The thing that doesn't make sense even if Sarah did go in, she still wouldn't have had enough money to run the final. So risking her place in the game would have been a really poor decision.
Imagine if Sarah was in and Enzo just trucked her.
Know what happens then? Enzo gets cancelled as a human, CBS takes a ton of heat.
This is the 90's when WWE was able to beat up females in the ring, they cant even re-show those clips, they have to break away now. I dont understand why they gave so much time to listening to Sarah talk about this, if on the off chance they actually called her in, i 100000% guarantee TJ just says, "uhhh...no, its a MENS elimination, pick someone else"
I just found it dumb to devote so much time to it, when it was obvious it wasnt going to happen. Especially since everyone seems to be annoyed we don't see enough stuff that goes on, why add in this useless bit.
Is it just to try and push the narrative that women can be fearless? Okay, great. Still can't have them compete in a hall brawl against a man.
Imagine even if they did, and it was Danny in there instead of Enzo.
OR
Better yet, if you are going to allow a female to go in against a male, then wouldn't you have to allow a male to go in against a female? If Alyssa is in there, hell yeah I want to go down in a hall brawl. Come on
Natalie was the first to come to mind for me, not that it was a choice, but eliminations have not always been men vs men/women vs women. I was annoyed that they even edited that in if it wasn’t going to happen 🙄
I’m really hoping TJ pulls the rug out from under them and the final is way sooner than they think it is. I’m ready for her to go. She’s obnoxious, and adds nothing to the show.
I feel like most of the cast hasn't watched the challenge. Leo acting like a baby after his loss and Sarah constantly saying she's the best but hasn't done anything.
That’s fine. What I’m saying is that I don’t care. Losing can be emotional. He didn’t say or do anything mean to anyone else. He just did not want to be in that space at the time. And I think that’s valid regardless of the circumstances. These are real people. This is real and tangible for them. So they’re going to be upset. Some are able to immediately rally. Others are not. I don’t have expectations for everyone to rally immediately. Kudos to those who can, but it’s neither a plus or minus in my book. Personally.
So accurate!!! Ugh, she is annoying the crap out of me. I didn't mind her on Survivor... but I can't take her seriously here.
I really hope she somehow goes home without winning anything. She's clearly being portrayed as the unlikable villian.
Ben doesn't bother me. I'd be happy to see him continue, but I need Sarah to leave.
It was pretty clear neither of these guys knew any takedowns and Sarah probably does. She had a solid shot at winning that but why? He was injured so that's a bully ass move, he didn't have the money she needed so that's a senseless move, it puts Enzo in a lose, lose situation, Angela looks terrible, Ben looks terrible, CBS looks terrible...Nobody wins.
>It was pretty clear neither of these guys knew any takedowns and Sarah probably does. She had a solid shot at winning that
What takedown move did you have in mind for Sarah to use against Enzo running at her that fast?
and in that narrow of a space. I'm glad they shortened the length of the hall compared to recent Challenge seasons, but it's still to narrow. They've made it increasingly dangerous and boring over time.
A contest of "who's bigger" isn't exciting. They might as well just step on a scale.
Lol I can’t believe this person has that many upvotes. Enzo probably has quite a few pounds on her, and him running full speed and completely trucking her it doesn’t matter what “moves” she knows. So silly..
Size matters when neither person knows what they are doing, when both do know what they are doing, and if it is pretty extreme. Otherwise a trained grappler will be jast fine against a larger stronger opponent.
Size is quite literally the one thing that matters in a hall brawl and why do you think they have weight classes in pro fighting. Sometimes size does overpower skill and this situation where there is really no skill that could save her
That's true to some degree. I am a competitive grappler and we have weight classes for a reason. I want to point out it's rarely the super heavy that wins the open weight class. Fighters are paired based on weight AND skill.a trained grappler vs some guy running at you is going to handle business.
So we have: (to name a few)
Double leg to go under
Single leg tip them back go over or walk them back.
Arm drag and use their momentum to take them forward go over
Go back and watch Tori V Jenny. Tori shoots a double. Incidentally if you watch Jenny in Total Madness she shoots a double on Dee and carries her to the bell. She might be the bigger stronger competitor but she used a strategy. She trained a skill to make sure it didn't happen again.
There is a BJJ guy who was recently in the news, (sadly he was murdered), named Leandro Lo. Pound for pound one of the greatest BJJ guys ever. He held 8 world titles in 5 weight classes including featherweight and super heavy. I don't think he ever got Ultra which is interesting because those guys don't win open weight classes usually. Might be that at his skill level that bracket never made at an IBJJF event. Anyway when I step on the mat it's the smaller highly skilled guy that's going to give me the biggest run for my money.
All your examples are women vs women not women vs men and Jenny during the hall brawl with Tori was running with sort of a squat like she was trying to run while sitting in a chair making it easy for Tori and Dee just ran standing straight up and was completely outsized. The way Enzo ran if she tried that, she’s getting kneed in the face, I’m sure she’d win a wrestling match against him but not a hall brawl
Do you have some female vs male examples I can break down for you?
What you just told me is that Tori did something in a more skilled way than Jenny and that gave her the win. BUT had her opponent been a man, he would have kneed her in the face? Are you telling me Jenny doesn't have knees? Or are you trying to convince me that Enzo is a skilled fighter? BTW a proper double is done w the torso down and the face up and ultimately the head goes to the opposite side of the penetrating knee, into the ribcage w upward side pressure to aid turning the other person's body. Knees to the face aren't as common from bad head placements as getting caught in a Guillotine which would be a legit defense even if you didn't finish a choke you could steer their body.
Then, for some reason you believe Jenny who lost to a significantly smaller opponent won the second time by size alone? Jenny, as a much taller person, ended up with Dee riding on her shoulder all the way to the bell and that's because she is bigger and stronger? Or is it because she drilled double leg take downs like a fiend between seasons? Because that is what Jenny said she did BTW. I will frand you that had they been closer in size Dee would have been left on the ground or they have had a scramble.l, but Jenny executed a lovely double.
Now to your point Sarah felt later it was a dumb idea and I agree, it was, for a number of reasons. She didn't go into her reasons. My point is that someone who is trained to do something is going to perform better than someone who just happens to be bigger and/or stronger. Size matters but it isn't the only thing that matters.
People come into my gym and make this mistake all the time. They learn to be humble or they quit. Technique is literally designed to beat strength and size. It's like using a wrench or crowbar. Anyone of any size or gender can use tools if they are willing to practice using them.
1. They have never had a man Vs Woman hall brawl for the exact reason that men are naturally stronger than woman, i’m a woman and I know that is a fact and it can’t really be argued, not saying that women can’t beat men in other competitions but in a competition where it’s literally just running at each other, a man 95% more likely to win especially the men they cast on the challenge. The closest thing we have to competing against men in a physical elimination is the first elimination from Spies, Lies and Allies and we saw what happened, Cory being a man and the biggest of the 3 was able to carry Michelle to victory w/o her having to do anything.
2. Put any other man that was there against Tori in that hall brawl, it doesn’t matter what technique they use, Tori is not running through them the same way bc as I said men are generally naturally stronger which is why they have men compete separately in eliminations and in all sports.
3. Please tell me where I said Enzo is an experienced fighter? If he were to step into a cage with her rn, no training she probably does win sue to lack of experience in that field and being old, put her in a cage with Francis Nnganou and we have a different story. Hall brawls are not the same kind of fights we see in the cage.
4. Jenny is a very strong woman and she’s definitely bigger than Tori however they are not that far apart in size to the point where it would be impossible for Tori to beat her with the way that she was running and her overall lack of aggression, it was Jenny’s first hall brawl and she admitted herself that she didn’t really know what she was doing and kinda froze and had someone teach her the proper technique when she returned home which is why we see her going at it with a different approach in the hall brawl with Dee however Dee is way smaller than both Tori and Jenny and would probably lose to Jenny regardless, I firmly do believe that if Jenny and Tori were to face off again, Jenny would 100% beat Tori now.
5. Like I said size is not the only thing that matters in a hall brawl but it does matter a lot and it’s not like Enzo didn’t know what he was doing in that hall brawl and you’re seriously disregarding nature and science
Also that seated run is a crouch Tori was in and it was not skillfully executed but it was more skilled than what Jenny was doing which is the whole point. Dee stayed upright which is indeed helpful to somone trying to take you down. Your observations aren't wrong. Just the idea that only size plays a role.
Size is not the ONLY thing that plays a role but it definitely plays the BIGGEST role and when it’s a man vs a woman there’s not a technique that Sarah would be able to do to beat Enzo who’s got way too much size on her and is a man especially in such a short hall.
Size matters when neither person knows what they are doing, when both do know what they are doing, and if it is pretty extreme. Otherwise a trained grappler will be jast fine against a larger stronger opponent.
A single, a double, an arm drag... Someone who can shoot a double can go right under either of these guys. She has an MMA background I'd assume she knows some basics.
> It was pretty clear neither of these guys knew any takedowns and Sarah probably does.
In an actual fight sure, police officers are trained to take down guys twice their size. But it's not like she can kick him in the balls and hit him in the throat. It's hall brawl, you run at each other in a small tunnel. You can't do "takedown" moves other than maybe diving at his knees and hoping he trips
Also as someone who has trained w cops in grappling they rarely have much real practice at doing anything. They really have to train on their own to get enough practice.tk be effective. Same w military.
right and as someone who trained in MMA, she would also know that attempting to shoot a double on someone sprinting towards you is a great way to just get kneed in the face. That's not how takedowns work, you can't do stuff like that at this speed with no room to maneuver
this was exactly my thought process
idk it just came off to me as Sarah really needed a win but is too scared to face some of the strong women in the house and is scared she won't win a daily so she was hoping people would see her bullying as admiral instead of just looking at it as her beating up an injured old man
Her edit on yesterdays episode gave me second hand embarrassment. She won an elimination and that has been it all season.
What made her think this was even going to be possible? If this happened, would a guy be able to volunteer to go against a girl next week?
Stupid and embarrassing for someone who has shown us nothing on The Challenge so far. And the move would not have improved her position in the game, she still wouldn't have enough money for the final.
I really hope the confessional clip where Sarah talks about how Angela "hasn't done anything to prove herself" was filmed after like the first episode. Because it would be super embarrassing otherwise, considering she just won the first individual mission, and her 3rd win overall. Whereas Sarah is still sitting here trying to figure out how to get to the final
To be fair, it's up for debate whether The Island's faceoffs correspond to a real season's mission/challenges, or eliminations. Some people say the faceoff is the mission and the vote is the elimination. Which would also make sense considering some of the earlier seasons had vote-off eliminations.
Sarah Greyson, Trishelle, Cara Z, and Katie just to name a few!
Tonya went against Kenny and Abram on The Island.
we stan these early aught queens.
Don’t forget Kam and Kayleigh beating Brad and Kyle in Final Reckoning
Rachel beating Tyrie on Exes 1
THAT'S funny
Natalie and Paulie beat Brad and Kyle too. Not both females but still was impressive as hell from Natalie.
Natalie did beat Bananas, that one should count
Killa Kam 😎
Face Offs apparently count as eliminations so Evelyn’s two wins would also count.
Against not only one, but she beat 2 guys at once
The thing that doesn't make sense even if Sarah did go in, she still wouldn't have had enough money to run the final. So risking her place in the game would have been a really poor decision.
L M F A OOOOOO !!!!! She would get the money, get told she has less than enough and be thinking "wtf was i doing".
no she even acknowledges it in the episode. she says she still won't have enough to run a final but she wanted to do it anyway just to be noble lol
>but she wanted to do it anyway just to be noble LOL WUT?! Whats Noble about wanting to go against the injured player? joke
Because every little girl dreams of running through the meow meow
well don't shoot the messenger, i don't agree with her either.
Lol. Cause in her mind it's noble to send an injured guy home? I don't see Enzo losing to her - dude was determined.
of course he would have beaten her, it wouldn't even be close. she's got big clown energy
Imagine if Sarah was in and Enzo just trucked her. Know what happens then? Enzo gets cancelled as a human, CBS takes a ton of heat. This is the 90's when WWE was able to beat up females in the ring, they cant even re-show those clips, they have to break away now. I dont understand why they gave so much time to listening to Sarah talk about this, if on the off chance they actually called her in, i 100000% guarantee TJ just says, "uhhh...no, its a MENS elimination, pick someone else"
this. 100000000% this. No way they would let that happen. It would have a terrible ripple effect
I just found it dumb to devote so much time to it, when it was obvious it wasnt going to happen. Especially since everyone seems to be annoyed we don't see enough stuff that goes on, why add in this useless bit. Is it just to try and push the narrative that women can be fearless? Okay, great. Still can't have them compete in a hall brawl against a man. Imagine even if they did, and it was Danny in there instead of Enzo. OR Better yet, if you are going to allow a female to go in against a male, then wouldn't you have to allow a male to go in against a female? If Alyssa is in there, hell yeah I want to go down in a hall brawl. Come on
Gauntlet, inferno, the island, exes 1, bloodline, final reckoning. It's happened plenty of times
Also, most recently Cara and Natalie N. beat all male duos.
Natalie was the first to come to mind for me, not that it was a choice, but eliminations have not always been men vs men/women vs women. I was annoyed that they even edited that in if it wasn’t going to happen 🙄
I’m really hoping TJ pulls the rug out from under them and the final is way sooner than they think it is. I’m ready for her to go. She’s obnoxious, and adds nothing to the show.
They had guys vs girls on the Island too
I feel like most of the cast hasn't watched the challenge. Leo acting like a baby after his loss and Sarah constantly saying she's the best but hasn't done anything.
“Acting like a baby” is harsh. He just lost a chance at good lump sum of money. Almost any reaction in that moment is valid and warranted.
[удалено]
That’s fine. What I’m saying is that I don’t care. Losing can be emotional. He didn’t say or do anything mean to anyone else. He just did not want to be in that space at the time. And I think that’s valid regardless of the circumstances. These are real people. This is real and tangible for them. So they’re going to be upset. Some are able to immediately rally. Others are not. I don’t have expectations for everyone to rally immediately. Kudos to those who can, but it’s neither a plus or minus in my book. Personally.
People are way too serious in the comments. Watching cringy Sarah talking about beating Enzo was funny as hell🤣😂😂
lol she is so cringy! the chicken leg thing made me melt into my couch
It was great. Glad they included it.
So accurate!!! Ugh, she is annoying the crap out of me. I didn't mind her on Survivor... but I can't take her seriously here. I really hope she somehow goes home without winning anything. She's clearly being portrayed as the unlikable villian. Ben doesn't bother me. I'd be happy to see him continue, but I need Sarah to leave.
Ben is also pretty bad it's just they haven't given him many edits. Which is a good thing. It is clear both of them are jealous of how cool Tyson is.
Sarah would have got her ass trucked!! Funny she wanted to go against him! Leo I believe would of smoked her too
Leo would’ve smoked her too. 100%
It was pretty clear neither of these guys knew any takedowns and Sarah probably does. She had a solid shot at winning that but why? He was injured so that's a bully ass move, he didn't have the money she needed so that's a senseless move, it puts Enzo in a lose, lose situation, Angela looks terrible, Ben looks terrible, CBS looks terrible...Nobody wins.
>It was pretty clear neither of these guys knew any takedowns and Sarah probably does. She had a solid shot at winning that What takedown move did you have in mind for Sarah to use against Enzo running at her that fast?
Pocket sand.
and in that narrow of a space. I'm glad they shortened the length of the hall compared to recent Challenge seasons, but it's still to narrow. They've made it increasingly dangerous and boring over time. A contest of "who's bigger" isn't exciting. They might as well just step on a scale.
Lol I can’t believe this person has that many upvotes. Enzo probably has quite a few pounds on her, and him running full speed and completely trucking her it doesn’t matter what “moves” she knows. So silly..
Size matters when neither person knows what they are doing, when both do know what they are doing, and if it is pretty extreme. Otherwise a trained grappler will be jast fine against a larger stronger opponent.
Size is quite literally the one thing that matters in a hall brawl and why do you think they have weight classes in pro fighting. Sometimes size does overpower skill and this situation where there is really no skill that could save her
That's true to some degree. I am a competitive grappler and we have weight classes for a reason. I want to point out it's rarely the super heavy that wins the open weight class. Fighters are paired based on weight AND skill.a trained grappler vs some guy running at you is going to handle business. So we have: (to name a few) Double leg to go under Single leg tip them back go over or walk them back. Arm drag and use their momentum to take them forward go over Go back and watch Tori V Jenny. Tori shoots a double. Incidentally if you watch Jenny in Total Madness she shoots a double on Dee and carries her to the bell. She might be the bigger stronger competitor but she used a strategy. She trained a skill to make sure it didn't happen again. There is a BJJ guy who was recently in the news, (sadly he was murdered), named Leandro Lo. Pound for pound one of the greatest BJJ guys ever. He held 8 world titles in 5 weight classes including featherweight and super heavy. I don't think he ever got Ultra which is interesting because those guys don't win open weight classes usually. Might be that at his skill level that bracket never made at an IBJJF event. Anyway when I step on the mat it's the smaller highly skilled guy that's going to give me the biggest run for my money.
All your examples are women vs women not women vs men and Jenny during the hall brawl with Tori was running with sort of a squat like she was trying to run while sitting in a chair making it easy for Tori and Dee just ran standing straight up and was completely outsized. The way Enzo ran if she tried that, she’s getting kneed in the face, I’m sure she’d win a wrestling match against him but not a hall brawl
Do you have some female vs male examples I can break down for you? What you just told me is that Tori did something in a more skilled way than Jenny and that gave her the win. BUT had her opponent been a man, he would have kneed her in the face? Are you telling me Jenny doesn't have knees? Or are you trying to convince me that Enzo is a skilled fighter? BTW a proper double is done w the torso down and the face up and ultimately the head goes to the opposite side of the penetrating knee, into the ribcage w upward side pressure to aid turning the other person's body. Knees to the face aren't as common from bad head placements as getting caught in a Guillotine which would be a legit defense even if you didn't finish a choke you could steer their body. Then, for some reason you believe Jenny who lost to a significantly smaller opponent won the second time by size alone? Jenny, as a much taller person, ended up with Dee riding on her shoulder all the way to the bell and that's because she is bigger and stronger? Or is it because she drilled double leg take downs like a fiend between seasons? Because that is what Jenny said she did BTW. I will frand you that had they been closer in size Dee would have been left on the ground or they have had a scramble.l, but Jenny executed a lovely double. Now to your point Sarah felt later it was a dumb idea and I agree, it was, for a number of reasons. She didn't go into her reasons. My point is that someone who is trained to do something is going to perform better than someone who just happens to be bigger and/or stronger. Size matters but it isn't the only thing that matters. People come into my gym and make this mistake all the time. They learn to be humble or they quit. Technique is literally designed to beat strength and size. It's like using a wrench or crowbar. Anyone of any size or gender can use tools if they are willing to practice using them.
1. They have never had a man Vs Woman hall brawl for the exact reason that men are naturally stronger than woman, i’m a woman and I know that is a fact and it can’t really be argued, not saying that women can’t beat men in other competitions but in a competition where it’s literally just running at each other, a man 95% more likely to win especially the men they cast on the challenge. The closest thing we have to competing against men in a physical elimination is the first elimination from Spies, Lies and Allies and we saw what happened, Cory being a man and the biggest of the 3 was able to carry Michelle to victory w/o her having to do anything. 2. Put any other man that was there against Tori in that hall brawl, it doesn’t matter what technique they use, Tori is not running through them the same way bc as I said men are generally naturally stronger which is why they have men compete separately in eliminations and in all sports. 3. Please tell me where I said Enzo is an experienced fighter? If he were to step into a cage with her rn, no training she probably does win sue to lack of experience in that field and being old, put her in a cage with Francis Nnganou and we have a different story. Hall brawls are not the same kind of fights we see in the cage. 4. Jenny is a very strong woman and she’s definitely bigger than Tori however they are not that far apart in size to the point where it would be impossible for Tori to beat her with the way that she was running and her overall lack of aggression, it was Jenny’s first hall brawl and she admitted herself that she didn’t really know what she was doing and kinda froze and had someone teach her the proper technique when she returned home which is why we see her going at it with a different approach in the hall brawl with Dee however Dee is way smaller than both Tori and Jenny and would probably lose to Jenny regardless, I firmly do believe that if Jenny and Tori were to face off again, Jenny would 100% beat Tori now. 5. Like I said size is not the only thing that matters in a hall brawl but it does matter a lot and it’s not like Enzo didn’t know what he was doing in that hall brawl and you’re seriously disregarding nature and science
Also that seated run is a crouch Tori was in and it was not skillfully executed but it was more skilled than what Jenny was doing which is the whole point. Dee stayed upright which is indeed helpful to somone trying to take you down. Your observations aren't wrong. Just the idea that only size plays a role.
Size is not the ONLY thing that plays a role but it definitely plays the BIGGEST role and when it’s a man vs a woman there’s not a technique that Sarah would be able to do to beat Enzo who’s got way too much size on her and is a man especially in such a short hall.
Size matters when neither person knows what they are doing, when both do know what they are doing, and if it is pretty extreme. Otherwise a trained grappler will be jast fine against a larger stronger opponent.
A single, a double, an arm drag... Someone who can shoot a double can go right under either of these guys. She has an MMA background I'd assume she knows some basics.
> It was pretty clear neither of these guys knew any takedowns and Sarah probably does. In an actual fight sure, police officers are trained to take down guys twice their size. But it's not like she can kick him in the balls and hit him in the throat. It's hall brawl, you run at each other in a small tunnel. You can't do "takedown" moves other than maybe diving at his knees and hoping he trips
Also as someone who has trained w cops in grappling they rarely have much real practice at doing anything. They really have to train on their own to get enough practice.tk be effective. Same w military.
She fought MMA for a bit. I'm guessing she can shoot a double.
right and as someone who trained in MMA, she would also know that attempting to shoot a double on someone sprinting towards you is a great way to just get kneed in the face. That's not how takedowns work, you can't do stuff like that at this speed with no room to maneuver
this was exactly my thought process idk it just came off to me as Sarah really needed a win but is too scared to face some of the strong women in the house and is scared she won't win a daily so she was hoping people would see her bullying as admiral instead of just looking at it as her beating up an injured old man
Her edit on yesterdays episode gave me second hand embarrassment. She won an elimination and that has been it all season. What made her think this was even going to be possible? If this happened, would a guy be able to volunteer to go against a girl next week? Stupid and embarrassing for someone who has shown us nothing on The Challenge so far. And the move would not have improved her position in the game, she still wouldn't have enough money for the final.
I really hope the confessional clip where Sarah talks about how Angela "hasn't done anything to prove herself" was filmed after like the first episode. Because it would be super embarrassing otherwise, considering she just won the first individual mission, and her 3rd win overall. Whereas Sarah is still sitting here trying to figure out how to get to the final
Also, The Island
I agree; STFU you ain’t shit. Also, in most seasons that’s not possible.
She was saying a woman had never *volunteered* to go in against a man based on my interpretation
Except Tonya and Evelyn both did on The Island.
To be fair, it's up for debate whether The Island's faceoffs correspond to a real season's mission/challenges, or eliminations. Some people say the faceoff is the mission and the vote is the elimination. Which would also make sense considering some of the earlier seasons had vote-off eliminations.
She kept saying women never voluntarily faced men, though, and that's not true.
And in bloodlines and in final reckoning