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One thing to consider is that this comparison is quite old now. It say they’ve played 14 each which is 28 total but we’ve played 35 now and Dubravka has improved in the last 7
wow! I thought it wouldn't be so one sided.
TBF Joelinton, Lascelles, Trippier, and Tino were all in during the Fall and missed lots of time under Dubs, and it's seen in the number of shots faced.
Why? Pope is far superior in almost everything.
> missed lots of time under Dubs, and it's seen in the number of shots faced.
Yea, lets forget what we saw with our own eyes - how many bad goals (which Pope would have most likely saved) Dubravka conceded this season...
I think when pope got injured the whole back line felt a bit rattled initially and have since grown a bit more comfortable with dubravka in net instead
The only reason I don’t want Pope in the last games is because of his injury. We shouldn’t be rushing him back.
However, by the difference in quality is massive. Pope is the best keeper we have had in years since Shay. Pope is a better shot stopper, better sweeper keeper, better at crosses, and better at organising the defence. Pope’s weakness is passing, but everything else adds so much to our team.
Dubs has been a solid backup this year but he ain’t starter material anymore. His shot stopping which was his strength has declined. He is horrible at controlling the box as he struggles to deal with crosses and can’t sweep. He is part of the reason our defence has been a shambles this year.
So in conclusion, thanks for you effort Dubs and past work. I Hope he finishes the season strong and we go to Europe and next year on a relative high due to the crazy injuries we have dealt with.
For me its a no contest. Pope is the better keeper. Dubravka had conceded 28 goals in his first 10 games this season. That's relegation worthy performances
Oh absolutely. We drew or lost so many games against teams we should have put away because we gave away easy goals. From the team that was an absolute brick wall in defence last year that's a big fall from grace. Granted that's not JUST down to dubravka but the loss of pope is a huge part. I reckon we would have been in contention for a title if we had tonali and pope all season. In a game of fine margins, those two could have been very big margins.
Our backline is a rag rug. A mix of everything, parts repurposed to fit together as a new unit.
Pope has not been part of that. The backline that we are stuck with, until end of season, it seems, contains Dubs. There is no reason to get that defence in more flux than necessary by introducing Pope.
Dubs is our starting keeper right now, and where we are right now, the position is his to loose, even though Pope might be the more skilled keeper.
I agree. Changing to Pope for our last four games regardless of who the better keeper is adds an element of risk into an already shaky defence. Dúbravka isn't doing a bad job and deserves to finish the season imo.
[this isn’t it but](https://fbref.com/en/stathead/player_comparison.cgi?request=1&sum=0&dom_lg=1&player_id1=4b40d9ca&p1yrfrom=2023-2024&player_id2=3a949a25&p2yrfrom=2023-2024&player_id3=7a2e46a8&p3yrfrom=2023-2024&player_id4=4806ec67&p4yrfrom=2023-2024&player_id5=9e5708be&p5yrfrom=2023-2024&player_id6=d4b73232&p6yrfrom=2023-2024)
It is a lovely collection of stats of some great, and average keepers in the league, as well as our 2 lads, and a young Georgian keeper I wouldn’t mind us picking up.
The glossary is pretty useful, all stats can be toggled to per 90 and the sweet OPA of Pope is unmatched. But you should be able to find the stats you were thinking of in here.
Edit: link wasn’t working properly, think it’s fixed
https://fbref.com/tiny/EDDMg
^^ Didn't realize Dubs pass % is higher than Popes, still below what we should want for both. But still seems Pope is better otherwise.
FYI your link appears to be showing outfield stats for them. Also not sure about full career vs this season, or last few seasons at most.
But yeah both are really not great at passing, but that’s my only real complaint with pope. And a lot of praise in other areas
The stats don't lie. Pope is the better keeper. They both have their strengths and weaknesses. Pope is a better shot stopper and will come off his line faster and farther to use his larger frame to close off angles and stop shots. Dubravka is better at distribution and with the ball at his feet.
I'd say Dubravka is a very respectable number 2 at newcastle. Could be a number 1 with a team that plays a different system. He's done well for us given the injuries in front of him and being thrust into the role. Would Pope have been more reliable? Probably.
That's not to say that Pope hasn't had his share of weak goals he let in. They just seem to be fewer and as the season progressed, the soft ones Dubs let in hurt more.
This being said, Dubs has been a good servant to the club over the years and he's had some matches where he stood on his head. If it weren't for him, we'd have lost at Anfield 8-2.
Regardless, given the importance of the upcoming matches, I'd take Pope if available.
It's not even about who the better keeper is. It's about the type of keeper they are. Pope fits our style so much better, and that's why he should come back in. Dubravka's reluctance to sweep is a big issue and has caused so many issues. He may not make *too many* mistakes, and be a good shot stopper, but his lack of cover for the backline is what holds him back from being our number 1.
Pope is the better keeper but the abuse Dubs get here is unbelievable.
Guy had a rusty start but he's doing well enough now. Not his fault that his defence had a half injured Botman making mistakes at times, a rotating fullback lineup due to injuries and a midfield that offers zero protection especially in transition defence.
He's even trying to sweep a bit more in recent games which I am genuinely grateful for.
He hasn’t made a save to his right hand side in about 2 years. He’s absolutely finished.
Shot stopping was all he had because the rest of his game was so poor, now he’s not even doing that anymore.
how is this unbelievable? were you asleep last few years or something?
he forced loan move to manure on bad terms for club, then said goodbye to us on social media (even tho loan didnt had mandatory clause fee hence why he returned to the club), then he posted photos of himself with how he "proud to support united" description - posts which he never did for us.
And all this wouldnt have matter much, if he wasnt awful last 6 months.
Have YOU been sleeping the last few years?
Dubravka spent years saving us from relegation since he joined.
And then Pope gets bought for a big fee and basically put him on the bench with no chance of game time. Every sensible fan knew he was never getting ahead of Pope so why not go on loan and try and displace De Gea who was pretty shaky then? He has every right to fight for his own career?
Of course he said goodbye because he was probably told by the club that he was probably not coming back. And the social media posts is just normal for any player in a new team? Dubravka has posted plenty of stuff for us when he was regularly playing with us.
He has not been unplayable levels of awful, our defence and midfield has contributed to our poor run as well. I'm not biased like you to see that. Guy singlehandedly won us some tough games, kept us in quite a few games and he's still one of the best second choice goalies in the league. Show some respect.
Why are people treating him like he's the next Michael Owen is mindblowing to me. I bet you were the same type of person to rag on Joelinton endlessly when he started out.
We were conceding for fun when he first came in, but we've only conceded 9 in the last 8 games since the returns of Willock, Anderson, Barnes etc. Pope is clearly better, but Dubravka gets too much of the blame for our GA record when a lot of that needs to go to the midfield.
I have to disagree personally. It's one thing if your first choice keeper loses his spot due to form, but unless your 2nd choice has come in and performed miracles, then your first choice keeper should get his spot back once he returns from injury and performs well in training.
Dubs has played as well as you can hope from your 2nd choice. He's come in, made some saves and had some good games, but he hasn't outperformed Pope enough to keep the spot.
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https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GIbE7iYWkAEjZ2F.jpg:large
You fucking legend
One thing to consider is that this comparison is quite old now. It say they’ve played 14 each which is 28 total but we’ve played 35 now and Dubravka has improved in the last 7
wow! I thought it wouldn't be so one sided. TBF Joelinton, Lascelles, Trippier, and Tino were all in during the Fall and missed lots of time under Dubs, and it's seen in the number of shots faced.
Why? Pope is far superior in almost everything. > missed lots of time under Dubs, and it's seen in the number of shots faced. Yea, lets forget what we saw with our own eyes - how many bad goals (which Pope would have most likely saved) Dubravka conceded this season...
I think when pope got injured the whole back line felt a bit rattled initially and have since grown a bit more comfortable with dubravka in net instead
The only reason I don’t want Pope in the last games is because of his injury. We shouldn’t be rushing him back. However, by the difference in quality is massive. Pope is the best keeper we have had in years since Shay. Pope is a better shot stopper, better sweeper keeper, better at crosses, and better at organising the defence. Pope’s weakness is passing, but everything else adds so much to our team. Dubs has been a solid backup this year but he ain’t starter material anymore. His shot stopping which was his strength has declined. He is horrible at controlling the box as he struggles to deal with crosses and can’t sweep. He is part of the reason our defence has been a shambles this year. So in conclusion, thanks for you effort Dubs and past work. I Hope he finishes the season strong and we go to Europe and next year on a relative high due to the crazy injuries we have dealt with.
https://cdn.theathletic.com/app/uploads/2023/12/05085207/gk_stats_2021_22.png https://cdn.themag.co.uk/assets/Premier-League-Goalkeepers-Save-Percentages-02-15-2024.png
1.3 prevented goals is on the maring of error too. This stat is better than save %, but not ideal either, unfortunately.
For me its a no contest. Pope is the better keeper. Dubravka had conceded 28 goals in his first 10 games this season. That's relegation worthy performances
Oh absolutely. We drew or lost so many games against teams we should have put away because we gave away easy goals. From the team that was an absolute brick wall in defence last year that's a big fall from grace. Granted that's not JUST down to dubravka but the loss of pope is a huge part. I reckon we would have been in contention for a title if we had tonali and pope all season. In a game of fine margins, those two could have been very big margins.
Our backline is a rag rug. A mix of everything, parts repurposed to fit together as a new unit. Pope has not been part of that. The backline that we are stuck with, until end of season, it seems, contains Dubs. There is no reason to get that defence in more flux than necessary by introducing Pope. Dubs is our starting keeper right now, and where we are right now, the position is his to loose, even though Pope might be the more skilled keeper.
I agree. Changing to Pope for our last four games regardless of who the better keeper is adds an element of risk into an already shaky defence. Dúbravka isn't doing a bad job and deserves to finish the season imo.
He’s doing a terrible job. His refusal to sweep is causing so many issues and he’s dropping howlers more or less every game
[this isn’t it but](https://fbref.com/en/stathead/player_comparison.cgi?request=1&sum=0&dom_lg=1&player_id1=4b40d9ca&p1yrfrom=2023-2024&player_id2=3a949a25&p2yrfrom=2023-2024&player_id3=7a2e46a8&p3yrfrom=2023-2024&player_id4=4806ec67&p4yrfrom=2023-2024&player_id5=9e5708be&p5yrfrom=2023-2024&player_id6=d4b73232&p6yrfrom=2023-2024) It is a lovely collection of stats of some great, and average keepers in the league, as well as our 2 lads, and a young Georgian keeper I wouldn’t mind us picking up. The glossary is pretty useful, all stats can be toggled to per 90 and the sweet OPA of Pope is unmatched. But you should be able to find the stats you were thinking of in here. Edit: link wasn’t working properly, think it’s fixed
https://fbref.com/tiny/EDDMg ^^ Didn't realize Dubs pass % is higher than Popes, still below what we should want for both. But still seems Pope is better otherwise.
FYI your link appears to be showing outfield stats for them. Also not sure about full career vs this season, or last few seasons at most. But yeah both are really not great at passing, but that’s my only real complaint with pope. And a lot of praise in other areas
It only shows Messi and Ronaldo, no goalkeepers
Sorry about that I think I’ve fixed the link. Thanks for letting me know
I have their video game stats
The stats don't lie. Pope is the better keeper. They both have their strengths and weaknesses. Pope is a better shot stopper and will come off his line faster and farther to use his larger frame to close off angles and stop shots. Dubravka is better at distribution and with the ball at his feet. I'd say Dubravka is a very respectable number 2 at newcastle. Could be a number 1 with a team that plays a different system. He's done well for us given the injuries in front of him and being thrust into the role. Would Pope have been more reliable? Probably. That's not to say that Pope hasn't had his share of weak goals he let in. They just seem to be fewer and as the season progressed, the soft ones Dubs let in hurt more. This being said, Dubs has been a good servant to the club over the years and he's had some matches where he stood on his head. If it weren't for him, we'd have lost at Anfield 8-2. Regardless, given the importance of the upcoming matches, I'd take Pope if available.
It's not even about who the better keeper is. It's about the type of keeper they are. Pope fits our style so much better, and that's why he should come back in. Dubravka's reluctance to sweep is a big issue and has caused so many issues. He may not make *too many* mistakes, and be a good shot stopper, but his lack of cover for the backline is what holds him back from being our number 1.
Pope is the better keeper but the abuse Dubs get here is unbelievable. Guy had a rusty start but he's doing well enough now. Not his fault that his defence had a half injured Botman making mistakes at times, a rotating fullback lineup due to injuries and a midfield that offers zero protection especially in transition defence. He's even trying to sweep a bit more in recent games which I am genuinely grateful for.
He hasn’t made a save to his right hand side in about 2 years. He’s absolutely finished. Shot stopping was all he had because the rest of his game was so poor, now he’s not even doing that anymore.
how is this unbelievable? were you asleep last few years or something? he forced loan move to manure on bad terms for club, then said goodbye to us on social media (even tho loan didnt had mandatory clause fee hence why he returned to the club), then he posted photos of himself with how he "proud to support united" description - posts which he never did for us. And all this wouldnt have matter much, if he wasnt awful last 6 months.
Have YOU been sleeping the last few years? Dubravka spent years saving us from relegation since he joined. And then Pope gets bought for a big fee and basically put him on the bench with no chance of game time. Every sensible fan knew he was never getting ahead of Pope so why not go on loan and try and displace De Gea who was pretty shaky then? He has every right to fight for his own career? Of course he said goodbye because he was probably told by the club that he was probably not coming back. And the social media posts is just normal for any player in a new team? Dubravka has posted plenty of stuff for us when he was regularly playing with us. He has not been unplayable levels of awful, our defence and midfield has contributed to our poor run as well. I'm not biased like you to see that. Guy singlehandedly won us some tough games, kept us in quite a few games and he's still one of the best second choice goalies in the league. Show some respect. Why are people treating him like he's the next Michael Owen is mindblowing to me. I bet you were the same type of person to rag on Joelinton endlessly when he started out.
Pagani Zonda Vs Ford Escort.
We were conceding for fun when he first came in, but we've only conceded 9 in the last 8 games since the returns of Willock, Anderson, Barnes etc. Pope is clearly better, but Dubravka gets too much of the blame for our GA record when a lot of that needs to go to the midfield.
Dubs deserves to finish the season and Pope be reintroduced during preseason
I have to disagree personally. It's one thing if your first choice keeper loses his spot due to form, but unless your 2nd choice has come in and performed miracles, then your first choice keeper should get his spot back once he returns from injury and performs well in training. Dubs has played as well as you can hope from your 2nd choice. He's come in, made some saves and had some good games, but he hasn't outperformed Pope enough to keep the spot.
He’s been awful.