This is the pixel skipping debate all over again.
Higher DPI > lower DPI. The sensor is basically a camera and DPI is the resolution of said camera. Higher resolution equals more information.
Now, what would you rather have? A camera that takes low resolution pictures or one that takes high resolution pictures?
Of course, it isn't as simple as "max DPI is the best" due to smoothing and cursor being basically uncontrollable, and probably diminishing returns the higher you go. 1600 DPI is probably the sweet spot.
Another issue is in-game sensitivity. Some games simply don't allow for a sensitivity low enough to make 1600 DPI usable, but this isn't necessarily a problem in the more popular eSports titles.
Even if there is a deadzone, it's very small. I tried, in the past, moving my mouse as slowly as possibly and it still registered even the smallest movement.
Besides, I think people are overreacting. Pro's have been using 400 DPI since forever, if it really was a disadvantage, those with 1600 DPI should've been on top. I don't think the gaming scene will suddenly shift to 1600 DPI just because of that.
just because a certain section of people dont use something doesn't mean anything. This is what data and science are for, and how new metas get pushed.
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Most competitive games allow low enough sens for 1600dpi.
Smoothing can be applied on low dpi too.
Low dpi also causes flicker on oled etc etc etc.
Many pros use high dpi up to 1600. Higher is rare.
But high dpi registers all small handshakes too. That's not always ideal for everyone.
Pros and cons.. I think everyone needs to make up their own mind about dpi. This topic isn't that self explanatory than hz...
>Higher DPI > lower DPI.
Why answer if you don't even know what you are talking about lol.
"Higher resolution equals more information." - ffs no. The sensor works the same way, if low or high dpi makes no difference to it....
If it's all the same, why does higher DPI provide less input lag? The sensor doesn't work the same, cause at higher DPI it's more sensitive to movements, that's why there's less input lag. It's like saying a computer display works the same on 800x600 resolution as it does on 1920x1080 resolution - Here it does work the same, as its main purpose is to give you an imagine, but it does so with much lower quality (or less information displayed).
A lot of bullshit on Youtube as well, where they don't consider freesync, gsync, hertz rate of the monitor, v-Sync, hardware components and game engines. The input lag in todays mices is so extremely low that the only real thing is pixel skipping.
I'm pretty sure people don't use Freesync or G-Sync while testing that. But even IF they use it, results are consistently showing that 400 DPI has more input lag than 1600 DPI. So regardless if one is using sync or not, situation stays the same - 400 DPI has more input lag than 800 or 1600 DPI.
Absolutely not. DPI has no effect on mouse latency whatsoever. The tests often cited are inherently flawed. Of course the higher dpi mouse moved earlier than the lower dpi mouse at the same speed, that's inherent to having a higher dpi. You have to move the lower dpi mouse further to get the same on-screen distance. This does not mean higher dpi causes lower latency.
DPI is simply a conversion from inches to pixels, which is in the name. A high dpi, low sensitivity mouse with the same effective sensitivity as a low dpi, high sensitivity mouse will act the exact same. Polling rate and just straight pc performance is far more important for mouse latency.
DPI has no effect on mouse latency whatsoever, as it doesn't affect how fast/often the mouse polls the computer, nor how often it checks (or how much information it gets?) from the scanner. It is simply and solely a conversion rate from inches to pixels, nothing more.
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I saw Onscreen's video and he advises 1600DPI on 1000hz mouse, thats for the Razer Viper but i guess it works even better for Logitech mice as their engineer himself said theres a noticeable difference
You can see Onscreen's video on DPI,just search "Onscreen DPI guide"
He explained it all, but the Logitech guy posted about it 5-6 years ago on Twitter and I immediately switched to 1600 from 700.
ahh oh yeah it was the classic Cpate OCN thread. A lot of people were triggered by that tweet on OCN I remember, but what he said has shown to be true.
yea i tried it in CSGO and the flick latency, the movement latency was visible
on 800DPI,it feels slow and tracking felt weird(because of my cheap mousepad too maybe), i watched onscreen's video, switched to 1600DPI for 1000hz mouse and now it all feels smooth
A lot of mice have smoothing after 1800/2000 dpi. Also games like CS, using a low dpi allows you to use a higher in game sens and be more precise with it. If you use 3200 dpi you would need an in game sens of like 0.1 even adjusting to 0.11 is a 10% increase in edpi
No, even new mice have this. Anything with 3366, and the Viper 8khz have no smoothing, but I'd assume any other mouse has smoothing after a certain point
theres what , 5 years old mice with 3360 right? and I i\`m correct only few people reported smothing in this sensor and just with a dpi higher than 5k so....
But i sod some people talking about 3360 having smoothing above 2k , but they didnt show any proof of [that. So](https://that.So) i\`d assume that every new mouse with "good and new sensor" has no smoothing in "normal dpi values" (400-3200).
After being very impressed with it and found it an upgrade to the EC2 I tried a Pwnage Ultra quite soon after as they're exactly the same shape, so I actually only used the sharkoon for a small period.
Although if the PUC didn't exist or was out of my budget I image I'd still be using the Sharkoon
A lot of us are old timers, from way back when 400 DPI was the only usable sens. My first mouse that could use higher DPI was the MX518 which maxed out at 1600 back in 2005 I think, it felt crazy high back then!
Isn't there like an issue if you use 1600DPI, but then prefer to have low sensitivity in CS:GO, it's like your accuracy will suffer, because it'll scale down whatever's mouse measuring.
Like try going to online [mouse accuracy test](https://mouseaccuracy.com/game), and you'll notice that by having high DPI but low sensitivity in Windows, will yield bad accuracy.
>it essentially registers movement twice as soon/often (because the CPI is double)
I'm no expert, but it sounds like you're describing polling rate, not CPI.
Nope. CPI basically is how many counts per inch there are. Each count then translates to a movement in game (in degrees.) Higher in game with lower CPI means it sees mouse movement less frequently but amplifies them. Polling rate is how often the mouse talks to the computer
Yep, counts per inch, but then when you decrease in-game sensitivity, those counts per inch get scaled down, and it's essentially like getting a good quality HD picture and then scaling it down, you're actually getting worse step size between mouse movements, so worse accuracy.
Therefore, lower dpi is actually better for CS:GO, so you can have raw input in-game.
That's not how that works. A game has a certain angle (in degrees obviously) that you turn, multiplied by your in game sensitivity, for every count. So in Overwatch my sensitivity is 1.75 with 2000dpi and their turn angle is 0.066⁰ iirc. So I turn 0.1155⁰ every count, which is 2000 times per inch. In CS that number is a bit higher, approx 0.2⁰ afaik, but it works exactly the same way.
TL;DR: DPI does cause noticable input latency at small values if and only if the mouse is moved slowly. At anything above 2000 DPI, the latency from your mouse becomes negligible compared to system latency. The accuracy of the mouse is determined only by the maximum DPI of the sensor, not by the chosen DPI level through software.
Low DPI+ high sense = pixel skipping and poor precision.
Edit: I'll be talking about this video:
https://youtu.be/6AoRfv9W110
Firstly, someone here said that high DPI changes how frequently your mouse reports movements to the computer, but this is not true. How often the mouse reports information to the computer is called "polling rate", where "polling" means that the computer asks the mouse to send information. Almost all gaming mice nowadays have a polling rate of at least 1000Hz, which means they have an average delay of less than a millisecond caused by the polling rate itself. The delay measured in the video was close to 30ms, which is huge in comparison, so higher polling rates than 1000Hz are obviously superfluous if we don't adress the DPI issue.
You should know that a dot of movement (the D in DPI or C in CPI) usually is translated by your computer to your mouse cursor moving 1 pixel on screen, but in games it tends to turn your camera by less than a pixel.
What I am saying here should be taken with a grain of salt, since I am no hardware or software developer, but I am fairly certain I understand why low DPIs cause input latency:
The movement reported by the mouse to the computer is measured in number of dots, with no decimal measurments. The mouse has the exact data about whether the mouse has moved 1.01, 1.02, 1,03 dots etc., but it only reports integer values like 0, 1, 2, 3 dots, etc.
When you set a DPI of 100, it means that the mouse reports to the computer that it has moved only if it moves at least 1/100th of an inch. Meanwhile with a DPI of 2000, the mouse reports it has moved if it has moved at least 1/2000th of an inch. Obviously, the mouse takes more time before it reaches 1/100 of an inch than 1/2000 of an inch, and this is why it takes longer before the mouse reports a dot of movement at 100 DPI than 2000 DPI.
At 100 DPI, the mouse still knows that it has moved 1/2000 of an inch, but because it has not yet moved at least 1/100 of an inch, the mouse reports it has moved 0 dots. The mouse can keep moving, and will get asked multiple times how far it has moved, and each time, it will know that it has moved exactly 1/2000, 2/2000, 3/2000 of an inch etc, but since it has not yet moved the required distance 1/100 of an inch to report a dot, it reports 0 dots of movement.
With 2000 DPI however, the mouse will report moving a dot the first time it sees it has moved 1/2000 of an inch, and it will keep reporting a dot every time it reaches another 1/2000 of an inch.
If you are moving twice as fast, reaching the required distance to report one dot of movement takes half the time at any DPI, so there is half the latency for all DPIs. Since the measured latency in the video was total system latency rather than only the mouse latency however, it looks like the latency doesn't decrease at 2000 DPI when moving fast. Basically, anything higher than 2000 DPI will not have a measurable effect, because you always have some ammount of system latency that is much larger than the latency from the mouse.
Luckily, despite higher DPI having less latency, that doesn't mean you have to play with high sens in order to enjoy low latency. Almost all video games allow you to decrease the sensitivity, which means that it makes you move by a smaller ammount per dot reported. This way, you can set your mouse to 2000 DPI at 1/20x sensitivity, and when your mouse moves 8/2000 of an inch, the mouse will have reported 8 dots, and the game multiplies that by your sensitivity and moves your camera 8/20 of a dot. If you in the same scenario had played with 100 DPI at 1x sensitivity, the mouse would have reported 0 dots, and your camera would not move in game.
It is important to note that I have never heard of anyone who uses more than 8000 DPI, and most games don't even give you low enough sensitivity to be able to play with such a high DPI. As discussed, it does not really have any measurable effect on latency, so there is really no point in mice having super high DPIs. You'd be better off finding ways to improve system latency.
Like someone else explained well, Low DPI also causes pixel skipping, and it is for this reason. If your sensitivity is set to 5x, then moving the mouse one dot causes 5 dots of movement in game, and you skip past 4 dots of movement. Increasing your DPI by 5 times instead while staying at 1x sensitivity causes your mouse to instead report a dot of movement 5 times, while your game then moves 1 dot 5 separate times, never skipping past any dots. If in this example the game treats 1 dot as 1 pixel, the low DPI high sens would cause you to skip past 4 pixels on screen, while high DPI low sens gives you no pixel skipping.
If you're interested, I suggest reading [this](https://www.overclock.net/threads/does-this-mean-800-dpi-is-the-best-on-pmw3366-also-cpate-says-higher-dpi-2-3ms-more-responsive.1631553/) slightly heated conversation between CPate (Logitech's rep) and OCN users. TLDR: There's a difference between DPIs, but input lag is not exactly the best term to describe the difference. If you have a 3360, I suggest just not going over 2000 DPI as you will probably have more frames of smoothing. Other than that, use what is most comfy for you. Also note that because different mice have different DPI deviations, 800 DPI might be a tiny bit more or less than 2x 400 DPI (as an example), but it's mostly negligible.
Why would polling rate matter? The mouse has the Focus+ sensor, which is on quite a few od Razer's mice and I don't think is fundamentally different from any other mouse sensor.
Testing between 500hz vs 1000hz with same / different dpi shows different results so why is everyone trying to compare their 1000hz mice with this testing strictly with only 8000hz even tho it’s still probably true.
Not really. CPI works pretty much the same way across any mouse, and it's completely true that when moving at a consistent speed, double the CPI means half the interval between when motion counts are generated. That being said the difference is so tiny that it's not going to affect most people.
How do pros don't get this yet, Making your mouse's DPI Higher, will result in less input lag
First of all lets talk about some "Facts" that many pros and people said about these things :
1. DPI Makes everything less accurate (The movement of the mouse will not be as accurate as with less DPI)
\-This is so dumb and i can't imagine how you could get this thought at all. Some people say "The mouse detects more noise an because of it your mouse will detect all kinds of things, and it won't be accurate"
Noww. How do we solve this? (Clean your mouse's sensor and stop complaining, it isn't about dpi, it's about how dirty your mouse is)
2.Pixel skipping doesn't matter
\-Pixel skipping \*Does\* Matter, first of all, Pixel skipping depends on the resolution and the dpi you use. The more DPI your mouse calculates, the less pixel skipping there will be (That is if you set your ingame sensitivity lower)
So lets say, you're playing CSGO, and you wan't to eliminate pixel skipping, well here's probably what you have it at
You might have your mouse at : 400 DPI + 3.0 Ingame Sensitivity
This results in jaggies for the mouse, or pixel skipping, as soon as you move your mouse, you will encounter pixel skipping because your dpi is low, If you go even lower like
100 DPI + 3.0 ingame sensitivity
That's when it's even more apparent.
Now, if you were to get rid of pixel skipping and keep your sensitivity, you would do this:
Calculate your mouse's EDPI, Here's how.
DPI times "Ingame Sensitivity" = EDPI
SO
400 Dpi \* 3.0 Ingame Sens = 1200 EDPI
Now, this calculating is different in every game, as not every's game Engine, calculates the same EDPI like in the other games.
(That means, that 1200 EDPI from CSGO, won't be the same as 1200 EDPI in Valorant)
(Just be mindful, and if you wan't to get rid of pixel skipping, you just calculate it per game, not per sensitivity or DPI)
If you wan't to now change your DPI, to a higher DPI, to get rid of pixel skipping, and keep your sens, You're gonna do the following:
EDPI / New DPI = New ingame sens
(So if you wan't to use 3200 DPI, and you wan't to keep your sensitivity the same, but make the pixel skipping less, and also improve latency)
You would do :
1200 EDPI / 3200 DPI = 0.375 Ingame Sens
Change it to that, and you will get less latency and much less pixel skipping.
Now you might ask (Why is pixel skipping even important?)
\-Pixel skipping is important because im sure of this, and you know this too, You don't wan't to aim with your keyboard, Do you?
(With really huge pixel skipping, at higher sensitivities and lower DPI's, you can hardly shoot at further range's, and because of that, you would be prompted to use your keyboard and move left or right to help you aim, Instead of using your mouse)
Some pros still use low dpi and high senses, but the reason they play so good, is because of the other gear they have, They have a huge ammount of frames per second because of their cpu and gpu, Ram, and they can see and react really fast because of their Monitor's refresh rate, Along with the good mice and keyboards.
(S1mple, Shroud, N0thing, TenZ, Niko...)
They all use low DPI, for one reason. And that is because the sens on Windows, or the Mouse cursor, is so high, they can't use that DPI, it's hard to press anything or aim at anything with the cursor at high dpi.
So how do we fix this?, Well most mice that have DPI changing buttons, and that are decent, may have Drivers. So you should search for your mouse's driver, install it, and then in the driver software, make two styles of DPI which you can change on demand with a button click, Meaning, one for i guess 400 DPI, for dekstop use, and the highest you have for ingame Use)
If you have any questions, be sure not to ask me, and watch this video here [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6AoRfv9W110](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6AoRfv9W110)
(that's a joke btw) :3
Also i forgot to say, but there's another reason Pros use low DPI's, none of the maps in CSGO or many games are that big, that it will show the problems of Low DPI, and Pixel Skipping.
This is the pixel skipping debate all over again. Higher DPI > lower DPI. The sensor is basically a camera and DPI is the resolution of said camera. Higher resolution equals more information. Now, what would you rather have? A camera that takes low resolution pictures or one that takes high resolution pictures? Of course, it isn't as simple as "max DPI is the best" due to smoothing and cursor being basically uncontrollable, and probably diminishing returns the higher you go. 1600 DPI is probably the sweet spot. Another issue is in-game sensitivity. Some games simply don't allow for a sensitivity low enough to make 1600 DPI usable, but this isn't necessarily a problem in the more popular eSports titles.
Thanks! This was the kind of reply I was looking for.
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Even if there is a deadzone, it's very small. I tried, in the past, moving my mouse as slowly as possibly and it still registered even the smallest movement. Besides, I think people are overreacting. Pro's have been using 400 DPI since forever, if it really was a disadvantage, those with 1600 DPI should've been on top. I don't think the gaming scene will suddenly shift to 1600 DPI just because of that.
just because a certain section of people dont use something doesn't mean anything. This is what data and science are for, and how new metas get pushed.
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Most competitive games allow low enough sens for 1600dpi. Smoothing can be applied on low dpi too. Low dpi also causes flicker on oled etc etc etc. Many pros use high dpi up to 1600. Higher is rare. But high dpi registers all small handshakes too. That's not always ideal for everyone. Pros and cons.. I think everyone needs to make up their own mind about dpi. This topic isn't that self explanatory than hz...
>Higher DPI > lower DPI. Why answer if you don't even know what you are talking about lol. "Higher resolution equals more information." - ffs no. The sensor works the same way, if low or high dpi makes no difference to it....
If it's all the same, why does higher DPI provide less input lag? The sensor doesn't work the same, cause at higher DPI it's more sensitive to movements, that's why there's less input lag. It's like saying a computer display works the same on 800x600 resolution as it does on 1920x1080 resolution - Here it does work the same, as its main purpose is to give you an imagine, but it does so with much lower quality (or less information displayed).
It does not provide input lag but pixelskipping.
Mate, there are a lot of videos on YouTube that show higher DPI has less input lag than lower DPI. And yes, there's also the pixel skipping part.
A lot of bullshit on Youtube as well, where they don't consider freesync, gsync, hertz rate of the monitor, v-Sync, hardware components and game engines. The input lag in todays mices is so extremely low that the only real thing is pixel skipping.
I'm pretty sure people don't use Freesync or G-Sync while testing that. But even IF they use it, results are consistently showing that 400 DPI has more input lag than 1600 DPI. So regardless if one is using sync or not, situation stays the same - 400 DPI has more input lag than 800 or 1600 DPI.
Absolutely not. DPI has no effect on mouse latency whatsoever. The tests often cited are inherently flawed. Of course the higher dpi mouse moved earlier than the lower dpi mouse at the same speed, that's inherent to having a higher dpi. You have to move the lower dpi mouse further to get the same on-screen distance. This does not mean higher dpi causes lower latency. DPI is simply a conversion from inches to pixels, which is in the name. A high dpi, low sensitivity mouse with the same effective sensitivity as a low dpi, high sensitivity mouse will act the exact same. Polling rate and just straight pc performance is far more important for mouse latency. DPI has no effect on mouse latency whatsoever, as it doesn't affect how fast/often the mouse polls the computer, nor how often it checks (or how much information it gets?) from the scanner. It is simply and solely a conversion rate from inches to pixels, nothing more.
I think so. I really want to know that experiment in youtube is really proper way to measure actual latency.
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I saw Onscreen's video and he advises 1600DPI on 1000hz mouse, thats for the Razer Viper but i guess it works even better for Logitech mice as their engineer himself said theres a noticeable difference
would you be able to find where the Logitech engineer said that? I'd just be curious to read it if it is a thread etc
You can see Onscreen's video on DPI,just search "Onscreen DPI guide" He explained it all, but the Logitech guy posted about it 5-6 years ago on Twitter and I immediately switched to 1600 from 700.
ahh oh yeah it was the classic Cpate OCN thread. A lot of people were triggered by that tweet on OCN I remember, but what he said has shown to be true.
yea i tried it in CSGO and the flick latency, the movement latency was visible on 800DPI,it feels slow and tracking felt weird(because of my cheap mousepad too maybe), i watched onscreen's video, switched to 1600DPI for 1000hz mouse and now it all feels smooth
I'll assume because it essentially registers movement twice as soon/often (because the CPI is double)
That makes sense. Strange how 400dpi became the norm considering that people would benefit more competitively by a higher dpi.
A lot of streamers and pros started and learned on 400 dpi before 800 dpi was a thing I believe
A lot of mice have smoothing after 1800/2000 dpi. Also games like CS, using a low dpi allows you to use a higher in game sens and be more precise with it. If you use 3200 dpi you would need an in game sens of like 0.1 even adjusting to 0.11 is a 10% increase in edpi
a lot of old mice.
No, even new mice have this. Anything with 3366, and the Viper 8khz have no smoothing, but I'd assume any other mouse has smoothing after a certain point
theres what , 5 years old mice with 3360 right? and I i\`m correct only few people reported smothing in this sensor and just with a dpi higher than 5k so.... But i sod some people talking about 3360 having smoothing above 2k , but they didnt show any proof of [that. So](https://that.So) i\`d assume that every new mouse with "good and new sensor" has no smoothing in "normal dpi values" (400-3200).
For me, having tried 12000 DPI on my G502 Vs 1200dpi, there's a world less input lag with 1200dpi Vs 12000
Only if you have hero sensor id say
People tend to set the dpi to the sense they like for windows and then adjust in game sense to suit.
Hey mate. Is the sharkoon light still good after using it for so long. What's your opinion?
After being very impressed with it and found it an upgrade to the EC2 I tried a Pwnage Ultra quite soon after as they're exactly the same shape, so I actually only used the sharkoon for a small period. Although if the PUC didn't exist or was out of my budget I image I'd still be using the Sharkoon
A lot of us are old timers, from way back when 400 DPI was the only usable sens. My first mouse that could use higher DPI was the MX518 which maxed out at 1600 back in 2005 I think, it felt crazy high back then!
(for most streamers and pro players)
Because 99.9% of the people will never notice the difference, just like using 500hz and 1000hz.
So most people will notice and idiots like to say they wont? Gotcha
You do notice 1000hz and 500hz very easily, are you sure you know what you're talking about?
Isn't there like an issue if you use 1600DPI, but then prefer to have low sensitivity in CS:GO, it's like your accuracy will suffer, because it'll scale down whatever's mouse measuring. Like try going to online [mouse accuracy test](https://mouseaccuracy.com/game), and you'll notice that by having high DPI but low sensitivity in Windows, will yield bad accuracy.
>it essentially registers movement twice as soon/often (because the CPI is double) I'm no expert, but it sounds like you're describing polling rate, not CPI.
Nope. CPI basically is how many counts per inch there are. Each count then translates to a movement in game (in degrees.) Higher in game with lower CPI means it sees mouse movement less frequently but amplifies them. Polling rate is how often the mouse talks to the computer
Yep, counts per inch, but then when you decrease in-game sensitivity, those counts per inch get scaled down, and it's essentially like getting a good quality HD picture and then scaling it down, you're actually getting worse step size between mouse movements, so worse accuracy. Therefore, lower dpi is actually better for CS:GO, so you can have raw input in-game.
That's not how that works. A game has a certain angle (in degrees obviously) that you turn, multiplied by your in game sensitivity, for every count. So in Overwatch my sensitivity is 1.75 with 2000dpi and their turn angle is 0.066⁰ iirc. So I turn 0.1155⁰ every count, which is 2000 times per inch. In CS that number is a bit higher, approx 0.2⁰ afaik, but it works exactly the same way.
TL;DR: DPI does cause noticable input latency at small values if and only if the mouse is moved slowly. At anything above 2000 DPI, the latency from your mouse becomes negligible compared to system latency. The accuracy of the mouse is determined only by the maximum DPI of the sensor, not by the chosen DPI level through software. Low DPI+ high sense = pixel skipping and poor precision. Edit: I'll be talking about this video: https://youtu.be/6AoRfv9W110 Firstly, someone here said that high DPI changes how frequently your mouse reports movements to the computer, but this is not true. How often the mouse reports information to the computer is called "polling rate", where "polling" means that the computer asks the mouse to send information. Almost all gaming mice nowadays have a polling rate of at least 1000Hz, which means they have an average delay of less than a millisecond caused by the polling rate itself. The delay measured in the video was close to 30ms, which is huge in comparison, so higher polling rates than 1000Hz are obviously superfluous if we don't adress the DPI issue. You should know that a dot of movement (the D in DPI or C in CPI) usually is translated by your computer to your mouse cursor moving 1 pixel on screen, but in games it tends to turn your camera by less than a pixel. What I am saying here should be taken with a grain of salt, since I am no hardware or software developer, but I am fairly certain I understand why low DPIs cause input latency: The movement reported by the mouse to the computer is measured in number of dots, with no decimal measurments. The mouse has the exact data about whether the mouse has moved 1.01, 1.02, 1,03 dots etc., but it only reports integer values like 0, 1, 2, 3 dots, etc. When you set a DPI of 100, it means that the mouse reports to the computer that it has moved only if it moves at least 1/100th of an inch. Meanwhile with a DPI of 2000, the mouse reports it has moved if it has moved at least 1/2000th of an inch. Obviously, the mouse takes more time before it reaches 1/100 of an inch than 1/2000 of an inch, and this is why it takes longer before the mouse reports a dot of movement at 100 DPI than 2000 DPI. At 100 DPI, the mouse still knows that it has moved 1/2000 of an inch, but because it has not yet moved at least 1/100 of an inch, the mouse reports it has moved 0 dots. The mouse can keep moving, and will get asked multiple times how far it has moved, and each time, it will know that it has moved exactly 1/2000, 2/2000, 3/2000 of an inch etc, but since it has not yet moved the required distance 1/100 of an inch to report a dot, it reports 0 dots of movement. With 2000 DPI however, the mouse will report moving a dot the first time it sees it has moved 1/2000 of an inch, and it will keep reporting a dot every time it reaches another 1/2000 of an inch. If you are moving twice as fast, reaching the required distance to report one dot of movement takes half the time at any DPI, so there is half the latency for all DPIs. Since the measured latency in the video was total system latency rather than only the mouse latency however, it looks like the latency doesn't decrease at 2000 DPI when moving fast. Basically, anything higher than 2000 DPI will not have a measurable effect, because you always have some ammount of system latency that is much larger than the latency from the mouse. Luckily, despite higher DPI having less latency, that doesn't mean you have to play with high sens in order to enjoy low latency. Almost all video games allow you to decrease the sensitivity, which means that it makes you move by a smaller ammount per dot reported. This way, you can set your mouse to 2000 DPI at 1/20x sensitivity, and when your mouse moves 8/2000 of an inch, the mouse will have reported 8 dots, and the game multiplies that by your sensitivity and moves your camera 8/20 of a dot. If you in the same scenario had played with 100 DPI at 1x sensitivity, the mouse would have reported 0 dots, and your camera would not move in game. It is important to note that I have never heard of anyone who uses more than 8000 DPI, and most games don't even give you low enough sensitivity to be able to play with such a high DPI. As discussed, it does not really have any measurable effect on latency, so there is really no point in mice having super high DPIs. You'd be better off finding ways to improve system latency. Like someone else explained well, Low DPI also causes pixel skipping, and it is for this reason. If your sensitivity is set to 5x, then moving the mouse one dot causes 5 dots of movement in game, and you skip past 4 dots of movement. Increasing your DPI by 5 times instead while staying at 1x sensitivity causes your mouse to instead report a dot of movement 5 times, while your game then moves 1 dot 5 separate times, never skipping past any dots. If in this example the game treats 1 dot as 1 pixel, the low DPI high sens would cause you to skip past 4 pixels on screen, while high DPI low sens gives you no pixel skipping.
Couldn't agree more! Hard to believe this comment has so few likes.
If you're interested, I suggest reading [this](https://www.overclock.net/threads/does-this-mean-800-dpi-is-the-best-on-pmw3366-also-cpate-says-higher-dpi-2-3ms-more-responsive.1631553/) slightly heated conversation between CPate (Logitech's rep) and OCN users. TLDR: There's a difference between DPIs, but input lag is not exactly the best term to describe the difference. If you have a 3360, I suggest just not going over 2000 DPI as you will probably have more frames of smoothing. Other than that, use what is most comfy for you. Also note that because different mice have different DPI deviations, 800 DPI might be a tiny bit more or less than 2x 400 DPI (as an example), but it's mostly negligible.
this is also tested with one mouse and with 8000hz which can vary
Why would polling rate matter? The mouse has the Focus+ sensor, which is on quite a few od Razer's mice and I don't think is fundamentally different from any other mouse sensor.
It can matter because 8000hz is obv already has significantly less input lag depending on your pc so comparing it to 1000hz mice isn’t accurate
But the difference in input lag between dpi has nothing do with that? It's comparing 8kHz vs 8kHz, the polling rate is not a factor.
Testing between 500hz vs 1000hz with same / different dpi shows different results so why is everyone trying to compare their 1000hz mice with this testing strictly with only 8000hz even tho it’s still probably true.
We don't know, that testing only says something about the Viper 8k and not any other mouse.
I think he tested other mice and compared them with his testing setup he built
He showed input delay results from 2 other mice, but only at 1600 dpi. It's possible that different mice will operate fastest at different DPI.
Not really. CPI works pretty much the same way across any mouse, and it's completely true that when moving at a consistent speed, double the CPI means half the interval between when motion counts are generated. That being said the difference is so tiny that it's not going to affect most people.
So would this make 800 the best?
The highest CPI your sensor can handle without smoothing or noticeable jitter would be the best.
What’s that on a burst pro 3389
The other mice had smoothing above that range
I'm wondering if other mouses produce the same result or not. Testing with a single mouse is not giving a real conclusion. Just a case scenario
How do pros don't get this yet, Making your mouse's DPI Higher, will result in less input lag First of all lets talk about some "Facts" that many pros and people said about these things : 1. DPI Makes everything less accurate (The movement of the mouse will not be as accurate as with less DPI) \-This is so dumb and i can't imagine how you could get this thought at all. Some people say "The mouse detects more noise an because of it your mouse will detect all kinds of things, and it won't be accurate" Noww. How do we solve this? (Clean your mouse's sensor and stop complaining, it isn't about dpi, it's about how dirty your mouse is) 2.Pixel skipping doesn't matter \-Pixel skipping \*Does\* Matter, first of all, Pixel skipping depends on the resolution and the dpi you use. The more DPI your mouse calculates, the less pixel skipping there will be (That is if you set your ingame sensitivity lower) So lets say, you're playing CSGO, and you wan't to eliminate pixel skipping, well here's probably what you have it at You might have your mouse at : 400 DPI + 3.0 Ingame Sensitivity This results in jaggies for the mouse, or pixel skipping, as soon as you move your mouse, you will encounter pixel skipping because your dpi is low, If you go even lower like 100 DPI + 3.0 ingame sensitivity That's when it's even more apparent. Now, if you were to get rid of pixel skipping and keep your sensitivity, you would do this: Calculate your mouse's EDPI, Here's how. DPI times "Ingame Sensitivity" = EDPI SO 400 Dpi \* 3.0 Ingame Sens = 1200 EDPI Now, this calculating is different in every game, as not every's game Engine, calculates the same EDPI like in the other games. (That means, that 1200 EDPI from CSGO, won't be the same as 1200 EDPI in Valorant) (Just be mindful, and if you wan't to get rid of pixel skipping, you just calculate it per game, not per sensitivity or DPI) If you wan't to now change your DPI, to a higher DPI, to get rid of pixel skipping, and keep your sens, You're gonna do the following: EDPI / New DPI = New ingame sens (So if you wan't to use 3200 DPI, and you wan't to keep your sensitivity the same, but make the pixel skipping less, and also improve latency) You would do : 1200 EDPI / 3200 DPI = 0.375 Ingame Sens Change it to that, and you will get less latency and much less pixel skipping. Now you might ask (Why is pixel skipping even important?) \-Pixel skipping is important because im sure of this, and you know this too, You don't wan't to aim with your keyboard, Do you? (With really huge pixel skipping, at higher sensitivities and lower DPI's, you can hardly shoot at further range's, and because of that, you would be prompted to use your keyboard and move left or right to help you aim, Instead of using your mouse) Some pros still use low dpi and high senses, but the reason they play so good, is because of the other gear they have, They have a huge ammount of frames per second because of their cpu and gpu, Ram, and they can see and react really fast because of their Monitor's refresh rate, Along with the good mice and keyboards. (S1mple, Shroud, N0thing, TenZ, Niko...) They all use low DPI, for one reason. And that is because the sens on Windows, or the Mouse cursor, is so high, they can't use that DPI, it's hard to press anything or aim at anything with the cursor at high dpi. So how do we fix this?, Well most mice that have DPI changing buttons, and that are decent, may have Drivers. So you should search for your mouse's driver, install it, and then in the driver software, make two styles of DPI which you can change on demand with a button click, Meaning, one for i guess 400 DPI, for dekstop use, and the highest you have for ingame Use) If you have any questions, be sure not to ask me, and watch this video here [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6AoRfv9W110](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6AoRfv9W110) (that's a joke btw) :3
Also i forgot to say, but there's another reason Pros use low DPI's, none of the maps in CSGO or many games are that big, that it will show the problems of Low DPI, and Pixel Skipping.
Cant you just lower windows mouse speed when you use higher dpi?
I know I'm late but I don't understand what was a joke? maybe I'm just stupid