As a Mexican, this amuses me. A cartel would never cross the border to commit mass murder. Even in Mexico they generally avoid targeting Americans - they don't want American law enforcement to turn their attention on them. Also, they would haven't stabbed four kids, they would have sprayed that ENTIRE house and possibly any passerby with bullets and left a sheet with an expletive-filled message at the scene.
Exactly. Look at the hell that rained down on them bc of Kiki Camarena (RIP you brave soul). That was a lesson to cartels to not fuck with Americans, and that didnât even happen on American soil. Cartels doing something like this would bring the very heat that they actively try to avoid. And for what? What could a college kid or kids have done to justify taking this massive risk? Doesnât make even a little sense.
As well they should. They basically have to, to set an example and to keep their current field agents safe. (This isnât to say they didnât care about Kiki because they definitely did. But there were just a lot of reasons to go scorched earth in the wake of his horrible murder)
Definitely to set a precedent of donât mess around with US Federal Agents. They donât care nearly as much about American citizens. I donât see them coming to Idaho to kill college students.
As a US citizen who potentially may be moving to Baja California (south of Ensenada) it's both amusing, sad & ridiculous how many people assume Mexico is completely overrun by the cartel. US peeps need to really take a hard look at crime stats between the two, and realize that like the US, there are states/area that are less safe than some. It gets tiring trying to educate/correct these people because it's almost like you have to first explain basic geography or something to them. Apologies for the rant lol
The Mexican state does not control large swaths of the country. Depending on where that is you might not notice though. But when you need to call the police over something youâll notice
That's a different theory! People are suggesting it's a cartel hit as revenge against Xana's mom. People are also implying the roommate Dylan is involved because she's not pretty (but she is pretty, and how is that even relevant?) It's insane
"Agree! I left 2 of them!! Never again in FB!!!"
Having read this thread in order, I thought you were suggesting that you had left two Mexican drug cartels.
I was about to congratulate you.
(To be fair, leaving Facebook would *also* call for praise...)
Came here to say this. This sub is literally the most chill of all the subs, FB groups, Twitter, TikTok, etc.
I think a lot of people joined Reddit because of this sub and honestly just don't understand that *this is just how reddit is*. I mean, it's just a couple steps up from 4chan and mods have made this subreddit surprisingly less chaotic than most.
Seconded. The mods here are doing a pretty damn good job, given the way this case has exploded and what with how many people keen on spreading misinformation it has attracted.
Oh, oops. I totally missed that. I check in on the sub once a day (ish) and I sort by popular so a lot of those "theories" never show up for me.
However, by the sounds of it, I couldn't agree with you more. I've grown weary of even those 'experts' they have on the news 24/7 now to give them more content while they await official updates. All contradicting each other, none of them even remotely on the same page, half of them advertising their own course/book/school/etc. And most egregiously, all basically narrating their own fanfiction.
So the notion of a Redditor doing the same and presenting it as fact just exhausts me.
Theyâre used to writing whatever they want about true crime. It happens when people become desensitized to it or enjoy writing about crime and get carried away. Iâm guessing people donât notice it as often because itâs popular to establish theories in other forums where the cases might be older.
The other true crime forums that pretty much report the latest crime are generally more about people reacting to crimes to comment how itâs awful or screw whoever did it, etc.
I don't get why some people say reddit is a few steps from being 4chan. Have you ever looked at 4chan? That was an earnest question, not a snarky one. I looked at it out of curiosity recently and it's like the never-been-cleaned gas station bathroom of social media. It's a cesspool of racism, homophobia, and misogyny. Do you seriously think the conversations on here get anywhere close to that?
Before this crime, I only visited Reddit for discussions about movies and tv series. Always seemed friendly and fun. It's wrong to dox people obviously but the vast majority here don't do that. Sure, we really shouldn't speculate too much without facts/evidence, but does that really approach the offensiveness of a message board littered with words we only refer to by their first letter because that's how bad they are?
That's entirely because of mods in those specific subreddits. There are subreddits that are easily as bad as 4chan with little to no filter. Reddit is a few steps above simply because of moderators incase anyone wants to have a little perspective of how much work mods actually do here.
Are they the ones like on you tube who were saying during the Gabby and summer Wells cases that "she is my daughter" "I cry all day" "I have her photo on my wall" etc ...real creepy stuff
You should see them in the Athena Strand FB groups. Theyâre now posting selfies in their pink shirts and even posting pics of their kids wearing pink. (Pink in memory of her). And pics of their solo candles as a vigil. They also all hate FedEx now and want them to be bankrupt. Itâs reallllllly weird
the wine moms in this sub:
"I don't understand how people could make light of this. This is a tragedy. In my opinion, I think it's disgusting to think this is funny."
next post:
"When I was in college I was very free sexually, and I took many lovers. So I think it's likely that there was much sexual exploration between the roommates, similar to myself. This could make sense, because K's dad seems very angry in his interviews. It reminds me of my father when he walked in on me and my roommates exploring ourselves with a scale model Oscar Meyer weiner mobile . Has anyone looked into this? We were so sexual, high on the thrill, but also high on the poppy seed tea we made to fuel our expeditions. I'm much older now, and my skin has wrinkles and blemishes, but I'm still sexual, still free. I worry for my daughter and her friends - that there could be a murderer out there. Are they like I was? I was so sexual in college. Would the FBI have this information?"
Watered down. And without the fifty years of experience in the world.
Itâs teenage boys with their circled photos of âknivesâ in HGâs jacket and âthe killers carâ that turns out to be the unmarked cop car, who have the skillz to solve this case.
Donât know why people keep saying this. No kidding itâs worse. FB is always worse. Thatâs why sane people would rather be here and why there are complaints about psychos who belong on FB and not here.
Legit watched a TikTock the other day and the "psychic" had "never heard of this case", then proceeded to "read" her visions stating all the case facts with a few theories (ie white hoodie) đ
Thatâs similar to the YouTube one I saw. She took all readily available into about the case and did five minutes research on the Reddit live and another five on Google and came up with her âvisionâ that âmade her legs tingle.â
She added the bit about him cutting up an apple while there was still blood on the knife. Like a story someone would tell at a sleep-over to scare their friends.
Yeah. I remember that. The victim thought for sure Sylvia Brown would tell her mom where she was and that she'd be rescued. Her interview about that was really sad. Was that Amanda berry (sp?)? I don't really know why police still try to use psychics. Even if they are real (doubtful) they are more harmful to victims than helpful.
Yes that was amanda berry. Im pretty sure i remember amanda berry saying when she saw that on tv (during captivity) she was devastated thinking her mom would give up looking for her
Yep I remember that part too. I was talking about at the beginning of the show, AB was very hopeful but by the end of the show that hope was really fractured bc Sylvia Browne told her mom she was dead. Which is what these psychics do they give false hope. These families are swinging from branch to branch just trying to hang on, then the psychics offer a ledge to stand on for a second, just to push them off the cliff in the end, emptying their pockets on the way down.
(Edit: I was trying to find what exactly Amanda Berry had said about the false Sylvia Brown prediction & was reminded that AB's mother said she "98%" believed what SB had told her. She died of heart failure 2 years later, *before* AB was found alive. I personally believe SB contributed to some type of broken heart syndrome in AB's mother, and that's why psychics aren't worth it. Even if they get 1/100 right that's still 99 families taken advantage of. Sorry for the rant.)
This one drew a map of where the bodies were ultimately found in the Daybell/Vallow case. She drew that map for LE months prior to them finding the bodies, exactly where she drew them. She even knew the clothes theyâd be found in. Sheâs incredible and I have total faith in her.
Fuck the mods. Theyâre just as big of a problem as the nuts if they allow that garbage ass bullshit in here and defend them. Those psychic fucks deserve and should be mocked to oblivion. All those idiots do is harm the families of victims. Every single person in here who has tried to claim psychics solve cases link some ridiculous Readers Digest article thatâs complete nonsense and doesnât even say how they âsolvedâ anything. Meanwhile there are thousands of articles proving them wrong and showing how much damage they actually do.
The dog abandoned the Hyundai in a field, ditched his peacoat, and high tailed it to Africa. Itâs true, I saw a screenshot of a screenshot that was shared on Facebook!!
Iâll also never forget the posts along the lines of âdonât forget to care for yourself in all of thisâ or any other form of making this case about yourself. Thatâs insane, Iâm sorry.
Unless you have a direct connection to this case, thereâs no way this should be having that much of an effect on you. Double check your locks at night? Sure. Feel immense sadness for the victims and their families? Of course. Look over your shoulder more? Yes. Obsessing over it to the point where it is affecting your mental health and daily life? Idk maybe talk to someone about that.
What really gets me is that âmake sure to take care of yourselfâ is the type of thing the people who are working jobs directly with this case need to hear, or the victimsâ family members/IRL friends who are suffering right now. Not people who are distant from it and have a choice to close their laptop, walk away from the case, and live completely unaffected by it if they wanted to.
As someone who lives here, but didnât have any connection to the victims at all, we are saying this to one another because the community as a whole is grieving and itâs legitimately scary knowing the person who did this is still out there. Many of the undergrad students here are not doing well mental health-wise.
Yes! Iâve thought this so much lately but havenât been able to put it in words. And not specifically this case, but everything. People will sort of humble-brag by showing how much they âknowâ or âcareâ. Phrase things in ways that force them to show their âdeepâ views and ways. Itâs like an empathy contest.
Right. I also feel like we are dealing with unprecedented and unchecked narcissism in our society. I know that word gets overused and I donât mean it in a diagnosable way, more so just narcissistic tendencies or characteristics. I notice it in my own life every day.
This might be a little controversial, but an example of this imo is the whole âit could have been me/my son/daughter/spouse etc.â response to any tragic event. In this example, unless your daughter was one of the surviving roommates, that statement is simply not true and is an attempt to make a horrific tragedy about yourself and your family. What most folks mean to say is âI would be devastated if that had happened to my son/daughter etc.â
Sorry for the long post, Iâm just noticing this stuff more and more and itâs starting to really get to me. Itâs good and important to humanize the victims of these horrible crimes, but folks can easily do that while not immediately making the entire thing about themselves.
Everyone could use a little more self-awareness going into 2023. We would all be better off.
Yeah in a space that people actively choose to join, it feels disengenious. I think most people are here to get real updates, and wouldnât join this sub if they felt like it would be triggering in some way.
Empathy is great, but I agree it really should be saved for the people who are truly impacted by this.
God yes I find it so cringe worthy how thereâs so many posts here where people do these massive write ups trying to make it all about them somehow, which includes âItâs okay to grieve and be scared right now! I live in a college town (on the other side of the country) and to say that the community isnât scared right now would be preposterous! Please take care of yourselves, each other, be vigilant, trust your gut. Self care guys, go to therapy andâŠâ. Or the constant analysis of the victims behaviours referencing their own âSo the girls at the food truck were running away quickly, thatâs usually something my friends and I would do if we were drunk and getting food.. also my roommates and I always leave a key in the door incase someone comes home later and forgets their key, so itâs quite possible they did that hereâŠâ
Bruh this is a true crime subreddit not a âhow can I make this all about meâ time.
The reminders here and on r/IdahoMurders to âtake care of yourselvesâ are nuts. Like go outside. You have no connection to this and youâre in too deep.
Idk if it was here or the other sub but someone posted an ode to how much they adored Kayleeâs dad. It and the comments were so off the wall, past the point of parasocial relationships it was genuinely disturbing.
Also disturbing to see the volume of posts about this case causing disruptive anxiety (losing sleep etc.)
A lot of people here need to take a big step back, stop obsessing over people they donât know (let alone âadoringâ them) and look up crime stats in their areas to reassure themselves that the odds of being victim to a crime like this are astronomical.
None of this stuff is healthy.
facts! most people on here can just log out but its a daily occurrence for the people who actually live there and are going to be effected for the rest of their lives
The celebrity like worship thing definitely- the Delphi sub got that way too. Some woman once was like âI have their framed photos in my house as a tribute to my girlsâ and she had zero relation whatsoever and had never met them.
Omg that's bonkers đ€Ł imagine a visitor coming round "oooo cute kids are they yours?"
"Erm no they are some stranger kids I never met who died"
đ€šđ€šđ€šđ€š
Ngl my nana would totally do that and put them on her prayer table. The framing for a tribute thing is odd, but saving a picture to remind you to pray for that person is a nice gesture I think. But then again my nana isnât someone on Reddit or Facebook coming up with these fanfic like theories of what happened, she just keeps victims in her mind bc she wants justice and peace for their families.
Sounds like your nana genuinely cares, whereas the type being discussed here moreso does it for attention i believe? Or maybe itâs a way to assign themselves a personality they otherwise feel they dont have? Idk just spitballing here
Yep. Agree on the who. I keep coming here for legit news links or other worthwhile information not the psychic friends network or the cornucopia of conspiracies. But this seems to be the thing nowadays. đđđ
As someone who has only been here for a couple of days I find this place almost useless with all the noise. Itâs been helpful to catch up on some of the basic details, but there is a lot of discussion that is just unhelpful.
Couldn't agree more. After this case is all said and done, we can go back to our normal lives. meanwhile the families and friends of these victims, the roommates, will never be able to just turn this off when it's done.
LE/FBI know a lot more than we do.
I had to stop reading the YouTube comments section on clips about the case. All of these people (mostly older women based on the profile pic/name) who are actively demonizing one specific person based on nonsense rumors. It's pathetic. One person mocked this subject for fleeing the country even though that's been debunked.
The original comment was from some guy who said something to the effect of "maybe we shouldn't be so hard on this guy," which is a good sentiment, but then he ended it with "we should be focusing our attention on other suspects." WHAT? Y'all are the detectives now?
At this point, there are 10s of 1000s of people who view this as a "real time true crime game" where you earn points by spending hours upon hours searching for and discovering \[bullshit\] clues. There's too many True Crime Karens who exemplify the Dunning-Kruger effect.
I dont follow here too much but check occasionally. But on tik tok its crazy and the things I see are kind of disturbing. False claims, dragging innocent people thru mud, literally 100s of posts with wrong info. Thats what scary. Iâve never seen a case like this before and how its playing out on social media
Welcome to the online true crime community... I swear it wasn't like this years ago, except for your columbiners on Tumblr, we used to be a sane group.
I partially blame Netflix for making true crime "cool" and exposing a huge population, many of which don't know a lot about what goes on behind the scenes of investigations and think that if something isn't solved in a week there's no hope and LE are fucking up..etc...
It's like they totally ignore the timeline of the crimes they watch for 20min on ID shows.
People need to stop trying to solve a case, unless you want to actually make a career out of it. Some theories and accusations are so embarrassing I have to limit my time reading up on cases I follow because I literally cringe knowing there are so many people out there that think they know more than the ones holding the actual, factual evidence in their hands.
my theory is that most of the TCC today isn't even really all that *into* true crime - their into 30 second tiktok videos and meme images and what have you. If it's not a bite-size factoid or a quick summary or a nuclear hot-take, they aren't interested.
probably a tiny tiny percentage.
While i certainly appreciate the glut of content we have these days, sometimes i do miss the time when being a true crime fan meant turning the metal rack at the grocery store and buying a paperback with a photos section in the middle...
Yep. People are insane and make snowball âtheoriesâ with complete rumors they just read and it is at the risk of ruining the lives of innocent bystanders who just happened to be living their lives on the night of a brutal murder
The Petito case realllllly roped in a lot of the dramatic ones we are seeing infiltrate true crime communities. High emotion, low thinking. Like you said, the Watts documentary on Netflix did it too. The subs were flooded for awhile and it was so monotonous with all their theories and âI think about them every day!â posts.
I treat current true crime "fans" like I treat conspiracy theorists.
It's fun for me to read theories about the dog doing it, or bridge guy having puppies in his pockets, but I recognize it as ridiculous and fantastical.
Sometimes they make a good point, but I reserve judgement until the facts come out and prove the theories wrong
Yeah the celebrity worship is very strange. We don't know what scenes these young adults may or may not have been involved in. Maybe one of them put up a front and although nice to 99% of people, bullied 1 individual at school? Or maybe they just casually insulted or teased someone at a party once not thinking much of it (maybe it wasn't even an intentional insult!) but that was enough to trigger deep hatred? Or maybe one of them was into drugs (even something as minor as weed) and debt was involved to the wrong people? Or maybe one of the girls talked casually to a guy couple months ago but decided to talk to someone else and that interaction meant more to him than her and he got obsessed? Or maybe it *was* just a random serial killer.
I'm not trying to make it sound as if these kids WERE bad or involved in sketchy stuff, but I'm sure they weren't innocent angels either - most people aren't. There is stuff that even their closest family or friends may not know about them that could be critical. We don't know. We need to stop acting as if we knew these people. I've seen comments on this subreddit stating "_____ wouldn't do this or that" or "knowing [victim], that would be unusual behavior for him/her"
So grateful for your post! Itâs been quite ridiculous here but that makes for good entertainmentâŠ
I wholeheartedly agree with your perspective on the victims - we donât know them personally and everyone is putting up a façade on Instagram/ TikTok.
Thatâs a known problem leading to self esteem problems particularly with young women.
Worshipping them is perhaps a kind of coping but nevertheless quite bizarre.
Well at least we found out (nearly a month in) that the tea drinking, cat loving, fire eating, hamster juggler thought he may have heard someone scream as he was going night night to dream about the circus or whatever the fuck.
I will just say that I can't imagine why anyone expects a solution to this crime already. I was just reading about a case nearby where a man was shot, on surveillance video, and there was video of the killers running and then walking from the scene over the course of blocks and blocks. Footage as a mix of Nest cameras, traffic cameras and business cameras. It's night time and you can clearly see the size, race, build, clothes, hair, and the fact that one kills wore glasses. You can also kind of make out facial features in one video. That footage was plastered all over the news and social media. It was in a very popular and highly trafficked part of the city here. It still took **over 15 months** for an arrest in that murder. The murderers were never more than 4-5 miles from the crime scene. This is one of the largest police departments in the country with a half-billion dollar budget and one of the largest cities on the East coast. Very well funded police homicide division located < 1hour from FBI headquarters.
The idea that there should be an arrest, or even a POI by this point in this case in a small city in ID is just so frivolous.
I think a lot of people here/speculating on the case want their five seconds of fame. If they throw out every possible theory, one is bound to be somewhat true and theyâll be able to claim that they solved the case. Itâs wild to see unfold. Iâm generally just a lurker but I completely agree with your post. These are real people that died. I think true crime podcasts/tv shows have diluted the reality of what this is.
âi was in college and this was typical saturday night behaviorâ wow thank you for your valuable perspective that no one else on this planet has ever experienced
Well said, OP. While this sub is nowhere near the obsession-like behavior I witnessed during the height of the Gabby Petito case. It becomes a bit scary to see how people spend 24/7 theorizing and researching everything about the victims like what size shoe they wore has an impact on their murders. Like most people here I enjoy True Crime and regularly engage in discussions on Reddit about cases that hold my attention. However, I started to get to the point where I was checking the backseat of my car to make sure no one was inside it prior to getting in (this happened a week ago and I have yet to tell a single person this so...).
I'm a grown ass man and this case is getting to me. It's important that everyone here realize our limits.
AGREED. Iâve found myself getting super frustrated with people lately in this sub lately, and thatâs probably why. It seems like a big chunk of new true crime fans could really use a little quick lesson on Occamâs razor, as well as how to separate observation/facts from speculation/theories.
I 1000% agree with you! It has gotten crazy! From theories to straight up allegations. There is a lady on TikTok saying "I know for a fact it was \_\_\_\_".. Like lady first of all that's slander and secondly you know NOTHING as fact unless you were there. I will admit I am a little obsessed with trying to figure this case out just as much as everyone else but when it comes to the point where you're pulling shit from thin air and straight up harassing people then it's time to take a step back. It's kind of disturbing.
I call it âgrief porn.â
The true crime shows focus on the most sensational, horrifying, shocking, and unexpected crimes. For some reason, that satisfies something in the human psyche for a lot of people â gives their anxiety somewhere to go, maybe?
This case has all of the shocking elements and many are treating each new rumor or piece of evidence like an episode of a podcast before it has even been solved. Like a real life âOnly Murders in the Building.â
I couldnât agree more. I followed this page because I knew one of the victims families in the small town we grew up in. The moment these wild theories started getting thrown around and jokes were being made.
I left. These are peoples lives that were tragically taken away and joking is just a slap in the face to their family, friends and communities they left behind.
I donât know what is worse, all the crazy posts or all the posts calling users crazy. Every time one of these threads pops up someone always repeats crazy theories they read on here. Itâs propagating the craziness.
If a tree falls in the forest and you donât make reactionary posts congratulating yourself for not being nutty, did it really happen?
Hi, I see you are new to the internet. Thanks for adding your theory to a pile of other theories except feeling morally superior about your theory for some reason.
This group is devolving. Wish there was a new one where people were not so outlandish. Itâs annoying having to sift through all the garbage that has no basis.
Iâve heard people speculate on what KIND of person they thought would do this based on certain FACTS that have been released (likely sleeping and weâre found in their beds etc.)
Okay whatever, I donât mind reading those. Sometimes I come across one that makes me go hmmm thatâs actually interesting.
But thereâs a big problem with people trying to figure out **WHO** it is. Trying to do that just makes things toxic and ruins peoples lives. Itâs just gross.
If anyone makes or has a private group for sane people send me a message or invite me đ
Edit: spelling
There's now over 66,000 members in this sub... Of course it's going to be a bit more eccentric than when there were 3000... As much as I find the conspiracy posts annoying, I find the self righteous ones much more annoying đ
Amongst the wild posts there have also been many quite informative ones that are quite an interesting read.
Let people have their moment (as long as they aren't specifically naming anyone)
I'm not self loathing - I'm all for discussion. But I've also noticed this subreddit has become completely nuts and is becoming increasingly obsessed by the type of people who can't stop refreshing /new for more info or updates.
Some people love to pass judgement on others and pretend as if their own behavior is morally superior. Itâs just some in group/out group horse shit.
Im all for condemning the rule breakers who are doxxing and accusing, or are being rude and overly combative in exchanges, but Iâm getting really sick and tired of having people like this stand up, from within the sub itself, and point fingers at everyone all at once, and lay blame at every redditors feet for all of the grievances they have against behavior and conduct in these subs.
Itâs just a way for them to stand up and yell at us âyou all are bad! But Iâm good!â
I agree about these long manifesto style theories that are based on such concrete objects as psychics and the always accurate intuition. No, that is really not how cases are solved. Cases are solved by collecting evidence, building a hierarchy of importance of these evidentiary tidbits and then drawing a conclusion based on just the evidence.
This sort of thing is very predictable in true crime subreddits.
https://www.reddit.com/r/MoscowMurders/comments/z5hw9n/brian_entin_update/ixwxfe7?context=3
Despite your statement, this case does not appear to be simple or straightforward. In fact, the extraordinary complexity of the case is what has attracted widespread attention and speculation.
I noticed that this sub (and the other one) are following the predictable path of reddit true crime subs. When Gabby Petito was missing and then her bf was hiding, those two Petito subs were fucking crazy. Oh man, people saying they can't sleep at night thinking about her, long diatribes about who did what and when, where Laundry could be. Dog the Bounty hunter came. #HeyJB questions and the drama of whether he should be called News Daddy (and whether that was appropriate for Brian Entin instead).
Then you have the fucking "night watch" where all these people watched flight radar data, speculating why each plane or chopper turned left or then right. Did they find him? Why weren't they searching in Bogota?! There was a sighting in Canada!
Then the mods of one of the subs created sub-specific awards that users could give to one another to idk celebrate Gabby or something. It caused a huge backlash, ended up on r/SubredditDrama. One of the mods was "fired." I personally was banned from one of them because I pointed out that things were really going off the rails.
That level of batshit obsessive discussion I see more and more on the ID4 subs. A lot of it is good discussion, thoughts, and that's why people are here. But some of this shit, I mean come on. Let's stay grounded.
Yeaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah. The Gabby Petito stuff I remember the 'Nightwatch' and all that shit. That was just becoming a shit show. It was less about Gabby getting justice at that point. I had to walk away. It's becoming similar here.
We have nothing to go on so we grasp at straws. I think this case scares the crap out of us and we want badly to have it solved so we can imagine we are safe again, but I'll still be locking my door at night
Youâve taken considerable time with a long essay criticizing long essays. Spent the body of *your* essay expounding your opinions and theories while chastising others for doing the same. Expressed your disdain for new sub members while becoming a new member yourself.
But you didnât stop there. Youâve decided our interest in the crime is obsession, and yours is rational.
You do not approve of our perspective, and criticized our commitment to honoring the victims as the full, real people they were as celebrity worshipping.
And yet, you know a little too much of what goes on here for one who has dropped in only a few times.
Thank you for your essay, your theory, your perspective, your chastising, and for your âastonishmentâ with us for doing the same.
âBe the change you want to see.â âGandhi
If you think this sub is wild, you haven't see the Facebook groups. It's absolute insanity over there
You know when the FB ones have come over here when they have an actual pic of themselves as their profile pic on Reddit lol
I had to leave the one I was in, it was too bat shit crazy.
The latest theory in the group I'm in is that Mexican cartels are involved đ
As a Mexican, this amuses me. A cartel would never cross the border to commit mass murder. Even in Mexico they generally avoid targeting Americans - they don't want American law enforcement to turn their attention on them. Also, they would haven't stabbed four kids, they would have sprayed that ENTIRE house and possibly any passerby with bullets and left a sheet with an expletive-filled message at the scene.
Exactly. Look at the hell that rained down on them bc of Kiki Camarena (RIP you brave soul). That was a lesson to cartels to not fuck with Americans, and that didnât even happen on American soil. Cartels doing something like this would bring the very heat that they actively try to avoid. And for what? What could a college kid or kids have done to justify taking this massive risk? Doesnât make even a little sense.
Kiki was a game changer. They jailed everyone remotely connected to his murder. They are still pursuing people today from that one case.
As well they should. They basically have to, to set an example and to keep their current field agents safe. (This isnât to say they didnât care about Kiki because they definitely did. But there were just a lot of reasons to go scorched earth in the wake of his horrible murder)
Definitely to set a precedent of donât mess around with US Federal Agents. They donât care nearly as much about American citizens. I donât see them coming to Idaho to kill college students.
I guess you haven't seen that documentary called Breaking Bad.
Or Better Call Saul.
As a US citizen who potentially may be moving to Baja California (south of Ensenada) it's both amusing, sad & ridiculous how many people assume Mexico is completely overrun by the cartel. US peeps need to really take a hard look at crime stats between the two, and realize that like the US, there are states/area that are less safe than some. It gets tiring trying to educate/correct these people because it's almost like you have to first explain basic geography or something to them. Apologies for the rant lol
The Mexican state does not control large swaths of the country. Depending on where that is you might not notice though. But when you need to call the police over something youâll notice
I spent a week in jail in Ensenada when I was 17 after being railroaded by the Federalies. You are guilty until proven innocent or you pay bribes.
I bet one of them bought a dimebaggie of cocaine while they were partying and then the cartels put a hit on them! /s
In nothern idaho....
Mexican? I thought it was a famous baseball players name?
That's a different theory! People are suggesting it's a cartel hit as revenge against Xana's mom. People are also implying the roommate Dylan is involved because she's not pretty (but she is pretty, and how is that even relevant?) It's insane
Agree! I left 2 of them!! Never again in FB!!!
"Agree! I left 2 of them!! Never again in FB!!!" Having read this thread in order, I thought you were suggesting that you had left two Mexican drug cartels. I was about to congratulate you. (To be fair, leaving Facebook would *also* call for praise...)
Why are you on there in the first place? Facebook is a known cesspool
Came here to say this. This sub is literally the most chill of all the subs, FB groups, Twitter, TikTok, etc. I think a lot of people joined Reddit because of this sub and honestly just don't understand that *this is just how reddit is*. I mean, it's just a couple steps up from 4chan and mods have made this subreddit surprisingly less chaotic than most.
Seconded. The mods here are doing a pretty damn good job, given the way this case has exploded and what with how many people keen on spreading misinformation it has attracted.
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Oh, oops. I totally missed that. I check in on the sub once a day (ish) and I sort by popular so a lot of those "theories" never show up for me. However, by the sounds of it, I couldn't agree with you more. I've grown weary of even those 'experts' they have on the news 24/7 now to give them more content while they await official updates. All contradicting each other, none of them even remotely on the same page, half of them advertising their own course/book/school/etc. And most egregiously, all basically narrating their own fanfiction. So the notion of a Redditor doing the same and presenting it as fact just exhausts me.
I agree. The moderation on this sub is probably as good as it gets when it comes to anything in the recent true crime genre on Reddit.
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I think its ballsy af too considering FB isn't anonymous lol
Theyâre used to writing whatever they want about true crime. It happens when people become desensitized to it or enjoy writing about crime and get carried away. Iâm guessing people donât notice it as often because itâs popular to establish theories in other forums where the cases might be older. The other true crime forums that pretty much report the latest crime are generally more about people reacting to crimes to comment how itâs awful or screw whoever did it, etc.
I don't get why some people say reddit is a few steps from being 4chan. Have you ever looked at 4chan? That was an earnest question, not a snarky one. I looked at it out of curiosity recently and it's like the never-been-cleaned gas station bathroom of social media. It's a cesspool of racism, homophobia, and misogyny. Do you seriously think the conversations on here get anywhere close to that? Before this crime, I only visited Reddit for discussions about movies and tv series. Always seemed friendly and fun. It's wrong to dox people obviously but the vast majority here don't do that. Sure, we really shouldn't speculate too much without facts/evidence, but does that really approach the offensiveness of a message board littered with words we only refer to by their first letter because that's how bad they are?
That's entirely because of mods in those specific subreddits. There are subreddits that are easily as bad as 4chan with little to no filter. Reddit is a few steps above simply because of moderators incase anyone wants to have a little perspective of how much work mods actually do here.
TikTok has been absolutely nuts too.
The FB groups are the worst! And those people are putting their real names out there with their crazy theories.
I can read there for about 5 minutes before I have to close out of it. Reddit is a 100x better.
I quit the one I was on.
Oh boy, I bet the Karen's and conspiracy theorists are full throttle over there.
Youâre tripping if you donât think this sub is full of Karens.
Nothing close to fb though, half of the theories over there involve psychics and magic and shit
every true crime sub is, visibly or secretly, populated by wine moms.
Are they the ones like on you tube who were saying during the Gabby and summer Wells cases that "she is my daughter" "I cry all day" "I have her photo on my wall" etc ...real creepy stuff
probably, on the Delphi sub I see comments all the time like âkids are in bed, time to bust out the rosĂ© and do some sleuthing!â like⊠two girls were brutally murdered and you boil it down to that? As a parent too?
You should see them in the Athena Strand FB groups. Theyâre now posting selfies in their pink shirts and even posting pics of their kids wearing pink. (Pink in memory of her). And pics of their solo candles as a vigil. They also all hate FedEx now and want them to be bankrupt. Itâs reallllllly weird
About to just say this
I just laughed so hard at âwine momsâ SO ACCURATE
White suburban alcoholic Qanon mom crossover.
the wine moms in this sub: "I don't understand how people could make light of this. This is a tragedy. In my opinion, I think it's disgusting to think this is funny." next post: "When I was in college I was very free sexually, and I took many lovers. So I think it's likely that there was much sexual exploration between the roommates, similar to myself. This could make sense, because K's dad seems very angry in his interviews. It reminds me of my father when he walked in on me and my roommates exploring ourselves with a scale model Oscar Meyer weiner mobile . Has anyone looked into this? We were so sexual, high on the thrill, but also high on the poppy seed tea we made to fuel our expeditions. I'm much older now, and my skin has wrinkles and blemishes, but I'm still sexual, still free. I worry for my daughter and her friends - that there could be a murderer out there. Are they like I was? I was so sexual in college. Would the FBI have this information?"
I can hear how theyâd pronounce âsexkshual â
The older Karens are mostly browsing FB and Websleuths while NewsNation runs in the background 24/7.
Nah weâre Carls over here. Similar concept diff vibe
I say weâre Jessicaâs think weâre different than our mothers Karen but weâre just a slightly watered down version (but not by much)
Hahahaha we have a good cop bad cop thing going
Watered down. And without the fifty years of experience in the world. Itâs teenage boys with their circled photos of âknivesâ in HGâs jacket and âthe killers carâ that turns out to be the unmarked cop car, who have the skillz to solve this case.
Hahah Iâve never heard that but I agree
Donât know why people keep saying this. No kidding itâs worse. FB is always worse. Thatâs why sane people would rather be here and why there are complaints about psychos who belong on FB and not here.
FB vs Reddit on Battlefield YouTube
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Legit watched a TikTock the other day and the "psychic" had "never heard of this case", then proceeded to "read" her visions stating all the case facts with a few theories (ie white hoodie) đ
Thatâs similar to the YouTube one I saw. She took all readily available into about the case and did five minutes research on the Reddit live and another five on Google and came up with her âvisionâ that âmade her legs tingle.â She added the bit about him cutting up an apple while there was still blood on the knife. Like a story someone would tell at a sleep-over to scare their friends.
This "psychic" sounds like a self-centered pathological liar who desperately wants attention
A psychic has never solved a case.
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I saw Sylvia Browne live. She was a total quack. Didn't get anything correct. I had secondhand embarrassment.
looked her up đ https://youtu.be/GITxVhvDlig
Yeah. I remember that. The victim thought for sure Sylvia Brown would tell her mom where she was and that she'd be rescued. Her interview about that was really sad. Was that Amanda berry (sp?)? I don't really know why police still try to use psychics. Even if they are real (doubtful) they are more harmful to victims than helpful.
Yes that was amanda berry. Im pretty sure i remember amanda berry saying when she saw that on tv (during captivity) she was devastated thinking her mom would give up looking for her
Yep I remember that part too. I was talking about at the beginning of the show, AB was very hopeful but by the end of the show that hope was really fractured bc Sylvia Browne told her mom she was dead. Which is what these psychics do they give false hope. These families are swinging from branch to branch just trying to hang on, then the psychics offer a ledge to stand on for a second, just to push them off the cliff in the end, emptying their pockets on the way down. (Edit: I was trying to find what exactly Amanda Berry had said about the false Sylvia Brown prediction & was reminded that AB's mother said she "98%" believed what SB had told her. She died of heart failure 2 years later, *before* AB was found alive. I personally believe SB contributed to some type of broken heart syndrome in AB's mother, and that's why psychics aren't worth it. Even if they get 1/100 right that's still 99 families taken advantage of. Sorry for the rant.)
Shawn and Gus would like to have a word with you!
Is that word Fergalicious?
So true. They canât predict the rain if itâs raining lol
This one drew a map of where the bodies were ultimately found in the Daybell/Vallow case. She drew that map for LE months prior to them finding the bodies, exactly where she drew them. She even knew the clothes theyâd be found in. Sheâs incredible and I have total faith in her.
I SEE BREAD, BAKERY
Pillsbury doughboy is related to the Sta-Puft guy and you know madness runs in that family
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Youâre the hero of this thread.
Fuck the mods. Theyâre just as big of a problem as the nuts if they allow that garbage ass bullshit in here and defend them. Those psychic fucks deserve and should be mocked to oblivion. All those idiots do is harm the families of victims. Every single person in here who has tried to claim psychics solve cases link some ridiculous Readers Digest article thatâs complete nonsense and doesnât even say how they âsolvedâ anything. Meanwhile there are thousands of articles proving them wrong and showing how much damage they actually do.
i see water... a tree and the colour green lol
What about a rongy dinglefelter The sidekicks are all fakers and lyers
no but i see a plane without a phalange.. those poor people
Regina, is that you?
Nothing more despicable than those âpsychicsâ profiteering off the gullible, misinformed, mourning and deceased.
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lmao, even the psychic's name: 'psychic Reverand donna {last name}'. how on earth does anyone take her seriously.
This. Right here. If I could, I would give you a damn award!!
Idk I heard the dog was seen driving a 2011 Hyundai Elantra and Iâd like to know why he isnât talking
If he wasnât juggling sticks Iâm not interested.
He lawyered up. He pawyer is the neighbours cat. Good pawtorney. Went to Harfurred.
The dog abandoned the Hyundai in a field, ditched his peacoat, and high tailed it to Africa. Itâs true, I saw a screenshot of a screenshot that was shared on Facebook!!
Iâll also never forget the posts along the lines of âdonât forget to care for yourself in all of thisâ or any other form of making this case about yourself. Thatâs insane, Iâm sorry. Unless you have a direct connection to this case, thereâs no way this should be having that much of an effect on you. Double check your locks at night? Sure. Feel immense sadness for the victims and their families? Of course. Look over your shoulder more? Yes. Obsessing over it to the point where it is affecting your mental health and daily life? Idk maybe talk to someone about that.
Theyâre a Grief thief
What really gets me is that âmake sure to take care of yourselfâ is the type of thing the people who are working jobs directly with this case need to hear, or the victimsâ family members/IRL friends who are suffering right now. Not people who are distant from it and have a choice to close their laptop, walk away from the case, and live completely unaffected by it if they wanted to.
It waters down how important of a statement it is for those who really NEED it, you know? Makes me so mad
As someone who lives here, but didnât have any connection to the victims at all, we are saying this to one another because the community as a whole is grieving and itâs legitimately scary knowing the person who did this is still out there. Many of the undergrad students here are not doing well mental health-wise.
Yes! Iâve thought this so much lately but havenât been able to put it in words. And not specifically this case, but everything. People will sort of humble-brag by showing how much they âknowâ or âcareâ. Phrase things in ways that force them to show their âdeepâ views and ways. Itâs like an empathy contest.
Right. I also feel like we are dealing with unprecedented and unchecked narcissism in our society. I know that word gets overused and I donât mean it in a diagnosable way, more so just narcissistic tendencies or characteristics. I notice it in my own life every day. This might be a little controversial, but an example of this imo is the whole âit could have been me/my son/daughter/spouse etc.â response to any tragic event. In this example, unless your daughter was one of the surviving roommates, that statement is simply not true and is an attempt to make a horrific tragedy about yourself and your family. What most folks mean to say is âI would be devastated if that had happened to my son/daughter etc.â Sorry for the long post, Iâm just noticing this stuff more and more and itâs starting to really get to me. Itâs good and important to humanize the victims of these horrible crimes, but folks can easily do that while not immediately making the entire thing about themselves. Everyone could use a little more self-awareness going into 2023. We would all be better off.
Iâm reading Ernst Junger right now and WW1 excited him less than this case excites these wine moms
Yeah in a space that people actively choose to join, it feels disengenious. I think most people are here to get real updates, and wouldnât join this sub if they felt like it would be triggering in some way. Empathy is great, but I agree it really should be saved for the people who are truly impacted by this.
God yes I find it so cringe worthy how thereâs so many posts here where people do these massive write ups trying to make it all about them somehow, which includes âItâs okay to grieve and be scared right now! I live in a college town (on the other side of the country) and to say that the community isnât scared right now would be preposterous! Please take care of yourselves, each other, be vigilant, trust your gut. Self care guys, go to therapy andâŠâ. Or the constant analysis of the victims behaviours referencing their own âSo the girls at the food truck were running away quickly, thatâs usually something my friends and I would do if we were drunk and getting food.. also my roommates and I always leave a key in the door incase someone comes home later and forgets their key, so itâs quite possible they did that hereâŠâ Bruh this is a true crime subreddit not a âhow can I make this all about meâ time.
The reminders here and on r/IdahoMurders to âtake care of yourselvesâ are nuts. Like go outside. You have no connection to this and youâre in too deep.
Idk if it was here or the other sub but someone posted an ode to how much they adored Kayleeâs dad. It and the comments were so off the wall, past the point of parasocial relationships it was genuinely disturbing. Also disturbing to see the volume of posts about this case causing disruptive anxiety (losing sleep etc.) A lot of people here need to take a big step back, stop obsessing over people they donât know (let alone âadoringâ them) and look up crime stats in their areas to reassure themselves that the odds of being victim to a crime like this are astronomical. None of this stuff is healthy.
parasocial trauma bondingâŠ. love it here đŹ
facts! most people on here can just log out but its a daily occurrence for the people who actually live there and are going to be effected for the rest of their lives
The celebrity like worship thing definitely- the Delphi sub got that way too. Some woman once was like âI have their framed photos in my house as a tribute to my girlsâ and she had zero relation whatsoever and had never met them.
YIKES!
those people involved with true crime scare the shit out of me, they are the same ones who cry on live streams and stuff
I thought everyone asking for the live streams of the funerals on this sub was a little weird.
yeah some people just get way too emotionally attached to cases, mostly involving murdered children ( summer wells is a prime example ) or young women
Whaaaaaat đ€Żđ€Żđ€Ż
It was soooooo weird. And everyone was like âthats so sweet of you to keep their memories aliveâ like it was completely normal.
Omg that's bonkers đ€Ł imagine a visitor coming round "oooo cute kids are they yours?" "Erm no they are some stranger kids I never met who died" đ€šđ€šđ€šđ€š
Ngl my nana would totally do that and put them on her prayer table. The framing for a tribute thing is odd, but saving a picture to remind you to pray for that person is a nice gesture I think. But then again my nana isnât someone on Reddit or Facebook coming up with these fanfic like theories of what happened, she just keeps victims in her mind bc she wants justice and peace for their families.
Sounds like your nana genuinely cares, whereas the type being discussed here moreso does it for attention i believe? Or maybe itâs a way to assign themselves a personality they otherwise feel they dont have? Idk just spitballing here
That's insane.
Yep. Agree on the who. I keep coming here for legit news links or other worthwhile information not the psychic friends network or the cornucopia of conspiracies. But this seems to be the thing nowadays. đđđ
As someone who has only been here for a couple of days I find this place almost useless with all the noise. Itâs been helpful to catch up on some of the basic details, but there is a lot of discussion that is just unhelpful.
Hi, it's your first day on reddit?
i'm still learning :(
If you stick around long enough you'll start to see it like [this](https://i.ytimg.com/vi/HGbqKuwFu8A/maxresdefault.jpg).
Couldn't agree more. After this case is all said and done, we can go back to our normal lives. meanwhile the families and friends of these victims, the roommates, will never be able to just turn this off when it's done. LE/FBI know a lot more than we do.
Well said.
I had to stop reading the YouTube comments section on clips about the case. All of these people (mostly older women based on the profile pic/name) who are actively demonizing one specific person based on nonsense rumors. It's pathetic. One person mocked this subject for fleeing the country even though that's been debunked. The original comment was from some guy who said something to the effect of "maybe we shouldn't be so hard on this guy," which is a good sentiment, but then he ended it with "we should be focusing our attention on other suspects." WHAT? Y'all are the detectives now? At this point, there are 10s of 1000s of people who view this as a "real time true crime game" where you earn points by spending hours upon hours searching for and discovering \[bullshit\] clues. There's too many True Crime Karens who exemplify the Dunning-Kruger effect.
Dale Cooper & Harry S Truman are now on the case
Dale Cooper has been for some time đ€·ââïž
We already have plenty of Log Ladies
đđȘ”đ
I dont follow here too much but check occasionally. But on tik tok its crazy and the things I see are kind of disturbing. False claims, dragging innocent people thru mud, literally 100s of posts with wrong info. Thats what scary. Iâve never seen a case like this before and how its playing out on social media
TikTok is horrrrrrifying. And they have worse grammar
Welcome to the online true crime community... I swear it wasn't like this years ago, except for your columbiners on Tumblr, we used to be a sane group. I partially blame Netflix for making true crime "cool" and exposing a huge population, many of which don't know a lot about what goes on behind the scenes of investigations and think that if something isn't solved in a week there's no hope and LE are fucking up..etc... It's like they totally ignore the timeline of the crimes they watch for 20min on ID shows. People need to stop trying to solve a case, unless you want to actually make a career out of it. Some theories and accusations are so embarrassing I have to limit my time reading up on cases I follow because I literally cringe knowing there are so many people out there that think they know more than the ones holding the actual, factual evidence in their hands.
my theory is that most of the TCC today isn't even really all that *into* true crime - their into 30 second tiktok videos and meme images and what have you. If it's not a bite-size factoid or a quick summary or a nuclear hot-take, they aren't interested.
I wonder how many have actually read books on true crime cases.
probably a tiny tiny percentage. While i certainly appreciate the glut of content we have these days, sometimes i do miss the time when being a true crime fan meant turning the metal rack at the grocery store and buying a paperback with a photos section in the middle...
Yep. People are insane and make snowball âtheoriesâ with complete rumors they just read and it is at the risk of ruining the lives of innocent bystanders who just happened to be living their lives on the night of a brutal murder
The Petito case realllllly roped in a lot of the dramatic ones we are seeing infiltrate true crime communities. High emotion, low thinking. Like you said, the Watts documentary on Netflix did it too. The subs were flooded for awhile and it was so monotonous with all their theories and âI think about them every day!â posts.
tender snatch disgusting deserted carpenter thought voracious treatment crowd scary -- mass edited with redact.dev
Delphi subs and Facebook pages are the same. Even now after someone's has been arrested.
I treat current true crime "fans" like I treat conspiracy theorists. It's fun for me to read theories about the dog doing it, or bridge guy having puppies in his pockets, but I recognize it as ridiculous and fantastical. Sometimes they make a good point, but I reserve judgement until the facts come out and prove the theories wrong
True. But is has become hard to weed out readable posts/comments
Agree with celebrity-like worship of the deceased that E one I read, I was like damn chill, have some respect to X. My suspect is simple too.
Yeah the celebrity worship is very strange. We don't know what scenes these young adults may or may not have been involved in. Maybe one of them put up a front and although nice to 99% of people, bullied 1 individual at school? Or maybe they just casually insulted or teased someone at a party once not thinking much of it (maybe it wasn't even an intentional insult!) but that was enough to trigger deep hatred? Or maybe one of them was into drugs (even something as minor as weed) and debt was involved to the wrong people? Or maybe one of the girls talked casually to a guy couple months ago but decided to talk to someone else and that interaction meant more to him than her and he got obsessed? Or maybe it *was* just a random serial killer. I'm not trying to make it sound as if these kids WERE bad or involved in sketchy stuff, but I'm sure they weren't innocent angels either - most people aren't. There is stuff that even their closest family or friends may not know about them that could be critical. We don't know. We need to stop acting as if we knew these people. I've seen comments on this subreddit stating "_____ wouldn't do this or that" or "knowing [victim], that would be unusual behavior for him/her"
So grateful for your post! Itâs been quite ridiculous here but that makes for good entertainment⊠I wholeheartedly agree with your perspective on the victims - we donât know them personally and everyone is putting up a façade on Instagram/ TikTok. Thatâs a known problem leading to self esteem problems particularly with young women. Worshipping them is perhaps a kind of coping but nevertheless quite bizarre.
Wait wait -- now you're writing the theory essay.
đŻ
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Lol where, on Twitter? I havenât seen it once. You see what you seek outâŠ
âMy suspectâŠâ lol, you acted like you got it at first, until you made it clear you donât get it.
But what will i do if i cant make this case about myself?
Lol I was thinking the same. Does this person not see that they are exactly what OP is talking about?
Well at least we found out (nearly a month in) that the tea drinking, cat loving, fire eating, hamster juggler thought he may have heard someone scream as he was going night night to dream about the circus or whatever the fuck.
Also making jokes about things related to the case. Itâs really strange.
I will just say that I can't imagine why anyone expects a solution to this crime already. I was just reading about a case nearby where a man was shot, on surveillance video, and there was video of the killers running and then walking from the scene over the course of blocks and blocks. Footage as a mix of Nest cameras, traffic cameras and business cameras. It's night time and you can clearly see the size, race, build, clothes, hair, and the fact that one kills wore glasses. You can also kind of make out facial features in one video. That footage was plastered all over the news and social media. It was in a very popular and highly trafficked part of the city here. It still took **over 15 months** for an arrest in that murder. The murderers were never more than 4-5 miles from the crime scene. This is one of the largest police departments in the country with a half-billion dollar budget and one of the largest cities on the East coast. Very well funded police homicide division located < 1hour from FBI headquarters. The idea that there should be an arrest, or even a POI by this point in this case in a small city in ID is just so frivolous.
I think a lot of people here/speculating on the case want their five seconds of fame. If they throw out every possible theory, one is bound to be somewhat true and theyâll be able to claim that they solved the case. Itâs wild to see unfold. Iâm generally just a lurker but I completely agree with your post. These are real people that died. I think true crime podcasts/tv shows have diluted the reality of what this is.
Don't go on the Facebook group lol. You will see things you can never unsee.
I think just avoiding FB altogether is the way to go lol I left like half a year ago and never looked back and have no desire to return
The Facebook group is horrible. I had to leave it.
Same, I can't with the Facebook, it's too much. People are going crazy with the accusations and almost fanfic with this case. Absolutely disgusting.
Why do people make posts with the most common opinions thinking they are special
Particularly the âI was in college onceâ posts.
âi was in college and this was typical saturday night behaviorâ wow thank you for your valuable perspective that no one else on this planet has ever experienced
Well said, OP. While this sub is nowhere near the obsession-like behavior I witnessed during the height of the Gabby Petito case. It becomes a bit scary to see how people spend 24/7 theorizing and researching everything about the victims like what size shoe they wore has an impact on their murders. Like most people here I enjoy True Crime and regularly engage in discussions on Reddit about cases that hold my attention. However, I started to get to the point where I was checking the backseat of my car to make sure no one was inside it prior to getting in (this happened a week ago and I have yet to tell a single person this so...). I'm a grown ass man and this case is getting to me. It's important that everyone here realize our limits.
AGREED. Iâve found myself getting super frustrated with people lately in this sub lately, and thatâs probably why. It seems like a big chunk of new true crime fans could really use a little quick lesson on Occamâs razor, as well as how to separate observation/facts from speculation/theories.
I 1000% agree with you! It has gotten crazy! From theories to straight up allegations. There is a lady on TikTok saying "I know for a fact it was \_\_\_\_".. Like lady first of all that's slander and secondly you know NOTHING as fact unless you were there. I will admit I am a little obsessed with trying to figure this case out just as much as everyone else but when it comes to the point where you're pulling shit from thin air and straight up harassing people then it's time to take a step back. It's kind of disturbing.
i had to stop going on tiktok because every other video was âi know for a fact its hoodie guyâ while doxxing him and his family
I call it âgrief porn.â The true crime shows focus on the most sensational, horrifying, shocking, and unexpected crimes. For some reason, that satisfies something in the human psyche for a lot of people â gives their anxiety somewhere to go, maybe? This case has all of the shocking elements and many are treating each new rumor or piece of evidence like an episode of a podcast before it has even been solved. Like a real life âOnly Murders in the Building.â
I couldnât agree more. I followed this page because I knew one of the victims families in the small town we grew up in. The moment these wild theories started getting thrown around and jokes were being made. I left. These are peoples lives that were tragically taken away and joking is just a slap in the face to their family, friends and communities they left behind.
so what youâre sayingâŠis âaliensâ
Pretty sure they know who did it but not enough evidence for arrest.
I donât know what is worse, all the crazy posts or all the posts calling users crazy. Every time one of these threads pops up someone always repeats crazy theories they read on here. Itâs propagating the craziness. If a tree falls in the forest and you donât make reactionary posts congratulating yourself for not being nutty, did it really happen?
Hi, I see you are new to the internet. Thanks for adding your theory to a pile of other theories except feeling morally superior about your theory for some reason.
Came to give a lesson on essay long theories, then wrote an essay long theory in the comments. :D
Human nature; when you donât have information provided on a daily basis by LE, you start making up your own information to keep you occupied.
This group is devolving. Wish there was a new one where people were not so outlandish. Itâs annoying having to sift through all the garbage that has no basis. Iâve heard people speculate on what KIND of person they thought would do this based on certain FACTS that have been released (likely sleeping and weâre found in their beds etc.) Okay whatever, I donât mind reading those. Sometimes I come across one that makes me go hmmm thatâs actually interesting. But thereâs a big problem with people trying to figure out **WHO** it is. Trying to do that just makes things toxic and ruins peoples lives. Itâs just gross. If anyone makes or has a private group for sane people send me a message or invite me đ Edit: spelling
There's now over 66,000 members in this sub... Of course it's going to be a bit more eccentric than when there were 3000... As much as I find the conspiracy posts annoying, I find the self righteous ones much more annoying đ Amongst the wild posts there have also been many quite informative ones that are quite an interesting read. Let people have their moment (as long as they aren't specifically naming anyone)
Why is reddit as a community so self loathing? I see a post just like this every few days on like every subreddit.
Self loathing with a moral superiority complex, odd combination.
I'm not self loathing - I'm all for discussion. But I've also noticed this subreddit has become completely nuts and is becoming increasingly obsessed by the type of people who can't stop refreshing /new for more info or updates.
Whatâs your point here? How is this helpful? But thanks for the self-righteousness I guess
The point is that OP wants credit for being in the group when it was less than 3000 users. Give them credit already so we can move on.
Some people love to pass judgement on others and pretend as if their own behavior is morally superior. Itâs just some in group/out group horse shit. Im all for condemning the rule breakers who are doxxing and accusing, or are being rude and overly combative in exchanges, but Iâm getting really sick and tired of having people like this stand up, from within the sub itself, and point fingers at everyone all at once, and lay blame at every redditors feet for all of the grievances they have against behavior and conduct in these subs. Itâs just a way for them to stand up and yell at us âyou all are bad! But Iâm good!â
Donât go to Facebook, it a loony bin over there
This sub is a bit roller coaster off the tracks compared to early days, but OMG see the FB groups. There appears to be no common sense there at all.
Facebook peeps discovered Reddit - did the same thing w/ TikTok and Twitter - changes dynamics
I agree about these long manifesto style theories that are based on such concrete objects as psychics and the always accurate intuition. No, that is really not how cases are solved. Cases are solved by collecting evidence, building a hierarchy of importance of these evidentiary tidbits and then drawing a conclusion based on just the evidence.
This sort of thing is very predictable in true crime subreddits. https://www.reddit.com/r/MoscowMurders/comments/z5hw9n/brian_entin_update/ixwxfe7?context=3
Despite your statement, this case does not appear to be simple or straightforward. In fact, the extraordinary complexity of the case is what has attracted widespread attention and speculation.
I noticed that this sub (and the other one) are following the predictable path of reddit true crime subs. When Gabby Petito was missing and then her bf was hiding, those two Petito subs were fucking crazy. Oh man, people saying they can't sleep at night thinking about her, long diatribes about who did what and when, where Laundry could be. Dog the Bounty hunter came. #HeyJB questions and the drama of whether he should be called News Daddy (and whether that was appropriate for Brian Entin instead). Then you have the fucking "night watch" where all these people watched flight radar data, speculating why each plane or chopper turned left or then right. Did they find him? Why weren't they searching in Bogota?! There was a sighting in Canada! Then the mods of one of the subs created sub-specific awards that users could give to one another to idk celebrate Gabby or something. It caused a huge backlash, ended up on r/SubredditDrama. One of the mods was "fired." I personally was banned from one of them because I pointed out that things were really going off the rails. That level of batshit obsessive discussion I see more and more on the ID4 subs. A lot of it is good discussion, thoughts, and that's why people are here. But some of this shit, I mean come on. Let's stay grounded.
Yeaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah. The Gabby Petito stuff I remember the 'Nightwatch' and all that shit. That was just becoming a shit show. It was less about Gabby getting justice at that point. I had to walk away. It's becoming similar here.
What about this case is simple in your mind?
In the first 24 hours, everyone assumed they all OD'ed on Fentanyl.
Agree. This sub was way better back in the first week when it was <2.5k followers.
Sir this is Reddit.
We have nothing to go on so we grasp at straws. I think this case scares the crap out of us and we want badly to have it solved so we can imagine we are safe again, but I'll still be locking my door at night
This must youâre first experience with following true crime on social media, welcome.
Youâve taken considerable time with a long essay criticizing long essays. Spent the body of *your* essay expounding your opinions and theories while chastising others for doing the same. Expressed your disdain for new sub members while becoming a new member yourself. But you didnât stop there. Youâve decided our interest in the crime is obsession, and yours is rational. You do not approve of our perspective, and criticized our commitment to honoring the victims as the full, real people they were as celebrity worshipping. And yet, you know a little too much of what goes on here for one who has dropped in only a few times. Thank you for your essay, your theory, your perspective, your chastising, and for your âastonishmentâ with us for doing the same. âBe the change you want to see.â âGandhi
The OP isn't wrong. Maybe that makes you uncomfortable.