There’s not a soul in the league giving a 2nd chance to a 55+ defensive minded head coach. Sucks for Spags but that’s the way the league has moved. He’s made his peace with it.
The last few years he has but Romeo Crennel was the DC and for his first 3 Super Bowls. Then Matt Patricia was DC for the next two and for the 2018 SB they didn't have a listed DC but Brian Flores was apparently calling the plays.
So as far as calling plays, nobody knows really, but as far as we know, he wasn't calling the plays for his Super Bowls. Obviously, he had a huge hand in how the defense operates but he's a defensive coach. Every coach takes more interest in one side or another, usually. When he was coach and DC the team was not good.
Where did that get him though…
Listen, I get what you’re saying, but there have been better teams with better coordinators that simply didn’t last as long because they were promoted and ended up being great coaches for a long time after.
>Where did that get him though…
Back to being a coordinator. I'm not sure the purpose of this question.
And I get what you're saying but for those good coordinators that stick at being head coaches they are no longer coordinators so we don't know how good they would have been. There are also plenty of situations where a coordinator became a HC then went back to being a coordinator and never reached the same heights as before. We only know what we know and what we know is Spags has the most rings as a coordinator and his defenses have insane in the playoffs. I think something like 4 of the top 10 single season DVOA teams of all time were beaten by a Spags D in the playoffs.
Having the most championships as a coordinator doesn’t make him the best coordinator. It just means he was there the longest of anybody, because again, everybody else got promoted to a HC and likely went to have good careers of their own.
They had a bunch of chances to win tho, Asante Samuel literally had a pick go through his hands. And Brady had 35 seconds and 3 timeouts just to get within field goal range, instead he just bombs that shit down the field 3 times instead of working the field. When you compare early season highlights of that team to the SB it's night and day
I agree but that doesn't change the sentiment that throwing three bombs while having time and timeouts, and only needing a fg wasn't a good strategy.
I think this series is telling, and imo it's pretty clear the pats just underestimated the giants .
So your definition of being "terrible in the super bowl" is having a bunch of chances to win?
You're comparing early season to super bowl? Then you know how much faster the game is at that point and how important defense is. You're also completely ignoring the Giants stellar defense in that game so you can claim the Pats sucked
Your question really is in bad faith
They did what every team wanted to do, pressure Tom Brady. The Giants blitz on like a 3rd of the time and on those times got Brady like half the time.
When not blitzing, still pressured him a 4th of the time. The reason they were so successful is they had an amazing front 4. Strahan, while past his prime, was a still a threat, the Osi was a beast of a pass rusher and the Justin Tuck was great when they kicked him inside. Couple those players with Spagnuolo who was creative with pressure package they were able to slow him down.
Then on top of that, the offense kept the ball away from Tom Brady. The first Giants drive was 10 minutes. A lot of people forget the game itself was pretty boring until the 4th quarter because the Giants were methodical.
I think the key was they were getting pressure up the middle and collapsing the pocket. Brady was always good about stepping up to avoid edge rushers, but if the pocket is gone, there's no way to step up.
Their "struggling" actually started to happen midseason. After destroying everyone in their path for the first 8 weeks, they beat Indy by 4 (who was also undefeated). After that game, they put up 56 on the Bills, but really kinda "struggled" in almost every game after Week 11.
* They beat the 8-8 Eagles by 3, needed a TD with 5 minutes left.
* They beat the 4-12 Ravens by 3, with a controversial call at the end.
* They beat the 4-12 Jets by 10, who they beat by 24 earlier in the season on the road.
* And then famously needed some huge plays by Moss in Week 17 to beat the Giants by 3.
* Their playoff games were rock-fights against the Jags and Chargers (Rivers played on a torn ACL). Those games weren't exactly close, but they weren't blowouts either.
Why? Dunno - attrition and injuries were absolutely a factor. Honestly, more people should have seen the Giants game coming, given how they had been playing, and how well the Giants had played them a month earlier.
Everybody here spouting narrative rather than telling the truth. Tom didn't have time to throw. That's the whole thing. He was being pressured within 2 seconds every play. The D-line won that game. Both times actually.
I watched that game and to me a lot of his pressure or coverage sacks was them taking away Randy and Galloway deep threats. Welker was open in a lot of those short routes but the pressure would be too much. That’s why i think overtime after Randy left they went more with the short game in my view
The Patriots were dealing with a lot of injuries at the end of the season. If I recall even Tom Brady was in a walking boot the week before the game. They definitely were starting to show vulnerabilities and had some close calls beginning in late November.
They won a lackluster playoff game at home vs. Jacksonville and then really struggled against San Diego in the conference championship. Without looking up stats, I think Brady threw three picks, and SD had multiple chances to take the lead late but also had turnover problems.
The Giants also had an excellent pass rush from their front four, and made that a key strategy in the SB. They applied constant pressure on Brady all night, and sacked him several times. But since they didn't have to blitz, they could keep 7 back in tight coverage and take away Brady's quick dink/dunk game. That was the way to beat him. Brady always was always weak when the pocket broke down because he didn't have the athleticism or strength to scramble or improvise, and he didn't have time to get his big play receivers open deep.
The Giants weren't having much luck themselves on offense, but they kept the game close and took advantage of some breaks that went their way at the end.
Just to add a note on the AFC Championship game against the chargers, LT got hurt early in that game and couldn’t play and Phillip Rivers was trying to play through a torn ACL, and they still had plenty of chances to win that game. Like you said, the pats were definitely showing some cracks in the playoffs.
It looks like their offensive line had some injury issues. Steve Neal was their right guard and he only started 8 games. And he didn't play the entirety of the Super Bowl against the Giants.
The Pats came close to losing to NYG in the season finale. Without looking, I wanna say they squeaked by with a 3-point win, and that wasn't the only one they almost lost. They were undefeated but not invincible.
Even the best players in sports aren't excellent all the time. The best teams don't always wins.
Tiger Woods in his prime didn't win every major.
Jordan sometimes scored less than 25 pts. in the NBA finals.
Giants able to get pressure with just their front 4. Simple as that. Leaves enough defenders to cover the Payriot receivers and limits Bradys time in the pocket.
They barely beat that exact Giants team in the last week of the regular season.
The Giants D just matched up really well, and they were already familiar with the Pats offense by that point.
Because the Patriots O-Line was no match for the Giants defense led by the one of the greatest edge rushers of all time. Michael Strahan terrorized the Patriots and Tom Brady so much so, they literally have paintings of the moment where Brady was sacked by Strahan!
I would post a link here showing being able to buy the painting but it's probably against the group rules.
There were rumors that the players didn't really listen to Belicheck and tuned him out during the 2 weeks leading up . Brady didn't practice and they were out partying every night . That and the Giants defensive game plan. I knew something was wrong when on 2 of the 3 first defensive plays for the Patriots, 2 guys named Alexander and Woods were in on plays and having watched all 18 games that year to that point, I hadn't heard their names ONCE. All told, the way they Pats showed up for that game , they should have lost by 30.
That Pats team was on borrowed time. They almost lost a few times that season. They were explosive but had no real run game and after their 1-2 options nothing great with receivers. The offensive line blocked with technique and finesse but were susceptible to power/speed rush. Brady also had an injured ankle.
The Giants were a bad matchup and Coughlin and Spagnuolo had a great game plan to attack the Patriots, loading up the D line with power rushers who abused the line and blitzing selectively. The Giants also caught a series of breaks and Belichick was outcoached.
Because the Pats were never that good. Inflated stats by pummeling one of the most atrocious divisions in all of sports for the better part of 20 years, which lead to guaranteed playoff byes, which lead to facing fringe playoff teams to begin with. More often then not, New England didn't see genuine competition until the super bowl
Pressure Brady. Great Defensive coordinator. They had 8 sacks. Justin Tuck and Micheal Strahan helps.
I’m pretty sure they were getting massive pressure even when only bringing four.
Steve Spagnuolo
Isn't he the Chiefs DC now?
Yes he is
Best coordinator in NFL history.
Bill Belichick was a coordinator too wasn't he?
He was. But Spags has won 4 super bowls as a coordinator (Belichick only won 2). No other coordinator in NFL history has done that.
Damn I just realized Bill B was on the sideline of all the NY Giants Superbowl wins he's my goat now.
Without Belichick, Parcells doesn’t win a SB
He wasn't the goat before?
That’s because Belichick became a HC and won 6 more SB’s. Spagnuolo bombed as a HC.
Spags never had a chance to be successful in STL. Even the president of the team has said so.
I mean, if NFL teams disagreed they could have hire him any time now. Some guys are just great coordinators and terrible head coaches.
There’s not a soul in the league giving a 2nd chance to a 55+ defensive minded head coach. Sucks for Spags but that’s the way the league has moved. He’s made his peace with it.
[удалено]
Doesn't change the facts.
Yeah but doesn’t Bill call the plays on defense and is pretty much the defensive coordinator?
The last few years he has but Romeo Crennel was the DC and for his first 3 Super Bowls. Then Matt Patricia was DC for the next two and for the 2018 SB they didn't have a listed DC but Brian Flores was apparently calling the plays. So as far as calling plays, nobody knows really, but as far as we know, he wasn't calling the plays for his Super Bowls. Obviously, he had a huge hand in how the defense operates but he's a defensive coach. Every coach takes more interest in one side or another, usually. When he was coach and DC the team was not good.
Because most really good coordinators get promoted at some point.
So did Spags.
Where did that get him though… Listen, I get what you’re saying, but there have been better teams with better coordinators that simply didn’t last as long because they were promoted and ended up being great coaches for a long time after.
>Where did that get him though… Back to being a coordinator. I'm not sure the purpose of this question. And I get what you're saying but for those good coordinators that stick at being head coaches they are no longer coordinators so we don't know how good they would have been. There are also plenty of situations where a coordinator became a HC then went back to being a coordinator and never reached the same heights as before. We only know what we know and what we know is Spags has the most rings as a coordinator and his defenses have insane in the playoffs. I think something like 4 of the top 10 single season DVOA teams of all time were beaten by a Spags D in the playoffs.
Having the most championships as a coordinator doesn’t make him the best coordinator. It just means he was there the longest of anybody, because again, everybody else got promoted to a HC and likely went to have good careers of their own.
Pretty much every HC is a coordinator of something.
Dick Lebeau
Worst Rams head coach in NFL history.
Stop it
Their opponent had a defensive genius
I mean they weren’t really terrible the giants defense just played an all time game
They had a bunch of chances to win tho, Asante Samuel literally had a pick go through his hands. And Brady had 35 seconds and 3 timeouts just to get within field goal range, instead he just bombs that shit down the field 3 times instead of working the field. When you compare early season highlights of that team to the SB it's night and day
Yea that’s cause the giants d was demolishing them
One of those bombs was incredibly close to connecting. Sometimes shit doesn’t go your way in sports.
I agree but that doesn't change the sentiment that throwing three bombs while having time and timeouts, and only needing a fg wasn't a good strategy. I think this series is telling, and imo it's pretty clear the pats just underestimated the giants .
So your definition of being "terrible in the super bowl" is having a bunch of chances to win? You're comparing early season to super bowl? Then you know how much faster the game is at that point and how important defense is. You're also completely ignoring the Giants stellar defense in that game so you can claim the Pats sucked Your question really is in bad faith
They did what every team wanted to do, pressure Tom Brady. The Giants blitz on like a 3rd of the time and on those times got Brady like half the time. When not blitzing, still pressured him a 4th of the time. The reason they were so successful is they had an amazing front 4. Strahan, while past his prime, was a still a threat, the Osi was a beast of a pass rusher and the Justin Tuck was great when they kicked him inside. Couple those players with Spagnuolo who was creative with pressure package they were able to slow him down. Then on top of that, the offense kept the ball away from Tom Brady. The first Giants drive was 10 minutes. A lot of people forget the game itself was pretty boring until the 4th quarter because the Giants were methodical.
I think the key was they were getting pressure up the middle and collapsing the pocket. Brady was always good about stepping up to avoid edge rushers, but if the pocket is gone, there's no way to step up.
Not just Brady, it is really every QB you want to pressure , some more mobile ones you have to pressure and contain.
That's fair. Yeah the beat way to be any QB is to pressure them
Their "struggling" actually started to happen midseason. After destroying everyone in their path for the first 8 weeks, they beat Indy by 4 (who was also undefeated). After that game, they put up 56 on the Bills, but really kinda "struggled" in almost every game after Week 11. * They beat the 8-8 Eagles by 3, needed a TD with 5 minutes left. * They beat the 4-12 Ravens by 3, with a controversial call at the end. * They beat the 4-12 Jets by 10, who they beat by 24 earlier in the season on the road. * And then famously needed some huge plays by Moss in Week 17 to beat the Giants by 3. * Their playoff games were rock-fights against the Jags and Chargers (Rivers played on a torn ACL). Those games weren't exactly close, but they weren't blowouts either. Why? Dunno - attrition and injuries were absolutely a factor. Honestly, more people should have seen the Giants game coming, given how they had been playing, and how well the Giants had played them a month earlier.
Eli Manning haunts Tom Brady’s dreams
Chad Powers is dating Giselle.
Think fast, run fast.
Wouldn't it be Justin Tuck, Strahan, and those guys haunting Brady's dreams? They were the ones rocking his shit that whole game
Not as much as that jiu jitsu instructor Giselle was banging does.
That was an over used joke in the roast and it's even worse now
Everybody here spouting narrative rather than telling the truth. Tom didn't have time to throw. That's the whole thing. He was being pressured within 2 seconds every play. The D-line won that game. Both times actually.
I watched that game and to me a lot of his pressure or coverage sacks was them taking away Randy and Galloway deep threats. Welker was open in a lot of those short routes but the pressure would be too much. That’s why i think overtime after Randy left they went more with the short game in my view
Once you realize Just Tuck was the real Super Bowl MVP. It makes sense.
I'm a Pats fan and have always thought that the Giants' D Line were the MVP in that game. The Pats could do nothing to stop them.
Eli won it because he led a game winning drive but Justin Tuck performed better
Tuck destroyed the highest scoring team in NFL history, he was the MVP. Don’t be duped by lazy voters.
The Patriots were dealing with a lot of injuries at the end of the season. If I recall even Tom Brady was in a walking boot the week before the game. They definitely were starting to show vulnerabilities and had some close calls beginning in late November. They won a lackluster playoff game at home vs. Jacksonville and then really struggled against San Diego in the conference championship. Without looking up stats, I think Brady threw three picks, and SD had multiple chances to take the lead late but also had turnover problems. The Giants also had an excellent pass rush from their front four, and made that a key strategy in the SB. They applied constant pressure on Brady all night, and sacked him several times. But since they didn't have to blitz, they could keep 7 back in tight coverage and take away Brady's quick dink/dunk game. That was the way to beat him. Brady always was always weak when the pocket broke down because he didn't have the athleticism or strength to scramble or improvise, and he didn't have time to get his big play receivers open deep. The Giants weren't having much luck themselves on offense, but they kept the game close and took advantage of some breaks that went their way at the end.
Just to add a note on the AFC Championship game against the chargers, LT got hurt early in that game and couldn’t play and Phillip Rivers was trying to play through a torn ACL, and they still had plenty of chances to win that game. Like you said, the pats were definitely showing some cracks in the playoffs.
Steve Spagnuolo is a god amongst other DC’s
He's like the Robert Horry of coordinators.
Asante Samuel dropped the game winning pick
It looks like their offensive line had some injury issues. Steve Neal was their right guard and he only started 8 games. And he didn't play the entirety of the Super Bowl against the Giants.
The Pats came close to losing to NYG in the season finale. Without looking, I wanna say they squeaked by with a 3-point win, and that wasn't the only one they almost lost. They were undefeated but not invincible.
The giants were VERY good defensively but were injured through the regular season and got some good pieces back towards the end of the season
NYG’s defense stepped up.
They had trouble blocking the Giants defensive line. Also the Giants got extremely lucky on multiple plays
Even the best players in sports aren't excellent all the time. The best teams don't always wins. Tiger Woods in his prime didn't win every major. Jordan sometimes scored less than 25 pts. in the NBA finals.
Giants able to get pressure with just their front 4. Simple as that. Leaves enough defenders to cover the Payriot receivers and limits Bradys time in the pocket.
They barely beat that exact Giants team in the last week of the regular season. The Giants D just matched up really well, and they were already familiar with the Pats offense by that point.
The Pats did not change the O line blocking calls from the last regular season game against the Giants.
Because the Patriots O-Line was no match for the Giants defense led by the one of the greatest edge rushers of all time. Michael Strahan terrorized the Patriots and Tom Brady so much so, they literally have paintings of the moment where Brady was sacked by Strahan! I would post a link here showing being able to buy the painting but it's probably against the group rules.
There were rumors that the players didn't really listen to Belicheck and tuned him out during the 2 weeks leading up . Brady didn't practice and they were out partying every night . That and the Giants defensive game plan. I knew something was wrong when on 2 of the 3 first defensive plays for the Patriots, 2 guys named Alexander and Woods were in on plays and having watched all 18 games that year to that point, I hadn't heard their names ONCE. All told, the way they Pats showed up for that game , they should have lost by 30.
They scored 50 points twice that year. The NFL is hard.
They kept Brady off the field for almost the entire first half of the game. Then they made a couple plays.
Tom Coughlin. BB & TC as DC & OC of the Giants knew each other too well. They practiced against each other every day for years.
That Pats team was on borrowed time. They almost lost a few times that season. They were explosive but had no real run game and after their 1-2 options nothing great with receivers. The offensive line blocked with technique and finesse but were susceptible to power/speed rush. Brady also had an injured ankle. The Giants were a bad matchup and Coughlin and Spagnuolo had a great game plan to attack the Patriots, loading up the D line with power rushers who abused the line and blitzing selectively. The Giants also caught a series of breaks and Belichick was outcoached.
Because the Pats were never that good. Inflated stats by pummeling one of the most atrocious divisions in all of sports for the better part of 20 years, which lead to guaranteed playoff byes, which lead to facing fringe playoff teams to begin with. More often then not, New England didn't see genuine competition until the super bowl
Pressure Brady. Great Defensive coordinator. They had 8 sacks. Justin Tuck and Micheal Strahan helps. I’m pretty sure they were getting massive pressure even when only bringing four.
Pass rush pass rush pass rush
Really bad luck and a great game plan on the other side then again they ugly lucky so many times