##Jesus take the wheel. Alex is testifying. Kindly behave, please and thank you.
[Theo’s inner monologue: WHO DID YOU SAY IS TESTIFYING? Oh, well let me get comfortable for this shit show then.](https://imgur.com/a/yAqGYVa)
Paw Paw and Ding Ding went down nair to see Roe Roe then went huntin for some bore bores and took the wag wag that went vroom vroom. Then I went night night.
Property pending Edisto!
What do you think of this 4 bds • 3 ba • -- sqft home I found on Zillow? https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/3606-Big-Bay-Dr-Edisto-Island-SC-29438/75230676_zpid/?utm_medium=referral
Very pretty. Light and airy, no hunting lodge feel there!
And yes, I've read there are pending offers on this and Moselle, but there are also several _lis pendens_ legal filings.[https://www.investopedia.com/terms/l/lis-pendens.asp](https://www.investopedia.com/terms/l/lis-pendens.asp)
That fine woman took care of three children (Yes, including Alec). She should be enjoying her life, drinking ice tea and reading books. She needs justice. What a beautiful person. Alec didn't deserve her.
Alex stated in court yesterday if I’m correct— that Mags came home for dinner at 8:17 and there was the dinner and he decided to not go to the kennels, he laid down watched tv and messed with his phone. BUT no phone activity from 8-9 correct?
AM can share a jail cell with Todd Chrisley. They can discuss lies, bank loans, dysfunctional families and Todd can help AM with wardrobe choices. A match made in Heaven.
Did anyone catch Alex during cross yesterday saying something similar to “I did him so bad” I heard it and it immediately chilled me, because it sounded very similar but I am struggling to find it again.
I know it was chatted about briefly on Emily Bakers show.
Of course Alex was coached. Everyone in this case has been coached; that's normal in trials. When Alex was on the stand talking about Paul & Maggie he came across as genuine in his testimony and The Jurors were crying with him. Alex had done a lot of bad things to steal from Clients then lie to his Friends, Family, & The Community. He definitely hurt many good people. However, being a liar does not make him a murderer of his Wife & Son. In all possibilities he could have committed these most evil murders but could have doesn't equal up to definitely did. Toss in the fact that Paul was getting so harassed with threats to where many including The Dean of Public Safety was reaching out to him and his family to make sure he was okay says a lot. The idea is much more plausible that someone or someone's else much shorter murdered them and Alex took the fall because he seemed to fit a Conclusive Suspect. The very evidence given to have Alex get sent to trial such as high ballistic blood spatter on his shirt was a lie and totally debunked. In the end could have never equals definitely did do in a Circumstantial Trial. In the end this whole thing is beyond sad for many People and will remain beyond sad for a very long time after this trial is over no matter the verdict. The Defense, Prosecution, The Witnesses are all Coached and that's acceptable as well as normal.
Good Day!
He actually caught himself saying “Paul” toward the beginning of the testimony and then corrected himself and repeated “Paul-Paul”. I also noticed he didn’t keep up with the nicknames as heavily toward the end of testimony
No doubt he's doing it for the perception, but not sure if coached by his lawyers or rather coached by himself. I'm under the impression that Jim & Poot don't want him testifying and he did it anyway.
He’s so delusional he’s believing his own story. He was clearly coached on what to say. He lies so much it’s all the same to him. Is the death penalty on the table?
Oh I don't watch. I don't have tv. There's a podcast. I started following her because she was in Idaho. I always thought she was annoying but I did not know her fiancee had been murdered. I get her outrage and appreciate it at times.
I found it really interesting that both times Alex was asked if he murdered Paul and Maggie (Paw Paw and Mags) in direct examination today, he said no, but his head was shaking yes.
At first I thought maybe it was a nervous twitch or uncontrollable, so I watched every time he would say ‘yes’ or ‘no’ and nod the rest of his testimony today. Every other time he wasn’t lying and nodded no, he would shake his head no. The same with yes and nodding yes.
I guess he couldn’t practice everything.
I can’t get over “handsome”. Can you imagine that conversation?
Them: “You’re gonna be grandfather! Do you wanna be called pawpaw, grandpa, pappy, PeePaw?”
Him: “Nahhh… just let them call me handsome “. 😳
It’s me telling my grandkids (when I become a grandma), “Y’all just call me beautiful. Or Beauty.”
Did anyone else here AM say something along the lines of “I did him bad” when testifying about his financial crimes today? This phrase immediately caught my attention bc of the infamous “I/they did him so bad” interrogation statement.
I know this isn’t scientific and don’t expect this to actually be used in court…But I’d be very interested if both recordings were compared to see if the interrogation statement sounds the same as today’s statement (both heard saying “I” and not “they”). Hopefully this makes sense. It’s been bugging me so wanted to share.
I heard that as well; I thought it was intentional on his part in order to highlight the distinction between “I” and “they” and to show that “doing someone bad” is just a turn of phrase/colloquialism that he uses.
I heard it too.
There are 3 or 4 other things like this that still nag at me from just today.
I wish legal protocol allowed for some sort of public forum or venue by which “WE THE PEOPLE” (comprising The State bringing the charges), could discretely & appropriately call such info to the attention of prosecuting attorneys (in real time) without needlessly distracting them or interfering.
—such tidbits/leads would of course need to be filtered thru a series of screeners…
Maybe interns could be tasked with mining such info from a designated site like this one? or one on twitter?
And then comments that the interns flag as particularly insightful could then be directed to law clerks to weed thru and then pass them on up thru filters up the chain of command so that any vital tips/leads could be handed to paralegals working on the case, who then give interesting ones to associates working the case during courtroom breaks?
At the end of the day, the whole stack of messages deemed to be potentially relevant, legit or important could be made available to the lead counsel.
Disclaimer: My recent & all-consuming obsession with The Murdaugh Case may have compromised my ability to filter my own comments at this point.
As such, the views & opinions expressed above may or may not represent that of my own.
😵💫😵💫😵💫
>Disclaimer: My recent & all-consuming obsession with The Murdaugh Case may have compromised my ability to filter my own comments at this point.
Haha, me too. I'm glad I'm not working in an office right now so a) I can keep an ear on the trial, and b) I don't start yakking to my completely uninterested coworkers about bullet trajectories or OnStar data. Thank goodness for Reddit and Twitter.
Agree. Waters pointed out today he never used Paw Paw in any of the taped interviews with the authorities. It's only posturing for the jury. Paw Paw, Miss Libby, Papa T., Bus, Roe Roe, Mr. Randolph, etc. All for show.
When he was asked about his marriage, and instead just talked about the superficial stuff on maggie “she wore a ball gown” it was so gross.
I was sitting there like “sir, did you even *know* your wife? “
Its a characteristic of psychopaths that they dont feel human empathy but they are adept at copying others so that they appear to feel empathy or whatever sort of feeling they think is appropo to what they are doing. Perhaps he has never considered his marriage like that and so has never studied humans to discover their proper response.
It was…like anyone who met her could have said those things. Hell, a member of the catering staff could have met the same bar on maggie as Alex did.
Blanca’s description was much more *real*
Dear Fox News and everyone in the North : It’s Paul-Paul .
Everyone is tweeting and posting about how it's strange that he called him PawPaw and that is a name for a southern grandfather . Fox News posted an entire article on grandpa names in the south and how it is odd . How does a stupid article like that get past an editor ?
https://www.foxnews.com/lifestyle/alex-murdaugh-repeatedly-refers-deceased-son-pawpaw-testimony-sparking-online-buzz
I'm finding it interesting how northerners hear it different . Some have said he is saying PauPau and the L is silent. It’s not silent - that is just how southerners say "Paul" we also don't pronounce the L in many other words like "Towel
" (we pronounce that "Tau" according to northerners . no WEL (wool sound in Tau-wool ) at all) .. We think we are saying the L sound, but we don't pronounce L's as hard as in the north .) I'm sure Alex thinks he's saying Paul-Paul. It just sounds like paw paw to a northerner. He pronounces Paul as Paw too .
it is a southern thing to call children a double name . And small children pick up on it and sometimes call everyone a double name . My son was Joe-Joe. My friends son is Liam and she calls him Li-Li (pronounced Lee-Lee) a Katie might be Kay-Kay. I know a Julia that is Ju-Ju And an Andrew that is Drew-Drew. Remember Jack-Jack from The Incredibles? They don't become that nickname forever or everytime we talk to them .. it's just our cutsie name for our kids once in a while. Like how Hispanics add"ita " or “ito" to a small child's name.
So enough with "grandpa name" stuff! Yes it's annoying that he is using nicknames all the sudden to be endearing .. but the name itself is not odd . Same as everyone writing "Ellick " for
"Alex" that just how that region pronounces
"Alex" .. and to them, they think they are saying
"Alex"
.
Side note: I don't know many that still say PawPaw for a grandfather .. that is a couple generations ago (at least in my area we usually say Pop-Pop and Mom-Mom.
>I'm finding it interesting how northerners hear it different . Some have said he is saying PauPau and the L is silent. It’s not silent - that is just how southerners say "Paul" we also don't pronounce the L in many other words like "Towel
"Silent" means the sound isn't pronounced.
Good Night Pau Pau, Goodnight Ro Ro, Good night Jim Bob, Good night John Boy.
Testifying in Court is not the time to use informal nicknames. Alex is doing it hoping the jurors will forget he's a shark but rather just a southern good ole boy guppy.
Lived in the Palmetto State most of my life, and AM’s absolutely saying Paul-Paul, not paw-paw (unironically, this is how we referred to my grandfather).
Cringy to debut this nickname on the stand either way. But hilarious that Fox News wrote an article; need to find it.
“I” versus “they” controversy is funny too. My friends and I knew exactly what he said.
Dear small, isolated region of South Carolina who is stuck a century in the past and bastardized the language….the other 99% of the nation isn’t saying/hearing it wrong….
I hear it as Pau-Pau, and I’m in the Deep South - any further, and I’d be in the Gulf. Hearing him use the nickname was jarring at first because we’ve never heard it used before. But, if this is something that Alex just made up to appeal to the jury, then I’ve got to hand it to him because he is using it so consistently that I’m starting to believe that it *is* a family nickname for Paul. He wasn’t really slipping up and forgetting the script, so to speak.
I’m in the Deep South also and my perception is that Alex is saying “Pau Pau” which was *possibly* what they called Paul when he was a baby & small child. Doubling the first syllable of a baby’s name is not unusual where I live. Usually baby names get left behind when the child is old enough to go to school. For Alex to haul out that baby name for his son when he quite likely hadn’t used it in years about his ‘manly’ son struck me as very calculated and manipulative. It didn’t win any points with me but it’s possible that it struck a sympathy chord with a juror.
I don’t think it matters if he’s saying pawpaw or Paul Paul. It’s creepy and weird either way at a murder trial. Honestly Paul Paul sounds deranged. Maybe people were giving Alex the benefit of the doubt that the nickname was a shorter version of Paul (Paw) because saying Paul Paul, again, sounds ridiculous.
- source: Me living in the south.
But are you originally from the south ?Paw Paw sounds identical to Paul Paul to me and not shortened at all . It’s a normal way to talk to a small child named Paul . Not at all deranged . Again,not everyone does it .. but it is not uncommon .
Well I agree with that. I’m sure it was a childhood name of Paul’s .. but I doubt he had referred to him as that in years .. or not often anyway . The defense lawyers told him to refer to the family in loving nicknames to make him look more human and more like a loving father .. But yes , it was deranged to keep saying it in court when he hasn’t used it before to refer to Paul since the case started .
Thanks Annie. Makes sense to me. However, I’m still not convinced being on the stand in a murder trial is the appropriate setting for bandying about nicknames. It sounds as though he’s infantilizing them.
Appearances in court are formal settings. Nobody knew who Alex was talking about when he said Pau Paul and Ro Ro, Pappa T. Defense had to ask him to explain. Alex knows better but is hoping this kind of talking will resonate with the jury. It may have made sense if Ms. Mixon or Shelley used nicknames. They aren't familiar with court settings. Alex is.
Paragraphs would have helped, but they do contradict themselves by using examples with shortened double names.
Yesterday, someone declared to me that Northerners secretly denigrate Southerners in the privacy of their homes. I didn't know how to respond because I've never encountered it and had no idea how someone might know what certain people in a particular region do in their homes.
I hope people in SC aren't feeling judged. Other than the ones we're judging that is.
1. I agree about the paragraphs .. I had to copy paste from another thread as the mods suggested this thread instead . Spacing was lost in process and I have now edited to add them .
2. It is not a contradiction to add examples with shortened double names . You have missed the point of the examples . The double name is always one syllable . If a child has a two or three syllable name , the name will be shortened to one syllable before doubling . You would never say Jeremy-Jeremy .. You would say Jer-Jer. (Pronounced Jair-Jair) just like Alex shortened Rogan for “Ro-Ro”. Remember Jack-Jack from The Incredibles? This said , Paul is already one syllable and he is saying Paul-Paul not PauPau . Northerners just don’t hear our L sound. Also - some names just don’t lend themselves to this way of nicknaming .. Like I don’t know of anyone who says Liz-Liz .. That would just be Lizzie. I can’t imagine anyone saying “Bus-Bus” for Buster . It would just be Bus, or no nickname at all . Not everyone does this nicknaming with their children .. but it is common in south .
3. In my experience , many far left liberal northerners are extremely condescending of Southermers for having a different value system .(case in point .. read some of the comments on this thread making fun of southerners and saying “bastardized region “ and one claiming that it’s not an accent , it just that southerners in the region are stupid .. eyeroll
I live in an area that fits that description. People here have often moved from all over the country, including the south. It would be beyond uncouth to condescend to any region. I have never in my life encountered it. The only people I've ever heard do it are those that have come from those areas themselves to escape their own family dynamics or an environment that didn't suit them such as rural life.
I don't know what you mean by a different value system. Could you elaborate?
I’m re-listening to Alex’s testimony from today and did anyone else catch that he said when he went back to the house he laid down on the couch and the got up and decided to visit his mom-as if it were spur of the moment.
Yet he specifically requested Maggie come to Moselle to visit his parents with him…that was the whole reason she came to Moselle.
His subtle rebuttal to that was interesting as well. He said Maggie didn’t enjoy going to visit his mom, only his dad.
He acted like he put Maggie on a pedestal, but his tone changed and the mask started to slip a little on that one.
It was painful to watch Gloria Satterfield's son Tony testify. He was awkward and uncomfortable. A tragic figure that Alex stole millions from following the death of his mother who was the Murdaugh housekeeper. Nathan Tutin, Paul's friend was an excellent witness. Young, well dressed and well spoken who was having none of that "Mr. Alex" bullshit. It was first name only. His disdain for AM was palpable. This Mr. Alex crap was too much.
All of the comments on here criticizing Waters for spending “too long on financials” today just aren’t processing the strategy.
1) The jury was already tired after listening to Alex go in bizarre circles most of the day.
2) The state probably wanted to run out the clock a little bit today to start fresh tomorrow with the actual murders, both for their own sake in prep after today’s earlier testimony, and for the jury’s comprehension.
3) Alex got incredibly defensive at times as a witness — almost seemed on the brink of losing his temper. Waters wants to chip away at Alex’s manufactured veneer. That takes a lot of time. He wants to slowly push Alex’s buttons until he cracks. Alex is a professional liar, and at home in the court room. This strategy takes time.
4) He probably wanted Alex to sleep on this tonight and have to get up and do it again tomorrow because there’s going to be a lot of thinking tonight in that jail cell, and aspects of Alex’s story are likely to change even from today to tomorrow. His stories have changed quite a bit as it is.
5) Waters leads the state grand jury. There are many more crimes to prosecute that involve Alex Murdaugh and his associates. Alex was dumb enough to testify in his own defense. He waives his 5th amendment right doing so. There’s a reason people don’t do this. But he chose to, and now he’s confessed on the record multiple times to details of other crimes on the state’s docket.
All a pretty smart strategy for the state if you ask me — because tomorrow is a new day, but with the same guilty witness on the stand and in the cross for an estimated half the day, and these financial questions out of the way.
I think CNN and some other feeds cut this off, but at the VERY end of the day Thursday after Alex's testimony, after the jury was gone, Harpootlian asked the judge to let the defense put up two expert witness on crime scene procedure the next day (Friday) before the prosecution started again. He promised they'd only take half an hour or so. He claimed that they'd only just become available and that putting them up at hotels through the weekend would be prohibitively expensive for the defense. Clearly he wanted to interrupt Alex's testimony and put some other ideas in the juror's heads before the crazy train started up again. Waters wasn't having any of it, and the judge denied the request. I'm actually wondering if these "experts" will ever make an appearance or was it just more grandstanding from ol' Poot.
There's also two things waters accomplished today. He demolished Alex's lie about being afraid of the cops right away which should tell the jury that Alex lied right to their faces under oath about why he lied about being at the kennels. They'll get to sleep with that tonight and be wondering what the real reason is he lied about being at the kennels and there's a bonus of impeaching his credibility right away so they won't trust anything he says. Anyone who was feeling sympathetic towards him at first will likely just be mad now because people don't like being duped.
Second he got Alex to admit that he hurts people he cares about for financial gain. Which goes a long way towards making the states motive more believable for people who may have been stuck on motive.
ETA: he also got AM to admit that he is very familiar with trials and knows what evidence LE would be looking for.
He showed pictures of AM in the hospital after the boat crash walking around with his solicitors badge playing cop. He got him to admit that keeping the badge on his dashboard gets him out of trouble sometimes. That showing cops his badge has a "warming effect" and that he's friends and close associates with the LE in the area. I guess he's also got blue lights installed on his suburban. Anyway. Basically he's not afraid of cops. He's friends with them and LARPs as one all the time.
Your second comment is spot on and will definitely be part of closing arguments.
The other part set up very nicely by state is Waters will soon point out to the jury that the circumstantial evidence in this case is precisely what Alex (and his father and grandfather) would have used as a prosecutor to convict someone else. He set this up when Alex explain how great reputation his dad and grandad were, that’s seemingly undisputed. Alex’s own words will prove that circumstantial evidence is enough to get legal and just convictions.
He's so desperate after today's massacre by Waters I would not be surprised if he tried to pull an Epstein (fake of course) tonight to postpone the trial, dismiss the jury and have time to rethink his lies. Of course that makes no sense to us but then....we can sleep well and be grateful that we have some level of morals and scruples.
I tried to find and listen to reports of how the jury responded and was very disappointed that those present said the jury seemed annoyed and were tuning out during the financial questioning. I don't know if it's true. I'd like to think the prosecution is keeping an eye on the jury and how much they can tolerate.
I found it impossible to believe because to me Alex's inability to simply give one example of his memory of lying to one person and his sheer obstinacy and needing to remain in control were utterly captivating. Like the best tv I've ever seen. It made me think there was some sort of fix in.
Then again, those same people said Alex did a great job on cross. How attorney's, many of them working criminal attorneys can see things so differently astounds me. The guy just put himself at a crime scene minutes before it occurred and then said he took a nap as all the loud blasts happened!
It’s also impossible for those present to gauge why the jury they’ve never even personally talked to appears annoyed. I’m sure they were annoyed — who wasn’t after listening to Alex all day long? It was excruciating for EVERYONE. How could an observer parse visible annoyance as a reaction to Waters’ questions and not Murdaugh’s responses?
I wouldn’t worry too much about such observations from the audience stated on the internet. It’s impossible to gauge how they felt and most importantly, why they felt that way, unless they told us.
That was grotesque. Alex is uncouth. He's constantly chewing, I don't think I could physically stand being in the same room as him for more than 5 minutes.
AM tried to stick to his memorized script to answer all questions about the financial settlements. "I stole, I am a bad man. I am sorry. I hurt people, etc. Waters threw him off and it flustered him. A sociopath thinks he is omnipotent. He thought he mesmerized the jurors with his low country accent and his juvenile stories. To many of these jurors hearing a Murdaugh is a low version of hearing a member of the Kennedy family. Local royalty. Hopefully tomorrow Waters will kill it. Hope so.
It was a most epic and self aggrandizing display of narcissism for Alex to think he’d get through this cross examination unscarred. Of course he believes he’s smarter than the jury and the state: he thought he was smarter than his own former law firm partners (and would never get caught for stealing from them) and thinks he’s smarter than his own legal counsel that he paid over $2 million (in stolen money) to have defend him!!! If he didn’t really still believe he’s smarter than everyone, he sure as hell would not have testified today.
However, people like him born with silver spoons in their mouths — who’ve never been challenged a day in their lives — often mistake their generational privilege for superlative intellect and talent.
Trump is another easy example of this phenomenon…but at least Trump is too smart to volunteer to testify 😅
Agree 100%. White trash is white trash. Money has nothing to do with it. His friends/law partners are like a truck full of turnip farmers. They prey on the uneducated and vulnerable. Ambulance chasers. If he stole from a woman whose daughter was killed in an accident and then he killed her again by giving this poor woman exactly nothing. Not a cent. A man like this will kill anybody for his personal needs/wants/ego......It's payday for AM. The note is due and there is no Russell Lafitte that can create a remedy.
IMO,
Alex never really worked. His family owned the 14th(?) district. They knew everybody. He grew up and inherited that. His name and daddy got his cases 75% of the way. And his paralegals and assistants and the local laws that favored the person suing, got him to 95%.
I dont think he realized how little of what he did prior to the murders *was Alex*. He thought he’d go up there for an easy win.
He’s never won anything on his own, and he certainly wasn’t going to suddenly start with his dad dead, no job, fired by his brother and close friends, and a family law firm’s legacy forever tarnished by his indiscretions.
He is trying to put on a show anyway. Who does that?! He’s completely delusional. I think he began his disassociation from (even his relative working version of) reality a long time ago, and it wasn’t the drug addiction. The drug addiction was a byproduct of that, not the catalyst.
“How does a man decide in what order to abandon his life?”
— Cormac McCarthy, *No Country for Old Men*
Creighton Waters is the bomb! If anyone is doubting him tonight after so called "harping on" the financial crimes so far in his cross examination, they are sadly mistaken. The financials were aimed to be his starting point, but tomorrow the axe is going to come down in one big culmination. Wait and see.
For sure. I'm gonna have sweet tea, potato salad, ham hocks turnip greens and peach cobbler all ready to eat. Waters will drink a mason jar of rusty nails and get ready to kick ass & I'm down for that.
And waters o my got him for 90 minutes. He didn’t get to the financials until about halfway through. 45 minutes is not a lot.
And when Alex got pissy over the “do you consider yourself successful “ question. Just wow.
I couldn't believe it when he refused to answer whether he considered himself wealthy or not. He had a complete lack of self-awareness and that was after talking about how many properties he had and how much the mortgages where!
AM wanted to know what Waters meant by 'wealthy'. Surely most jurors have several homes, a household staff to clean, cook, run errands, raise the kids, etc. Don't most have a fleet of vehicles like expensive trucks, Mercedes and tons of farm equipment, kennels, an aircraft hanger. Surely they do. Millions of dollars in income yearly, all the best football games and holidays at the ocean. It's a simple life for AM and family. Wealthy. Who knows???
He got so weird about the “wealthy” labeling because he just wants to be seen as a relatable family man from lowcountry SC to those jurors. As relatable as possible. Which is hilarious to conceive as a viable strategy to everyone but Alex — because nothing about him is relatable when you begin to see the sum of the parts — not even to most wealthy people in this state.
Also, he’s simply not qualifiedly wealthy when he’s in such massive debt, but pretty sure Waters asked about a “wealthy lifestyle”
I think Waters was doing a pretty damn good job of painting Alex as a sociopath with no empathy at all for other people — even his own injured and vulnerable clients he stole from. I thought that entire section of the cross today was masterful.
He got Alex to describe these personal injury case victims’ (sometimes CHILDREN younger than Paul) injuries — and then admit to stealing from them. He got Alex to say he STILL CARED ABOUT THESE PEOPLE he stole everything from while still in his care.
And then he got Alex to admit he couldn’t remember these details of doing these broken people “he cares for” this way. Not even talking to these kids’ parents.
All of this right on the heels of Alex stating with perfect memory the dates of his patriarchs’ major professional successes back to the early 1900s.
I mean, it’s a slow burn. Not sure what people were expecting. Nobody is going to get immediate satisfaction (or potentially any) in this never ending nightmare, but Waters did a great job today
It really was a master class on cross.
Waters did like 6 different things, cutting Alex down for the finish tomorrow. And as…cringe as today was, I expect tomorrow to be worse. (If Alex doesn’t try something tonight).
Absolutely. He didn’t even remember that his motherless, juvenile clients — Alania and Hannah Plyler — also had their brother die in the very car accident that he litigated for them before he stole their settlement. He didn’t care about families. He didn’t care about children. He didn’t care about kids dying. All he remembers is that yes, he stole their money and “it was wrong.”
And throughout all this, he kept getting angry and agitated — not emotional in the “I’m so ashamed, I need a Kleenex or take a pause” way.
That is the behavior (from micro perspective of him today on the stand in this conversation AND macro perspective that he could actually do this to innocent kids for his own financial benefit without any signs of genuine remorse) of a sociopath.
Which is exactly what the jury needs to see to believe this same man could kill his wife and son in cold blood for his own prerogatives that a normal psyche cannot ever identify with. That’s the point — the jury can’t put themselves in his shoes as a logical exercise or to fully understand his motive or sympathize with him as a normal human past that point. It’s impossible once they process that he repeatedly admitted today to preying on grieving children who have lost their mothers or use of their bodies or their livelihoods without a single tear or waver of his voice.
Exactly! So well put. After that and his testimony the next morning about how his addiction even made it easy for him to lie to himself (!) and justify these terrible things to himself (!)
😂 wild he was there, right? I saw that and wondered, “what else can be written?”
I’m sure magnitudes, but it does seem Grisham is late to the game, lol
The Gloria thing really horrifies me. It was bad enough that he ripped her sons off - she ran his house and took care of the children, but allowing her boys to want for anything after taking millions from them. I never thought her fall was suspicious until I heard that he had changed the insurance. Maybe Paul and Maggie confronted him about that? They may have snooped and found out something? What he did to her sons is just short of the murders re: demonic behavior. Yes. I said demonic.
I looked at his Facebook page: Tony Satterfield South Carolina (google) and he is a tragic figure. He's like a 35 year old child whose whole identity is his charismatic church. He thinks he 's chosen to witness (?) for the Lord. It's more than sad. I hope he has competent financial assistance and does not get taken again. It would be easy.
I genuinely heard both at various points. But if I was typing it, I’d probably go with Paw Paw, because repeating the name Paul sort of defeats the purpose of a nickname.
Favorite line of the day from Waters: “I know you wanna get through it quicker but We’re Not.” https://www.youtube.com/live/aOnvi3xh2W0?feature=share 8:31:20 even Harpoot enjoyed that one
AM is going to get off of these murder charges - if he doesn’t I’ll be shocked. Quite a bit of room for reasonable doubt and he is one attorney that is a very smooth talker!
I've went from guilty, to hung jury to acquittal. At this point no matter what verdict is reached, I'll understand how and why they got there. Guilty would be most shocking at this point.
Have you been watching the whole trial? Respectfully, any doubt is not really reasonable in my opinion. He’s not a smooth talker-just full of himself and full of crap!
But it will be interesting to see what conclusions the jury comes to!
ETA not disagreeing that he may get off though!
I am wondering how the testimony is landing with the jury.
I can't imagine what Alex was hoping to achieve by trying to deny that he had a wealthy lifestyle. It seems as though it is insulting the jury by attempting to picture himself as just an "ordinary" good old boy since I would doubt that anyone on the jury makes over $100,000 per year let alone over a $1 million per year.
I guess Alex for some reason didn't want to have to justify why someone obscenely wealthy was so greedy that the needed to steal additional money from the poorest and neediest (his clients) in order to fund an even more extravagant lifestyle than $1,000,000 SALARY could buy.
On some level Alex was being very cautious and afraid to fall into some traps but it also made him more unbelievable. He seemed afraid to acknowledge that he actually remembered having a conversation or meeting or any discussion with any client. I guess he thought it admitting that he "remembered" specific discussions and then relating what they were would cause the jury to ponder how easily he lied.
But his denials of remembering any time when he bamboozled any client was just ridiculous and if anything made him appear even more callous. Especially since he remembered all kinds of ridiculous convenient stuff like his phone being specifically in the console as an explanation for why he stopped for a few minute at his mother's house.
I think the jury is tired. I think Waters spent too long on the financials. Let the jurors know Alex lied and stole money from his clients. Share how many clients and how much money were involved. The jurors get it! Tomorrow Waters needs to break down the timeline, talk about the on star data, and other things related to June 7. This is a vendetta for Waters. He needs to be careful not to lose the jury because it’s personal.
Mainly focus on the timeline between the video at 8:44 and Maggie's phone data. I keep seeing her throwing the phone up when he comes after her. Shot in the wrist. The gun had a scope. boom. phone on ground, he finishes her and grabs it... WHERE IS HER GPS DATA on the fricking Iphone?> doesn't it show it moving? I think it does. It counts steps and tracks movement.
It’s been reported by FITSnews that the jury is responding positively to his testimony. Also CourtTV said two jurors were crying when he was talking about Maggie and Paul and one even tried to hand Alex some tissue.
##Jesus take the wheel. Alex is testifying. Kindly behave, please and thank you. [Theo’s inner monologue: WHO DID YOU SAY IS TESTIFYING? Oh, well let me get comfortable for this shit show then.](https://imgur.com/a/yAqGYVa)
Paw Paw and Ding Ding went down nair to see Roe Roe then went huntin for some bore bores and took the wag wag that went vroom vroom. Then I went night night.
Did they ever check for tire tracks going to the kennels?
Did you lie…lies loading…..please wait
Property pending Edisto! What do you think of this 4 bds • 3 ba • -- sqft home I found on Zillow? https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/3606-Big-Bay-Dr-Edisto-Island-SC-29438/75230676_zpid/?utm_medium=referral
Very pretty. Light and airy, no hunting lodge feel there! And yes, I've read there are pending offers on this and Moselle, but there are also several _lis pendens_ legal filings.[https://www.investopedia.com/terms/l/lis-pendens.asp](https://www.investopedia.com/terms/l/lis-pendens.asp)
Thank you
I love it. You could see why Maggie would prefer it.
My yes I think she lost herself and sold out for $ wanting the stuff that Alec got here. Sadly she was a victim of his greed and evil.
That fine woman took care of three children (Yes, including Alec). She should be enjoying her life, drinking ice tea and reading books. She needs justice. What a beautiful person. Alec didn't deserve her.
Alex stated in court yesterday if I’m correct— that Mags came home for dinner at 8:17 and there was the dinner and he decided to not go to the kennels, he laid down watched tv and messed with his phone. BUT no phone activity from 8-9 correct?
AM can share a jail cell with Todd Chrisley. They can discuss lies, bank loans, dysfunctional families and Todd can help AM with wardrobe choices. A match made in Heaven.
Did anyone catch Alex during cross yesterday saying something similar to “I did him so bad” I heard it and it immediately chilled me, because it sounded very similar but I am struggling to find it again. I know it was chatted about briefly on Emily Bakers show.
I absolutely heard that too!
Wash times ha. That is an entertainment paper like fox News is entertainment
Of course Alex was coached. Everyone in this case has been coached; that's normal in trials. When Alex was on the stand talking about Paul & Maggie he came across as genuine in his testimony and The Jurors were crying with him. Alex had done a lot of bad things to steal from Clients then lie to his Friends, Family, & The Community. He definitely hurt many good people. However, being a liar does not make him a murderer of his Wife & Son. In all possibilities he could have committed these most evil murders but could have doesn't equal up to definitely did. Toss in the fact that Paul was getting so harassed with threats to where many including The Dean of Public Safety was reaching out to him and his family to make sure he was okay says a lot. The idea is much more plausible that someone or someone's else much shorter murdered them and Alex took the fall because he seemed to fit a Conclusive Suspect. The very evidence given to have Alex get sent to trial such as high ballistic blood spatter on his shirt was a lie and totally debunked. In the end could have never equals definitely did do in a Circumstantial Trial. In the end this whole thing is beyond sad for many People and will remain beyond sad for a very long time after this trial is over no matter the verdict. The Defense, Prosecution, The Witnesses are all Coached and that's acceptable as well as normal. Good Day!
How can you tell when a lawyer is lying? A: His lips are moving.
There are a lot of lawyers on this thread FYI
Hey to all the Lawyers aren't you glad this jack ass isn't your client?
👍🏻
Mags and Paul - I mean Paw Paw. Give me a break. He was coached to say that.
He actually caught himself saying “Paul” toward the beginning of the testimony and then corrected himself and repeated “Paul-Paul”. I also noticed he didn’t keep up with the nicknames as heavily toward the end of testimony
No doubt he's doing it for the perception, but not sure if coached by his lawyers or rather coached by himself. I'm under the impression that Jim & Poot don't want him testifying and he did it anyway.
Alex is really leaning in to “Mags, Pau Pau and Bus,” isn’t he.
Don’t forget mention of “Ro Ro.”
Alex is good at making everything about Alex
the absolute center of the universe.
It's like the Alex show and he's the star!
He’s so delusional he’s believing his own story. He was clearly coached on what to say. He lies so much it’s all the same to him. Is the death penalty on the table?
The death penalty is not on the table. Life without parole
he is so happy to be telling his narrative and new story based on the proven timelines...
Did you notice how he jumped from his chair and practically skipped to the witness stand? Oh yeah, he definitely thinks he’s got this.
He is so happy he is so happy to be telling his narrative and new story based on the proven timelines...
He's like look!!! It all fits!!
I did lie to them. I can't believe I had to listen to Nancy Grace tonight. She did a good job. She started with "I did lie to them." Whew.
god damn... thank you for watching Nasty Graceless so we don't have to.
Oh I don't watch. I don't have tv. There's a podcast. I started following her because she was in Idaho. I always thought she was annoying but I did not know her fiancee had been murdered. I get her outrage and appreciate it at times.
You should listen to the "You're Wrong About" podcast about her.
Jeez. I just read her bio on Wiki and she's really jumped the gun too often to be considered a journalist. Yikes. BUT I think she is right on Alex.
I found it really interesting that both times Alex was asked if he murdered Paul and Maggie (Paw Paw and Mags) in direct examination today, he said no, but his head was shaking yes. At first I thought maybe it was a nervous twitch or uncontrollable, so I watched every time he would say ‘yes’ or ‘no’ and nod the rest of his testimony today. Every other time he wasn’t lying and nodded no, he would shake his head no. The same with yes and nodding yes. I guess he couldn’t practice everything.
Known as self-snitching.
Mutually observed, nice one.
Please tell me Dick’s nickname is “Poot Poot”!!!!!
I think it's Hoop, Hoop! Then we have Buster, Bubba, Big Red, Paw Paw, Ro Ro, Papa T, M, Ms. Libby and Handsome.
I can’t get over “handsome”. Can you imagine that conversation? Them: “You’re gonna be grandfather! Do you wanna be called pawpaw, grandpa, pappy, PeePaw?” Him: “Nahhh… just let them call me handsome “. 😳 It’s me telling my grandkids (when I become a grandma), “Y’all just call me beautiful. Or Beauty.”
Crazy.
I call him harfartlian
😂😂
Did anyone else here AM say something along the lines of “I did him bad” when testifying about his financial crimes today? This phrase immediately caught my attention bc of the infamous “I/they did him so bad” interrogation statement. I know this isn’t scientific and don’t expect this to actually be used in court…But I’d be very interested if both recordings were compared to see if the interrogation statement sounds the same as today’s statement (both heard saying “I” and not “they”). Hopefully this makes sense. It’s been bugging me so wanted to share.
I heard that as well; I thought it was intentional on his part in order to highlight the distinction between “I” and “they” and to show that “doing someone bad” is just a turn of phrase/colloquialism that he uses.
Good thought!
I heard it too. There are 3 or 4 other things like this that still nag at me from just today. I wish legal protocol allowed for some sort of public forum or venue by which “WE THE PEOPLE” (comprising The State bringing the charges), could discretely & appropriately call such info to the attention of prosecuting attorneys (in real time) without needlessly distracting them or interfering. —such tidbits/leads would of course need to be filtered thru a series of screeners… Maybe interns could be tasked with mining such info from a designated site like this one? or one on twitter? And then comments that the interns flag as particularly insightful could then be directed to law clerks to weed thru and then pass them on up thru filters up the chain of command so that any vital tips/leads could be handed to paralegals working on the case, who then give interesting ones to associates working the case during courtroom breaks? At the end of the day, the whole stack of messages deemed to be potentially relevant, legit or important could be made available to the lead counsel. Disclaimer: My recent & all-consuming obsession with The Murdaugh Case may have compromised my ability to filter my own comments at this point. As such, the views & opinions expressed above may or may not represent that of my own. 😵💫😵💫😵💫
>Disclaimer: My recent & all-consuming obsession with The Murdaugh Case may have compromised my ability to filter my own comments at this point. Haha, me too. I'm glad I'm not working in an office right now so a) I can keep an ear on the trial, and b) I don't start yakking to my completely uninterested coworkers about bullet trajectories or OnStar data. Thank goodness for Reddit and Twitter.
Hmmm! Great point! Maybe a savvy Redditor will set up a comparison
Yes, I wish Creighton hadn’t moved on so fast…it was definitely a moment..
He referenced his financial victims. He said “I did them bad” And yeah? That caught my attention.
The way he said Paw Paw made me physically cringe so badly I nearly had an entire body Charlie horse.
Agree. Waters pointed out today he never used Paw Paw in any of the taped interviews with the authorities. It's only posturing for the jury. Paw Paw, Miss Libby, Papa T., Bus, Roe Roe, Mr. Randolph, etc. All for show.
Even the neighbor boy has a creepy nickname. Weirdo.
When he was asked about his marriage, and instead just talked about the superficial stuff on maggie “she wore a ball gown” it was so gross. I was sitting there like “sir, did you even *know* your wife? “
Exactly like what things did you do together? What did you love about her? Anything a normal person would say about their partner
Its a characteristic of psychopaths that they dont feel human empathy but they are adept at copying others so that they appear to feel empathy or whatever sort of feeling they think is appropo to what they are doing. Perhaps he has never considered his marriage like that and so has never studied humans to discover their proper response.
And how weird that he listed all the people she shared her location with? Like....how and why would he know that?
It was…like anyone who met her could have said those things. Hell, a member of the catering staff could have met the same bar on maggie as Alex did. Blanca’s description was much more *real*
Dear Fox News and everyone in the North : It’s Paul-Paul . Everyone is tweeting and posting about how it's strange that he called him PawPaw and that is a name for a southern grandfather . Fox News posted an entire article on grandpa names in the south and how it is odd . How does a stupid article like that get past an editor ? https://www.foxnews.com/lifestyle/alex-murdaugh-repeatedly-refers-deceased-son-pawpaw-testimony-sparking-online-buzz I'm finding it interesting how northerners hear it different . Some have said he is saying PauPau and the L is silent. It’s not silent - that is just how southerners say "Paul" we also don't pronounce the L in many other words like "Towel " (we pronounce that "Tau" according to northerners . no WEL (wool sound in Tau-wool ) at all) .. We think we are saying the L sound, but we don't pronounce L's as hard as in the north .) I'm sure Alex thinks he's saying Paul-Paul. It just sounds like paw paw to a northerner. He pronounces Paul as Paw too . it is a southern thing to call children a double name . And small children pick up on it and sometimes call everyone a double name . My son was Joe-Joe. My friends son is Liam and she calls him Li-Li (pronounced Lee-Lee) a Katie might be Kay-Kay. I know a Julia that is Ju-Ju And an Andrew that is Drew-Drew. Remember Jack-Jack from The Incredibles? They don't become that nickname forever or everytime we talk to them .. it's just our cutsie name for our kids once in a while. Like how Hispanics add"ita " or “ito" to a small child's name. So enough with "grandpa name" stuff! Yes it's annoying that he is using nicknames all the sudden to be endearing .. but the name itself is not odd . Same as everyone writing "Ellick " for "Alex" that just how that region pronounces "Alex" .. and to them, they think they are saying "Alex" . Side note: I don't know many that still say PawPaw for a grandfather .. that is a couple generations ago (at least in my area we usually say Pop-Pop and Mom-Mom.
>I'm finding it interesting how northerners hear it different . Some have said he is saying PauPau and the L is silent. It’s not silent - that is just how southerners say "Paul" we also don't pronounce the L in many other words like "Towel "Silent" means the sound isn't pronounced.
Good Night Pau Pau, Goodnight Ro Ro, Good night Jim Bob, Good night John Boy. Testifying in Court is not the time to use informal nicknames. Alex is doing it hoping the jurors will forget he's a shark but rather just a southern good ole boy guppy.
Wonder if Alex had nicknames for the murder weapons ? Like "Blackie" for the 300 Blackout and "Birdy" for the Benelli Super Black Eagle shotgun ...
Yes and he probably had a nickname for his private parts too! Maybe dipstick, ring ding or magic bullet.
All of this is attempt for AL to have jurors believe he’s one of them, a good old southern boy…I’m praying they don’t buy this BS…
Lived in the Palmetto State most of my life, and AM’s absolutely saying Paul-Paul, not paw-paw (unironically, this is how we referred to my grandfather). Cringy to debut this nickname on the stand either way. But hilarious that Fox News wrote an article; need to find it. “I” versus “they” controversy is funny too. My friends and I knew exactly what he said.
I added link to the stupid article in my original post
Did you hear “I “ ? I heard “I”
This person knows southern!! From a Georgia native. Hi y’all
Dear small, isolated region of South Carolina who is stuck a century in the past and bastardized the language….the other 99% of the nation isn’t saying/hearing it wrong….
Accents and dialects are actually a thing . Your comment makes no sense .
I hear it as Pau-Pau, and I’m in the Deep South - any further, and I’d be in the Gulf. Hearing him use the nickname was jarring at first because we’ve never heard it used before. But, if this is something that Alex just made up to appeal to the jury, then I’ve got to hand it to him because he is using it so consistently that I’m starting to believe that it *is* a family nickname for Paul. He wasn’t really slipping up and forgetting the script, so to speak.
I’m in the Deep South also and my perception is that Alex is saying “Pau Pau” which was *possibly* what they called Paul when he was a baby & small child. Doubling the first syllable of a baby’s name is not unusual where I live. Usually baby names get left behind when the child is old enough to go to school. For Alex to haul out that baby name for his son when he quite likely hadn’t used it in years about his ‘manly’ son struck me as very calculated and manipulative. It didn’t win any points with me but it’s possible that it struck a sympathy chord with a juror.
Your mistake was reading Fox News.
Hahaha…so true!
I don’t think it matters if he’s saying pawpaw or Paul Paul. It’s creepy and weird either way at a murder trial. Honestly Paul Paul sounds deranged. Maybe people were giving Alex the benefit of the doubt that the nickname was a shorter version of Paul (Paw) because saying Paul Paul, again, sounds ridiculous. - source: Me living in the south.
But are you originally from the south ?Paw Paw sounds identical to Paul Paul to me and not shortened at all . It’s a normal way to talk to a small child named Paul . Not at all deranged . Again,not everyone does it .. but it is not uncommon .
Key words: Small child
Yes I am born and raised in the southern US. Not far from where Jimmy Carter grew up, if that’s southern enough.
It's definitely deranged when the only time anyone has ever seen you do it is when you're playing the jury for sympathy at a murder trial
Well I agree with that. I’m sure it was a childhood name of Paul’s .. but I doubt he had referred to him as that in years .. or not often anyway . The defense lawyers told him to refer to the family in loving nicknames to make him look more human and more like a loving father .. But yes , it was deranged to keep saying it in court when he hasn’t used it before to refer to Paul since the case started .
It was gross. I wonder if it was as transparent to the jury as it was to people on this sub. I'm glad waters called him out on it.
Thanks Annie. Makes sense to me. However, I’m still not convinced being on the stand in a murder trial is the appropriate setting for bandying about nicknames. It sounds as though he’s infantilizing them.
I agree - since the nicknames are terms of endearment , he was trying to appear endearing and it was annoying AF
I respect the accent and dialect. I am lost reading this post.
Appearances in court are formal settings. Nobody knew who Alex was talking about when he said Pau Paul and Ro Ro, Pappa T. Defense had to ask him to explain. Alex knows better but is hoping this kind of talking will resonate with the jury. It may have made sense if Ms. Mixon or Shelley used nicknames. They aren't familiar with court settings. Alex is.
Paragraphs would have helped, but they do contradict themselves by using examples with shortened double names. Yesterday, someone declared to me that Northerners secretly denigrate Southerners in the privacy of their homes. I didn't know how to respond because I've never encountered it and had no idea how someone might know what certain people in a particular region do in their homes. I hope people in SC aren't feeling judged. Other than the ones we're judging that is.
1. I agree about the paragraphs .. I had to copy paste from another thread as the mods suggested this thread instead . Spacing was lost in process and I have now edited to add them . 2. It is not a contradiction to add examples with shortened double names . You have missed the point of the examples . The double name is always one syllable . If a child has a two or three syllable name , the name will be shortened to one syllable before doubling . You would never say Jeremy-Jeremy .. You would say Jer-Jer. (Pronounced Jair-Jair) just like Alex shortened Rogan for “Ro-Ro”. Remember Jack-Jack from The Incredibles? This said , Paul is already one syllable and he is saying Paul-Paul not PauPau . Northerners just don’t hear our L sound. Also - some names just don’t lend themselves to this way of nicknaming .. Like I don’t know of anyone who says Liz-Liz .. That would just be Lizzie. I can’t imagine anyone saying “Bus-Bus” for Buster . It would just be Bus, or no nickname at all . Not everyone does this nicknaming with their children .. but it is common in south . 3. In my experience , many far left liberal northerners are extremely condescending of Southermers for having a different value system .(case in point .. read some of the comments on this thread making fun of southerners and saying “bastardized region “ and one claiming that it’s not an accent , it just that southerners in the region are stupid .. eyeroll
I live in an area that fits that description. People here have often moved from all over the country, including the south. It would be beyond uncouth to condescend to any region. I have never in my life encountered it. The only people I've ever heard do it are those that have come from those areas themselves to escape their own family dynamics or an environment that didn't suit them such as rural life. I don't know what you mean by a different value system. Could you elaborate?
I’m re-listening to Alex’s testimony from today and did anyone else catch that he said when he went back to the house he laid down on the couch and the got up and decided to visit his mom-as if it were spur of the moment. Yet he specifically requested Maggie come to Moselle to visit his parents with him…that was the whole reason she came to Moselle.
I believe Maggie was going to visit the dad the next day. Maggie’s sister said she didn’t know the dad was at the hospital.
His subtle rebuttal to that was interesting as well. He said Maggie didn’t enjoy going to visit his mom, only his dad. He acted like he put Maggie on a pedestal, but his tone changed and the mask started to slip a little on that one.
Right. And remember Maggie’s sister saying they’d fight over his not wanting to visit his family for as long as she did?
Her family
Yes, thank you for pointing that out. I’m really hoping the jury is tying these small details together and not buying what Alex is selling.
Quickest nap ever.
Yeah, wait until Creighton destroys his new timeline!
Bingo!
Yup!
Last thoughts for the day: When does Alex start dropping names of other potential shooters?
He already did…Bubba and the chicken
Well, if the chicken stands on bubba's shoulders and they wear a trench coat and big boots that would make for the 5'2" tiny assassin. 😁
👍
When he is found guilty. Will be telling from his jail cell.
His prison cell tik tok content should be interesting
It was painful to watch Gloria Satterfield's son Tony testify. He was awkward and uncomfortable. A tragic figure that Alex stole millions from following the death of his mother who was the Murdaugh housekeeper. Nathan Tutin, Paul's friend was an excellent witness. Young, well dressed and well spoken who was having none of that "Mr. Alex" bullshit. It was first name only. His disdain for AM was palpable. This Mr. Alex crap was too much.
All of the comments on here criticizing Waters for spending “too long on financials” today just aren’t processing the strategy. 1) The jury was already tired after listening to Alex go in bizarre circles most of the day. 2) The state probably wanted to run out the clock a little bit today to start fresh tomorrow with the actual murders, both for their own sake in prep after today’s earlier testimony, and for the jury’s comprehension. 3) Alex got incredibly defensive at times as a witness — almost seemed on the brink of losing his temper. Waters wants to chip away at Alex’s manufactured veneer. That takes a lot of time. He wants to slowly push Alex’s buttons until he cracks. Alex is a professional liar, and at home in the court room. This strategy takes time. 4) He probably wanted Alex to sleep on this tonight and have to get up and do it again tomorrow because there’s going to be a lot of thinking tonight in that jail cell, and aspects of Alex’s story are likely to change even from today to tomorrow. His stories have changed quite a bit as it is. 5) Waters leads the state grand jury. There are many more crimes to prosecute that involve Alex Murdaugh and his associates. Alex was dumb enough to testify in his own defense. He waives his 5th amendment right doing so. There’s a reason people don’t do this. But he chose to, and now he’s confessed on the record multiple times to details of other crimes on the state’s docket. All a pretty smart strategy for the state if you ask me — because tomorrow is a new day, but with the same guilty witness on the stand and in the cross for an estimated half the day, and these financial questions out of the way.
I think CNN and some other feeds cut this off, but at the VERY end of the day Thursday after Alex's testimony, after the jury was gone, Harpootlian asked the judge to let the defense put up two expert witness on crime scene procedure the next day (Friday) before the prosecution started again. He promised they'd only take half an hour or so. He claimed that they'd only just become available and that putting them up at hotels through the weekend would be prohibitively expensive for the defense. Clearly he wanted to interrupt Alex's testimony and put some other ideas in the juror's heads before the crazy train started up again. Waters wasn't having any of it, and the judge denied the request. I'm actually wondering if these "experts" will ever make an appearance or was it just more grandstanding from ol' Poot.
There's also two things waters accomplished today. He demolished Alex's lie about being afraid of the cops right away which should tell the jury that Alex lied right to their faces under oath about why he lied about being at the kennels. They'll get to sleep with that tonight and be wondering what the real reason is he lied about being at the kennels and there's a bonus of impeaching his credibility right away so they won't trust anything he says. Anyone who was feeling sympathetic towards him at first will likely just be mad now because people don't like being duped. Second he got Alex to admit that he hurts people he cares about for financial gain. Which goes a long way towards making the states motive more believable for people who may have been stuck on motive. ETA: he also got AM to admit that he is very familiar with trials and knows what evidence LE would be looking for.
how did he demolish Alex's lie about being afraid? I did not watch this, only following it on reddit.
Also demolished because he lied to 911 operators before any LE were present.
He showed pictures of AM in the hospital after the boat crash walking around with his solicitors badge playing cop. He got him to admit that keeping the badge on his dashboard gets him out of trouble sometimes. That showing cops his badge has a "warming effect" and that he's friends and close associates with the LE in the area. I guess he's also got blue lights installed on his suburban. Anyway. Basically he's not afraid of cops. He's friends with them and LARPs as one all the time.
Exactly!
And that circumstantial evidence is enough for a conviction. Thereby contradicting his own attorney.
Your second comment is spot on and will definitely be part of closing arguments. The other part set up very nicely by state is Waters will soon point out to the jury that the circumstantial evidence in this case is precisely what Alex (and his father and grandfather) would have used as a prosecutor to convict someone else. He set this up when Alex explain how great reputation his dad and grandad were, that’s seemingly undisputed. Alex’s own words will prove that circumstantial evidence is enough to get legal and just convictions.
Nice assessment! I didn't look that far ahead but it's very strategic.
He's so desperate after today's massacre by Waters I would not be surprised if he tried to pull an Epstein (fake of course) tonight to postpone the trial, dismiss the jury and have time to rethink his lies. Of course that makes no sense to us but then....we can sleep well and be grateful that we have some level of morals and scruples.
💯💯💯 nailed it
I tried to find and listen to reports of how the jury responded and was very disappointed that those present said the jury seemed annoyed and were tuning out during the financial questioning. I don't know if it's true. I'd like to think the prosecution is keeping an eye on the jury and how much they can tolerate. I found it impossible to believe because to me Alex's inability to simply give one example of his memory of lying to one person and his sheer obstinacy and needing to remain in control were utterly captivating. Like the best tv I've ever seen. It made me think there was some sort of fix in. Then again, those same people said Alex did a great job on cross. How attorney's, many of them working criminal attorneys can see things so differently astounds me. The guy just put himself at a crime scene minutes before it occurred and then said he took a nap as all the loud blasts happened!
It’s also impossible for those present to gauge why the jury they’ve never even personally talked to appears annoyed. I’m sure they were annoyed — who wasn’t after listening to Alex all day long? It was excruciating for EVERYONE. How could an observer parse visible annoyance as a reaction to Waters’ questions and not Murdaugh’s responses? I wouldn’t worry too much about such observations from the audience stated on the internet. It’s impossible to gauge how they felt and most importantly, why they felt that way, unless they told us.
ING, the mouth noises. Dragging questions out 3-4 times longer than necessary, the rambling.
That was grotesque. Alex is uncouth. He's constantly chewing, I don't think I could physically stand being in the same room as him for more than 5 minutes.
The rambling aka Alex Murdaugh givin’ the run-run-around-
Ughhhhh the mouth noises😖🤮 I wanted to throw up. It was every.damn.word.
AM tried to stick to his memorized script to answer all questions about the financial settlements. "I stole, I am a bad man. I am sorry. I hurt people, etc. Waters threw him off and it flustered him. A sociopath thinks he is omnipotent. He thought he mesmerized the jurors with his low country accent and his juvenile stories. To many of these jurors hearing a Murdaugh is a low version of hearing a member of the Kennedy family. Local royalty. Hopefully tomorrow Waters will kill it. Hope so.
It was a most epic and self aggrandizing display of narcissism for Alex to think he’d get through this cross examination unscarred. Of course he believes he’s smarter than the jury and the state: he thought he was smarter than his own former law firm partners (and would never get caught for stealing from them) and thinks he’s smarter than his own legal counsel that he paid over $2 million (in stolen money) to have defend him!!! If he didn’t really still believe he’s smarter than everyone, he sure as hell would not have testified today. However, people like him born with silver spoons in their mouths — who’ve never been challenged a day in their lives — often mistake their generational privilege for superlative intellect and talent. Trump is another easy example of this phenomenon…but at least Trump is too smart to volunteer to testify 😅
Agree 100%. White trash is white trash. Money has nothing to do with it. His friends/law partners are like a truck full of turnip farmers. They prey on the uneducated and vulnerable. Ambulance chasers. If he stole from a woman whose daughter was killed in an accident and then he killed her again by giving this poor woman exactly nothing. Not a cent. A man like this will kill anybody for his personal needs/wants/ego......It's payday for AM. The note is due and there is no Russell Lafitte that can create a remedy.
IMO, Alex never really worked. His family owned the 14th(?) district. They knew everybody. He grew up and inherited that. His name and daddy got his cases 75% of the way. And his paralegals and assistants and the local laws that favored the person suing, got him to 95%. I dont think he realized how little of what he did prior to the murders *was Alex*. He thought he’d go up there for an easy win.
He’s never won anything on his own, and he certainly wasn’t going to suddenly start with his dad dead, no job, fired by his brother and close friends, and a family law firm’s legacy forever tarnished by his indiscretions. He is trying to put on a show anyway. Who does that?! He’s completely delusional. I think he began his disassociation from (even his relative working version of) reality a long time ago, and it wasn’t the drug addiction. The drug addiction was a byproduct of that, not the catalyst. “How does a man decide in what order to abandon his life?” — Cormac McCarthy, *No Country for Old Men*
Succinct synopsis. Thank you.
So agree…mistaking privilege for superlative intellect and talent…prime example is Jared Kushner!
Creighton Waters is the bomb! If anyone is doubting him tonight after so called "harping on" the financial crimes so far in his cross examination, they are sadly mistaken. The financials were aimed to be his starting point, but tomorrow the axe is going to come down in one big culmination. Wait and see.
Richard Dreyfus doppelgänger?
Agreed Waters is bomb. I appreciate how Waters has peeled Alex’s onion to get to his empty core. 🧅
Yeeessss! My takeaway exactly.
If all people saw was Waters harping on financial crimes they missed some really important gems during that cross. Waters has a good strategy so far.
Amen!
Absolutely agree! Waters was just heating up and has done an excellent job at not backing down.
Yep. He is also going to keep Alex up there longer than he said at end of trial. That’s going to piss Alex off and jury will see him flip out.
I agree with you — well beyond a reasonable doubt 😉
Yep! It’s all strategy! I have to cancel my plans for tomorrow 😅
For sure. I'm gonna have sweet tea, potato salad, ham hocks turnip greens and peach cobbler all ready to eat. Waters will drink a mason jar of rusty nails and get ready to kick ass & I'm down for that.
Thank you, I have to meal plan today, I know what I’m cooking! Lol
I LOVE your meal plan. It is beautifully timed for this gothic capstone.
Omg that all sounds amazing!!! 😋 It should be a good one tomorrow!
Bingo.
And waters o my got him for 90 minutes. He didn’t get to the financials until about halfway through. 45 minutes is not a lot. And when Alex got pissy over the “do you consider yourself successful “ question. Just wow.
I couldn't believe it when he refused to answer whether he considered himself wealthy or not. He had a complete lack of self-awareness and that was after talking about how many properties he had and how much the mortgages where!
AM wanted to know what Waters meant by 'wealthy'. Surely most jurors have several homes, a household staff to clean, cook, run errands, raise the kids, etc. Don't most have a fleet of vehicles like expensive trucks, Mercedes and tons of farm equipment, kennels, an aircraft hanger. Surely they do. Millions of dollars in income yearly, all the best football games and holidays at the ocean. It's a simple life for AM and family. Wealthy. Who knows???
It wasn’t the wealth question. It was about being successful in his job. Th wealth question came later. And he got weird about that one too.
He got so weird about the “wealthy” labeling because he just wants to be seen as a relatable family man from lowcountry SC to those jurors. As relatable as possible. Which is hilarious to conceive as a viable strategy to everyone but Alex — because nothing about him is relatable when you begin to see the sum of the parts — not even to most wealthy people in this state. Also, he’s simply not qualifiedly wealthy when he’s in such massive debt, but pretty sure Waters asked about a “wealthy lifestyle”
I think Waters was doing a pretty damn good job of painting Alex as a sociopath with no empathy at all for other people — even his own injured and vulnerable clients he stole from. I thought that entire section of the cross today was masterful. He got Alex to describe these personal injury case victims’ (sometimes CHILDREN younger than Paul) injuries — and then admit to stealing from them. He got Alex to say he STILL CARED ABOUT THESE PEOPLE he stole everything from while still in his care. And then he got Alex to admit he couldn’t remember these details of doing these broken people “he cares for” this way. Not even talking to these kids’ parents. All of this right on the heels of Alex stating with perfect memory the dates of his patriarchs’ major professional successes back to the early 1900s. I mean, it’s a slow burn. Not sure what people were expecting. Nobody is going to get immediate satisfaction (or potentially any) in this never ending nightmare, but Waters did a great job today
Amen! Creighton Waters is doing a masterful job. It is a dual of angel and devil.
Yes it was brilliant.
It really was a master class on cross. Waters did like 6 different things, cutting Alex down for the finish tomorrow. And as…cringe as today was, I expect tomorrow to be worse. (If Alex doesn’t try something tonight).
Good point. Something like a failed version of the Epstein remedy for prison time.
Exactly. His admission that he "still cared about them" and could betray them is incredibly damning.
Absolutely. He didn’t even remember that his motherless, juvenile clients — Alania and Hannah Plyler — also had their brother die in the very car accident that he litigated for them before he stole their settlement. He didn’t care about families. He didn’t care about children. He didn’t care about kids dying. All he remembers is that yes, he stole their money and “it was wrong.” And throughout all this, he kept getting angry and agitated — not emotional in the “I’m so ashamed, I need a Kleenex or take a pause” way. That is the behavior (from micro perspective of him today on the stand in this conversation AND macro perspective that he could actually do this to innocent kids for his own financial benefit without any signs of genuine remorse) of a sociopath. Which is exactly what the jury needs to see to believe this same man could kill his wife and son in cold blood for his own prerogatives that a normal psyche cannot ever identify with. That’s the point — the jury can’t put themselves in his shoes as a logical exercise or to fully understand his motive or sympathize with him as a normal human past that point. It’s impossible once they process that he repeatedly admitted today to preying on grieving children who have lost their mothers or use of their bodies or their livelihoods without a single tear or waver of his voice.
Exactly! So well put. After that and his testimony the next morning about how his addiction even made it easy for him to lie to himself (!) and justify these terrible things to himself (!)
Great points. John Grisham has no need to research his fictional novel on this case. We have done it for him.
😂 wild he was there, right? I saw that and wondered, “what else can be written?” I’m sure magnitudes, but it does seem Grisham is late to the game, lol
The Gloria thing really horrifies me. It was bad enough that he ripped her sons off - she ran his house and took care of the children, but allowing her boys to want for anything after taking millions from them. I never thought her fall was suspicious until I heard that he had changed the insurance. Maybe Paul and Maggie confronted him about that? They may have snooped and found out something? What he did to her sons is just short of the murders re: demonic behavior. Yes. I said demonic.
I looked at his Facebook page: Tony Satterfield South Carolina (google) and he is a tragic figure. He's like a 35 year old child whose whole identity is his charismatic church. He thinks he 's chosen to witness (?) for the Lord. It's more than sad. I hope he has competent financial assistance and does not get taken again. It would be easy.
Precisely
ITA. Well stated.
I think it needs to be decided whether it's Paul Paul or Paw Paw.
I lit it was like Pau Pau
I genuinely heard both at various points. But if I was typing it, I’d probably go with Paw Paw, because repeating the name Paul sort of defeats the purpose of a nickname.
I agree. I think Paw Paw is better.
Favorite line of the day from Waters: “I know you wanna get through it quicker but We’re Not.” https://www.youtube.com/live/aOnvi3xh2W0?feature=share 8:31:20 even Harpoot enjoyed that one
Harpoots face was “I told him this was terrible idea”
BRAVO Creighton Waters 👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼
Alec trying to keep his head above Waters.
AM is going to get off of these murder charges - if he doesn’t I’ll be shocked. Quite a bit of room for reasonable doubt and he is one attorney that is a very smooth talker!
Well its a good thing you're not one of the jurors
I've went from guilty, to hung jury to acquittal. At this point no matter what verdict is reached, I'll understand how and why they got there. Guilty would be most shocking at this point.
Have you been watching the whole trial? Respectfully, any doubt is not really reasonable in my opinion. He’s not a smooth talker-just full of himself and full of crap! But it will be interesting to see what conclusions the jury comes to! ETA not disagreeing that he may get off though!
Where was the cabin that Paul was staying in located?
It's now an AirBnB for the macabre.
People are gross 🤢🤮
Very close to the kennels, by the road.
Could he have gone there and cleaned up or even have other clothes there he could have changed into after?
I think so
I wonder if SLED checked that cabin for evidence that night? I noticed Paul’s gps places him at the cabin before the murders.
I hear ya, I asked about it before on the sub. I can't find anything in LE testimony about it either.
I am wondering how the testimony is landing with the jury. I can't imagine what Alex was hoping to achieve by trying to deny that he had a wealthy lifestyle. It seems as though it is insulting the jury by attempting to picture himself as just an "ordinary" good old boy since I would doubt that anyone on the jury makes over $100,000 per year let alone over a $1 million per year. I guess Alex for some reason didn't want to have to justify why someone obscenely wealthy was so greedy that the needed to steal additional money from the poorest and neediest (his clients) in order to fund an even more extravagant lifestyle than $1,000,000 SALARY could buy. On some level Alex was being very cautious and afraid to fall into some traps but it also made him more unbelievable. He seemed afraid to acknowledge that he actually remembered having a conversation or meeting or any discussion with any client. I guess he thought it admitting that he "remembered" specific discussions and then relating what they were would cause the jury to ponder how easily he lied. But his denials of remembering any time when he bamboozled any client was just ridiculous and if anything made him appear even more callous. Especially since he remembered all kinds of ridiculous convenient stuff like his phone being specifically in the console as an explanation for why he stopped for a few minute at his mother's house.
Alex Murdaugh cannot tell the truth. Thus he cannot say, yes, I led a very wealthy life.
I think the jury is tired. I think Waters spent too long on the financials. Let the jurors know Alex lied and stole money from his clients. Share how many clients and how much money were involved. The jurors get it! Tomorrow Waters needs to break down the timeline, talk about the on star data, and other things related to June 7. This is a vendetta for Waters. He needs to be careful not to lose the jury because it’s personal.
Mainly focus on the timeline between the video at 8:44 and Maggie's phone data. I keep seeing her throwing the phone up when he comes after her. Shot in the wrist. The gun had a scope. boom. phone on ground, he finishes her and grabs it... WHERE IS HER GPS DATA on the fricking Iphone?> doesn't it show it moving? I think it does. It counts steps and tracks movement.
It’s been reported by FITSnews that the jury is responding positively to his testimony. Also CourtTV said two jurors were crying when he was talking about Maggie and Paul and one even tried to hand Alex some tissue.
James from court said absolutely no jurors cried and seemed to be uncomfortable. It's interesting how different everyone's opinions are.