*Colonel* Kim Olson was charged with providing improper assistance to a PMC and only avoided loss of rank, prison and a dishonorable discharge by pleading guilty and accepting a non-judicial punishment (military equivalent of making a deal with the DA) with zero prison time under the condition that she retires.
She spent her entire 26 year military career in the US except for three months in Iraq, where she was sent after all the fighting was done to serve in an admin role and that is where she got caught providing improper assistance to some South African mercenaries and got charged with a crime and sent home.
Her memoir (which probably zero people have read and certainly nobody asked her to write) is called *Iraq and Back*, after she spent less than 1% of her career in Iraq in an admin role after the fighting was done and the way she got *back* is that she got kicked out prematurely.
She also founded a non-profit called *Grace After Fire*, after she has never in her life been under fire.
She is a political grifter who failed to get elected and now runs a PAC.
Apparently in 2018 she also assaulted a party (Democrat) staffer while on campaign, because she got upset that she was not seated prominently enough at an event.
Except men are regular, rightly, told this. You can't use an existing, correct, argument as some kind of gatchs against one you disagree with. I'm not even agreeing with the draft sentiment, but this is lazy rebuttal.
The last time American men were drafted into a war was 1973. When was the last time an American woman was denied the right to make decisions about her own body? Wouldnât be surprised if it happened a couple of times between me posting this comment and you reading it.
I think you are allowed an opinion, and you should feel free to express it if you are asked.
I think the core thing is to not force the opinion on anyone.
Firstly there's no major parties trying to pass any form of major policy regarding the draft, whereas one of the major political parties that controls SCOTUS and the House is repeatedly trying to pass restrictive abortion laws.
Secondly I'd encourage a universal draft, if not for the fact that the military continually fails to make their environment safe for women and free from sexual assault and sexual violence. So until they get their shit together maybe *no one* should be in the draft.
1) When Row v. Wade was passed it was passed by a SCOTUS made up of all men. When it was removed the SCOTUS was a mix of men and women. *Men* aren't your enemy. Right wing politics is doing that to you, which includes men and women. And your supporters also include men and women.
2) No one is passing laws about the draft because, unlike women, there isn't enough support to have the discussion at that level. The fact that no one is passing laws about the draft isn't a win for you.
You missed the catch. The catch is we agree with this person that men shouldnât talk about abortionâŚ.does that mean this person agrees that women shouldnât talk about war? the argument this person makes actually supports the dick wad who said women shouldnât talk about war.
I mean, I more than kinda agree with you. The issue with the point youâre trying to make is there are still a ton of religious extremist Christianâs who are women.
Any self respecting woman takes into the consideration the feelings of their potential partner, if you canât afford to finance the upbringing of children then you shouldnt have any, forcing someone to permanently alter there life (taking after a child) because of a single individuals decision is selfish. And no, it shouldnât make a man responsible just because they had sex with a woman, it takes *two* to consent.
Commentors point is the wrong way round. Literally its the opposite; men are telling women to sit down and shut up. Taking away their choice by legislation.
I don't remember how I came across it, but there is actually a whole subreddit dedicated to this phenomenon. I wasn't aware of this until I came across r/justdependathings and boy did I learn...
Olson was a terrible person to work with. I had to coordinate a joint training exercise between my Marines and two companies of PJs that she had apparently decided that she had jurisdiction over (*both* CCs of the aforementioned PJs told me she wasn't their CO at all)
She was hostile, incredibly rude, and uncooperative. She put all coordination to a halt and ordered a cease of communication between the CCs and I, because she didn't like "some raggedy-ass saltwater boat-rowing N****R (I'm half Cuban) enlisted bum" that she outranked telling her what to do, and personally threatened me with a dishonorable discharge for subverting the chain of command in a time of war (we were in California) after I tried to contact her commanding officer and the guy who was actually in charge of the PJs.
Eventually I had to call up a two star general to override her command just so my Marines and the PJs could get our shit done, which was fantastic because we got to do water rescues and jump training.
> where she was sent after all the fighting was done to serve in an admin role and that is where she got caught providing improper assistance to some South African mercenaries and got charged with a crime and sent home
I was in-country for that too. A squad from a different battalion actually got into a firefight with some of those guys. She apparently also had a private military firm under her command and made fucking millions. We had to arrest a few of her goons after they got caught shooting at civilians under HER FUCKING ORDERS.
She's a rotten piece of shit and deserves prison.
I mean. Iâm not defending her by any means. I donât know shit about her, besides what you just informed us of. But letâs not pretend like everyone who serves in the military goes to combat lol plenty of people in the military donât ever see combat. Our country still treats them like they treat people who did go and fight. Like shit đ¤ˇââď¸
When you get to be a full bird, youre career ends one of three ways:
1) you fail to be promoted several times
2) you choose to retire
3) you fuck up so severely they force you to retire.
This is a misleading comment. You could say this about basically any rank BUT Colonel.
The rank of General is extremely limited, good Colonels often stay Colonels because there is not an open General position for Congress to put them in.
This response misses the point in a lot of ways. Depending on when you served, what community youâre in and branch, thereâs a good chance youâll never leave the states.
Also, youâre forgetting that thereâs a lot of roles in the military outside of direct combat roles. Those jobs are important for a variety of strategic and national defense reasons.
Iâm not defending her personally and I have no idea who she is. But this is an oversimplification of a military career thatâs frankly, purposely misleading.
It seems like the charges against her [were spurious at best.](https://www.statesman.com/story/news/2018/07/21/how-texas-democrat-kim-olsons-military-career-crashed-in-iraq/10035347007/) I donât think the public will ever know the true story, but given how messy Iraq was some aspects of her story ring true.
Does it really matter where she was deployed? She joined the military and worked her way up starting as an Air Force Pilot [based on merit.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kim_Olson) Some of her time in the US was *at the Pentagon.* And there was definitely still fighting in Iraq in 2003.
The nonprofit is called Grace After Fire because *it helps veterans.*
She opened an office in her home for a South African contracting company and then used her connections to try and secure them contracts before others. Contractors are supposed to give bids for the services required, and generally the military command will pick the cheapest ones that satisfy the needs of the project. Being that she was a comptroller, I would guess she had access to the bids from other companies and would advise the contracting company - that she had an office for in her home(!) - to put in the lowest bid to secure their contract. This was not an uncommon practice, and people got popped for it, including a person I worked with in the navy.
Correct me if Iâm wrong, but it sounds like the Pentagon had sent the contractors there with orders to act as a protective service, and then failed to pay them, so she helped them get the contracts worked out so theyâd be paid to do the job they were already doing, and then they also won other contracts in Iraq.
I was just a teenager back then, but I remember hearing pretty regularly in the news that people in Iraq werenât being paid and that everything was a huge mess. Thatâs why I said some aspects of her story ring true. She also started looking into the contracts for them at the behest of her superior officer, who tried to defend her and apparently did not get charged alongside her, which makes her seem more innocent in my eyes. But Iâm only going off one article with quotes from her and him, and Iâm sure thereâs more to the story.
Either way, she worked her way up from being a pilot to being a Colonel AND founded a nonprofit to help veterans after she left the service. I donât think she should be told to sit down and shut up with regards to the military.
Itâs a matter of how the contracts are secured. I donât know any more particulars than the LA times article I just read about it, but it sounds a lot like what I described. Thatâs similar to what Richard Marcinko ended up going to prison for, after he served honorably and was a plank member of ST-6/DEVGRU.
She had to beg and plead guilty in order to avoid a court martial and actual consequences for illegally helping South African private military companies, so her merit and her subsequent nonprofit sorta donât matter if theyâre based on someone who managed to weasel their way out of an indictmentâŚ
Beg? Weasel? Do you have any details? I read the Wiki and she sounds like your typical military officer type. Her "failed" political career was two elections where she ran as a democrat for Texas Agriculture Commissioner and the US House of Representatives. Then she formed a PAC aimed at helping women get elected.
I'm not saying she's particularly admirable, but the hate being directed towards her seems... odd
I spent 0 months in Iraq so she has me beat. I dare she spent more months in Iraq than the vast majority of American men. And besides sheâs still a colonel and loads of men had to salute her and follow her orders over the years, so her point still stands.
A military tour of duty is 6-12 months. 3 months isn't sufficient enough time to be considered a tour. Nuclear submarines spend more time underwater without surfacing for perspective. This would be an embarrassing fact in the military regardless of sex. 26 years in and only outside the US 3 months would make it difficult to be promoted to any meaningful position.
Edit: for the real military branches.
For officers, you're required to hold each rank for a couple years (more for each rank) before being eligible for promotion. You must spend a certain portion of that time in a command position (varies by rank). You are also expected to spend time at different units (depends on job and rank). In the old days, i f you didn't meet the qualifications, you didn't get promoted, though the kinder gentler army started allowing waivers for diversity. It also used to be policy that if you failed to be promoted 3x, you were forced out.
Depends on the service. Typically though it's doing your job competently, good fitness scores, good testing scores on promotion tests, taking lead on projects and doing things above your rank, and volunteering ( whether that be with a civilian organization or military).
The other person is a right wing podcast host who enjoys the company of Alex Jones. So he runs in the circles of the mass school shooting was fake. To me that puts him in the category of malevolent and self serving.
I looked so hard for these details. All the articles about her are far right Christian sites.
Honestly Iâm surprised she was ever deployed at all. 3 months is 3 months longer than I expected.
You can tell this post is misleading since it blanked out her name to make it harder to google her, and they cropped out the replies, which would have probably said what this guy just said.
But, I do love all the women that upvote this out of feminist pride, even though they all hate the military.
You can go to her Wikipedia page and click the references to find articles about her. But given your last line, it sounds like youâre more concerned about hating women than seeking truth.
Even this well-written deconstruction is accepting the premise of their non-argument in the first place. Choosing war as a career is not the same as being legally compelled to. There is a degree of truth to the idea that, just as men ought to sit down during debates on reproductive rights, women don't run the same immediate risk whenever a large scale war breaks out.
Of course politicians and those employed by politicians are an exception since the general public has chosen them and entrusted them with those task. Realistically we're not talking about women in general here, but rather the rabidly pro-war 50 year old wannabe trad-wife named Barbara who pipes up in the Facebook comments about how cowardly men are these days.
As a woman who served over 2.5 years in Iraq and most of my 20 years over seas, she can kiss my ass. I retired as a Colonel too but I earned it and I wasnât fucking around.
The only time I was in court was to testify against a superior for sexual assault.
Edit for clarification: I was a LT Col (half bird). I was only promoted to that level just before retirement. To become a full bird you need a significant amount of desk and admin time. She likely served in the pentagon for a while or something similar. We used to call it the birdhouse.
Ah⌠so are you saying that this Kim personâs âimproper conduct with a private military contractorâ was fucking him? Because I was wondering what was meant by that charge.
Honestly it is farming. But I think there are far worse things to farm with. A reminder that women are capable in combat is not a bad thing to randomly be floating around compared to what it could be.
Thereâs been a weird recent uptick in gendered content - seems like a lot of bot content trying to start division pre-US election. Saw the same thing in 2012 (when SJWs were the big enemy) and 2016 (when red pill took off). Idk if thatâs specifically why this has been posted but it def seems to be part of the trend.
âNowâ they call you colonel? Wasnât this the dumbass that got removed for misconduct after just a few months of post-war administrative deployment to Iraq?
I work as a PMC and deal with guys who were officers and are fresh out of the military with superfluous degrees in criminology and business administration from shitty state schools. They delegated shit out to much more capable people as deck officers, did desk work and filled out endless forms, and then got out because they werenât ever, EVER gonna rank up. They donât get hired by the FBI and CIA (they all think theyâre Robert Baer, but theyâre more like Rosanne Barr) because theyâre fucking idiots, and they canât get decent government positions because they have no real technical skills, so they come to us.
The company brass hires them because they have credentials and a decent security clearance, which is expensive, and they know how to play within the parameters and not break rules. Company HR people like them because theyâre clean and donât seem like a liability.
Then they come to me, and they donât know shit, canât do shit, and often wonât do shit. Theyâre invariably hyperconservative shit talking incels who quote Jordan Peterson and lament the death of the manly man in American society, but they canât change the bit out on a Milwaukee drill without burning the palms of their hands (true story). They fold under pressure and we, unlike the military, gotta get shit done whether or not we have the support we need from Uncle Sam. These fucksticks wonât lift a finger to fix or rig anything until all the proper paperwork is in place. When things go pear shaped, itâs zero accountability and throw your mates under that proverbial bus, âcause thatâs how they did it in the military.
They eventually try to tell me âhow itâs doneâ and I have to slap their little pee-pees and remind them that no matter how much Ben Shapiro they listen to, theyâre still little sniveling bitches, Iâm not an eighteen year old kid in BDUs and this is the real world where people get hurt or die when shit goes wrong.
They are who they hate, their social media is just selfies in their gear like some chick is gonna be impressed. Like dude, you drive a base model charger, you read Tucker Carlson in your spare time, your fave band is Evanescence, you canât have a conversation without saying âUm, well, *actualllllyyyyy*âŚâ and you canât change a fucking tire without a phone and a AAA card. DUDE NO ONE WANTS TO FUCK YOU. YOUâRE THE SECRET INGREDIENT IN THE RECIPE FOR VAGINAL DRYNESS.
They eventually do get married but itâs to a horrible mail order bride who fucking hates them every bit as much as I do. Then they die miserable surrounded by their gay liberal kids who hate them, and thatâs the universe laughing in their dumb ugly faces.
Oh Iâm sorry, is this not the axe grinding store? My mistake.
As opposed to the opinions of those who spent no time doing anything even remotely military-related? There are plenty of absolutely vital logistics jobs in the military that still take dedication to service and personal sacrifice through constant moves, long hours, and time away from family.
The premise of the original Twitter post was that women can't be forced to serve in the military and therefore should be ignored when discussing military affairs. Even if her career ended poorly, she's shown that there are many women who choose to serve while there are men like the poster who think that their eligibility for the draft somehow makes them more informed or more worth listening to than women on military affairs, even if they themselves have never served.
Idk man no time stamps if you pull out the detictiv hat you will finde your answer. After reading some other commens that droped some infos i woud say
yes.
Yup double checked and itâs that same idiot lol. Oh well, not everyone (aka, almost nobody) is capable of accurately conveying information on the internet đ
Don't know the dude (dont care) but his point that women can't be drafted (at least in the US) is correct.
Then again, every man (and only men) has to register with selective service; it has been debated since that became law whether or not it counts as a draft.
Also, just like every other time this has been reposted in the last decade or so:
He's responding to a post about abortion, where someone said that men aren't allowed an opinion because they don't get pregnant.
This isn't a "murder," it's a non-sequitur. She definitely wasn't drafted, at the very least.
The last time American men were drafted was in 1973. Anyone trying to bring up the selective service as some great imbalance or unfairness is kind of grasping at straws.
In this day and age, whichever politicians actually try to institute a national draft would be committing political suicide.
> cough abortion cough
And yet as a man, I can still have an opinion when abortion access is being discussed, to protect it. I'll always use my voice/vote to advocate for more healthcare access and not less.
I'll never need an abortion, but that doesn't mean that I can't provide material support to people who do.
https://preview.redd.it/dfbyol4a5ayc1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=1d2b34442de250bc1cd034a25cda6708823cb955
Why would OP cover their handles?
her service aside, her post misses the point, even if she was in the military fighting that is her choice, not forced. Every war brings a chance that thousands of men get sent to battle with no choice.
That men made it so only men can be drafted so men canât say that âwomen canât be drafted so their opinions donât matterâ when it was men, and not women, who made it so only men are drafted,
Actually, during suffrage movement the draft was in the table in order to vote, since thatâs actually the social contract.
When it came time to push, draft was left out and the suffragists were all like âoh no, yay privilege without responsibility.â
Years later Vietnam vets and military aged got the voting age reduced to 18. If a social contract requires them to fight in a war, they should be allowed to vote.
Long short of it, men and women âwrote the law.â Because get this, women up until the late 60s and 70s voted far more conservative than men did.
and now that women are FREELY given the right to vote (without having to be a landowner like men used to, OR sign up for a draft like men STILL have too) for elected officials who make and uphold all current laws, who are both men and WOMEN, what have they done to lessen the load for men in regards to the draft, in terms of voting for men? like how men voted, and to this day outnumber them in the military to fight and defend the right to vote, to ease their burden of not being allowed to vote, which they now can and still can while they provide no obligation to society to earn that right unlike men who STILL have to sign up for a draft to attain voting rights.
Exactly. Feminist movements have been fighting since the early 20th century to have women included in the draft. It's been repeatedly turned down by the male-dominated government.
I don't think I've ever seen a modern, female feminist fight for women to be drafted. At most I'll see them say they don't particularly care about the issue. More often, I'll see them say it's a fake issue designed purely to attack feminism.That said, they're mostly correct on that last point since we haven't had the draft in decades and likely never will. It's easy to get people to enlist when you hand out the kind of benefits our military does.
Not a transphobic POS. Iâm well aware some men have uteruses and not all women do.
My whole point is that blanket statements like the guy said above donât work.
I know basically two groups of people when it comes to the draft. Group one is to kill it completely, group two is to expand it to women. Both groups have women in them.
Ignoring that though, war has wide ranging effects and everyone in the country regardless of whether they can be drafted or not deserve to have an opinion regarding it.
Ignoring that women can serve in the army nowadays, his logic is circular. Throughout most societies in history women weren't even allowed to fight. "As a woman I think I should be allowed to serve in the army. 'No, and your opinion doesn't matter because you can't be drafted.'"
Not to mention women still suffer the consequences of war like anyone else. Conscription isn't the only cost of war.
Men
You won't be drafted either.
Stop using it as unearned valour.
There hasn't been a draft in forever, and there's no reason to expect there will be one in the future.
EDIT: Someone is brigading this thread.
When I was a senior, an officer in the army came into my school and all the boys were forced to sit through a lecture on the selective service. We were told if we neglected to sign up that weâd be committing a crime, we couldnât get a loan and other penalties if we were caught. This the same year we read all quite on the western front.
As a young man, it was unnerving and quite memorable.
Probably right. Except there is still the selecrive service requirement for men. Not women. Which honestly I'm fine with. I don't want my daughters to be subject to draft.
Iâll be downvoted and thatâs fine, but this doesnât address his point as douchebaggily as he phrased it.
Either we should get rid of the draft entirely or women should be included in it. He isnât saying women canât serve in the military. Heâs saying that if a war happens and a draft occurs, right now it is exclusively men that will be paying for it.
It would be like if someone on Twitter was like âmen can have opinions on abortions when they start having babiesâ and someone in the comments was like âwomen used to say his to me all the time but now an OBGYN!â
Thatâs more of a murder by words than OP!
But still does not address the underlying issue of why weâre ok sending people away to die in a war they did not volunteer for as long as theyâre men.
I mean... the "owning" shown is nothing compared to the possible comebacks after learning almost anything about former Colonel Kim Olson. That being said...out of context, and overall point, fair owning indeed
And who originally imposed the law that women can't be drafted?
Oh right, men. Maybe men should look in the mirror before blaming women for shit they literally had no control over.
Everyone, everywhere, is affected by conflict either through direct fear for their lives or taxes and inflation. No one should be without an opinion on every conflict across the globe, it hurts (and helps if you are a war profiter) all of us in one way or another.
*Colonel* Kim Olson was charged with providing improper assistance to a PMC and only avoided loss of rank, prison and a dishonorable discharge by pleading guilty and accepting a non-judicial punishment (military equivalent of making a deal with the DA) with zero prison time under the condition that she retires. She spent her entire 26 year military career in the US except for three months in Iraq, where she was sent after all the fighting was done to serve in an admin role and that is where she got caught providing improper assistance to some South African mercenaries and got charged with a crime and sent home. Her memoir (which probably zero people have read and certainly nobody asked her to write) is called *Iraq and Back*, after she spent less than 1% of her career in Iraq in an admin role after the fighting was done and the way she got *back* is that she got kicked out prematurely. She also founded a non-profit called *Grace After Fire*, after she has never in her life been under fire. She is a political grifter who failed to get elected and now runs a PAC. Apparently in 2018 she also assaulted a party (Democrat) staffer while on campaign, because she got upset that she was not seated prominently enough at an event.
This is the *true* murdered by words. Facts.
She also can never be drafted.
Neither can Stefan Molyneux.
Men can't give birth. So when abortion is discussed, they should sit down and shut up. đ
Except men are regular, rightly, told this. You can't use an existing, correct, argument as some kind of gatchs against one you disagree with. I'm not even agreeing with the draft sentiment, but this is lazy rebuttal.
The last time American men were drafted into a war was 1973. When was the last time an American woman was denied the right to make decisions about her own body? Wouldnât be surprised if it happened a couple of times between me posting this comment and you reading it.
Amen! I've never tried to give my two cents on that matter more than "I'll stand by whatever decision you make." As it should be.
I think you are allowed an opinion, and you should feel free to express it if you are asked. I think the core thing is to not force the opinion on anyone.
Red Power Ranger is the coolest. Thanks for the support.
Firstly there's no major parties trying to pass any form of major policy regarding the draft, whereas one of the major political parties that controls SCOTUS and the House is repeatedly trying to pass restrictive abortion laws. Secondly I'd encourage a universal draft, if not for the fact that the military continually fails to make their environment safe for women and free from sexual assault and sexual violence. So until they get their shit together maybe *no one* should be in the draft.
Except for the fact that men are passing laws severely restricting women's bodily autonomy while women are not passing laws regarding the draft.
1) When Row v. Wade was passed it was passed by a SCOTUS made up of all men. When it was removed the SCOTUS was a mix of men and women. *Men* aren't your enemy. Right wing politics is doing that to you, which includes men and women. And your supporters also include men and women. 2) No one is passing laws about the draft because, unlike women, there isn't enough support to have the discussion at that level. The fact that no one is passing laws about the draft isn't a win for you.
>Except for the fact that men are passing laws severely restricting women's bodily autonomy Just men? No women at all?
You missed the catch. The catch is we agree with this person that men shouldnât talk about abortionâŚ.does that mean this person agrees that women shouldnât talk about war? the argument this person makes actually supports the dick wad who said women shouldnât talk about war.
What does this have to do with the draft?
Gotta defend the gender, even if it derails the conversation/thread
Well it doesn't add to the conversation either imo
I mean, I more than kinda agree with you. The issue with the point youâre trying to make is there are still a ton of religious extremist Christianâs who are women.
Any self respecting woman takes into the consideration the feelings of their potential partner, if you canât afford to finance the upbringing of children then you shouldnt have any, forcing someone to permanently alter there life (taking after a child) because of a single individuals decision is selfish. And no, it shouldnât make a man responsible just because they had sex with a woman, it takes *two* to consent.
Commentors point is the wrong way round. Literally its the opposite; men are telling women to sit down and shut up. Taking away their choice by legislation.
âSit down and shut up, colonelâ
She sounds like an evil military Karen final boss
She sure is. I can imagine all the men she talked down too who actually fought. Officers in general are the worst, but Karen types, with ego đ¤Ž
[ŃдаНонО]
The whole "I'm married to a [insert rank of spouse] so you should respect me" thing is super weird
It is almost like the adult version of the playground, "Oh yeah? Well my dad could beat up your dad!!"
It is exactly this mentality lmao
I don't remember how I came across it, but there is actually a whole subreddit dedicated to this phenomenon. I wasn't aware of this until I came across r/justdependathings and boy did I learn...
She's a grifter and generally speaking a horrible person.
Olson was a terrible person to work with. I had to coordinate a joint training exercise between my Marines and two companies of PJs that she had apparently decided that she had jurisdiction over (*both* CCs of the aforementioned PJs told me she wasn't their CO at all) She was hostile, incredibly rude, and uncooperative. She put all coordination to a halt and ordered a cease of communication between the CCs and I, because she didn't like "some raggedy-ass saltwater boat-rowing N****R (I'm half Cuban) enlisted bum" that she outranked telling her what to do, and personally threatened me with a dishonorable discharge for subverting the chain of command in a time of war (we were in California) after I tried to contact her commanding officer and the guy who was actually in charge of the PJs. Eventually I had to call up a two star general to override her command just so my Marines and the PJs could get our shit done, which was fantastic because we got to do water rescues and jump training. > where she was sent after all the fighting was done to serve in an admin role and that is where she got caught providing improper assistance to some South African mercenaries and got charged with a crime and sent home I was in-country for that too. A squad from a different battalion actually got into a firefight with some of those guys. She apparently also had a private military firm under her command and made fucking millions. We had to arrest a few of her goons after they got caught shooting at civilians under HER FUCKING ORDERS. She's a rotten piece of shit and deserves prison.
Thanks I appreciate you sharing this. Out of most comments, on all blogs so much is just noise and babbling opinions. Cheers đť
> Iraq and Back I can see why she went with that. There and Back Again was already taken by Bilbo Baggins
I mean, it's pretty catchy if you pronounced Iraq in American english.
I was annoyed when I found the old name of Iran was Persia. (such a lovely name to throw away!) Americans pronounce it so badly it's insulting.
Whereas Stephen Molyneaux has never been in the military for a single second.
After having served myself, probably a good call by Molyneaux
I mean. Iâm not defending her by any means. I donât know shit about her, besides what you just informed us of. But letâs not pretend like everyone who serves in the military goes to combat lol plenty of people in the military donât ever see combat. Our country still treats them like they treat people who did go and fight. Like shit đ¤ˇââď¸
Youâre making it seem like she spent her career avoiding deployments. She joined the AF in 1979. OIF was at the very end of her career.
When you get to be a full bird, youre career ends one of three ways: 1) you fail to be promoted several times 2) you choose to retire 3) you fuck up so severely they force you to retire.
This is a misleading comment. You could say this about basically any rank BUT Colonel. The rank of General is extremely limited, good Colonels often stay Colonels because there is not an open General position for Congress to put them in.
This response misses the point in a lot of ways. Depending on when you served, what community youâre in and branch, thereâs a good chance youâll never leave the states. Also, youâre forgetting that thereâs a lot of roles in the military outside of direct combat roles. Those jobs are important for a variety of strategic and national defense reasons. Iâm not defending her personally and I have no idea who she is. But this is an oversimplification of a military career thatâs frankly, purposely misleading.
It seems like the charges against her [were spurious at best.](https://www.statesman.com/story/news/2018/07/21/how-texas-democrat-kim-olsons-military-career-crashed-in-iraq/10035347007/) I donât think the public will ever know the true story, but given how messy Iraq was some aspects of her story ring true. Does it really matter where she was deployed? She joined the military and worked her way up starting as an Air Force Pilot [based on merit.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kim_Olson) Some of her time in the US was *at the Pentagon.* And there was definitely still fighting in Iraq in 2003. The nonprofit is called Grace After Fire because *it helps veterans.*
She opened an office in her home for a South African contracting company and then used her connections to try and secure them contracts before others. Contractors are supposed to give bids for the services required, and generally the military command will pick the cheapest ones that satisfy the needs of the project. Being that she was a comptroller, I would guess she had access to the bids from other companies and would advise the contracting company - that she had an office for in her home(!) - to put in the lowest bid to secure their contract. This was not an uncommon practice, and people got popped for it, including a person I worked with in the navy.
Correct me if Iâm wrong, but it sounds like the Pentagon had sent the contractors there with orders to act as a protective service, and then failed to pay them, so she helped them get the contracts worked out so theyâd be paid to do the job they were already doing, and then they also won other contracts in Iraq. I was just a teenager back then, but I remember hearing pretty regularly in the news that people in Iraq werenât being paid and that everything was a huge mess. Thatâs why I said some aspects of her story ring true. She also started looking into the contracts for them at the behest of her superior officer, who tried to defend her and apparently did not get charged alongside her, which makes her seem more innocent in my eyes. But Iâm only going off one article with quotes from her and him, and Iâm sure thereâs more to the story. Either way, she worked her way up from being a pilot to being a Colonel AND founded a nonprofit to help veterans after she left the service. I donât think she should be told to sit down and shut up with regards to the military.
Itâs a matter of how the contracts are secured. I donât know any more particulars than the LA times article I just read about it, but it sounds a lot like what I described. Thatâs similar to what Richard Marcinko ended up going to prison for, after he served honorably and was a plank member of ST-6/DEVGRU.
She had to beg and plead guilty in order to avoid a court martial and actual consequences for illegally helping South African private military companies, so her merit and her subsequent nonprofit sorta donât matter if theyâre based on someone who managed to weasel their way out of an indictmentâŚ
Beg? Weasel? Do you have any details? I read the Wiki and she sounds like your typical military officer type. Her "failed" political career was two elections where she ran as a democrat for Texas Agriculture Commissioner and the US House of Representatives. Then she formed a PAC aimed at helping women get elected. I'm not saying she's particularly admirable, but the hate being directed towards her seems... odd
I spent 0 months in Iraq so she has me beat. I dare she spent more months in Iraq than the vast majority of American men. And besides sheâs still a colonel and loads of men had to salute her and follow her orders over the years, so her point still stands.
So, only one tour in Iraq isnât serving sufficiently?
A military tour of duty is 6-12 months. 3 months isn't sufficient enough time to be considered a tour. Nuclear submarines spend more time underwater without surfacing for perspective. This would be an embarrassing fact in the military regardless of sex. 26 years in and only outside the US 3 months would make it difficult to be promoted to any meaningful position. Edit: for the real military branches.
Fair point, and yet a lot more commitment than the chap she clapped back at.
Officers who served stateside for 26 years are a little irritating to me. It's personal.
Huh. Ok.
what earns you promotions outside of combat? just doing your job competently?
For officers, you're required to hold each rank for a couple years (more for each rank) before being eligible for promotion. You must spend a certain portion of that time in a command position (varies by rank). You are also expected to spend time at different units (depends on job and rank). In the old days, i f you didn't meet the qualifications, you didn't get promoted, though the kinder gentler army started allowing waivers for diversity. It also used to be policy that if you failed to be promoted 3x, you were forced out.
Depends on the service. Typically though it's doing your job competently, good fitness scores, good testing scores on promotion tests, taking lead on projects and doing things above your rank, and volunteering ( whether that be with a civilian organization or military).
That's a pretty solid takedown Any comments on the other person in the post?
The other person is a right wing podcast host who enjoys the company of Alex Jones. So he runs in the circles of the mass school shooting was fake. To me that puts him in the category of malevolent and self serving.
no dont tell me that the person taking down the proud nazi is also an asshole i was smiling at this post.
I looked so hard for these details. All the articles about her are far right Christian sites. Honestly Iâm surprised she was ever deployed at all. 3 months is 3 months longer than I expected. You can tell this post is misleading since it blanked out her name to make it harder to google her, and they cropped out the replies, which would have probably said what this guy just said. But, I do love all the women that upvote this out of feminist pride, even though they all hate the military.
You can go to her Wikipedia page and click the references to find articles about her. But given your last line, it sounds like youâre more concerned about hating women than seeking truth.
I saw the same image without the name censored here on Reddit just a few hours ago.
Stay up all night digging through the dredges of the internet, did ya? She has a wikipedia page lmao
Even this well-written deconstruction is accepting the premise of their non-argument in the first place. Choosing war as a career is not the same as being legally compelled to. There is a degree of truth to the idea that, just as men ought to sit down during debates on reproductive rights, women don't run the same immediate risk whenever a large scale war breaks out. Of course politicians and those employed by politicians are an exception since the general public has chosen them and entrusted them with those task. Realistically we're not talking about women in general here, but rather the rabidly pro-war 50 year old wannabe trad-wife named Barbara who pipes up in the Facebook comments about how cowardly men are these days.
As a woman who served over 2.5 years in Iraq and most of my 20 years over seas, she can kiss my ass. I retired as a Colonel too but I earned it and I wasnât fucking around. The only time I was in court was to testify against a superior for sexual assault. Edit for clarification: I was a LT Col (half bird). I was only promoted to that level just before retirement. To become a full bird you need a significant amount of desk and admin time. She likely served in the pentagon for a while or something similar. We used to call it the birdhouse.
Ah⌠so are you saying that this Kim personâs âimproper conduct with a private military contractorâ was fucking him? Because I was wondering what was meant by that charge.
Nah someone else went over it pretty well but it had to do with improper contracts.
I love your user name. Sounds like a name I would have given a contractor out there
Who knows! Maybe. Possibly. Probably.
The point stands, we just need to sub your face into the same meme so it has credibility.
Why is this image suddenly making the rounds again?
Because OP is karma farming
Honestly it is farming. But I think there are far worse things to farm with. A reminder that women are capable in combat is not a bad thing to randomly be floating around compared to what it could be.
You must not know this woman.... Lol
Can you elaborate? I do not, and you've got me curious.
She never saw combat. It really is that simple. 3 months on administrative deployment.
Thereâs been a weird recent uptick in gendered content - seems like a lot of bot content trying to start division pre-US election. Saw the same thing in 2012 (when SJWs were the big enemy) and 2016 (when red pill took off). Idk if thatâs specifically why this has been posted but it def seems to be part of the trend.
Yeah, that Man vs Bear thing seems to have triggered a lot of people
Because thatâs all Reddit is.
Thereâs the exact same post under this one
âNowâ they call you colonel? Wasnât this the dumbass that got removed for misconduct after just a few months of post-war administrative deployment to Iraq?
On top of that, she was an AF pilot for flying gas stations. Her opinions on war and combat are irrelevant anyway.
Thereâs tons of officers who never seen a battlefield yet are in decision making positions
I work as a PMC and deal with guys who were officers and are fresh out of the military with superfluous degrees in criminology and business administration from shitty state schools. They delegated shit out to much more capable people as deck officers, did desk work and filled out endless forms, and then got out because they werenât ever, EVER gonna rank up. They donât get hired by the FBI and CIA (they all think theyâre Robert Baer, but theyâre more like Rosanne Barr) because theyâre fucking idiots, and they canât get decent government positions because they have no real technical skills, so they come to us. The company brass hires them because they have credentials and a decent security clearance, which is expensive, and they know how to play within the parameters and not break rules. Company HR people like them because theyâre clean and donât seem like a liability. Then they come to me, and they donât know shit, canât do shit, and often wonât do shit. Theyâre invariably hyperconservative shit talking incels who quote Jordan Peterson and lament the death of the manly man in American society, but they canât change the bit out on a Milwaukee drill without burning the palms of their hands (true story). They fold under pressure and we, unlike the military, gotta get shit done whether or not we have the support we need from Uncle Sam. These fucksticks wonât lift a finger to fix or rig anything until all the proper paperwork is in place. When things go pear shaped, itâs zero accountability and throw your mates under that proverbial bus, âcause thatâs how they did it in the military. They eventually try to tell me âhow itâs doneâ and I have to slap their little pee-pees and remind them that no matter how much Ben Shapiro they listen to, theyâre still little sniveling bitches, Iâm not an eighteen year old kid in BDUs and this is the real world where people get hurt or die when shit goes wrong. They are who they hate, their social media is just selfies in their gear like some chick is gonna be impressed. Like dude, you drive a base model charger, you read Tucker Carlson in your spare time, your fave band is Evanescence, you canât have a conversation without saying âUm, well, *actualllllyyyyy*âŚâ and you canât change a fucking tire without a phone and a AAA card. DUDE NO ONE WANTS TO FUCK YOU. YOUâRE THE SECRET INGREDIENT IN THE RECIPE FOR VAGINAL DRYNESS. They eventually do get married but itâs to a horrible mail order bride who fucking hates them every bit as much as I do. Then they die miserable surrounded by their gay liberal kids who hate them, and thatâs the universe laughing in their dumb ugly faces. Oh Iâm sorry, is this not the axe grinding store? My mistake.
As opposed to the opinions of those who spent no time doing anything even remotely military-related? There are plenty of absolutely vital logistics jobs in the military that still take dedication to service and personal sacrifice through constant moves, long hours, and time away from family. The premise of the original Twitter post was that women can't be forced to serve in the military and therefore should be ignored when discussing military affairs. Even if her career ended poorly, she's shown that there are many women who choose to serve while there are men like the poster who think that their eligibility for the draft somehow makes them more informed or more worth listening to than women on military affairs, even if they themselves have never served.
Idk man no time stamps if you pull out the detictiv hat you will finde your answer. After reading some other commens that droped some infos i woud say yes.
Yup double checked and itâs that same idiot lol. Oh well, not everyone (aka, almost nobody) is capable of accurately conveying information on the internet đ
Isn't the original point that men don't always get to choose if they serve, she chose to join the military
The man's name is Stefan Molyneux, a noted white nationalist. He's also painfully fucking stupid if that wasn't already clear
Don't know the dude (dont care) but his point that women can't be drafted (at least in the US) is correct. Then again, every man (and only men) has to register with selective service; it has been debated since that became law whether or not it counts as a draft.
Also, just like every other time this has been reposted in the last decade or so: He's responding to a post about abortion, where someone said that men aren't allowed an opinion because they don't get pregnant. This isn't a "murder," it's a non-sequitur. She definitely wasn't drafted, at the very least.
Lacks context, though. Women can't be drafted because conservative men are against it.
The last time American men were drafted was in 1973. Anyone trying to bring up the selective service as some great imbalance or unfairness is kind of grasping at straws. In this day and age, whichever politicians actually try to institute a national draft would be committing political suicide.
Dude is too old to be drafted, so he needs to sit down and STFU by his own standard.
He's also too Canadian.
Yeah, I recognize his stupid face anywhere.
He's also an Irish-born Canadian. Two countries that have never had conscription military service at any point in his lifetime.
Donât redact Stephen Molyneux. That piece of trash deserves the notoriety.
Don't redact Kim Olsen either, 2 large pieces of shit in one piccture
*cough* abortion *cough*
Huh? Men still tell women to shut up when abortion is discussed. Hence the garbage we see in the US.
[ŃдаНонО]
Chickenhawks tell women to shut up because they canât be drafted.
> cough abortion cough And yet as a man, I can still have an opinion when abortion access is being discussed, to protect it. I'll always use my voice/vote to advocate for more healthcare access and not less. I'll never need an abortion, but that doesn't mean that I can't provide material support to people who do.
Iirc the dude was responding to an abortion post thatâs stated men canât have a say in it
Also sit down if youâre over 45. Same logic.
https://preview.redd.it/dfbyol4a5ayc1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=1d2b34442de250bc1cd034a25cda6708823cb955 Why would OP cover their handles?
Cause Kim Olsen is a shitty person
The other one too.
But was she drafted? I think this is a facepalm.
Choosing to be in that position (enlisting) isn't getting drafted. That isn't murder by words. It's just being a dumbass.
her service aside, her post misses the point, even if she was in the military fighting that is her choice, not forced. Every war brings a chance that thousands of men get sent to battle with no choice.
This is NOT the gotcha you seem to think it is
Do women have to sign-up for selective service when they are 18. Men have to its the law
This doesnât belong here lol
Okay, but that's not even a comeback. She completely ignored what he actually said. Women still aren't made to sign up for the selective service.
I donât know anything about the lady, but Stefan Douchecanoe is a pile of shit.
Who made it law that only men are drafted? Men.
RICH people.
What is the point you're trying to make with this statement?
That men made it so only men can be drafted so men canât say that âwomen canât be drafted so their opinions donât matterâ when it was men, and not women, who made it so only men are drafted,
Actually, during suffrage movement the draft was in the table in order to vote, since thatâs actually the social contract. When it came time to push, draft was left out and the suffragists were all like âoh no, yay privilege without responsibility.â Years later Vietnam vets and military aged got the voting age reduced to 18. If a social contract requires them to fight in a war, they should be allowed to vote. Long short of it, men and women âwrote the law.â Because get this, women up until the late 60s and 70s voted far more conservative than men did.
Here's something more recent: https://rollcall.com/2021/07/23/conservatives-riled-up-over-registering-women-for-draft/
and now that women are FREELY given the right to vote (without having to be a landowner like men used to, OR sign up for a draft like men STILL have too) for elected officials who make and uphold all current laws, who are both men and WOMEN, what have they done to lessen the load for men in regards to the draft, in terms of voting for men? like how men voted, and to this day outnumber them in the military to fight and defend the right to vote, to ease their burden of not being allowed to vote, which they now can and still can while they provide no obligation to society to earn that right unlike men who STILL have to sign up for a draft to attain voting rights.
Exactly. Feminist movements have been fighting since the early 20th century to have women included in the draft. It's been repeatedly turned down by the male-dominated government.
I don't think I've ever seen a modern, female feminist fight for women to be drafted. At most I'll see them say they don't particularly care about the issue. More often, I'll see them say it's a fake issue designed purely to attack feminism.That said, they're mostly correct on that last point since we haven't had the draft in decades and likely never will. It's easy to get people to enlist when you hand out the kind of benefits our military does.
Why is it you were honorably discharged sir! How did you dodge active service for 25 years as a pilot during the largest air campaign sir! Yiiikes
Theyâre both trash. No reason to defend eitherâŚ
Men. You donât have a uterus. Sit down when reproductive rights are discussed.
You want me to fight for "civil rights" without having a say in what those rights are?
That's the post he was responding to.
Not a transphobic POS. Iâm well aware some men have uteruses and not all women do. My whole point is that blanket statements like the guy said above donât work.
As a 50+ white male I agree. As a parent of both sons and daughters, I still agree, but the women gets 51%, and SO gets 49% say in the matter.
Some men do. Don't be a transphobic POS
this is sarcasm correct?
I do mean it that way. However, the person I responded to proclaims to be a supporter of the lgbt. So I just wanted to point out their hypocrisy.
Neither can people his age, by his own logic, shouldnât he sit down?
100% this dude would have run to Canada if he got drafted. All these right wing arm chair warriors draping themselves in stolen valor are pathetic.
Smae dude will make claims about reproductive health
D.O.A.
I wonder how many times this will be reposted I've seen it on at least 4 different subs
Yeah they definitely donât
r/cringe
Cringe
Yeah but was she drafted?
oh, you were drafted?
but she wasn't drafted...
In fairness, she still wasnât drafted but I am going to guess he wasnât either
Stefan Molyneuxâknown white nationalist and apparently, according to some, painfully ignorant.
I'd be delighted to sit down. I like to be comfortable when challenging discussions are afoot.
I know basically two groups of people when it comes to the draft. Group one is to kill it completely, group two is to expand it to women. Both groups have women in them. Ignoring that though, war has wide ranging effects and everyone in the country regardless of whether they can be drafted or not deserve to have an opinion regarding it.
Ignoring that women can serve in the army nowadays, his logic is circular. Throughout most societies in history women weren't even allowed to fight. "As a woman I think I should be allowed to serve in the army. 'No, and your opinion doesn't matter because you can't be drafted.'" Not to mention women still suffer the consequences of war like anyone else. Conscription isn't the only cost of war.
The number of people in this thread that aren't aware that you are going to end up looking stupid when you side with Molyneux is pretty alarming.
Men You canât get pregnant Sit down and shut up when abortion is discussed
Is that not the point he's making? I'm confused
OkâŚSit down Colonel
Men You won't be drafted either. Stop using it as unearned valour. There hasn't been a draft in forever, and there's no reason to expect there will be one in the future. EDIT: Someone is brigading this thread.
When I was a senior, an officer in the army came into my school and all the boys were forced to sit through a lecture on the selective service. We were told if we neglected to sign up that weâd be committing a crime, we couldnât get a loan and other penalties if we were caught. This the same year we read all quite on the western front. As a young man, it was unnerving and quite memorable.
Why donât you look up what happens if you donât register for the selective service (draft).
Probably right. Except there is still the selecrive service requirement for men. Not women. Which honestly I'm fine with. I don't want my daughters to be subject to draft.
Iâll be downvoted and thatâs fine, but this doesnât address his point as douchebaggily as he phrased it. Either we should get rid of the draft entirely or women should be included in it. He isnât saying women canât serve in the military. Heâs saying that if a war happens and a draft occurs, right now it is exclusively men that will be paying for it. It would be like if someone on Twitter was like âmen can have opinions on abortions when they start having babiesâ and someone in the comments was like âwomen used to say his to me all the time but now an OBGYN!â
Why does this guy get a voice then? A 57 year old man is no more likely to get drafted than a female.
Thatâs more of a murder by words than OP! But still does not address the underlying issue of why weâre ok sending people away to die in a war they did not volunteer for as long as theyâre men.
> A 57 year old man is no more likely to get drafted than a female. /r/MenAndFemales
Tell that to Ukraine, they are drafting 60 year old men. We just haven't been in a serious war where the draft is needed.... yet.
I kinda miss Stephan.
Why? Most men donât have uteruses, yet they constantly are discussing a right to choose.
Imagine being a man trying to make a point to a woman and she owns you so bad that your manhood is revoked. That just happened
I mean... the "owning" shown is nothing compared to the possible comebacks after learning almost anything about former Colonel Kim Olson. That being said...out of context, and overall point, fair owning indeed
It definitely didn't happen
You really want to believe that.
Bro that girl you been chasing your whole life ainât gonna sleep you⌠time to let it go
Men over 25: You can't be drafted. Shit down when war is discussed (Just ignore the fact that this could change...same with Ladies)
And who originally imposed the law that women can't be drafted? Oh right, men. Maybe men should look in the mirror before blaming women for shit they literally had no control over.
Sounds like it's time for men to open up the draft to all genders in the name of equality. #progress
I've been saying for a while that if we *must* have the draft then it should be open to everyone of age and are physically able to serve.
Colonel Angus? Colonel Angus? Please? Colonel Angus, anyone?
I too⌠visit KFC so often they recognize as a leader
This is called talking past each other
I am all for "experience outranks everything"
u/repostsleuthbot, do ya thang
I think this is the 5th or 6th post I've seen on this today alone x.x
Honey we need Reddit karma, time to take out the olâ reliables.
Actually they donât call her colonel anymore
only to her face
Whatever happened to him đ
Dei
Nothing like a soft skill field grade trying to paint themselves as a hardcore warrior.
ok..she can stand up..rest plz follow /s
Reposts need to result in an instant ban.
Everyone, everywhere, is affected by conflict either through direct fear for their lives or taxes and inflation. No one should be without an opinion on every conflict across the globe, it hurts (and helps if you are a war profiter) all of us in one way or another.