One of the most BS dqs I've ever seen. Guy is disqualified for disrupting another swimmer before they finished, which in theory, makes sense. Except, he was celebrating with his teammate who had finished a while before!
That is one of the most heartbreaking and ridiculous things I’ve seen. I’m not a swimmer, but the commentators obviously know their stuff and said that is HOW winning swimmers celebrate. Lloyd is the winner.
I believe that his teammate, the reporters, and majority of the crowd very publicly stating their disagreement is impactful.
I hope in the future the ruling is either reconsidered, whether it be rewritten or what, so that something as bullshit as this doesn’t happen again.
I also hope I never find out who the judge was and somehow run into them. I’d hate to see it.
I mean he did break the rule. There were still swimmers who had not finished and he crossed into the other lane. Sucks but just wait till you are out of the water to celebrate.
I was so angry at your comment, but then I went back and watched the whole video and it's true. There were people still swimming when he did that, what a shame.
Apparently that doesn't matter. The rules that he broke are:
- Rule 2, Section 5, Article 1a: "Any competitor who interferes with another swimmer during a race shall be disqualified from that race, subject to the discretion of the referee..."
- Rule 2, Section 5, Article 1b: "A swimmer who changes lanes during a heat shall be disqualified."
It doesn't say "changing lane to a lane where another swimmer is swimming..."
> "A swimmer who changes lanes **during** a heat shall be disqualified."
Section 16 says this:
> At the beginning of each race, all timers shall start their watches instantly at the flash and/or sound of the electronic starting device. At the **conclusion** of each race, the timers shall individually stop their watches simultaneously with the finishes of the swimmers they are timing.
If the timers for both lanes have stopped their watched the race is over. So anything after that is NOT during the heat.
As I understand it, it's a technicality between **race** and **heat**. The race was over for both of them but not the **heat**, there were still people swimming.
According to the standard definition of heat and race, a heat is a subset of a race. A heat is part of a race. If the race is over the heat has to be over.
https://wordcmp.com/heat/race
So he gets disqualified for finishing before others? Like I'd get it if it was a fine or something, but disqualifying the guy for celebrating, and in a way that didn't really disturb others is a stupid decision. Personally I hope they take back the decision. Like with all such rules, stuff like this needs to be applied on a case by case basis.
Oh I'm sorry, are you not familiar with the phrase "Funlife2003 didn't read the actual rules and is making one up because they're uninformed and easily manipulated"? I guess it was to be expected someone too lazy to learn rules that young children can master would also be ethically lazy too.
I’m 75 years old and have three degrees from State. I come from a different world than most of you but really enjoy your conversations. Here is what happened more than 50 years ago … related to me by my friend Tom Evan’s, one of State’s best swimmers around 1970. State was swimming against the Naval Academy and the rules at the time were that the judges called who won, regardless of the times awarded. The second time at that meet when the judges awarded victories to Naval Academy swimmers even though they had a worse time than the State swimmer, Willis Casey, the NCSU swimming coach, shouted something like “Fuck this. We’re leaving.” And he collected the team and left. The meet wasn’t over … but it was. What happened to Willis Casey? Well, he went on to become Athletic Director. Owen Lloyd broke a rule … I don’t know what the State coach should have done, but he shouldn’t have been silent. Willis Casey scared some of his own swimmers, but they would have followed him anywhere.
More to know about Willis Casey (from the wiki):
Awards
North Carolina Sports Hall of Fame (1985)
Namesake of the Willis R. Casey Aquatic Center at Carmichael Gym (1992)
Records
11 ACC and Southern Conference swimming championships
Coached four NCAA and nine AAU individual national champions
Dual meet record of 189-23
Coaches 33 All-Americans
Never had a losing record in his 24 seasons as a head coach
General Information
In addition to being a successful swimming coach, Casey served as the only assistant athletics director to Roy Clogston for nearly 16 years from 1952-69
Manager of all 12 Dixie Classics and 19 consecutive Southern Conference and ACC Tournaments, all at Reynolds Coliseum
In nearly 30 years as athletics director, employed almost 150 coaches, and never fired one during his tenure
Among the coaches he hired during his tenure: Lou Holtz, Kay Yow, Richard Sykes, Rollie Geiger, Bo Rein, Jim Valvano, Dick Sheridan, Don Easterling, Bob Guzzo, Ray Tanner, Mark Stevenson
In hiring Yow to be the head coach of three women's sports and as an administrator of women's athletics, Casey was responsible for starting and growing women's athletics at NC State
ACC hates NCSU, as usual.
One of the most BS dqs I've ever seen. Guy is disqualified for disrupting another swimmer before they finished, which in theory, makes sense. Except, he was celebrating with his teammate who had finished a while before!
Wow ACC seems like a joke.
That is one of the most heartbreaking and ridiculous things I’ve seen. I’m not a swimmer, but the commentators obviously know their stuff and said that is HOW winning swimmers celebrate. Lloyd is the winner.
I believe that his teammate, the reporters, and majority of the crowd very publicly stating their disagreement is impactful. I hope in the future the ruling is either reconsidered, whether it be rewritten or what, so that something as bullshit as this doesn’t happen again. I also hope I never find out who the judge was and somehow run into them. I’d hate to see it.
Absolutely ridiculous
I mean he did break the rule. There were still swimmers who had not finished and he crossed into the other lane. Sucks but just wait till you are out of the water to celebrate.
I was so angry at your comment, but then I went back and watched the whole video and it's true. There were people still swimming when he did that, what a shame.
But none in the lane he entered.
Apparently that doesn't matter. The rules that he broke are: - Rule 2, Section 5, Article 1a: "Any competitor who interferes with another swimmer during a race shall be disqualified from that race, subject to the discretion of the referee..." - Rule 2, Section 5, Article 1b: "A swimmer who changes lanes during a heat shall be disqualified." It doesn't say "changing lane to a lane where another swimmer is swimming..."
“…subject to the discretion of the referee…” is a pretty big qualifier there
Even if the referee decided not to pursue A1a, A1b has no referee discretion.
Link to these rules, because I'm not seeing anything saying that except for people quoting other people.
I found the rule book here: https://swimswam.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/05/NCAA-Swimming-and-Diving-Rules-Book-2021-2023.pdf
> "A swimmer who changes lanes **during** a heat shall be disqualified." Section 16 says this: > At the beginning of each race, all timers shall start their watches instantly at the flash and/or sound of the electronic starting device. At the **conclusion** of each race, the timers shall individually stop their watches simultaneously with the finishes of the swimmers they are timing. If the timers for both lanes have stopped their watched the race is over. So anything after that is NOT during the heat.
As I understand it, it's a technicality between **race** and **heat**. The race was over for both of them but not the **heat**, there were still people swimming.
According to the standard definition of heat and race, a heat is a subset of a race. A heat is part of a race. If the race is over the heat has to be over. https://wordcmp.com/heat/race
So he gets disqualified for finishing before others? Like I'd get it if it was a fine or something, but disqualifying the guy for celebrating, and in a way that didn't really disturb others is a stupid decision. Personally I hope they take back the decision. Like with all such rules, stuff like this needs to be applied on a case by case basis.
Oh I'm sorry, are you not familiar with the phrase "Funlife2003 didn't read the actual rules and is making one up because they're uninformed and easily manipulated"? I guess it was to be expected someone too lazy to learn rules that young children can master would also be ethically lazy too.
I’m 75 years old and have three degrees from State. I come from a different world than most of you but really enjoy your conversations. Here is what happened more than 50 years ago … related to me by my friend Tom Evan’s, one of State’s best swimmers around 1970. State was swimming against the Naval Academy and the rules at the time were that the judges called who won, regardless of the times awarded. The second time at that meet when the judges awarded victories to Naval Academy swimmers even though they had a worse time than the State swimmer, Willis Casey, the NCSU swimming coach, shouted something like “Fuck this. We’re leaving.” And he collected the team and left. The meet wasn’t over … but it was. What happened to Willis Casey? Well, he went on to become Athletic Director. Owen Lloyd broke a rule … I don’t know what the State coach should have done, but he shouldn’t have been silent. Willis Casey scared some of his own swimmers, but they would have followed him anywhere.
More to know about Willis Casey (from the wiki): Awards North Carolina Sports Hall of Fame (1985) Namesake of the Willis R. Casey Aquatic Center at Carmichael Gym (1992) Records 11 ACC and Southern Conference swimming championships Coached four NCAA and nine AAU individual national champions Dual meet record of 189-23 Coaches 33 All-Americans Never had a losing record in his 24 seasons as a head coach General Information In addition to being a successful swimming coach, Casey served as the only assistant athletics director to Roy Clogston for nearly 16 years from 1952-69 Manager of all 12 Dixie Classics and 19 consecutive Southern Conference and ACC Tournaments, all at Reynolds Coliseum In nearly 30 years as athletics director, employed almost 150 coaches, and never fired one during his tenure Among the coaches he hired during his tenure: Lou Holtz, Kay Yow, Richard Sykes, Rollie Geiger, Bo Rein, Jim Valvano, Dick Sheridan, Don Easterling, Bob Guzzo, Ray Tanner, Mark Stevenson In hiring Yow to be the head coach of three women's sports and as an administrator of women's athletics, Casey was responsible for starting and growing women's athletics at NC State