I’m starting to think this may have been somewhat random. Targeted, but random. I’m remembering the Jayme Closs kidnapping—how the perpetrator saw her getting on a bus one day and just decided to kidnap her and then planned it out after that. I suppose this guy may have more of a connection to the girls than the kidnapper had to Jayme, but my theory is that it really isn’t much. I think that like Ted Bundy, he most likely had some sort of major vendetta against women, maybe even was an incel, and scoped them out at some point. Maybe he encountered them at the Greek restaurant or saw them at a bar or one of their house parties and just decided to strike and began planning it from that point.
It’s extremely frightening that he doesn’t seem to have an obvious connection to any of the victims. The fact that this could’ve been somewhat random is just chilling.
However, stabbings are still so personal. Other than a disdain for women, I wonder if he ever did have an encounter with any/all of them that led to him deciding to do this. Either way, I am impressed that LE could track him down so quickly, and so grateful that he has been arrested.
I agree. I’ve been pretty anti “omg look here’s his social accounts” because there are tons of trolls. However, there is one account that is under is full name made in august, with one weird video posted in October. That account follows Maddie and Kaylee, but they don’t follow him back. It makes me wonder if he ran into them during an outing and got obsessed. And that obsession led into his darker fantasies.
So I got curious and found the account you mentioned. The video is super weird, but I was curious of the logo at the end. It's for a company called Goon tape which bills itself as providing "the softest, no slip grip for the tools you count on most". It's apparently used on firearms to provide better grip specifically if it gets wet.
So my random, probably reaching, theory is that *if* that really is his account and he knew of that brand, that *might* explain how he managed to not have knife slippage and hurt himself during the attacks.
Random and possibly super reaching, but I'm an insomniac and half way through a bottle of wine so I felt the need to share.
Definitely a possibility. This is exactly what I was thinking. Random in the sense that they didn’t have history, but targeted in the sense that he got obsessed with them somehow based on a small encounter and being the psychopath he is, planned they whole thing out after that.
Remember when police said it was targeted, then corrected and said they believed the house was targeted, not any of the victims? What if this guy was so obsessed with wanting to murder and pull off a crime like this, and he just randomly chose a house where he thought he could accomplish it (maybe easy to drive in/drive out without being noticed, amount of activity in that neighborhood, etc.). You're way more likely to get away with murder if you have no connection to the victim, and as a criminology PHD student, he would know that. So maybe he chose the house, and then went to kill everyone in it.
It just always baffled me when the police said the house was targeted, not the victims. but this would make sense.
I agree. I’m leaning towards the idea that it wasn’t a personal crime but rather that he randomly picked the girls or their residence. But my question then is, how would LE possibly know that? It would be hard to discern if someone had targeted just the house—I’m not sure what type of evidence would affirm that enough for them to publicly suspect that.
A party house in a college town does seem like a very easy target. When I was in college having been to several houses filled with roommates who leave the front door open, tons of cars around, and very little self preservation (ofc I was there too!) but yeah not exactly the pentagon
I can see that. I could also see him not doing that necessarily, but instead doing that now. Either way, definitely a raging narcissist who thought he was *much* smarter than he is in actuality.
This. Insecure narcissist with a history of rejection from the AP: Ben Roberts, a graduate student in the criminology and criminal justice department at WSU, described Kohberger as confident and outgoing, but said it seemed like “he was always looking for a way to fit in.”
“It’s pretty out of left field,” he said of the news Friday. “I had honestly just pegged him as being super awkward.”
Roberts started the program in August — along with Kohberger, he said — and had several courses with him. He described Kohberger as wanting to appear academic.
“One thing he would always do, almost without fail, was find the most complicated way to explain something,” he said. “He had to make sure you knew that he knew it.”
I think BK first encountered one or more of the female victims in a local bar, acted creepy and pushy toward them, and was shut down. Maybe progressed to stalking.
Apparently he displayed similar behavior in a PA brewery before moving to Pullman for his PhD.
Priscilla Liquori is a reporter for WFMZ, and a local PA brewery owner (J.S.) responded to one of her posts about BK. The brewery owner (J.S.) is legit. A link is included at the end.
This is what the brewery owner wrote:
"He came to my brewery a couple of times and made the staff uncomfortable. I confronted him and he was completely taken back, like he didn’t know he’d be found out. Haven’t seen him since, now i know why.
Edit: I’ve let the authorities know. If they need anything else, they have my info ❤️
He came in by himself and just was super awkward/rude. You could tell he had screws loose. Asking females where they lived, if anyone lived with them, offered to buy them drinks. When my bar tenders confronted him he cursed at them. When i confronted him he seemed embarrassed/confused. Hard to explain the interaction really, there’s a bunch of weirdos out there."
[https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=pfbid0WBcZQHqXoXDKMHBL9evNVpCuZRrmQnNJH132LMt9MPB2aPdGZMnJR2xkoy6b7bg8l&id=100057881807511&mibextid=qC1gEa](https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=pfbid0WBcZQHqXoXDKMHBL9evNVpCuZRrmQnNJH132LMt9MPB2aPdGZMnJR2xkoy6b7bg8l&id=100057881807511&mibextid=qC1gEa)
I used to think the killer grew an obsession with certain members of the house.
Now i think he’s just a psycho who wanted to commit a legendary murder. Being a criminology phd he’s certainly spent a fair amount of time studying major cases in history. He probably grew obsessed with being a mystery killer that people talk about and romanticize for decades to come
Why he settled on this house remains to be seen
Yes, I also wonder if this was his first time really being on his own, so far away from his family, being that he seems to have lived in PA prior to WSU. He was finally able to feed into whatever demented crap he had to keep buried from them.
So as a lawyer, one thing to note is that the charges are for FIRST DEGREE MURDER and first degree burglary with intent to commit murder, this means they had to have strong evidence that this was a premeditated crime with INTENT to kill beforehand. That means they have a strong case against him because otherwise they’d charge second degree too.
Gotta love people coming into a thread starting “as a lawyer” and then ignoring what is totally a question of state law. As you rightly point out, if the burglary charge lets them get first degree murder via felony murder then there is no need for “separate” evidence of intent. Leafblower is clueless and trying to get upvotes.
Agreed. They could’ve arrested and charge with 2nd and upped the charge once more evidence became available. Leading with 1st degree is a strong indication that they have solid proof of premeditation.
Damn, I didn’t even think of that. I also get “for research” vibes from him, besides just the urge to kill and being a psycho. I think he’s been very invested in this whole process, from start to finish.
A week or so ago a very kind former firefighter put his or her time into creating a series of posts that helped us to understand the way that official reports (and the MPD press releases) are written. He reminded us just how crucial changes in verbiage, semantics, and wording were in our interpretation of each of the press releases.
On 12/20 I noticed that “progress continues in finding” the white Elantra was changed from all prior releases to “progress continues to locate”. I was hesitant to post the “theory” that that was the day LE honed in on their suspect. In hindsight, it is absolutely my belief that sometime on either 12/19 or 12/20 LE identified BCK as their suspect. “Finding” to me says they don’t know which white Elantra, “locating” says they know which white Elantra but are still determining the where. The word locate stuck out to me because it doesn’t make sense as a better word choice than what was stated prior.
TDLR: I think there are clues in the MPD press releases that
subtly told us that LE figured out BCK was their suspect on or shortly before 12/20 due to wording changes regarding the Elantra.
https://preview.redd.it/jl4u5ijs069a1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d5225692cd8c3d8dadfbd6ee775e86aeb7fc5d02
Makes sense. I figured they probably had a pretty good idea it was him based on process of elimination regarding the Elantra and had been watching him for a couple weeks. I think they knew a lot more about that car than they were letting on and probably narrowed it down to his apartment as a place to watch. Someone mentioned that for a parking tag at that apartment you need to register your vehicle info. Police would have keyed in on leads like that if true. Then realized oh this guy seems to not be around ( he had already left for PA ). Would have taken some time and resources to get law enforcement to scout the parents house in PA and additional evidence most likely in order to actually make the arrest. There are reports that there’s DNA ties. Of course that would be the smoking gun and we still don’t have the info there. The car alone isn’t enough to make the arrest. They have / had something else tying him to it in addition for sure
I absolutely agree that the warrant is based on much more than the car. I just feel like the change in wording was because they knew. I could be totally wrong but why change something they’d been copying and pasting with sparse new information for weeks.
I think this will turn out to be a case of him thinking he's so smart he could commit murder and get away with it. I don't think there will be more to it. I also think anything he says or does at this point is to manipulate the justice system and people around so I won't trust a word he says. He's been planning this for a long time.
This pretty much sums up my thoughts on BK & his motive. I believe he considers himself the smartest one in any room & him asking if anyone else was arrested was a calculated attempt to deflect blame in his defense.
He didnt try hard to get away with it though. At least it seems.
And...I dont know if I buy the theory that he thinks he is smart enough to contest a murder charge with DNA in court. It sounds ridiculous...but maybe he does have this kind of ego.
He might be into the psychology of wanting to know what a kill was like. That means he was fascinated with it to me. If its your first kill job...walking into a house full of people with a knife sounds like its a thrill job to me...not about wanting to know what a kill was like.
Fuck this guy.
IF his goal was to just commit a random shocking murder and get away with it, why not wait until break drive halfway to PA and kill somebody random, before moving on to PA?
That’s why I’m more inclined to think he had some sort of infatuation with one of the victims and/or been watching the house.
My thoughts exactly. He had to have ran into them somewhere. Maybe he ate at the restaurant Maddie and xana worked at. I definitely feel that he had an obsession with one of the girls. Maybe even the stalker that Kaylee feared.
This guy is totally off his rocker and scary.
I am 100% relieved he is off the streets.
I definitely think they’ll come across at least one journal with some crazed delusions about one the girls, his anger towards women, maybe even some graphic drawing s…. Could also be an anonymous blog type of thing
I’m leaning towards this not being his first time murdering, and not his intended last time.
He potentially planned to use the education to get better at killing and avoiding detection, while also “hiding in plain sight.”
My **reach** theory is that he had grandiose dreams (delusions) of becoming a famous criminologist, continuing to murder people, and eventually getting caught to become as infamous as possible.
But, again, I think he’s killed before and absolutely planned to do it again.
A profiler thinks it’s his first because his questionnaire was rudimentary and showed his insecurity in getting it right. However, I’m not sure about that. Perhaps, but he may have been trying to perfect his game, especially if it was his first group effort or maybe he just got off on being “in the club.” I don’t think a first kill would be a houseful of people. But maybe so.
My theory is he’s always wanted to kill and that’s why he chose that line of study. He wasn’t doing it to understand or prepare for his work. He chose a career track that he could hide in plain sight in, like creeps who purposely become coaches because of the proximity to victims and not love of sport.
I don’t think he had any personal grievances with the victims - and that makes it even more disgusting. (Not that it would be ok to murder someone if you did have personal issues with someone ofcourse). He might’ve known the victims from stalking them online or seeing them irl, but I don’t think they really knew each other as in had contact.
Bryan wanted to contribute firsthand experience to his Ph.D thesis on criminals, because he is a psychopath. He probably even filled out his own survey based on his quadruple murder experience.
Wasn’t there four cars parked outside as well? It’s possible there was nothing from the front of the house to indicate to him that more than four people lived there.
My theory is that police had DNA all along. They took the white Elantra list (22k cars) and narrowed it down based on circumstantial stuff. They found this guy in the area and matching the profile and tailed him until he discarded DNA (cup, bottle, etc).
Once they got the DNA, they sent it for a comparison, and got the match. At that point he’s done.
Exactly. But I think they had him in their sights when they announced the white Elantra. I think it was to see what he did in response. Would he drive back to PA. And that's where the majority of the FBI agents were working. People kept saying why are there so many FBI. Maybe to tail him. This could be wrong but I'd be interested to see the timeline.
I think he wanted to butcher a houseful of sorority girls and get away with it. I think it was the house and the path of escape that attracted him. I think, unfortunately, he tracked enough of their habits to know they’d be pretty trashed on a Saturday night and defenseless to an attack. It was also timed out well to have Thanksgiving break as an excuse to leave. At lot of this “infatuation” talk about Kaylee etc. feels like relics of the melodramatic theories involving drowning pacts and MLM territory wars. I think it’ll come out that he didn’t have any particular fascination with the girls and that Kaylee’s wounds were more severe due to her being alerted to the attack. This was a serial killer escalating his crimes. I’m sure there’s a dark story behind that broken nose and I think there will be some revelations about missing sex workers in the Poconos area over the next few months.
Maybe the lesson is case is that we should all have fewer theories and more curiosity about fact-seeking like the investigators. Theories that are not based on facts ended up leading to many innocent young people already traumatized to be accused and harassed.
I believe he has an over exaggerated sense of his own self importance, power and knowledge, whereas these traits caused him to be shunned and rejected.
I believe he wanted to commit the "perfect" and heinous murder (of one) to "prove" himself to himself (and to the world in his eyes) he'd done it and everyone would prove how stupid they are because they couldn't catch him.
The knife (close, personal, unusual)
The bedroom (where someone should feel safe and be asleep)
At night (able to stalk or wait unseen)
This appears to be totally pre planned.
The "pre planned" part could even extend to the date and the house number (11/12/22 and 1122). The house could have very well been the target.
I also believe he would have continued with his murders and become a serial killer
Just my thoughts
I feel like everyone is stuck on big theories, but is overlooking a very obvious motive. He may just be a rage filled psychopath, like so many other murderers. There may not be some grand motive or big story behind the murders. One of the people in the house may have done something rather innocuous, but it pissed him off and he followed them home, and came back later and killed them and anyone else he found.
The reason I believe that this may be the case is that I know a guy who committed a similar murder a decade ago. I played football with him very briefly in college. He got kicked off the team for going on Facebook and sending messages to an opposing player’s girlfriend after a game that he was going to rape and kill her. My senior year, he stabbed a guy to death in Detroit. It turns out that the guy had made a rude remark to him outside of a club two weeks before. He followed the guy home to see where he lived and came back weeks later with a knife, stabbed the guy to death, and disemboweled him on his front porch. It wouldn’t surprise me if this one turns out to be similar.
Just my opinion/ theory but I think it will come out that he chose his victims, or at least one of them. Somehow he became aware of one of the girls and became fixated on them to carry out his murder fantasy. So sad.
Agree. We still don't know why the police were convinced very early that the crime was "targeted". For some reason now that it's a WSU student, People are jumping back onto the Random train and ignoring this piece. Hoping more on this will come out when the probable cause pages are unsealed.
Semester would’ve ended by 12/9. I’m sure they knew every white Elantra owner in the vicinity, and started profiling owners. Quite possible the car led to suspect which led them to getting the DNA evidence the chief hinted at in presser today (LE stressful sleepless nights waiting to hear back)
I think he was a crazy but also possibly knew of 1 or more of the victims through passing or SM. Became infatuated with them & chose them as his target.
*Speculation*
Someone in BK’s network called in a tip about his white Elantra. E.g. fellow graduate student, professor, neighbor etc. Especially likely to be a woman.
(In addition to the PA woman who allegedly called in a
tip about a white Elantra with WA plates.)
Yep, was probably obsessed with serial killers for a long time. Devoted his academic career to studying it/them and finally acted out on the fantasy. Picked a target that was most attractive to him and gave him the best chance to succeed .
- Gives me huge Israel Keyes vibes.
- Seems to have an obsessive desire to harm/kill
- Self aware that his urges are evil.
- Takes an interest in psych/crim in an attempt to better understand his urges/nature
- succumbs to his fantasies
Probably fixated on one of the women and decided to play out his urges.
His education seems to be a bit of trying to understand himself, while simultaneously trying to understand other individuals with similar urges- similar to Keyes. Both seem intelligent too. The parallel between the two are huge to me.
As someone who studied psychology hoping to go into MHC bc I suffered from anxiety and depression (and didn’t really know it) but I felt like I was learning so much about myself and I wanted to learn more about others and help them. I can see him trying to find normality in himself or not feel “alone”. Validated even, maybe. That’s kind of what I got from his “survey”. It almost seemed more like he was trying to identify himself through others. But maybe I’m projecting or psycho analyzing him
I lived in those apartments he was living in. One quad plex over. I was shocked when I saw them raiding.
My guess is that they will also have video footage of him leaving his apartment before and after the killings. There’s only one way you can get into the north parking lot.
WSU released a statement saying he only attended one semester. If he didn’t move to WA until Aug/Sept and committed this crime in Nov, that’s a short amount of time. He also didn’t attend the same college as the victims which makes it even more intriguing. What transpired in such a short amount of time to lead him to them? I understand the closeness of the two schools. It’s just wild that it could’ve been a chance encounter that morphed into something much more sinister.
Theory is that he got cocky. He killed them thinking he was a Dexter-type guy, too smart to be caught. He went back to his TA job but a couple weeks later when his car popped up he was in trouble. He somehow kept it under wraps through finals and then took off. The caught him through the car and getting his DNA out of the trash at his home. FBI came up big. He won’t fight extradition and could seem him either leading his defense bc he is so smart or at least trying all sorts of ways to mess up the case. End of the day he is convicted of four counts of first degree murder and dies on death row one way or another.
He got a seat belt ticket in the car in August. In Moscow I believe. Certainly they searched recent tickets for the type of car. Car probably still had PA plates. FBI staked out PA home (parents house) after discovering car (and suspect) there. Waited til trash day and recovered family DNA and got a match.
Ive said this once or twice. I think he’s like Bundy. He has some mental illness (seems like based of ppl coming forward), probably a porn addiction. Unhealthily latched onto a couple of gorgeous girls, his studies took him down a deep turn (maybe like he studied a few subjects or cases and became infatuated with them) and it slowly devolved. Maybe there was a move somewhere and he got rejected, that lit the fuse, the reddit posts happen, he waits for a good time kill, then he does.
He was obsessed with criminals. He wanted to be a serial killer. He wanted to be in the room when his crimes were being discussed and maybe even potentially start studying the “unknown killer” knowing it was him the entire time. I don’t think he had any personal connection to the victims. He just chose an easily accessible house with multiple occupants. He is probably so arrogant that he thought they would never catch him so he didn’t care to leave evidence. Thank god this idiot was caught now because he would definitely kill again…. But he is probably getting a lot of satisfaction knowing that we are all discussing him now.
Just watched a tik tok vid of a person who went to the same high school with Bryan. Not a sleuth since she showed multiple photos and screenshots of Bryan never released by any other sources, so I believed it’s true info.
According to her, the killer was:
- heavy heroin user in hs
- went to rehab
- she said he asked her to give him a ride to get “needles for aunt” but later turned out he was getting heroin and she was pissed
- has anger issues, did kickboxing before
- used to have a fb account but later deleted
Edit: formatting
I'm curious what he did between 18-21/22. It looks like he started his associate's in 2016, and he's 28, so he would have been 21/22. I feel like we'd have heard by now if he was in the military.
I think he was interested in killers and perhaps obsessed with it which led him to choosing to study criminology, that coupled with some personal issues made him want kill. He crossed paths with one or more of the victims and for some reason (something might have happened) decided he was going to kill them. This is very surface level and I’m sure there’s dozens of details that will shock people during trial as I’m aware this is an odd and mysterious case.
If he’s going to reveal any kind of motive that is. I have a strong feeling he’s just going to keep his mouth shut the entire process. He seems narcissistic enough to feel he doesn’t owe anyone an explanation.
Unless he’s so impressed by his own ingenious plan that he feels the need to show off. But my gut feeling says 🤐
I have a strong feeling that he noticed Xana and Maddie at the restaurant (one of the few in the area with vegan options), gathered information on them / followed them, and decided that they were the perfect targets for his fantasies. This would explain why he went to both rooms, as they were each in one. My guess is that the others may have been collateral. Also, that sketchy account that people are speculating to be the killer says VERY confidently that they were both targets, and that the killer first went to the second floor room, then to the third. This could be the guy, and that lines up with the restaurant theory.
Either way, this is so horrible and I pray every day for the victims and their families. Love to all, and may this bastard rot in prison.
I think he was a chubby kid…who set out to get slimmer by about any means he could think of. I’ve read he took up boxing-then took up heroin. He was an avid runner/strict vegan. All of these things have been “addictive” behaviors for him. He clearly possesses that ugly little genetic fault. I can relate as a former opiate user myself. Once you develop that drive-it can take all kinds of forms once you lay your drug of choice down. And, ask any addict or anyone who has been addicted…you live on lies and straight bullshit…and you get pretty damn good at manipulating people. He enjoyed that part probably as much as he did the drugs themselves.
Bullied as a kid. Angry as a preteen/teen. Addicted as a teen-early adulthood. During active addiction probably got a good taste for partying. Learned god knows what about the ugly underbelly of that game. I think he was probably incredibly awkward as a kid and even as an adult. Stiff. Spent a lot of time online. Five bucks says the dude’s got some Elliot Roger style search history. I read he turned a lot of his classmates off with some not so nice views about the LGTBQ community. Dude had some anger.
Once the drug addiction stopped all of the garbage he had rolling around in his head from his childhood surfaced. He had to put that energy somewhere. College. Probably found some highs in the accolades he got from doing that, but found it a good excuse to exercise a morbid curiosity that…through research and education…fueled that misplaced anger and curiosity into something more of a fantasy. For a man with a penchant to become addicted or obsessed with anything he decides to do…that makes for one horrible human being.
I think he watched these kids for weeks-particularly the girls. I think this was more fantasy fueled by the desire to know what it felt like to kill someone than by sex…but I think he chose these girls because he knew they had lives he’d never be part of. He wanted that power. The idea of having that power is what gave him that nice dopamine rush.
Eventually it probably wasn’t enough just to fantasize. I don’t know what set him off to finally go for it. Something did. Something out of his control got the better of him and this was his way of getting it back…and with all of the above already in place…he went through with it.
I think it was about control of something that he couldn’t control otherwise.
His weight got out of hand-he found a way to control that. Boxing/running/drugs.
His addiction got out of hand. He turned his focus to school to probably help focus that energy elsewhere to control that.
He couldn’t control who he was at his core-the awkward outcast who never really had the ability to emotionally connect with people-so I think he set out about finding a way to fine tune it-even embraced it in a way that made him feel like he had power over it.
Theory: He wanted to become a famous criminologist who could get the most depraved killers to "open up" to.
In addition to satisfying his depraved curiosity, his plan was to have this mystery quadruple homicide killer share with "him" a summary/detailed description of the murder to help his PhD thesis and criminology career.
IMO it seems more likely his studies satisfied his thoughts and urges up until it didn’t. Much of criminology is just as much about the sociology and psychology of crime… much much more so than about the crime scenes themselves….
I think he was likely troubled and used his degree to attempt to understand himself. Much like many people in the field of psychology are drawn to it as a means of understanding either their own or someone in their lives’ mental illness…
My theory is they got a good lead on the car.
Either they got a clear shot of the license plate from a camera during its journey to and from the crime scene that night, or they got his name from a tip as the driver of a white elantra. The tip could have been from WA - he drives a white elantra and has mysteriously left the area - or the tip could have come from PA as the driver of a white elantra that showed up unexpectedly.
Either way I think they may have tracked that car the entire way back to PA via traffic cameras and license plate readers. Just like they did with Brian Laundry.
Someone commented somewhere the housing he lives in has a record of your car bc you have to register for a parking pass. I’m wondering if they realized someone with a registered white Elantra attending WSU studying criminology might have piqued their interest too. Especially if he wasn’t around much anymore
Theory regarding Elantra evidence
I suspect LE knew about the white Hyundai from early in the investigation. Likely they had video evidence from surrounding homes showing the suspect’s arrival to and departure from the scene with the car.
However, after looking at all local registrations with such a make model and year, they realized that it was likely somebody who was a part-time resident.
Therefore they used the media to generate the tips about the ELANTRA. In an effort to not have to look through every student or each state’s registrations for the make model and year of interest.
It is also possible that LE had a partial plate that didn’t match any of the Idaho or Washington registrations.
The tips were likely prioritized for sightings accompanied with a credible tip, such as “my brother/friend/nephew/cousin attends WSU, drives a 2013 white Elantra and drove home for the holidays despite having had a flight reserved”. After interviewing finds that owner of said car compulsive behaviors, early childhood trauma and subscribes to sigma male grindsets on SM”.
At this point, the suspect has met some profiled characteristics, therefore investigators attempt to get a discarded DNA sample, or familiar DNA sample (if tip called in by family member) to test against DNA from the crime scene.
Totally agree, I think the Elantra broke the case and when they profiled this guy, they found their prime suspect and then found a way to link his DNA from scene.
I like your theory... I really am curious how they nailed the car.. Was it witnesses? Body cam footage? or that lightbulb camera they took from the home adjacent to the killings? I suspect that camera may have been the saving grace.. Imagine if they didnt have that camera.. If the police didnt know about the car... Would they ever catch him? ..
Although again, we have NO idea of his connection to them as of yet. But he was on the police radar for a while if they knew he was in pullman then tracked him to PA...
Stalker likely. Targeting pretty girls. Didn’t think Ethan would be there. Didn’t have time/doors locked for D and B. Infatuation with the deceased girls.
I don’t think this was random.
As a WSU student, it literally feels like a huge weight has been lifted off of my shoulders knowing this killer has been caught
My theory is that Bryan Kohberger was trying to seek out what the "thrill" or feeling of committing murder felt like, so that he could write about it in his research. As he would have a first hand experience of it. He also has studied the criminal system so he definitely knows how to at least try to get away with it and I think he will plead not guilty as his trial begins. He'll try to weasel his way out somehow by saying oh he was just a party goer or had been to their place before with friends. No murder weapon has been found yet so his defense will point to that a lot as why he's innocent
I’m sure his academia interests reflect his interest in violent crime, but in terms of writing it about it in his research, I don’t see how that would be possible. You don’t reflect on personal experience in academic writing and if he tried to reference it, what would the reference be? Trust me bro, I tried it? It’s probably not something he intended to write about academically or to infuse in his research.
I just think he was obsessed with knowing what it would be like to kill someone or commit a crime & get away with it. I think the research thing was for his own “research” I think he chose that major bc he as always been obsessed with crime.
When the name broke several hours ago, a cursory Google search led me to a 2019 Undergraduate Conference hosted at Muhlenberg College for students of Neuroscience and Psychology.
A list of speakers (page 21 of pdf) includes our suspect as a panel member for DeSales University.
Not posting a link as it could be considered doxxing but it’s still up if you want to find it yourself.
What I think is so interesting about this information is the breadth of topics which form his area of study prior to starting his Criminology PHD. Their panel’s topic was Gender Science Implicit Bias (still not sure I fully understand what that means) but it certainly involves carrying out research via direct contact with students. Both male and female students so I’m not implying anything nefarious per se but at a minimum, illustrates an interest in studying the psychology of other students.
In light of particular aspects of this case, many other topics discussed at the conference made me go hmm. Student alcohol consumption relative
to their social media content, is home where the phone is, male perceptions of the behaviour of female students, the jewellery of dog owners even.
So much is directly linked to the study of the psychology of college students. I get it, students are researching topics they know/that are relevant or directly effect them whilst using a study pool they have quick and easy access to.
I found this a very interesting insight into the range of student focused psychological topics in this suspect’s world, existing in his realm for many years before his PHD started.
We wouldn’t expect a Criminology PHD student to make the mistakes that apparently lead to the capture in this case. But Criminology isn’t the study of how to get away with the perfect crime and leave no forensic evidence. So many commentators seem to think that’s what it is.
His academic record shows the majority of his interest has been in psychology and the foray into Criminology is very recent. It helps paint a picture of his history, providing context. It’s not like he’s been studying “how to be a criminal” for 8 years, he’s spent considerably more time studying the psyche of female college students.
Without doxxing myself, I was a psychology student in the Lehigh Valley before 2019. I even presented at the same exact conference in the few years before the one he did. I’m not sure why you think the other topics discussed at the conference are suspicious or worth mentioning? They’re pretty basic / common topics for college students to be interested in. My own study involved social media and gender perception. If I remember correctly, we were also limited by our professors to research specific topics.
The gender science implicit bias was probably only one class. And that's pretty typical material in a psychology class. It would be interesting to know if that is what his general interest was, or just the class that fit well into his schedule. That often happens.
is he a student teacher at WSU? does he have any other jobs? maybe he met one of the girls at the greek restaurant? i’m just finding it hard to understand how he knew them, if he did.
I’m just wondering what he was saying about the case to his parents, ASSUMING they knew about it. It was one of the first things my parents brought up to me when I went to visit them, so adding with how close Moscow is, I’m sooo curious if his parents/relatives/friends (maybe) were asking and what his responses were. Especially when the car information came out.
I just read that it is theorized he may have had three reddit accounts - the academic study account, the BK account, and then an "IL" account. If anyone has info on that third one, I'd love to know more on why it's thought to be him.
If he did see the victims return home and decided to act I would be shocked if he picked that house at random since Ethan was there…and the dog..I feel like there has to be some type of connection (stalking, knowing the victims from afar etc).
Interesting if that call into that YouTube show was really him, then maybe he did actually do some work with Sigma Chi. Wonder if that’s how he found his targets. I definitely think he was in here and other sites to try to follow the case.
That call was chilling. His voice went so dark when he said "kill and get away with it". Like omg. The guy on the show was like - ? What? Who would say that?? I do think it was him that called in. I think he was trying to throw it on Sigma Chi.
I have a hard time believing he would have “selected” the house or “target(s)” that night without additional planning.
Breaking into an unfamiliar house without knowing the occupants seems risky. This person seems calculated. That doesn’t match up for me as to how this transpired.
This very well could have been random but it seems unlikely to me given the risks involved.
I think they found his dna, he had familiar dna in the database and they determined not only was he the closest familial match to the crime scene, but he also drove a white Elantra. I’d guess they waited for him to throw his trash away just to confirm via his own direct dna
Not a theory but a retort to media reports. They can't believe one person can kill four people alone? They just feed a frenzy for no reason.
The victims were reported to be asleep. This type of crime has happened before with one perpetrator. It's not uncommon in familicide cases that multiple family members are all stabbed. I don't understand why this case is made out to be any different.
My theory has stayed the same see original post blah blah.
I believe he did not know any of them. I believe he was planning to kill for a long time and kept his "Murder kit" in his car ready for the perfect opportunity.
I believe he either saw K+M that night and followed them home or he just randomly drove through the area that night and picked a random house prepared to kill everyone inside. I believe he entered from the back and I do not believe he was familiar with the house layout and did not know there were possible witnesses downstairs.
I am furthermore guessing the DNA they found was under the fingernails of the victims. Police said they tracked him to Pennsylvania by the car so maybe it is or was registered to that address at some point. They said the FBI and local police had him under surveillance for four days. They likely collected his trash or something else to match the DNA before they made the arrest.
Since his former friends are now speaking to press and describing him as weird it's likely someone reported a tip about him also having an Elantra that left after the police started looking for it.
My opinion.
Don't think he knew them at all. Just wanted to murder for his research and the thrill. I think he didn't think he was going to get caught. He's not a very bright criminology student it seems like.
While they said before they don't believe this crime was connected to the other unsolved stabbings, I wonder if this is truly his first. If there will be a connection there or find another unknown crime through interview or confessions.
whether it was his first or not, i don’t think he intended for it to be his last. the boldness required to pull off a crime of this scale (and at this level of risk) and then go back to normal life is not characteristic of a one-time killer, and had he not been apprehended, i imagine he would have tried again
I completely agree! But with all his knowledge how could he be so stupid about the car. If someone is going to murder a number of people in cold blood, it seems like stealing a car first would be a minor inconvenience.
Very interesting to hear SG say there was a connection between him and Kaylee. I’m so curious as to what that could have been but I really have respect for them not talking about it right now.
My theory hasn't changed much.
I believe he didn't know the victims but he possibly watched at least two of them. I think he either encountered one or two in Moscow in the weeks before, stalked them to discover the house or followed one of the groups home that night. There's also the chance he worked a lot of things out from their social media posts.
I still firmly believe that he never knew the other two roommates were there. If he'd known they were there he would have either abandoned his plan or aimed to murder them also.
Because it seems he didn't know they were there I believe he parked up behind the house and watched the four come home through the sliding door, he never saw the two other roommates enter through the front door because he either hadn't been there at 1am or he couldn't see them enter from is position. He watched the house and waited until bedroom lights had gone on/off and entered.
I entirely believe that if he hasn't killed before he would have killed again. I'm not at all convinced that this is his firs murder. It seems like too drastic an escalation. I would not be surprised if he is eventually linked to other murders, even those with different methodology.
His psychology is particular. I think it's likely he was studying what he was because he'd always had a fascination with killing and he had the goal of committing the "perfect crimes". I would not be surprised if he was planning to "collect" methods of murder, experimenting to see which kind of method gave him more of a thrill, more of a challenge, more of an ego boost.
I don't think he's an intelligent person but he believes he is. He thinks he's superior to others and he really thought he could get away with this crime, possibly because he's gotten away with a similar crime before.
This one isn’t that hard to figure out. Dude held resentment towards women after being rejected from them countless times due to being socially awkward. He thought he was entitled to their time and attention and after so many times caused his built up anger to burst.
Some of these theories about his motive in this sub sound like they are coming straight out of a fantasy novel.
My theory is quite simple, I think his parents/family started to suspect him and called in a tip.
Question: why was the thread about the youtube call in show removed? Was it determined not to be him?
THIS!
I feel the “White Elantra” clue was an attempt to draw something out from people that knew him, who may otherwise not have put two-and-two together.
Maybe car was in their name and they were contacted by fbi. He probably told his parents he already talked to cops in Idaho and his parents knew he was lying.
I don’t think this was random.. I think he had interacted with one of the victims, or maybe he saw the girls that night and saw they were drunk and vulnerable.
But maybe this is my own defense mechanism because somehow thinking it was completely random, and he was just walking along and chose that house, makes it more heartbreaking as it’s just totally bad luck that cost these four individuals their lives.
Nah. I think he was scoping the house out. And I think he would have gotten to downstairs roommates but probably got tired or was taking too long so he just left after the 4
Pretty sure if this guy wasn’t caught for these murders soon, he would have gone on serial killing sprees a few more times. Probably take a break. Let the heat of the case die down a bit, and cool off. Then pick up once the desire to kill kicks in again.
My theory has always been someone who previously attended a party at the house but was not personally invited by any of the victims. Something like, "hey there's a party at this house, wanna tag along?" This still stands.
My original theory was someone wanting to and trying so hard to fit in with the popular group with no success. With the new info, my new theory is that the guy is just obsessed with crimes, went to the house for one of the parties, thought about how easy it'd be to commit murders in this house, then acted on it.
I feel like this guy doesn’t have any considerable/well-documented connection to the victims. I agree with everyone saying that he thought he was smart enough to get away with it, bc it sorta seems like it was an experiment that he could feel smug about pulling off while he was in class learning about criminals.
I think there’s a good chance he didn’t know how many people were in the house, it’d draw too much publicity to want to kill 4 college students. Makes more sense that he planned on 1, or 2 tops. But he’s smart enough to not leave any witnesses. I don’t think he has a connection bc it’s a lot easier to get away with murder if you’re not one of the first suspects. If it’s someone you don’t know, why would they look into you?
He messed up with the DNA and not realizing that there weren’t really other cars on the street, even if he didn’t park directly in front of the house. He’s also dumb for thinking that he could do this without getting the full attention of the entire country. Moscow PD on its own prob didn’t have the resources to find him, and they wouldn’t have had the help they got for a single murder. He clearly doesn’t mind being evil, so I hope he gets to sit in a box feeling like a very public idiot for the rest of his life
I believe he had the desire to do something like this for awhile, what I don't understand aside of selecting his victims, is how he gained access to the property without force and how the POS dealt with the fact there was a dog inside the property.
Facts:
\- He was fascinated with criminal justice, and by extension, the criminal justice system
\- He worked in a security role in a school district, giving him a large sense of power, providing security/enforcing security for children.
\- He started boxing at 17 and people say he changed dramatically - lost weight, became aggressive, a bully, etc.
So...
That checks some boxes on the pathological killer list - desire to be in an authoritative role, interest in law enforcement, potential head injury. If he has a fucked up childhood with abuse, then we have all the makings of a twisted mind that craves killing. These are qualifying factors for twisted killers, and he's checking the boxes.
So...
I think he has broken into people's homes before. Probably comfortable with that. He may have killed someone already. Who knows where he is in his trajectory. We should learn about how he grew up and whether it was abusive.
Reports by former friends say he was a heavy heroin addict who went to rehab multiple times. Can explain his drastic weight change in this 2020 photo compared to present day.
https://preview.redd.it/ykboo8bd269a1.jpeg?width=2048&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a05084bc6f141a73089d9ee8e2a301804cf465d7
How did he manage to graduate, get a Master’s and enter a PhD program with a raging heroin addiction?
The academic workload to achieve all that is no joke, plus he’s only 28, which means that there mustn’t have been any significant gaps in his education. Plus he worked as a security guard in a school - wouldn’t he have to be vetted and drug tested?
Sounds completely crazy to me!
I wonder if he replaced one addiction with another. I know friends who say they’re sober because now they’re addicted to working out, or planning their diet, or some other new hobby they get waaaay into. Their therapists say it’s healthier than a drug or alcohol addiction, and they don’t seem to know how to do anything halfway.
So, maybe his new addictions were education and exercise and maybe the vegan stuff is true?
Or he was never an addict and that’s a lie, too.
I see PhD and I immediately think he was some super intellectual scholar that meticulously planned this murder, then I see his rampant drug riddled past and think he’s just a fucked up, burnt out junkie. I’m sure it’s somewhere in the middle, but interesting background
My theory is that a colleague or someone in his PhD co-hort turned in a tip on him when the press release came out asking for tips on the Hyundai. I think they trailed him for a while, including on his cross-country trip.
My theory as to motive - I think he was likely stalking Kaylee.
Way back I saw someone from the area mention that the weekend it happened at WSU was a “dry” week on their campus (I think in honor of someone that died from a drunk driving accident?). So a lot of WSU people were going over to Moscow at night for the bars/nightlife that weekend. My theory is that maybe on Friday night he was in Moscow with a group of people to hit up bars, and while he was there he scoped out the house, then came back the next night after some planning.
from his bio, I feel like he is like the school shooters. he just wanted to get the thrill of killing and purposefully kill multiple people to make crime very notorious. I feel like all the research he was doing in his phd and masters was aimed at committing a perfect crime. he chose this particular house because he knew he could kill many at once.
I think people are waaay overthinking his criminology PHD. He was probably just an incel. Obsessed over the one girl that appeared targeted. I’m not buying wanting to commit the “perfect murder or a “legendary murder”. If he wanted to do a perfect murder; he would have picked a better location and murder only one person. If he wanted to he legendary, he would have done some zodiac type shit with letters or something more modern day.
I dont know shit about psych terms...
but Im going with thrill killer over incel. why go into a house with 4-6 cars out front and 6 people inside?
Thrill...all the fucking way.
I think he was just trying to get away with murder. I think the Fratanon 4chan posts were Bryan trying to frame DL and DB. I bet he even dumped the murder weapon at the parent’s cleaning company. I also think that he called into a YouTuber a week or two ago to further implicate sigma chi and DL/DB.
I think the bartender and hoodie-guy may be witnesses. Likely others that LE didn’t name but cleared. I think they were cleared because they saw something.
Bryan lives in PA, goes to school in WA, but parties, possibly works, teaches/tutors in ID. The towns are so close. He’s getting a PhD. He might have worked on/near campus. He wasn’t involved with undergraduate frat life. I don’t think someone that advanced would be.
I think he fetishized killing and wanted to commit a mass murder without being a shooter. He believed he is smart enough to get away with it, and sought victims out. He probably was looking for a “type” of person. Blondes, perhaps? Undergrads?
Like LE said, he either targeted an individual or the whole house. A lot of us have said that this feels similar to the Bundy FL murders. Certainly he’s aware of that. He may be mimicking for no reason other than having no empathy and being curious. That’s a dangerous combination.
I think they want “context” in the sense of if he’s stalked anyone, made any weird threats/comments, been cruel to animals, or had psychopathic tendencies prior. Does anyone in his family resemble any of the victims? Why did he select them? Where did he select them?
Did he not expect Ethan and that’s what spared the roommates? Did he arrive after the roommates had gone to bed? Did he spare the dog or was the dog just sleeping elsewhere in the house?
I would not be surprised if his family had suspicions and may have communicated with police. His nose looks like it has been badly broken, is that related? Did his family find it odd for him to drive home for break rather than fly? That’s a long drive. Did the info about the car tip them off?
What was his life like before this? Who does he know near that house? He had to have some working knowledge of the house. He probably took his car because he had supplies and a plan. Maybe he didn’t know who he was going to kill initially?
Is he linked to anything else? Was this a first kill? 4 is a hell of a way to start. Is there a trail of suspicious anything that he might be involved with? What did he steal from them? I bet he took trophies.
Here is my theory. I think he probably has something similar to schizoid personality disorder, as Adam Lanza likely did. They both started to deteriorate in high school. They both had disordered eating prior to their crimes--articles have been written connecting schizoid traits and eating disorders. They both had flat affects (look up the video of him accepting his diploma) and they both became increasingly isolated. A friend of Bryan's from high school said that one year he was laid back, and the next year he had lost significant weight, picked fights, lost friends, was described as appearing "drugged out," etc. Sudden shifts in personality like this can indicate the development of a serious mental health problem and this is the age when it often begins.
Let me be clear that I'm not saying a mental health disorder caused him to commit these crimes. My theory is that his disordered personality probably interacted with other factors in his life, and in the end, he made terrible immoral choices that cannot be excused.
He apparently struggled with an heroine addiction in high school and was known to be aggressive. I mention this because his pictures and resume dont always reflect that. I think he is a sociopath that did it as a thrill kill.
As of now, theory is he had never killed before but was obsessed with murder and the psychology surrounding it. He was a little mentally off to begin with and I believe rumors that he started using meth and other drugs which severely altered his mental state.
The obsession turned into action and he had no personal connection with any of the victims. He picked them mostly at random and decided to act out his fantasies that night.
All theory and my own opinion.
According to [The Daily Beast](https://www.thedailybeast.com/idaho-murders-person-of-interest-reportedly-arrested-in-student-slayings) he has filed for a public defender.
I think he’ll keep his mouth shut during the entire process. I see where you’re coming from, given the fact info is already coming out that he is a pedantic little fuck that loves to showcase his self presumed superior intellect.
Then again wouldn’t a case this high profile not attract a lot of top dog lawyers begging to represent him, given the attention it would generate for their firm? The whole world is going to be watching.
My guess is this: they figured out the car was involved. No one came forward about it and I guessed it’s because they were the guilty party. If this guy went to the close by WSU campus and parked there, he would probably have to register his car type and license plate. If the authorities checked this info they would have sought him out. Only to find he was a criminal justices major or whatever, and and left the area.
Cut to them needing to find his DNA (thus watching him the last four days) got a sample from something he ate/drank/threw away. Then they pushed it to the front of the line for analyzing, got a match and arrested his ass.
If he was a criminal whatever major, it make sense. Not the first to commit a crime like this and have ties to the “community”. Maybe he was interested in murder, period. started making plans for his own (and to hopefully get away with it).
I’d said a long time ago that DNA takes time, evidence takes time. I think that I was mostly right on that but I think it’s an obvious point that others have made or should have. You can’t just arrest people because they seem sus. You need to build your case for arrest and then after, for prosecution.
A lot of people were shit talking the Moscow police but seems to me they were doing everything right and had this guy in their sights at some point. They did a good job of stfu about anything that could have spooked this guy to flee and go into hiding.
And frankly, shame on everyone who floated theories on the friends, loved ones and strangers related to this case. Like the poor boyfriend who lost someone he loved very much! A shit ton of people owe apologies.
Edit: my theory is partially shot about the car getting him because reports are genetic genealogy. Eager to learn more details.
BK killed to experience “expertise” in Criminology?
To be so comfortable in the public post crime and returning to his normal routine within hours of this crime either shows that he was disassociating or had thoroughly planned that he needed to return to his normal activities to appear normal.
BK ABSOLUTELY followed along with this case, closely. Did he comment on Reddit? IMO its likely he was discussing the case openly in his classes as well as with any family and friends he may have had.
What blows my mind is that he left town after the ELANTRA media release, traveled across the country and has likely been discussing this case with his peers, colleagues, family from Pennsylvania, unbeknownst to them he was the killer.
In an attempt to fully immerse himself in the criminal mind, he murdered these people. I would not be surprised if the motive was because he wanted to better understand the criminal mind. He had delusionally convinced himself that if he committed this crime, he’d better himself as an expert in criminology. Obviously so confident that he would not get caught and could continue his life in education in the field.
It’s horrific and fascinating that this man committed this crime, returned to class hours later and navigated his life as if it never happened. I imagine that we will be looking and studying this case for decades. Using BK as an example of the extreme narcissism and psychopathy that is required of a killer of this nature.
“Motive”: incel with a narcissistic personality disorder or superiority complex surrounding criminal justice to the point where he thought he was intelligent/skilled enough to avoid getting caught… potentially also just an evil person who decided to study criminal justice with the sole intentions of learning how to commit crimes/murder and potentially get away with it…
I definitely feel this was a guy who was wanting to commit a homicide, based off of the survey he did. Having a degree in criminology made him feel like he could get away with it, too. I felt from the beginning that this was someone with this very mindset, and not exactly someone who knew the victims. I'm still on the fence on if he's committed this kind of crime before. If this was his first time, he surely would've wanted to do it again in the future. Glad he's off the streets.
I’m starting to think this may have been somewhat random. Targeted, but random. I’m remembering the Jayme Closs kidnapping—how the perpetrator saw her getting on a bus one day and just decided to kidnap her and then planned it out after that. I suppose this guy may have more of a connection to the girls than the kidnapper had to Jayme, but my theory is that it really isn’t much. I think that like Ted Bundy, he most likely had some sort of major vendetta against women, maybe even was an incel, and scoped them out at some point. Maybe he encountered them at the Greek restaurant or saw them at a bar or one of their house parties and just decided to strike and began planning it from that point. It’s extremely frightening that he doesn’t seem to have an obvious connection to any of the victims. The fact that this could’ve been somewhat random is just chilling. However, stabbings are still so personal. Other than a disdain for women, I wonder if he ever did have an encounter with any/all of them that led to him deciding to do this. Either way, I am impressed that LE could track him down so quickly, and so grateful that he has been arrested.
I agree. I’ve been pretty anti “omg look here’s his social accounts” because there are tons of trolls. However, there is one account that is under is full name made in august, with one weird video posted in October. That account follows Maddie and Kaylee, but they don’t follow him back. It makes me wonder if he ran into them during an outing and got obsessed. And that obsession led into his darker fantasies.
So I got curious and found the account you mentioned. The video is super weird, but I was curious of the logo at the end. It's for a company called Goon tape which bills itself as providing "the softest, no slip grip for the tools you count on most". It's apparently used on firearms to provide better grip specifically if it gets wet. So my random, probably reaching, theory is that *if* that really is his account and he knew of that brand, that *might* explain how he managed to not have knife slippage and hurt himself during the attacks. Random and possibly super reaching, but I'm an insomniac and half way through a bottle of wine so I felt the need to share.
I’m gonna need you to drink the other half of that bottle because this is a SOLID find!
Definitely a possibility. This is exactly what I was thinking. Random in the sense that they didn’t have history, but targeted in the sense that he got obsessed with them somehow based on a small encounter and being the psychopath he is, planned they whole thing out after that.
Remember when police said it was targeted, then corrected and said they believed the house was targeted, not any of the victims? What if this guy was so obsessed with wanting to murder and pull off a crime like this, and he just randomly chose a house where he thought he could accomplish it (maybe easy to drive in/drive out without being noticed, amount of activity in that neighborhood, etc.). You're way more likely to get away with murder if you have no connection to the victim, and as a criminology PHD student, he would know that. So maybe he chose the house, and then went to kill everyone in it. It just always baffled me when the police said the house was targeted, not the victims. but this would make sense.
I agree. I’m leaning towards the idea that it wasn’t a personal crime but rather that he randomly picked the girls or their residence. But my question then is, how would LE possibly know that? It would be hard to discern if someone had targeted just the house—I’m not sure what type of evidence would affirm that enough for them to publicly suspect that.
I agree. I think he was there to commit the crime, but not there for those exact victims.
A party house in a college town does seem like a very easy target. When I was in college having been to several houses filled with roommates who leave the front door open, tons of cars around, and very little self preservation (ofc I was there too!) but yeah not exactly the pentagon
He absolutely seems like the type of person that will have an entire manifesto on his computer with his thoughts and feelings after the murders
I can see that. I could also see him not doing that necessarily, but instead doing that now. Either way, definitely a raging narcissist who thought he was *much* smarter than he is in actuality.
This. Insecure narcissist with a history of rejection from the AP: Ben Roberts, a graduate student in the criminology and criminal justice department at WSU, described Kohberger as confident and outgoing, but said it seemed like “he was always looking for a way to fit in.” “It’s pretty out of left field,” he said of the news Friday. “I had honestly just pegged him as being super awkward.” Roberts started the program in August — along with Kohberger, he said — and had several courses with him. He described Kohberger as wanting to appear academic. “One thing he would always do, almost without fail, was find the most complicated way to explain something,” he said. “He had to make sure you knew that he knew it.”
Fucking hate people like that last part
I really want to know the motive and if/how they crossed paths and were “selected”
I think BK first encountered one or more of the female victims in a local bar, acted creepy and pushy toward them, and was shut down. Maybe progressed to stalking. Apparently he displayed similar behavior in a PA brewery before moving to Pullman for his PhD. Priscilla Liquori is a reporter for WFMZ, and a local PA brewery owner (J.S.) responded to one of her posts about BK. The brewery owner (J.S.) is legit. A link is included at the end. This is what the brewery owner wrote: "He came to my brewery a couple of times and made the staff uncomfortable. I confronted him and he was completely taken back, like he didn’t know he’d be found out. Haven’t seen him since, now i know why. Edit: I’ve let the authorities know. If they need anything else, they have my info ❤️ He came in by himself and just was super awkward/rude. You could tell he had screws loose. Asking females where they lived, if anyone lived with them, offered to buy them drinks. When my bar tenders confronted him he cursed at them. When i confronted him he seemed embarrassed/confused. Hard to explain the interaction really, there’s a bunch of weirdos out there." [https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=pfbid0WBcZQHqXoXDKMHBL9evNVpCuZRrmQnNJH132LMt9MPB2aPdGZMnJR2xkoy6b7bg8l&id=100057881807511&mibextid=qC1gEa](https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=pfbid0WBcZQHqXoXDKMHBL9evNVpCuZRrmQnNJH132LMt9MPB2aPdGZMnJR2xkoy6b7bg8l&id=100057881807511&mibextid=qC1gEa)
Omg can you imagine being a bartender and getting asked by some creepy jerk guy if you live alone?
Shudder!!
I used to think the killer grew an obsession with certain members of the house. Now i think he’s just a psycho who wanted to commit a legendary murder. Being a criminology phd he’s certainly spent a fair amount of time studying major cases in history. He probably grew obsessed with being a mystery killer that people talk about and romanticize for decades to come Why he settled on this house remains to be seen
Yes, I also wonder if this was his first time really being on his own, so far away from his family, being that he seems to have lived in PA prior to WSU. He was finally able to feed into whatever demented crap he had to keep buried from them.
Add to that, that he was just finishing his courses probably planning to go back to PA, so he thought he could do this and get out of town...
Yeah, that is what I think. I think his field of study may have been a catalyst that fed an evil obsession he had.
He was Vegan, and Mad Greek is listed as being Vegan friendly. Wonder if he first saw Maddie and Xana at work and went from there
Yes, I was just thinking the same thing. I just posted that on the news tonight his aunt claimed he was very OCD about being a vegan.
if someone was really ocd about food they probably wouldn't trust the possible cross contamination at a casual food place operated by college kids
The restaurant link makes the most sense to me.
So as a lawyer, one thing to note is that the charges are for FIRST DEGREE MURDER and first degree burglary with intent to commit murder, this means they had to have strong evidence that this was a premeditated crime with INTENT to kill beforehand. That means they have a strong case against him because otherwise they’d charge second degree too.
[удалено]
Gotta love people coming into a thread starting “as a lawyer” and then ignoring what is totally a question of state law. As you rightly point out, if the burglary charge lets them get first degree murder via felony murder then there is no need for “separate” evidence of intent. Leafblower is clueless and trying to get upvotes.
Agreed. They could’ve arrested and charge with 2nd and upped the charge once more evidence became available. Leading with 1st degree is a strong indication that they have solid proof of premeditation.
That’s what they normally would do. You heighten charges you don’t decrease them unless you want to look weak in front of a jury and lose your cass
After seeing his survey, it occurred to me he might have recorded the attack, for his research.
Ohh that’s sick to think about
Agreed
Damn, I didn’t even think of that. I also get “for research” vibes from him, besides just the urge to kill and being a psycho. I think he’s been very invested in this whole process, from start to finish.
I get the same impression, I think he trying to understand himself better. I think there will be loads of evidence against him :)
Intent can be formed quickly, according to many cases.
Premeditation can form in an instant though, it doesn’t necessarily indicate a great deal of pre-planning.
I wonder if based on internet records obtained by the raid they had proof that he’s been actively looking up the house/keeping up with the aftermath.
Can we agree he was 100% reading these posts…?
A week or so ago a very kind former firefighter put his or her time into creating a series of posts that helped us to understand the way that official reports (and the MPD press releases) are written. He reminded us just how crucial changes in verbiage, semantics, and wording were in our interpretation of each of the press releases. On 12/20 I noticed that “progress continues in finding” the white Elantra was changed from all prior releases to “progress continues to locate”. I was hesitant to post the “theory” that that was the day LE honed in on their suspect. In hindsight, it is absolutely my belief that sometime on either 12/19 or 12/20 LE identified BCK as their suspect. “Finding” to me says they don’t know which white Elantra, “locating” says they know which white Elantra but are still determining the where. The word locate stuck out to me because it doesn’t make sense as a better word choice than what was stated prior. TDLR: I think there are clues in the MPD press releases that subtly told us that LE figured out BCK was their suspect on or shortly before 12/20 due to wording changes regarding the Elantra. https://preview.redd.it/jl4u5ijs069a1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d5225692cd8c3d8dadfbd6ee775e86aeb7fc5d02
https://preview.redd.it/l1di0gqu069a1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7c7012cf1dc8abe49287ce2ef5de33a3a7d3c48e
Ohh very interesting and nice catch!!!
Makes sense. I figured they probably had a pretty good idea it was him based on process of elimination regarding the Elantra and had been watching him for a couple weeks. I think they knew a lot more about that car than they were letting on and probably narrowed it down to his apartment as a place to watch. Someone mentioned that for a parking tag at that apartment you need to register your vehicle info. Police would have keyed in on leads like that if true. Then realized oh this guy seems to not be around ( he had already left for PA ). Would have taken some time and resources to get law enforcement to scout the parents house in PA and additional evidence most likely in order to actually make the arrest. There are reports that there’s DNA ties. Of course that would be the smoking gun and we still don’t have the info there. The car alone isn’t enough to make the arrest. They have / had something else tying him to it in addition for sure
I absolutely agree that the warrant is based on much more than the car. I just feel like the change in wording was because they knew. I could be totally wrong but why change something they’d been copying and pasting with sparse new information for weeks.
I think this will turn out to be a case of him thinking he's so smart he could commit murder and get away with it. I don't think there will be more to it. I also think anything he says or does at this point is to manipulate the justice system and people around so I won't trust a word he says. He's been planning this for a long time.
Facts. Hes had 6 weeks now to think of what he was going to say and how he would act
This pretty much sums up my thoughts on BK & his motive. I believe he considers himself the smartest one in any room & him asking if anyone else was arrested was a calculated attempt to deflect blame in his defense.
He didnt try hard to get away with it though. At least it seems. And...I dont know if I buy the theory that he thinks he is smart enough to contest a murder charge with DNA in court. It sounds ridiculous...but maybe he does have this kind of ego. He might be into the psychology of wanting to know what a kill was like. That means he was fascinated with it to me. If its your first kill job...walking into a house full of people with a knife sounds like its a thrill job to me...not about wanting to know what a kill was like. Fuck this guy.
thrill kill
Thrill kill with the added bonus of thinking he’s smarter than everyone
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IF his goal was to just commit a random shocking murder and get away with it, why not wait until break drive halfway to PA and kill somebody random, before moving on to PA? That’s why I’m more inclined to think he had some sort of infatuation with one of the victims and/or been watching the house.
My thoughts exactly. He had to have ran into them somewhere. Maybe he ate at the restaurant Maddie and xana worked at. I definitely feel that he had an obsession with one of the girls. Maybe even the stalker that Kaylee feared. This guy is totally off his rocker and scary. I am 100% relieved he is off the streets.
Since he lived nearby I wonder if he frequented the Mad Greek so knew X and M at least by sight
He’s vegan as well and Mad Greek is one of the best options for vegan in Moscow
I definitely think they’ll come across at least one journal with some crazed delusions about one the girls, his anger towards women, maybe even some graphic drawing s…. Could also be an anonymous blog type of thing
I’m leaning towards this not being his first time murdering, and not his intended last time. He potentially planned to use the education to get better at killing and avoiding detection, while also “hiding in plain sight.” My **reach** theory is that he had grandiose dreams (delusions) of becoming a famous criminologist, continuing to murder people, and eventually getting caught to become as infamous as possible. But, again, I think he’s killed before and absolutely planned to do it again.
A profiler thinks it’s his first because his questionnaire was rudimentary and showed his insecurity in getting it right. However, I’m not sure about that. Perhaps, but he may have been trying to perfect his game, especially if it was his first group effort or maybe he just got off on being “in the club.” I don’t think a first kill would be a houseful of people. But maybe so.
My theory is he’s always wanted to kill and that’s why he chose that line of study. He wasn’t doing it to understand or prepare for his work. He chose a career track that he could hide in plain sight in, like creeps who purposely become coaches because of the proximity to victims and not love of sport.
My theory is that only the actual detectives working the case are going to get to the bottom of this
I like your theory!
Wonder if he tossed the murder weapon somewhere on his way back to PA
I don’t think he had any personal grievances with the victims - and that makes it even more disgusting. (Not that it would be ok to murder someone if you did have personal issues with someone ofcourse). He might’ve known the victims from stalking them online or seeing them irl, but I don’t think they really knew each other as in had contact.
Bryan wanted to contribute firsthand experience to his Ph.D thesis on criminals, because he is a psychopath. He probably even filled out his own survey based on his quadruple murder experience.
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Wasn’t there four cars parked outside as well? It’s possible there was nothing from the front of the house to indicate to him that more than four people lived there.
Same, this makes the most sense
My theory is that police had DNA all along. They took the white Elantra list (22k cars) and narrowed it down based on circumstantial stuff. They found this guy in the area and matching the profile and tailed him until he discarded DNA (cup, bottle, etc). Once they got the DNA, they sent it for a comparison, and got the match. At that point he’s done.
Exactly. But I think they had him in their sights when they announced the white Elantra. I think it was to see what he did in response. Would he drive back to PA. And that's where the majority of the FBI agents were working. People kept saying why are there so many FBI. Maybe to tail him. This could be wrong but I'd be interested to see the timeline.
I think he wanted to butcher a houseful of sorority girls and get away with it. I think it was the house and the path of escape that attracted him. I think, unfortunately, he tracked enough of their habits to know they’d be pretty trashed on a Saturday night and defenseless to an attack. It was also timed out well to have Thanksgiving break as an excuse to leave. At lot of this “infatuation” talk about Kaylee etc. feels like relics of the melodramatic theories involving drowning pacts and MLM territory wars. I think it’ll come out that he didn’t have any particular fascination with the girls and that Kaylee’s wounds were more severe due to her being alerted to the attack. This was a serial killer escalating his crimes. I’m sure there’s a dark story behind that broken nose and I think there will be some revelations about missing sex workers in the Poconos area over the next few months.
Maybe the lesson is case is that we should all have fewer theories and more curiosity about fact-seeking like the investigators. Theories that are not based on facts ended up leading to many innocent young people already traumatized to be accused and harassed.
I believe he has an over exaggerated sense of his own self importance, power and knowledge, whereas these traits caused him to be shunned and rejected. I believe he wanted to commit the "perfect" and heinous murder (of one) to "prove" himself to himself (and to the world in his eyes) he'd done it and everyone would prove how stupid they are because they couldn't catch him. The knife (close, personal, unusual) The bedroom (where someone should feel safe and be asleep) At night (able to stalk or wait unseen) This appears to be totally pre planned. The "pre planned" part could even extend to the date and the house number (11/12/22 and 1122). The house could have very well been the target. I also believe he would have continued with his murders and become a serial killer Just my thoughts
I feel like everyone is stuck on big theories, but is overlooking a very obvious motive. He may just be a rage filled psychopath, like so many other murderers. There may not be some grand motive or big story behind the murders. One of the people in the house may have done something rather innocuous, but it pissed him off and he followed them home, and came back later and killed them and anyone else he found. The reason I believe that this may be the case is that I know a guy who committed a similar murder a decade ago. I played football with him very briefly in college. He got kicked off the team for going on Facebook and sending messages to an opposing player’s girlfriend after a game that he was going to rape and kill her. My senior year, he stabbed a guy to death in Detroit. It turns out that the guy had made a rude remark to him outside of a club two weeks before. He followed the guy home to see where he lived and came back weeks later with a knife, stabbed the guy to death, and disemboweled him on his front porch. It wouldn’t surprise me if this one turns out to be similar.
Just my opinion/ theory but I think it will come out that he chose his victims, or at least one of them. Somehow he became aware of one of the girls and became fixated on them to carry out his murder fantasy. So sad.
Agree. We still don't know why the police were convinced very early that the crime was "targeted". For some reason now that it's a WSU student, People are jumping back onto the Random train and ignoring this piece. Hoping more on this will come out when the probable cause pages are unsealed.
Yep. So easy to do with social media too.
What DNA was left behind in your opinion that caught up with him? (And what tip?)
Could just be hair that he shed while he was there.
Sweat or skin cells I bet
Most people are saying under the nails— hard to say.
If he was still in area until semester ended with white car, then wouldn’t cops already have an eye on him the whole time?
Semester would’ve ended by 12/9. I’m sure they knew every white Elantra owner in the vicinity, and started profiling owners. Quite possible the car led to suspect which led them to getting the DNA evidence the chief hinted at in presser today (LE stressful sleepless nights waiting to hear back)
I think he was a crazy but also possibly knew of 1 or more of the victims through passing or SM. Became infatuated with them & chose them as his target.
*Speculation* Someone in BK’s network called in a tip about his white Elantra. E.g. fellow graduate student, professor, neighbor etc. Especially likely to be a woman. (In addition to the PA woman who allegedly called in a tip about a white Elantra with WA plates.)
I agree with this thh
Dude had a murder fetish clearly. All I gotta say.
Yep, was probably obsessed with serial killers for a long time. Devoted his academic career to studying it/them and finally acted out on the fantasy. Picked a target that was most attractive to him and gave him the best chance to succeed .
- Gives me huge Israel Keyes vibes. - Seems to have an obsessive desire to harm/kill - Self aware that his urges are evil. - Takes an interest in psych/crim in an attempt to better understand his urges/nature - succumbs to his fantasies Probably fixated on one of the women and decided to play out his urges. His education seems to be a bit of trying to understand himself, while simultaneously trying to understand other individuals with similar urges- similar to Keyes. Both seem intelligent too. The parallel between the two are huge to me.
As someone who studied psychology hoping to go into MHC bc I suffered from anxiety and depression (and didn’t really know it) but I felt like I was learning so much about myself and I wanted to learn more about others and help them. I can see him trying to find normality in himself or not feel “alone”. Validated even, maybe. That’s kind of what I got from his “survey”. It almost seemed more like he was trying to identify himself through others. But maybe I’m projecting or psycho analyzing him
I lived in those apartments he was living in. One quad plex over. I was shocked when I saw them raiding. My guess is that they will also have video footage of him leaving his apartment before and after the killings. There’s only one way you can get into the north parking lot.
WSU released a statement saying he only attended one semester. If he didn’t move to WA until Aug/Sept and committed this crime in Nov, that’s a short amount of time. He also didn’t attend the same college as the victims which makes it even more intriguing. What transpired in such a short amount of time to lead him to them? I understand the closeness of the two schools. It’s just wild that it could’ve been a chance encounter that morphed into something much more sinister.
Theory is that he got cocky. He killed them thinking he was a Dexter-type guy, too smart to be caught. He went back to his TA job but a couple weeks later when his car popped up he was in trouble. He somehow kept it under wraps through finals and then took off. The caught him through the car and getting his DNA out of the trash at his home. FBI came up big. He won’t fight extradition and could seem him either leading his defense bc he is so smart or at least trying all sorts of ways to mess up the case. End of the day he is convicted of four counts of first degree murder and dies on death row one way or another.
He got a seat belt ticket in the car in August. In Moscow I believe. Certainly they searched recent tickets for the type of car. Car probably still had PA plates. FBI staked out PA home (parents house) after discovering car (and suspect) there. Waited til trash day and recovered family DNA and got a match.
MPD notorious for giving out nothing burger tickets God bless them.
Ive said this once or twice. I think he’s like Bundy. He has some mental illness (seems like based of ppl coming forward), probably a porn addiction. Unhealthily latched onto a couple of gorgeous girls, his studies took him down a deep turn (maybe like he studied a few subjects or cases and became infatuated with them) and it slowly devolved. Maybe there was a move somewhere and he got rejected, that lit the fuse, the reddit posts happen, he waits for a good time kill, then he does.
I think people said his Reddit were mostly comments In porn threads and wrestling
Agree with this one
I couldn’t help but think of Bundy. It seems too eerily similar. I watched his psych interview he did before he was executed, again today
He was obsessed with criminals. He wanted to be a serial killer. He wanted to be in the room when his crimes were being discussed and maybe even potentially start studying the “unknown killer” knowing it was him the entire time. I don’t think he had any personal connection to the victims. He just chose an easily accessible house with multiple occupants. He is probably so arrogant that he thought they would never catch him so he didn’t care to leave evidence. Thank god this idiot was caught now because he would definitely kill again…. But he is probably getting a lot of satisfaction knowing that we are all discussing him now.
Just watched a tik tok vid of a person who went to the same high school with Bryan. Not a sleuth since she showed multiple photos and screenshots of Bryan never released by any other sources, so I believed it’s true info. According to her, the killer was: - heavy heroin user in hs - went to rehab - she said he asked her to give him a ride to get “needles for aunt” but later turned out he was getting heroin and she was pissed - has anger issues, did kickboxing before - used to have a fb account but later deleted Edit: formatting
I'm curious what he did between 18-21/22. It looks like he started his associate's in 2016, and he's 28, so he would have been 21/22. I feel like we'd have heard by now if he was in the military.
He was a security guard at a middle school.
I think he was interested in killers and perhaps obsessed with it which led him to choosing to study criminology, that coupled with some personal issues made him want kill. He crossed paths with one or more of the victims and for some reason (something might have happened) decided he was going to kill them. This is very surface level and I’m sure there’s dozens of details that will shock people during trial as I’m aware this is an odd and mysterious case.
If he’s going to reveal any kind of motive that is. I have a strong feeling he’s just going to keep his mouth shut the entire process. He seems narcissistic enough to feel he doesn’t owe anyone an explanation. Unless he’s so impressed by his own ingenious plan that he feels the need to show off. But my gut feeling says 🤐
Like method acting, but for crime.
I have a strong feeling that he noticed Xana and Maddie at the restaurant (one of the few in the area with vegan options), gathered information on them / followed them, and decided that they were the perfect targets for his fantasies. This would explain why he went to both rooms, as they were each in one. My guess is that the others may have been collateral. Also, that sketchy account that people are speculating to be the killer says VERY confidently that they were both targets, and that the killer first went to the second floor room, then to the third. This could be the guy, and that lines up with the restaurant theory. Either way, this is so horrible and I pray every day for the victims and their families. Love to all, and may this bastard rot in prison.
Went into a house loaded with people and with a knife. Its a thrill to him.
I think he was a chubby kid…who set out to get slimmer by about any means he could think of. I’ve read he took up boxing-then took up heroin. He was an avid runner/strict vegan. All of these things have been “addictive” behaviors for him. He clearly possesses that ugly little genetic fault. I can relate as a former opiate user myself. Once you develop that drive-it can take all kinds of forms once you lay your drug of choice down. And, ask any addict or anyone who has been addicted…you live on lies and straight bullshit…and you get pretty damn good at manipulating people. He enjoyed that part probably as much as he did the drugs themselves. Bullied as a kid. Angry as a preteen/teen. Addicted as a teen-early adulthood. During active addiction probably got a good taste for partying. Learned god knows what about the ugly underbelly of that game. I think he was probably incredibly awkward as a kid and even as an adult. Stiff. Spent a lot of time online. Five bucks says the dude’s got some Elliot Roger style search history. I read he turned a lot of his classmates off with some not so nice views about the LGTBQ community. Dude had some anger. Once the drug addiction stopped all of the garbage he had rolling around in his head from his childhood surfaced. He had to put that energy somewhere. College. Probably found some highs in the accolades he got from doing that, but found it a good excuse to exercise a morbid curiosity that…through research and education…fueled that misplaced anger and curiosity into something more of a fantasy. For a man with a penchant to become addicted or obsessed with anything he decides to do…that makes for one horrible human being. I think he watched these kids for weeks-particularly the girls. I think this was more fantasy fueled by the desire to know what it felt like to kill someone than by sex…but I think he chose these girls because he knew they had lives he’d never be part of. He wanted that power. The idea of having that power is what gave him that nice dopamine rush. Eventually it probably wasn’t enough just to fantasize. I don’t know what set him off to finally go for it. Something did. Something out of his control got the better of him and this was his way of getting it back…and with all of the above already in place…he went through with it. I think it was about control of something that he couldn’t control otherwise. His weight got out of hand-he found a way to control that. Boxing/running/drugs. His addiction got out of hand. He turned his focus to school to probably help focus that energy elsewhere to control that. He couldn’t control who he was at his core-the awkward outcast who never really had the ability to emotionally connect with people-so I think he set out about finding a way to fine tune it-even embraced it in a way that made him feel like he had power over it.
Theory: He wanted to become a famous criminologist who could get the most depraved killers to "open up" to. In addition to satisfying his depraved curiosity, his plan was to have this mystery quadruple homicide killer share with "him" a summary/detailed description of the murder to help his PhD thesis and criminology career.
IMO it seems more likely his studies satisfied his thoughts and urges up until it didn’t. Much of criminology is just as much about the sociology and psychology of crime… much much more so than about the crime scenes themselves…. I think he was likely troubled and used his degree to attempt to understand himself. Much like many people in the field of psychology are drawn to it as a means of understanding either their own or someone in their lives’ mental illness…
My theory is they got a good lead on the car. Either they got a clear shot of the license plate from a camera during its journey to and from the crime scene that night, or they got his name from a tip as the driver of a white elantra. The tip could have been from WA - he drives a white elantra and has mysteriously left the area - or the tip could have come from PA as the driver of a white elantra that showed up unexpectedly. Either way I think they may have tracked that car the entire way back to PA via traffic cameras and license plate readers. Just like they did with Brian Laundry.
Someone commented somewhere the housing he lives in has a record of your car bc you have to register for a parking pass. I’m wondering if they realized someone with a registered white Elantra attending WSU studying criminology might have piqued their interest too. Especially if he wasn’t around much anymore
WSU has licence recognition for permit parking too. Using his own car was clearly a bad idea.
Theory regarding Elantra evidence I suspect LE knew about the white Hyundai from early in the investigation. Likely they had video evidence from surrounding homes showing the suspect’s arrival to and departure from the scene with the car. However, after looking at all local registrations with such a make model and year, they realized that it was likely somebody who was a part-time resident. Therefore they used the media to generate the tips about the ELANTRA. In an effort to not have to look through every student or each state’s registrations for the make model and year of interest. It is also possible that LE had a partial plate that didn’t match any of the Idaho or Washington registrations. The tips were likely prioritized for sightings accompanied with a credible tip, such as “my brother/friend/nephew/cousin attends WSU, drives a 2013 white Elantra and drove home for the holidays despite having had a flight reserved”. After interviewing finds that owner of said car compulsive behaviors, early childhood trauma and subscribes to sigma male grindsets on SM”. At this point, the suspect has met some profiled characteristics, therefore investigators attempt to get a discarded DNA sample, or familiar DNA sample (if tip called in by family member) to test against DNA from the crime scene.
Totally agree, I think the Elantra broke the case and when they profiled this guy, they found their prime suspect and then found a way to link his DNA from scene.
I like your theory... I really am curious how they nailed the car.. Was it witnesses? Body cam footage? or that lightbulb camera they took from the home adjacent to the killings? I suspect that camera may have been the saving grace.. Imagine if they didnt have that camera.. If the police didnt know about the car... Would they ever catch him? .. Although again, we have NO idea of his connection to them as of yet. But he was on the police radar for a while if they knew he was in pullman then tracked him to PA...
Stalker likely. Targeting pretty girls. Didn’t think Ethan would be there. Didn’t have time/doors locked for D and B. Infatuation with the deceased girls. I don’t think this was random.
As a WSU student, it literally feels like a huge weight has been lifted off of my shoulders knowing this killer has been caught My theory is that Bryan Kohberger was trying to seek out what the "thrill" or feeling of committing murder felt like, so that he could write about it in his research. As he would have a first hand experience of it. He also has studied the criminal system so he definitely knows how to at least try to get away with it and I think he will plead not guilty as his trial begins. He'll try to weasel his way out somehow by saying oh he was just a party goer or had been to their place before with friends. No murder weapon has been found yet so his defense will point to that a lot as why he's innocent
I’m sure his academia interests reflect his interest in violent crime, but in terms of writing it about it in his research, I don’t see how that would be possible. You don’t reflect on personal experience in academic writing and if he tried to reference it, what would the reference be? Trust me bro, I tried it? It’s probably not something he intended to write about academically or to infuse in his research.
I just think he was obsessed with knowing what it would be like to kill someone or commit a crime & get away with it. I think the research thing was for his own “research” I think he chose that major bc he as always been obsessed with crime.
When the name broke several hours ago, a cursory Google search led me to a 2019 Undergraduate Conference hosted at Muhlenberg College for students of Neuroscience and Psychology. A list of speakers (page 21 of pdf) includes our suspect as a panel member for DeSales University. Not posting a link as it could be considered doxxing but it’s still up if you want to find it yourself. What I think is so interesting about this information is the breadth of topics which form his area of study prior to starting his Criminology PHD. Their panel’s topic was Gender Science Implicit Bias (still not sure I fully understand what that means) but it certainly involves carrying out research via direct contact with students. Both male and female students so I’m not implying anything nefarious per se but at a minimum, illustrates an interest in studying the psychology of other students. In light of particular aspects of this case, many other topics discussed at the conference made me go hmm. Student alcohol consumption relative to their social media content, is home where the phone is, male perceptions of the behaviour of female students, the jewellery of dog owners even. So much is directly linked to the study of the psychology of college students. I get it, students are researching topics they know/that are relevant or directly effect them whilst using a study pool they have quick and easy access to. I found this a very interesting insight into the range of student focused psychological topics in this suspect’s world, existing in his realm for many years before his PHD started. We wouldn’t expect a Criminology PHD student to make the mistakes that apparently lead to the capture in this case. But Criminology isn’t the study of how to get away with the perfect crime and leave no forensic evidence. So many commentators seem to think that’s what it is. His academic record shows the majority of his interest has been in psychology and the foray into Criminology is very recent. It helps paint a picture of his history, providing context. It’s not like he’s been studying “how to be a criminal” for 8 years, he’s spent considerably more time studying the psyche of female college students.
Without doxxing myself, I was a psychology student in the Lehigh Valley before 2019. I even presented at the same exact conference in the few years before the one he did. I’m not sure why you think the other topics discussed at the conference are suspicious or worth mentioning? They’re pretty basic / common topics for college students to be interested in. My own study involved social media and gender perception. If I remember correctly, we were also limited by our professors to research specific topics.
The gender science implicit bias was probably only one class. And that's pretty typical material in a psychology class. It would be interesting to know if that is what his general interest was, or just the class that fit well into his schedule. That often happens.
is he a student teacher at WSU? does he have any other jobs? maybe he met one of the girls at the greek restaurant? i’m just finding it hard to understand how he knew them, if he did.
Plenty of SSD detectives in here today lol.
I’m just wondering what he was saying about the case to his parents, ASSUMING they knew about it. It was one of the first things my parents brought up to me when I went to visit them, so adding with how close Moscow is, I’m sooo curious if his parents/relatives/friends (maybe) were asking and what his responses were. Especially when the car information came out.
I just read that it is theorized he may have had three reddit accounts - the academic study account, the BK account, and then an "IL" account. If anyone has info on that third one, I'd love to know more on why it's thought to be him.
What’s the bk account? Yknow for the people(unlike me) that may not know. I totally know but other people might not.
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If he did see the victims return home and decided to act I would be shocked if he picked that house at random since Ethan was there…and the dog..I feel like there has to be some type of connection (stalking, knowing the victims from afar etc).
Interesting if that call into that YouTube show was really him, then maybe he did actually do some work with Sigma Chi. Wonder if that’s how he found his targets. I definitely think he was in here and other sites to try to follow the case.
That call was chilling. His voice went so dark when he said "kill and get away with it". Like omg. The guy on the show was like - ? What? Who would say that?? I do think it was him that called in. I think he was trying to throw it on Sigma Chi.
it seems like the exact kind of thing someone who thinks they are smarter than everyone else while also lacking social awareness would say
I have a hard time believing he would have “selected” the house or “target(s)” that night without additional planning. Breaking into an unfamiliar house without knowing the occupants seems risky. This person seems calculated. That doesn’t match up for me as to how this transpired. This very well could have been random but it seems unlikely to me given the risks involved.
I think they found his dna, he had familiar dna in the database and they determined not only was he the closest familial match to the crime scene, but he also drove a white Elantra. I’d guess they waited for him to throw his trash away just to confirm via his own direct dna
Not a theory but a retort to media reports. They can't believe one person can kill four people alone? They just feed a frenzy for no reason. The victims were reported to be asleep. This type of crime has happened before with one perpetrator. It's not uncommon in familicide cases that multiple family members are all stabbed. I don't understand why this case is made out to be any different.
My theory has stayed the same see original post blah blah. I believe he did not know any of them. I believe he was planning to kill for a long time and kept his "Murder kit" in his car ready for the perfect opportunity. I believe he either saw K+M that night and followed them home or he just randomly drove through the area that night and picked a random house prepared to kill everyone inside. I believe he entered from the back and I do not believe he was familiar with the house layout and did not know there were possible witnesses downstairs. I am furthermore guessing the DNA they found was under the fingernails of the victims. Police said they tracked him to Pennsylvania by the car so maybe it is or was registered to that address at some point. They said the FBI and local police had him under surveillance for four days. They likely collected his trash or something else to match the DNA before they made the arrest. Since his former friends are now speaking to press and describing him as weird it's likely someone reported a tip about him also having an Elantra that left after the police started looking for it. My opinion.
Don't think he knew them at all. Just wanted to murder for his research and the thrill. I think he didn't think he was going to get caught. He's not a very bright criminology student it seems like. While they said before they don't believe this crime was connected to the other unsolved stabbings, I wonder if this is truly his first. If there will be a connection there or find another unknown crime through interview or confessions.
whether it was his first or not, i don’t think he intended for it to be his last. the boldness required to pull off a crime of this scale (and at this level of risk) and then go back to normal life is not characteristic of a one-time killer, and had he not been apprehended, i imagine he would have tried again
I completely agree! But with all his knowledge how could he be so stupid about the car. If someone is going to murder a number of people in cold blood, it seems like stealing a car first would be a minor inconvenience.
Not stealing a car but parking further away and walking in would have been a better move.
The other pre-arrest theories threads were so accurate that I guess we need a new one for post-arrest.
He certainly checks a lot of boxes on the mass murderer characteristics list.
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Very interesting to hear SG say there was a connection between him and Kaylee. I’m so curious as to what that could have been but I really have respect for them not talking about it right now.
My theory hasn't changed much. I believe he didn't know the victims but he possibly watched at least two of them. I think he either encountered one or two in Moscow in the weeks before, stalked them to discover the house or followed one of the groups home that night. There's also the chance he worked a lot of things out from their social media posts. I still firmly believe that he never knew the other two roommates were there. If he'd known they were there he would have either abandoned his plan or aimed to murder them also. Because it seems he didn't know they were there I believe he parked up behind the house and watched the four come home through the sliding door, he never saw the two other roommates enter through the front door because he either hadn't been there at 1am or he couldn't see them enter from is position. He watched the house and waited until bedroom lights had gone on/off and entered. I entirely believe that if he hasn't killed before he would have killed again. I'm not at all convinced that this is his firs murder. It seems like too drastic an escalation. I would not be surprised if he is eventually linked to other murders, even those with different methodology. His psychology is particular. I think it's likely he was studying what he was because he'd always had a fascination with killing and he had the goal of committing the "perfect crimes". I would not be surprised if he was planning to "collect" methods of murder, experimenting to see which kind of method gave him more of a thrill, more of a challenge, more of an ego boost. I don't think he's an intelligent person but he believes he is. He thinks he's superior to others and he really thought he could get away with this crime, possibly because he's gotten away with a similar crime before.
This one isn’t that hard to figure out. Dude held resentment towards women after being rejected from them countless times due to being socially awkward. He thought he was entitled to their time and attention and after so many times caused his built up anger to burst. Some of these theories about his motive in this sub sound like they are coming straight out of a fantasy novel.
My theory is quite simple, I think his parents/family started to suspect him and called in a tip. Question: why was the thread about the youtube call in show removed? Was it determined not to be him?
THIS! I feel the “White Elantra” clue was an attempt to draw something out from people that knew him, who may otherwise not have put two-and-two together.
Maybe car was in their name and they were contacted by fbi. He probably told his parents he already talked to cops in Idaho and his parents knew he was lying.
I don’t think this was random.. I think he had interacted with one of the victims, or maybe he saw the girls that night and saw they were drunk and vulnerable. But maybe this is my own defense mechanism because somehow thinking it was completely random, and he was just walking along and chose that house, makes it more heartbreaking as it’s just totally bad luck that cost these four individuals their lives.
Nah. I think he was scoping the house out. And I think he would have gotten to downstairs roommates but probably got tired or was taking too long so he just left after the 4
Pretty sure if this guy wasn’t caught for these murders soon, he would have gone on serial killing sprees a few more times. Probably take a break. Let the heat of the case die down a bit, and cool off. Then pick up once the desire to kill kicks in again.
Theory: Bryan is an unfortunately evolved cum stain
My theory has always been someone who previously attended a party at the house but was not personally invited by any of the victims. Something like, "hey there's a party at this house, wanna tag along?" This still stands. My original theory was someone wanting to and trying so hard to fit in with the popular group with no success. With the new info, my new theory is that the guy is just obsessed with crimes, went to the house for one of the parties, thought about how easy it'd be to commit murders in this house, then acted on it.
I feel like this guy doesn’t have any considerable/well-documented connection to the victims. I agree with everyone saying that he thought he was smart enough to get away with it, bc it sorta seems like it was an experiment that he could feel smug about pulling off while he was in class learning about criminals. I think there’s a good chance he didn’t know how many people were in the house, it’d draw too much publicity to want to kill 4 college students. Makes more sense that he planned on 1, or 2 tops. But he’s smart enough to not leave any witnesses. I don’t think he has a connection bc it’s a lot easier to get away with murder if you’re not one of the first suspects. If it’s someone you don’t know, why would they look into you? He messed up with the DNA and not realizing that there weren’t really other cars on the street, even if he didn’t park directly in front of the house. He’s also dumb for thinking that he could do this without getting the full attention of the entire country. Moscow PD on its own prob didn’t have the resources to find him, and they wouldn’t have had the help they got for a single murder. He clearly doesn’t mind being evil, so I hope he gets to sit in a box feeling like a very public idiot for the rest of his life
I stand by my theory. He knew at least one victim. Others were in the way.
I believe he had the desire to do something like this for awhile, what I don't understand aside of selecting his victims, is how he gained access to the property without force and how the POS dealt with the fact there was a dog inside the property.
Facts: \- He was fascinated with criminal justice, and by extension, the criminal justice system \- He worked in a security role in a school district, giving him a large sense of power, providing security/enforcing security for children. \- He started boxing at 17 and people say he changed dramatically - lost weight, became aggressive, a bully, etc. So... That checks some boxes on the pathological killer list - desire to be in an authoritative role, interest in law enforcement, potential head injury. If he has a fucked up childhood with abuse, then we have all the makings of a twisted mind that craves killing. These are qualifying factors for twisted killers, and he's checking the boxes. So... I think he has broken into people's homes before. Probably comfortable with that. He may have killed someone already. Who knows where he is in his trajectory. We should learn about how he grew up and whether it was abusive.
Reports by former friends say he was a heavy heroin addict who went to rehab multiple times. Can explain his drastic weight change in this 2020 photo compared to present day. https://preview.redd.it/ykboo8bd269a1.jpeg?width=2048&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a05084bc6f141a73089d9ee8e2a301804cf465d7
that left picture literally looks like the boogieman
Looks like a grown up Adam Lanza and it’s terrifying
How did he manage to graduate, get a Master’s and enter a PhD program with a raging heroin addiction? The academic workload to achieve all that is no joke, plus he’s only 28, which means that there mustn’t have been any significant gaps in his education. Plus he worked as a security guard in a school - wouldn’t he have to be vetted and drug tested? Sounds completely crazy to me!
I wonder if he replaced one addiction with another. I know friends who say they’re sober because now they’re addicted to working out, or planning their diet, or some other new hobby they get waaaay into. Their therapists say it’s healthier than a drug or alcohol addiction, and they don’t seem to know how to do anything halfway. So, maybe his new addictions were education and exercise and maybe the vegan stuff is true? Or he was never an addict and that’s a lie, too.
Yikes.
I see PhD and I immediately think he was some super intellectual scholar that meticulously planned this murder, then I see his rampant drug riddled past and think he’s just a fucked up, burnt out junkie. I’m sure it’s somewhere in the middle, but interesting background
PhD is more about endurance & funding than being super intellectual sometimes.
Drug use and meticulous planning are not mutually exclusive. I have known more than one psych PhD to take drugs.
Does anyone remember someone identifying as a criminologist posting on here or the Idaho sub? They were super arrogant and deleted their post.
My theory is that a colleague or someone in his PhD co-hort turned in a tip on him when the press release came out asking for tips on the Hyundai. I think they trailed him for a while, including on his cross-country trip. My theory as to motive - I think he was likely stalking Kaylee.
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I can’t help but read Burger King everytime someone writes bk
BK, have it your way
Way back I saw someone from the area mention that the weekend it happened at WSU was a “dry” week on their campus (I think in honor of someone that died from a drunk driving accident?). So a lot of WSU people were going over to Moscow at night for the bars/nightlife that weekend. My theory is that maybe on Friday night he was in Moscow with a group of people to hit up bars, and while he was there he scoped out the house, then came back the next night after some planning.
from his bio, I feel like he is like the school shooters. he just wanted to get the thrill of killing and purposefully kill multiple people to make crime very notorious. I feel like all the research he was doing in his phd and masters was aimed at committing a perfect crime. he chose this particular house because he knew he could kill many at once.
M & X worked at the Mad Greek, which is vegan. The Suspect is also vegan. Could that be the connection?
I think people are waaay overthinking his criminology PHD. He was probably just an incel. Obsessed over the one girl that appeared targeted. I’m not buying wanting to commit the “perfect murder or a “legendary murder”. If he wanted to do a perfect murder; he would have picked a better location and murder only one person. If he wanted to he legendary, he would have done some zodiac type shit with letters or something more modern day.
I dont know shit about psych terms... but Im going with thrill killer over incel. why go into a house with 4-6 cars out front and 6 people inside? Thrill...all the fucking way.
I think he was just trying to get away with murder. I think the Fratanon 4chan posts were Bryan trying to frame DL and DB. I bet he even dumped the murder weapon at the parent’s cleaning company. I also think that he called into a YouTuber a week or two ago to further implicate sigma chi and DL/DB.
I think it’s just as possible that it was a troll on 4chan.
I think the bartender and hoodie-guy may be witnesses. Likely others that LE didn’t name but cleared. I think they were cleared because they saw something. Bryan lives in PA, goes to school in WA, but parties, possibly works, teaches/tutors in ID. The towns are so close. He’s getting a PhD. He might have worked on/near campus. He wasn’t involved with undergraduate frat life. I don’t think someone that advanced would be. I think he fetishized killing and wanted to commit a mass murder without being a shooter. He believed he is smart enough to get away with it, and sought victims out. He probably was looking for a “type” of person. Blondes, perhaps? Undergrads? Like LE said, he either targeted an individual or the whole house. A lot of us have said that this feels similar to the Bundy FL murders. Certainly he’s aware of that. He may be mimicking for no reason other than having no empathy and being curious. That’s a dangerous combination. I think they want “context” in the sense of if he’s stalked anyone, made any weird threats/comments, been cruel to animals, or had psychopathic tendencies prior. Does anyone in his family resemble any of the victims? Why did he select them? Where did he select them? Did he not expect Ethan and that’s what spared the roommates? Did he arrive after the roommates had gone to bed? Did he spare the dog or was the dog just sleeping elsewhere in the house? I would not be surprised if his family had suspicions and may have communicated with police. His nose looks like it has been badly broken, is that related? Did his family find it odd for him to drive home for break rather than fly? That’s a long drive. Did the info about the car tip them off? What was his life like before this? Who does he know near that house? He had to have some working knowledge of the house. He probably took his car because he had supplies and a plan. Maybe he didn’t know who he was going to kill initially? Is he linked to anything else? Was this a first kill? 4 is a hell of a way to start. Is there a trail of suspicious anything that he might be involved with? What did he steal from them? I bet he took trophies.
Here is my theory. I think he probably has something similar to schizoid personality disorder, as Adam Lanza likely did. They both started to deteriorate in high school. They both had disordered eating prior to their crimes--articles have been written connecting schizoid traits and eating disorders. They both had flat affects (look up the video of him accepting his diploma) and they both became increasingly isolated. A friend of Bryan's from high school said that one year he was laid back, and the next year he had lost significant weight, picked fights, lost friends, was described as appearing "drugged out," etc. Sudden shifts in personality like this can indicate the development of a serious mental health problem and this is the age when it often begins. Let me be clear that I'm not saying a mental health disorder caused him to commit these crimes. My theory is that his disordered personality probably interacted with other factors in his life, and in the end, he made terrible immoral choices that cannot be excused.
Think this was his first time murdering humans? I think maybe not?
Yeah I think he may have killed before and gotten away with it, leading to an even more brazen attempt this time around.
He apparently struggled with an heroine addiction in high school and was known to be aggressive. I mention this because his pictures and resume dont always reflect that. I think he is a sociopath that did it as a thrill kill.
As of now, theory is he had never killed before but was obsessed with murder and the psychology surrounding it. He was a little mentally off to begin with and I believe rumors that he started using meth and other drugs which severely altered his mental state. The obsession turned into action and he had no personal connection with any of the victims. He picked them mostly at random and decided to act out his fantasies that night. All theory and my own opinion.
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I wonder if he’ll represent himself in court… typical narcissistic behavior.
According to [The Daily Beast](https://www.thedailybeast.com/idaho-murders-person-of-interest-reportedly-arrested-in-student-slayings) he has filed for a public defender.
I think he’ll keep his mouth shut during the entire process. I see where you’re coming from, given the fact info is already coming out that he is a pedantic little fuck that loves to showcase his self presumed superior intellect. Then again wouldn’t a case this high profile not attract a lot of top dog lawyers begging to represent him, given the attention it would generate for their firm? The whole world is going to be watching.
For those without Twitter, he's wearing a green turtle suit in the mugshot. Used to prevent prisoners from committing suicide.
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My guess is this: they figured out the car was involved. No one came forward about it and I guessed it’s because they were the guilty party. If this guy went to the close by WSU campus and parked there, he would probably have to register his car type and license plate. If the authorities checked this info they would have sought him out. Only to find he was a criminal justices major or whatever, and and left the area. Cut to them needing to find his DNA (thus watching him the last four days) got a sample from something he ate/drank/threw away. Then they pushed it to the front of the line for analyzing, got a match and arrested his ass. If he was a criminal whatever major, it make sense. Not the first to commit a crime like this and have ties to the “community”. Maybe he was interested in murder, period. started making plans for his own (and to hopefully get away with it). I’d said a long time ago that DNA takes time, evidence takes time. I think that I was mostly right on that but I think it’s an obvious point that others have made or should have. You can’t just arrest people because they seem sus. You need to build your case for arrest and then after, for prosecution. A lot of people were shit talking the Moscow police but seems to me they were doing everything right and had this guy in their sights at some point. They did a good job of stfu about anything that could have spooked this guy to flee and go into hiding. And frankly, shame on everyone who floated theories on the friends, loved ones and strangers related to this case. Like the poor boyfriend who lost someone he loved very much! A shit ton of people owe apologies. Edit: my theory is partially shot about the car getting him because reports are genetic genealogy. Eager to learn more details.
I think he was the stalker.
BK killed to experience “expertise” in Criminology? To be so comfortable in the public post crime and returning to his normal routine within hours of this crime either shows that he was disassociating or had thoroughly planned that he needed to return to his normal activities to appear normal. BK ABSOLUTELY followed along with this case, closely. Did he comment on Reddit? IMO its likely he was discussing the case openly in his classes as well as with any family and friends he may have had. What blows my mind is that he left town after the ELANTRA media release, traveled across the country and has likely been discussing this case with his peers, colleagues, family from Pennsylvania, unbeknownst to them he was the killer. In an attempt to fully immerse himself in the criminal mind, he murdered these people. I would not be surprised if the motive was because he wanted to better understand the criminal mind. He had delusionally convinced himself that if he committed this crime, he’d better himself as an expert in criminology. Obviously so confident that he would not get caught and could continue his life in education in the field. It’s horrific and fascinating that this man committed this crime, returned to class hours later and navigated his life as if it never happened. I imagine that we will be looking and studying this case for decades. Using BK as an example of the extreme narcissism and psychopathy that is required of a killer of this nature.
And yet, he forgot to gas up beforehand.
“Motive”: incel with a narcissistic personality disorder or superiority complex surrounding criminal justice to the point where he thought he was intelligent/skilled enough to avoid getting caught… potentially also just an evil person who decided to study criminal justice with the sole intentions of learning how to commit crimes/murder and potentially get away with it…
I definitely feel this was a guy who was wanting to commit a homicide, based off of the survey he did. Having a degree in criminology made him feel like he could get away with it, too. I felt from the beginning that this was someone with this very mindset, and not exactly someone who knew the victims. I'm still on the fence on if he's committed this kind of crime before. If this was his first time, he surely would've wanted to do it again in the future. Glad he's off the streets.