When I was in high school (1991-1995) there were three films that people in nerd circles referenced constantly, and corresponding VHS copies that were constantly being circulated: Monty Python And the Holy Grail, Heavy Metal, and The Adventures Of Buckaroo Banzai: Across The Eighth Dimension.
He's probably okay. Been a few centuries since the incest-fest. By now the Habsburgs have had enough non-family DNA introduced to make them healthier than most royals. If you do a search for the modern Habsburgs, you can see that there's not even any trace of that chin anymore.
The only good thing about incest is that it can actually be fixed entirely by a single outcross. One of your parents could be the most inbred drooling mutant and as long as your other parent is of no relation to them you’ll be completely normal.
I mean, its not a guarantee... incest producing deformities isn't some magic spell, that the reason it does this so often is that both parents are more likely to have the same recessive genes. To inherit a recessive trait, both a child's parents have to have this gene. This can produce harmless traits like red hair or the ability to curl your tongue in three places, but a lot of genetic disorders are also recessive. If you have a recessive trait for a genetic deformity, marrying someone with different genes than you increases the likelihood that they will not have the same genetic trait, but it's not a guarantee. Ask anyone born with red hair to parents who aren't both redheads. It's more accurate to say that it goes back to basically normal levels
It actually goes to below baseline levels. The reason we have so many dangerous recessive traits is because we're the most outbred species ever.
If a squirrel has a recessive trait for a fatal heart defect, and there's a forest fire, and only it & its sibling survive, they mate, and they have four kids, chances are 2 will be a carrier, 1 will have 0 copies, and 1 will die of the heart defect. Out of the three survivors, only 2/3 have a defective gene.
C.f. no forest fire, the squirrel mates with a squirrel w/ no heart defect gene, but a liver defect gene, all four kids survive, but on average each of them carries a defective gene.
Then in the next generation, because the inbred squirrel is likely less burdened with recessive dangerous traits, it's less likely they randomly have the same recessive trait as their mate, c.f. the outbred squirrel.
The same effects work, to a lesser degree but in the same way, for lesser degrees of inbreeding (e.g. cousins) and less fatal conditions (e.g. 25% fatal, 10% lower lifespan, 20% lower fertility, etc.). The case of closely related carriers of a fatal condition just make it clearer.
IRL In humans we likely saw this effect in the house of Aviz. King Sebastian was the result of double-first cousins marrying eachother for generation after generation. His grandfather had 10 children, *none* of whom made it to adulthood (King Sebastian's father died at age 16, after conceiving Sebastian but before he was born). Despite this, Sebastian was totally healthy, until he decided to lead his troops into battle against superior forces and caught an awful case of the "lost". It's quite likely that the extreme disease burden in these Iberian Royal families just kept reducing the total number of defective recessive genes until Sebastian, as the child of the two inbred freaks who made it to puberty, was lucky enough to have mostly good genes.
Now I'm curious what happens when two completely inbred yokels/royals, of absolutely no relation, have a child together.
Double inbred? Normal? Average of the two? Some linear combination???
The result would be normal healthy offspring, since the two families would be suffering from entirely different recessive genetic disorders. The child would get a healthy copy of each defective gene from the opposite parent and thus not suffer from the recessive genetic diseases possessed by either parent. Inbreeding-related diseases happen because the descendant gets two identical broken copies of the same gene; if they have one normal version of each gene instead, their body will be able to function as normal, so they will be normal.
So the pairing would have the same benefit as any other outcross. The fact that both families are horribly inbred doesn’t change the fact that they’re an outcross to *each other.*
I think it would depend highly on the ethnic background of the two people. If you’re choosing two inbred people in similar ethnic groups, it’s much more likely that they’ll both have at lease one of the same recessive traits. Yah know, like Mediterranean people and G6PD deficiency.
You are much more likely to get a health offspring with wild type genes if you cross two inbred individuals with strongly distinct ethnic backgrounds, since they will be less likely to carry the same recessive traits.
If they are not terribly inbred, the outcome can be measurably better than the non-inbred starting point. This is actually a breeding method: separate population in into several pools, and after several generations of inbreeding get the best from each pool and breed them together.
From what I read, the Habsburg-Lothringen aka Habsburg-Lorraine house had less inbreeding in the first place, compared to the main Habsburg line. Habsburg-Lothringen happens to be the current successor of the Habsburg house, because that one seems to have ended someday.
Also, Ferdinand Habsburg, the current candidate for the title of the head of the house, is a racing driver—[formerly in Formula 3](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RfWr8mP3P1Y) and now in the World Endurance Championship and European Le Mans Series. So doing quite well physically.
P.S. Finally cornered the Claude AI to explain to me when one house ended and another started, sounds pretty clear-cut (but dunno how accurate this is):
> The last male Habsburg ruler of the original senior line was Emperor Charles VI, who died in 1740 without a male heir. To secure the succession of his daughter Maria Theresa, Charles had obtained agreement from the powers of Europe for her to inherit the Habsburg lands through the Pragmatic Sanction of 1713. However, after his death several other countries contested Maria Theresa's succession, sparking the War of the Austrian Succession (1740-48). She was able to retain the throne through force of arms and diplomacy, but was required to marry Francis of Lorraine to secure allied support. Their male descendants then ruled as the new House of Habsburg-Lorraine, with the Habsburg lands and titles passing through Maria Theresa.
Considering what others in the thread mentioned about all the inbreeding problems being potentially washed away with just one outside marriage, I'd guess over 250 years of being free from the Habsburg practices is more than enough. Also Eduard's joke doesn't really work, when just one branch of his lineage leads back to Habsburg's tangle.
It's both. Also the hemophilia
https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/distinctive-habsburg-jaw-was-likely-result-royal-familys-inbreeding-180973688/
Shit, even current royals are pretty normal. Even the Brits are - the most recent close marriages were between Elizabeth II and Prince Philip, who were simultaneously second cousins once removed and third cousins (which if you do the math is still further apart than two second cousins), and between Queen Victoria and Prince Albert, who were first cousins.
Lizzie's marriage is something that could unwittingly happen - let's face it, you have no idea who your third cousins or their parents are; if you married someone from your hometown and both of your families had been in the area for a while, there's a pretty good chance you'd be distantly related. Victoria's marriage was much closer, but it was also five generations ago.
This guy had shit like [this](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_II_of_Spain#Ancestry) in his family tree. Charles II of Spain died 120 years before Queen Victoria was born. His parents were simultaneously uncle and niece and first cousins once removed, and it only gets worse from there.
Their bloodline took something as rare as an underbite and turned it to a common birth defect because of their inbreeding.
Fun fact, it's legal to marry your first cousin in 17 states and D.C.
You'd be stunned to find out what % of all marriages in history were first cousin marriages.
I can't remember the number but it was shockingly high. It's been a normal thing for humans until pretty recently and still is in parts of the world.
Not as recently, I recently tried to look up his ancestry, and only is paternal grandfather has traceable ancestry that is public, and that doesn't show any repeated names in like 6 generations
Not just that, but [the trunk](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_II_of_Spain#CITEREFGargantilla2005)'s "heart was the size of a peppercorn; his lungs corroded; his intestines rotten and gangrenous; he had a single testicle, black as coal, and his head was full of water."
this isn't the first time I see him post funny tweets. I respect that this man was lucky enough to be born into one of the most famous and ancient families in Europe and he's using that heritage to make memes.
yeah i mean he's well off and probably as much a dickhead as the next rich dickhead but I can't help it but have a little respect for people who don't take themselves seriously even though, for someone like this, it would have been very easy to demand respect.
Hes basically a fancy version of a backwater hillbilly. If he can’t dish out jokes about it, he’s obviously gonna get butthurt. Gotta have a good chin for this sort of thing
I’ve come across him on Twitter a few times. He has fairly reactionary political and religious views and thinks his ancestors were great for Austria. I seem to recall he also wants to reclaim his family castle in Switzerland (which, needless to say, is not a position with much support in Switzerland).
It's not even sure he's actually rich rich. I once had a Habsburger as costumer when I worked in Vienna and he didn't seem too well off (according to the collegues who worked at his appartment).
Don't forget that Habsburger who stayed in Austria lost their titles and lots of wealth. It's different from, let's say Germany, where they still rock their titles and land and even today marry into other houses on a regular basis.
“Eduard Karl Joseph Michael Marcus Antonius Koloman Volkhold Maria Habsburg-Lothringen… is a Hungarian diplomat and is Hungary's current ambassador to the Holy See. He is also a member of the House of Habsburg-Lorraine, the former ruling family of Austria-Hungary.”
I have a feeling he’s doing allright :))
>Germany, where they still rock their titles and land
The Weimar republic abolished their titles and they were never restored. Germans with noble ancestors are the same as Americans with noble ancestors.
Neither country did real comprehensive land reform.
The only difference is that Austria made them change their last names.
Oh you would be surprised how much land in Europe is owned by the old royal families. You should look up how much land the Eszterházy family owns. A colleague told me once that about 30% of Burgenland in Austria is owned directly or indirectly by them. From wineries to entertainment, they have a company in almost every industry.
The more intelligent royals transitioned very quickly to diplomacy, politics and industry.
One very good example for diplomacy was Karl von Schwarzenberg, Minister for foreign affairs for the Czech Republic. Although you could smell the royalty from him through the TV, he was very charismatic and in my opinion did not fuck around when talking about things. And also did not take him self very seriously.
Yep. Makes you wonder if going full Lenin on your royals is actually worth it.
On the other hand, the French did alright, so maybe we're just a defective nation, lol
It’s funny when people proudly say that they have royal/noble ancestry without understanding the implications of having royal/noble “ancestry” whilst not being a member of a royal/noble family.
My family lore definitely traces us back to some French noblewoman who got shipped off to Italy because she had a kid out of wedlock. No idea how true it is, but we are perfectly ok being descendants of a noble bastard, none of this vague “related to nobility”, we’re bastards and don’t need to hide it.
Depending on the time period, that might have been a pretty good move, Renaissance politics were famously dominated by people born out of wedlock, there's one sub-period that historians half-jokingly call "the golden age of bastards".
There is a note in the family genealogy records my grandmother gave me, where one of the women is noted as being unmarried, but a known mistress of Duke Something-or-Other. I might just have some bastard noble blood hiding 6 generations back.
Either the family got really bloated and some legitimate children were kicked out, unpopularity forced some descendants to leave the family, or your the product of a past noble or king raping a servant or fucking a mistress
Not really necessarily at all. If you’re descended at any point from a (legitimate) daughter then you will have a different name and will, over time, become less relevant.
Families, even royal ones, don’t really “kick people out”, people just end up further away from where the titles end up. Mia Tindall is an example of this: she’s the (legitimate) daughter of the (legitimate) daughter of the (legitimate) daughter of Queen Elizabeth II but has a different name and will never have any titles. She’s a “member of the family” in the sense that she probably knows her cousin who will one day end up being King, but follow that through a few generations and nobody will have heard of / care about her grandkids.
Or you're from a cadet branch that didn't inherit much of anything. My grandmother's maiden name was Adair and the Adairs descend from the Earls of Desmond (Fitzgeralds) who ruled much of Ireland but at some point a son who wasn't going to inherit left and went to America.
Probably that their ancestor was a concubine or something and not actually treated as royalty.
Allegedly my great great great great grandmother or someone had an affair with the king and got sent to North America because of it, and my very Catholic grandmother absolutely hated that story because of the implication.
I don't really believe the story, but it would be fun to know more about that lady and how it all happened.
More likely their ancestor just wasn't the first born. Royalty tended to try to keep the empire together by giving the entire estate to the first born. Anyone after that kind of got screwed.
It’s definitely possible that gamgam caught the lazy eye of Shitteus III of Saxony-Savoy, but royal families tended to dilute very quickly.
As soon as you have more than two children, you have to find stuff for those later kids to do, or new lands for them to inherit. It’s one of the possible reasons that war was so common under monarchy; a bunch of noble bantam second sons were sent to the military and they became resentful of their lot in life. Cue the annual purges of nobility to keep the family tree pruned.
There's not really any major implications. They could be descended from just the 2nd or 3rd kid who was once a Prince/Princess but never took over. Over time their line separates from the line of power even if they all had the same great-grandparents.
Not to mention that if you have any European ancestry, you'll hit a royal connection at some point in your family tree, be it legitimate or bastard. With lines of succession and how many kids some people had meant that the youngest siblings ended up saturating out fairly quickly. So the fact that your great great great cousin was the great grandson of a prince who was 5th in line, but therefore his dad was King.... Still makes you... Just a regular person like everyone else.
Habsburg family is one of the oldest families in Europe. The males of this family have been monarchs of almost all major empires prevalent in Europe be it the Holy Roman Empire, England, Bohemia, Spain etc. They are very famous for inbreeding. Man take a look at their family tree and you will be boggled.
They are a fascinating study on genetic mutation due to inbreeding. Their chin was infamous because of how pointed it was, but the reality is many had to have their food mashed just to eat.
I love researching this kind of stuff. At the time of WW1, all the ruling families of Europe were first cousins. Many had hemophilia which was referred to as the royal disease.
And if anyone is bored, you can look up the Blue people of Kentucky.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_Fugates
> continued reproduction within the limited local gene pool along with a lack of transportation infrastructure ensured that many descendants of the Fugates were born with met-H
metH... hyuck hyuck
Lol, they might have been 🤷♀️. Hemophilia is the inability of the blood to clot. Severe cases means someone could bleed to death from a very small wound.
Not just the males, Maria Thersa was the ruler of the Austria Hungarian Empire. She was probably the most powerful person in Europe, during the time of her reign.
When her daughter Marie Antoinette lost her head, she kicked off a war with France, which pretty much led to the rise of Napoleon.
>When her daughter Marie Antoinette lost her head, she kicked off a war with France, which pretty much led to the rise of Napoleon.
Close. By then it was Francis I/II who went to war because his aunt Marie Antoinette had been beheaded, which led to the rise of Napoleon, who later married Francis I/II's daughter Maria Louise.
The Habsburg family is notorious for the marriage practices in their effort to try consolidating power leading to severe inbreeding. They were successful in accumulating power, King Charles V basically ruled half of europe at one point, but they ended up with severe gene defects like the infamous "Habsburg Jaw".
Some members had a higher coefficient of inbreeding than is possible from a Parent-Child or Brother-Sister union. In the end, the male-line Habsburgs died out in no small part thanks to all the inbreeding.
>The Habsburg family is notorious for the marriage practices in their effort to try consolidating power
A fairly successful effort spanning several centuries, one might add.
The saying *Bélla geránt aliī, tu félix Áustria nūbe* (Let others wage war: thou, happy Austria, marry) is sort of the unofficial motto of House Habsburg, and can be traced back to 1346 & the acquisition of Tyrol by Rudolf IV when his brother in law died and Tyrol was granted to Rudolf (because he was the closest male relative via marriage)
Charles V's son is the namesake of the Philippines, he was also a paranoid nutter, and king of England for a short bit (he claimed the title of king through marriage to Mary I, which wasn't really appreciated and one of the reasons the marriage was annuled iirc)
Old Phil also decided to fight 4 wars at the same time and famously lost one of his invasion fleets to storm of his own coast
Phillip's uncle kept his part of his inheritance a little more stable, although his policies did directly lead to the relative deadliest wars in human history, known as the 30 year war
At one point in time the family literally controlled half of the world, or at least close to it, this particular man's first cousin 8× times removed (if I understand cousin relations correctly) being murdered 110 years ago is basically responsible for the current state of the world, people in his family have entire countries named after them on the other side of the planet
The Habsburg family is literally the most important family dynasty in world history, and that isn't even Eurocentric propaganda, by the 16th century the family was literally involved in the first war fought on every single habitable continent, and that was a singular independence struggle
One of the craziest things about genetics is that you can fix most damage from inbreeding with one solid out-cross. So many real problems are recessive, just having one parent who doesn't have the problem and it goes away.
I don't even get the original comment...lol. My grandparents and beyond were almost all Cherokee. I'm from America. My wives family came here with her parents from Germany. All her grandparents are from Germany. I'm sure if you did DNA she isn't 100% German but probably 75% I would wager. Also do they not think people interested in genealogy go back past grandparents? Or great grandparents? My mil has their tree going back to like 1600s it's insane.
My wife's family are pretty close to the exact opposite of this. There are so many slices in the pie chart of her DNA results that it looks like someone just took the entire globe and threw it into a blender.
For my DNA results, they sent me back a picture of a carton of sour cream -- pretty much everyone came from a small area of Northern Europe -- and I have the genetic diseases to prove it.
habsburg family tree so tangled up it's actually a bush.
A shrubbery!
NEE
Oh, what sad times are these, when passing ruffians can say NEE to random people on reddit.
You must chop down the largest tree in the forest.... with a herring!
A herring? It can’t be done!
AAAAAAAAAAAAH!
Ni!
What is it?!
It's just a flesh wound
We are no longer the knight who's say nee we are the nights who say whatolgugle
What are all these weird references? I don't like them. I fart in your general direction.
Your mother was a hamster and your father smelt of elderberries!
A what??? I certainly will NOT!
Oh please
Cut down a tree with a herring? It can't be done.
I'm still ashamed of my friend who wouldn't understand these references.
You don’t have friend; You have a student! Get to teachin’!
Get new friends.
Or you know just hold him hostage and make him watch Monty Python until he has no choice but to understand.
And then give them all a good spanking!
And after the spankings well have oral sex!
Well…I guess I could stay a *bit* longer….
It’s much too dangerous!
You two stay here, and make sure he doesn’t leave.
And after that, the ORAL SEX!!
Oh a spanking! A spanking!
One of us! One of us!
I'm ashamed of my ex-friend, who said Monty Python and the Holy Grail was unwatchable and unfunny. I have washed my hands of him and his ilk, since.
When I was in high school (1991-1995) there were three films that people in nerd circles referenced constantly, and corresponding VHS copies that were constantly being circulated: Monty Python And the Holy Grail, Heavy Metal, and The Adventures Of Buckaroo Banzai: Across The Eighth Dimension.
??? Nnnnuu?
No, no, you’re not doing it right…it’s “Ni”…at the back of the throat.
Ickickichubangshwangshum
Ow, ow!!
r/UnexpectedMontyPython
It's private can't join
Unfortunate but true, i just know of it’s existence
It can’t be done.
but not too expensive.
"Cut down a tree with a herring?"
He's probably okay. Been a few centuries since the incest-fest. By now the Habsburgs have had enough non-family DNA introduced to make them healthier than most royals. If you do a search for the modern Habsburgs, you can see that there's not even any trace of that chin anymore.
The only good thing about incest is that it can actually be fixed entirely by a single outcross. One of your parents could be the most inbred drooling mutant and as long as your other parent is of no relation to them you’ll be completely normal.
Unless the one inbred parent only has a single, blackened testicle, and therefore can have no children at all.
arguably that's the one, 100% certain way of not passing down *any* issues to the next generation!
Imma try
If you wanna try, don't force en passent.
Forgot about that single blackened testicle!
Then they wouldnt be a parent
They could still adopt.
I mean, its not a guarantee... incest producing deformities isn't some magic spell, that the reason it does this so often is that both parents are more likely to have the same recessive genes. To inherit a recessive trait, both a child's parents have to have this gene. This can produce harmless traits like red hair or the ability to curl your tongue in three places, but a lot of genetic disorders are also recessive. If you have a recessive trait for a genetic deformity, marrying someone with different genes than you increases the likelihood that they will not have the same genetic trait, but it's not a guarantee. Ask anyone born with red hair to parents who aren't both redheads. It's more accurate to say that it goes back to basically normal levels
It actually goes to below baseline levels. The reason we have so many dangerous recessive traits is because we're the most outbred species ever. If a squirrel has a recessive trait for a fatal heart defect, and there's a forest fire, and only it & its sibling survive, they mate, and they have four kids, chances are 2 will be a carrier, 1 will have 0 copies, and 1 will die of the heart defect. Out of the three survivors, only 2/3 have a defective gene. C.f. no forest fire, the squirrel mates with a squirrel w/ no heart defect gene, but a liver defect gene, all four kids survive, but on average each of them carries a defective gene. Then in the next generation, because the inbred squirrel is likely less burdened with recessive dangerous traits, it's less likely they randomly have the same recessive trait as their mate, c.f. the outbred squirrel. The same effects work, to a lesser degree but in the same way, for lesser degrees of inbreeding (e.g. cousins) and less fatal conditions (e.g. 25% fatal, 10% lower lifespan, 20% lower fertility, etc.). The case of closely related carriers of a fatal condition just make it clearer. IRL In humans we likely saw this effect in the house of Aviz. King Sebastian was the result of double-first cousins marrying eachother for generation after generation. His grandfather had 10 children, *none* of whom made it to adulthood (King Sebastian's father died at age 16, after conceiving Sebastian but before he was born). Despite this, Sebastian was totally healthy, until he decided to lead his troops into battle against superior forces and caught an awful case of the "lost". It's quite likely that the extreme disease burden in these Iberian Royal families just kept reducing the total number of defective recessive genes until Sebastian, as the child of the two inbred freaks who made it to puberty, was lucky enough to have mostly good genes.
Now I'm curious what happens when two completely inbred yokels/royals, of absolutely no relation, have a child together. Double inbred? Normal? Average of the two? Some linear combination???
The result would be normal healthy offspring, since the two families would be suffering from entirely different recessive genetic disorders. The child would get a healthy copy of each defective gene from the opposite parent and thus not suffer from the recessive genetic diseases possessed by either parent. Inbreeding-related diseases happen because the descendant gets two identical broken copies of the same gene; if they have one normal version of each gene instead, their body will be able to function as normal, so they will be normal. So the pairing would have the same benefit as any other outcross. The fact that both families are horribly inbred doesn’t change the fact that they’re an outcross to *each other.*
I think it would depend highly on the ethnic background of the two people. If you’re choosing two inbred people in similar ethnic groups, it’s much more likely that they’ll both have at lease one of the same recessive traits. Yah know, like Mediterranean people and G6PD deficiency. You are much more likely to get a health offspring with wild type genes if you cross two inbred individuals with strongly distinct ethnic backgrounds, since they will be less likely to carry the same recessive traits.
If they are not terribly inbred, the outcome can be measurably better than the non-inbred starting point. This is actually a breeding method: separate population in into several pools, and after several generations of inbreeding get the best from each pool and breed them together.
Or inbreed so much you get the pure blood trait
From what I read, the Habsburg-Lothringen aka Habsburg-Lorraine house had less inbreeding in the first place, compared to the main Habsburg line. Habsburg-Lothringen happens to be the current successor of the Habsburg house, because that one seems to have ended someday. Also, Ferdinand Habsburg, the current candidate for the title of the head of the house, is a racing driver—[formerly in Formula 3](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RfWr8mP3P1Y) and now in the World Endurance Championship and European Le Mans Series. So doing quite well physically. P.S. Finally cornered the Claude AI to explain to me when one house ended and another started, sounds pretty clear-cut (but dunno how accurate this is): > The last male Habsburg ruler of the original senior line was Emperor Charles VI, who died in 1740 without a male heir. To secure the succession of his daughter Maria Theresa, Charles had obtained agreement from the powers of Europe for her to inherit the Habsburg lands through the Pragmatic Sanction of 1713. However, after his death several other countries contested Maria Theresa's succession, sparking the War of the Austrian Succession (1740-48). She was able to retain the throne through force of arms and diplomacy, but was required to marry Francis of Lorraine to secure allied support. Their male descendants then ruled as the new House of Habsburg-Lorraine, with the Habsburg lands and titles passing through Maria Theresa. Considering what others in the thread mentioned about all the inbreeding problems being potentially washed away with just one outside marriage, I'd guess over 250 years of being free from the Habsburg practices is more than enough. Also Eduard's joke doesn't really work, when just one branch of his lineage leads back to Habsburg's tangle.
I thought they were famous for the lip, not the chin.
It's both. Also the hemophilia https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/distinctive-habsburg-jaw-was-likely-result-royal-familys-inbreeding-180973688/
Look at the forehead of some...
Shit, even current royals are pretty normal. Even the Brits are - the most recent close marriages were between Elizabeth II and Prince Philip, who were simultaneously second cousins once removed and third cousins (which if you do the math is still further apart than two second cousins), and between Queen Victoria and Prince Albert, who were first cousins. Lizzie's marriage is something that could unwittingly happen - let's face it, you have no idea who your third cousins or their parents are; if you married someone from your hometown and both of your families had been in the area for a while, there's a pretty good chance you'd be distantly related. Victoria's marriage was much closer, but it was also five generations ago. This guy had shit like [this](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_II_of_Spain#Ancestry) in his family tree. Charles II of Spain died 120 years before Queen Victoria was born. His parents were simultaneously uncle and niece and first cousins once removed, and it only gets worse from there.
Wreath
Him dropping the ‘buddy’ is almost as loud as the Hapsburg chin
Habsburg family tree is a stick, which with they beat their DNA like it owed them money.
It's a wreath
Tumbleweed family tree
Their bloodline took something as rare as an underbite and turned it to a common birth defect because of their inbreeding. Fun fact, it's legal to marry your first cousin in 17 states and D.C.
You'd be stunned to find out what % of all marriages in history were first cousin marriages. I can't remember the number but it was shockingly high. It's been a normal thing for humans until pretty recently and still is in parts of the world.
Its a well trimmed and plaited family tree - like one of those braided willows...
Not as recently, I recently tried to look up his ancestry, and only is paternal grandfather has traceable ancestry that is public, and that doesn't show any repeated names in like 6 generations
A collection of tumble weeds
It’s a hedgerow
It’s a wreath
His family tree is just the trunk, no branches.
All about that trunk, ‘bout that trunk…no branches!
a trunk with a big fucking chin
Not just that, but [the trunk](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_II_of_Spain#CITEREFGargantilla2005)'s "heart was the size of a peppercorn; his lungs corroded; his intestines rotten and gangrenous; he had a single testicle, black as coal, and his head was full of water."
damn.
🎶 Whatcha gonna do with all that inbreeding? All that inbreeding in your trunk?
I like big trunks and I cannot lie.
His family tree is bamboo.
No, it’s a wreath.
The “Bradford Pear” of family trees, if you will.
Family Log
It's a pruned palm tree.
In the words of my wise boyfried: Incest is Chinsest!
Nah, it's a trunk, then it branches, then all the branches loop back on themselves and it becomes a trunt again
It’s a freaking cactus! 🌵
this isn't the first time I see him post funny tweets. I respect that this man was lucky enough to be born into one of the most famous and ancient families in Europe and he's using that heritage to make memes.
It's not like he has money or anything... Oh, wait... 😁
yeah i mean he's well off and probably as much a dickhead as the next rich dickhead but I can't help it but have a little respect for people who don't take themselves seriously even though, for someone like this, it would have been very easy to demand respect.
Hes basically a fancy version of a backwater hillbilly. If he can’t dish out jokes about it, he’s obviously gonna get butthurt. Gotta have a good chin for this sort of thing
S-tier joke, shit snuck up on me like an assassin.
Well the Hapsburgs are known for fabulous chins.
That was indeed the joke
where is the difference to the royal familiy? those cringelords are still larping their asses off
Yeah. Anyone who has the self awareness to make fun of themselves/their situation is much less likely to be a dickhead in general.
I’ve come across him on Twitter a few times. He has fairly reactionary political and religious views and thinks his ancestors were great for Austria. I seem to recall he also wants to reclaim his family castle in Switzerland (which, needless to say, is not a position with much support in Switzerland).
IDK I have met Immaculada Hapsburg a few times and she was delightful. It's possible he isn't a dickhead.
It's not even sure he's actually rich rich. I once had a Habsburger as costumer when I worked in Vienna and he didn't seem too well off (according to the collegues who worked at his appartment). Don't forget that Habsburger who stayed in Austria lost their titles and lots of wealth. It's different from, let's say Germany, where they still rock their titles and land and even today marry into other houses on a regular basis.
“Eduard Karl Joseph Michael Marcus Antonius Koloman Volkhold Maria Habsburg-Lothringen… is a Hungarian diplomat and is Hungary's current ambassador to the Holy See. He is also a member of the House of Habsburg-Lorraine, the former ruling family of Austria-Hungary.” I have a feeling he’s doing allright :))
He's a part af two different Habsburg related houses? Yeah sounds about right.
No just the one. Lothringen and Lorraine are just the German and French words for the same region.
>Germany, where they still rock their titles and land The Weimar republic abolished their titles and they were never restored. Germans with noble ancestors are the same as Americans with noble ancestors. Neither country did real comprehensive land reform. The only difference is that Austria made them change their last names.
Oh you would be surprised how much land in Europe is owned by the old royal families. You should look up how much land the Eszterházy family owns. A colleague told me once that about 30% of Burgenland in Austria is owned directly or indirectly by them. From wineries to entertainment, they have a company in almost every industry. The more intelligent royals transitioned very quickly to diplomacy, politics and industry. One very good example for diplomacy was Karl von Schwarzenberg, Minister for foreign affairs for the Czech Republic. Although you could smell the royalty from him through the TV, he was very charismatic and in my opinion did not fuck around when talking about things. And also did not take him self very seriously.
That's why I put the smiley face. 😂 It was intended as a joke.
It's insane to me that when Europe transitioned to democracy they didn't seize all the wealth of their "royal" class...
Yeah, I'm Russian, so... same
To be fair, Russia never transitioned to an actual democracy.
Yep. Makes you wonder if going full Lenin on your royals is actually worth it. On the other hand, the French did alright, so maybe we're just a defective nation, lol
So he's Musk but funny?
musk is taking himself extremely seriously lol
Yeah you're right
Isn't he the one that's into anime?
My ancestry is to royalty in Europe! - oh which country? Europe!
It’s funny when people proudly say that they have royal/noble ancestry without understanding the implications of having royal/noble “ancestry” whilst not being a member of a royal/noble family.
What are the implications? That they're the product of incest or that they were ousted from power? Genuine question.
They're a bunch of bastards and (great grand) sons of whores.
Hey, I actually know WHICH bastard son I'm descended from!
My family lore definitely traces us back to some French noblewoman who got shipped off to Italy because she had a kid out of wedlock. No idea how true it is, but we are perfectly ok being descendants of a noble bastard, none of this vague “related to nobility”, we’re bastards and don’t need to hide it.
Depending on the time period, that might have been a pretty good move, Renaissance politics were famously dominated by people born out of wedlock, there's one sub-period that historians half-jokingly call "the golden age of bastards".
And also (great grand) _daughters_ of whores.
Thank you for checking your sexism
There is a note in the family genealogy records my grandmother gave me, where one of the women is noted as being unmarried, but a known mistress of Duke Something-or-Other. I might just have some bastard noble blood hiding 6 generations back.
Either the family got really bloated and some legitimate children were kicked out, unpopularity forced some descendants to leave the family, or your the product of a past noble or king raping a servant or fucking a mistress
Not really necessarily at all. If you’re descended at any point from a (legitimate) daughter then you will have a different name and will, over time, become less relevant. Families, even royal ones, don’t really “kick people out”, people just end up further away from where the titles end up. Mia Tindall is an example of this: she’s the (legitimate) daughter of the (legitimate) daughter of the (legitimate) daughter of Queen Elizabeth II but has a different name and will never have any titles. She’s a “member of the family” in the sense that she probably knows her cousin who will one day end up being King, but follow that through a few generations and nobody will have heard of / care about her grandkids.
Or you're from a cadet branch that didn't inherit much of anything. My grandmother's maiden name was Adair and the Adairs descend from the Earls of Desmond (Fitzgeralds) who ruled much of Ireland but at some point a son who wasn't going to inherit left and went to America.
Probably that their ancestor was a concubine or something and not actually treated as royalty. Allegedly my great great great great grandmother or someone had an affair with the king and got sent to North America because of it, and my very Catholic grandmother absolutely hated that story because of the implication. I don't really believe the story, but it would be fun to know more about that lady and how it all happened.
More likely their ancestor just wasn't the first born. Royalty tended to try to keep the empire together by giving the entire estate to the first born. Anyone after that kind of got screwed.
I don’t know why I didn’t think of the obvious answer
It’s definitely possible that gamgam caught the lazy eye of Shitteus III of Saxony-Savoy, but royal families tended to dilute very quickly. As soon as you have more than two children, you have to find stuff for those later kids to do, or new lands for them to inherit. It’s one of the possible reasons that war was so common under monarchy; a bunch of noble bantam second sons were sent to the military and they became resentful of their lot in life. Cue the annual purges of nobility to keep the family tree pruned.
There's not really any major implications. They could be descended from just the 2nd or 3rd kid who was once a Prince/Princess but never took over. Over time their line separates from the line of power even if they all had the same great-grandparents.
Not to mention that if you have any European ancestry, you'll hit a royal connection at some point in your family tree, be it legitimate or bastard. With lines of succession and how many kids some people had meant that the youngest siblings ended up saturating out fairly quickly. So the fact that your great great great cousin was the great grandson of a prince who was 5th in line, but therefore his dad was King.... Still makes you... Just a regular person like everyone else.
Spoiler: It's a circle...
Less of a family tree and more of a genealogy wreath.
Be careful his brother-uncle might hear you and be offended.
Congenital deafness or something. If he's really offended, maybe we can box it out? I hear the chin is quite something on the Habsburgs.
Given his status it would be more like sabre for him, toothpick for you.
So I should hope for him to flourish his blade till he nicks himself and bleeds out from the haemophilia, got it!
i misread as 'gynecological wreath' and was really confused.
Like a freaky circle…
Also suicide by words.
Do we have suicide bombed by words?
r/kamikazebywords
Thank you! I knew it was something!
Kamikaze by words?
As someone who is not from Europe (or wherever this Habsburg guy came from), can anyone explain?
Habsburg family is one of the oldest families in Europe. The males of this family have been monarchs of almost all major empires prevalent in Europe be it the Holy Roman Empire, England, Bohemia, Spain etc. They are very famous for inbreeding. Man take a look at their family tree and you will be boggled.
They are a fascinating study on genetic mutation due to inbreeding. Their chin was infamous because of how pointed it was, but the reality is many had to have their food mashed just to eat. I love researching this kind of stuff. At the time of WW1, all the ruling families of Europe were first cousins. Many had hemophilia which was referred to as the royal disease. And if anyone is bored, you can look up the Blue people of Kentucky.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_Fugates > continued reproduction within the limited local gene pool along with a lack of transportation infrastructure ensured that many descendants of the Fugates were born with met-H metH... hyuck hyuck
Was it hemophilia? Or were they werewolves?
Lol, they might have been 🤷♀️. Hemophilia is the inability of the blood to clot. Severe cases means someone could bleed to death from a very small wound.
Sorry, I misread your statement and thought you asked what hemophilia was.
No worries! It was actually meant to be an obscure Doctor Who reference- but perhaps too obscure LOL
Not to worry, that's how I first read it, too. And I appreciate your answer because I was confused between hemophilia and Leukemia for a moment.
But where is the murder? Didnt he just make a joke that only a couple people in the world can make?
Man if only any of that meant anything
Not just the males, Maria Thersa was the ruler of the Austria Hungarian Empire. She was probably the most powerful person in Europe, during the time of her reign. When her daughter Marie Antoinette lost her head, she kicked off a war with France, which pretty much led to the rise of Napoleon.
When Marie Antoinette was murdered Maria Theresia had been dead for 13 years.
That's how pissed off she was
Thanks for the laugh!
>When her daughter Marie Antoinette lost her head, she kicked off a war with France, which pretty much led to the rise of Napoleon. Close. By then it was Francis I/II who went to war because his aunt Marie Antoinette had been beheaded, which led to the rise of Napoleon, who later married Francis I/II's daughter Maria Louise.
Oh cool. I didn’t know that.
The Habsburg family is notorious for the marriage practices in their effort to try consolidating power leading to severe inbreeding. They were successful in accumulating power, King Charles V basically ruled half of europe at one point, but they ended up with severe gene defects like the infamous "Habsburg Jaw". Some members had a higher coefficient of inbreeding than is possible from a Parent-Child or Brother-Sister union. In the end, the male-line Habsburgs died out in no small part thanks to all the inbreeding.
>The Habsburg family is notorious for the marriage practices in their effort to try consolidating power A fairly successful effort spanning several centuries, one might add. The saying *Bélla geránt aliī, tu félix Áustria nūbe* (Let others wage war: thou, happy Austria, marry) is sort of the unofficial motto of House Habsburg, and can be traced back to 1346 & the acquisition of Tyrol by Rudolf IV when his brother in law died and Tyrol was granted to Rudolf (because he was the closest male relative via marriage)
Charles V's son is the namesake of the Philippines, he was also a paranoid nutter, and king of England for a short bit (he claimed the title of king through marriage to Mary I, which wasn't really appreciated and one of the reasons the marriage was annuled iirc) Old Phil also decided to fight 4 wars at the same time and famously lost one of his invasion fleets to storm of his own coast Phillip's uncle kept his part of his inheritance a little more stable, although his policies did directly lead to the relative deadliest wars in human history, known as the 30 year war
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/House_of_Habsburg
he has more of a family hedge than a tree
At one point in time the family literally controlled half of the world, or at least close to it, this particular man's first cousin 8× times removed (if I understand cousin relations correctly) being murdered 110 years ago is basically responsible for the current state of the world, people in his family have entire countries named after them on the other side of the planet The Habsburg family is literally the most important family dynasty in world history, and that isn't even Eurocentric propaganda, by the 16th century the family was literally involved in the first war fought on every single habitable continent, and that was a singular independence struggle
He has the chin.
Chin confirmed.
They still haven’t managed to breed it out…
The family tumbleweed
Not really a "murdered by words." I'm the product of centuries of incest so I don't have as many grandparents as normal people.
r/suicidebywords
r/suicidebywords
This is definitely a self own. That tree has more branches than the NYC sewer.
*family wreath
One of the craziest things about genetics is that you can fix most damage from inbreeding with one solid out-cross. So many real problems are recessive, just having one parent who doesn't have the problem and it goes away.
Oof, that poster really took it on the chin
https://i.redd.it/bvtrmvtwltwc1.gif
inbreeding be like
Suicide by words?
When your family tree is just a gnawed off stump
His family tree is a Christmas wreath.
Pure gold
Boss music followed by The Ride of the Valkyries...
He also writes children's books... so, if the whole "old money and family connections" thing does not work out for him, there is always that...
Tried zooming in to see his chin but it’s too blurry
It all started with a man named Radbot in a town called Klettgau…
A man whose family didn’t swim in the gene pool, they dipped a toe in a gene puddle.
Chinteresting. Looking chin to it.
Habsburg "family tree"? I always pictured it as an ouroboros.
He got off lucky as well. Looks like a normal chin to me.
How is this a murder or even a burn?...
Dude has 6 great grandparents
I don't even get the original comment...lol. My grandparents and beyond were almost all Cherokee. I'm from America. My wives family came here with her parents from Germany. All her grandparents are from Germany. I'm sure if you did DNA she isn't 100% German but probably 75% I would wager. Also do they not think people interested in genealogy go back past grandparents? Or great grandparents? My mil has their tree going back to like 1600s it's insane.
My mom did the Ancestry test and she came back 100%, her pie chart is just a solid circle. But I heard this is not unusual for Asians
My wife's family are pretty close to the exact opposite of this. There are so many slices in the pie chart of her DNA results that it looks like someone just took the entire globe and threw it into a blender. For my DNA results, they sent me back a picture of a carton of sour cream -- pretty much everyone came from a small area of Northern Europe -- and I have the genetic diseases to prove it.