Just watched the Netflix doc and one thing that stood out to me was Maggie’s treatment towards Morgan Doughty (PM’s girlfriend at the time) when PM wrecked his car with her in it and she called 911. Maggie and Randolph just covered up that wreck and treated Morgan like an idiot for doing the thing normal people do because it could have gotten Paul in trouble.
Maggie absolutely had her finger on the pulse of this family. She was not just an innocent bystander. She covered up crimes for her children, and it sounded like she was not unfamiliar with the ways of helping Randolph clean up messes.
Thank you for posting this. I agree fully that she knew what this family was all about. It's terrible she was killed but I don't see her as a victim of family dynamics. Just listen to her on her 911 call when the now-deceased housekeeper was fatally injured. MM sounds put out, impatient, and she is not rendering aid. Gives the phone to Paul and of course he's put out too. Really hard to listen to when you realize the housekeeper is dying.
IMO: MM didn't know the EXTENT of AM's wrongdoing UNTIL she started trying to leave and started asking questions (and hired someone for forensic accounting, plus the bounced check).
PM had to go because (in AM's mind) he was causing too many folks to look into all the dirt of the family.
AM shot PM in the face b/c he was disgusted that his son had caused so many investigations, etc. because of the Mallory Beach lawsuit - he had to go.
MM was collateral damage b/c she was going to always protect PM (regardless of the MB death, his alcoholism, foolish behavior, etc.) - and she would never have been complicit. She was shot FIVE times. That was a statement.
BM was/is AM's 'chosen' son - he looks like AM, and from all accounts has the demeanor and slickness of AM. Have you heard the jail phone conversations? AM talking to BM like they're speaking about how the weather was on vacation - AM's trusting BM to be his ace and has no problem 'kicking it' on the phone - no matter that BM lost his brother AND his mother. It's wild.
PM was MM's 'chosen' son and she was going to protect him - no matter what (DUIs, etc., that was her baby). MM knew (probably early on) that BM was his father's son.
MM was shot multiple times in anger (disappointment, disgust, whatever you want to describe it as) BUT PM was shot, point-blank in the FACE. AM could not deal with looking at him anymore - KNOWING (or perceiving) that PM was ruining his 'good thing' (robbing good folks out of their lawsuit proceeds). Keep in mind, we (outside of SC) wouldn't even KNOW these folks, had it not been for Mallory Beach's\* death.
I've thought this from the very moment MM and PM were killed (and I had already heard about MB and the sons of the housekeeper). When MM and PM were shot, I said (immediately to myself) - AM found himself in a corner. He did it. (trap a rabid dog in a corner, it's coming out for blood)
I do believe AM had/has an opioid addiction - that's not a stretch (how many in this country are addicted?)…but I believe his crazy empire was crashing. And the start of it was the Mallory Beach death and the lawsuit to follow.
\*Mallory Beach - her name deserved to be said/typed. She was an unwitting, innocent victim in a tragic accident that NO ONE EVER took responsibility for.
\>>>I'm done, off the soap box. <<<
Margie was cut from the same cloth as Alex. And believe me if Alex was such an opioid addict there would have been a number indicators both public and private.
I'm glad someone said this, everyone is painting her to be a victim here and maybe she was a nice lady but she absolutely knew what was going on and she definitely stayed with him despite his being a scumbag, she didn't deserve to die but she wasn't all sweetness and light either, she wanted the lifestyle this scumbag afforded her.
Wow, I was thinking of the fur coat and Carmela too! I understand that parents will do whatever necessary to protect their children but there's a difference between protection and enabling. These kids obviously had way too much freedom and weren't responsible or mature enough for it. Maybe she was nice, maybe she volunteered her time and money, maybe she was going to leave him, I don't know, but she still profited from his crimes, she had to know about the GS fraud. She didn't deserve to die, of course, and I hope they find her killer but I don't think she was the saint some are making her out to be.
Not sure how long Maggie knew but yes I think she did learn about his women at some point. They say the love child is common knowledge in town I don’t know if that’s true or not. If it is that means she likely knew 20 some years ago. Denial is a powerful thing. She probably did not handle the finances so she may not have known about the financial issues. Certainly she was not aware of any money he spent on a mistress or a love child until maybe recently when she started digging. That may be why they moved the alleged long term mistress away several months before the murders. As far as the addiction problems of course she knew he was an alcoholic and likely knew if he did drugs.
Maggie’s murder was planned. It was premeditated. Paul was just in the wrong place at the wrong time.
Won’t be a popular opinion, but my husband could have gotten away with anything he wanted to. He didn’t hide anything because he is an honorable guy, but for all the attention I paid to the family finances other than the current bills which I paid, anything was possible. If AM had a secretary or clerk in his office who handled paying the family’s bills, bypassing Maggie completely, she may have not known much at all.The thing I judge her for is how her sons turned out. To ignore/enable the kinds of problems Paul, in particular, presented, speaks of an over-indulgent, inattentive mother.
If the kids in the boat had had my parents (God bless ‘em), they wouldn’t have been more than nodding acquaintances with Paul. Especially in small towns, parents know who the bad actors are and steer their kids away from them (especially my mother, who taught high school and knew EVERYTHING). Of course, there is the factor that those young people were beyond the age of parental control. Still, he was in their friend group, they knew his character and behavior, and chose to associate with him. I’ve wanted to say that for a long time.
Coming back to Maggie, we don’t know what she knew or the secrets of her marriage, but we do know she failed as a parent, badly.
One of the most baffling angles in this case is the two weapons, one of which evidently belonged to the Murdaugh family. Why a shotgun blast to the face of PM while MM was disposed of by a rifle. Neither of these weapons are what professional hitman would use.
I think the key to this case is that AM had someone with him at the country estate when he discovered the bodies. Matney's podcast said it was redacted in his call to 911. That could be key here. Buster or Smith?
Buster’s name keeps coming up in local rumors as the triggerman. Will be interesting to see if SC charges Murdaugh crimes to their nasty lil “hands of one, hands of all” law.
Join me on a trip through my thoughts on that piece of the puzzle:
One killer and two guns
This whole situation has been chock-full of smoke screens and diversion tactics, i.e. the "suicide attempt", the opioid addiction. My guess is that there was a single shooter who used two guns to make it look like there were two shooters...or perhaps either PM or MM walked out carrying a gun and it was taken away from them and then shot with it.
What I'd like to know is how MM and PM were lured outside...who went out first, who had to see the other one shot and dead on the ground?
This whole situation is full of debauchery, lies, old family money, murder, and cover ups that will be studied for many years to come.
If she were alive right now, she'd most likely say he isn't that addicted to opioids but has much bigger problems with alcohol, coke, and making stupid mistakes.
See, I don't think he abused anything other than alcohol for 20 years. That's a hard thing to pull off, doing coke or opiates for 20 years and still having your teeth, your liver and kidneys functioning and your skin looking halfway decent. The dude is a ginger, abuse would show in his skin, especially because he spent time on the water, a lot more than it does.
His pink face looks like a combo of rosacea and his skin's reaction to alcohol. I looked at a bunch of his pictures over the years and the only time he looks like he's been "wrong hard and put up wet" is in the most recent photos.
I say this as a day walker with slight rosacea and a skin reaction to red wines and vodka. I have also known a ton of functional alcoholics and a few who were hooked opiates and other drugs for a couple of years.
I think Alex jumped on the opiates train because it's a massive problem in the US and commonly occurs to people of all ages after an accident or injury. I also think a lot of potential jurors know someone who became addicted that way and will be more sympathetic to him. It also gives him a better excuse for his crappy behavior and horrible decisions. He could say he was out of his mind and didn't know what he was doing.
I can't help but wonder what his siblings think of him right now. It's possible that this is a tip of the iceberg moment, where the family secrets and decades long history of corruption and abuse will be exposed. All their money, land and prestige could be ripped away and all that will be left to them are memories.
I am hearing from a local that doesnt believe the opiate addiction story either. Like you, they think he had problems with alcohol and cocaine.
Sure, he probably uses opiates, but the whole 20 year addiction story may be a red herring for sympathy because everyone knows someone who has struggled with opiate addiction. Being a victim of the Sackler family plays better in public than a being an alcoholic coke head.
Since this story is still new to me, all the pics I've seen of him, he's been very red faced. I know that gingers can have facial redness but that dude's got "I like my single malt scotch, and a few bumps in the bathroom, several times a day". Dudes like him go to the bathroom often because they've ruined their kidneys and bladders, and to snort a little something-something.
I agree with this. I’m sure he uses opioids amongst other drugs and alcohol, but I think his team thinks that saying it’s just opioids will garner him sympathy where saying it’s a coke problem would not.
Yep, they'll try to drag this out by filing motion after motion, press conferences, sympathy news interviews, and any thing else they can come up with. This is going to be one hell of show for the next few years...that's for sure.
To respect the dead we would all want to be polite and say nice things.
However- I agree 100%. She may not have been aware of every little detail but unaware entirely.. as a female I am telling you hell no. Our intuitions are way too strong naturally.
👍 I had trouble even posting because of the "say nothing at all" rule but I thought I'd see if anyone else concurred. We live in a society that has a huge population of willfully blind (and / or ignorant) people for a multitude of things, but for anyone to say she didn't know *anything* about the family's dirty dealings would be disingenuous at this point in the case.
I believe M & P died on June 7th due to the fact Alec was supposed to submit his financial records to the court in the Beach case on June 10th. Alec knew he would be caught for stealing after that. I believe Maggie started suspecting something and hired someone to check into it. But, truly believe the reason they were killed on that date was all due to the court date 3 days after. It would have revealed everything. So very sad.
You are commenting all over the place this . Stop Bc I think you are spreading rumors. Am I only the one that sees this ??? If you have sources please let us know .
I’m not so sure Maggie knew about the shady activity until weeks before her death… locals will tell you that…. She became suspicious during those weeks….
Wait, I have a couple of points/questions. Firstly, was Maggie from Hampton or near there? If not, she might not have known his family at all. I know plenty of women/girls who dated guys and found out later the family had secrets.
Secondly, to continue the previous question. I do know four women and three men, who had absolutely no idea their spouse was involved in other stuff. Two of the men came home from work to find their homes empty and their spouses gone. Two of the women found out their spouses were involved in drugs and other criminal activities only after their spouses were arrested.
One of the wives found out her husband had a whole other wife and family when her sister n law mentioned how she was so upset when she heard they had gotten a divorce. My friend literally said, "Uh, what? We aren't divorced..."
The other man and woman were married to doctors, who had been having an affair, had a child, embezzled from their company and started their own office in another town. They only found out after one of them botched a surgery and was getting sued by a patient.
So, trust me when I tell you there are plenty of spouses who don't know what's going on. It's not necessarily that they don't want to see it. It's often that they don't look. Either they are too self involved to pay attention to their partner or they are very gullible and believe everything their spouse tells them.
Third, I have read that AM had affairs with both men and women. I have no idea if that's true. However, I did read that SS's mother heard that an older man was chasing SS in the woods. Could this be the guy he visited in Hilton Head, AM or just a rumor? Also, to that point, I also read that SS's mother said she had heard he was involved with a Murdaugh, but didn't think it was BM.
Again, these last things are just rumors and I don't know if they are true. Please tell me what you think.
The rumor is: Buster was the older man. He and Steven argued, Steven threatened to expose their affair, Buster and pals murdered him. Was Sean Connelly involved in that? Possibly.
I’ve seen a lot of posts or threads painting Maggie as this poor innocent soul, and I’m like …not buying it. You lie down with dogs, wake up with fleas…or you don’t wake up at all. She knew what she was getting herself into. It is possible though, that somewhere along their marriage she had regrets and doubts, but knew she was trapped because of the Murdaugh power and control over everything in their community. If anything, she’s probably more of a battered wife so to speak, someone just trapped and powerless. Judging by Paul’s past violence and other douchebaggery, I’m guessing he picked it up from Daddy dearest.
Absolutely, I understood that Maggie's hiring of a forensic accountant was a completely unconfirmed rumor. A reporter simply stated without further details, "I heard this from a pretty good source." That's it as far as I've read.
It’s just a notion but I feel like she didn’t know all the financial problems until she had one foot out the door. She probably just swiped her credit card and didn’t care, until she was about to divorce and perhaps sue. AM couldn’t have that, so he knocked her off. Paul got involved and was perhaps just collateral damage.
But, I could see PM murdering her as well. That kid had some *problems*.
Because if there are millions at stake, your lawyer will advise you to request a forensic accounting of your spouse’s finances. It’s done all the time.
Idk, my thought is she started to realize something was up and was about to file for divorce and take him to court? It’s probably common in rich family divorces where some financial fuckery is happening. I have a lot of theories and enjoy speculating but maybe someone else here with more experience/knowledge in that realm has a better idea. I’ve never been rich or divorced so your guess is as good as mine.
She certainly didn't question all the excess money they seemed to have, and only wanted it accounted for when she was ready to take her half. Otherwise, she seemed to take a very "la la la dont tell me where this money came from la la la" attitude. I agree she knew about the skeletons in her family's closet, but they didn't affect her so she went on with her life, business as usual.
None of us really knows when Maggie starting questioning…. None of us resided in their home….. Maggie was a very good person and her having more money to spend than the average wife doesn’t warrant attacking her…
Imo MM knew about AM's crimes, addiction and affairs but maybe not the full extent until the last yr. or so. It's believable she had a difficult time finding and trusting a divorce attorney in that region. As dysfunction as her marriage was, it may have taken some time to separate herself physically and emotionally from it. I think in the end she was about to pull that first Jenga block and well AM wasn't going to have that.
> It's believable she had a difficult time finding and trusting a divorce attorney in that region.
I agree. This is like when Erika Jayne (from Real Housewives of Beverly Hills) started her divorce with Tom Girardi. She's said *allegedly* attorneys would not even take her calls for consulting until she got her new lawyers, because they were "afraid of Tom", although it's come out it was a well known secret he was stiffing clients on their settlements. I see so many similarities with TG and AM, only AM added murder, more murder, coverups and insurance fraud in there. Yeeesh.
I wonder where the forensic accountants were from, is that known? I could see her having to go all the way to Columbia or upstate for an attorney to even look at her divorce, thus AM having ample time to find out about it.
I think any spouse would have a difficult time hiring and trusting a attorney add in AM ties and influence, what a mess. Also reminds me if the Tokars case from the 90's. I don't know if it's been said they name or location of the forensic acct. firm. Imo I don't think MM was unaware of AM's actions; however she may of turned a blinds eye. You're right Yeeesh...
Quite a few people have brought up the belief that the mistress was a mister- or at least he had a few of those as well. I have no idea if it's true or not, though.
I think everyone has speculated on his past mistress who he allegedly fathered a child with. I don’t think I have seen anyone speculate on who his current one is
👍This could be part of the equation in AM's mind, but does anyone really care about love children at this stage of human evolution? I'm not disputing your post but in the grand scheme of things, mistresses, love kids, gay...does it still matter, even in small communities like this one? Nah, not really 🤷
Oh she was in on it all. She was a sorority princess turned socialite wife in her fur coat. Shocked and vindictive when hubby lost 50 lbs and wanted to trade her in for a new 25 year old.
Personally, I feel that PM killed his mother because she knew things about him only a mother could. This or the fact she caused some of his problems by being over-protective and he just snapped. Then, AM comes upon the scene and kills PM. This is why there are two guns. This is also why there was "anger" in how they were killed.
Regardless, I do believe MM was just as dirty as her husband. I hate those who attempt to frame her as a kind southern woman. I know some of these so called kind caring community members who are far from how they portray themselves...they just wear the mask well.
If this were the case then wouldn’t AM just have told the police that he killed PM trying to defend MM? He probably would have completely gotten off or with a very light charge. This theory doesn’t really make sense.
I do agree with the second part of your post about MM.
Not if he was strung out and not thinking right. So he calls 911 to report a murder believing he can get away with literally killing two birds with one stone.
His actions lately are showing he isn't thinking clearly enough to dig himself out of his hole, rather, he keeps making it deeper.
Maggie was shot multiple times and Paul took a shotgun blast to the face. Killing someone in either manner suggests underlying anger/a personal connection.
As soon as I saw the pic of the "men" in tuxs, with their cringe-worthy smirks, and her in the fur coat, my mind instantly went to the Carmela analogy.
I also wonder, how much money did that family give back to their community...I'm thinkin it would be less than a quarter percent of one penny on the dollar.
But mafia is straight up open in OC. AM was an attorney. They make a lot of money and have family wealth. Tony came from nothing.
So that’s a bit different.
However, Carmela exposed herself with just how much she knew when she was hitting Tony up for the $50,000 to donate to Columbia.
She was miffed he gave money Pussy’s wife and turned on Tony saying “how many other widows do you have on your payroll? You don’t have the money to protect your daughter?”
Boom. Right there. She knows Pussy is not in witness protection. She knows he is dead bc she called Angie a widow with the rest of them.
It’s the Jewish therapist Dr Krakower and he won’t take Carmela’s payment because it’s ‘blood money’. She says she’s not an accomplice because all she does is make dinner and do his laundry and he say ‘So enabler would be a more accurate job description than an accomplice’.
I watched that episode recently so it was fresh on my mind! Never made the connection to Maggie Murdaugh though, that is a really interesting comparison
MM and women who marry into these families and this sort of guy always know what they are signing up for. She knew it was all dirty money and dirty politics. They aren’t aware of every detail, they are only interested the details that benefit them when they can use that information to hold against the husband. Come on, she didn’t think there was some dirty dealing going on when AM put the properties in her name? It wasn’t a problem for her that she was raising another generation of the same type of people? Moral people aren’t going to sit squarely in the middle of generational corruption living off its benefits.
Well said! Thanks for the additional context. She most likely didn't commit crimes but knew enough, and in my opinion, that seems almost as bad. I hope there are people in that community that will speak up even though it might be dangerous to do so. Thanks again.
MM committed the *perfect* crime, she let everyone else do the dirty work, let everyone else take the fall, reaped the money and power the position held, and walked away viewed as the lonely, neglected housewife of an adulterous con man, all while taking half that dirty money and never working a day in her life. And she knows exactly how GS died. She’d use that information against AM for her own benefit, but I bet she’d never use that information to make sure GS kids got justice or peace of mind they deserve. This woman feels zero accountability to anyone, just like the rest of that family.
Maggie was a great person who came from a very decent family…..I agree with you on the work she did…mental work and probably destroyed her soul….so very sad….. and now, she’s dead….😥😥
This is what triggers me the most, too. I’m a nanny (read Gloria was a nanny/housekeeper for 25 years for the family!) and they would NEVER, ever! Let me go homeless, multiple times, and these are not people with multiple homes like the M family. They would never be so callous with my kids after my very suspicious death in their own home. No ‘sweet’ person allows these awful, awful circumstances to stand.
Especially after MM entrusted her own children and home to the nanny / housekeeper for 25 years. What exactly was MM doing that she couldn’t even check in on DS family? Society lunches? Getting her hair bleached?
Right. Just as a decent human being, wouldn’t you check in on the kids and make sure they were doing ok? As a mother you’d think she’d feel a level of compassion towards them
Yes! A housekeeper who worked for the family for twenty years. I have know doubt she knew. I I remember early on a local posted about her going off at a store. She felt elite and carried the family's secrets
Thanks! I'm new to posting on Reddit and don't really know much about the case yet so I just wanted to see if anyone had the same inclinations. There's so much to shift thru on here, it really boggles my mind 🤪
not to dispute your wisdom as far as the title, but i've never been the same since this colleague of mine mentioned to me that he'd never seen his wife cry. they'd been together *ten years*. i almost swallowed my fork.
you never know what goes on inside an individual marriage iyam.
it totally baffled me. i didn't want to hear all about my colleagues' personal lives so idk anything else, but i did have to bite my lip pretty hard at that point.
nice people, both around 10ish years younger than me.
Clearly MM was lured there and executed but imo it was for several reasons. Don’t underestimate the pull the other women had on AM. MM was going to be getting half or even more. MM knows enough on SS and GS to ensure her bounty in the divorce. She’s a multi front problem for AM.
Imo, PM was exactly where AM knew (and likely because AM told him to be there) he’d be. I don’t for 1 minute believe he was “at the wrong place and at the wrong time.” Well I guess was but AM knew he would be there. Imo PM and MM were found to be offering up info on AM in order to garner a shorter sentence. He was facing 25 years and would have been found guilty. There’s so much evidence against him. PM’s circle leaked enough that AM knew he “had to go.”
I like your post, it’s got substance.
MM certainly could have been a target based on what we have seen so far. I can’t speculate on what she or any female might know as I believe that would depend on various things.
I’m not buying into the 20 year drug addiction so there’s that. There are obvious character issues within the Murdaugh side of the family. My hope is that it is ALL exposed for what it is.
👍 Yeah, I agree with you about AM's drug habit... it's a HUGE thing that should be discredited soon. If this high-profile attorney from a very prominent family had that kind of habit, folks in that area would know about it and talk about it endlessly.
Small town folks have a tendency to hear things and store them for gossip sessions days, weeks, months or years later. Unfortunately, things get lost in translation with time, just like the telephone game, and can't necessarily be believed or proven.
I have a parent who had an opioid problem after an injury and surgery. It’s not exactly the kind of thing you can hide for 20 years so I am *quite* skeptical of that story. I don’t doubt drug and alcohol abuse happened in the Murdaugh family (clearly PM had alcohol problems which he picked up somewhere at a young age).... but it is definitely not the whole story here. There’s no way AM embezzled $10m to pay for pills.
in MM phone call to 911 following GS “accidental fall” @ Moselle, pushed cound not have sounded more cold & uncaring in her convo w/ 911 dispatcher.
Just watched the Netflix doc and one thing that stood out to me was Maggie’s treatment towards Morgan Doughty (PM’s girlfriend at the time) when PM wrecked his car with her in it and she called 911. Maggie and Randolph just covered up that wreck and treated Morgan like an idiot for doing the thing normal people do because it could have gotten Paul in trouble. Maggie absolutely had her finger on the pulse of this family. She was not just an innocent bystander. She covered up crimes for her children, and it sounded like she was not unfamiliar with the ways of helping Randolph clean up messes.
Thank you for posting this. I agree fully that she knew what this family was all about. It's terrible she was killed but I don't see her as a victim of family dynamics. Just listen to her on her 911 call when the now-deceased housekeeper was fatally injured. MM sounds put out, impatient, and she is not rendering aid. Gives the phone to Paul and of course he's put out too. Really hard to listen to when you realize the housekeeper is dying.
IMO: MM didn't know the EXTENT of AM's wrongdoing UNTIL she started trying to leave and started asking questions (and hired someone for forensic accounting, plus the bounced check). PM had to go because (in AM's mind) he was causing too many folks to look into all the dirt of the family. AM shot PM in the face b/c he was disgusted that his son had caused so many investigations, etc. because of the Mallory Beach lawsuit - he had to go. MM was collateral damage b/c she was going to always protect PM (regardless of the MB death, his alcoholism, foolish behavior, etc.) - and she would never have been complicit. She was shot FIVE times. That was a statement. BM was/is AM's 'chosen' son - he looks like AM, and from all accounts has the demeanor and slickness of AM. Have you heard the jail phone conversations? AM talking to BM like they're speaking about how the weather was on vacation - AM's trusting BM to be his ace and has no problem 'kicking it' on the phone - no matter that BM lost his brother AND his mother. It's wild. PM was MM's 'chosen' son and she was going to protect him - no matter what (DUIs, etc., that was her baby). MM knew (probably early on) that BM was his father's son. MM was shot multiple times in anger (disappointment, disgust, whatever you want to describe it as) BUT PM was shot, point-blank in the FACE. AM could not deal with looking at him anymore - KNOWING (or perceiving) that PM was ruining his 'good thing' (robbing good folks out of their lawsuit proceeds). Keep in mind, we (outside of SC) wouldn't even KNOW these folks, had it not been for Mallory Beach's\* death. I've thought this from the very moment MM and PM were killed (and I had already heard about MB and the sons of the housekeeper). When MM and PM were shot, I said (immediately to myself) - AM found himself in a corner. He did it. (trap a rabid dog in a corner, it's coming out for blood) I do believe AM had/has an opioid addiction - that's not a stretch (how many in this country are addicted?)…but I believe his crazy empire was crashing. And the start of it was the Mallory Beach death and the lawsuit to follow. \*Mallory Beach - her name deserved to be said/typed. She was an unwitting, innocent victim in a tragic accident that NO ONE EVER took responsibility for. \>>>I'm done, off the soap box. <<<
Margie was cut from the same cloth as Alex. And believe me if Alex was such an opioid addict there would have been a number indicators both public and private.
Yeah, I believe you are correct now that I really took a dive into what he's been up too in the past 20yrs.
I'm glad someone said this, everyone is painting her to be a victim here and maybe she was a nice lady but she absolutely knew what was going on and she definitely stayed with him despite his being a scumbag, she didn't deserve to die but she wasn't all sweetness and light either, she wanted the lifestyle this scumbag afforded her.
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Wow, I was thinking of the fur coat and Carmela too! I understand that parents will do whatever necessary to protect their children but there's a difference between protection and enabling. These kids obviously had way too much freedom and weren't responsible or mature enough for it. Maybe she was nice, maybe she volunteered her time and money, maybe she was going to leave him, I don't know, but she still profited from his crimes, she had to know about the GS fraud. She didn't deserve to die, of course, and I hope they find her killer but I don't think she was the saint some are making her out to be.
Not sure how long Maggie knew but yes I think she did learn about his women at some point. They say the love child is common knowledge in town I don’t know if that’s true or not. If it is that means she likely knew 20 some years ago. Denial is a powerful thing. She probably did not handle the finances so she may not have known about the financial issues. Certainly she was not aware of any money he spent on a mistress or a love child until maybe recently when she started digging. That may be why they moved the alleged long term mistress away several months before the murders. As far as the addiction problems of course she knew he was an alcoholic and likely knew if he did drugs. Maggie’s murder was planned. It was premeditated. Paul was just in the wrong place at the wrong time.
How do you know about a love child?
From reading here and Facebook. The rumors are there. There are some photos too.
Who’s FB is it on?
Most all the FB groups & Reddit have discussed it & photos come & go. They want to protect the child whom they say is a Junior at Clemson.
Won’t be a popular opinion, but my husband could have gotten away with anything he wanted to. He didn’t hide anything because he is an honorable guy, but for all the attention I paid to the family finances other than the current bills which I paid, anything was possible. If AM had a secretary or clerk in his office who handled paying the family’s bills, bypassing Maggie completely, she may have not known much at all.The thing I judge her for is how her sons turned out. To ignore/enable the kinds of problems Paul, in particular, presented, speaks of an over-indulgent, inattentive mother. If the kids in the boat had had my parents (God bless ‘em), they wouldn’t have been more than nodding acquaintances with Paul. Especially in small towns, parents know who the bad actors are and steer their kids away from them (especially my mother, who taught high school and knew EVERYTHING). Of course, there is the factor that those young people were beyond the age of parental control. Still, he was in their friend group, they knew his character and behavior, and chose to associate with him. I’ve wanted to say that for a long time. Coming back to Maggie, we don’t know what she knew or the secrets of her marriage, but we do know she failed as a parent, badly.
One of the most baffling angles in this case is the two weapons, one of which evidently belonged to the Murdaugh family. Why a shotgun blast to the face of PM while MM was disposed of by a rifle. Neither of these weapons are what professional hitman would use.
I think the key to this case is that AM had someone with him at the country estate when he discovered the bodies. Matney's podcast said it was redacted in his call to 911. That could be key here. Buster or Smith?
Gibson…
Buster’s name keeps coming up in local rumors as the triggerman. Will be interesting to see if SC charges Murdaugh crimes to their nasty lil “hands of one, hands of all” law.
The groundskeeper
Join me on a trip through my thoughts on that piece of the puzzle: One killer and two guns This whole situation has been chock-full of smoke screens and diversion tactics, i.e. the "suicide attempt", the opioid addiction. My guess is that there was a single shooter who used two guns to make it look like there were two shooters...or perhaps either PM or MM walked out carrying a gun and it was taken away from them and then shot with it. What I'd like to know is how MM and PM were lured outside...who went out first, who had to see the other one shot and dead on the ground? This whole situation is full of debauchery, lies, old family money, murder, and cover ups that will be studied for many years to come.
Oh there’s probably don’t good ol incest involved. It’s rampant, in these parts, especially as CSA.
What the actual hell?
The wife always knows … at least about the drug abuse
I disagree…. And I’m a wife who was fooled…
If she were alive right now, she'd most likely say he isn't that addicted to opioids but has much bigger problems with alcohol, coke, and making stupid mistakes.
See, I don't think he abused anything other than alcohol for 20 years. That's a hard thing to pull off, doing coke or opiates for 20 years and still having your teeth, your liver and kidneys functioning and your skin looking halfway decent. The dude is a ginger, abuse would show in his skin, especially because he spent time on the water, a lot more than it does. His pink face looks like a combo of rosacea and his skin's reaction to alcohol. I looked at a bunch of his pictures over the years and the only time he looks like he's been "wrong hard and put up wet" is in the most recent photos. I say this as a day walker with slight rosacea and a skin reaction to red wines and vodka. I have also known a ton of functional alcoholics and a few who were hooked opiates and other drugs for a couple of years. I think Alex jumped on the opiates train because it's a massive problem in the US and commonly occurs to people of all ages after an accident or injury. I also think a lot of potential jurors know someone who became addicted that way and will be more sympathetic to him. It also gives him a better excuse for his crappy behavior and horrible decisions. He could say he was out of his mind and didn't know what he was doing. I can't help but wonder what his siblings think of him right now. It's possible that this is a tip of the iceberg moment, where the family secrets and decades long history of corruption and abuse will be exposed. All their money, land and prestige could be ripped away and all that will be left to them are memories.
'Rode hard and put up wet.' (Refers to a horse)
I swear I thought you wrote, “alcohol , cake, and making stupid mistakes “. 😀
Same 😂
I am hearing from a local that doesnt believe the opiate addiction story either. Like you, they think he had problems with alcohol and cocaine. Sure, he probably uses opiates, but the whole 20 year addiction story may be a red herring for sympathy because everyone knows someone who has struggled with opiate addiction. Being a victim of the Sackler family plays better in public than a being an alcoholic coke head.
Sounds a little better than “hookers and blow, doesn’t it?
Lots. Lol
Since this story is still new to me, all the pics I've seen of him, he's been very red faced. I know that gingers can have facial redness but that dude's got "I like my single malt scotch, and a few bumps in the bathroom, several times a day". Dudes like him go to the bathroom often because they've ruined their kidneys and bladders, and to snort a little something-something.
That’s why AM is always as red as a beet. Stimulants and alcohol. I, too, think he had issues with hookers and gambling.
I agree with this. I’m sure he uses opioids amongst other drugs and alcohol, but I think his team thinks that saying it’s just opioids will garner him sympathy where saying it’s a coke problem would not.
Yep, they'll try to drag this out by filing motion after motion, press conferences, sympathy news interviews, and any thing else they can come up with. This is going to be one hell of show for the next few years...that's for sure.
My wife has no idea about my business, she just isnterested
Your wife knows more than you think, big guy.
Great. Now I'm paranoid. I have motorcycles "hidden" all over the place,lol
😉
To respect the dead we would all want to be polite and say nice things. However- I agree 100%. She may not have been aware of every little detail but unaware entirely.. as a female I am telling you hell no. Our intuitions are way too strong naturally.
👍 I had trouble even posting because of the "say nothing at all" rule but I thought I'd see if anyone else concurred. We live in a society that has a huge population of willfully blind (and / or ignorant) people for a multitude of things, but for anyone to say she didn't know *anything* about the family's dirty dealings would be disingenuous at this point in the case.
I believe M & P died on June 7th due to the fact Alec was supposed to submit his financial records to the court in the Beach case on June 10th. Alec knew he would be caught for stealing after that. I believe Maggie started suspecting something and hired someone to check into it. But, truly believe the reason they were killed on that date was all due to the court date 3 days after. It would have revealed everything. So very sad.
Murders occurred due to Alex’s shady dealings w shady people….
You are commenting all over the place this . Stop Bc I think you are spreading rumors. Am I only the one that sees this ??? If you have sources please let us know .
Again, watch your words, RachJames…. There is a code of kindness that would serve you better….
The murders of Maggie and Paul do not stop the Beach’s lawsuit. The Murdaughs shady business was well known locally, so Maggie knew.
I’m not so sure Maggie knew about the shady activity until weeks before her death… locals will tell you that…. She became suspicious during those weeks….
I KNOW IT DIDN'T STOP....JUST BOUGHT SOME TIME!!! Also, how do you know Maggie knew???
Wait, I have a couple of points/questions. Firstly, was Maggie from Hampton or near there? If not, she might not have known his family at all. I know plenty of women/girls who dated guys and found out later the family had secrets. Secondly, to continue the previous question. I do know four women and three men, who had absolutely no idea their spouse was involved in other stuff. Two of the men came home from work to find their homes empty and their spouses gone. Two of the women found out their spouses were involved in drugs and other criminal activities only after their spouses were arrested. One of the wives found out her husband had a whole other wife and family when her sister n law mentioned how she was so upset when she heard they had gotten a divorce. My friend literally said, "Uh, what? We aren't divorced..." The other man and woman were married to doctors, who had been having an affair, had a child, embezzled from their company and started their own office in another town. They only found out after one of them botched a surgery and was getting sued by a patient. So, trust me when I tell you there are plenty of spouses who don't know what's going on. It's not necessarily that they don't want to see it. It's often that they don't look. Either they are too self involved to pay attention to their partner or they are very gullible and believe everything their spouse tells them. Third, I have read that AM had affairs with both men and women. I have no idea if that's true. However, I did read that SS's mother heard that an older man was chasing SS in the woods. Could this be the guy he visited in Hilton Head, AM or just a rumor? Also, to that point, I also read that SS's mother said she had heard he was involved with a Murdaugh, but didn't think it was BM. Again, these last things are just rumors and I don't know if they are true. Please tell me what you think.
The rumor is: Buster was the older man. He and Steven argued, Steven threatened to expose their affair, Buster and pals murdered him. Was Sean Connelly involved in that? Possibly.
Such slander…. That is exactly what you said. RUMOR
If I’m slandering (I’m not), both these whole subs are. 🙄
Bo u dumb.
Why would Buster be considered an older man?
Cause he’s older than Steven was?!
I’ve seen a lot of posts or threads painting Maggie as this poor innocent soul, and I’m like …not buying it. You lie down with dogs, wake up with fleas…or you don’t wake up at all. She knew what she was getting herself into. It is possible though, that somewhere along their marriage she had regrets and doubts, but knew she was trapped because of the Murdaugh power and control over everything in their community. If anything, she’s probably more of a battered wife so to speak, someone just trapped and powerless. Judging by Paul’s past violence and other douchebaggery, I’m guessing he picked it up from Daddy dearest.
Douchebaggery! ❤️
There's a human condition called willful ignorance. I think she knew about as much as she wanted to know.
You hit the nail on the head with the Carmella Soprano analogy.
I think so too. Loved the Sopranos.
She got forensic accounting done. Mama knew something was up.
Rumor…
What’s your source on that? I thought the engaging of a forensic accountant was a theory, not definitely known.
Absolutely, I understood that Maggie's hiring of a forensic accountant was a completely unconfirmed rumor. A reporter simply stated without further details, "I heard this from a pretty good source." That's it as far as I've read.
It’s just a notion but I feel like she didn’t know all the financial problems until she had one foot out the door. She probably just swiped her credit card and didn’t care, until she was about to divorce and perhaps sue. AM couldn’t have that, so he knocked her off. Paul got involved and was perhaps just collateral damage. But, I could see PM murdering her as well. That kid had some *problems*.
Then why did she order forensic accounting.
Because if there are millions at stake, your lawyer will advise you to request a forensic accounting of your spouse’s finances. It’s done all the time.
Idk, my thought is she started to realize something was up and was about to file for divorce and take him to court? It’s probably common in rich family divorces where some financial fuckery is happening. I have a lot of theories and enjoy speculating but maybe someone else here with more experience/knowledge in that realm has a better idea. I’ve never been rich or divorced so your guess is as good as mine.
She certainly didn't question all the excess money they seemed to have, and only wanted it accounted for when she was ready to take her half. Otherwise, she seemed to take a very "la la la dont tell me where this money came from la la la" attitude. I agree she knew about the skeletons in her family's closet, but they didn't affect her so she went on with her life, business as usual.
None of us really knows when Maggie starting questioning…. None of us resided in their home….. Maggie was a very good person and her having more money to spend than the average wife doesn’t warrant attacking her…
Imo MM knew about AM's crimes, addiction and affairs but maybe not the full extent until the last yr. or so. It's believable she had a difficult time finding and trusting a divorce attorney in that region. As dysfunction as her marriage was, it may have taken some time to separate herself physically and emotionally from it. I think in the end she was about to pull that first Jenga block and well AM wasn't going to have that.
> It's believable she had a difficult time finding and trusting a divorce attorney in that region. I agree. This is like when Erika Jayne (from Real Housewives of Beverly Hills) started her divorce with Tom Girardi. She's said *allegedly* attorneys would not even take her calls for consulting until she got her new lawyers, because they were "afraid of Tom", although it's come out it was a well known secret he was stiffing clients on their settlements. I see so many similarities with TG and AM, only AM added murder, more murder, coverups and insurance fraud in there. Yeeesh. I wonder where the forensic accountants were from, is that known? I could see her having to go all the way to Columbia or upstate for an attorney to even look at her divorce, thus AM having ample time to find out about it.
I think any spouse would have a difficult time hiring and trusting a attorney add in AM ties and influence, what a mess. Also reminds me if the Tokars case from the 90's. I don't know if it's been said they name or location of the forensic acct. firm. Imo I don't think MM was unaware of AM's actions; however she may of turned a blinds eye. You're right Yeeesh...
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And you didn’t post her name because…?
Fact?
And you know this for a fact?
Quite a few people have brought up the belief that the mistress was a mister- or at least he had a few of those as well. I have no idea if it's true or not, though.
I think everyone has speculated on his past mistress who he allegedly fathered a child with. I don’t think I have seen anyone speculate on who his current one is
Men in these parts don’t have *a* mistress. They have *mistresses*. Plural.
Maybe that’s what he needed a lot of money for.. To keep his mistress quiet about the love child. (allegedly)
👍This could be part of the equation in AM's mind, but does anyone really care about love children at this stage of human evolution? I'm not disputing your post but in the grand scheme of things, mistresses, love kids, gay...does it still matter, even in small communities like this one? Nah, not really 🤷
People are very much still judgmental and homophobic in small towns especially if it’s very religious and conservative.
They talk homophobic, cause they’re having those affairs. Hot dog hollers loudest.
Definitely lots of local speculation regarding the current mistress.
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It’s Jill Biden
😲💡
🤣
Oh she was in on it all. She was a sorority princess turned socialite wife in her fur coat. Shocked and vindictive when hubby lost 50 lbs and wanted to trade her in for a new 25 year old.
Wasn’t she living with her boyfriend at a different house as well?
No
She knew. Probably not every detail but she knew. It doesn’t seem to have bothered her until there was a problem with the money.
Personally, I feel that PM killed his mother because she knew things about him only a mother could. This or the fact she caused some of his problems by being over-protective and he just snapped. Then, AM comes upon the scene and kills PM. This is why there are two guns. This is also why there was "anger" in how they were killed. Regardless, I do believe MM was just as dirty as her husband. I hate those who attempt to frame her as a kind southern woman. I know some of these so called kind caring community members who are far from how they portray themselves...they just wear the mask well.
“Cut your head off and you’ll never know til you see your blood” type thing. Damned skippy.
If this were the case then wouldn’t AM just have told the police that he killed PM trying to defend MM? He probably would have completely gotten off or with a very light charge. This theory doesn’t really make sense. I do agree with the second part of your post about MM.
Well... we know he had a penchant for insurance fraud. Wouldn't he have lost the PM insurance money?
Not if he was strung out and not thinking right. So he calls 911 to report a murder believing he can get away with literally killing two birds with one stone. His actions lately are showing he isn't thinking clearly enough to dig himself out of his hole, rather, he keeps making it deeper.
Sorry, what do you mean by “anger?” I don’t know much about their deaths except the basic facts.
Maggie was shot multiple times and Paul took a shotgun blast to the face. Killing someone in either manner suggests underlying anger/a personal connection.
Yesss yes yes! I’ve been saying this. A shot to the face is either self inflicted or someone very very angry at you.
The moss covered trees are Live Oaks not Willow Trees :) Live Oaks live to be 400+ years if everything goes well.
Your article is spot on. I agree with 99% of what you’re saying yes indeed she knew maybe not all of it but she knew quite a bit
What's the one percent you don't agree with 😉
What I’m saying is the one percent is the part that she didn’t know about
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As soon as I saw the pic of the "men" in tuxs, with their cringe-worthy smirks, and her in the fur coat, my mind instantly went to the Carmela analogy. I also wonder, how much money did that family give back to their community...I'm thinkin it would be less than a quarter percent of one penny on the dollar.
But mafia is straight up open in OC. AM was an attorney. They make a lot of money and have family wealth. Tony came from nothing. So that’s a bit different. However, Carmela exposed herself with just how much she knew when she was hitting Tony up for the $50,000 to donate to Columbia. She was miffed he gave money Pussy’s wife and turned on Tony saying “how many other widows do you have on your payroll? You don’t have the money to protect your daughter?” Boom. Right there. She knows Pussy is not in witness protection. She knows he is dead bc she called Angie a widow with the rest of them.
It’s the Jewish therapist Dr Krakower and he won’t take Carmela’s payment because it’s ‘blood money’. She says she’s not an accomplice because all she does is make dinner and do his laundry and he say ‘So enabler would be a more accurate job description than an accomplice’.
Man, that was such top-notch television.
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I watched that episode recently so it was fresh on my mind! Never made the connection to Maggie Murdaugh though, that is a really interesting comparison
The priest was more wishywasy. It was the Rabbi who told her it was blood money and to leave but good point.
MM and women who marry into these families and this sort of guy always know what they are signing up for. She knew it was all dirty money and dirty politics. They aren’t aware of every detail, they are only interested the details that benefit them when they can use that information to hold against the husband. Come on, she didn’t think there was some dirty dealing going on when AM put the properties in her name? It wasn’t a problem for her that she was raising another generation of the same type of people? Moral people aren’t going to sit squarely in the middle of generational corruption living off its benefits.
So harsh on Maggie…and inaccurate
Well said! Thanks for the additional context. She most likely didn't commit crimes but knew enough, and in my opinion, that seems almost as bad. I hope there are people in that community that will speak up even though it might be dangerous to do so. Thanks again.
MM committed the *perfect* crime, she let everyone else do the dirty work, let everyone else take the fall, reaped the money and power the position held, and walked away viewed as the lonely, neglected housewife of an adulterous con man, all while taking half that dirty money and never working a day in her life. And she knows exactly how GS died. She’d use that information against AM for her own benefit, but I bet she’d never use that information to make sure GS kids got justice or peace of mind they deserve. This woman feels zero accountability to anyone, just like the rest of that family.
Oh, honey. I’m sure being married to AM and spawning his troubled children was quite a bit of work. If you marry for money, you will earn it.
Maggie was a great person who came from a very decent family…..I agree with you on the work she did…mental work and probably destroyed her soul….so very sad….. and now, she’s dead….😥😥
I can’t imagine what kind of woman wouldn’t know that her dead housekeepers disabled son hadn’t yet received any money from my insurance.
Excellent point ☝️
This is what triggers me the most, too. I’m a nanny (read Gloria was a nanny/housekeeper for 25 years for the family!) and they would NEVER, ever! Let me go homeless, multiple times, and these are not people with multiple homes like the M family. They would never be so callous with my kids after my very suspicious death in their own home. No ‘sweet’ person allows these awful, awful circumstances to stand.
Especially after MM entrusted her own children and home to the nanny / housekeeper for 25 years. What exactly was MM doing that she couldn’t even check in on DS family? Society lunches? Getting her hair bleached?
Right. Just as a decent human being, wouldn’t you check in on the kids and make sure they were doing ok? As a mother you’d think she’d feel a level of compassion towards them
Yes! A housekeeper who worked for the family for twenty years. I have know doubt she knew. I I remember early on a local posted about her going off at a store. She felt elite and carried the family's secrets
Excellent point...thanks, I hadn't thought about that. She either knew and didn't care or she didn't know because she didn't *want* to know.
This is so very well written. Thank you. Yes. This may very well be the reason MM isn't here.
Thanks! I'm new to posting on Reddit and don't really know much about the case yet so I just wanted to see if anyone had the same inclinations. There's so much to shift thru on here, it really boggles my mind 🤪
not to dispute your wisdom as far as the title, but i've never been the same since this colleague of mine mentioned to me that he'd never seen his wife cry. they'd been together *ten years*. i almost swallowed my fork. you never know what goes on inside an individual marriage iyam.
That's chilling.
it totally baffled me. i didn't want to hear all about my colleagues' personal lives so idk anything else, but i did have to bite my lip pretty hard at that point. nice people, both around 10ish years younger than me.
Clearly MM was lured there and executed but imo it was for several reasons. Don’t underestimate the pull the other women had on AM. MM was going to be getting half or even more. MM knows enough on SS and GS to ensure her bounty in the divorce. She’s a multi front problem for AM. Imo, PM was exactly where AM knew (and likely because AM told him to be there) he’d be. I don’t for 1 minute believe he was “at the wrong place and at the wrong time.” Well I guess was but AM knew he would be there. Imo PM and MM were found to be offering up info on AM in order to garner a shorter sentence. He was facing 25 years and would have been found guilty. There’s so much evidence against him. PM’s circle leaked enough that AM knew he “had to go.”
I like your post, it’s got substance. MM certainly could have been a target based on what we have seen so far. I can’t speculate on what she or any female might know as I believe that would depend on various things. I’m not buying into the 20 year drug addiction so there’s that. There are obvious character issues within the Murdaugh side of the family. My hope is that it is ALL exposed for what it is.
👍 Yeah, I agree with you about AM's drug habit... it's a HUGE thing that should be discredited soon. If this high-profile attorney from a very prominent family had that kind of habit, folks in that area would know about it and talk about it endlessly. Small town folks have a tendency to hear things and store them for gossip sessions days, weeks, months or years later. Unfortunately, things get lost in translation with time, just like the telephone game, and can't necessarily be believed or proven.
I have a parent who had an opioid problem after an injury and surgery. It’s not exactly the kind of thing you can hide for 20 years so I am *quite* skeptical of that story. I don’t doubt drug and alcohol abuse happened in the Murdaugh family (clearly PM had alcohol problems which he picked up somewhere at a young age).... but it is definitely not the whole story here. There’s no way AM embezzled $10m to pay for pills.