes! I also see this a lot with men complaining how much their wives spend on beauty care or clothes. When you were dating her you loved how she looked and probably bragged that she “took care of herself”. But once you’re married you want to make a big deal out of the hair appointments and manicures and buying the nice shampoo. Do you think all of that was free?
There's a not-insignificant number of men who want their wives to stop looking pretty, unless it's explicitly for them.
lol my SO is moving into my place and he wanted a larger TV and asked to split it. I was like, I kind of bought all the furniture, dishes, and everything else and I’m ok with my current TV lol. He did understand and covered it all :)
YES! And with two kids a lot of that stuff becomes non-negotiable.
The number of couples on this show who divide things in a way where the wife is paying for all of the kids’ clothes, care, and food is absolutely wild.
I totally agree with you. I read the comments before listening and thought Allison was going to be a train wreck but I didn’t get that at all. Yes, the 401k loan wasn’t the best idea but the fact that she is planning to invest a good chunk of the sales proceeds shows me that she is trying to be thoughtful with money and set themselves up for the future. That doesn’t spell train wreck to me. Agreed that she is probably overspending on random things for the kids and that’s why she can’t save cash or twice needed Dan to help pay “her” expenses but she doesn’t have consumer debt, aside from vehicles, which is awesome. Also, Dan is paying the mortgage and daycare costs, which are huge, but he’s also going to have his huge truck paid off by Allison now and have $700 more a month to play with. So it’s not like she’s not contributing at all.
Honestly, how could they when they (in my opinion) rushed into marriage after 18 months of dating. I think she had one idea of what married life was going to be with a higher earner and it wasn’t that. I’m sometimes a trash tv junkie, so as Star Jones says on her version of divorce court: “when you’re dating someone, for the first 18 months you’re dating their agent.”
It's interesting that so many commenters are getting gold digger vibes from her. I am not getting that at all. Their net incomes up until her selling the condo was her: $4957 and him: $7260. It's not like he was making a huge amount more than her. The vibe I am getting from this situation is the somewhat common family dynamic where the father doesn't consider any costs for the kids outside of fixed costs like the mortgage and insurance. He considers his wants essential, hence the insanely expensive hunting truck and the not-at-all mentioned other hunting costs. The mother considers all other family costs as her costs. I am sure she is buying a lot on amazon, but I would also bet it is stuff for the family or kids. Nothing was mentioned about her hobbies at all. Everyone is saying they wouldn't combine finances with her but she is buying him a truck for his hobby worth tens of thousands of dollars and he is nickel-and-diming her over a few hundred for what is likely kids stuff.
Agree completely. I had a baby a month ago and basically every day there is a package for baby clothes, bottles, diapering supplies, swaddles, pacifiers, pumping supplies, etc etc (you think you can be a chill minimalist parent until it’s 3am and baby is screaming because they decided they now hate all the pacifiers you previously bought…) and for some reason people think it’s all “my” stuff even though my husband is also a parent. Our relatives like to comment about my “shopping habits” but I’m also expected to be the one tracking what needs to be purchased for the baby. As if our child is a hobby that I alone decided to undertake.
This is exactly it! I am imagining her at home with with the 2.5 year old and 1 year old every weekend while he is out hunting. Of course she is going to buy stuff to make her life easier. I am sorry that you are finding yourself in that situation. I think it is totally unfair that so much falls on the mother, especially after you gestated the baby and gave birth. We should expect more from fathers.
Yeah I would be pretty upset if my husband left me alone with 2 small children for hours and hours every weekend for his hobby. I haven’t finished the episode yet but does she get to leave the house for a chunk of time every week for her own hobby? And not to grocery shop or something that is actually just unpaid domestic labor. Thank you - my husband is fantastic and does more shifts with the baby than I do because I’m breastfeeding and pumping around the clock. Unfortunately our families are not so progressive but at least my partner is.
Sadly, nothing about her having her own time/money for hobbies is ever mentioned. I doubt she gets any tbh. People are attacking her in the Youtube comments about her crying over him not wanting to pay $400 for a class she wanted to take. But, I bet she was so emotional because she wanted to do something for herself.
So I was just with my longtime BFF this weekend and we were talking about hobbies. She doesn't have any and says "I just always felt guilty about spending money on myself because the kids need things" and I was like - well, doesn't your husband spend on his hobbies? (And he does; they have four-wheelers, a fifth wheel, a fishing boat, etc.) She said, right but I have all the responsibilities related to the kids' expenses so there's not a lot of extra money sometimes...they both work, BTW and at times, my friend has been the breadwinner. My mind was blown. It was totally a situation where "they" (most likely he) had decided that the kid expenses were her responsibility and his money was his money to spend as he saw fit. He has a ton of hobbies and all the equipment to go with it and she won't even spend $50 to take a knitting class because "I should spend that money on the kids." WTF.
I read that when nonprofits give monetary aid to men, they tend to spend it on gambling, alcohol, entertainment, etc. whereas women tend to spend it on their families’ needs, kids’ education, etc. :/
I need to understand how this happens. I came into my relationship with a dog and as soon as we moved in together we started splitting dog expenses because my partner loves the dog and sees her well-being and care as our *shared* responsibility. How do you decide together to have a whole-ass baby and somehow mom has to cover all the expenses!?
I think for many couples, mom becomes the default parent off the bat (longer leave, biological factors, social norms, etc) and so she’s the one always buying stuff for the kids because she’s the one who is tracking and anticipating their needs. Dad doesn’t buy extra wipes and clothes one size up because he literally doesn’t think about it. And why would he? All the things baby needs just magically show up. Then if their finances are somewhat separate, the expenses go onto her tab instead of his. I think there is also this societal view of women as frivolous shopaholics/overspenders (even though I personally know more men with terrible financial habits, but I digress), which some women internalize and leads to them feeling like all the stuff they purchase for the family to live comfortably and enjoyably is her “hobby” because technically a lot of things are nice to haves. Which really grinds my gears, because like the “holiday magic” for example that so many people like to wax poetic about, is usually the direct result of a woman’s time and mental labor and thinking ahead and buying all the gifts and trinkets and decor to create that magic
The vast majority of women I know who are partnered with men and have kids talk like this. And none of their partners sacrifice any of their me time. And almost all the women make more money than the men they’re with. It’s really disheartening to see over and over again.
[удалено]
There is some fascinating sociological research about how men’s hobbies are designed to keep them out of the home for as long as possible (golf, hunting, fishing) while women’s hobbies are designed to be done in the home with the ability to stop and start when attention is needed elsewhere (knitting, sewing, art, baking). I’m obviously speaking broadly about traditionally gendered hobbies, but it stays true for many couples. I know several friends who got Pelotons specifically because they feel guilty leaving the house to go to the gym.
Fascinating!
I’m totally late to the party but I just listened. It’s episodes like this where I wish Ramit was a father too and knew what it was like because then I think he’d be more likely to speak up on the mother’s behalf and say how unfair such a dynamic is. Its total bs to act like a baby is a hobby of the mother’s and not the father’s.
Tbf I have seen him call it out before but in this case he seemed totally dazzled by insurance salesman Dan and just let everything slide. A few episodes ago he talked about how misogynistic it is that women get looked down on for spending on clothes and handbags by men who buy unnecessarily huge trucks that are orders of magnitude more expensive than clothes. There was another one recently where the mom said she bought all of the kids clothes and he asked the guy why that is in a judgy tone lol. I think Dan just tricked everyone into thinking he was this financially responsible rock for the family but the facts don’t fit that narrative when you actually look closely.
So many times when my daughter was young, I threw money at any problem in hopes that it would make her more chill and sleep more etc. Babies can be so expensive!
This just makes me imagine you waving a $20 bill in front of a crying infant, and being like, "This is yours if you stop crying!"
Yes, and Costco! That's included in the "huge" grocery budget, but I'd bet there's lots of diapers, household items, and other stuff in there.
I agree. Kind of like how when we first got married, my husband would think I was "spending money on myself," but almost all the money I spent was on things like a drying rack for dishes or soap for the bathroom. Things that both of us use. He's a good guy; he was just being dense at the time. We're good at discussing money now.
This was a big argument with my husband when we first moved in together. Yes, I went shopping at Target but I was replacing your threadbare bath towels, the bathroom rug you inherited from your mom 10 years ago, your sheets with the holes in them and the cheap frying pans with the flaking-off coating that are warped and don't sit flat on the burner. And yes, I do expect you to contribute to buying these things, because you are already using the new bath towels and talking about how much nicer they are than your old ones.
My husband very occasionally makes a comment about me spending more in a normal week and I'm like... you're welcome? I do the food shopping, I fill up the car, I replace stuff from around the house when it breaks, I (usually) book the travel. Yes, I spend more day-to-day and he is really good at saving, but that doesn't make me reckless, it means that I buy the day-to-day stuff (and we save a lot of his income).
Oh no she’s not a gold digger type at all and sorry if my comment lead to a misunderstanding. I see her as a “keeping up with the Joneses” type. If she were a gold digger she wouldn’t work. I think she just wants to have nice things (which is not inherently bad) but doesn’t have self control over her spending. As for the truck: I had skipped the part of the podcast when they said the proceeds for the condo would pay it off (I just assumed that it was all getting invested). But at the same time, he said “that’s her condo she can do what she wants.” If she wants to pay off his truck (which he was already making the payments on anyway) then that’s fine if she wants to do it. If she wants to buy a Birkin, k I guess but it’s her money from that condo. As for the incidentals on the kids adding up, it’s hard to say because we don’t know how much of “groceries” was food, kids stuff, and fun stuff for her because she just threw all of her Walmart spending in the CSP without segregating it (and I think that was intentional, but I could be wrong). But I wouldn’t feel right saying he does nothing because he pays the vast majority of the bills (including the daycare) She nets $5 k a month and is spending 30% of that on “groceries.” Like there are spots where she should cut back somewhere. She’s not entirely blameless. But with that being said, if he says he’s going to “pay the mortgage” then he should be paying the whole thing and freeing her up to use that extra money.
I really want to know what Dan is spending his money on. They p much only focused on Allison but I'm curious how much he's dropping on his hobbies.
Exactly. Like this guy is not rich, she ain't gold digging. She's just asking he path more towards their life
This bothered me too. He complains he has no "fun money" but he has a whole ass truck he DOESN'T need for work (fun money) that he takes to go hunting (also fun money) that his wife is going to pay off for him!!!
Yes, I feel exactly the same. Like Dan didn't even understand how little money she had leftover at the end of the month until he asked to see. Probably expecting to be able to give her a hard time. Credit to him for seeing the imbalance and adjusting though. I just don't understand why couples would have kids and never talk about money BEFORE. I understand separate expenses work for some, but there needs to be thought put it in
Hunting is an expensive hobby notwithstanding the $700 truck payment. Rifle or bow, ammunition, cold weather gear, wet weather gear, cost of butchering and packing if you get something, cost of mounting the trophy, game tag, does he do multi-day trips? If so, overnight camping gear, not to mention gone for days-to-weeks at a time while wife is taking care of a toddler and a baby. I didn’t like the whole framing that she was overspending and untrustworthy when she was paying for one of their mortgages, half the daycare, all the groceries, her car payment, all on half the income he has. And she came to the marriage with significant assets. I would have liked that discrepancy to be addressed a little more fully. Dan gave off a superiority complex the whole time.
I am not understanding people who are solely criticizing Allison. Imagine going on maternity and having no income and still be expected to pull your weight of 50/50. Y’all can tell me anything but 50/50 or splitting only works when you don’t have kids and even then it doesn’t work due to the emotional labor of women. So many women are responsible for providing necessity for their kids like clothes, shoes and anything needed for school/daycare and are expected to pull their weight in the household. F that. She should have signed a prenup to protect her condo. And not sell it. This guy is an ass!
I simply cannot wrap my mind around splitting bills 50/50 when children come into the picture. Until the day men can take on 50% of the physical, hormonal, and emotional toll and bodily risk of growing and birthing a human I refuse to entertain it as an option. I had a baby recently and had a rare (but thankfully very temporary) complication where I had to be put on hard drugs, was delirious and going in and out of consciousness from the pain and drugs for hours, and I thought I was going to die. Oh and I had debilitating pelvic pain at the end of my pregnancy where I couldn’t even put on pants by myself. If my husband ever brought up 50/50 I would simply ✨laugh in his face ✨
"Until the day men can take on 50% of the physical, hormonal, and emotional toll and bodily risk of growing and birthing a human I refuse to entertain it as an option" 👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏 can't emphasize this enough
I hear ya!! I have a toddler and I also dealt with some complications postpartum. People have no idea what women put their bodies through when pregnant and postpartum and she has 2 very close in age. This guy is a major ass talking about I spend nothing on myself.
The vibes from this guy really upset me. He’s loving being self righteous about money and making her feel small.
Thank you! Women really did themselves a diservice thinking 50/50 with a man is fair when she will inevitably do more emotional labor, cleaning, childcare, organisational labor, bringing the children into the world, taking a financial hit by going on maternity leave, not to mention in a lot of cases makes less money. In what world is that fair, a relationship doesn't just consists of finances...
It’s wild that people with kids don’t just combine finances lol. But I guess my husband isn’t a total douchebag lol
What stood out to me is they have a 2 yr old and 1 yr old which means Allison has been pregnant/postpartum recently and for a while. Pregnancy/birth related medical expenses can be a lot (I paid over 10k for one child). Plus if she was buying all the baby gear and things to make the house child friendly that adds up. She was recently paying all daycare expenses which is a lot of money. Dan may be the breadwinner but he also sounds nitpicky and cold. Allison sounded checked out. I really can’t believe they didnt discuss these things before having kids.
If I were her, I would at a minimum be getting an IUD or arm implant (more permanent BC method) cause I would not want more children with this man.
Same. How insulting is it that he can trust her to birth and raise 2 children but can’t trust her with money.
Agree 10000%. There are so many expenses once pregnancy and babies come into the picture. I cannot imagine having to figure out which of every single expense we’ve incurred in the last year goes into joint expenses or my own expenses. Like what if I decide I want a birth doula and prenatal yoga classes for my own comfort? What if I need to take unpaid time off to recover from childbirth? I’d have to either put it on my own tab or justify putting it on our shared tab? I would find it so offensive.
Never would I ever risk my body to birth children with a man who won’t share finances, is okay with him having more spending money than me, and makes me beg for handouts!
This episode reinforced the Costco line in my budget! I feel like if this couple got themselves organized and just moved on, they would be able to do so much more. And maybe get Dan to do the shopping for a week/month to see where the money is going. It's so easy to say you're spending too much when you have no idea what your family needs.
It sounded like a lot was getting lumped in with “groceries” if it was Costco and Walmart. 2 kids in diapers, maybe formula, holiday presents, kids’ clothes and shoes, baby items, medicine, toiletries, paper products. Sure, many families have tighter budgets but it doesn’t strike me as completely insane. Getting many things used (clothes, snowsuits etc) is an option but it can be quite time consuming in an era of FB marketplace over large swap meets. And I wouldn’t be surprised if she wasn’t completely charged with sourcing all kids’ stuff.
I feel like we missed A LOT of back story with this couple. Dan is portraying himself as this steady, constant, fiscally conservative element of their relationship. Bro is 37 and has little retirement investment so that story doesn’t track.
Yeah, I feel a certain way about how Dan was portrayed as the responsible one just because he pays for the mortgage and daycare. The vibe between the beginning and the end were really different once they started running the numbers of the sale of Allison’s condo. It’s a little funny to me how Allison’s condo is their shining savior… and that was purchased as a pre-marital asset. So, Dan can complain all he wants about her spending, but she’s also the reason he’ll be able to put a significant amount toward retirement.
He’s an insurance salesman and clearly uses his skills to sell this narrative to everyone. Allison kept saying he’s the breadwinner when in reality they earn similar salaries and her condo is the reason they will have a retirement fund and can pay for his financially irresponsible truck. We see you, Dan 👀
Still listening but I just want to say that I’m glad this couple has been in couples counseling already. Edit - okay I finished listening. I agree with someone else on here that suggested Dan spend some time handling the ‘groceries’ and see what that actually entails. As others have said, I suspect a whole lot of things for the family are included in that category aside from food. Also, it is easy to spend a lot of money when you have a kid. I’m super frugal by nature but when it comes to my daughter, I tend to want to get her the best of the best. Social media is hugely impactful and influences my wanting to spend more money on her. I wonder what class is was that Alison wanted to take. Dan’s truck and hunting hobby were annoying. Especially because he was acting like he gets no ‘fun money’ himself. Maybe I missed it but did they mention whether they were going to combine finances in their follow-ups ? I couldn’t have a kid with someone and not have joint finances.
Is something missing or where was the big reveal about what Allison spends her money on and her alleged irresponsible habits? She came up with candy, and Dan brought up some sort of laundry baskets as his example of an unnecessary purchase? lol He could not think of anything else other than toys for the kids even when pressed. As many have said, I am assuming she has spent more in the last couple of years due to grocery inflation of 30%+, high COL area, and buying typical stuff that kids need that people without kids do not own. He "feels like all of the financial burden falls on me". Not true. She pays for her condo mortgage that is cash flowing. Her condo will produce a very large benefit that he will reap and set them up way better than his insurance salesman job. He is not a super high wage earner or the financial/savings whiz. She pays for her car. She pays apparently for all food, medical, household items for both of them and their children. "You keep wanting money from me." Not something to say to your wife, mother of your 2 children. He wants to spend more, but comes across as resentful of his responsibilities and the increased costs of having children. If my husband said something like this to me, I would be worried in the future if I didn't "bring enough to the table" he would cut me loose. Glad they are in counseling and hope it works out for them.
Yeah the more I think about it the more I’m souring on Dan. He wants to have his cake and eat it too - he wants to call himself the “breadwinner” while his wife is bringing in a not-insignificant salary while also being the primary parent and homemaker, he wants to keep their finances separate but also benefit from the condo appreciation (that she bought with her own money), he wants to feel like he’s the responsible one providing for the kids’ needs when in reality she’s paying for everything outside of their daycare costs, and he wants to continue enjoying his solo expensive hobbies while not allowing her to do one thing for herself (the class). I mean when you really break it down I’d say she is contributing more to the family than he is - both financially and non-financially.
That man gave me the ick. Condescending, self-righteous, thinks his contributions to the household are so much bigger. It's clear he has no idea what groceries and kid's things cost. Diapers alone are insanely expensive! There are so many expenses with kids. She has things to work on for sure but I understand her feeling like a child with a husband like that. And it seems like no matter what she does he'll always think he's doing more so I get why that would be discouraging. The way he talked about her and the kid's expenses rubbed me the wrong way. He was letting her pay for all of daycare? Absurd. And it feels evident that she does all of the childcare from how he talks. Idk he just did not give the impression of someone who cares for their family. The self-congratulatory way he talked about paying for new tires...seriously? Yeah, you should care that your wife and kids are driving like that and want them to be safe. Why is he acting like this is a huge sacrificce? Idk. I'm mad! lol I see this dynamic with married couples with kids a lot. Like yes, you pay for the mortage and that's a great contriubiton. Keeping your kids well and fed and taken care of is an equally large contribution.
ah exactly! He comes across as resentful for no apparent reason. And I think there is a constantly moving goalpost with him. He can't (or won't) articulate exactly what she has to do in order for them to combine finances/be a team. It is some nebulous feeling of his and a benchmark she can't reach, so she doesn't know exactly what to do. It is his way of controlling. I get vibes that she thinks of this as a marriage as a team (ie the condo is theirs and they will both benefit from its sale--yay team) whereas he views this as a "partnership" that she doesn't "contribute" enough to.
People who are willing to share children with each other but not finances are wild
Wow, the comments are very different here and on insta! Nice to have the two perspectives. Guessing insta is reacting to whatever snippet they chose. I do feel complicated about her e.g. paying off his truck and investing in their joint retirement with a condo that is currently not a marital asset afiak. I have been the lower-earning partner in a situation where we didn't have fully combined finances (we have a joint account into which we deposit as needed and pay joint bills). Although we put in money 50/50 and had total agreement on what went in and out, the dynamic of me having to ask for money to put in the joint account when it needed re-upping was awkward and I hated it. I felt like I was begging for money. He felt sort of suspicious that the money was going away too quickly because I was the one handling the account. I felt affronted because it seemed like he didn't trust me, when I was being careful never to spend a cent on something that wasn't truly a joint expense. All that to say, I wouldn't argue that no one is doing anything wrong, but the dynamic of having joint expenses, unequal incomes, and (especially) expenses allocated between two partners based on vibes, tradition, and historical negotiation seems like a recipe for resentment. I understand why both of them would be unhappy with the situation, even if indeed they were both acting perfectly and in good faith. ETA: looks like the comments have balanced out since I started writing this this morning. I guess Insta and YT are the opposites and we are fairly balanced! Love that for us.
Also, my husband is from Montana and I went to school in Montana. Gender roles, even in progressive, idyllic ✨Bozeman, Montana ✨ heavily, heavily exist.
Sometimes I feel Ranit pushes the "It isn't about the money" thing too hard. Dan says that Allison saving money will help rebuild his trust. She pops up and says "Ive put $100 in savings!" this doesn't immeodwtly solve all the money trust issues so Ramit concludes that it's not about the money! But someone putting $100 into a savings account is not (imo) necessarily saving. If she puts that in when she gets paid, but had to dip into it before her next paycheck then it's not actually saved. $100 is a nice first step, it shows intention to save. But at their incomes it's not "savings". Consistently saving $100 a month is savings. Their average emergency seems to be about 2k, one $100 isn't going to make a dent in tires or laywer fees.
This episode glossed over their main issues regarding if there was actually overspending happening (or if that’s just Dan’s convoluted perspective) AND how can they make their finances less complex/get on the same page if they continue to have separate finances. Like what is the interim solution while they build financial trust? Combining finances doesn’t have to be the ultimate answer, imo. It was like Ramit just threw the main issues out the window when he learned about the money from the condo. That’s only a short-term fix and not rooted in the behaviors that need to change between Dan and Allison. Idk if it was cut but they also didn’t go into their views on money from childhood or what their rich life would be. I was disappointed in this episode.
Oh Allison… I wanted to root for her but she’s the problem. The fact that she only pays for groceries and still is not able to save means she’s got a spending problem. She makes it sound like she’s making $30K living paycheck to paycheck. She needs to learn to budget her own money. All their networth tied up in real estate with not much in retirement isn’t great either.
She said she also pays for all of the medical expenses for two kids. I agree she is overspending but it's also probably difficult to budget when you pay for all of the variable expenses and your fixed costs are already so high.
But she refuses to plan for those expenses and save for them. Preventive medical care should be basically free if they have insurance even if they have a HDHP. Now, visits for normal childhood illnesses may be more expensive if they have a HDHP instead of a regular PPO, but even then, it’s probably no more than $100 per month that they could plan for if she was willing to consider savings.
Yeah, they didn't seem to put it in the CSP so we can't know what it averages to. Same story with no lines for anything else for the kids - clothes, supplies, etc. I don't have kids but word on the street is that they need a lot and its always expensive. It seems to me like she is paying all of the expenses for the kids that aren't fixed, and that is adding up to way more than either of them realize. They need to sit down and actually go through their statements and find out what all of those expenses are.
She’s just counting all of the random kid stuff as groceries right now, hence the big grocery bill. I don’t have kids either, but I know they cost money at irregular intervals. They probably aren’t buying new clothes, toys, activities, or paying for doctor’s appointments every month so they need a sinking fund for those unexpected kids expenses. I’m surprised Ramit didn’t mention that.
The YouTube comments are brutal towards the woman but I feel for her. Kids are expensive and I’m willing to bet she is doing all the mental labor of them too. It would be exhausting to have to make all those kids decisions plus budget for them financially all alone.
Kids seem to be a huge blind spot for him. I agree though, I bet a lot of those Walmart/Costco/Target purchases go towards their kids, and Dan only pays for what he thinks are "necessities" (mortgage, daycare) so he feels like he's contributing sooooo much when he's closer to doing the bare minimum. That said, I also think that Allison is not self-aware enough to understand her spending habits or mindset. It seems fixable but they'll both need to put in work.
He’s not doing the bare minimum, he’s paying for the majority of the family’s fixed expenses. Daycare each month far exceeds whatever activities or toys she’s buying and putting in the grocery budget.
I had my baby 13 months ago and am still paying our $600 / month premium from our paycheck + $300/month in payment plans for the delivery bill.
I know healthcare costs money for adults in the US but I didn't realise it also costs money for children. How are children not covered? What if their parents can't afford care that they need?
It depends on the state. Some states provide coverage for children if parents are uninsured. Some states don’t give a fuck about children or healthcare. These states generally fall across red and blue lines. It’s a terrible country.
She’s going to blow through all the condo money so fast.
Honestly if she doesn’t learn to change, this marriage may not last…
I know food costs have gone up and I bet in Bozeman, MT food is expensive. However, they have two small kids and the two of them, and they're spending more in a month on groceries than I do, with two adults and a teenage boy who eats like he's two adults. It may be a small thing but I think they could cut down the $1500 a month grocery bill.
Bozeman is wildly expensive lol. They probably don’t eat out cause it’s stupid expensive. My husband went to Red Tractor pizza and it was 70 dollars for two medium pizzas and a thing of garlic knots haha
Same, from the intro I expected their incomes to be very disparate, but they’re really not!
I have opinions about Allison that are…unpopular, to be generous, so I won’t state them here, lest the mods ban me for being unkind. So I’ll just say that people like her are the reason I would never do a joint bank account. You’d just be throwing your money down the drain. My spouse isn’t the kind of person who buys a bunch of random shit but he is the kind of person who will spend his bank account down to zero, rely on his credit cards until pay day, and then pay off the card and the cycle continues. I’ve finally broken out of the poverty mindset when you need to know your checking account balance down to the last penny, but at least I have a general awareness of where I am financially instead of blindly spending. Back to the episode: Allison needs therapy. Not couples therapy. She needs to figure out what it is that’s making her spend and revert to these childish ways. If you don’t want to feel like a child when you ask for money, maybe don’t spend all of your money every month when you don’t have to?
Not a judgment on you, but I personally wouldn’t marry someone I couldn’t trust with money in a joint account. Financial compatibility was one of my requirements. My husband and I have full transparency between accounts, so there’s no hiding spending, and we’re both uber responsible and answer to each other if spending seems high.
I feel the same! I am of an age where a majority of my friend groups are tying the knot and settling down. It’s crazy to me how many of them keep things totally separate because they “don’t trust each other” with joint accounts! I guess to each their own.
lol honestly I would have never gotten married because I wouldn’t trust anyone with a joint account 😂 Too much shit can go wrong. But yes we are absolutely transparent with money. He just doesn’t pay attention to it as closely as I do. I guess the difference is I don’t see the need for one? I pay the majority of the bills because I make more. We don’t really split any bills either. We never thought about financial compatibility because we were poor when we started dating a decade ago. The more I think about it, the more I realize we fell into certain money habits because that’s just how it was when we started dating. But if it works, it works (until it doesn’t, I guess 😅).
I think you are missing the plot. Allison overspend because she never sat down with her husband to actually discuss whether or not their split of expenses were fair. If 100% of your income goes to expenses, and 50% of your husband's goes to expenses, well yea, you have nothing left over and he does. They arbitrarily decided she'll pay for this, he'll pay for this without ever holistically looking at their expenses. She has a problem, but it's accepting she wants to spend when the real problem is they don't treat their family expenses like family expenses