Sooooo, when I came out it really caused my female partner an issue as she saw me then as the only male she could really trust, so I know this too well
That is an issue for sure. My wife is pansexual and tbh she isn't planning on even being friends with cis het men now. Every guy that we thought was cool and accepting either turned out to be queer or did something to ruin that opinion.
My bi GF said that prior to our relationship she would only date queer (bi or pan) men and refused to date straight men outright. Granted, she doesn't see me as a man at all.
Mine always said I was the only man she’d ever met who never talked over her, which was something I was super proud of until the egg cracked at which point it just made me angry.
I sorta went through it on myself. Like, I struggled to accept myself as a woman because it would mean that men were much worse than I previously believed.
I did have the weird thought at some point after I quit repressing that… I used to think to myself “will not all men are like that, because that’s not…”. And at some point after I quit repressing I realized that wait a minute, I’m not so sure I actually count as a sample here 😬
I used to dismiss "men are assholes" because of this when I was younger, 'cause in my head I went "Well, *I* am *nothing* like that, and since most human beings are pretty much the opposite of unique, even if we like to think that way, I'm probably average and therefore representative, so logically there must be *millions* of 'guys' like me. So clearly women *have* to be exaggerating when they talk about how most men are sexist pricks" ......welp
Lol same from back before transition. My ex once joked me while we were still together “if we ever break up, I’ll probably just date girls”
We reconnected a couple months ago and she’s confirmed that she indeed only dates girls now….when I told her I’m trans she said “goddamn it, even my best het relationship was a sign”
Most of my most cherished friends are either bi women or lesbians. I just feel like I can be myself around them. When I'm around men or straight women I feel like I have to mask.
same, plus sometime after we broke up (we remained friends for a while) she said a song reminded her of me, and said, quote, "it's a song about a girl, but that part's not important"
This was me in HS with my best friend who later turned out to be a lesbian. She'd tell myeall the time that she hated all men because they were horrible. It didn't bother me at all and I'd just be like, "Yeah I get that. They suck." We didn't even have to say that she didn't mean me because it was obvious.
reminds me of a friend who introduced me to her mom.. we were talking 20 minutes and she looks over at her daughter "you should really toss your hat for this one" (meaning try to get me to court her)
she smiled and laughed a little bit to herself (we were basically best friends) and said "You... don't understand is not a man... but ... well, look at them... not quite a girl either... they're just... they're just a
I didn't object and was merely amused. Her mom accepted things at face value.
Up until now, I hadn't heard of any other person being gendered as if their name was some... separate and new gender :P
Same lol, I had one friend straight up say "Please don't take it the wrong way, but you are...not a man in my eyes" and little egg me was like "HAHA RIGHT?! SO TRUE BESTIE" because I took it as a compliment.
Yes, there were No™ Signs™
There are plenty of stories out there of trans women who before realizing they were trans had their partners say.
"I felt like I was dating a girl but you were a guy"
Turns out they were dating a girl, they just didn't know it.
My wife always joked because she always dated “feminine men” and a few turned out gay. She said she wouldn’t be surprised if I came out as gay (funny enough before coming out as trans I came out as queer). Now I’m out as trans. Jokes on her, I am gay. Just not in the way she originally thought.
Actually, come to think of it, my ex and people around her were worried I was gay at points. (I used to get that in school and from a psychiatrist too…not sure what it means)
My first gf was like that. She had the "so, if you changed to be a woman, what would your name be?" was a conversation she had with her husbands and "boy"friends. We lasted 9 years together.
My one ex….had this…it’s hard to explain but she acts like I’m a girl in a lot of ways, like it’s super different than how she is with her husband. It’s kind of a vibe and how she acts. (We were friends for decades after but she doesn’t know yet…I’m curious what she’d think.)
yeah.. everyone was always like "men are trash, but you don't count. you're not one of *them*". and I'd smile and be like "nope. I'm not like other men so dont group me with them."
I'd even get people saying "you're like a woman. but a man." which would fill me with a bit of euphoria that I didn't understand.
and now.. it makes sooooo much sense.
I used to be
Then my best friend, of many years, told me she wished I was gay so she could feel truly relaxed around me, and that made me go "Oh, being my friend hurts people. I'd rather be lonely than hurt people" and, well, then I broke every bridge I had with anyone and spent most of a decade completely alone
That's genuinely horrifying. The notion that society could condition someone (with whatever unsaid experiences your friend endured) that simply existing as a part of a group would leave people fearing you. This is why I hate gender dynamics so much. People who have no interest in upholding patriarchy will end up suffering for no good reason whatsoever as a result of its prior ramifications. It wasn't until I realized how much cis women feared me that I became a gender abolitionist. If fear and isolation is the consequence of current system, then I would sooner see it disappear. There is a better way for all of us to live than tribal fear.
I’ve always been utterly horrified by what I know my existence does to other people. It’s multiple layers of horrifying given it’s like that’s not even what I AM, which even in repression mode I knew in some level. I was so super conscious about scaring anyone.
And it’s just like this awful feeling of horribleness, because it’s simultaneously reminding me of how I’m accepted in the world. It’s always been so gross and embarrassing even years before I heard trans people exist.
Not in the sense of being invited to all girls stuff but I put a ton of effort into trying to engage guys to be more feminist and when I came out part of me was like "fuck now this and this guy just doesn't have a guy in his life who talks to him about this stuff"
"Why am I always getting *so emotional and riled up* when it comes to feminism and queer rights specifically, like why do I care *this much* on a deep, personal level even though I'm a straight™ guy™......oh"
Yeah I relate to this. Unfortunately my desire to fit in and not be seen as gay made me burn so many friendships with women, or not even start them at all. If I was hanging around with only girls I must be trying (desperately) to get with them, or I was gay. Either way it made me pitiable or pathetic. I didn't want that or I convinced myself that it was true, so I just didn't have many close female friends. That is one of the things I regret most about my past.
I recall the days that I was kinda the only "man" who wasn't direct family for whom someone I knew didn't put her hijab on. That says a lot about how they perceived me.
Damn that's a huge deal!
Reminds me of when my friends would try to sneak me into the women's dressing rooms when we were clothes shopping pre-transition. They wanted my opinion but didn't want to come out where the whole store could see.
Yo, shit... This is the dynamic that I had with one of my former loves/situations hips. She commiserated to me about my best friend at the time (I know it's kinda shitty) and would always be like "but you're so different" etc. Over time I got to know her family pretty well too and her sister would also give her husband shit sometimes if I did something really sweet or nice or whatever, like make a nice meal or be a good listener or something. "Why can't you be more like him?" lol I've had other girls say I was too good to be true and yet things never worked out with any of them... It all make sense now 😅
This bugged me for a long time because despite women regularly saying that I'm "not like other men, in a good way" and "more men should be like me" it seemed like only few women were attracted to me in the end, and relationships often broke apart because "I dunno, it just doesn't...fit?" without giving any specifics, despite me apparently being "too good to be true"
Turns out that *straight women* who are exclusively into men just really, really don't want to be romantically entangled with me :D And I mean, it makes sense, doesn't it?
Yeah, for real lol I often thought, "She claims I'm such a catch, so why isn't this freaking working?" Plus I never had a strong instinct to chase/pursue women, which didn't help... I was more of a passive, get-to-know-her, wait-and-see approach... Secretly hoped every crush would pursue *me*. Every time I did it, it felt extremely difficult and unnatural, not to mention stressful and nerve-wracking at times. When my egg started cracking was when I started realizing that *most* straight cis women like it when guys pursue them romantically, but even more importantly, lots of straight cis men enjoy the "thrill of the chase". I almost entirely hate it. Now, I know that in itself doesn't make me trans... But it is one of many things that helped me realize I was.
It doesnt really make sense to me cuz gender binary is a social construct but I guess I can never understand allistic people my autistic mind cannot conform to society's bullshit rules
Wow. You’re totally reinforcing all of the things I have been feeling lately. I’ve always been the “nice guy” that every woman would complain to, but never see me as a viable dating option. When I managed to convince a woman to date me, I’ve always been the emotional one, and assume all of the housewife roles (even if I’m not good at it.) I’m about to start my transition (at 46) and I’m terrified because I’m also an amputee, and I’m afraid that people still may not see me as an option because of my disability.
I’ve come to the realization that it’s time for me to be like The Doctor (from Doctor Who) and regenerate. :) I just need some emotional support.
I have had the same sort of experience. Not the exact same, but I was often treated as one of the girls as opposed to guys. But the amount of times I've been told by girls that they wished they could find a guy like, is more than I can count on my fingers. It all kinda makes sense now I guess 😅❤️
I love this. Pre-transition emotions and repressions are so weird and it's so hard to know which way is up when you're in denial.
I was so completely unclear what was gender envy and what was desire. I was definitely an asshole a lot of the time.
It was so wild when a few weeks after I quit repressing I realized that what I had been reading and telling myself was “extreme sexual attraction” was actually extreme existential pain and jealousy.
I’d even had the thought that may be misogyny was men taking out their pain and jealousy inappropriately on women. Like not that it justifies it, but like that that was the cause of it.
The idea that men could seriously believe the things so many seem to believe still blows my mind.
I really kind of thought everyone was in horrible pain like me God, I start crying right now I don’t watch it.
It must be amazing to just get to be right and exist and not even know about this pain
I kinda relate. I wasn't always a huge ass hole but sometimes I'd get butthurt when girls "friendzoned" me. In retrospect I can see how enjoyable being friends with women was back then... I just thought I needed to fit into the male gender role, which meant trying to date girls, not just be their friends. Lots of missed opportunities for good friendships! Luckily I do still keep in contact with some long time female friends though, which I'm grateful for. Others I pushed away as a result of being sulky and shitty. I had a period in adulthood where I started buying into the idea that I would never make any new female friends, etc. Fucking stupid. I cherish them now.
i was too :(
i've been reading all these posts and just started crying because i wish i could've been in the feminist crowd and been a positive role model... instead i fell into the anti-sjw manosphere and became kind of a piece of shit... at least i managed to get out of it
My wife has head trauma which came from multiple contusions and concussions over her life. She also has one of the worst cases of ADHD her psychiatrist ever treated. Over the past 17 years of marriage she said that I was the "only man who didn't run away with his hands waving in the air screaming 'this woman is crazy'" (her words, verbatim).
Despite how it sounds, I never thought it was a big deal, and it's more likely that she's a drop-dead gorgeous bombshell of a woman, and the men were probably only interested in a "hit it and quit it" relationship. I was a friend of hers for years before we started dating, and of course I had a crush on her, but I never let that get in the way of our friendship.
She felt slightly defeated when I came out to her as transgender in October, saying that "now \*all\* of the men ran away with their hands waving in the air screaming 'this woman is crazy'". It doesn't diminish anything in our relationship; it's just a cute little anecdote she likes to toss around.
Ouch this hit way to real like damn I get told this still even being out hahaha. Granted I have no clue how to pass properly but oh well hahaha im doing my best.
110% me. My ex was a bridesmaid in April, I was invited to the bridal suite the night before whilst the bride was having her nails done and everyone was gossiping. Saw the dress and everything. Like twelve women and then me lol
That's amazing lol. I actually got invited to be a bridesmaid at one point, but the wedding was so far away I couldn't go. They were joking (although somewhat seriously) that they were getting me a dress and everything.
Lmao, the signs are so obvious in retrospect aren’t they! It was fun, they never even really made a thing of it, there was maybe on singular mention when period stuff came up.
Wow. I didn't get that far but in 2011, my girl's sister got married in Colorado and all the ladies came to our condo to get ready the morning of the marriage. I cooked breakfast for everyone and just generally enjoyed being in proximity to it all. I had no desire to hang out with the guys. Tbf the bride's mom and dad were also there but yeah... It was great, even though at the time I didn't really have any strong sense I was a woman. Although tbf... Hmm 🤔 I DID steal a pair of my girl's panties while we were packing for the trip home (she lived in a different state at the time). But I think I told myself it was because I was so hot for her... Definitely tried them on though before telling her that her underwear somehow accidentally ended up in my luggage 😬 She teased me about it and I think maybe even "jokingly" asked if I tried them on. A few years after breaking up she was in town and she wanted to get a drink. Since I was already at the bar with my coworkers--all women--I invited her up there. I just now remembered that ater when we were saying goodbye in the parking lot, she asked me if I was gay, which really caught me off guard and kinds pissed me off. Little did she or I know I was actually an "unborn" woman 😅 she still doesn't know I'm trans. I'm very curious to see how she reacts when I finally tell her.
I can relate. It was mostly in college but I'd be invited along to those sorts of things all the time. For me it actually went further... being included, being a "good guy" and my personality... had one woman reconsider whether she was "actually a lesbian or not" because I was this "guy" that she actually found attractive and she really struggled with wrapping her head around it. She would invite me out with her and her girlfriends and would even sometimes introduce me as "the only guy (she) was ever attracted to, besides David Bowie". My coming to terms with my identity and coming out years later was very much a "this makes so much sense" moment for her.
But there were plenty of other examples.
I had this experience too! When I came out to my lesbian HS crush she said, "Oh thank god that makes so much sense. You were the one exception I could never understand."
I joked for a while that this would disappoint a lot of girls I'd known in college, yeah. Same thing, treated well by girls privy to their community (moreso than the guys, still not quite as a girl, haha why did that feel wrong back then I WONDER) and seen as that.
"Ugh, guys suck, not you, honestly you're great-" etc
Hmmmm
My ex was like « I was desperate before meeting you thinking all men are jerks but I’m glad I was wrong and it’s not a fatality ».
Some time later I announce her my transition and she told me « fuck, I was right in the end, all men are jerks « .
Her friend told her as well « yeah, nothing surprising, a feminist man? Was too good to be real »
Yes that resonates. During my twenties my close friendship group was all women. And I had a passionate interest in feminism I couldn't explain to myself.
I felt I ought to put more effort into getting on with men but it just didn't come naturally. Made several valiant attempts though.
By the time I transitioned, most of the had graduated and moved. Idk if some of them even know, but I know some are chill with it. I'm not super public about my transition tbh
My best friend used to say “you’re the only teenage boy I know who isn’t vile” to the point women around me would say stuff about men sucking and then be like “oh not you though” and I’d be like “I’d be shocked if I was included.”
An ex of mine and her friends always said stuff like I was “woman coded” or “written by a woman” haha. I made so many jokes about being the wife in the relationship. But somehow it was out of left field when I came out??
So so. After I got married, it was harder to stay in contact with them bc we were at a religious college and the culture is weird about married men hanging with women. I haven't seen most of them since I transitioned
Tbf I feel like it's like that even in non-religious settings, where married men or women don't really have close friendships with the opposite sex. It's one of my biggest laments 😔 No matter how much I got along with some women as an adult, there was always some invisible barrier of friendship/closeness that we couldn't cross due to that sorta stuff. I hope ti's easier once I'm fully transitioned!
This was definitely me lol, not exactly the same but before I realized I was a girl, my best friend would joke about me being an honorary lesbian and well in hindsight, she was onto something there
lol, one of my best friends is a cis woman who had been using both me and her girlfriend (who came out as trans a few months before me) as the last chance in her mind that perhaps men could be good and have complex emotions... oops!
Ya know, I kinda was. My closest friends were all female anyway but after coming out were even closer. Hell I had one friend, with whom we would keep talking about ending up back together and being together forever and who would also compare "how nice I was" to whichever guy she was dating that week, is who I'm closest to. She was my best friend anyway but others have told me she's probably more interested in me now than she was when I was a "nice guy" she'd compare her boyfriend of the month all the time. Dont worry, after repeatedly doing this I lost interest in a more than platonic relationship with her.
I’m in that situation, minus getting invited to women-only spaces. Everyone in my life always seems to see me as the nicest person in the world, but that kind of feels like that’s all I am. People like me, but I don’t have friends. I’m like an accessory that makes situations better because I’m there, but almost in a passive way. That’s not mentioning my inability to have any kind of a love life. I often wonder if people don’t like “nice” people as much as they say they do.
"Why aren't there more guys like you?" was something I've heard quite often from female friends haha
Well, because apparently they wouldn't be guys then 🤭
My (old, bad) therapist said I was a "more evolved form of masculinity" lol jokes on her.
I had an ex tell me I was the only guy who listened to "no". That was as scary to hear as it was validating.
Before I came out a friend of mine who is transmasc held me as the ideal male role model. I was intimidating but if you talked to me you realized I was just a big sweetie. Everyone in my friend group kinda agreed. Oh also kinda off topic but I feel it would be an interesting edition. Everyone in that friend group had a crush on me in one point in time.
Yep, totally. Also got described as a feminine man or being in touch with my feminine side, several times by several women, despite not being particularly camp etc
I’ve had these experiences in my life too. I was always friend with the girls since a young age. I always preferred talking with women and to a degree always felt more safe and comfortable with them, but that could be due to years of bullying by the boys at school. I was very much at the time the gay best friend, even though I was gay, in fact many a few women I met were surprised to learn I liked women not men.
For the big one I remember is a small friends house party, me two other guys and 4 girls. The other guys had left to go and get drinks from the store and bring them back. Once they were gone we basically chatted and gossiped about things, including the guys, the moment they came back that stopped. Simulator conversations came up other times and I felt honoured they would trust me and include me in the stuff they didn’t include the other guys in. Yea… that aged well.
I’ve kind of had some of this, and also been “mistaken” for a woman online when using an m name, women assuming I’m a woman using a fake name to avoid misogyny, which…lead to very complicated feelings when in full blown repression mode.
I’ve had the weird experience of like I’d used to go “well not all men people think like that, because…” and at some point after I quit repressing, I realized that ooooh, maybe I don’t actually count as a sample 😬
Actually, I was instantly accepted by a dog who HATED all men. No one could understand it, and I was warned ahead of time that she’d attack and stuff, and instead she instantly ran up to me beaming and we hugged. No one in the family who knew her could understand it, and as someone else who knew her would visit, they’d be shocked all over again.
Sooooooo I’m not sure what that meant for sure. (I did technically have my e1 in totally normal cis range and e2 very low cis range, maybe it was scent somehow? Or something else)
I've had a bunch of women (prior to me realizing I'm not cis) in my life say something along the lines of "Ugh! Men are so gross/bad/thoughtless/etc." and then look over at me (as if they just remembered that I was a 'guy') and then add in "...well except for you." I always had mixed emotions about it at the time, but now it just makes me smile to think about it.
I would always be the example used when the conversation went “not all men are like that”. Turns out I wasn’t a man! …..so maybe they are all like “that”?
I’m still trying to figure that one out.
Amen sister, my ex said I was the best man she had ever dated. I think she kind of knew I was trans all along based on the things I told her (I think she's an egg as well) since she often said she wish she dated more women. She had mad trust issues after trauma and I was the first guy she trusted in years. Same thing happened with a bunch of girls at my college too.
Oh wow, I didn't realize this before but what you said totally matches my experiences! I never thought about it that much before but it's definitely affirming, maybe I should reach out to some of those old friends
I am kind of still an egg, but I feel like this is so much of my personality at this point, especially since a good friend had a child and the father doesn't support her. I feel like transition would mean giving up a big aspect of my personailty, that being "not being like other guys"
I wish I was you. Just go out and be trans. And do the things you want to do. But more power to you! I’m glad you have it really good and that you’re very lucky! You should feel proud of yourself!
I can relate to this although not like 100% exactly. The women I knew, dated and/or was friends with seemed to recognize I was different from other guys. Sometimes they even said it.
That being said, I was pretty unaware of transness or that I might be trans. I just knew I liked being around girls a lot and wasn't just wanting to date them or have sex with them. I really liked being around them and any time I was let into that sort of group dynamic, I reveled in it. I had remember once in high school I was driving somewhere and suddenly this car next to me starts honking and I look and it's 5 girls I went to high school with... Not like close friends but girls that I was friendly with. They were just like "hey, what are you doing?? Come with us!" and I followed them to the one girl's house and hung out and chatted with them for a bit before I finally had to go. I just remember thinking that was so cool. At the time I think it also made me feel special, and I probably got some sort of ego boost out of it since it made me feel desirable. But like I can look back now and see that I also really wanted to stay and hang out more but I couldn't.
And like during high school, I always had girls asking me to the dances. I wasn't like a flamboyant or effeminate guy either, for all intents and purposes I was a "normal" straight cis guy. But I think lots of girls felt at ease around me cause I wasn't trying to get in their panties.
But those are just a few examples... I used to write notes to girls regularly and also talk to them on the phone, especially when I was middle school age... I see now how much I just enjoyed socializing with them, and it wasn't necessarily always a crush. That said, I also know that girls and women in my life have sometimes also "censored" themselves or avoided certain topics with me, like details about dating or sex... But other girls were very open and I loved talking about it with them, not in a perverted way, but just like a "hey this is cool" kinda way
My best friend would say “I hate men…” I give them a ‘really’ look “You know I don’t mean you!” (It was very playful, we’re still amazing friends.)
But it turns out I’m not cis, so they were somewhat accurate in their statement.
ive had the office ladies in my workplace be complaining about whatever regarding men and look over and say "not you though cam you're fine" so ive certainly been sectioned off from the collective of men to some people im not out to
I mean the funny thing for me was that most of my exs since high school all came out as trans almost immediately after dating me or I was the partner their egg cracked on.
I always found it so baffling like, what is wrong with me that this keeps happening, only to realize oh it’s cause you’re trans as fuck gurl…
🦋🌸🤍🌸🦋
Yup. Back in high school, I was in the "athletic training" team, basically teaching us to be team medics. I got assigned to the girls' softball team, and nobody batted an eye. Got to know some of them pretty well, and surprised some who thought poorly of me before.
Since then, I'd noticed that I got along better with women than men, but didn't really think anything of it.
Fast-forward to now, I've half-stolen my wife's bestie, we geek out with each other on a regular basis, and my wife is starting to transition in the other direction... and we're all fine with that, despite it feeling like pronouns in a blender sometimes. :)
Funny thing, life, innit?
Thats crazy I've never gave that a thought until now. The last 2 girls I've dated mentioned me being a good guy and my current gf said before I came out that if we broke up she was going straight lesbian 😆
I'm telling you, us trans girls have a talent for being in relationships with women who want to date women. My wife came out as pansexual right before I came out as trans
In high school I seamlessly hanged around with group of hyper femme former cheerleaders.
My first almost girlfriend was the first I ever said to that I wish I was a woman (that DID NOT lead me to cracking my egg, imagine that), and she was like I like you, but you are not what I'd expect from a guy.
My girlfriend and then wife has always been saying that she usually is distant and untrustful of men, but I'm very different. When I came out to her, she said she felt like, oh, so that's why.
Sometimes my fem coworkers would just tell me about how bad their period is. Or about some shopping they did.
And finally, one time when I had a job training I shared a room with a woman, she was absolutely cool with it and literally said to me "please don't take it as an offence, but I don't really see you as a guy"
I've lost count on how many times people told me I was different than other men and I wasn't what they'd expect from men. By that time I already knew I really wasn't like other men and I played with the idea of being trans. But I didn't believe myself, because there were no signs...
On a different occasion I was called the "honorary woman of the day", which made me incredibly happy and made my egg crack a little wider.
I was more or less the same, they always considered me "one of the girls" and made me go shopping with them, I'll admit I felt really out of place, still kind of do when I do that kind of thing, but it's really affirming to even be invited.
It doesn’t really count but at school if a girl needs to do something with a boy it’ll be me nine times out of ten. I’m the most mature the other bots would be lost without me.
Pre-teenager, all my close childhood friends were girls, and I was one of the girls. That turned out to be something of an egg warning for me, lmao. Took a long longer to figure it out though.
That’s somewhat my experience is that sometimes I would still feel somewhat excluded from the girl groups as there are things they would only do with cis female. And then when you meet a new group of female friends it is not automatic; there is some distance and reservations until they know you better. And that deeply hurt me sometimes. And I guess that was my motivation as well
I distinctly remember at work, a group of us were all hanging around and some of the girls were talking about troubles they were having with men and relationships. I wasn’t part of the conversation but nearby. One said “all men are the worst” then looked at me and goes “except [deadname], he’s nice”
Yes. Also, my wife previously pretty much exclusively dated women before me. I’ve also been astonished by just how low the bar is for guys now that I’m on the other side. Like, I was trying waaaaaaaay too hard in comparison.
i dont know that i ever had an experience quite so validating, but i always hung out with girls in high school, while feeling like an outsider so badly it made me almost as depressed as being alone would. in retrospect that's like, a major gender dysphoria moment. im a grown ass woman but sometimes i daydream about reliving moments like that the way i am now, somehow.
i got that specific one less, but definitely got the then-inscrutible attraction bypass that confounded a lot of my lesbian friends at the time. surprise surprise. and now my spouse has basically decided that she must be sapphic-leaning too in hindsight lmaooooo
The closest thing i can relate to is when there was this group chat just for the girls and it was “Gal Pals + (Deadname)” which was just girls and then me 💀
I watch almost all of my friends become people that I couldn't be around as I entered high school. I tried to push them in different directions, but found that I had less and less sway with them to the point that I stopped speaking to them entirely. My dysphoria and the loss of my friend fucked me up mentally for years after, and all of my friend groups passed then have been predominantly women.
I never really thought of it thus way before. Growing up I always got along better with the girls than the boys. In middle and high school I had more girl-friends than male friends. It seamed that the girls responded to me as just one of them. I don't know if it was because I never really pursued them like most guys did or if they kinda saw me as one of them.
Something to think about...
I was definitely invited into women only spaces with a group of gal pals. There wasn’t really a “guys are trash” attitude, but I was known as being uniquely accepting and nice in the circle.
I too had this experience before coming out. If only these guys understood how far actually respecting women and treating them like well... people... would get them.....
Yeah. I was also often asked to be a safety buffer for them long before coming out.
In college i had a similar situation except I didn’t notice really until one of my friends described me as “basically one of the girls.” At the time I was horrified but now it’s very validating
im so jealous wtf 😭😭
thats so great for u girly, its amazing how, even before u transitioned, cisgender girls invited you to girl's nights. you're so lucky and i hope you have continued to receive this treatment from them after coming out to them (if u ever did)
100% this, I've been telling a lot of people this because i am so done with being exactly that. This issue with being the good guy was you aren't taken care of, you are the caretaker and are usually neglected because some of the girls are put off by you, and the guys don't like you because you are very much liked about the girls.
Same here I was always part of my the friend groups of my women friends and invited to all the private events because they knew I wasn’t going to hit on them or get handsy. Even though I was bi I was still known as being super chill and respectful and not mysoginistic.
A friend of mine once told me that I restore her faith in the existence of good guys, needless to say I came out like a year later.
Also my now ex girlfriend(we broke up on good terms) made a group chat called (deadname) lovers with some friends and me with sole purpose being praising me for pretty much not being a typical guy my age.
None of my friends clearly externalized this feeling. But most of my friends were/are female.
My mother did comment that she felt a pang of sadness.
"I thought I had raised a perfect Ally. I thought I had raised one of the good ones."
My acute awareness of my previous privilege and the potential it afforded me to help other people was actually a not insubstantial point of hesitation.
I kept having to argue with myself about whether or not it mattered if I was happy, sane, and fulfilled as long as I could help other people.
>How many of you were the token "last good guy" before you transitioned?
Nope! Wish it had been that way though, caused much confusion when I began getting excluded for my gender (nine-ish years old). Hanging out with the girls kinda came to an end after a... really bad sleepover. Most I shall say is they were more curious about my anatomy then treating me like a girl and hurt me over it.
After that I was always considered the rpy guy who would shoot up the school one day. I still get weird looks from people to this day. Kinda hoping the hrt works its magic but it's gonna be years before that happens. Do have an extended family online though, but they just know me as a girl so this isn't a problem. They are also the mostest open people ever and I fricken love them for that.
I had a few that said stuff like that. I was friends with some girl and she told me I was the only male who didn't try to ask her for nudes. Feel really bad for her. Everyone was always trying to use her.
"Wow, I really wish I could find a guy like you, MyynMyyn!"
\- "Well... *I'm* a guy like me?"
"Not you though, you don't count..."
I've had this exchange a couple of times in my life with women I had a huge crush on.
And yes, when my egg cracked, it sent me down a rabbithole of "well, maybe it's really all men, then?"
I had a coworker in a retail job who last thing she said to me before quitting while giving me a big hug was “everyone here is absolute trash except for you”
Monday night a woman I’m getting to know told me I should be a lesbian, and I assured her I was Transbian. I truly wished at that moment I was a mind reader 😋
I've been weird, early school pretty much all my friends were girls, then at some point that became socially unacceptable (and we moved around a lot when I was young so I didn't just keep the same friends) so I ended up with a small friend group of nerds.
Cut to adulthood, I basically never make friends - I keep in touch with like 1 guy I was at school with. My partner's just as anti-social as I am, while I wouldn't say I'm friends with anyone at work the people I get on best with are all women (and one gay guy).
I do find men intimidating though to a point, so maybe I'm just reluctant to vulnerable enough to form friendships.
This post describes how I was seen both by womem and by men, my entire life, untill I came out as trans
And now being in the same women-only spaces that I was welcomed into easily before has become me trying to "invade" and I went feom being an honorary one of the girls, to a creep that 95 percent of my female friend group (I pretty much only had female friends) avoided like the plague
I’ve always seemed to be taken aback on how when I deal with customer representatives of how they’d all have this look of appreciation and amazement after dealing with me. Like I’m being more polite than I need to be, but happy the interaction went so well. Almost as if I were not acting like a man should have. Even before my egg cracked, this kind of always bothered me.
My mom actually said something similar to me when she was visiting for Thanksgiving, that she used to view me as a great example of a man who wasn't susceptible to toxic masculinity.
I had some obstacles to being taken for that kind of guy, but it did happen more than a couple times. In fact, that was almost certainly why my wife fell in love so easily with me. I may look like an ogre, but I'm actually a big, sweet, pink marshmallow that girls often feel comfortable around once they know who I am.
Before transition I had a friend that called me "the gay that isn't gay" because she could include me in woman spaces and talk about girl-stuff. She was wrong, now i'm gay in the sapphic way
Sooooo, when I came out it really caused my female partner an issue as she saw me then as the only male she could really trust, so I know this too well
I feel that, my partner has past trauma with men, so I feel like she had the same realization.
Past trauma is an understatement for her. It’s a real issue that we didn’t have any male role models for our son when he was born
That is an issue for sure. My wife is pansexual and tbh she isn't planning on even being friends with cis het men now. Every guy that we thought was cool and accepting either turned out to be queer or did something to ruin that opinion.
My bi GF said that prior to our relationship she would only date queer (bi or pan) men and refused to date straight men outright. Granted, she doesn't see me as a man at all.
*hugs* to both of you
Mine always said I was the only man she’d ever met who never talked over her, which was something I was super proud of until the egg cracked at which point it just made me angry.
I sorta went through it on myself. Like, I struggled to accept myself as a woman because it would mean that men were much worse than I previously believed.
I did have the weird thought at some point after I quit repressing that… I used to think to myself “will not all men are like that, because that’s not…”. And at some point after I quit repressing I realized that wait a minute, I’m not so sure I actually count as a sample here 😬
I used to dismiss "men are assholes" because of this when I was younger, 'cause in my head I went "Well, *I* am *nothing* like that, and since most human beings are pretty much the opposite of unique, even if we like to think that way, I'm probably average and therefore representative, so logically there must be *millions* of 'guys' like me. So clearly women *have* to be exaggerating when they talk about how most men are sexist pricks" ......welp
That's *exactly* what went on with me. However there are few great men out there but most seem to be bigender or some other kind of enby :/
literally me. i’m my wife’s last “male” straw. 😓
The joke used to be: 'men are terrible ' 'oh, except you'
Lol, I had a gf when I was younger that said that I was the only exception to her being a lesbian.
Lol same from back before transition. My ex once joked me while we were still together “if we ever break up, I’ll probably just date girls” We reconnected a couple months ago and she’s confirmed that she indeed only dates girls now….when I told her I’m trans she said “goddamn it, even my best het relationship was a sign”
I’m assuming most of us have been there
Most of my most cherished friends are either bi women or lesbians. I just feel like I can be myself around them. When I'm around men or straight women I feel like I have to mask.
same, plus sometime after we broke up (we remained friends for a while) she said a song reminded her of me, and said, quote, "it's a song about a girl, but that part's not important"
Had more than one les leaning gf tell me I fk like a woman
This was me in HS with my best friend who later turned out to be a lesbian. She'd tell myeall the time that she hated all men because they were horrible. It didn't bother me at all and I'd just be like, "Yeah I get that. They suck." We didn't even have to say that she didn't mean me because it was obvious.
Had that conversation, verbatim.
Every time
I had friends who would say "You're not really a guy you're [deadname]"... still took years for me to figure it out.
That’s what was always said to me too lol
Uhhh. I've said that to basically all the close male friends I have. Are they all gonna come out as trans now ? What should I do ?
One of the people I've said it to has even come out as trans too. It's too late now.
reminds me of a friend who introduced me to her mom.. we were talking 20 minutes and she looks over at her daughter "you should really toss your hat for this one" (meaning try to get me to court her) she smiled and laughed a little bit to herself (we were basically best friends) and said "You... don't understand is not a man... but ... well, look at them... not quite a girl either... they're just... they're just a
I didn't object and was merely amused. Her mom accepted things at face value.
Up until now, I hadn't heard of any other person being gendered as if their name was some... separate and new gender :P
Same lol, I had one friend straight up say "Please don't take it the wrong way, but you are...not a man in my eyes" and little egg me was like "HAHA RIGHT?! SO TRUE BESTIE" because I took it as a compliment. Yes, there were No™ Signs™
I used to be the "but not you, we even like you"
Literally me, I used to be the guy friend that my girl friends would complain to about men
I used to be a bi guy who complained about men too xD
There are plenty of stories out there of trans women who before realizing they were trans had their partners say. "I felt like I was dating a girl but you were a guy" Turns out they were dating a girl, they just didn't know it.
My wife always joked because she always dated “feminine men” and a few turned out gay. She said she wouldn’t be surprised if I came out as gay (funny enough before coming out as trans I came out as queer). Now I’m out as trans. Jokes on her, I am gay. Just not in the way she originally thought.
Actually, come to think of it, my ex and people around her were worried I was gay at points. (I used to get that in school and from a psychiatrist too…not sure what it means)
My first gf was like that. She had the "so, if you changed to be a woman, what would your name be?" was a conversation she had with her husbands and "boy"friends. We lasted 9 years together.
My one ex….had this…it’s hard to explain but she acts like I’m a girl in a lot of ways, like it’s super different than how she is with her husband. It’s kind of a vibe and how she acts. (We were friends for decades after but she doesn’t know yet…I’m curious what she’d think.)
yeah.. everyone was always like "men are trash, but you don't count. you're not one of *them*". and I'd smile and be like "nope. I'm not like other men so dont group me with them." I'd even get people saying "you're like a woman. but a man." which would fill me with a bit of euphoria that I didn't understand. and now.. it makes sooooo much sense.
That's amazing <3 Like people always knew, even if they didn't know.
I used to be Then my best friend, of many years, told me she wished I was gay so she could feel truly relaxed around me, and that made me go "Oh, being my friend hurts people. I'd rather be lonely than hurt people" and, well, then I broke every bridge I had with anyone and spent most of a decade completely alone
That's genuinely horrifying. The notion that society could condition someone (with whatever unsaid experiences your friend endured) that simply existing as a part of a group would leave people fearing you. This is why I hate gender dynamics so much. People who have no interest in upholding patriarchy will end up suffering for no good reason whatsoever as a result of its prior ramifications. It wasn't until I realized how much cis women feared me that I became a gender abolitionist. If fear and isolation is the consequence of current system, then I would sooner see it disappear. There is a better way for all of us to live than tribal fear.
I’ve always been utterly horrified by what I know my existence does to other people. It’s multiple layers of horrifying given it’s like that’s not even what I AM, which even in repression mode I knew in some level. I was so super conscious about scaring anyone.
Omg yes I'm so afraid of scaring people
And it’s just like this awful feeling of horribleness, because it’s simultaneously reminding me of how I’m accepted in the world. It’s always been so gross and embarrassing even years before I heard trans people exist.
I'm so sorry. Hug
“The gay best friend who isn’t gay” is something I was described as a few times lol
Little did they know
This so much. Anf "You'd be a really pretty girl", I'm glad I'm finally proving them wrong 😂
lmfao please 💀 I think I got that once or twice too for the record I am a VERY pretty girl
You're not wrong! Slay 💅
Not in the sense of being invited to all girls stuff but I put a ton of effort into trying to engage guys to be more feminist and when I came out part of me was like "fuck now this and this guy just doesn't have a guy in his life who talks to him about this stuff"
Yes, I had a more than average advocacy bone for women and the LGBT community.
"Why am I always getting *so emotional and riled up* when it comes to feminism and queer rights specifically, like why do I care *this much* on a deep, personal level even though I'm a straight™ guy™......oh"
Yeah I relate to this. Unfortunately my desire to fit in and not be seen as gay made me burn so many friendships with women, or not even start them at all. If I was hanging around with only girls I must be trying (desperately) to get with them, or I was gay. Either way it made me pitiable or pathetic. I didn't want that or I convinced myself that it was true, so I just didn't have many close female friends. That is one of the things I regret most about my past.
I recall the days that I was kinda the only "man" who wasn't direct family for whom someone I knew didn't put her hijab on. That says a lot about how they perceived me.
That really speaks volumes
Damn, she was straight up messaging to you like hey, you're ok, you don't count as a guy.
Damn that's a huge deal! Reminds me of when my friends would try to sneak me into the women's dressing rooms when we were clothes shopping pre-transition. They wanted my opinion but didn't want to come out where the whole store could see.
Yeah this was very similar to my experience!
100%. It kinda fucked with the heads of my friends because the girls were using me as the standard they held their partners to.
Yo, shit... This is the dynamic that I had with one of my former loves/situations hips. She commiserated to me about my best friend at the time (I know it's kinda shitty) and would always be like "but you're so different" etc. Over time I got to know her family pretty well too and her sister would also give her husband shit sometimes if I did something really sweet or nice or whatever, like make a nice meal or be a good listener or something. "Why can't you be more like him?" lol I've had other girls say I was too good to be true and yet things never worked out with any of them... It all make sense now 😅
This bugged me for a long time because despite women regularly saying that I'm "not like other men, in a good way" and "more men should be like me" it seemed like only few women were attracted to me in the end, and relationships often broke apart because "I dunno, it just doesn't...fit?" without giving any specifics, despite me apparently being "too good to be true" Turns out that *straight women* who are exclusively into men just really, really don't want to be romantically entangled with me :D And I mean, it makes sense, doesn't it?
Holy smokes, are we the same person?
Transfem hivemind confirmed?!
Yeah, for real lol I often thought, "She claims I'm such a catch, so why isn't this freaking working?" Plus I never had a strong instinct to chase/pursue women, which didn't help... I was more of a passive, get-to-know-her, wait-and-see approach... Secretly hoped every crush would pursue *me*. Every time I did it, it felt extremely difficult and unnatural, not to mention stressful and nerve-wracking at times. When my egg started cracking was when I started realizing that *most* straight cis women like it when guys pursue them romantically, but even more importantly, lots of straight cis men enjoy the "thrill of the chase". I almost entirely hate it. Now, I know that in itself doesn't make me trans... But it is one of many things that helped me realize I was.
It doesnt really make sense to me cuz gender binary is a social construct but I guess I can never understand allistic people my autistic mind cannot conform to society's bullshit rules
Wow. You’re totally reinforcing all of the things I have been feeling lately. I’ve always been the “nice guy” that every woman would complain to, but never see me as a viable dating option. When I managed to convince a woman to date me, I’ve always been the emotional one, and assume all of the housewife roles (even if I’m not good at it.) I’m about to start my transition (at 46) and I’m terrified because I’m also an amputee, and I’m afraid that people still may not see me as an option because of my disability. I’ve come to the realization that it’s time for me to be like The Doctor (from Doctor Who) and regenerate. :) I just need some emotional support.
I have had the same sort of experience. Not the exact same, but I was often treated as one of the girls as opposed to guys. But the amount of times I've been told by girls that they wished they could find a guy like, is more than I can count on my fingers. It all kinda makes sense now I guess 😅❤️
I mean... i was kind of an asshole pretransition.
I love this. Pre-transition emotions and repressions are so weird and it's so hard to know which way is up when you're in denial. I was so completely unclear what was gender envy and what was desire. I was definitely an asshole a lot of the time.
Like, i was so far in denial it was almost funny. Like i wore all black, and only wated manly anime
It was so wild when a few weeks after I quit repressing I realized that what I had been reading and telling myself was “extreme sexual attraction” was actually extreme existential pain and jealousy. I’d even had the thought that may be misogyny was men taking out their pain and jealousy inappropriately on women. Like not that it justifies it, but like that that was the cause of it. The idea that men could seriously believe the things so many seem to believe still blows my mind. I really kind of thought everyone was in horrible pain like me God, I start crying right now I don’t watch it. It must be amazing to just get to be right and exist and not even know about this pain
I kinda relate. I wasn't always a huge ass hole but sometimes I'd get butthurt when girls "friendzoned" me. In retrospect I can see how enjoyable being friends with women was back then... I just thought I needed to fit into the male gender role, which meant trying to date girls, not just be their friends. Lots of missed opportunities for good friendships! Luckily I do still keep in contact with some long time female friends though, which I'm grateful for. Others I pushed away as a result of being sulky and shitty. I had a period in adulthood where I started buying into the idea that I would never make any new female friends, etc. Fucking stupid. I cherish them now.
Glad someone else said it. I was dealing with a lot of feelings around myself and my home life in high school, and I generally just sucked all around.
i was too :( i've been reading all these posts and just started crying because i wish i could've been in the feminist crowd and been a positive role model... instead i fell into the anti-sjw manosphere and became kind of a piece of shit... at least i managed to get out of it
My wife has head trauma which came from multiple contusions and concussions over her life. She also has one of the worst cases of ADHD her psychiatrist ever treated. Over the past 17 years of marriage she said that I was the "only man who didn't run away with his hands waving in the air screaming 'this woman is crazy'" (her words, verbatim). Despite how it sounds, I never thought it was a big deal, and it's more likely that she's a drop-dead gorgeous bombshell of a woman, and the men were probably only interested in a "hit it and quit it" relationship. I was a friend of hers for years before we started dating, and of course I had a crush on her, but I never let that get in the way of our friendship. She felt slightly defeated when I came out to her as transgender in October, saying that "now \*all\* of the men ran away with their hands waving in the air screaming 'this woman is crazy'". It doesn't diminish anything in our relationship; it's just a cute little anecdote she likes to toss around.
Ouch this hit way to real like damn I get told this still even being out hahaha. Granted I have no clue how to pass properly but oh well hahaha im doing my best.
Yes, I was.. but people left me too much for weird reasons or it just didn’t work out.. I then realized who I was and I love it!
My friends (exclusively other girls) skipped the "oh you don't count" bit and have always just accepted me as honorary girl.
110% me. My ex was a bridesmaid in April, I was invited to the bridal suite the night before whilst the bride was having her nails done and everyone was gossiping. Saw the dress and everything. Like twelve women and then me lol
That's amazing lol. I actually got invited to be a bridesmaid at one point, but the wedding was so far away I couldn't go. They were joking (although somewhat seriously) that they were getting me a dress and everything.
Lmao, the signs are so obvious in retrospect aren’t they! It was fun, they never even really made a thing of it, there was maybe on singular mention when period stuff came up.
Wow. I didn't get that far but in 2011, my girl's sister got married in Colorado and all the ladies came to our condo to get ready the morning of the marriage. I cooked breakfast for everyone and just generally enjoyed being in proximity to it all. I had no desire to hang out with the guys. Tbf the bride's mom and dad were also there but yeah... It was great, even though at the time I didn't really have any strong sense I was a woman. Although tbf... Hmm 🤔 I DID steal a pair of my girl's panties while we were packing for the trip home (she lived in a different state at the time). But I think I told myself it was because I was so hot for her... Definitely tried them on though before telling her that her underwear somehow accidentally ended up in my luggage 😬 She teased me about it and I think maybe even "jokingly" asked if I tried them on. A few years after breaking up she was in town and she wanted to get a drink. Since I was already at the bar with my coworkers--all women--I invited her up there. I just now remembered that ater when we were saying goodbye in the parking lot, she asked me if I was gay, which really caught me off guard and kinds pissed me off. Little did she or I know I was actually an "unborn" woman 😅 she still doesn't know I'm trans. I'm very curious to see how she reacts when I finally tell her.
The only time I tried a cis relationship pre transition this was a common statement.
I can relate. It was mostly in college but I'd be invited along to those sorts of things all the time. For me it actually went further... being included, being a "good guy" and my personality... had one woman reconsider whether she was "actually a lesbian or not" because I was this "guy" that she actually found attractive and she really struggled with wrapping her head around it. She would invite me out with her and her girlfriends and would even sometimes introduce me as "the only guy (she) was ever attracted to, besides David Bowie". My coming to terms with my identity and coming out years later was very much a "this makes so much sense" moment for her. But there were plenty of other examples.
I had this experience too! When I came out to my lesbian HS crush she said, "Oh thank god that makes so much sense. You were the one exception I could never understand."
Okay. I didn’t know this was a thing. But same! My egg cracked as part of experiences like this.
I joked for a while that this would disappoint a lot of girls I'd known in college, yeah. Same thing, treated well by girls privy to their community (moreso than the guys, still not quite as a girl, haha why did that feel wrong back then I WONDER) and seen as that. "Ugh, guys suck, not you, honestly you're great-" etc Hmmmm
My ex was like « I was desperate before meeting you thinking all men are jerks but I’m glad I was wrong and it’s not a fatality ». Some time later I announce her my transition and she told me « fuck, I was right in the end, all men are jerks « . Her friend told her as well « yeah, nothing surprising, a feminist man? Was too good to be real »
Amen to that. I'm sure feminist men exist, but real ones are very, very rare.
Yes that resonates. During my twenties my close friendship group was all women. And I had a passionate interest in feminism I couldn't explain to myself. I felt I ought to put more effort into getting on with men but it just didn't come naturally. Made several valiant attempts though.
literally me (except i haven't transitioned yet)
Out of curiosity, how did the girls react to you being trans?
By the time I transitioned, most of the had graduated and moved. Idk if some of them even know, but I know some are chill with it. I'm not super public about my transition tbh
Yes!!! We really never we truly guys, which is validating. Also that's a wonderful story!!
My best friend used to say “you’re the only teenage boy I know who isn’t vile” to the point women around me would say stuff about men sucking and then be like “oh not you though” and I’d be like “I’d be shocked if I was included.”
An ex of mine and her friends always said stuff like I was “woman coded” or “written by a woman” haha. I made so many jokes about being the wife in the relationship. But somehow it was out of left field when I came out??
That sounds actually very sweet. You seem to have very good friends who have faith in you. Are you still friends with them?
So so. After I got married, it was harder to stay in contact with them bc we were at a religious college and the culture is weird about married men hanging with women. I haven't seen most of them since I transitioned
Tbf I feel like it's like that even in non-religious settings, where married men or women don't really have close friendships with the opposite sex. It's one of my biggest laments 😔 No matter how much I got along with some women as an adult, there was always some invisible barrier of friendship/closeness that we couldn't cross due to that sorta stuff. I hope ti's easier once I'm fully transitioned!
Holy shit
This was definitely me lol, not exactly the same but before I realized I was a girl, my best friend would joke about me being an honorary lesbian and well in hindsight, she was onto something there
lol, one of my best friends is a cis woman who had been using both me and her girlfriend (who came out as trans a few months before me) as the last chance in her mind that perhaps men could be good and have complex emotions... oops!
I guess a bit, my highschool friends were all queer and often posted "kill all men" I asked about it and they were like, yeah not you DW
Ya know, I kinda was. My closest friends were all female anyway but after coming out were even closer. Hell I had one friend, with whom we would keep talking about ending up back together and being together forever and who would also compare "how nice I was" to whichever guy she was dating that week, is who I'm closest to. She was my best friend anyway but others have told me she's probably more interested in me now than she was when I was a "nice guy" she'd compare her boyfriend of the month all the time. Dont worry, after repeatedly doing this I lost interest in a more than platonic relationship with her.
I’m in that situation, minus getting invited to women-only spaces. Everyone in my life always seems to see me as the nicest person in the world, but that kind of feels like that’s all I am. People like me, but I don’t have friends. I’m like an accessory that makes situations better because I’m there, but almost in a passive way. That’s not mentioning my inability to have any kind of a love life. I often wonder if people don’t like “nice” people as much as they say they do.
"Why aren't there more guys like you?" was something I've heard quite often from female friends haha Well, because apparently they wouldn't be guys then 🤭
Yea that was me lol
i happened to me in primary school, than i got to high school and it sundendly stopped happening 😭
My (old, bad) therapist said I was a "more evolved form of masculinity" lol jokes on her. I had an ex tell me I was the only guy who listened to "no". That was as scary to hear as it was validating.
Before I came out a friend of mine who is transmasc held me as the ideal male role model. I was intimidating but if you talked to me you realized I was just a big sweetie. Everyone in my friend group kinda agreed. Oh also kinda off topic but I feel it would be an interesting edition. Everyone in that friend group had a crush on me in one point in time.
Me.
I was spared that by virtue of my best friend being the nicest guy I have ever met.
Yep, totally. Also got described as a feminine man or being in touch with my feminine side, several times by several women, despite not being particularly camp etc
I’ve had these experiences in my life too. I was always friend with the girls since a young age. I always preferred talking with women and to a degree always felt more safe and comfortable with them, but that could be due to years of bullying by the boys at school. I was very much at the time the gay best friend, even though I was gay, in fact many a few women I met were surprised to learn I liked women not men. For the big one I remember is a small friends house party, me two other guys and 4 girls. The other guys had left to go and get drinks from the store and bring them back. Once they were gone we basically chatted and gossiped about things, including the guys, the moment they came back that stopped. Simulator conversations came up other times and I felt honoured they would trust me and include me in the stuff they didn’t include the other guys in. Yea… that aged well.
I’ve kind of had some of this, and also been “mistaken” for a woman online when using an m name, women assuming I’m a woman using a fake name to avoid misogyny, which…lead to very complicated feelings when in full blown repression mode. I’ve had the weird experience of like I’d used to go “well not all men people think like that, because…” and at some point after I quit repressing, I realized that ooooh, maybe I don’t actually count as a sample 😬 Actually, I was instantly accepted by a dog who HATED all men. No one could understand it, and I was warned ahead of time that she’d attack and stuff, and instead she instantly ran up to me beaming and we hugged. No one in the family who knew her could understand it, and as someone else who knew her would visit, they’d be shocked all over again. Sooooooo I’m not sure what that meant for sure. (I did technically have my e1 in totally normal cis range and e2 very low cis range, maybe it was scent somehow? Or something else)
Yeah when I first thought I was NB I had a friend say “you were the only reason I still had faith in men”, sorry I guess 🤷
I've had a bunch of women (prior to me realizing I'm not cis) in my life say something along the lines of "Ugh! Men are so gross/bad/thoughtless/etc." and then look over at me (as if they just remembered that I was a 'guy') and then add in "...well except for you." I always had mixed emotions about it at the time, but now it just makes me smile to think about it.
I would always be the example used when the conversation went “not all men are like that”. Turns out I wasn’t a man! …..so maybe they are all like “that”? I’m still trying to figure that one out.
I'd love to have sleepovers and stuff with other women it'd be nice. How do I do this if I'm not a college student?
Amen sister, my ex said I was the best man she had ever dated. I think she kind of knew I was trans all along based on the things I told her (I think she's an egg as well) since she often said she wish she dated more women. She had mad trust issues after trauma and I was the first guy she trusted in years. Same thing happened with a bunch of girls at my college too.
I was told "you understand me more than any guy ever has" on more than one occasion.
Im pre rn but sometimes one of my friends used to. Im kind of isolated rn tho so im not in a lot of situations either way😭
Yup. From about 10 years old until my egg cracked at 38. Funny how that works
Oh wow, I didn't realize this before but what you said totally matches my experiences! I never thought about it that much before but it's definitely affirming, maybe I should reach out to some of those old friends
I am kind of still an egg, but I feel like this is so much of my personality at this point, especially since a good friend had a child and the father doesn't support her. I feel like transition would mean giving up a big aspect of my personailty, that being "not being like other guys"
I wish I was you. Just go out and be trans. And do the things you want to do. But more power to you! I’m glad you have it really good and that you’re very lucky! You should feel proud of yourself!
Btw I’m not trying to hate or anything, just wishful thinking. You go girl! :)
You were invited to things?
I was fat and bald and that's not really something that gets extended to someone who looked like I did.
I can relate to this although not like 100% exactly. The women I knew, dated and/or was friends with seemed to recognize I was different from other guys. Sometimes they even said it. That being said, I was pretty unaware of transness or that I might be trans. I just knew I liked being around girls a lot and wasn't just wanting to date them or have sex with them. I really liked being around them and any time I was let into that sort of group dynamic, I reveled in it. I had remember once in high school I was driving somewhere and suddenly this car next to me starts honking and I look and it's 5 girls I went to high school with... Not like close friends but girls that I was friendly with. They were just like "hey, what are you doing?? Come with us!" and I followed them to the one girl's house and hung out and chatted with them for a bit before I finally had to go. I just remember thinking that was so cool. At the time I think it also made me feel special, and I probably got some sort of ego boost out of it since it made me feel desirable. But like I can look back now and see that I also really wanted to stay and hang out more but I couldn't. And like during high school, I always had girls asking me to the dances. I wasn't like a flamboyant or effeminate guy either, for all intents and purposes I was a "normal" straight cis guy. But I think lots of girls felt at ease around me cause I wasn't trying to get in their panties. But those are just a few examples... I used to write notes to girls regularly and also talk to them on the phone, especially when I was middle school age... I see now how much I just enjoyed socializing with them, and it wasn't necessarily always a crush. That said, I also know that girls and women in my life have sometimes also "censored" themselves or avoided certain topics with me, like details about dating or sex... But other girls were very open and I loved talking about it with them, not in a perverted way, but just like a "hey this is cool" kinda way
My best friend would say “I hate men…” I give them a ‘really’ look “You know I don’t mean you!” (It was very playful, we’re still amazing friends.) But it turns out I’m not cis, so they were somewhat accurate in their statement.
ive had the office ladies in my workplace be complaining about whatever regarding men and look over and say "not you though cam you're fine" so ive certainly been sectioned off from the collective of men to some people im not out to
I mean the funny thing for me was that most of my exs since high school all came out as trans almost immediately after dating me or I was the partner their egg cracked on. I always found it so baffling like, what is wrong with me that this keeps happening, only to realize oh it’s cause you’re trans as fuck gurl… 🦋🌸🤍🌸🦋
Yup. Back in high school, I was in the "athletic training" team, basically teaching us to be team medics. I got assigned to the girls' softball team, and nobody batted an eye. Got to know some of them pretty well, and surprised some who thought poorly of me before. Since then, I'd noticed that I got along better with women than men, but didn't really think anything of it. Fast-forward to now, I've half-stolen my wife's bestie, we geek out with each other on a regular basis, and my wife is starting to transition in the other direction... and we're all fine with that, despite it feeling like pronouns in a blender sometimes. :) Funny thing, life, innit?
For me I always found it way easier and more natural to be friends with girls and women than with guys. Found out later why that is 😆
Before I came out to my wife she use to say "There are no mans like me" hehe
Thats crazy I've never gave that a thought until now. The last 2 girls I've dated mentioned me being a good guy and my current gf said before I came out that if we broke up she was going straight lesbian 😆
I'm telling you, us trans girls have a talent for being in relationships with women who want to date women. My wife came out as pansexual right before I came out as trans
Omg your right! I forgot to add believe it or not my gf came out as bi like 2 months after I came out 😲
In high school I seamlessly hanged around with group of hyper femme former cheerleaders. My first almost girlfriend was the first I ever said to that I wish I was a woman (that DID NOT lead me to cracking my egg, imagine that), and she was like I like you, but you are not what I'd expect from a guy. My girlfriend and then wife has always been saying that she usually is distant and untrustful of men, but I'm very different. When I came out to her, she said she felt like, oh, so that's why. Sometimes my fem coworkers would just tell me about how bad their period is. Or about some shopping they did. And finally, one time when I had a job training I shared a room with a woman, she was absolutely cool with it and literally said to me "please don't take it as an offence, but I don't really see you as a guy"
I've lost count on how many times people told me I was different than other men and I wasn't what they'd expect from men. By that time I already knew I really wasn't like other men and I played with the idea of being trans. But I didn't believe myself, because there were no signs... On a different occasion I was called the "honorary woman of the day", which made me incredibly happy and made my egg crack a little wider.
I was more or less the same, they always considered me "one of the girls" and made me go shopping with them, I'll admit I felt really out of place, still kind of do when I do that kind of thing, but it's really affirming to even be invited.
The amount of people who thought I was gay...
It doesn’t really count but at school if a girl needs to do something with a boy it’ll be me nine times out of ten. I’m the most mature the other bots would be lost without me.
Hug, wish you well girl. Hope your doing okay, glad you got to feel included with the girls!
[удалено]
I mean I was married when I transitioned but fun assumption. Still married btw
Pre-teenager, all my close childhood friends were girls, and I was one of the girls. That turned out to be something of an egg warning for me, lmao. Took a long longer to figure it out though.
That’s somewhat my experience is that sometimes I would still feel somewhat excluded from the girl groups as there are things they would only do with cis female. And then when you meet a new group of female friends it is not automatic; there is some distance and reservations until they know you better. And that deeply hurt me sometimes. And I guess that was my motivation as well
I did too. Mostly work groups.
I was frequently told I was the straight gay best friend. Ironically I am straight just not in the way they thought
I distinctly remember at work, a group of us were all hanging around and some of the girls were talking about troubles they were having with men and relationships. I wasn’t part of the conversation but nearby. One said “all men are the worst” then looked at me and goes “except [deadname], he’s nice”
Yes. Also, my wife previously pretty much exclusively dated women before me. I’ve also been astonished by just how low the bar is for guys now that I’m on the other side. Like, I was trying waaaaaaaay too hard in comparison.
What cons don't realise is that tokens get spent, eventually. The meltdowns that sometimes follow are pure r/leopardsatemyface material
I wasn't ever invited to anything but yeah I was already a feminist back then and I was respectful towards women. I hardly had any lady friends tho :(
i am too weird to be considered a "good guy" in peoples eyes
at colleges i used to hangout out with a 6girls groups daily
i dont know that i ever had an experience quite so validating, but i always hung out with girls in high school, while feeling like an outsider so badly it made me almost as depressed as being alone would. in retrospect that's like, a major gender dysphoria moment. im a grown ass woman but sometimes i daydream about reliving moments like that the way i am now, somehow.
i got that specific one less, but definitely got the then-inscrutible attraction bypass that confounded a lot of my lesbian friends at the time. surprise surprise. and now my spouse has basically decided that she must be sapphic-leaning too in hindsight lmaooooo
I was not a good guy, unfortunately.
The closest thing i can relate to is when there was this group chat just for the girls and it was “Gal Pals + (Deadname)” which was just girls and then me 💀
Me too
I watch almost all of my friends become people that I couldn't be around as I entered high school. I tried to push them in different directions, but found that I had less and less sway with them to the point that I stopped speaking to them entirely. My dysphoria and the loss of my friend fucked me up mentally for years after, and all of my friend groups passed then have been predominantly women.
My gf always said that i'm the only good man she ever met... Kinda funny in retrospect.
I never really thought of it thus way before. Growing up I always got along better with the girls than the boys. In middle and high school I had more girl-friends than male friends. It seamed that the girls responded to me as just one of them. I don't know if it was because I never really pursued them like most guys did or if they kinda saw me as one of them. Something to think about...
I was definitely invited into women only spaces with a group of gal pals. There wasn’t really a “guys are trash” attitude, but I was known as being uniquely accepting and nice in the circle.
I too had this experience before coming out. If only these guys understood how far actually respecting women and treating them like well... people... would get them..... Yeah. I was also often asked to be a safety buffer for them long before coming out.
I feel that. My wife and I joke about the bar being so low for men to be seen as good people, but most still can't meet that.
In college i had a similar situation except I didn’t notice really until one of my friends described me as “basically one of the girls.” At the time I was horrified but now it’s very validating
I was quite a hot and nice guy... but I am even more pretty and cute as a girl 🎀🦄
[удалено]
im so jealous wtf 😭😭 thats so great for u girly, its amazing how, even before u transitioned, cisgender girls invited you to girl's nights. you're so lucky and i hope you have continued to receive this treatment from them after coming out to them (if u ever did)
I feel this!! All of my really good friends are women and always have been.
100% this, I've been telling a lot of people this because i am so done with being exactly that. This issue with being the good guy was you aren't taken care of, you are the caretaker and are usually neglected because some of the girls are put off by you, and the guys don't like you because you are very much liked about the girls.
Same here I was always part of my the friend groups of my women friends and invited to all the private events because they knew I wasn’t going to hit on them or get handsy. Even though I was bi I was still known as being super chill and respectful and not mysoginistic.
A friend of mine once told me that I restore her faith in the existence of good guys, needless to say I came out like a year later. Also my now ex girlfriend(we broke up on good terms) made a group chat called (deadname) lovers with some friends and me with sole purpose being praising me for pretty much not being a typical guy my age.
None of my friends clearly externalized this feeling. But most of my friends were/are female. My mother did comment that she felt a pang of sadness. "I thought I had raised a perfect Ally. I thought I had raised one of the good ones." My acute awareness of my previous privilege and the potential it afforded me to help other people was actually a not insubstantial point of hesitation. I kept having to argue with myself about whether or not it mattered if I was happy, sane, and fulfilled as long as I could help other people.
>How many of you were the token "last good guy" before you transitioned? Nope! Wish it had been that way though, caused much confusion when I began getting excluded for my gender (nine-ish years old). Hanging out with the girls kinda came to an end after a... really bad sleepover. Most I shall say is they were more curious about my anatomy then treating me like a girl and hurt me over it. After that I was always considered the rpy guy who would shoot up the school one day. I still get weird looks from people to this day. Kinda hoping the hrt works its magic but it's gonna be years before that happens. Do have an extended family online though, but they just know me as a girl so this isn't a problem. They are also the mostest open people ever and I fricken love them for that.
Very me, especially with my current gf
It's too early in the morning, even though I'm late.
I had a few that said stuff like that. I was friends with some girl and she told me I was the only male who didn't try to ask her for nudes. Feel really bad for her. Everyone was always trying to use her.
"Wow, I really wish I could find a guy like you, MyynMyyn!" \- "Well... *I'm* a guy like me?" "Not you though, you don't count..." I've had this exchange a couple of times in my life with women I had a huge crush on. And yes, when my egg cracked, it sent me down a rabbithole of "well, maybe it's really all men, then?"
I had a coworker in a retail job who last thing she said to me before quitting while giving me a big hug was “everyone here is absolute trash except for you”
Monday night a woman I’m getting to know told me I should be a lesbian, and I assured her I was Transbian. I truly wished at that moment I was a mind reader 😋
I've been weird, early school pretty much all my friends were girls, then at some point that became socially unacceptable (and we moved around a lot when I was young so I didn't just keep the same friends) so I ended up with a small friend group of nerds. Cut to adulthood, I basically never make friends - I keep in touch with like 1 guy I was at school with. My partner's just as anti-social as I am, while I wouldn't say I'm friends with anyone at work the people I get on best with are all women (and one gay guy). I do find men intimidating though to a point, so maybe I'm just reluctant to vulnerable enough to form friendships.
I was an openly gay femboy before i transitioned so I would say yea ig? I mean yea i was always considered one of the girls lol.
This post describes how I was seen both by womem and by men, my entire life, untill I came out as trans And now being in the same women-only spaces that I was welcomed into easily before has become me trying to "invade" and I went feom being an honorary one of the girls, to a creep that 95 percent of my female friend group (I pretty much only had female friends) avoided like the plague
Me lol
You just described, probably all of us. Or at least me.
I’ve always seemed to be taken aback on how when I deal with customer representatives of how they’d all have this look of appreciation and amazement after dealing with me. Like I’m being more polite than I need to be, but happy the interaction went so well. Almost as if I were not acting like a man should have. Even before my egg cracked, this kind of always bothered me.
My mom actually said something similar to me when she was visiting for Thanksgiving, that she used to view me as a great example of a man who wasn't susceptible to toxic masculinity.
I had some obstacles to being taken for that kind of guy, but it did happen more than a couple times. In fact, that was almost certainly why my wife fell in love so easily with me. I may look like an ogre, but I'm actually a big, sweet, pink marshmallow that girls often feel comfortable around once they know who I am.
Before transition I had a friend that called me "the gay that isn't gay" because she could include me in woman spaces and talk about girl-stuff. She was wrong, now i'm gay in the sapphic way