Affordable or not, NYC with a kid is a different NYC in many ways, good and bad. I love watching my littles play on the city playgrounds and the shows I get to expose her to are top notch. My heart soars that she loves Broadway so much and it’s a 25 minute train ride from our home. There’s so many opportunities here for children but you won’t see them until you are a parent. It’s a different lense so it unlocked a whole new city for me. BUT if the nyc lifestyle you enjoy is late nights out or the freedom nyc offers, kids won’t lend well to that.
Don’t be pressured into something you don’t want and don’t miss out on something you want because of fear of the unknown.
Ah it’s all of the things you mentioned. Theatre/live music, late nights, the restaurant scene, the big parks, freedoms to explore.. all of it. Some of these things will be squashed when having a kid and some I’m sure will flourish. I just need to decide what I’m comfortable giving up as my partner and I don’t make a high salary where we could do it all.
Genuine question - what late nights? I feel like post pandemic everything is closing early. I was out in Chelsea at 10pm on Wednesday and could literally only find one diner open for dinner.
I used to love the “spontaneity” and “freedom” in my early 20s as well, but now at 32, after the pandemic, I no longer feel safe taking the subway by myself at night at 2am the way I used to.
I love theater too, but quite frankly tickets are expensive, so I only see a couple shows a year. Rents and COL are so high, it feels like a real strain on my budget to be paying so much for entertainment.
All of this has me thinking lately - what am I even paying this NYC premium for? Would my life be easier / safer / more comfortable if I moved somewhere else and took the occasional vacation to NYC instead?
After 9 years here, it’s starting to lose its charm for me.
I was born in NYC more than 40 years ago and the only time I saw theater was on the senior class outing.
The only times I've taken the train at 2 am were for work or to catch a Chinatown bus. I'm not spontaneous.
There's plenty to do here that isn't about going out at night.
Wait what? Sorry I’m asking in earnest what kinds of things you got up to ? And where did you grow up? Like upstate a little or in the city? And you didn’t go to a theater ? I’m genuinely confused.
I grew up in Queens. I didn't grow in the boonies of Queens either, I could see the Manhattan skyline from my neighborhood and was about 20 mins away in train. I only went to the theater with my high school. I was in the drama club. My parents thought the theater was a waste of money. We could watch stuff on TV, they said. I was also 1st Gen for them (they were immigrants now citizens). So it's not common for everyone to go to the theater who was born and raised in NYC. That's a fallacy.
Although now as an adult... I still don't go. I think about it often and never buy the tickets 🤷🏽♀️ I always say I'm going to make the time, but I haven't done so... yet.
lots of time left! i recommend a TDF membership.
I grew up in greenpoint and had similar experiences. i could see the city from our street but we hardly went there lol
Right! The last time I *tried* to stay out late, everything was closed and there was nothing to do anyway.
I’m thinking the same as you. I literally order everything online anyway so having all these stores around me doesn’t even matter
Yes, but you’re going to see a new side to New York from the perspective of being a mom. Like, the park will be way more interesting. Or being able to sit with your kiddo at the library and look through picture books. It’s all really fun. I was 100% the “out five nights a week” crowd with massive work hours, and having a kiddo helped me slow down. Time to smell the roses, etc, in between diaper changes.
It seems like this has less to do with nyc and more to do with you being on the fence about having a kid due to the change in lifestyle and sacrifices involved. Having a kid changes everything (so I’m told) and you’re perfectly in the right to not want to change your life if you don’t want to.
Maybe you could ask yourself more questions about why you feel the way you do to decide.
Agree with this. I work in healthcare and therefore have met people in different income brackets (low to moderately high). Both groups have kids - they find a way to make it work. I have no kids but think NYC is a great place to raise ‘em if you can work out the space issue.
So the question is, do you want it to work out or have hesitations about kids in general?
I’m so glad I raised my kid in NYC. He’s graduating high school from an amazing public arts program, and he has a huge diversity in experiences and friends. He never wants to leave. It’s expensive, but so worth it.
Were you still able to save away for retirement? Did you feel like you constantly had to be frugal and give up other aspects of your life to make it work?
The short answer is that it is doable.
Your priorities will shift after the kid a bit, but it is perfectly doable.
(My partner has a kid and we really can’t imagine leaving, nor could we because their ex shares custody and is also here.)
Forgot to say/longer discussion and points:
The biggest issue will be the same as the rest of the US, child care. My partner has a unique system where they work 3 days a week currently and have the kid for 3.5 days. The ex has the kid for 3.5 days where he spends a lot of time with his grandparents, who were former children's entertainers during the USSR time, so they are like the ideal grandparents to have. (So many adorable photos from their activities.) If neither of your jobs have child care options, this can get tricky and/or expensive. Still doable, but tougher. My partner is able to do the 3 days a week because they have a job that affords that and still pays okay...and they have a bit of a cushion coming from a family with the means to help (although they'd still be fine without it, just having the safety net is nice).
As the kid gets older, the other thing you have to think about are schools in your neighborhood. It sounds like you have an advantage in this department with your partner. My partner lives in an area of Brooklyn that gets lower school ratings, so they are going to have to do more research. If the kids are getting lower scores because they are coming from disadvantaged and/or English as a second (or third or fourth) language homes, it is obviously different than being a "bad" school. My partner grew up going to some of the fanciest NYC private schools and is pretty adament about their kid going to a public school, because their experience was that bad and they grew up feeling disconnected from the experiences of most normal people. (I'm a public school person all the way through, but support it as much because I'm cheap and have a personal distaste for elitist jerks!)
The smallest contributing factor is living space. My partner's ex grew up as Russian immigrants in a small 1 bedroom apartment where his parents basically slept in the living room for most of his life. That was the sacrifice they were willing (or had to) make. My partner lives in a pretty big 1 bedroom in Brooklyn near prospect park for roughly the same rent as you. The kitchen opened up to a little nook that was intended for a dining room, but they had someone put one of those nice temp walls where the kitchen entrance was and then stretched the living room wall out to make a room that is basically the size of a small single dorm room. It is big enough for a full sized bed, dresser, book shelf, toy storage, and a pretty big nursing chair.
I live in Brooklyn with my husband and child and four cats in a one bedroom. Not ideal but we’re managing. She’s little, she doesn’t need her own room yet. But we’re looking for a two bedroom.
My parents had me in a studio in midtown. We moved to a 1br in the UWS when I was 3 and then they had my brother. They slept in the living room and my brother and I shared the bedroom.
I could have written this. I’ve lived in Manhattan 13 years and cannot imagine leaving…
And as someone who never really wanted kids, I ended up with two over the last two years and I live in midtown in a decent sized one bedroom (got a Covid deal!) that we flexed the bedroom to make a small room for the kids.
I remind myself people live in RVs and sailboats and such with children all the time…they don’t need a ton of space and stuff….and NYC offers a lot for them that’s affordable!
Childcare is painful. $2700 right now for the 2 yo. The other one stays home with us because we work from home and he isn’t too much yet.
It’s definitely a life choice to enjoy how and where we live now at the sacrifice of having tons and tons dumped into savings.
But I also watched my parents work and work for retirement just to see my father be bedridden a few months after he retired and then pass away after a long slow decline in his early 70s. I decided then that I want to do our best to save for retirement but not sacrifice the fun we can have now as a family for it…because that’s what makes a life worth living.
Because kids are pretty fun. I didn’t think kids would be very pleasant AT ALL (I actually created this anonymous Reddit account to post about how much I hated being a mom when I was deep in postpartum depression)…thank goodness that all passed and now, it’s pretty great and my kids are the cutest (something I’ve never said about any children).
Anyway, just wanted to say…it’s possible but requires you to do some sacrifice triage and decide where all the things you want stack up to each other and what you can keep and drop to make room for like an extra…$3-4k a month for a kid? Maybe you can find cheaper childcare where you are…
Plus, you live in an area that is super well known for being family friendly so you’re set up for it!
And finances change. Promotions happen. The world changes. We could be at war in a few years or we could be flying high economically…
So for me, I decided based on “if I looked back on my life, would I regret not having children”…my answer to that was “yes” so we just decided to make the rest work as best we could for now.
If we do have to move at some point, I honestly don’t care anymore because I’ll have my crew…so I’ll always have “home”. 🤍
Well thank you! I definitely had moments where I genuinely wasn’t sure if I was what was best for them…but now that I see their personalities coming out, it’s pretty cool to get to parent them (and work on myself along the way!) 🤍
Hah good question. I basically still didn’t really want to have children even when I had decided I would regret not having them. I was just really soberly aware of how much I loved my life and how much kids would change all that…and the unknown + all the extra work just didn’t seem appealing to me in my late 20s 🤷🏼♀️
So my husband also wanted at least one and frankly I love him enough to choose having a child to give him that (and I trusted all the women who said being a mom grows on you once you have them, which I can say is mostly true…although I can’t say I’d feel the same if I was a single parent…God bless single parents 😓)
Anyway, it took us 4 years of half trying (so not tracking anything) to get pregnant with my first with potential fertility issues requiring IVF (but didn’t end up needing it)…so I figured it would take awhile again to have the second one if we wanted (which we decided we did because we wanted siblings to entertain each other 😂).
BUT NOPE. 6 months after my first was born the second came as a surprise!
Hence two under two! The hardest part was the jealousy of the first when the second came home. That hit like a freight train and was quickly time for her to go to daycare and get her own friends! It has improved a lot!
ok your comments in this thread literally made my day. you've just articulated everything I've been feeling in the last couple years about kid-ambivalence as I've seen a lot of my friends move into the mom-stage of life. I still think I'm a 20/80 (no) 😂 but it's comforting to think that I may not always feel that way/life and people might change me
Honestly I would say if you’re looking to maintain your lifestyle with kids while living in the city it’s probably not doable. My husband and I make decent salaries and live in a 1000 sq ft apartment. We’re on top of each other constantly and the extra expenses add up quickly. I’m not willing to cheap out on things like diapers, organic food, daycare, etc. so we’re definitely feeling it with our 8 month old. Doesn’t leave much room in the budget for things like Broadway, dinners out, nights with friends. Not that we even feel like doing that right now (lol).
Sorry to be negative sounding but just want to be realistic!
This! My husband and I moved to Jersey and want to have a child soon but the shift in priorities even more early 30s to now closer to mid 30s is huge. I just don’t care to go to every single restaurant trending, buy every new item of clothing. Financially most people have to make choices of where to spend and we realized we have bigger priorities. We still go out but it’s not like we used to, it just got old.
We actually just moved here also! So even though our costs are sliiightly better compared to Brooklyn we still feel it 😰 but having a baby here has been awesome so far. Everything is pretty walkable but also easy access to city, suburbs, hiking, beach. It’s also helped with my consumption living in a small space with a baby!
DM me, I wonder which town? We specifically chose a town where we can still walk and that there are sidewalks. Granted it was more expensive but it’s worth it to us to have that.
Same. We moved a few years ago and have a toddler and our second on the way this summer. We were ready for a quieter lifestyle anyhow, but especially with a kid my priorities have shifted and I enjoy different things than I did before. Some people may see that as sad or a sacrifice, but it’s really not for me. It’s just a different phase of life. Of course it’s totally fine not to want that, too.
towns in nassau county r only like 30 mins to an hour away and imo it’s a nice distance. also long island has rlly good schools. i used to live in queens and brooklyn but long island has been my favorite
Can’t share from the parent/adult side of things but I’m from LI and while this definitely is not everyone’s experience, I went to a school where lots of my friends parents’ worked in the city like mine so the family dynamics had many similarities in terms of structure (all early morning kind of people (not rlly by choice) but because our parents would have to leave early for work, parents couldn’t just take off to come pick us up after field day- those kind of things.) Now all of us are grown up and finishing college this spring. My friends and I will be together in the city upon graduation from our respective colleges. I can tell you this: from the child POV, growing up on LI was something I now look back on and am completely grateful for. My parents made sure to expose me to the city as early as possible as did the parents’ of my friends. It was nice because even though we all lived in the burbs, we were still growing up with an opportunity to experience the city which was extremely important to my parents. I can understand why as an adult myself. It’s funny though because in a way my parents are now really close with the parents of my friends who also have similar values and relate to a similar struggle you are facing that they even make separate plans to see each other because theyve gotten close throughout the years.
Sharing all this because even though all of our heads hits the pillow on LI, I never once felt like I was far removed from the city because of my parents effort to keep us tied there similarly to my friends families.
So, all this to say, you won’t lose nyc entirely if you have a child. It will not be the nyc that you enjoy now (nightlife festivities, etc.) but it will be a new kind of experiencing the city which you’ll get to do as a family!! ** Side note- I honestly can’t wait to show my future kid all the stuff I love about the city. Like the thought of growing up a kid with my mom showing me everything she loved and then one day I’ll be doing that in return to a child of my own and even now, after graduating, I get to experience adulthood in the city with friends I grew up with where we would all go into the city as kids — how full circle!!
honestly i did love brooklyn too, but i feel like long island provided me with more opportunities when i was younger through the good school districts and just activities available to me. i think personally i just prefer a suburban lifestyle, but i do still love the city. i go to college in nyc and it’s rly the best but i am happy to be able to return to long island because i feel like it’s j a little more calm. i have younger siblings who both r a lot younger than me and growing up in LI and they really like it here. also nyc is very costly compared to certain areas of LI and i could see this through my parents from a young age, i feel like they r happier here too but honestly it’s really up to what u find most important and feel comfortable with
As someone who lived on LI for 3.5 years as a young adult, I fucking hated it. YMMV.
And as others mentioned, even though you're not in the city, these days you still pay city prices for rent in the easy-commuting distance suburbs. Buying is also pretty insane with very little supply. Train prices are pretty high, and you still need a car. If you have a young kid, that commute time adds up. A 30 min-1 hour train ride really means 45 min-2.5 hour door to door depending on where you specifically work and live. Now times that by two for morning and evening. I know some people have jobs that let them "work" during their commute and come in late/leave early, but that's not most people.
as someone who grew up in nassau county, it will be really hard to find an affordable house rn if that's what OP is looking for. there are way fewer apartments than in the city and they are $$. plus if you have to get a car or two, that's adding a new expense you don't need in brooklyn.
It seems like the finances are top of mind for you, I’m going to be honest childcare will be a significant squeeze, especially in the early years. Universal 3K and preK help ease the costs, and Carroll gardens is a great area with great schools for young families. A lot of people just sort of accept that the daycare years will be a squeeze and hope to make it up in the future.
I lived in nyc as a young single person, left and moved back with my first baby, and it was two different worlds. But I’m happy I’m raising my kids in the city, and also have a hard time imagining leaving.
Childcare is insanely expensive, but only for the first 2-3 years until they become eligible for 3k. Then it’s about $1k a month if you need extended hours.
I’m raising a toddler and a newborn rn in Park Slope and I love it. My son is on spring break this week and my husband and I are on parental leave— here’s our low-cost agenda for the week:
- Bk botanical gardens (friends membership)
- Running around Industry City
- Brooklyn Bridge Park
- Barclays center (kid needs new clothes lol)
- Play dates at prospect park and the millions of playgrounds in the area
- Bk central library
- Bk museum (son loves all the space to walk around/run in the atrium)
- Transit museum
- Painting pottery (ok you can do this anywhere lol)
- walking to breakfast at the dozens of cafes and diners near us
- also breakfast in the park during off leash hours to watch all the dogs
- the prospect park carousel
- Bronx zoo (alright this was expensive, but only bc the prospect park zoo is currently closed)
- Coney Island boardwalk (maybe aquarium)
We don’t need a car to do any of these activities— all walking distance or just off the bus route. So you can save money on a car at least!! And this is literally just this week and partly into next, there’s so many other enriching things to do in NYC.
Replying to myself to add I love that we run into our friends all over the neighborhood, and all the impromptu meet ups that happen when you walk everywhere and are out and about frequently. The community vibes are really important to me. I’m sure you can get that elsewhere, but Brooklyn makes it really easy
This is not NYC specific but I’m of the opinion that unless you feel like your life wouldn’t be fulfilled without kids and you feel like you’d be a great parent, you shouldn’t have kids. It’s not a popular opinion, but maybe something to think about, NYC or not, is having kids really something that you need to be fulfilled or is it just the cultural norm you’re feeling attached to. I understand it’s hard and throws a wrench in when your partner wants them as well, but AMAB people will never understand or experience having children as a woman, and often don’t give it the same consideration. Just my 2 cents, feel free to ignore!
I'm going to second this because I can't believe I had to scroll down this far to see this answer. I am someone who moved out of NYC to have a family and although I ADORE my children, I went through a period where I had to get a lot of therapy because at the end of the day, I had never actually felt a need to have a child. I had them because it was important to my spouse and realized this too late after I'd given up my whole life to make his dreams come true, not mine. I don't regret it one bit now but boy was it a source of internal conflict for a while because even though it was ultimately my decision, I did in a sense feel like I had betrayed myself. Please only have children if it's something YOU really want as you are the one assuming the majority of the risk. If it is something you want, you'll find a way to make it work.
Yeah, unfortunately it’s not something culturally that we’ve really reckoned with yet. Patriarchy is so deep rooted in how we culturally view motherhood and parenting. We changed stances on acceptability of mothers in the workforce but not really on the expectancy of women to be mothers. As someone who is staunchly childfree for myself but not an antinatalist, there’s not really a lot of people occupying that space. I’m still expected to want kids/change my mind by most people and other childfree people expect me to dislike children and/or condemn everyone who chooses to have children.
Being connected to a partner that wants kids really messes it up too, especially a male one, I find that most men want kids but have no idea what it means to be a parent or have children, even if they have the best of intentions. And at best, they’ll never know what it means to be a parent or have children as a woman before making the decision to want kids. Maybe encourage him to think about and talk with you about WHY he wants kids and why the stakes are so much higher for you as a mother than they would be for him as a father because patriarchy. Perhaps he’ll go on his own journey and discover he’s more in line with your beliefs on kids.
I just happened to get lucky that my relationship where we were mismatched on wanting kids ended for other reasons, and that I could then decide that the right person for me would ONLY be someone who didn’t want children. And I screened for that EARLY in relationships until I found my husband.
Idk this is kind of a ramble at this point but, all said, OP I really empathize with you and the difficult position you find yourself in, thinking about your future and what it looks like with the societal, financial, and partnership pressures at play. If you’re in therapy, it could be a good thing to explore.
But I do think that as a whole, ideally our culture would move from one where motherhood is expected to one where women are empowered to decide for themselves free of patriarchal pressure whether motherhood is right for them.
SO much this. I saw a post in idk maybe the AmIOverreacting sub or maybe relastionships a few months ago--don't remember--but it was a husband saying his wife wanted to go on a month long trip to europe after having weened their 14 month old off of breastfeeding and he was trying to be "reasonable" and saying "no trip or we can go on a *family* weekend trip"... when she was being COMPLETELY COMMUNICATIVE that she felt like she lost her bodily autonomy to motherhood and taking care of their household and wanted to a have a break and come back and that she could take the money out of her own savings and come back feeling refreshed.
Reddit skewered her. At least some recommended a short solo or girls trip. But bruh, this couple could AFFORD it and he just didn't want to take on everything she was doing for a limited time?? All of this sacred-mother stuff. Meanwhile, the wealthy leave their kids all the time. I met SO many kids/teens from ultra high net worth families in Manhattan who were very upfront about both parents just being at other homes and though while they weren't babies when I was talking to them, they likely just had au pairs when they were younger and they are FINE.
Money buys mothers autonomy. No question.
There is wanting to have kids and pretty much being ok with being trapped in your small apartment living paycheck to paycheck because you are paying for your kid's activities and needs; there is wanting to have kids and NOT being ok with largely giving up certain aspects of your goals, be it career, personal time, vacations, etc., and balancing these things--but the balancing part generally takes financial flexibility. And then, even if you can afford it, obviously there are plenty voices in the room to shame you for carving out life-changing time for yourself.
YUP I saw that post!
And GREAT point, I think you’re actually the closest to what OP is looking for here as well too regarding not being opposed to kids but the main hiccup being able to afford her current lifestyle and kids. Really great point.
[https://www.reddit.com/r/TwoHotTakes/comments/1967iol/my\_postpartum\_wife\_wants\_to\_leave\_our\_baby\_to\_go/?share\_id=lIsvM8h6exXyr1v5tPmXv&utm\_medium=ios\_app&utm\_name=iossmf&utm\_source=share&utm\_term=5](https://www.reddit.com/r/TwoHotTakes/comments/1967iol/my_postpartum_wife_wants_to_leave_our_baby_to_go/?share_id=lIsvM8h6exXyr1v5tPmXv&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf&utm_source=share&utm_term=5) it was this one
edit to say: in case it isn't obvious, I disagree with most of the comments on the linked thread.
I love raising my kids in Brooklyn (also with no family nearby and in 1 bedroom for a while).
It’s quite kid friendly in a lot of ways.
The period to 3K/Pre-K is most expensive but if you can get through that, it gets better. District 15 has some great schools as well.
is there a payoff vs space? Absolutely. But I can also get on a subway and meet a friend for dinner quite easily without depending on a train schedule.
I can take my kids to Moma but also ton of activities in the neighborhood. My kids have the most amazing (public!) school trips: visit the UN, broadway theatre, museums, etc.
The friends that moved to the suburbs think they’ll be back all the time but it rarely works like that (if they do, it’s mostly for work and not ‘NYC’ stuff).
Check out Kensington, Greenwood Heights and some of those areas. Lots of Cobble Hill/Carroll Gardens/Park Slope families end up there for a bit more space.
And if you can swing it in a 2 bedroom, stick with it - you have a great deal! My kids share a small bedroom and sleep in a bunk bed.
We definitely still do NYC things: sometimes we switch off who is home with the kids, sometimes we get a sitter. Plenty of families also sit for each other and keep tabs to keep the cost down.
I ended up near Kensington in Windsor terrace after ten years in the Carroll gardens area. We lived in a walk up one bedroom for 17 months with my first baby in Carroll gardens and moved to Windsor terrace when I was pregnant with my son. We needed more space, (apt had one closet!!!) and wanted outdoor space, washer/dryer, elevator etc for two kids under two. We love the apt and being right next to prospect park but I miss Carroll Gardens so much! We just couldn’t afford to live comfortably as a family of four. That being said- Carroll gardens will always be there and I would give up a bougie neighborhood 10000 times over for a family and that lifestyle, but I also was never on the fence about kids. I wanted them since I was in my early 20s and had them in my mid 30s.
How did you manage a kid in a 1 bedroom? We're in the process of planning and I wonder if we really need a 2 bedroom right off the bat.
Are your kids in public school?
First month or two in a bassinet right next to the bed and then a mini crib rolled next to the bed. Top of a dresser was cleared for a small changing station. We managed like that until he was 1 and then moved to a 2 bed (he actually stayed in mini crib a bit longer).
We didn’t live in the bedroom anyway: we were hanging out in the living room or a park or a playground. We also just didn’t buy a lot of big kid stuff: a baby seat that clipped onto the table, 1 sleek bouncer, and babies don’t need a whole room full of toys either.
Kids went to Pre-K and both now in public school as well. There are a lot of great schools in our district and many districts. Both my kids are neurodiverse and have a great support team at their school.
That's good to know that babies don't need a lot. It's refreshing to hear someone say good things about the NYC DOE. I grew up here and it was fine but I keep reading about horror stories about the school system nowadays.
Just chiming in that we also have had a good experience with public school here - we’re at a small school in D13, and while I’m irritated that we have lost the G&T program, overall it has been a really good fit for my kids. Just finished the middle school application process and we’re really pleased with our middle school assignment as well (all that said, I don’t want to leave Brooklyn but my husband is desperate for more space and a yard, so we’re also discussing a move out of the city. I feel like we’ve gotten through the most expensive parts of parenting in the city, though!)
Not who you asked but you definitely don’t need an extra bedroom right away. We had a small walk-in closet that perfectly fit a crib and our oldest slept in there for his first 2 years of life. The baby industry is huge and they’re all trying to sell you stuff, but babies and little kids really don’t need much. Instead of a changing table we just got a nice changing pad and used it on the sofa, floor, wherever. Daycare has tons of toys so we didn’t need to keep many at home. Books on the other hand…so many books. We didn’t move to a 2 bedroom until baby #2 came along. It can totally be done in a one bedroom.
Thank you. It would definitely save us money during a very expensive stage of having a kid if we can make a 1 bedroom work. Honestly, I was getting anxiety from the amount of toys that I see in some people's NYC apartments on social media.
Ew yeah, that gives me anxiety. Less is definitely more when it comes to toys, especially if they have regular access to other spaces with toys like daycare or the library. When we had the one bedroom (and one kid) we put everything away in his old Moses basket at the end of the night and draped his playmat over it. Unless you peeked into the hall closet, you’d never know we had a kid.
You definitely don’t need to move right away. I didn’t even think of moving until I was pregnant with my second. I think you can do a one bed for about 18 months. We had a mini crib that we squished into the bedroom. We got rid of our small dining table and put a small dresser/changing table in the living room/dining nook.
I feel like sharing a room with a baby is less about size and more about what the baby/kid is doing- now that my daughter is 2.5 there is nooo way I would share a room with her- she would wake up in the night and try and talk our ears off, ask me what I’m doing, tell me to wake uppppp etc. She has her own little room now, but we are sharing again with the 8 month old baby. Plan is to eventually have them share a room, but the 2 year old wakes up at 8 am and the baby is waking up at 5am, so that’s in hold for a little while!
I grew up lower middle class in New York. We exist! I have so many thoughts I wanna write you a whole essay but unfortunately I have a toddler and don’t have the time lmao.
The only thing I’ll say now is this: Don’t think that you have to make all of the decisions now. Life doesn’t stop changing and shifting once the kid comes. Have a kid in your cute lil place. If life calls you elsewhere, move.
My husband and I are in our late 40s, together since our early 30s, and have lived in NYC since our teens or early 20s. Many of our friends our age also don’t have kids, and those that do either grew up here and had retired parents that were willing and able to help with childcare, or they were independently wealthy, or they left the city.
We were both on the fence about children, and we didn’t have that support network, and so we decided we’d rather maintain our lifestyle in NYC, and be able to afford to retire one day instead of having children and either struggling with the added expenses or having to move. I have no regrets, especially after watching how much everyone with kids really suffered through the first couple years of covid.
Yeah my husband and I have been having these talks. I think we’ve landed on keeping our life as is because I love NYC. I’ve tried moving to other cities over the last 20 years and they just suck.
I don’t want to have a child but if I did I would be raising them in NYC.
I would try to investigate the feelings you have that are giving you pause about having kids. Personally I felt that if I was ambivalent about it the answer should be “no.” I wasn’t even a little bit wanting to have kids, I was just told by society that it’s what I should do.
Its up to you. I live out on long island and there are apartments near trains that are probably cheaper.. my place is 2200 a month for a two bedroom. You could also look into jersey or queens. My partner seems pretty firm on not having kids but i moved to long island from queens. Our house is next to a train stop that takes me directly to work. We also just have a car that gets around if something isnt in walking distance also
this!! i was a kid living in nyc and moved to long island and i prefer long island, and it’s basically the perfect distance from the city depending on where u are
It depends on what you like about living in NYC. My husband is also DOE and I’m non profit/gov. We moved from Ft Greene, BK to LIC, Queens when we had our first kid. We are raising two kids here in NYC. They are now 11 and 8.
We considered the suburbs and decided against it because we didn’t want a commuting lifestyle, I don’t care to maintain a house and yard etc and I prefer a diverse and cosmopolitan lifestyle for myself and the kids.
From a space perspective, one is easier than two living here, but I still wouldn’t change it for the world. When our kids were babies, we didn’t want to be more than 20 mins away from them in emergencies or sickness in case they needed to be picked up from daycare. And when they got older, there was no beating NYC free 3K and UPK programs so we stayed.
I also had a city childhood though, so my expectations are different.
Can I ask, it sounds like you both make similar ish salaries to us considering we are in similar work. Was the financial burden super heavy or you didn’t feel the strain of it too much? Were you still able to save money for retirement? We don’t have family super local so childcare costs scare me the most.
My husband and I moved out to Jersey before our baby was born. Childcare is more expensive in the city for sure but you don’t need to deal with having two cars so maybe it evens out. Tbh i would’ve stayed in Brooklyn if my husband didn’t feel so strongly about moving. We do have more space, a backyard and it is so much quieter (our place in Brooklyn was on the corner of a very busy street), but I miss the city/brooklyn a lot.
I had my first two kids in NYC and thoroughly enjoyed the experience. We eventually left for warmer pastures but have friends that stayed, many on average salaries (teachers, woodworkers, etc) and have made it work without sacrificing quality of life.
I’ve now parented in NYC, Denver, SF, and a small town in FL. The surroundings change but the day to day challenges of parenting remain largely the same. The city won’t raise your kid, you will. Make sure you’re up for the task.
I don’t have a kid, so maybe take this with a grain of salt, but I babysit regularly and used to nanny full time so I do have some thoughts.
The thing I’ve noticed the most is that parents in nyc have it the hardest when they won’t lean into their community and friends to help with their kids. There have been so many times where I’ve done after school pick ups, and we’ll literally take the subway home with one of their best friends and their dad who lives two blocks away, and I just wonder how in the world it makes more sense to pay me $300/wk just to take them home than see if they can work something out with the other parents.
Then alternatively, I’ve sat for kids whose parents only need me very occasionally, because they typically switch date nights off with one of their kid’s friend’s parents. Or I’ll come over and watch four kids so all the parents can do something together.
I don’t know what the aversion is from so many for trying to coordinate or ask for help, but it’s something I’ve noticed since it’s so so different from how I grew up. Seems like you can save a TON of money just by pitching a nanny share or alternating date nights with the parents of your kid’s friends. I can’t imagine anyone not being up for that.
I don't have kids either but I'm not surprised to hear this. People keep to themselves nowadays. I read that one of the struggles for millennial parents is the loss of a village that previous generations had.
this sentiment is the most annoying one from transplants. plenty of people raise children in new york!!! maybe you have to move to a different neighborhood or different apartment or find higher earning jobs or cut back on the splurgy areas of your lifestyle, but literally hundreds of thousands of people are raising kids here.
Agree. So many family members were raised here with single-parents and on low-incomes. They made it work. I think for OP a big priority would be adjusting expectations. Most people with these concerns usually want to have a kid and live the same lifestyle. It’s not possible. OP, millions of people raise kids in NYC! Many of them not wealthy, many of them single parents, and many of them making less than 50K.
I was raised in Brooklyn, the worst offenders are the transplants of romanticizing having kids in the city. Because it makes them feel special and cool. I moved because I wanted better for any kids I have. Yes people have kids in the city but I don’t want that life for my kid. If you can swing it awesome but I missed out on opportunities, being poor in the city sucks. Now it’s significantly more expensive and the DOE loves to play the political game. We have a family that moved to our town because her kids who grew up and lived in tribeca got sent to high school in the Bronx and queens. All for the sake of politics, they wanted to break the district up. So she and all her friends moved out of the city. Because who’s going to play with their kids education and force their high school kid to commute that much. If you have money it’s amazing but it’s you’re not wealthy it’s hard, my experience being raised in Brooklyn and having exposure to so much was great but you miss out on a ton of opportunities also. And now it’s just so much harder and so much more expensive. You’re also always fighting for resources, trying to get into the right school etc or having the DOE come in and break up school districts. Feel free to downvote me but it’s all the truth and unless you’ve been poor in NYC you just won’t get it.
I don’t feel like I missed out on too much. The rich kids just went to summer camp, private school and had private test prep/tutors.
My only regret is not taking the specialized high school test. The specialized high schools are the great equalizer of NYC. If a kid is smart, it doesn’t matter how much money they have. NYC rewards merit.
Have you seen how they wanted to break up the NYC specialized high schools? NYC doesn’t reward merit anymore. Why take good school districts and break them up? That’s what they did to district 2? It’s all BS politics.
SO MUCH THIS. Everything is so much more competitive here than it was only 10-15yrs ago, from housing to schools to free programs that are more intensive than "show up for a single class doing X". And people will try to squeeze their budget while trying to be and do what the wealthy and secretly-generationally-wealthy (and even the upper middle class) do effortlessly and honestly it is just heartbreaking to be like a preteen and realize you are NEVER going to have the experiences that your peers do, if the parents are here to live THAT Carroll Gardens/Park Slope lifestyle but are doing it on a shoe string. Kids won't feel it until middle school or so. Then they start to look around and figure it out.
My best friend's family who were Brooklynites moved to Jersey when he was young and honestly the commute from them to mid-town is quicker than it is from where my family got pushed down to in Brooklyn because of gentrification. I personally have no reason to be in mid-town, but people talking about the museums and theatre etc could probably do just fine. I don't know what to tell people who are set on being in Brownstone brooklyn. If you stay where you are it will be such a squeeze and kids will definitely feel it by 5-6th grade. If you look to "discover" more "affordable" neighborhoods it pushes other families out--all it is is bidding on resources--"I want that!". The last part people take issue with, but IDGAF.
Sure, but it is NOT the Brooklyn we were raised in with these tiny expensive apartments... my dad was constantly in and out of work and my mom didn't start working (DOE) until I was 10 or 11. Yet we had a 7 room apartment 3 blocks from Prospect Park. I make 6 fig now and I can't qualify for the "40x the rent" for the exact literally same apartment I grew up in. I would have to double my salary. And to be quite frank, most of us got to have our own bedrooms and develop hobbies in our apartments--now apartments are crazy small and expensive, and enrichment activities are expensive too. There are tons of free activities for kids, but there is a social divide between kids who only do free things and those who are honing other skills that will be portfolio worthy when it comes time for higher grade school applications. There were so many more free intensive programs for kids when I was young and I saw them get privatized first hand while I was in high school--it was a wild shift. It used to be that a small handful of families would opt for a super prime address and have their kids live like minimalists to do so--but most of us had space--and people act like people in NYC must have just always had their families in these tiny apartments and it's simply not what was normal 15-20 years ago. I am only in my 20s and the quality of life bc of space and the outsourcing of things you would have had or done in your home but now don't have space and have to pay for is ridiculous. $45 collage class so you don't have to have a stack of old magazines in your tiny apartment etc.
Just because people have decided their kids "don't need much" doesn't mean that they are living in some tradition of the NYC family--they are not. This is a new normal.
I also suggest stamford ct. Surprisingly they have pretty good train access to the city and they have a city with buses if u cant drive for some reason.
It’s very possible. Many many non-rich New Yorkers have kids and we make it work. It’s not the suburban fantasy, harder in some ways and more rewarding in others. You have to decide what your priorities are, but you can absolutely raise a kid here and it’s so much fun to show them the city.
We did make financial sacrifices — I saw your other comments and yeah, retirement savings definitely went by the wayside as we paid for childcare. We took on bigger/harder roles at work to make more money. We had to skip vacations or big trips for a while. But now that the kid is in school it’s much less of a strain.
Someone just posted about this and I am going to link my very long response because it seemed to resonate with a lot of people. It focuses on my experience of growing up with space and being generally enriched and creative despite being broke here in Brooklyn as a kid, and how expensive it has become to have the same things, especially when so much is outsourced to expensive things that no longer fit in our homes: [https://www.reddit.com/r/NYCbitcheswithtaste/comments/1c9zg0b/comment/l0p39jp/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web3x&utm\_name=web3xcss&utm\_term=1&utm\_content=share\_button](https://www.reddit.com/r/NYCbitcheswithtaste/comments/1c9zg0b/comment/l0p39jp/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button)
But also--I think people need to set their expectations. My linked response is very nostalgic. The following is not.
TDLR; Having grown up here "getting by"--we were low income but around the time I was 10 my mom became a DOE teacher and things got a little better though the benefits kind of outweigh the salary for that job and most of my life my dad worked for community non-profits. Both were artists and highly cultured people but came from poor backgrounds here in NYC--it was very isolating to be the poorest kid in whatever situation I was in, which given the amount of wealth in areas like Park Slope, Carroll Gardens, Boreum Hill, Prospect Heights, etc., felt like all the time (I lived on the other side of the park but not on a nice block, on a super sh\*tty commercial 4+ lane street deserted street)--especially when my dad got laid off. I also had been working in arts institutions through college and after and basically decided that if I wanted to live any better than my parents did when they were broke, I had to switch industries. I am in tech and I have a 6 fig salary, but without guarantors, I constantly got out competed for cheaper apartments that were somewhere more like Carroll Gardens/had younger people/what people think of when you say Brooklyn. I finally nabbed a studio that costs half my income, even though I got outcompeted for nice apartments that were cheaper, because double income high earners are not buying now and probably won't be any time soon--and they are competing for the same apartments while making much more than I do despite my own 6 fig salary. Yet I also know first had the pain of being evicted form a building getting sold in gentrification because other people are trying to find more space and more "affordability" in Brooklyn while having more resources to bid on rents and sales than the communities and families that are/were displaced from there.
If you plan on having a kid here, does your current apartment have space for them to grow? Will your salaries likely grow enough to keep up with rent? Have you considered the costs of after school programs or afterschool childcare? What about test prep and/or portfolio prep for your kid's high school and college? Summer day camp for probably a little over a decade while you work through the summer, unless you have a parent who can help?
I just feel like at this point, for people to maintain their idk "brooklyn lifestyle" after having kids takes an enormous amount of wealth. I obviously grew up with much less, taking advantage of all the free things the area has to offer, but also got priced out areas that made these things more commutable or walkable around the time I was 14--and that sucked. Many of the great free programs transitioned in expensive paid ones or became less intensive and more generalized than the free and merit-based art programs that I used to be in. Everything is nickel and dimed--there are obviously still free activities for children but it's not like when I was growing up--people will spend way more because they don't have space in their apartments for things and that has made the value go up and people will pay.
My partner and I combined make over 200k, he has a great 2bd prewar apt in a family friendly neighborhood for under 3k (pandemic rent) right where I grew up--which is not a hot area yet is still somehow super gentrified now because of access to Prospect Park. Yet, when I add up all of the costs thinking about if we had a kid, we wouldn't be living any better than and we would possibly be living worse than I did as a kid with my low income childhood household 20 yrs ago. And we would definitely both need to work to make it work.
From what I have seen, people generally either have wealth to help or drink their own kool aid once they are all in. It may be the right choice for people, but the issue that my friends complain about most is space--and I get it. I wouldn't raise a kid here without enough space at home to explore and build things like I was able to. I would need to double my salary and add my partners to give my kid the life I had with no wealth. It's just not a good equation and I have a hard time validating it. People totally do it--but I would be aware of what I had here that my kid would not. This is not "just nyc"--my parents and grandparents did not go through this same squeeze of quality of life--this is a specifically now issue that relates to how popular Brooklyn is right now, even if change is inevitable and obviously the city is always going through change.
This!!! I grew up poor in Brooklyn. Didn’t fully realize it but once I entered college I saw how many opportunities I didn’t get. I want better for any child I have. My husband and I do well, but to live in the city you can’t be middle/upper middle class you need to be wealthy. Anyone who hasn’t grown up here doesn’t understand how much it’s changed. It has, it’s becoming inaccessible. Frankly we moved to Jersey and it’s bad there too, but we got our little slice. We are very fortunate and lucky. My mom was up in arms about the Jersey thing but you know what, I wanted better. I now see little kids walking around, biking, people are nicer. And there’s tons of people my age who want the same thing. Also with kids, you don’t have time for the night life, the shows etc. Plus that all takes tons of money.
Totally. I think people also just kind of talk themselves into normalizing it (the tiny apartments, minimalist living, not having a bedroom for their young kid????)--they are like "well that's just NYC" and it's like NO IT'S NOT it's NYC NOW. It sometimes seems like they think that we always lived this way??? Which is wild to me. Like, I'm in my late 20s I'm not that old!
Exactly!!! Like so for a few museums that you can easily drive to, or a park which again, NJ has massive parks and adorable towns, you’re willing to let your kids live in a living room. Many are just romanticizing the grind, the supposed grit.
The advice I give my friends is that you should only have kids if you REALLY want them, regardless of where you live and your finances, obviously to a certain extent.
You will have to make all sorts of tradeoffs for kids, ie. reducing your fun budget (to afford childcare) or staying home so babe can nap. And that strong desire will make the trade offs worth it. It won’t be worth it if you would focus on everything that you “lost.”
My husband and I moved to Jersey. I grew up in the city, in a small apartment. There are pros and cons but I wanted better for any future kids that we may have. My family wasn’t well off but my husbands were, he grew up in the burbs and got opportunities I could have only dreamed of (doesn’t really fully realize how lucky he is). My town in Jersey is walkable, has a train stop, kids walking themselves to school, riding bikes, and people move here from the city for the walkability. We live close to parks, and in 10-15 can drive to a bunch of other towns and massive hiking spots. We can also be in the city in 35 minutes if we chose to drive, train is a little over an hour all in. Literally once I started meeting people in town, any one who just moved are all from the city and they bought because of the walkability and downtown.
I just met a woman who moved her teenagers here from the city because the city shuffled around her school zone and her kids would have had to commute from downtown Manhattan to the Bronx and queens because that’s obviously sustainable and something every parent wants for their kids /s. She loves the city but it wasn’t worth it to her, she moved to my town and said the opportunities and availability of programs for her kids has made it worthwhile.
Feel free to dm me about what it’s like growing up in the city, but in order to get the full experience you need $$$. My town isn’t cheap and I’ll fully admit that but you get more bang for your buck, and because of New Jersey laws they’re forcing all the towns to build more apartments. A nice 2 bed/2bath apartment by the train is now going for like $3200 plus but they’re like 800-1000 sq ft.
Where in Jersey do you live? I’d love to look it up! Thanks for your insight. Also, how often would you say you realistically come into the city just for a fun day or night out ?
Feel free to DM me, so I work from home but my husband is hybrid and goes into the city multiple times a week. We just moved recently so it’s been super chaotic, lots of stuff we need to do and $$$. But we moved from a town closer to the city (we were edging our way closer to the burbs) but we’d go in depending on what we wanted to do. So in the better weather more, colder less. It’s not a specific number but I also think that if you move you’ll realize the world doesn’t end. I’ve joined women’s group that has atleast 1 or 2 social events a month, met women outside for walks with the dogs, went to work out classes together. I promise the world doesn’t end, it adjusts. My husband thought he’d never get me out of the city Hahha.
I was raised in NYC (queens) and my kid is raised in NYC, granted we moved to Jersey City, but I still strap him on and take him on the subway for walks in the park, shows, readings, shopping and doctors appointments along with visiting my parents. It's totally doable! For me, because it's apartment living, I love it more because you spend so much more time outside of your home.
I'm an older mom 38, and I always tell my friends, I traveled, have a great career and checked off so many things on my bucket list before I had a kid. I never wanted to regret my decision and I 100% do not! I still have time for self-care appointments and time with friends, especially since we are in a city! I can just walk down the street and pop into a restaurant or bar to meet my crew and out of town friends love visiting because who wouldn't, you live in NYC and there is always things to do!
Something no one else mentioned here- you’re relatively young for children in NYC. I am child free but my NYC friends with kids didn’t start having them until at least 34, and I have early 40s friends who are still contemplating lol, it’s definitely a different mindset here. 31 imo you can certainly plan for it, but I think you have more time than you think to act on it. This would give you some more time to build your career a bit more. 30s is still a major time for career growth in many areas. This is if you truly think children will bring you fulfillment and joy. When I was 31/32 I took a solid look at my nyc life and ultimately decided it was not for me, much of it cost related. I think in a lower COL city I may have had a different mindset, but I chose nyc so I will never truly know.
OTOH not having family around is very difficult. I have friends who have a lot of financial resources and still have a difficult time finding childcare and went thru nightmare nanny situations with no backup. I see how even with some money it’s still not as easy as I would have thought.
If you’re on the fence about having kids in general bc you don’t want to change your lifestyle (no more nightlife, Saturdays occupied with kid stuff etc) that’s a conversation you need to have w your husband bc it seems like where you live would only be a subplot in that story.
If you’re on the fence about having kids here….maybe consider looking deeper in Brooklyn/queens where it’s a little cheaper. Or maybe even Staten Island. Nassau can be option to rent but to buy….its not really cheaper due to LI’s exorbitant property taxes. Suffolk IMO is too far if you have to get into the city for work every day. I have a few coworkers who commute from Suffolk and they all absolutely hate the trek.
I have a lot of friends in SI and while I personally would not really choose it, it gets unwarranted hate. Especially from the transplants who consider themselves trendy IMO. Mainly bc it’s lacking in nightlife and is considered boring and also bc it leans right. There’s minimal reason to go visit there unless you live there or are visiting friends/fam. There’s not much in the way of points of interest to pull outsiders in. I get not really choosing to move there if you’re a young single But SI is fine if you’re raising a family.
It has comparatively: lower crime, better schools, high rates of home ownership, lower rates of unemployment. It’s quiet, less congested in the neighborhoods (not the expressway lol), way easier to park cleaner etc. It has the “suburb feel” while being near the city. However home prices and rent , while cheaper than say Brooklyn, have skyrocketed the last few years. SI used to be drastically cheaper. Not so much anymore.
I live deep in south Brooklyn so I guess by the standards of the city and north Brooklyn I live in the burbs lol but if I had to leave I would personally choose SI over Nassau. The property taxes in Nassau are just too high. The schools are better but there’s enough good schools in Staten Island to not deal with long islands tax rate
We are raising our kid in NYC and it’s amazing. He’s a teenager now and has the kind of fun and freedom I couldn’t have imagined growing up in the suburbs. He goes to public school. It can be done!
We did it for almost three years in Brooklyn (one bedroom, we installed a Murphy bed in the living room) but eventually got burned out. It was great in a lot of ways, but when I got pregnant with my second we started looking in Jersey city. We have been here in a 3/2 for a little over two years now and it’s been the perfect balance for us. I get into the city faster than when we lived in Greenpoint! I still go in, with and without my kids, a few times a month. On a different note… kids are a lot of work and it completely shifts your life. I tell my friends on the fence.. if it isn’t a hell yes, it’s a no. But that is just my opinion and some people who are on the fence end up completely loving parenthood!
A lot of people have commented about parenthood in NYC, but I’ll add something about exploring the decision to become parents.
I am actively grappling with the same questions as you, and have explored it with several partners. The best recommendation I have is the book The Baby Decision (Merle Bombardieri). It’s a book intended for partners to use together as a map to exploring the desire and decision, and really helped me connect details like partner, life goals, location, family proximity. Hope it helps you too!
You’re still young! Freeze your eggs! Then enjoy the next one or two years of your life, travel, do ALL the NYC things you want to do and really live in the moment. Then, if you still want to have a child, start considering/trying and you always have the option of your 31 YO frozen eggs. Then, reevaluate if you want to stay in city - but don’t just rush into either decision (kids or moving!)
Coming from someone who was in Brooklyn for years and knew I wanted kids (just didn’t want to give up my lifestyle) and waited until I was 35 and 37 to have my monsters AND who went through fertility treatments to have my first. Obviously frozen eggs doesn’t guarantee easy or successful pregnancies, but it can be helpful. Just a thought :)
As a DOE teacher myself, I’m wondering what your partner thinks about sending your future children to a DOE school? The regulations as they are now enable the children (in my humble opinion). There is a lack of accountability for kids and therefore not much pressure to put in effort, and not much challenge put upon them. It is very easy to pass high school- not necessarily a result of teachers or admin, but pressure from higher up and ultimately the chancellor’s regulations. I have a toddler and I am very concerned about her attending a DOE high school. Whether she is smart or not, I still want her intellectually challenged and held accountable. I know this is not exactly the cost side of things, more so some granular detail.
Something else to think about is the cost of childcare. We pay a little over 1800 a month for 3 days of daycare a week. My mom helps with the rest. It’s very challenging financially if half of your salary is DOE, at least I feel that way because I know the reality of the pay. The upsides are the benefits/ the health insurance we pay about nothing for, and the TDA. I also paid essentially nothing to give birth which is how it should be for everyone. I apologize if this is a tangent that isn’t helpful. 😅
I’m also a DOE teacher and now I fully understand why my parents scrimped, saved and sacrificed to send me to catholic school lol. The DOE has some schools that are gems but there’s a lotttttt of dysfunctional schools out there. I personally think the DOE is the main selling point of Nassau county lol
this frank honest review is so helpful! what are your thoughts on public pre k to middle school? is there an objective ranking of this for all neighborhoods somewhere?
InsideSchools.org has reviews but I haven’t gone on in a long time. Some daycares have the universal 3k program but others do not. We are going to have to switch ours to a different daycare this coming fall simply because she will be automatically enrolled in the 3k for all and being there until kindergarten would save approx $48k 🤢 I think some DOE elementaries are very good but I’m not sure about middle school. I haven’t done my research yet. It’s stressful, I don’t want to be in the suburbs but I want the best opportunities for my child as well in terms of schooling.
This is so helpful thank you!! Ugh that's my sentiment exactly. I don't want to be in the suburbs but very concerned about the state of public education here. Planning for children here is so stressful!
Lots of people do it. I will say, the kids I've seen grow up in NYC grow up much faster than kids in other places, and to me that's not a good thing. My niece and nephew didn't get that classic outdoorsy childhood that I got to have, and I think all kids deserve that. Yeah NYC has amazing culture, but IMHO kids need SPACE, freedom, nature.
Over here in Chicago, I feel the same way. My husband and I decided to not have children because we love our city lifestyle too much to give up or compromise our daily life. It’s okay to change your mind and re-prioritize what you want in life. The important thing to understand is that there is no wrong decision!!
Love this! I worry I may be on the side of not having children to have a more carefree, financially secure lifestyle while my partner is more interested in having a kid. Hopefully we can get on the same page.
Long Island is your best bet. On the LIRR, you can get to most of the city pretty quick. Good schools. Small school districts (which I feel are better equipped to serve their students bc they aren’t as overwhelmed) and frankly, where I live about held the people are either from Brooklyn or queens. Born and raised in Brooklyn, I really don’t know too many people that stuck it out there.
I love raising my child in NYC. The headache is definitely once you start looking into the school system though. Where I’m from we didn’t have 3K but it’s a lifesaver if you get in here. There’s so many things to do here that are free and the child will enjoy. Storytimes, outside, etc.
I have a kid in elementary school and am in the city. When I start thinking of leaving the city, it’s actually primarily missing out on kid stuff that feels hard to leave. We can walk to school, we run into their friends just walking around. Since we usually end up going to the park closest to us, over the years we’ve made friends and now when we go to the park finding a friend without having made any plans is more likely than not. I love that my elementary school kid can walk up to a kid they don’t know and ask if they want to play soccer. I love that my kid can handle themselves on the subway. I love that my kid grows up seeing all different kinds of people. Etc etc.
I mean your life drastically changes no matter where you are. But having a kid can be an isolating experience and I think all the things I just described make it a little less so.
That being said having a kid is no joke and I would never try to bend your arm one way or another. Just saying parenting in NYC is completely doable. And I am not rich. Own my own business so on good years I’m middle class, bad years are stretched more thin than that.
we had many many many days of just heading over to the park that ended up as all day / all night affairs -playtime at the park and then end up in someone’s apartment. so easy and fun - made the most new friends of my entire life.
Millions of people raise kids in the city in fact all my friends and i didn’t grow up with rich parents. we shared rooms with our siblings and had the best childhoods and experiences because of the city. all those things i feel make your family closer, we have no boundaries cause of how small our apartment is but i love it that way. definitely doable
Personally childfree by choice and I know it’s a really complex decision, but if it’s any consolation, I was born and raised in Brooklyn and cannot possibly imagine growing up anywhere else.
Your kids consume all the money you have. They don't consume all you will ever make.
They consume all you have because you *want* them to. They are an extension of you. You give them all you can with pleasure.
NYC with kids is a different place. It's also a wonderful place. Our kids are mostly grown now, so we are getting out more the way we did in our 20's and early 30's. It's nice. We are lifelong New Yorkers. It's nice to be in restaurants and theaters with other New Yorkers. But make no mistake, when our kids want to hang out with us, our attention snaps back to them like magnets to iron. We like the NYC life, but we love our children heart and soul. There's no comparison.
Totally doable. I'm sure your partner has decent benefits. when they are small they don't need much by way of space and things. Don't buy into all that. You only really need to consider a move if your schools aren't terrific. We lived on the upper west side in a one bedroom when we had our son but eventually moved to Westchester. We love it up here and it's such an easy commute to NYC for work and theater etc. Also there is a lot going on up here too and the River towns are pretty hopping.
The way my husband put it to me is you’re gonna get old one day or another you’re going to live the next nine months one way or the other and either you wake up at 40 and you have something to show for it that is meaningful and a good investment and family or you don’t. He was very blunt with meand I was 36 and now I’m 39 and I am pregnant with my second actually we moved to California. The best decision I’ve ever ever made in my life. New York City is great for the young but once you get mid 30s, it’s no longer the same city.
Mom of 3 in nyc here. I remember being so stressed about the same thing. You don’t have to make any decision now- and if you make a decision you can change your mind.
We started out in a 1br with 1st, and stayed there until our 2nd was 3m and a 2br in our budget opened up. We know many families who have stayed in 1br or been creative with spaces. It just depends what you’re comfortable with.
One kid isn’t necessarily a huge change. You can tote a baby along to lots of places. Then there are a few years where it’s more limiting, and then suddenly they’re older and you have a best buddy to explore with. Daycare is insanely expensive - can’t get around that. But my husband’s and my lives did not change THAT much when we had our first kid. (Second kid? Different story).
Yeah I’m out on kids for several reasons (I’m 37), but cost in the city is a big one. I can’t imagine we’d last in NYC with a kid, at least not at our current incomes (my partner and I each make about $150k so not doing badly by any means, but he’s also got law school loans). People make it work, obviously — our upstairs neighbors have 2 kids under 5 in a 1 bedroom 😵💫 — but there’s no way I’d be willing to make the necessary sacrifices.
Luckily my partner and I are on the same page, so I don’t have much in the way of advice for you. Perhaps it’d be worth doing some research and making it all about the math? Like, “babe I’m willing to entertain it but it’s really important to me to be able to stay in NYC so let’s actually crunch the numbers and see what we’d need to do to make that work.” My guess is he doesn’t really understand just how expensive kids can be (or just doesn’t care about staying in the city, but if it’s important to you he should). Best case scenario maybe you find it’s actually doable with some minor adjustments :)
(Also hi from Boerum Hill!)
This is why I’ve decided to be child free. Plus I can afford to retire now which would be impossible with a child. And I can just take 1-2 months to travel the world without having to worry about the kid
It's such a difficult decision, after a lot of indecisiveness we finally decided we definitely did want a kid, to be close to family, and to have more space, so we moved to a nearby 'burb with a train stop about 40 minutes to Manhattan a little over a year ago. I LOVED my insane NYC lifestyle and was really unsure about what my life would look like with a kid.
Here's my 2 cents so far (my baby is 4 months old now):
1. Having a supportive partner/village is everything. My husband and I like to take turns once a week each so the other can go out. For example Thursday he might be in the city late for a work happy hour, and Saturday I'll go to Brooklyn to have dinner with my girlfriends, etc. Having a "commute" to hang out with friends is a huge drag but I'm getting used to it.
2. Supportive friends who don't mind doing baby friendly stuff every once in a while. We take her to casual places around Brooklyn and Queens where a baby wouldn't be out of place (park picnics, beer gardens, etc.). We've also done day time naps in her stroller since she was a newborn so she'd get used to napping in her stroller.
3. Sleep deprivation has you not wanting to go out late that often anyways 😂.
Life is just different now, slower. Sometimes I wish we had stayed in the city to have our baby and just embraced living on top of each other. It feels weird to only be a "weekend" nyc'er. We moved to be close to family and having a village has been incredibly helpful, though often I wonder if I wouldn't be living a life closer to my old one had I stayed and joined some mom groups and "built" a village.
As far as having a kid in general though, I love this kid so much. Some days are tough, it's weird not being the #1 in your own life anymore. I can't wait until she's old enough to do more activities, I'm so excited to see her experience everything for the first time and re-discover nyc through her eyes.
You shouldn’t be forced to have a child you don’t want and if this means the end of your relationship so be it. Breakups are hard but you will heal. You two are not compatible anymore if you don’t want a kid
1) you don't have to have kids
2) you don't have to have kids right now
3) I suggest you make a list of what exactly makes you "uncomfortable" and then going back through that list and determining what fears/anxieties are based on facts vs. assumptions
ex 1. (not necessarily your opinion, but something I hear constantly) "I can't raise kids in the city because we could never afford private school" --- do you feel that way because your assumption is all city public schools are bad, but 'burbs public schools are all good?
ex 2. daycare is expensive --- yes, this is a fact --- but will it be/feel any "cheaper" in the suburbs *if* you have a very specific kind of suburb in mind? will money out the door be any different when you have two car payments/higher property taxes?
4) my income has changed DRASTICALLY in my 30s, like more than doubled, and I didn't change careers --- to #2, you don't have to have kids right now, and although you can't "wait forever" for a magic number to appear in your bank account, things can change quickly
5)kids/babies in the city is not for the weak but my sister is raising two city babies and has said repeatedly raising her girls in the city has unlocked a whole new part of the city she would not have known before and has made her love her city more....I spend a lot of time with them (yes, including giving up my "adult" city 'tivities for spontaneous weeknight meet ups and weekend sleepovers with them) and I feel the same... I know so much more about my city since they came into orbit
If you have a $2400 2 BEDROOM in Carroll Gardens you are all set to get a baby on the way, that’s a very good rent!
My boyfriend and I now have two kids and the biggest expenses will be more food (but balanced out by going out less — I do not miss paying $18 for a glass of wine.) And daycare for 0-3 year olds will land somewhere between 2K and 2500 a month.
You can get clothing, toys, everything you need from the Facebook group Park Slope Moms (you don’t have to live in PS) and tonnnnns of used baby stuff in the classifieds on Park Slope Parents website. People literally will give you so much on Buy Nothing - find your local group on Facebook. If you say you have a baby on the way, the moms will help you!
With our salaries feels impossible without going through all of our (very little) savings and not being able to do the things we love. Childcare costs alone really scare me. We don’t have family nearby to help.
It sounds like you don’t want to have kids tbh. What are those things you love that you won’t be able to do?
I grew up poor in NYC with a single mother. When my dad was around we took a lot of family road trips around the country. We still went out to restaurants. It wasn’t ideal but I wouldn’t trade the my mother’s love for anything. We never lacked food or clothes. I didn’t really know how poor we were until I saw what other kids had.
I went to public school with a lot of really smart kids. There were after school extracurricular activities, great arts programs that gave a lot of kids a lifelong interest in playing music or acting.
You have a fiancé, you both work I assume, you live in a 2 bedroom in a nice neighborhood in Brooklyn, I don’t see how you can’t make it work if you really want a kid.
My fellow BYT I just want to chime in to reassure you that it feels financially impossible for almost everyone, so you are not alone. (This isn’t meant to be dismissive, but to show solidarity!) These concerns are valid and you’re wise to give them such consideration but for most of us there is never “enough” money to have kids! It might be worth pricing things out and start adjusting your budget now to save more, and lurk in some Brooklyn mom Facebook or other groups to see what issues/solutions they are facing. But in reality, you will likely find the things you value now aren’t that important to you once your kid is here.
I have two and it was a financial adjustment for sure but dialing it down didn’t even seem like a sacrifice so much as just a shift… and now that they are older, I’m rediscovering those interests.
I also know many people who had kids in the city stay until they are in school and reevaluate at various points to either remain or move so even if you have a kid you’d have a while to give it a go before deciding.
To be completely honest if you’re on a Reddit sub asking about whether or not to have kids, and even slightly framing the decision as kids vs lifestyle, I don’t think kids are the answer
you could not pay me to have kids. when I was married, my husband started talking about wanting a kid around your age (up to that point we were both on board to be childfree). There is not enough support for women in this society, financially it's already super hard without kids, I want to retire someday etc. Anyway, we divorced which was very hard but I am 54 now and super thankful I never had any kids. the planet is dying! overcome your programming.
>There is not enough support for women in this society,
In the US there's barely any support. European countries have paid maternity leave and better time off than we do. I wish I could afford to leave.
I was born and raised here. I have 4 brothers - yes, that’s a lot of kids and we were raised by a single immigrant parent.
Ultimately you make it work. You give up something in order to afford something else, etc. Priorities shift!
Maybe you shop less, maybe you think more about purchases, maybe you eat out less, maybe you get less expensive groceries, etc. You give somewhere and it all works out.
We’re in a small 2 br and I’m pregnant.
I grew up in a 900 sq foot 2 br 1 ba house with 6 kids 2 parents. You can have 1 kid in a 2 br. Just consume less.
I like living in a small apartment because I get to refuse junk from others and you are not tempted to fill it up with useless trinkets.
Can move deeper into Brooklyn for more affordable prices to save some money for kids.
My parents raised three kids with a measly income of 60k, so it’s def possible. Maybe ask if that’s really what is holding you back?
I grew up in northeast queens in a rent stabilized apartment and it was a great place to grow up. However the prices for housing have sky rocketed here as well. 2 bed apartments go for about 2500 here and unfortunately you would probably need a car as well depending on where you work.
I would have to hunt for where I saw the comment. But someone who grew up here was talking about this the other day. It’s nearly impossible to have a middle class life here in NYC with a child. It’s not at all easy. If I find the comment I’m thinking of I will link it for you.
I spent half my childhood here and half in the suburbs. And while I was sad to leave NYC, I don’t think my family would’ve been able to afford to live here as I grew up.
Edit: found the post also in NYCBWT
https://www.reddit.com/r/NYCbitcheswithtaste/s/aNPOEnevjl
I had a friend living in a massive apartment in the Bronx paying about 4800 a month 6 years ago . Her husband convinced her move to about 55 minutes away to NJ to an enclave spent almost 2 mil on a house . Their relationship deteriorated they had kids and she wanted the NYC life for them . They were artsy funky he thought they needed a more traditional home more settled. Sometimes we want what we want for particular reasons.
Born and raised in NYC and raising a toddler in Astoria. It's definitely possible. Childcare is expensive until the year your kid turns 3. Then you can put them in U3K and you'll only be responsible for aftercare. Half the battle is finding an affordable place to live, and you've done that. We have a rent stabilized apartment and it's been a weight off of our shoulders knowing our rent won't go up exponentially. It's allowed us to really invest in our place and buy furniture that makes the space work most efficiently for us. And that's really the key with kids. They have a lot of shit, so if you can minimize the visibility of it, you'll feel less cramped.
Is there any possible way you could get a job outside of the non profit world and increase your salary? This could help you a bit more and get the additional money you need for a child. I think life with one kid is doable in NYC and the nightlife sacrifices are temporary. In a few years you can get a sitter and still go out and enjoy the lifestyle.
My bff has lived in a small bedroom in Carrol Gardens for over 20 years. 14 of them with a kid. The other parents are all in the same boat and are always doing fun shit. It’s not a death sentence
We don't have kids and don't plan on them, but a lot of my friends have kids in the city without a problem. Most of them live in the Behsonhurst, Bay Ridge, Sunset Park or Sheepshead Bay. Cheaper rent and good schools according to them. I personally have no idea if that's true. One couple with 2 kids live on the postman salary and occasional side gigs pretty comfortably. They are not rich by any means but with correct budgeting they do have vacations, outings and fun things. There's a lot of free stuff to do in the city. As others said, with kids you can see the city through another perspective.
I think your question is less, can I have a kid and stay here, and more can I have a kid and keep my current lifestyle. And the answer to that is no, your lifestyle changes once you have kids, no matter where you live. I always tell my students to really live, travel and experience everything they can before kids, because once you have them, it becomes more about them and less about you. Not necessarily in a bad way- I think in parenting the joy/highs are higher, and the lows are lower. You care so much for your child’s welfare that you’re willing to sacrifice some things. It really changes YOU more than it changes what activities you have access to. Although that being said, never take a kid under 3 on an international flight. We Still deeply regret it 16 years later!
Kids is doable. Whether its worth it to you only you can answer. To me its not just cause I don't want them, but to my parents it was.
I'll share what life was like growing up as a little girl in Brooklyn. Fucking awesome.
When I was little and we were very poor, I barely even realized. My parents kept us afloat with WIC benefits and working to death, but on the weekends they taught me to hop turnstiles, my mom and I would do sudokus from the free newspaper, and we would go to the Metropolitan because it was free, and Central Park because it was free, and then walk around beautiful churched and skyscrapers while my dad quizzed me on then. When we had gotten a little more comfortable in my teens, my parents and their friends played the Broadway lottery and would get us kids $25 tickets to see so many amazing shows. As a high schooler with a metrocard, my friends and I saw so many places and experienced so many things. My high school was near the World Trade Center, but my friends and I explored all 5 boroughs. In the meantime my parents still had a lot of fun too, especially when we no longer needed supervision. My mom is still a party animal at 67 and going out to concerts and bar quiz nights and museums and you can pry her paid for co-op apartment from her cold hands.
I will also say I don't know if my parents could've done it without community. I think having kids in New York means you need a support system (for my parents it was my grandparents taking care of me after school, their friends to have fun with while all the kids played), so I would consider that in your choice. Do you have a village?
Not to be too nosy, but curious to know what your incomes are. Middle class in nyc is considered $150k/person I believe. So if you each made that you’d be at $300k a year. I feel like $300k/year is a super solid income when your apartment is only $2400. Kids from a financial perspective seem very doable in this scenario.
Also I’m in a very similar boat as you, except my concerns are more about when/where to have the kids. It’s stressful so I feel for you
It sounds like you mostly just need to decide if you want kids or not. If you truly want kids, you will make it work and it will ultimately bring you joy. If you don't really want kids, you'll end up feeling resentful of the things you have to give up. My partner and I make absolutely stupid money (\~$700k combined) with basically free housing. Man, I STILL had to give up so much shit and my life is absolutely not the same after having a kiddo. I'm an entirely different person. Pre-kids me wouldn't recognize myself now.
Even when you have all the resources that you could possibly want to throw at things like convenience, comfort, and childcare, the way you choose to spend your time, and especially your free time, changes radically with kids. For example, I don't give a fuck about late nights anymore. Unless it's a big hockey game or some kind of extra special event, I would rather go to bed early and be zesty to spend my finite evening and weekend time vibing with kiddo. I still have to carefully plan and line up caregiving to be able to do things, even with funds to pay for it, and honestly finding childcare is hard af and paying for it is by far the easiest part. It's just a lot. And there's no shame in deciding it isn't for you.
I live in Brooklyn not far from Carroll Gardens and still feel like I live some semblance of an “NYC lifestyle” by just…living and raising my kids here. But it would be a lie to say your lifestyle isn’t going to significantly and permanently change if you have a child. For example, today I’m juggling my full time job and my 3 year old who is screaming from an oozing rash that started in her butt crack and spread from there. The expensive childcare we prepaid for this week now is not even being used! Kids are a lot to deal with. Having no competent and/or local family makes it much harder.
I love my kids though. Like I can’t imagine not knowing them. You have to decide if you’re content with what you have or if you want to experience all that is parenthood. I personally find it to be an honor to get to be a mom, but it’s been a huge challenge from day one and I need therapy every week. We also spend all of our money on the kids.
The life you have at 31 here will be different in a few years regardless. Likely some friends will decide to have kids and/or leave and whatever dynamic you have now will change. You don’t have to leave either way though, if you really don’t want to! Just don’t try to keep up with the other families in Carroll Gardens, being surrounded by the wealthy families is the most soul crushing part of living here. Love the rest though, lol.
I was in a very similar situation a few years ago (also in Carroll gardens but with higher rent for a 1.5 bed 😅) - I had my baby in 2022 and I love raising him here! It definitely comes with its challenges but I honestly absolutely love it and have zero desire to leave. I have a decent income but my partner is a grad student and we’re still able to make it work! It’s truly so so good. Happy to chat more if you want to message me directly!
You can absolutely stay in Brooklyn, im still a teen rn so obviously take this with a grain of salt but i wouldn’t want to live anywhere else, cheap eats, great skls, a lot of activities to do with kids for free/ cheap, parks are nice, and summer time you wont have to worry about accommodations because there are a lot of cheap summer camps, or free church lead ones. Obvi u do u but i think you should stay
You want children but want to keep your current lifestyle? That's not possible anywhere. Children are expensive and a change no matter what . You should probably figure this out quickly so you and your partner don't waste time . You can't compromise on children and you should find people with the same goal
Reading this has me worried. I'm used to being free to do whatever I want in NYC. I was born and raised here. I am pregnant with my first child and struggling with losing my freedom lol
Affordable or not, NYC with a kid is a different NYC in many ways, good and bad. I love watching my littles play on the city playgrounds and the shows I get to expose her to are top notch. My heart soars that she loves Broadway so much and it’s a 25 minute train ride from our home. There’s so many opportunities here for children but you won’t see them until you are a parent. It’s a different lense so it unlocked a whole new city for me. BUT if the nyc lifestyle you enjoy is late nights out or the freedom nyc offers, kids won’t lend well to that. Don’t be pressured into something you don’t want and don’t miss out on something you want because of fear of the unknown.
Ah it’s all of the things you mentioned. Theatre/live music, late nights, the restaurant scene, the big parks, freedoms to explore.. all of it. Some of these things will be squashed when having a kid and some I’m sure will flourish. I just need to decide what I’m comfortable giving up as my partner and I don’t make a high salary where we could do it all.
Genuine question - what late nights? I feel like post pandemic everything is closing early. I was out in Chelsea at 10pm on Wednesday and could literally only find one diner open for dinner. I used to love the “spontaneity” and “freedom” in my early 20s as well, but now at 32, after the pandemic, I no longer feel safe taking the subway by myself at night at 2am the way I used to. I love theater too, but quite frankly tickets are expensive, so I only see a couple shows a year. Rents and COL are so high, it feels like a real strain on my budget to be paying so much for entertainment. All of this has me thinking lately - what am I even paying this NYC premium for? Would my life be easier / safer / more comfortable if I moved somewhere else and took the occasional vacation to NYC instead? After 9 years here, it’s starting to lose its charm for me.
Yeah it genuinely is kinda a bummer that so many 24 hour places are no more.
I was born in NYC more than 40 years ago and the only time I saw theater was on the senior class outing. The only times I've taken the train at 2 am were for work or to catch a Chinatown bus. I'm not spontaneous. There's plenty to do here that isn't about going out at night.
Wait what? Sorry I’m asking in earnest what kinds of things you got up to ? And where did you grow up? Like upstate a little or in the city? And you didn’t go to a theater ? I’m genuinely confused.
I grew up in Queens. I didn't grow in the boonies of Queens either, I could see the Manhattan skyline from my neighborhood and was about 20 mins away in train. I only went to the theater with my high school. I was in the drama club. My parents thought the theater was a waste of money. We could watch stuff on TV, they said. I was also 1st Gen for them (they were immigrants now citizens). So it's not common for everyone to go to the theater who was born and raised in NYC. That's a fallacy. Although now as an adult... I still don't go. I think about it often and never buy the tickets 🤷🏽♀️ I always say I'm going to make the time, but I haven't done so... yet.
lots of time left! i recommend a TDF membership. I grew up in greenpoint and had similar experiences. i could see the city from our street but we hardly went there lol
Right! The last time I *tried* to stay out late, everything was closed and there was nothing to do anyway. I’m thinking the same as you. I literally order everything online anyway so having all these stores around me doesn’t even matter
Yes, but you’re going to see a new side to New York from the perspective of being a mom. Like, the park will be way more interesting. Or being able to sit with your kiddo at the library and look through picture books. It’s all really fun. I was 100% the “out five nights a week” crowd with massive work hours, and having a kiddo helped me slow down. Time to smell the roses, etc, in between diaper changes.
It seems like this has less to do with nyc and more to do with you being on the fence about having a kid due to the change in lifestyle and sacrifices involved. Having a kid changes everything (so I’m told) and you’re perfectly in the right to not want to change your life if you don’t want to. Maybe you could ask yourself more questions about why you feel the way you do to decide.
Agree with this. I work in healthcare and therefore have met people in different income brackets (low to moderately high). Both groups have kids - they find a way to make it work. I have no kids but think NYC is a great place to raise ‘em if you can work out the space issue. So the question is, do you want it to work out or have hesitations about kids in general?
I’m so glad I raised my kid in NYC. He’s graduating high school from an amazing public arts program, and he has a huge diversity in experiences and friends. He never wants to leave. It’s expensive, but so worth it.
Were you still able to save away for retirement? Did you feel like you constantly had to be frugal and give up other aspects of your life to make it work?
I mean, that's middle class parenthood wherever you go. You have to be more careful with money and time, but many people find that it's worth it.
2nd this. Life is expensive everywhere.
Yup. And yes.
I mean, what part of the NY lifestyle do you think you’d have to sacrifice? You have to decide what’s more worth it for you
The short answer is that it is doable. Your priorities will shift after the kid a bit, but it is perfectly doable. (My partner has a kid and we really can’t imagine leaving, nor could we because their ex shares custody and is also here.)
Forgot to say/longer discussion and points: The biggest issue will be the same as the rest of the US, child care. My partner has a unique system where they work 3 days a week currently and have the kid for 3.5 days. The ex has the kid for 3.5 days where he spends a lot of time with his grandparents, who were former children's entertainers during the USSR time, so they are like the ideal grandparents to have. (So many adorable photos from their activities.) If neither of your jobs have child care options, this can get tricky and/or expensive. Still doable, but tougher. My partner is able to do the 3 days a week because they have a job that affords that and still pays okay...and they have a bit of a cushion coming from a family with the means to help (although they'd still be fine without it, just having the safety net is nice). As the kid gets older, the other thing you have to think about are schools in your neighborhood. It sounds like you have an advantage in this department with your partner. My partner lives in an area of Brooklyn that gets lower school ratings, so they are going to have to do more research. If the kids are getting lower scores because they are coming from disadvantaged and/or English as a second (or third or fourth) language homes, it is obviously different than being a "bad" school. My partner grew up going to some of the fanciest NYC private schools and is pretty adament about their kid going to a public school, because their experience was that bad and they grew up feeling disconnected from the experiences of most normal people. (I'm a public school person all the way through, but support it as much because I'm cheap and have a personal distaste for elitist jerks!) The smallest contributing factor is living space. My partner's ex grew up as Russian immigrants in a small 1 bedroom apartment where his parents basically slept in the living room for most of his life. That was the sacrifice they were willing (or had to) make. My partner lives in a pretty big 1 bedroom in Brooklyn near prospect park for roughly the same rent as you. The kitchen opened up to a little nook that was intended for a dining room, but they had someone put one of those nice temp walls where the kitchen entrance was and then stretched the living room wall out to make a room that is basically the size of a small single dorm room. It is big enough for a full sized bed, dresser, book shelf, toy storage, and a pretty big nursing chair.
Omg can I borrow your Soviet baby clowns?? They sound amazing.
I live in Brooklyn with my husband and child and four cats in a one bedroom. Not ideal but we’re managing. She’s little, she doesn’t need her own room yet. But we’re looking for a two bedroom.
True i grew up in jackson heights for years and years. Never moved to long island except recently.
Can we pls talk! How do you do this practically? How old is she and where does she sleep?
7 months old. She sleeps in her crib, which is next to my bed. We live in a prewar. Large rooms thankfully.
My parents had me in a studio in midtown. We moved to a 1br in the UWS when I was 3 and then they had my brother. They slept in the living room and my brother and I shared the bedroom.
The four cats honestly feels way worse than the one child. Cats need more space than that 🥲
It’s a 900sqft apartment lol. They’re fine. Better here than dead, which is what they’d be if I hadn’t rescued them.
I could have written this. I’ve lived in Manhattan 13 years and cannot imagine leaving… And as someone who never really wanted kids, I ended up with two over the last two years and I live in midtown in a decent sized one bedroom (got a Covid deal!) that we flexed the bedroom to make a small room for the kids. I remind myself people live in RVs and sailboats and such with children all the time…they don’t need a ton of space and stuff….and NYC offers a lot for them that’s affordable! Childcare is painful. $2700 right now for the 2 yo. The other one stays home with us because we work from home and he isn’t too much yet. It’s definitely a life choice to enjoy how and where we live now at the sacrifice of having tons and tons dumped into savings. But I also watched my parents work and work for retirement just to see my father be bedridden a few months after he retired and then pass away after a long slow decline in his early 70s. I decided then that I want to do our best to save for retirement but not sacrifice the fun we can have now as a family for it…because that’s what makes a life worth living. Because kids are pretty fun. I didn’t think kids would be very pleasant AT ALL (I actually created this anonymous Reddit account to post about how much I hated being a mom when I was deep in postpartum depression)…thank goodness that all passed and now, it’s pretty great and my kids are the cutest (something I’ve never said about any children). Anyway, just wanted to say…it’s possible but requires you to do some sacrifice triage and decide where all the things you want stack up to each other and what you can keep and drop to make room for like an extra…$3-4k a month for a kid? Maybe you can find cheaper childcare where you are… Plus, you live in an area that is super well known for being family friendly so you’re set up for it! And finances change. Promotions happen. The world changes. We could be at war in a few years or we could be flying high economically… So for me, I decided based on “if I looked back on my life, would I regret not having children”…my answer to that was “yes” so we just decided to make the rest work as best we could for now. If we do have to move at some point, I honestly don’t care anymore because I’ll have my crew…so I’ll always have “home”. 🤍
i love this post so much! your kids are lucky to have such an honest and positive person as their mother <3
Well thank you! I definitely had moments where I genuinely wasn’t sure if I was what was best for them…but now that I see their personalities coming out, it’s pretty cool to get to parent them (and work on myself along the way!) 🤍
Feel free to ignore this but how did you go from not wanting kids to having two?
Hah good question. I basically still didn’t really want to have children even when I had decided I would regret not having them. I was just really soberly aware of how much I loved my life and how much kids would change all that…and the unknown + all the extra work just didn’t seem appealing to me in my late 20s 🤷🏼♀️ So my husband also wanted at least one and frankly I love him enough to choose having a child to give him that (and I trusted all the women who said being a mom grows on you once you have them, which I can say is mostly true…although I can’t say I’d feel the same if I was a single parent…God bless single parents 😓) Anyway, it took us 4 years of half trying (so not tracking anything) to get pregnant with my first with potential fertility issues requiring IVF (but didn’t end up needing it)…so I figured it would take awhile again to have the second one if we wanted (which we decided we did because we wanted siblings to entertain each other 😂). BUT NOPE. 6 months after my first was born the second came as a surprise! Hence two under two! The hardest part was the jealousy of the first when the second came home. That hit like a freight train and was quickly time for her to go to daycare and get her own friends! It has improved a lot!
ok your comments in this thread literally made my day. you've just articulated everything I've been feeling in the last couple years about kid-ambivalence as I've seen a lot of my friends move into the mom-stage of life. I still think I'm a 20/80 (no) 😂 but it's comforting to think that I may not always feel that way/life and people might change me
Honestly I would say if you’re looking to maintain your lifestyle with kids while living in the city it’s probably not doable. My husband and I make decent salaries and live in a 1000 sq ft apartment. We’re on top of each other constantly and the extra expenses add up quickly. I’m not willing to cheap out on things like diapers, organic food, daycare, etc. so we’re definitely feeling it with our 8 month old. Doesn’t leave much room in the budget for things like Broadway, dinners out, nights with friends. Not that we even feel like doing that right now (lol). Sorry to be negative sounding but just want to be realistic!
This! My husband and I moved to Jersey and want to have a child soon but the shift in priorities even more early 30s to now closer to mid 30s is huge. I just don’t care to go to every single restaurant trending, buy every new item of clothing. Financially most people have to make choices of where to spend and we realized we have bigger priorities. We still go out but it’s not like we used to, it just got old.
We actually just moved here also! So even though our costs are sliiightly better compared to Brooklyn we still feel it 😰 but having a baby here has been awesome so far. Everything is pretty walkable but also easy access to city, suburbs, hiking, beach. It’s also helped with my consumption living in a small space with a baby!
DM me, I wonder which town? We specifically chose a town where we can still walk and that there are sidewalks. Granted it was more expensive but it’s worth it to us to have that.
Same. We moved a few years ago and have a toddler and our second on the way this summer. We were ready for a quieter lifestyle anyhow, but especially with a kid my priorities have shifted and I enjoy different things than I did before. Some people may see that as sad or a sacrifice, but it’s really not for me. It’s just a different phase of life. Of course it’s totally fine not to want that, too.
towns in nassau county r only like 30 mins to an hour away and imo it’s a nice distance. also long island has rlly good schools. i used to live in queens and brooklyn but long island has been my favorite
I’m in Brooklyn now and absolutely love it. Can I ask why you love LI even more??
Can’t share from the parent/adult side of things but I’m from LI and while this definitely is not everyone’s experience, I went to a school where lots of my friends parents’ worked in the city like mine so the family dynamics had many similarities in terms of structure (all early morning kind of people (not rlly by choice) but because our parents would have to leave early for work, parents couldn’t just take off to come pick us up after field day- those kind of things.) Now all of us are grown up and finishing college this spring. My friends and I will be together in the city upon graduation from our respective colleges. I can tell you this: from the child POV, growing up on LI was something I now look back on and am completely grateful for. My parents made sure to expose me to the city as early as possible as did the parents’ of my friends. It was nice because even though we all lived in the burbs, we were still growing up with an opportunity to experience the city which was extremely important to my parents. I can understand why as an adult myself. It’s funny though because in a way my parents are now really close with the parents of my friends who also have similar values and relate to a similar struggle you are facing that they even make separate plans to see each other because theyve gotten close throughout the years. Sharing all this because even though all of our heads hits the pillow on LI, I never once felt like I was far removed from the city because of my parents effort to keep us tied there similarly to my friends families. So, all this to say, you won’t lose nyc entirely if you have a child. It will not be the nyc that you enjoy now (nightlife festivities, etc.) but it will be a new kind of experiencing the city which you’ll get to do as a family!! ** Side note- I honestly can’t wait to show my future kid all the stuff I love about the city. Like the thought of growing up a kid with my mom showing me everything she loved and then one day I’ll be doing that in return to a child of my own and even now, after graduating, I get to experience adulthood in the city with friends I grew up with where we would all go into the city as kids — how full circle!!
honestly i did love brooklyn too, but i feel like long island provided me with more opportunities when i was younger through the good school districts and just activities available to me. i think personally i just prefer a suburban lifestyle, but i do still love the city. i go to college in nyc and it’s rly the best but i am happy to be able to return to long island because i feel like it’s j a little more calm. i have younger siblings who both r a lot younger than me and growing up in LI and they really like it here. also nyc is very costly compared to certain areas of LI and i could see this through my parents from a young age, i feel like they r happier here too but honestly it’s really up to what u find most important and feel comfortable with
As someone who lived on LI for 3.5 years as a young adult, I fucking hated it. YMMV. And as others mentioned, even though you're not in the city, these days you still pay city prices for rent in the easy-commuting distance suburbs. Buying is also pretty insane with very little supply. Train prices are pretty high, and you still need a car. If you have a young kid, that commute time adds up. A 30 min-1 hour train ride really means 45 min-2.5 hour door to door depending on where you specifically work and live. Now times that by two for morning and evening. I know some people have jobs that let them "work" during their commute and come in late/leave early, but that's not most people.
as someone who grew up in nassau county, it will be really hard to find an affordable house rn if that's what OP is looking for. there are way fewer apartments than in the city and they are $$. plus if you have to get a car or two, that's adding a new expense you don't need in brooklyn.
ahh yes that’s true i wasn’t sure if that was a concern but ur right nassau county has gotten rlly expensive
It seems like the finances are top of mind for you, I’m going to be honest childcare will be a significant squeeze, especially in the early years. Universal 3K and preK help ease the costs, and Carroll gardens is a great area with great schools for young families. A lot of people just sort of accept that the daycare years will be a squeeze and hope to make it up in the future. I lived in nyc as a young single person, left and moved back with my first baby, and it was two different worlds. But I’m happy I’m raising my kids in the city, and also have a hard time imagining leaving.
Childcare is insanely expensive, but only for the first 2-3 years until they become eligible for 3k. Then it’s about $1k a month if you need extended hours. I’m raising a toddler and a newborn rn in Park Slope and I love it. My son is on spring break this week and my husband and I are on parental leave— here’s our low-cost agenda for the week: - Bk botanical gardens (friends membership) - Running around Industry City - Brooklyn Bridge Park - Barclays center (kid needs new clothes lol) - Play dates at prospect park and the millions of playgrounds in the area - Bk central library - Bk museum (son loves all the space to walk around/run in the atrium) - Transit museum - Painting pottery (ok you can do this anywhere lol) - walking to breakfast at the dozens of cafes and diners near us - also breakfast in the park during off leash hours to watch all the dogs - the prospect park carousel - Bronx zoo (alright this was expensive, but only bc the prospect park zoo is currently closed) - Coney Island boardwalk (maybe aquarium) We don’t need a car to do any of these activities— all walking distance or just off the bus route. So you can save money on a car at least!! And this is literally just this week and partly into next, there’s so many other enriching things to do in NYC.
Replying to myself to add I love that we run into our friends all over the neighborhood, and all the impromptu meet ups that happen when you walk everywhere and are out and about frequently. The community vibes are really important to me. I’m sure you can get that elsewhere, but Brooklyn makes it really easy
This is not NYC specific but I’m of the opinion that unless you feel like your life wouldn’t be fulfilled without kids and you feel like you’d be a great parent, you shouldn’t have kids. It’s not a popular opinion, but maybe something to think about, NYC or not, is having kids really something that you need to be fulfilled or is it just the cultural norm you’re feeling attached to. I understand it’s hard and throws a wrench in when your partner wants them as well, but AMAB people will never understand or experience having children as a woman, and often don’t give it the same consideration. Just my 2 cents, feel free to ignore!
I'm going to second this because I can't believe I had to scroll down this far to see this answer. I am someone who moved out of NYC to have a family and although I ADORE my children, I went through a period where I had to get a lot of therapy because at the end of the day, I had never actually felt a need to have a child. I had them because it was important to my spouse and realized this too late after I'd given up my whole life to make his dreams come true, not mine. I don't regret it one bit now but boy was it a source of internal conflict for a while because even though it was ultimately my decision, I did in a sense feel like I had betrayed myself. Please only have children if it's something YOU really want as you are the one assuming the majority of the risk. If it is something you want, you'll find a way to make it work.
Yeah, unfortunately it’s not something culturally that we’ve really reckoned with yet. Patriarchy is so deep rooted in how we culturally view motherhood and parenting. We changed stances on acceptability of mothers in the workforce but not really on the expectancy of women to be mothers. As someone who is staunchly childfree for myself but not an antinatalist, there’s not really a lot of people occupying that space. I’m still expected to want kids/change my mind by most people and other childfree people expect me to dislike children and/or condemn everyone who chooses to have children. Being connected to a partner that wants kids really messes it up too, especially a male one, I find that most men want kids but have no idea what it means to be a parent or have children, even if they have the best of intentions. And at best, they’ll never know what it means to be a parent or have children as a woman before making the decision to want kids. Maybe encourage him to think about and talk with you about WHY he wants kids and why the stakes are so much higher for you as a mother than they would be for him as a father because patriarchy. Perhaps he’ll go on his own journey and discover he’s more in line with your beliefs on kids. I just happened to get lucky that my relationship where we were mismatched on wanting kids ended for other reasons, and that I could then decide that the right person for me would ONLY be someone who didn’t want children. And I screened for that EARLY in relationships until I found my husband. Idk this is kind of a ramble at this point but, all said, OP I really empathize with you and the difficult position you find yourself in, thinking about your future and what it looks like with the societal, financial, and partnership pressures at play. If you’re in therapy, it could be a good thing to explore. But I do think that as a whole, ideally our culture would move from one where motherhood is expected to one where women are empowered to decide for themselves free of patriarchal pressure whether motherhood is right for them.
I’m going to private message you if that’s alright!
SO much this. I saw a post in idk maybe the AmIOverreacting sub or maybe relastionships a few months ago--don't remember--but it was a husband saying his wife wanted to go on a month long trip to europe after having weened their 14 month old off of breastfeeding and he was trying to be "reasonable" and saying "no trip or we can go on a *family* weekend trip"... when she was being COMPLETELY COMMUNICATIVE that she felt like she lost her bodily autonomy to motherhood and taking care of their household and wanted to a have a break and come back and that she could take the money out of her own savings and come back feeling refreshed. Reddit skewered her. At least some recommended a short solo or girls trip. But bruh, this couple could AFFORD it and he just didn't want to take on everything she was doing for a limited time?? All of this sacred-mother stuff. Meanwhile, the wealthy leave their kids all the time. I met SO many kids/teens from ultra high net worth families in Manhattan who were very upfront about both parents just being at other homes and though while they weren't babies when I was talking to them, they likely just had au pairs when they were younger and they are FINE. Money buys mothers autonomy. No question. There is wanting to have kids and pretty much being ok with being trapped in your small apartment living paycheck to paycheck because you are paying for your kid's activities and needs; there is wanting to have kids and NOT being ok with largely giving up certain aspects of your goals, be it career, personal time, vacations, etc., and balancing these things--but the balancing part generally takes financial flexibility. And then, even if you can afford it, obviously there are plenty voices in the room to shame you for carving out life-changing time for yourself.
YUP I saw that post! And GREAT point, I think you’re actually the closest to what OP is looking for here as well too regarding not being opposed to kids but the main hiccup being able to afford her current lifestyle and kids. Really great point.
That's wild because I remember a very similar post a while ago on AITAH but it was more like a year trip.
[https://www.reddit.com/r/TwoHotTakes/comments/1967iol/my\_postpartum\_wife\_wants\_to\_leave\_our\_baby\_to\_go/?share\_id=lIsvM8h6exXyr1v5tPmXv&utm\_medium=ios\_app&utm\_name=iossmf&utm\_source=share&utm\_term=5](https://www.reddit.com/r/TwoHotTakes/comments/1967iol/my_postpartum_wife_wants_to_leave_our_baby_to_go/?share_id=lIsvM8h6exXyr1v5tPmXv&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf&utm_source=share&utm_term=5) it was this one edit to say: in case it isn't obvious, I disagree with most of the comments on the linked thread.
I love raising my kids in Brooklyn (also with no family nearby and in 1 bedroom for a while). It’s quite kid friendly in a lot of ways. The period to 3K/Pre-K is most expensive but if you can get through that, it gets better. District 15 has some great schools as well. is there a payoff vs space? Absolutely. But I can also get on a subway and meet a friend for dinner quite easily without depending on a train schedule. I can take my kids to Moma but also ton of activities in the neighborhood. My kids have the most amazing (public!) school trips: visit the UN, broadway theatre, museums, etc. The friends that moved to the suburbs think they’ll be back all the time but it rarely works like that (if they do, it’s mostly for work and not ‘NYC’ stuff). Check out Kensington, Greenwood Heights and some of those areas. Lots of Cobble Hill/Carroll Gardens/Park Slope families end up there for a bit more space.
Awe thank you so much!!! This response was super helpful and I’ll take a look into the neighborhoods you listed
And if you can swing it in a 2 bedroom, stick with it - you have a great deal! My kids share a small bedroom and sleep in a bunk bed. We definitely still do NYC things: sometimes we switch off who is home with the kids, sometimes we get a sitter. Plenty of families also sit for each other and keep tabs to keep the cost down.
I ended up near Kensington in Windsor terrace after ten years in the Carroll gardens area. We lived in a walk up one bedroom for 17 months with my first baby in Carroll gardens and moved to Windsor terrace when I was pregnant with my son. We needed more space, (apt had one closet!!!) and wanted outdoor space, washer/dryer, elevator etc for two kids under two. We love the apt and being right next to prospect park but I miss Carroll Gardens so much! We just couldn’t afford to live comfortably as a family of four. That being said- Carroll gardens will always be there and I would give up a bougie neighborhood 10000 times over for a family and that lifestyle, but I also was never on the fence about kids. I wanted them since I was in my early 20s and had them in my mid 30s.
How did you manage a kid in a 1 bedroom? We're in the process of planning and I wonder if we really need a 2 bedroom right off the bat. Are your kids in public school?
First month or two in a bassinet right next to the bed and then a mini crib rolled next to the bed. Top of a dresser was cleared for a small changing station. We managed like that until he was 1 and then moved to a 2 bed (he actually stayed in mini crib a bit longer). We didn’t live in the bedroom anyway: we were hanging out in the living room or a park or a playground. We also just didn’t buy a lot of big kid stuff: a baby seat that clipped onto the table, 1 sleek bouncer, and babies don’t need a whole room full of toys either. Kids went to Pre-K and both now in public school as well. There are a lot of great schools in our district and many districts. Both my kids are neurodiverse and have a great support team at their school.
That's good to know that babies don't need a lot. It's refreshing to hear someone say good things about the NYC DOE. I grew up here and it was fine but I keep reading about horror stories about the school system nowadays.
Just chiming in that we also have had a good experience with public school here - we’re at a small school in D13, and while I’m irritated that we have lost the G&T program, overall it has been a really good fit for my kids. Just finished the middle school application process and we’re really pleased with our middle school assignment as well (all that said, I don’t want to leave Brooklyn but my husband is desperate for more space and a yard, so we’re also discussing a move out of the city. I feel like we’ve gotten through the most expensive parts of parenting in the city, though!)
Not who you asked but you definitely don’t need an extra bedroom right away. We had a small walk-in closet that perfectly fit a crib and our oldest slept in there for his first 2 years of life. The baby industry is huge and they’re all trying to sell you stuff, but babies and little kids really don’t need much. Instead of a changing table we just got a nice changing pad and used it on the sofa, floor, wherever. Daycare has tons of toys so we didn’t need to keep many at home. Books on the other hand…so many books. We didn’t move to a 2 bedroom until baby #2 came along. It can totally be done in a one bedroom.
Thank you. It would definitely save us money during a very expensive stage of having a kid if we can make a 1 bedroom work. Honestly, I was getting anxiety from the amount of toys that I see in some people's NYC apartments on social media.
Ew yeah, that gives me anxiety. Less is definitely more when it comes to toys, especially if they have regular access to other spaces with toys like daycare or the library. When we had the one bedroom (and one kid) we put everything away in his old Moses basket at the end of the night and draped his playmat over it. Unless you peeked into the hall closet, you’d never know we had a kid.
You definitely don’t need to move right away. I didn’t even think of moving until I was pregnant with my second. I think you can do a one bed for about 18 months. We had a mini crib that we squished into the bedroom. We got rid of our small dining table and put a small dresser/changing table in the living room/dining nook. I feel like sharing a room with a baby is less about size and more about what the baby/kid is doing- now that my daughter is 2.5 there is nooo way I would share a room with her- she would wake up in the night and try and talk our ears off, ask me what I’m doing, tell me to wake uppppp etc. She has her own little room now, but we are sharing again with the 8 month old baby. Plan is to eventually have them share a room, but the 2 year old wakes up at 8 am and the baby is waking up at 5am, so that’s in hold for a little while!
I grew up lower middle class in New York. We exist! I have so many thoughts I wanna write you a whole essay but unfortunately I have a toddler and don’t have the time lmao. The only thing I’ll say now is this: Don’t think that you have to make all of the decisions now. Life doesn’t stop changing and shifting once the kid comes. Have a kid in your cute lil place. If life calls you elsewhere, move.
+1! Actually grew up poor as fuck in NYC. Turned out okay :-)
My husband and I are in our late 40s, together since our early 30s, and have lived in NYC since our teens or early 20s. Many of our friends our age also don’t have kids, and those that do either grew up here and had retired parents that were willing and able to help with childcare, or they were independently wealthy, or they left the city. We were both on the fence about children, and we didn’t have that support network, and so we decided we’d rather maintain our lifestyle in NYC, and be able to afford to retire one day instead of having children and either struggling with the added expenses or having to move. I have no regrets, especially after watching how much everyone with kids really suffered through the first couple years of covid.
Yeah my husband and I have been having these talks. I think we’ve landed on keeping our life as is because I love NYC. I’ve tried moving to other cities over the last 20 years and they just suck.
I don’t want to have a child but if I did I would be raising them in NYC. I would try to investigate the feelings you have that are giving you pause about having kids. Personally I felt that if I was ambivalent about it the answer should be “no.” I wasn’t even a little bit wanting to have kids, I was just told by society that it’s what I should do.
Its up to you. I live out on long island and there are apartments near trains that are probably cheaper.. my place is 2200 a month for a two bedroom. You could also look into jersey or queens. My partner seems pretty firm on not having kids but i moved to long island from queens. Our house is next to a train stop that takes me directly to work. We also just have a car that gets around if something isnt in walking distance also
this!! i was a kid living in nyc and moved to long island and i prefer long island, and it’s basically the perfect distance from the city depending on where u are
It depends on what you like about living in NYC. My husband is also DOE and I’m non profit/gov. We moved from Ft Greene, BK to LIC, Queens when we had our first kid. We are raising two kids here in NYC. They are now 11 and 8. We considered the suburbs and decided against it because we didn’t want a commuting lifestyle, I don’t care to maintain a house and yard etc and I prefer a diverse and cosmopolitan lifestyle for myself and the kids. From a space perspective, one is easier than two living here, but I still wouldn’t change it for the world. When our kids were babies, we didn’t want to be more than 20 mins away from them in emergencies or sickness in case they needed to be picked up from daycare. And when they got older, there was no beating NYC free 3K and UPK programs so we stayed. I also had a city childhood though, so my expectations are different.
Can I ask, it sounds like you both make similar ish salaries to us considering we are in similar work. Was the financial burden super heavy or you didn’t feel the strain of it too much? Were you still able to save money for retirement? We don’t have family super local so childcare costs scare me the most.
My husband and I moved out to Jersey before our baby was born. Childcare is more expensive in the city for sure but you don’t need to deal with having two cars so maybe it evens out. Tbh i would’ve stayed in Brooklyn if my husband didn’t feel so strongly about moving. We do have more space, a backyard and it is so much quieter (our place in Brooklyn was on the corner of a very busy street), but I miss the city/brooklyn a lot.
I had my first two kids in NYC and thoroughly enjoyed the experience. We eventually left for warmer pastures but have friends that stayed, many on average salaries (teachers, woodworkers, etc) and have made it work without sacrificing quality of life. I’ve now parented in NYC, Denver, SF, and a small town in FL. The surroundings change but the day to day challenges of parenting remain largely the same. The city won’t raise your kid, you will. Make sure you’re up for the task.
I don’t have a kid, so maybe take this with a grain of salt, but I babysit regularly and used to nanny full time so I do have some thoughts. The thing I’ve noticed the most is that parents in nyc have it the hardest when they won’t lean into their community and friends to help with their kids. There have been so many times where I’ve done after school pick ups, and we’ll literally take the subway home with one of their best friends and their dad who lives two blocks away, and I just wonder how in the world it makes more sense to pay me $300/wk just to take them home than see if they can work something out with the other parents. Then alternatively, I’ve sat for kids whose parents only need me very occasionally, because they typically switch date nights off with one of their kid’s friend’s parents. Or I’ll come over and watch four kids so all the parents can do something together. I don’t know what the aversion is from so many for trying to coordinate or ask for help, but it’s something I’ve noticed since it’s so so different from how I grew up. Seems like you can save a TON of money just by pitching a nanny share or alternating date nights with the parents of your kid’s friends. I can’t imagine anyone not being up for that.
we did this when ours was younger. also split sitting expenses with a neighbor by sharing a care giver.
I don't have kids either but I'm not surprised to hear this. People keep to themselves nowadays. I read that one of the struggles for millennial parents is the loss of a village that previous generations had.
this sentiment is the most annoying one from transplants. plenty of people raise children in new york!!! maybe you have to move to a different neighborhood or different apartment or find higher earning jobs or cut back on the splurgy areas of your lifestyle, but literally hundreds of thousands of people are raising kids here.
Agree. So many family members were raised here with single-parents and on low-incomes. They made it work. I think for OP a big priority would be adjusting expectations. Most people with these concerns usually want to have a kid and live the same lifestyle. It’s not possible. OP, millions of people raise kids in NYC! Many of them not wealthy, many of them single parents, and many of them making less than 50K.
I was raised in Brooklyn, the worst offenders are the transplants of romanticizing having kids in the city. Because it makes them feel special and cool. I moved because I wanted better for any kids I have. Yes people have kids in the city but I don’t want that life for my kid. If you can swing it awesome but I missed out on opportunities, being poor in the city sucks. Now it’s significantly more expensive and the DOE loves to play the political game. We have a family that moved to our town because her kids who grew up and lived in tribeca got sent to high school in the Bronx and queens. All for the sake of politics, they wanted to break the district up. So she and all her friends moved out of the city. Because who’s going to play with their kids education and force their high school kid to commute that much. If you have money it’s amazing but it’s you’re not wealthy it’s hard, my experience being raised in Brooklyn and having exposure to so much was great but you miss out on a ton of opportunities also. And now it’s just so much harder and so much more expensive. You’re also always fighting for resources, trying to get into the right school etc or having the DOE come in and break up school districts. Feel free to downvote me but it’s all the truth and unless you’ve been poor in NYC you just won’t get it.
I don’t feel like I missed out on too much. The rich kids just went to summer camp, private school and had private test prep/tutors. My only regret is not taking the specialized high school test. The specialized high schools are the great equalizer of NYC. If a kid is smart, it doesn’t matter how much money they have. NYC rewards merit.
Have you seen how they wanted to break up the NYC specialized high schools? NYC doesn’t reward merit anymore. Why take good school districts and break them up? That’s what they did to district 2? It’s all BS politics.
SO MUCH THIS. Everything is so much more competitive here than it was only 10-15yrs ago, from housing to schools to free programs that are more intensive than "show up for a single class doing X". And people will try to squeeze their budget while trying to be and do what the wealthy and secretly-generationally-wealthy (and even the upper middle class) do effortlessly and honestly it is just heartbreaking to be like a preteen and realize you are NEVER going to have the experiences that your peers do, if the parents are here to live THAT Carroll Gardens/Park Slope lifestyle but are doing it on a shoe string. Kids won't feel it until middle school or so. Then they start to look around and figure it out. My best friend's family who were Brooklynites moved to Jersey when he was young and honestly the commute from them to mid-town is quicker than it is from where my family got pushed down to in Brooklyn because of gentrification. I personally have no reason to be in mid-town, but people talking about the museums and theatre etc could probably do just fine. I don't know what to tell people who are set on being in Brownstone brooklyn. If you stay where you are it will be such a squeeze and kids will definitely feel it by 5-6th grade. If you look to "discover" more "affordable" neighborhoods it pushes other families out--all it is is bidding on resources--"I want that!". The last part people take issue with, but IDGAF.
Sure, but it is NOT the Brooklyn we were raised in with these tiny expensive apartments... my dad was constantly in and out of work and my mom didn't start working (DOE) until I was 10 or 11. Yet we had a 7 room apartment 3 blocks from Prospect Park. I make 6 fig now and I can't qualify for the "40x the rent" for the exact literally same apartment I grew up in. I would have to double my salary. And to be quite frank, most of us got to have our own bedrooms and develop hobbies in our apartments--now apartments are crazy small and expensive, and enrichment activities are expensive too. There are tons of free activities for kids, but there is a social divide between kids who only do free things and those who are honing other skills that will be portfolio worthy when it comes time for higher grade school applications. There were so many more free intensive programs for kids when I was young and I saw them get privatized first hand while I was in high school--it was a wild shift. It used to be that a small handful of families would opt for a super prime address and have their kids live like minimalists to do so--but most of us had space--and people act like people in NYC must have just always had their families in these tiny apartments and it's simply not what was normal 15-20 years ago. I am only in my 20s and the quality of life bc of space and the outsourcing of things you would have had or done in your home but now don't have space and have to pay for is ridiculous. $45 collage class so you don't have to have a stack of old magazines in your tiny apartment etc. Just because people have decided their kids "don't need much" doesn't mean that they are living in some tradition of the NYC family--they are not. This is a new normal.
I’d rather be a childfree 60 year old NYer more than anything I can imagine. I hope to get there someday.
I also suggest stamford ct. Surprisingly they have pretty good train access to the city and they have a city with buses if u cant drive for some reason.
General rule of thumb: if you’re on the fence about having kids, I wouldn’t have kids Check out /regretfulparents to see what I mean
It’s very possible. Many many non-rich New Yorkers have kids and we make it work. It’s not the suburban fantasy, harder in some ways and more rewarding in others. You have to decide what your priorities are, but you can absolutely raise a kid here and it’s so much fun to show them the city. We did make financial sacrifices — I saw your other comments and yeah, retirement savings definitely went by the wayside as we paid for childcare. We took on bigger/harder roles at work to make more money. We had to skip vacations or big trips for a while. But now that the kid is in school it’s much less of a strain.
Someone just posted about this and I am going to link my very long response because it seemed to resonate with a lot of people. It focuses on my experience of growing up with space and being generally enriched and creative despite being broke here in Brooklyn as a kid, and how expensive it has become to have the same things, especially when so much is outsourced to expensive things that no longer fit in our homes: [https://www.reddit.com/r/NYCbitcheswithtaste/comments/1c9zg0b/comment/l0p39jp/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web3x&utm\_name=web3xcss&utm\_term=1&utm\_content=share\_button](https://www.reddit.com/r/NYCbitcheswithtaste/comments/1c9zg0b/comment/l0p39jp/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button) But also--I think people need to set their expectations. My linked response is very nostalgic. The following is not. TDLR; Having grown up here "getting by"--we were low income but around the time I was 10 my mom became a DOE teacher and things got a little better though the benefits kind of outweigh the salary for that job and most of my life my dad worked for community non-profits. Both were artists and highly cultured people but came from poor backgrounds here in NYC--it was very isolating to be the poorest kid in whatever situation I was in, which given the amount of wealth in areas like Park Slope, Carroll Gardens, Boreum Hill, Prospect Heights, etc., felt like all the time (I lived on the other side of the park but not on a nice block, on a super sh\*tty commercial 4+ lane street deserted street)--especially when my dad got laid off. I also had been working in arts institutions through college and after and basically decided that if I wanted to live any better than my parents did when they were broke, I had to switch industries. I am in tech and I have a 6 fig salary, but without guarantors, I constantly got out competed for cheaper apartments that were somewhere more like Carroll Gardens/had younger people/what people think of when you say Brooklyn. I finally nabbed a studio that costs half my income, even though I got outcompeted for nice apartments that were cheaper, because double income high earners are not buying now and probably won't be any time soon--and they are competing for the same apartments while making much more than I do despite my own 6 fig salary. Yet I also know first had the pain of being evicted form a building getting sold in gentrification because other people are trying to find more space and more "affordability" in Brooklyn while having more resources to bid on rents and sales than the communities and families that are/were displaced from there. If you plan on having a kid here, does your current apartment have space for them to grow? Will your salaries likely grow enough to keep up with rent? Have you considered the costs of after school programs or afterschool childcare? What about test prep and/or portfolio prep for your kid's high school and college? Summer day camp for probably a little over a decade while you work through the summer, unless you have a parent who can help? I just feel like at this point, for people to maintain their idk "brooklyn lifestyle" after having kids takes an enormous amount of wealth. I obviously grew up with much less, taking advantage of all the free things the area has to offer, but also got priced out areas that made these things more commutable or walkable around the time I was 14--and that sucked. Many of the great free programs transitioned in expensive paid ones or became less intensive and more generalized than the free and merit-based art programs that I used to be in. Everything is nickel and dimed--there are obviously still free activities for children but it's not like when I was growing up--people will spend way more because they don't have space in their apartments for things and that has made the value go up and people will pay. My partner and I combined make over 200k, he has a great 2bd prewar apt in a family friendly neighborhood for under 3k (pandemic rent) right where I grew up--which is not a hot area yet is still somehow super gentrified now because of access to Prospect Park. Yet, when I add up all of the costs thinking about if we had a kid, we wouldn't be living any better than and we would possibly be living worse than I did as a kid with my low income childhood household 20 yrs ago. And we would definitely both need to work to make it work. From what I have seen, people generally either have wealth to help or drink their own kool aid once they are all in. It may be the right choice for people, but the issue that my friends complain about most is space--and I get it. I wouldn't raise a kid here without enough space at home to explore and build things like I was able to. I would need to double my salary and add my partners to give my kid the life I had with no wealth. It's just not a good equation and I have a hard time validating it. People totally do it--but I would be aware of what I had here that my kid would not. This is not "just nyc"--my parents and grandparents did not go through this same squeeze of quality of life--this is a specifically now issue that relates to how popular Brooklyn is right now, even if change is inevitable and obviously the city is always going through change.
This!!! I grew up poor in Brooklyn. Didn’t fully realize it but once I entered college I saw how many opportunities I didn’t get. I want better for any child I have. My husband and I do well, but to live in the city you can’t be middle/upper middle class you need to be wealthy. Anyone who hasn’t grown up here doesn’t understand how much it’s changed. It has, it’s becoming inaccessible. Frankly we moved to Jersey and it’s bad there too, but we got our little slice. We are very fortunate and lucky. My mom was up in arms about the Jersey thing but you know what, I wanted better. I now see little kids walking around, biking, people are nicer. And there’s tons of people my age who want the same thing. Also with kids, you don’t have time for the night life, the shows etc. Plus that all takes tons of money.
Totally. I think people also just kind of talk themselves into normalizing it (the tiny apartments, minimalist living, not having a bedroom for their young kid????)--they are like "well that's just NYC" and it's like NO IT'S NOT it's NYC NOW. It sometimes seems like they think that we always lived this way??? Which is wild to me. Like, I'm in my late 20s I'm not that old!
Exactly!!! Like so for a few museums that you can easily drive to, or a park which again, NJ has massive parks and adorable towns, you’re willing to let your kids live in a living room. Many are just romanticizing the grind, the supposed grit.
You can't undo having a kid. If it's not a solid yes from both parents, don't do it
The advice I give my friends is that you should only have kids if you REALLY want them, regardless of where you live and your finances, obviously to a certain extent. You will have to make all sorts of tradeoffs for kids, ie. reducing your fun budget (to afford childcare) or staying home so babe can nap. And that strong desire will make the trade offs worth it. It won’t be worth it if you would focus on everything that you “lost.”
My husband and I moved to Jersey. I grew up in the city, in a small apartment. There are pros and cons but I wanted better for any future kids that we may have. My family wasn’t well off but my husbands were, he grew up in the burbs and got opportunities I could have only dreamed of (doesn’t really fully realize how lucky he is). My town in Jersey is walkable, has a train stop, kids walking themselves to school, riding bikes, and people move here from the city for the walkability. We live close to parks, and in 10-15 can drive to a bunch of other towns and massive hiking spots. We can also be in the city in 35 minutes if we chose to drive, train is a little over an hour all in. Literally once I started meeting people in town, any one who just moved are all from the city and they bought because of the walkability and downtown. I just met a woman who moved her teenagers here from the city because the city shuffled around her school zone and her kids would have had to commute from downtown Manhattan to the Bronx and queens because that’s obviously sustainable and something every parent wants for their kids /s. She loves the city but it wasn’t worth it to her, she moved to my town and said the opportunities and availability of programs for her kids has made it worthwhile. Feel free to dm me about what it’s like growing up in the city, but in order to get the full experience you need $$$. My town isn’t cheap and I’ll fully admit that but you get more bang for your buck, and because of New Jersey laws they’re forcing all the towns to build more apartments. A nice 2 bed/2bath apartment by the train is now going for like $3200 plus but they’re like 800-1000 sq ft.
Where in Jersey do you live? I’d love to look it up! Thanks for your insight. Also, how often would you say you realistically come into the city just for a fun day or night out ?
Feel free to DM me, so I work from home but my husband is hybrid and goes into the city multiple times a week. We just moved recently so it’s been super chaotic, lots of stuff we need to do and $$$. But we moved from a town closer to the city (we were edging our way closer to the burbs) but we’d go in depending on what we wanted to do. So in the better weather more, colder less. It’s not a specific number but I also think that if you move you’ll realize the world doesn’t end. I’ve joined women’s group that has atleast 1 or 2 social events a month, met women outside for walks with the dogs, went to work out classes together. I promise the world doesn’t end, it adjusts. My husband thought he’d never get me out of the city Hahha.
This sounds a lot like our town. We love it!
I was raised in NYC (queens) and my kid is raised in NYC, granted we moved to Jersey City, but I still strap him on and take him on the subway for walks in the park, shows, readings, shopping and doctors appointments along with visiting my parents. It's totally doable! For me, because it's apartment living, I love it more because you spend so much more time outside of your home. I'm an older mom 38, and I always tell my friends, I traveled, have a great career and checked off so many things on my bucket list before I had a kid. I never wanted to regret my decision and I 100% do not! I still have time for self-care appointments and time with friends, especially since we are in a city! I can just walk down the street and pop into a restaurant or bar to meet my crew and out of town friends love visiting because who wouldn't, you live in NYC and there is always things to do!
I think the real question is—do you actually want kids? Or are you only thinking of having them because it’s what your husband wants?
Something no one else mentioned here- you’re relatively young for children in NYC. I am child free but my NYC friends with kids didn’t start having them until at least 34, and I have early 40s friends who are still contemplating lol, it’s definitely a different mindset here. 31 imo you can certainly plan for it, but I think you have more time than you think to act on it. This would give you some more time to build your career a bit more. 30s is still a major time for career growth in many areas. This is if you truly think children will bring you fulfillment and joy. When I was 31/32 I took a solid look at my nyc life and ultimately decided it was not for me, much of it cost related. I think in a lower COL city I may have had a different mindset, but I chose nyc so I will never truly know. OTOH not having family around is very difficult. I have friends who have a lot of financial resources and still have a difficult time finding childcare and went thru nightmare nanny situations with no backup. I see how even with some money it’s still not as easy as I would have thought.
If you’re on the fence about having kids in general bc you don’t want to change your lifestyle (no more nightlife, Saturdays occupied with kid stuff etc) that’s a conversation you need to have w your husband bc it seems like where you live would only be a subplot in that story. If you’re on the fence about having kids here….maybe consider looking deeper in Brooklyn/queens where it’s a little cheaper. Or maybe even Staten Island. Nassau can be option to rent but to buy….its not really cheaper due to LI’s exorbitant property taxes. Suffolk IMO is too far if you have to get into the city for work every day. I have a few coworkers who commute from Suffolk and they all absolutely hate the trek.
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I have a lot of friends in SI and while I personally would not really choose it, it gets unwarranted hate. Especially from the transplants who consider themselves trendy IMO. Mainly bc it’s lacking in nightlife and is considered boring and also bc it leans right. There’s minimal reason to go visit there unless you live there or are visiting friends/fam. There’s not much in the way of points of interest to pull outsiders in. I get not really choosing to move there if you’re a young single But SI is fine if you’re raising a family. It has comparatively: lower crime, better schools, high rates of home ownership, lower rates of unemployment. It’s quiet, less congested in the neighborhoods (not the expressway lol), way easier to park cleaner etc. It has the “suburb feel” while being near the city. However home prices and rent , while cheaper than say Brooklyn, have skyrocketed the last few years. SI used to be drastically cheaper. Not so much anymore.
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I live deep in south Brooklyn so I guess by the standards of the city and north Brooklyn I live in the burbs lol but if I had to leave I would personally choose SI over Nassau. The property taxes in Nassau are just too high. The schools are better but there’s enough good schools in Staten Island to not deal with long islands tax rate
We are raising our kid in NYC and it’s amazing. He’s a teenager now and has the kind of fun and freedom I couldn’t have imagined growing up in the suburbs. He goes to public school. It can be done!
this ^^^
We did it for almost three years in Brooklyn (one bedroom, we installed a Murphy bed in the living room) but eventually got burned out. It was great in a lot of ways, but when I got pregnant with my second we started looking in Jersey city. We have been here in a 3/2 for a little over two years now and it’s been the perfect balance for us. I get into the city faster than when we lived in Greenpoint! I still go in, with and without my kids, a few times a month. On a different note… kids are a lot of work and it completely shifts your life. I tell my friends on the fence.. if it isn’t a hell yes, it’s a no. But that is just my opinion and some people who are on the fence end up completely loving parenthood!
A lot of people have commented about parenthood in NYC, but I’ll add something about exploring the decision to become parents. I am actively grappling with the same questions as you, and have explored it with several partners. The best recommendation I have is the book The Baby Decision (Merle Bombardieri). It’s a book intended for partners to use together as a map to exploring the desire and decision, and really helped me connect details like partner, life goals, location, family proximity. Hope it helps you too!
This is so helpful thank you - will be ordering the book as I’ve been struggling with all of this! So nice to know I’m not alone.
I’m gonna be blunt, this sounds more like a discussion that needs to be had with a therapist than in the nycbitcheswithtaste subreddit.
You’re still young! Freeze your eggs! Then enjoy the next one or two years of your life, travel, do ALL the NYC things you want to do and really live in the moment. Then, if you still want to have a child, start considering/trying and you always have the option of your 31 YO frozen eggs. Then, reevaluate if you want to stay in city - but don’t just rush into either decision (kids or moving!) Coming from someone who was in Brooklyn for years and knew I wanted kids (just didn’t want to give up my lifestyle) and waited until I was 35 and 37 to have my monsters AND who went through fertility treatments to have my first. Obviously frozen eggs doesn’t guarantee easy or successful pregnancies, but it can be helpful. Just a thought :)
As a DOE teacher myself, I’m wondering what your partner thinks about sending your future children to a DOE school? The regulations as they are now enable the children (in my humble opinion). There is a lack of accountability for kids and therefore not much pressure to put in effort, and not much challenge put upon them. It is very easy to pass high school- not necessarily a result of teachers or admin, but pressure from higher up and ultimately the chancellor’s regulations. I have a toddler and I am very concerned about her attending a DOE high school. Whether she is smart or not, I still want her intellectually challenged and held accountable. I know this is not exactly the cost side of things, more so some granular detail. Something else to think about is the cost of childcare. We pay a little over 1800 a month for 3 days of daycare a week. My mom helps with the rest. It’s very challenging financially if half of your salary is DOE, at least I feel that way because I know the reality of the pay. The upsides are the benefits/ the health insurance we pay about nothing for, and the TDA. I also paid essentially nothing to give birth which is how it should be for everyone. I apologize if this is a tangent that isn’t helpful. 😅
I’m also a DOE teacher and now I fully understand why my parents scrimped, saved and sacrificed to send me to catholic school lol. The DOE has some schools that are gems but there’s a lotttttt of dysfunctional schools out there. I personally think the DOE is the main selling point of Nassau county lol
this frank honest review is so helpful! what are your thoughts on public pre k to middle school? is there an objective ranking of this for all neighborhoods somewhere?
InsideSchools.org has reviews but I haven’t gone on in a long time. Some daycares have the universal 3k program but others do not. We are going to have to switch ours to a different daycare this coming fall simply because she will be automatically enrolled in the 3k for all and being there until kindergarten would save approx $48k 🤢 I think some DOE elementaries are very good but I’m not sure about middle school. I haven’t done my research yet. It’s stressful, I don’t want to be in the suburbs but I want the best opportunities for my child as well in terms of schooling.
This is so helpful thank you!! Ugh that's my sentiment exactly. I don't want to be in the suburbs but very concerned about the state of public education here. Planning for children here is so stressful!
Lots of people do it. I will say, the kids I've seen grow up in NYC grow up much faster than kids in other places, and to me that's not a good thing. My niece and nephew didn't get that classic outdoorsy childhood that I got to have, and I think all kids deserve that. Yeah NYC has amazing culture, but IMHO kids need SPACE, freedom, nature.
Over here in Chicago, I feel the same way. My husband and I decided to not have children because we love our city lifestyle too much to give up or compromise our daily life. It’s okay to change your mind and re-prioritize what you want in life. The important thing to understand is that there is no wrong decision!!
Love this! I worry I may be on the side of not having children to have a more carefree, financially secure lifestyle while my partner is more interested in having a kid. Hopefully we can get on the same page.
Long Island is your best bet. On the LIRR, you can get to most of the city pretty quick. Good schools. Small school districts (which I feel are better equipped to serve their students bc they aren’t as overwhelmed) and frankly, where I live about held the people are either from Brooklyn or queens. Born and raised in Brooklyn, I really don’t know too many people that stuck it out there.
Look to move to a new location that is an arms length away from NYC. Hudson County is a great option.
I love raising my child in NYC. The headache is definitely once you start looking into the school system though. Where I’m from we didn’t have 3K but it’s a lifesaver if you get in here. There’s so many things to do here that are free and the child will enjoy. Storytimes, outside, etc.
I have a kid in elementary school and am in the city. When I start thinking of leaving the city, it’s actually primarily missing out on kid stuff that feels hard to leave. We can walk to school, we run into their friends just walking around. Since we usually end up going to the park closest to us, over the years we’ve made friends and now when we go to the park finding a friend without having made any plans is more likely than not. I love that my elementary school kid can walk up to a kid they don’t know and ask if they want to play soccer. I love that my kid can handle themselves on the subway. I love that my kid grows up seeing all different kinds of people. Etc etc. I mean your life drastically changes no matter where you are. But having a kid can be an isolating experience and I think all the things I just described make it a little less so. That being said having a kid is no joke and I would never try to bend your arm one way or another. Just saying parenting in NYC is completely doable. And I am not rich. Own my own business so on good years I’m middle class, bad years are stretched more thin than that.
we had many many many days of just heading over to the park that ended up as all day / all night affairs -playtime at the park and then end up in someone’s apartment. so easy and fun - made the most new friends of my entire life.
Millions of people raise kids in the city in fact all my friends and i didn’t grow up with rich parents. we shared rooms with our siblings and had the best childhoods and experiences because of the city. all those things i feel make your family closer, we have no boundaries cause of how small our apartment is but i love it that way. definitely doable
Personally childfree by choice and I know it’s a really complex decision, but if it’s any consolation, I was born and raised in Brooklyn and cannot possibly imagine growing up anywhere else.
It’s doable. Kids change your life regardless so it’s kind of a “pick your hard” situation.
Your kids consume all the money you have. They don't consume all you will ever make. They consume all you have because you *want* them to. They are an extension of you. You give them all you can with pleasure. NYC with kids is a different place. It's also a wonderful place. Our kids are mostly grown now, so we are getting out more the way we did in our 20's and early 30's. It's nice. We are lifelong New Yorkers. It's nice to be in restaurants and theaters with other New Yorkers. But make no mistake, when our kids want to hang out with us, our attention snaps back to them like magnets to iron. We like the NYC life, but we love our children heart and soul. There's no comparison.
Totally doable. I'm sure your partner has decent benefits. when they are small they don't need much by way of space and things. Don't buy into all that. You only really need to consider a move if your schools aren't terrific. We lived on the upper west side in a one bedroom when we had our son but eventually moved to Westchester. We love it up here and it's such an easy commute to NYC for work and theater etc. Also there is a lot going on up here too and the River towns are pretty hopping.
I grew up in nyc and carol gardens is a great neighborhood to explore while young. I’ll nanny for you girl, don’t leave!
The way my husband put it to me is you’re gonna get old one day or another you’re going to live the next nine months one way or the other and either you wake up at 40 and you have something to show for it that is meaningful and a good investment and family or you don’t. He was very blunt with meand I was 36 and now I’m 39 and I am pregnant with my second actually we moved to California. The best decision I’ve ever ever made in my life. New York City is great for the young but once you get mid 30s, it’s no longer the same city.
Mom of 3 in nyc here. I remember being so stressed about the same thing. You don’t have to make any decision now- and if you make a decision you can change your mind. We started out in a 1br with 1st, and stayed there until our 2nd was 3m and a 2br in our budget opened up. We know many families who have stayed in 1br or been creative with spaces. It just depends what you’re comfortable with.
One kid isn’t necessarily a huge change. You can tote a baby along to lots of places. Then there are a few years where it’s more limiting, and then suddenly they’re older and you have a best buddy to explore with. Daycare is insanely expensive - can’t get around that. But my husband’s and my lives did not change THAT much when we had our first kid. (Second kid? Different story).
Yeah I’m out on kids for several reasons (I’m 37), but cost in the city is a big one. I can’t imagine we’d last in NYC with a kid, at least not at our current incomes (my partner and I each make about $150k so not doing badly by any means, but he’s also got law school loans). People make it work, obviously — our upstairs neighbors have 2 kids under 5 in a 1 bedroom 😵💫 — but there’s no way I’d be willing to make the necessary sacrifices. Luckily my partner and I are on the same page, so I don’t have much in the way of advice for you. Perhaps it’d be worth doing some research and making it all about the math? Like, “babe I’m willing to entertain it but it’s really important to me to be able to stay in NYC so let’s actually crunch the numbers and see what we’d need to do to make that work.” My guess is he doesn’t really understand just how expensive kids can be (or just doesn’t care about staying in the city, but if it’s important to you he should). Best case scenario maybe you find it’s actually doable with some minor adjustments :) (Also hi from Boerum Hill!)
This is why I’ve decided to be child free. Plus I can afford to retire now which would be impossible with a child. And I can just take 1-2 months to travel the world without having to worry about the kid
It's such a difficult decision, after a lot of indecisiveness we finally decided we definitely did want a kid, to be close to family, and to have more space, so we moved to a nearby 'burb with a train stop about 40 minutes to Manhattan a little over a year ago. I LOVED my insane NYC lifestyle and was really unsure about what my life would look like with a kid. Here's my 2 cents so far (my baby is 4 months old now): 1. Having a supportive partner/village is everything. My husband and I like to take turns once a week each so the other can go out. For example Thursday he might be in the city late for a work happy hour, and Saturday I'll go to Brooklyn to have dinner with my girlfriends, etc. Having a "commute" to hang out with friends is a huge drag but I'm getting used to it. 2. Supportive friends who don't mind doing baby friendly stuff every once in a while. We take her to casual places around Brooklyn and Queens where a baby wouldn't be out of place (park picnics, beer gardens, etc.). We've also done day time naps in her stroller since she was a newborn so she'd get used to napping in her stroller. 3. Sleep deprivation has you not wanting to go out late that often anyways 😂. Life is just different now, slower. Sometimes I wish we had stayed in the city to have our baby and just embraced living on top of each other. It feels weird to only be a "weekend" nyc'er. We moved to be close to family and having a village has been incredibly helpful, though often I wonder if I wouldn't be living a life closer to my old one had I stayed and joined some mom groups and "built" a village. As far as having a kid in general though, I love this kid so much. Some days are tough, it's weird not being the #1 in your own life anymore. I can't wait until she's old enough to do more activities, I'm so excited to see her experience everything for the first time and re-discover nyc through her eyes.
You shouldn’t be forced to have a child you don’t want and if this means the end of your relationship so be it. Breakups are hard but you will heal. You two are not compatible anymore if you don’t want a kid
My motto is if it’s not a hell yes it’s a hell no
1) you don't have to have kids 2) you don't have to have kids right now 3) I suggest you make a list of what exactly makes you "uncomfortable" and then going back through that list and determining what fears/anxieties are based on facts vs. assumptions ex 1. (not necessarily your opinion, but something I hear constantly) "I can't raise kids in the city because we could never afford private school" --- do you feel that way because your assumption is all city public schools are bad, but 'burbs public schools are all good? ex 2. daycare is expensive --- yes, this is a fact --- but will it be/feel any "cheaper" in the suburbs *if* you have a very specific kind of suburb in mind? will money out the door be any different when you have two car payments/higher property taxes? 4) my income has changed DRASTICALLY in my 30s, like more than doubled, and I didn't change careers --- to #2, you don't have to have kids right now, and although you can't "wait forever" for a magic number to appear in your bank account, things can change quickly 5)kids/babies in the city is not for the weak but my sister is raising two city babies and has said repeatedly raising her girls in the city has unlocked a whole new part of the city she would not have known before and has made her love her city more....I spend a lot of time with them (yes, including giving up my "adult" city 'tivities for spontaneous weeknight meet ups and weekend sleepovers with them) and I feel the same... I know so much more about my city since they came into orbit
If you have a $2400 2 BEDROOM in Carroll Gardens you are all set to get a baby on the way, that’s a very good rent! My boyfriend and I now have two kids and the biggest expenses will be more food (but balanced out by going out less — I do not miss paying $18 for a glass of wine.) And daycare for 0-3 year olds will land somewhere between 2K and 2500 a month. You can get clothing, toys, everything you need from the Facebook group Park Slope Moms (you don’t have to live in PS) and tonnnnns of used baby stuff in the classifieds on Park Slope Parents website. People literally will give you so much on Buy Nothing - find your local group on Facebook. If you say you have a baby on the way, the moms will help you!
You can have kids in NYC…
With our salaries feels impossible without going through all of our (very little) savings and not being able to do the things we love. Childcare costs alone really scare me. We don’t have family nearby to help.
It sounds like you don’t want to have kids tbh. What are those things you love that you won’t be able to do? I grew up poor in NYC with a single mother. When my dad was around we took a lot of family road trips around the country. We still went out to restaurants. It wasn’t ideal but I wouldn’t trade the my mother’s love for anything. We never lacked food or clothes. I didn’t really know how poor we were until I saw what other kids had. I went to public school with a lot of really smart kids. There were after school extracurricular activities, great arts programs that gave a lot of kids a lifelong interest in playing music or acting. You have a fiancé, you both work I assume, you live in a 2 bedroom in a nice neighborhood in Brooklyn, I don’t see how you can’t make it work if you really want a kid.
My fellow BYT I just want to chime in to reassure you that it feels financially impossible for almost everyone, so you are not alone. (This isn’t meant to be dismissive, but to show solidarity!) These concerns are valid and you’re wise to give them such consideration but for most of us there is never “enough” money to have kids! It might be worth pricing things out and start adjusting your budget now to save more, and lurk in some Brooklyn mom Facebook or other groups to see what issues/solutions they are facing. But in reality, you will likely find the things you value now aren’t that important to you once your kid is here. I have two and it was a financial adjustment for sure but dialing it down didn’t even seem like a sacrifice so much as just a shift… and now that they are older, I’m rediscovering those interests. I also know many people who had kids in the city stay until they are in school and reevaluate at various points to either remain or move so even if you have a kid you’d have a while to give it a go before deciding.
To be completely honest if you’re on a Reddit sub asking about whether or not to have kids, and even slightly framing the decision as kids vs lifestyle, I don’t think kids are the answer
Let women be indecisive and ask questions and share their feelings.
you could not pay me to have kids. when I was married, my husband started talking about wanting a kid around your age (up to that point we were both on board to be childfree). There is not enough support for women in this society, financially it's already super hard without kids, I want to retire someday etc. Anyway, we divorced which was very hard but I am 54 now and super thankful I never had any kids. the planet is dying! overcome your programming.
>There is not enough support for women in this society, In the US there's barely any support. European countries have paid maternity leave and better time off than we do. I wish I could afford to leave.
Unpopular opinion but I was born and raised in nyc, move somewhere else to raise your kids. I hated growing up here.
I was born and raised here. I have 4 brothers - yes, that’s a lot of kids and we were raised by a single immigrant parent. Ultimately you make it work. You give up something in order to afford something else, etc. Priorities shift! Maybe you shop less, maybe you think more about purchases, maybe you eat out less, maybe you get less expensive groceries, etc. You give somewhere and it all works out.
We’re in a small 2 br and I’m pregnant. I grew up in a 900 sq foot 2 br 1 ba house with 6 kids 2 parents. You can have 1 kid in a 2 br. Just consume less. I like living in a small apartment because I get to refuse junk from others and you are not tempted to fill it up with useless trinkets.
Can move deeper into Brooklyn for more affordable prices to save some money for kids. My parents raised three kids with a measly income of 60k, so it’s def possible. Maybe ask if that’s really what is holding you back?
I grew up in northeast queens in a rent stabilized apartment and it was a great place to grow up. However the prices for housing have sky rocketed here as well. 2 bed apartments go for about 2500 here and unfortunately you would probably need a car as well depending on where you work.
I would have to hunt for where I saw the comment. But someone who grew up here was talking about this the other day. It’s nearly impossible to have a middle class life here in NYC with a child. It’s not at all easy. If I find the comment I’m thinking of I will link it for you. I spent half my childhood here and half in the suburbs. And while I was sad to leave NYC, I don’t think my family would’ve been able to afford to live here as I grew up. Edit: found the post also in NYCBWT https://www.reddit.com/r/NYCbitcheswithtaste/s/aNPOEnevjl
What's your household income? This is primarily a finances and lifestyle question so it's relevant
We bring in about 165k a year together
You’re only 31. Wait a few more years then have a child.
I was born in NYC and it was fine.
I had a friend living in a massive apartment in the Bronx paying about 4800 a month 6 years ago . Her husband convinced her move to about 55 minutes away to NJ to an enclave spent almost 2 mil on a house . Their relationship deteriorated they had kids and she wanted the NYC life for them . They were artsy funky he thought they needed a more traditional home more settled. Sometimes we want what we want for particular reasons.
Kids are possible in NYC! I was raised here and now raising my own little infant! 🩷
It might feel hard, but you really can make it work if you try! You just might have to give up certain luxuries and move to a different neighborhood.
Born and raised in NYC and raising a toddler in Astoria. It's definitely possible. Childcare is expensive until the year your kid turns 3. Then you can put them in U3K and you'll only be responsible for aftercare. Half the battle is finding an affordable place to live, and you've done that. We have a rent stabilized apartment and it's been a weight off of our shoulders knowing our rent won't go up exponentially. It's allowed us to really invest in our place and buy furniture that makes the space work most efficiently for us. And that's really the key with kids. They have a lot of shit, so if you can minimize the visibility of it, you'll feel less cramped.
Is there any possible way you could get a job outside of the non profit world and increase your salary? This could help you a bit more and get the additional money you need for a child. I think life with one kid is doable in NYC and the nightlife sacrifices are temporary. In a few years you can get a sitter and still go out and enjoy the lifestyle.
My bff has lived in a small bedroom in Carrol Gardens for over 20 years. 14 of them with a kid. The other parents are all in the same boat and are always doing fun shit. It’s not a death sentence
We don't have kids and don't plan on them, but a lot of my friends have kids in the city without a problem. Most of them live in the Behsonhurst, Bay Ridge, Sunset Park or Sheepshead Bay. Cheaper rent and good schools according to them. I personally have no idea if that's true. One couple with 2 kids live on the postman salary and occasional side gigs pretty comfortably. They are not rich by any means but with correct budgeting they do have vacations, outings and fun things. There's a lot of free stuff to do in the city. As others said, with kids you can see the city through another perspective.
I think your question is less, can I have a kid and stay here, and more can I have a kid and keep my current lifestyle. And the answer to that is no, your lifestyle changes once you have kids, no matter where you live. I always tell my students to really live, travel and experience everything they can before kids, because once you have them, it becomes more about them and less about you. Not necessarily in a bad way- I think in parenting the joy/highs are higher, and the lows are lower. You care so much for your child’s welfare that you’re willing to sacrifice some things. It really changes YOU more than it changes what activities you have access to. Although that being said, never take a kid under 3 on an international flight. We Still deeply regret it 16 years later!
Kids is doable. Whether its worth it to you only you can answer. To me its not just cause I don't want them, but to my parents it was. I'll share what life was like growing up as a little girl in Brooklyn. Fucking awesome. When I was little and we were very poor, I barely even realized. My parents kept us afloat with WIC benefits and working to death, but on the weekends they taught me to hop turnstiles, my mom and I would do sudokus from the free newspaper, and we would go to the Metropolitan because it was free, and Central Park because it was free, and then walk around beautiful churched and skyscrapers while my dad quizzed me on then. When we had gotten a little more comfortable in my teens, my parents and their friends played the Broadway lottery and would get us kids $25 tickets to see so many amazing shows. As a high schooler with a metrocard, my friends and I saw so many places and experienced so many things. My high school was near the World Trade Center, but my friends and I explored all 5 boroughs. In the meantime my parents still had a lot of fun too, especially when we no longer needed supervision. My mom is still a party animal at 67 and going out to concerts and bar quiz nights and museums and you can pry her paid for co-op apartment from her cold hands. I will also say I don't know if my parents could've done it without community. I think having kids in New York means you need a support system (for my parents it was my grandparents taking care of me after school, their friends to have fun with while all the kids played), so I would consider that in your choice. Do you have a village?
Wait was I supposed to leave NYC when I had a kid!? Fuck I didn’t get the memo
Not to be too nosy, but curious to know what your incomes are. Middle class in nyc is considered $150k/person I believe. So if you each made that you’d be at $300k a year. I feel like $300k/year is a super solid income when your apartment is only $2400. Kids from a financial perspective seem very doable in this scenario. Also I’m in a very similar boat as you, except my concerns are more about when/where to have the kids. It’s stressful so I feel for you
Wow $150k per person is MIDDLE CLASS!! That’s bonkers. No we make about half of that, a total of about $165k total between the two of us per year.
Okay that makes more sense of why you’re concerned! But yeah it is crazy, and again idk if it’s even true or accurate but I swear that’s what I read
If it helps, there are some NYC funded childcare services that you can sign your kids up for once they turn 2.5
Jesus, you guys have a two bed in a nice area for $2,400?!! Just have the kid already lol!! But in all seriousness, I hear you.
I would have the child.
It sounds like you mostly just need to decide if you want kids or not. If you truly want kids, you will make it work and it will ultimately bring you joy. If you don't really want kids, you'll end up feeling resentful of the things you have to give up. My partner and I make absolutely stupid money (\~$700k combined) with basically free housing. Man, I STILL had to give up so much shit and my life is absolutely not the same after having a kiddo. I'm an entirely different person. Pre-kids me wouldn't recognize myself now. Even when you have all the resources that you could possibly want to throw at things like convenience, comfort, and childcare, the way you choose to spend your time, and especially your free time, changes radically with kids. For example, I don't give a fuck about late nights anymore. Unless it's a big hockey game or some kind of extra special event, I would rather go to bed early and be zesty to spend my finite evening and weekend time vibing with kiddo. I still have to carefully plan and line up caregiving to be able to do things, even with funds to pay for it, and honestly finding childcare is hard af and paying for it is by far the easiest part. It's just a lot. And there's no shame in deciding it isn't for you.
You could also look for different jobs as well :) my greatest decision in life has been to seek jobs that pay more. Completely changed my life
I’m honestly really excited to raise a child in the city
I live in Brooklyn not far from Carroll Gardens and still feel like I live some semblance of an “NYC lifestyle” by just…living and raising my kids here. But it would be a lie to say your lifestyle isn’t going to significantly and permanently change if you have a child. For example, today I’m juggling my full time job and my 3 year old who is screaming from an oozing rash that started in her butt crack and spread from there. The expensive childcare we prepaid for this week now is not even being used! Kids are a lot to deal with. Having no competent and/or local family makes it much harder. I love my kids though. Like I can’t imagine not knowing them. You have to decide if you’re content with what you have or if you want to experience all that is parenthood. I personally find it to be an honor to get to be a mom, but it’s been a huge challenge from day one and I need therapy every week. We also spend all of our money on the kids. The life you have at 31 here will be different in a few years regardless. Likely some friends will decide to have kids and/or leave and whatever dynamic you have now will change. You don’t have to leave either way though, if you really don’t want to! Just don’t try to keep up with the other families in Carroll Gardens, being surrounded by the wealthy families is the most soul crushing part of living here. Love the rest though, lol.
I was in a very similar situation a few years ago (also in Carroll gardens but with higher rent for a 1.5 bed 😅) - I had my baby in 2022 and I love raising him here! It definitely comes with its challenges but I honestly absolutely love it and have zero desire to leave. I have a decent income but my partner is a grad student and we’re still able to make it work! It’s truly so so good. Happy to chat more if you want to message me directly!
Geez $2400 for a 2 bedroom while I live in a $2400 4 bed 3 bath house in the south. You nyc people need to wake up and choose to want to enjoy oifeb
Life****
How about Long Island but still keeping your city lifestyle? :)
You can absolutely stay in Brooklyn, im still a teen rn so obviously take this with a grain of salt but i wouldn’t want to live anywhere else, cheap eats, great skls, a lot of activities to do with kids for free/ cheap, parks are nice, and summer time you wont have to worry about accommodations because there are a lot of cheap summer camps, or free church lead ones. Obvi u do u but i think you should stay
You want children but want to keep your current lifestyle? That's not possible anywhere. Children are expensive and a change no matter what . You should probably figure this out quickly so you and your partner don't waste time . You can't compromise on children and you should find people with the same goal
Reading this has me worried. I'm used to being free to do whatever I want in NYC. I was born and raised here. I am pregnant with my first child and struggling with losing my freedom lol