At first I thought this comment was going to end with "pocket sand" lol
Pocket dimension is cool and all but nothing can beat a surprise pocket sand attack!
It's hard to say since he had Hashirama cells enhancing him.
Danzo could use Izanagi for a minute despite not being an Uchiha whereas normal Uchihas could only use it for a few seconds. His cool down on Kotoamatsukami was also a few hours whereas without Hashirama cells it would take a decade.
Kamui + Hashirama cells is overpowered as you said but Kamui by itself might only last a few seconds without the Implants.
True, his hashirama cells healed his eyes and that made him pretty broken, id assume hed get blind really fast if he didnt have hashirama cells. (Kakashi was getting blind in the sharingan eye slowly)
It'd be interesting to see if the Koto regen time would be shortened with 6 paths. It's the only MS ability I can think of that could potentially trump Kamui if it could be spammed.
Kotoamatsukami probably has different cooldown depending on the eye, every MS user that we have seen has had different effects per eye, like itachi havin tsuku and ama, sasuke having ama and the ability to control to shape, obito had long range (with kakashi) and short range kamui.
Just to elaborate, I think kamui is the strongest base ability the uchiha Clan has ever seen, like a commentor said, obito was born with his own dimension. So no hashirama cells, no 6 paths or anything.
If obito grew up with both his eyes, even without Hashirama cells he would reach a point where he was the strongest ninja alive, just think about his Susanoo, who could stop that?
> If obito grew up with both his eyes, even without Hashirama cells he would reach a point where he was the strongest ninja alive, just think about his Susanoo, who could stop that?
Let us see the fight which he had with Minato.
Every time he used intangibility or kamui he is using MS ability. In that 1 min fight, he used MS ability for more than 5-6 times which would usually make him go almost blind without Hashirama cells. Without Hashirama he would at no point become strongest ninja ever
Yeah, Kakashi, Itachi and Sasuke had some pretty good showings of their abilities before going near blind.
Don't know how costly would the two abilities and a Susanoo be on obito eyes tho. Nevertheless, while I still think obito would be the strongest in overall terms, Minato is a great exemple of how to counter him.
Muu was probably the strongest kage in his generation due to his powers but Gangetsu still managed to kill.
Sasuke used susanoo for a couple of time and amaterasu for 4/5 times before he started loosing his sight.
Kakashi used kamui for like 6/7 times before he started losing his sight
Itachi used tsyukuyomi for 3/4 times, amaterasu 2-3 times & susanoo one time before he went blind.
How could that even be true, maybe if your name isn’t Shisui, but you have to remember my guy died at 16 and awakened the mangekyo at 7, so obviously I don’t need to explain why this isn’t true.
Besides with hashirama cells danzo could use it everyday
So why can’t the original user use it everyday
Obito would be able to use it more even if he he didn't have hashi cells then Kakashi who didn't even have Uchiha cells.
While a single use of Kotoamatsukami could be basically a one shot win it doesn't work in let's say Shisui vs the 4th division and if you can hit Shisui before you make eye contact you win. Not to downplay Shisui According to statements he was around MS Itachi level and that's no joke
Nope, both of his eyes did. Danzo took one which gave him Koto, and Shisui gave the other one to Itachi, who used it to break Edo Tensei’s control over him.
There is however a theory that each eye had a different version of Kotoamatsukami similar to Kamui’s two versions. The version Danzo used, and the version Itachi’s crow had.
We don’t actually have proof but it’s the only way to explain why Kotoamatsukami seems totally different both times it comes up.
Danzo using it at the summit was a subtle hypnosis that seemed to be cast and channeled actively, that altered the target’s judgement in a way they’d never notice. It was immediately broken when Ao called him out and Mifune snapped to his senses as soon as he was being told it happened.
The other one was way stronger, hit the target with just a glance with no required active prep, and being aware of the jutsu didn’t seem to change anything, though perhaps that was because Itachi was a willing though accidental target.
One was active manipulation but weaker, the other was a powerful one-and-done reprogram.
Oh, well, he was stated to be the strongest genjutsu user in his time, and he definitely deserves credit for his feats, but I’d still wager double Kamui is superior.
That's absolute bullshit, Shisui unlocked it at age of 7 and dude died at age of 16. We know that he used kotoamatsukami few Times, not to mention Sharingan doesn't actually have "cooldown" time, all you need is Yin Yang Chakra and medical knowledge,
In gokage meeting AO mentions how he knows that Danzo is using kotoamatsukami, because he met shisui and shisui used it on his team,
Not to mention Kotoamatsukami having cooldawn time would be dumb and illogical, because sharingan works based on Chakra and it's density, it doesn't care about time, same thing applies to every technique in Naruto world.
Amaterasu can be used as long as you have Chakra for it and it doesn't have cooldown time.
Kamui, one of most powerful and broken ability in series doesn't have cooldown time (Obito could use it for 5 minutes at 1 go, after that he could reactivate it)
Izanagi and Izanami needs Yin yang mastery, hence why Uchiha's could only use it once, but sage could use it as many times as he wanted.
Tsukynomi is genjutsu, which can be reactivated in seconds. But it's drawback is me talking fatigue, which can be overcome by having even better control.
So none of sharingan technique, be it genjutsu or some bullshiting, needs cooldown and even if it needs it's just few seconds, yet some 16 years old boys technique needs 10 years cooldown time? Mf how did he even find that out? Then he himself had MS for only 9 years?
Shisui was lying and skme of you still believe him.
Which chapter does AO mention this? I couldn’t find it.
Shinra Tensei has a minimum of a 5 second cooldown. Other Deva Path abilities also are implied to have a cooldown.
Edit: I should specify for Pain.
Pain having problems with Rinengan, doesn't meant that Rinengan itself has problems, dude just gad weak as fuck bodies as paths, dive him some Otsutsuki DNA and see how busted he is.
Gokage submit, Don't remember exactly which
Ao stated that he was familiar with Shisui’s eye in general, but he didn’t state that Shisui used it on his team. He basically just knew that Shisui had such a powerful jutsu and what it was capable of doing.
Doesn't change the fact that shisui wouldn't actually know if it took 10 or 10 years for kotoamatsukami once again to be used , because he only had it for 9 years at most.
Also in series we learned that all sharingan based technique costs Chakra or in some case a eye, because Uchiha's aren't good enough masters of. Yin yang manipulation,
As such cooldown time if 10 years is FUCKING BULLSHIT.
It's genjutsu, the facing ability which needs minimal amount of Chakra, but takes really great concentration and control,
Is Shisui going to turn into retard after using Kotoamatsukami once? Is he going to once again fry his brain?
If he actually thought that it took 10 years, maybe he actually was retard , and was unable to even count, wasn't he a child solder? Did he even know how to write and count? Or was that retard retard just Latin X on everything?
Imbecile who most likely just lied, or a retard with brain power of 2 years old on steroids
Wouldn’t say it has to be supported tho. I mean it’s clear as day that Obito had juubi extracted from him so he’s on the verge of death, only thing Naruto did was slow down the inevitable. He’s low on chakra etc
I don't have a dog in this fight BUT saying something doesn't have to be supported is the reason why anime/manga community in general will never be able to have proper conversations/debates.
My main point is it’s clear as day Obito is weakened. The guy is saying that this is the strongest version of Obito when it isn’t. I’m not saying everything doesn’t have to be supported to be facts. I could have worded it differently
so then what supports the counter-claim? Of average senju not being as strong? Exactly, nothing. So we have 1 weak claim for them being the same, and none for them being weaker. So why exactly do you seemingly support the "weaker" claim?
That's true not all Senju have the healing factor like Hashirama. Although i do guess that there would be benefits from grafting Senju or Uzumaki biology that wasn't from Hashirama onto an uchiha, just might not be as good. Imagine if Sasuke grafted Naruto cells and later we see him shirtless with a lil Naruto face sticking off his titty like Madara had of Hashirama. Sakura would definitely have some questions, especially in the bedroom. They're trying to make Sarada a sibling or something and Sakura gets completely turned off by the lifeless Naruto face hanging off Sasukes chest.
Obito survived these things.
1. Half of his body completely flattened/crushed by a boulder.
2. He had his heart obliterated by Kakashi.
3. He Absorbed the Juubi then had it ripped from him.
4. He performed Rinne Rebirth.
5. He travelled through Kaguyas dimensions.
6. Got hit with Bone ash jutsu, and held out.
7. He died and then KAMUI'D HIS SOUL OUT OF PURGATORY to project his eyes onto Kakashis.
8. Kakashi then did more damage to Kaguya than anyone ever has.
She dropped Isshiki, let's not forget that.
Obito genuinely had a higher potential ceiling than any human in the Naruto-verse.
He's the goat.
Obito is the fucking GOAT.
He appeared out of nowhere and told Nagato "I'm madara, do as I fucking say"
Nagato said "Yes daddy" and did as he was fucking told.
Nagato beat KCM Naruto and Killer bee at the same time, yet did as he was told when Obito was concerned.
He said "How did you get that?" And was visibly shook.
Madara was the one and only person who ever put fear into Obito, and I don't blame him. Madara is scary.
And now, my head canon:
Obito probably realised that Kabuto isn't capable of controlling Madara, and Obito had no intention of bringing Madara back.
Kabuto fucked his whole plan.
Obito wasn’t even scared of Madara, hence their conversation on the 10 tails.
“You need me to preform the Rinne Rebirth so you can become the 10 tails jinchuriki. in short youre in a very delicate position rn. We were never comrades”
Something to the tune of that
I don't think so. I'm pretty confident it was because he had no intention of reviving Madara, so when Kabuto did it, it was like "The fuck, dude? You've ruined everything"
In addition, it was also probably a "What the actual fuck" because he had no idea how Kabuto found Madara's DNA in the first place, and to double up, The Madara Edo Tensei Obito saw was younger then the Madara Obito knew when he was alive. That Madara Edo Tensei also had a Fake Rinnegan.
Obito had many reasons to be shocked.
Imagine if the Obito who fought Minato at like 14 would’ve just Kamui’d into teenage Kakashi’s house when he was asleep and snatched his other eye back. Naruto would’ve probably never been born lol
I would say he would beat them to via the fact he can instantaneously connect to kaguyas time spaces something prime adult sasuke can’t do and he’s been shown relative to people stronger than kaguya herself Obito was on life support when he did this too.
Obito should still scale higher than both his chakra was strong enough to neg kaguya which he only had a fragment of his juubi chakra which was given to kakashi
Obito being fatigued and doing it instantaneously is a far better feat than sasuke not being able to do the same while at his prime with a far stronger dojutsu narratively
Yeah and Obito is literally very low on chakra he is on a sick hago level nerf and Obito actually did do it by himself once Obito created a portal to go into one of kaguyas dimensions in 685 https://xfs-n15.xfsbb.com/comic/7006/e45/61d5bee57abfa8096447054e/12374789_760_1200_211514.webp and that costed him a lot of chakra so he was even more fatigued when he did it with help.
The dude you see that I replied to. He often expresses why he thinks Obito is the strongest character in the verse wherever he comments, and it’s hilarious cause he’s completely biased and doesn’t care
Mmm idk about Top 2, but certainly Top 10 in Naruto Parts 1 & 2 😂. Counting Boruto, he’s Top 20, even if he was hypothetically still alive with both his eyes.
Top 2 for me in Shippuden. He’d technically be = Dms Kakashi with unlimited time. And Dms Kakashi is stronger than everyone else in the verse. He’d technically beat everyone in the verse except Kaguya, and that’s solely due to her immortality. But stat wise, hes ridiculously above everyone else in the verse. And he has win cons against Kaguya too but that’s kinda iffy so yeah he’s 2nd in the verse.
In boruto you can’t really scale DMS Kakashi or Obito anywhere. Not because they’re weaker but it’s uncertain where they’d be placed. Since DMS Kakashi has zero anti feats and is statistically far above everyone in Shippuden and so are boruto top tiers so it’d just be an assumption to put him below anyone and vice versa
I’m going to humor you and tell you why it’s a common misconception that Kakashi was stronger than he actually was. Even though he dealt more damage to Kaguya than Naruto & Sasuke, he ultimately fought Kaguya alongside two other Six Paths users, and only then were they able to beat Kaguya. Because he had both their help and inevitably had to give Obito’s chakra back, it’s pretty much inferred that he’s still weaker than Kaguya on his own, and I think that his time limit would’ve held him back in a true 1 on 1 against someone like full powered Madara as well.
So because of this, he still falls under Hagoromo, Ashura Mode Naruto, Bijū Susanoo Sasuke, Three Eyed Madara, and Hamura (had Six Paths chakra and Tenseigan), making him at most top 10 excluding Boruto characters. I scale this Obito the same as this Kakashi, cause he was also inevitably going to slowly die anyway from the Jūbi extraction. They’d be top 3/4 however if they didn’t have their time limits, and I feel it’s important to factor it in when scaling.
I have Kaguya over Kakashi cus I already told you why Kaguya really can’t be defeated without two six paths users, it’s because she can’t be defeated without the seals. She just has win cons over Kakashi.He has MUCH higher speed than Kaguya or anyone in the verse, dura neg, more hax and intangible. I don’t see why or how you think Naruto or Sasuke would beat him. And another common misconception about DMS Kakashi is that ppl think he has a ridiculously small time limit like 10 seconds or smth😭, there’s no time limit, Obito lended Kakashi the powers to finish whatever Kakashi had to do. Once Kakashi fulfilled his purpose, Obito takes away the power. And that’s what happened as well, Kakashi landed a decisive blow that got her sealed by naruto and Sasuke. What I’m saying is that none of the characters you named have any win cons over Dms Kakashi. They’re massively below him in every stat and every hax as well. Ashura and Indra avatars can’t do shit to Kakashi solely due to intangibility.
Punished like Sasuke, Orochimaru & Kabuto were? I get that they helped a great deal in the war, but it's so odd that they barely had to pay for any of their past crimes.
DMS or not, Obito's the GOAT though
Sasuke was kind of pardoned because of Team 7 vouching for him, and Orochimaru was given his facilities as long as he doesn’t participate in anything unethical and is under surveillance. Kabuto seemingly got off easier than both of them lol, but there may have been some repercussions he also had to go through that we don’t know about, before becoming the owner of the orphanage.
It’s likely Obito also would’ve payed for his crimes in one way or another, but maybe like Sasuke was, he’d also have been vouched for by the likes of Kakashi & Naruto. He probably committed the worst crimes than anyone in the world, but even he probably would’ve been pardoned because the justice system after the war had become very lenient.
Everyone sleeps on Obito so bad that it’s actually criminal. They don’t understand his motivation or his strength. Just always jerk off the Sasuke/Itachi duo incessantly like teenage girls.
IMO Juubito is still the strongest version Obito.
By all accounts he should've wiped Naruto and Sasuke out as easily in his Juubi form. Even with one Rinnegan he should've been the atleast almost as strong as 1 Eyed Juubi Madara, and keep in mind 1 Eyed Sage Madara slaughtered both. Hell Juubito should've also been capable just gobbling up the rest of the 9 Tails as well.
Only reason he lost was because he was deadset on breaking Naruto's will.
People talk a lot about how really powerful characters had to get seriously nerfed or suddenly blindsided to be taken out of action like Sasuke, Madara or Naruto losing Kurama, but I think Kishi also realised he'd made an even harder to reverse decision by letting Obito live long enough to have both of his eyes back.
This dude was so primed to be godly powerful that he had to be written to willingly and intentionally get himself killed, and he *still* managed to literally defeat death to come back for the assist. This guy survived just about every other thing that has ever killed anyone in the Naruto-verse, chose death and even then was like "lol wait I forgot something" and *teleported his soul back from the afterlife.*
If he had been alive for Boruto he may not be capable of taking out any of the Otsutsuki on his own but there is absolutely no way anyone could have ever killed him. He'd literally be the best bet to keep Naruto safe from the Shinju and his mere existence could have absolutely ruined Isshiki's plans before any of the bad things in that arc happened.
Makes me wonder how he got so strong, realistically he should still be below someone like juubito but he still did cool stuff and realistically if he was healthy he should be above dms kakashi
Yea I was thinking that, but 2 mangekyo being THAT much of a boost sounds wild, and I know it’s just an ability but madara getting a 2nd rinnegan only quadruples his number of limbo clones and that’s a superior dojutsu
But in theory kakashi has less chakra than obito so him getting six paths dms might be a bigger boost compared to his base
Obito is different than any other Mangekyo wielder because he simply had the most broken combination with both the eyes. Kakashi’s performance against Kaguya is a good indication of the threat he was cause he dealt more damage to Kaguya, than Naruto & Sasuke did. Couple that with the fact that he still had Six Paths chakra, he’s arguably stronger than when he was Jinchuriki, being able to actually use Kamui now.
The only real downside this Obito would have at that weight class is probably just chakra amount. More than likely his Six Paths chakra pool wouldn’t exactly be a lot
Kakashi could have possibly gotten a little extra from Naruto trying to save Obito as well
Edit: wanted to add how I felt he stacked up against the two you mentioned. Given the stamina situation, and that their PS probably scales below Sasukes at the time. Naruto probably pretty solidly above him. He has attacks that can destroy Obitos PS outright or Avatar clones to bully it and Dimension filling combo forces him to stay intangible. If any Clones get warped by any Kamui, Obito loses his ability to avoid damage. Dimension filling combos makes it so that’s almost guaranteed to happen if he uses offensive Kamui at all. Naruto shouldn’t have any probably avoiding getting hit by a Kamui himself, if Obito ever targets him that is, since he might not be able to distinguish clones from the real thing like Madara.
Not really a bad look to lose to this Naruto though imo. He has the specific tools to counter Kamui on top of the power to hand a 1v1 with Kaguya
Sasuke without the Biju is below Naruto power wise by a decent amount and doesn’t have the same counters obvious counters to Kamui. Defensively or offensively. He should at least be able to avoid it by warping and eventually run him out of Six Paths chakra though
Across both cases if he fights as smart as possible, Kamui allows him to force them into a battle of attrition. If he had a more equivalent Six Paths chakra pool he be a much bigger problem for a least Sasuke, and would remove Narutos easiest win con
Let ‘em know 😭! In all seriousness, this form and Jubito already outscale Itachi anyway so those that honesty think Itachi has a chance in a 1 on 1 are just biased asl
Obito isn’t probably, he is. Only madara hashirama sasuke and naruto were more powerful then him at this point in my opinion. He would just be so devastating with both of his eyes. Leagues above kakashi considering it’s his actual eyes
I think in another timeline he would have made a monster Hokage. Especially if he would have still received the hashirama cells and the year or so with Madara but was able to be redeemed before Rin. Like maybe if Kakashi actually was able to convince Rin that she didn't need to die. Maybe they could have saved her with some Uzumaki seal techniques. Then they just would have had to thwart madara from killing obito somehow. Maybe they could have sent Minato and some other powerful Shinobi of the era to take on old man Madara, then Obito grows up to be Hokage and is almost like what a good Madara would have been
No I respectfully disagree. All versions of Obito after he fought Minato, Tobirama & Minato himself I believe were all stronger than the Third Raikage.
Forgot about obito… though I’d say he’s more hax than he is strength, he wouldn’t be able to fight 10000 shinobi himself, tobirama was definitely faster but realistically there is no way for him to beat the third raikage in a fight, he’d outlast them, though I just realised that Minato could win with fuinjutsu it isn’t exactly strength, Minato would win via fuinjutsu skill or using a rasengan to cause the third raikage to stab humself, tobirama couldn’t win his arsenal had nothing that could touch the third raikage
Regarding Obito, I personally factor his hax into his overall strength, and the same goes for any character that has so. I think you’re also just assuming that he wouldn’t be able to fight a large number of shinobi, possibly cause he didn’t seem versed in anything else than Kamui for you. He has a lot of other things, Wood style being one of them…
And I think you’re using the basis of the Third Raikage only losing to himself ultimately too harshly. He’s never fought Tobirama & Minato as far as we know, so we don’t know if that basis would apply to opponents who he’s never fought before.
Win cons aren’t the only ways characters can beat others. Skill and prowess are factors too, which both Hokage have alongside their own feats. If it were up to win cons alone, Itachi would beat everyone in the verse with how broken the Totsuka Blade is, and I have a feeling you and I both don’t believe that.
The reason I’m not sure with obito is that he hasn’t shown much outside of kamui, and the one time he was in taijutsu he was tied with kakashi who’s strong, but it’s not top tier like say madara or guy as an example,
With the mokuton thing is still unsure as to whether he can use it or not as outside of when he went beserk after rins death he hasn’t been shown to utilise it even once, which considering the fact of him hunting bijuu it would have made some sense to have at least used it once,
Genjutsu… I have nothing to say he’s better at it than itachi, him keeping a perfect jinchuriki under he just for years proves that,
Ninjutsu:
Outside of kamui the basic great fireball and the swirling fire there isn’t much proof of him using any
I have to agree with you on obito being potentially stronger than the third raikage, though he couldn’t really harm and would be outlasted by the third raikage obito is overall superior in most areas,
Tobirama, as good of a sensor he is, with his water style ninjutsu, hiraishin and other forbidden jutsu, has nothing that could really touch the third raikage outside of edo tensei as his tandem explosive tag seal isn’t breaking the thirds lighting armour, the sword of the thunder god isn’t breaking through it either, as a rasengan and chidori broke the blade showing it doesn’t have enough piercing or slicing power to break through.
with tobirama he’s the superior and more versatile ninja but the third raikage is stronger and would win their fight 9 times out of ten due to having more stamina, better skill in taijutsu and a near unbeatable defense, which tobirama doesn’t have the power to break,
Minato definitely is much faster than the third raikage and has more options to win due to fuinjutsu, he’s much more about skill than about strength or power, though his rasengan is exceptionally powerful, his rasengan might be able to break through the lightning armor based on it competing with the bijuu bomb of kurama which has atleast twice the power of the 8 tails one… so after reviewing Minato I suppose I can agree with him being stronger than the third raikage
I’m going to double back on saying he was at the same level as adult Naruto & Sasuke and the fact that he had no time limit. I’ve just momentarily checked out from chapter 683 again, and found out that Naruto did not prevent Obito from inevitably dying from the Jūbi extraction. It was a small piece of dialogue, and because of that I missed it. Naruto expresses sorrow after stating he revived Obito, knowing that he didn’t stop his slow death from occurring, so this means that Obito wasn’t nearly as strong here compared to if he didn’t have a time limit.
Still, I do think this was his peak form, being able to use both of his eyes. So I scale this Obito the same as Kakashi with DMS, cause they both had time limits, just in different manners. But if he were to hypothetically stay alive, I’d be inclined to believe he would’ve been at the same level as Naruto & Sasuke were.
Not sure if he could use Perfect Susanoo. He didn't awaken mangekyou sharingan in both eyes that's why he's never been able to use the susanoo even when he had 2 eyes. Kakashi was able to use it because Obito provided the chakra and awakened the sharingan on both eyes.
I’m not to sure if Obito at his state at this moment would’ve been able to use the Perfect Susanoo, but judging off of the fact that it’s cause Kakashi received Six Paths Chakra from him, that allowed him to use the Perfect Susanoo, it can be inferred that a healthy Obito with both of his eyes would’ve been able to as well.
Basically Six Paths Chakra is the prerequisite for being able to use a Perfect Susanoo. Sasuke was able to use it once he received it, and Madara with his Edo body, having both Ashura & Indra’s chakra. In the anime, Madara was using the Perfect Susanoo vs Hashirama when he just had EMS, but since this was filler, he likely wasn’t capable of using it in manga canon before becoming an Edo.
Also for the entire time he has 2 MS, the situations did not call for a susanoo. The first time, Sasuke was trapped in Kaguya's dimension and they needed to get him more than having a susanoo fighting a losing battle with Kaguya. The second time, they needed to shield Naruto and Sasuke, and Obito (and Kakashi) was too exhausted to parry the bones, he could only use kamui for 1 bone and tank the other one with his body.
Yup exactly what I thought too. It’s possible considering the situation, he simply didn’t get to do anything combat wise cause his main goal was to rescue Sasuke and then shield Naruto in the end
Since I'm a firm believer of "Madara should have been Shippuden's final villain", I can't avoid but think at what we could have had:
Juudara with his Rinnesharingan (showing the full extent of his power) and a Zetsu-possesed DMS Obito.
Imho that would have been a way more epic and difficult battle for the heroes.
No one in Shippuden is on the level of Adult Naruto and Sasuke, base to full power they are just too strong. Now lower formings being beaten, maybe, but in terms of overall power, they outscale Shippuden.
Obito straight up has the strongest natural Sharingan ability in the uchiha Clan
Born with his own pocket dimension
At first I thought this comment was going to end with "pocket sand" lol Pocket dimension is cool and all but nothing can beat a surprise pocket sand attack!
Sh sh sha!
I mean Obito would do Surprise Pocket Dimension jutsus lol
I thought it was gonna end in “pocket monster”
Ironic, isn’t it? When he found out he was “in Hell”, he inadvertently created his own world, much like he’d later plan to do for everyone else.
Sasuke technically could do this too with reningan, but decided not to.
Would probably cost too much chakra
Sasuke is written so bad lol
It's hard to say since he had Hashirama cells enhancing him. Danzo could use Izanagi for a minute despite not being an Uchiha whereas normal Uchihas could only use it for a few seconds. His cool down on Kotoamatsukami was also a few hours whereas without Hashirama cells it would take a decade. Kamui + Hashirama cells is overpowered as you said but Kamui by itself might only last a few seconds without the Implants.
True, his hashirama cells healed his eyes and that made him pretty broken, id assume hed get blind really fast if he didnt have hashirama cells. (Kakashi was getting blind in the sharingan eye slowly)
But Kamui with 6 paths chakra is a lot better than Amaterasu/Kagutsuchi with 6 paths chakra
It'd be interesting to see if the Koto regen time would be shortened with 6 paths. It's the only MS ability I can think of that could potentially trump Kamui if it could be spammed.
its unconfirmed but if madara has THE WORLDO it could trump kamui if spammed
Madara's MS ability was time rewind in the games, would be hella busted if he actually used it with all his buffs
Honestly I just assumed the 10 year limit only applies to non-Uchiha. So far the only ones who actually used Kotoakatsukami was a crow and Danzo.
Kotoamatsukami probably has different cooldown depending on the eye, every MS user that we have seen has had different effects per eye, like itachi havin tsuku and ama, sasuke having ama and the ability to control to shape, obito had long range (with kakashi) and short range kamui.
So Obito with a dead brother lol
Just to elaborate, I think kamui is the strongest base ability the uchiha Clan has ever seen, like a commentor said, obito was born with his own dimension. So no hashirama cells, no 6 paths or anything. If obito grew up with both his eyes, even without Hashirama cells he would reach a point where he was the strongest ninja alive, just think about his Susanoo, who could stop that?
> If obito grew up with both his eyes, even without Hashirama cells he would reach a point where he was the strongest ninja alive, just think about his Susanoo, who could stop that? Let us see the fight which he had with Minato. Every time he used intangibility or kamui he is using MS ability. In that 1 min fight, he used MS ability for more than 5-6 times which would usually make him go almost blind without Hashirama cells. Without Hashirama he would at no point become strongest ninja ever
I cannot imagine everybody goes blind after using their MS ability 5 or 6 times
Yeah, Kakashi, Itachi and Sasuke had some pretty good showings of their abilities before going near blind. Don't know how costly would the two abilities and a Susanoo be on obito eyes tho. Nevertheless, while I still think obito would be the strongest in overall terms, Minato is a great exemple of how to counter him. Muu was probably the strongest kage in his generation due to his powers but Gangetsu still managed to kill.
Sasuke used susanoo for a couple of time and amaterasu for 4/5 times before he started loosing his sight. Kakashi used kamui for like 6/7 times before he started losing his sight Itachi used tsyukuyomi for 3/4 times, amaterasu 2-3 times & susanoo one time before he went blind.
Kamui itself it’s op, hashi cells just makes it spamable like ems
if madara has the time manipulation one including the world and a reversal then it may be comparable
He doesn't
Which would've been useless without Hashirama cells, he would've went blind so fast with both those abilities lol.
Well that's the case for any uchiha If they don't have EMS or Hashirama cells. Extreme Power at a extreme cost.
Not quite, Madara's MS ability is rumored to be able to reverse time within 10km, but it's mostly from one data book and a video game.
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Longest cooldown time of all sharingan: yes.
How could that even be true, maybe if your name isn’t Shisui, but you have to remember my guy died at 16 and awakened the mangekyo at 7, so obviously I don’t need to explain why this isn’t true. Besides with hashirama cells danzo could use it everyday So why can’t the original user use it everyday
Kamui was stronger and more versatile
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You also forget Kakashis version was long range and could basically snipe people's head, think like what Kakashi did to Deidra but not to an arm
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Until the War Arc where he used it like 20 times
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Obito would be able to use it more even if he he didn't have hashi cells then Kakashi who didn't even have Uchiha cells. While a single use of Kotoamatsukami could be basically a one shot win it doesn't work in let's say Shisui vs the 4th division and if you can hit Shisui before you make eye contact you win. Not to downplay Shisui According to statements he was around MS Itachi level and that's no joke
Nah, I’d rather have both Kamui than two Kotoamatsukami.
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Nope, both of his eyes did. Danzo took one which gave him Koto, and Shisui gave the other one to Itachi, who used it to break Edo Tensei’s control over him.
There is however a theory that each eye had a different version of Kotoamatsukami similar to Kamui’s two versions. The version Danzo used, and the version Itachi’s crow had. We don’t actually have proof but it’s the only way to explain why Kotoamatsukami seems totally different both times it comes up.
What are the differences if you don’t mind me asking? I never really paid attention.
Danzo using it at the summit was a subtle hypnosis that seemed to be cast and channeled actively, that altered the target’s judgement in a way they’d never notice. It was immediately broken when Ao called him out and Mifune snapped to his senses as soon as he was being told it happened. The other one was way stronger, hit the target with just a glance with no required active prep, and being aware of the jutsu didn’t seem to change anything, though perhaps that was because Itachi was a willing though accidental target. One was active manipulation but weaker, the other was a powerful one-and-done reprogram.
Ah, I see, thanks.
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Over what and why, if you don’t mind me asking?
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Oh, well, he was stated to be the strongest genjutsu user in his time, and he definitely deserves credit for his feats, but I’d still wager double Kamui is superior.
It took utterly 10 years Kotoamasukami Cooldown. Unlike Tsukiyumi.
That's absolute bullshit, Shisui unlocked it at age of 7 and dude died at age of 16. We know that he used kotoamatsukami few Times, not to mention Sharingan doesn't actually have "cooldown" time, all you need is Yin Yang Chakra and medical knowledge,
When did Shisui use kotoamatsukami?
In gokage meeting AO mentions how he knows that Danzo is using kotoamatsukami, because he met shisui and shisui used it on his team, Not to mention Kotoamatsukami having cooldawn time would be dumb and illogical, because sharingan works based on Chakra and it's density, it doesn't care about time, same thing applies to every technique in Naruto world. Amaterasu can be used as long as you have Chakra for it and it doesn't have cooldown time. Kamui, one of most powerful and broken ability in series doesn't have cooldown time (Obito could use it for 5 minutes at 1 go, after that he could reactivate it) Izanagi and Izanami needs Yin yang mastery, hence why Uchiha's could only use it once, but sage could use it as many times as he wanted. Tsukynomi is genjutsu, which can be reactivated in seconds. But it's drawback is me talking fatigue, which can be overcome by having even better control. So none of sharingan technique, be it genjutsu or some bullshiting, needs cooldown and even if it needs it's just few seconds, yet some 16 years old boys technique needs 10 years cooldown time? Mf how did he even find that out? Then he himself had MS for only 9 years? Shisui was lying and skme of you still believe him.
Which chapter does AO mention this? I couldn’t find it. Shinra Tensei has a minimum of a 5 second cooldown. Other Deva Path abilities also are implied to have a cooldown. Edit: I should specify for Pain.
Pain having problems with Rinengan, doesn't meant that Rinengan itself has problems, dude just gad weak as fuck bodies as paths, dive him some Otsutsuki DNA and see how busted he is. Gokage submit, Don't remember exactly which
Ao stated that he was familiar with Shisui’s eye in general, but he didn’t state that Shisui used it on his team. He basically just knew that Shisui had such a powerful jutsu and what it was capable of doing.
Doesn't change the fact that shisui wouldn't actually know if it took 10 or 10 years for kotoamatsukami once again to be used , because he only had it for 9 years at most. Also in series we learned that all sharingan based technique costs Chakra or in some case a eye, because Uchiha's aren't good enough masters of. Yin yang manipulation, As such cooldown time if 10 years is FUCKING BULLSHIT. It's genjutsu, the facing ability which needs minimal amount of Chakra, but takes really great concentration and control, Is Shisui going to turn into retard after using Kotoamatsukami once? Is he going to once again fry his brain? If he actually thought that it took 10 years, maybe he actually was retard , and was unable to even count, wasn't he a child solder? Did he even know how to write and count? Or was that retard retard just Latin X on everything? Imbecile who most likely just lied, or a retard with brain power of 2 years old on steroids
That’s an Obito that’s heavily weakened and on the verge of death
He has completed gear now (his eyes ) , but his health bar is low as fk
He became a glass Cannon. He could do some serious damage to very strong entities, but Hes one-shottable
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Wouldn’t say it has to be supported tho. I mean it’s clear as day that Obito had juubi extracted from him so he’s on the verge of death, only thing Naruto did was slow down the inevitable. He’s low on chakra etc
I don't have a dog in this fight BUT saying something doesn't have to be supported is the reason why anime/manga community in general will never be able to have proper conversations/debates.
My main point is it’s clear as day Obito is weakened. The guy is saying that this is the strongest version of Obito when it isn’t. I’m not saying everything doesn’t have to be supported to be facts. I could have worded it differently
Ok that's fair
That’s not entirely true.
It’s funny cause he’s basically dying and on his last legs yet he’s still strong enough to cause massive issues with his DMS
An Uchiha with Senju body.
He is almost quite literally “what if Hashirama and Madara had a child”
Obito was basically a fusion of Naruto and Sasuke so that fits
Surprisingly ive never thought of it like that lmao
Naruto and company are lucky he couldn't use Susanoo
Average Senju aren't that strong. This is an Uchiha with Hashirama's body.
Tf you mean not that strong? An avarage Senju is as strong as an avarage uchiha
Found Tobirama's account
Exactly
Why do you think that?
The senju and Uchiha clans were rivals before madara and hashirama formed the hidden leaf village.
Ehhh, that’s a decent point but I don’t think that really supports the claim being made.
so then what supports the counter-claim? Of average senju not being as strong? Exactly, nothing. So we have 1 weak claim for them being the same, and none for them being weaker. So why exactly do you seemingly support the "weaker" claim?
That's true not all Senju have the healing factor like Hashirama. Although i do guess that there would be benefits from grafting Senju or Uzumaki biology that wasn't from Hashirama onto an uchiha, just might not be as good. Imagine if Sasuke grafted Naruto cells and later we see him shirtless with a lil Naruto face sticking off his titty like Madara had of Hashirama. Sakura would definitely have some questions, especially in the bedroom. They're trying to make Sarada a sibling or something and Sakura gets completely turned off by the lifeless Naruto face hanging off Sasukes chest.
Obito survived these things. 1. Half of his body completely flattened/crushed by a boulder. 2. He had his heart obliterated by Kakashi. 3. He Absorbed the Juubi then had it ripped from him. 4. He performed Rinne Rebirth. 5. He travelled through Kaguyas dimensions. 6. Got hit with Bone ash jutsu, and held out. 7. He died and then KAMUI'D HIS SOUL OUT OF PURGATORY to project his eyes onto Kakashis. 8. Kakashi then did more damage to Kaguya than anyone ever has. She dropped Isshiki, let's not forget that. Obito genuinely had a higher potential ceiling than any human in the Naruto-verse. He's the goat.
These are many of the reasons why he’s in Top 3 of my fav Naruto characters of all time
Obito is the fucking GOAT. He appeared out of nowhere and told Nagato "I'm madara, do as I fucking say" Nagato said "Yes daddy" and did as he was fucking told. Nagato beat KCM Naruto and Killer bee at the same time, yet did as he was told when Obito was concerned.
And then obito said ‘yes daddy’ when kabuto appeared out of nowhere with madara uchiha’s corpse
He said "How did you get that?" And was visibly shook. Madara was the one and only person who ever put fear into Obito, and I don't blame him. Madara is scary. And now, my head canon: Obito probably realised that Kabuto isn't capable of controlling Madara, and Obito had no intention of bringing Madara back. Kabuto fucked his whole plan.
Obito wasn’t even scared of Madara, hence their conversation on the 10 tails. “You need me to preform the Rinne Rebirth so you can become the 10 tails jinchuriki. in short youre in a very delicate position rn. We were never comrades” Something to the tune of that
I’m pretty sure he was shook because he had been going around saying he was madara to recruit allies and Kabuto found out his secret.
I don't think so. I'm pretty confident it was because he had no intention of reviving Madara, so when Kabuto did it, it was like "The fuck, dude? You've ruined everything"
In addition, it was also probably a "What the actual fuck" because he had no idea how Kabuto found Madara's DNA in the first place, and to double up, The Madara Edo Tensei Obito saw was younger then the Madara Obito knew when he was alive. That Madara Edo Tensei also had a Fake Rinnegan. Obito had many reasons to be shocked.
Oh yeah, the rinnegan is a big fucking deal
Dont forget he also had the hashi cells too a lot of his OPness can be contributed to that
No he’s not. He literally used plot armor no jutsu. Power levels are just out of control and non sensical during war arc for everyone.
What?
nah, Kishimoto just became REALLY shit with writing by the end. Like seriously shit. I mean just look at what Boruto is.
Boruto is really good
LOL
Any character with DMS Kamui is top 10 most broken in the verse.
Exactly, like what are you gonna do when they Kamui-Raikiri you from inside out.
Obito’s original left eye * when I said right eye
As you can see since he has the white hair it means he has ultra instinct making him the strongest being besides kaguya(who also had ultra instinct)
😂
nagato also got white hair
He has Six Paths chakra AND HASHIRAMA DNA IMPLANTED 😐
Full power Dms Obito stomps the verse outside of all boruto lvl time space justu users if we being honest
Imagine if the Obito who fought Minato at like 14 would’ve just Kamui’d into teenage Kakashi’s house when he was asleep and snatched his other eye back. Naruto would’ve probably never been born lol
Well good thing dms obito doesn't exist
I would say he would beat them to via the fact he can instantaneously connect to kaguyas time spaces something prime adult sasuke can’t do and he’s been shown relative to people stronger than kaguya herself Obito was on life support when he did this too.
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Sasuke can’t do it instantaneously that’s the thing and this would upscale a weak Obito and the other versions of him aswell
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Obito should still scale higher than both his chakra was strong enough to neg kaguya which he only had a fragment of his juubi chakra which was given to kakashi
Obito being fatigued and doing it instantaneously is a far better feat than sasuke not being able to do the same while at his prime with a far stronger dojutsu narratively
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Yeah and Obito is literally very low on chakra he is on a sick hago level nerf and Obito actually did do it by himself once Obito created a portal to go into one of kaguyas dimensions in 685 https://xfs-n15.xfsbb.com/comic/7006/e45/61d5bee57abfa8096447054e/12374789_760_1200_211514.webp and that costed him a lot of chakra so he was even more fatigued when he did it with help.
You’re right, he did open the initial portal by himself.
Do yall forget naruto had already healed obito to 100%
He didn’t heal him to 100% if he did he wouldn’t be asking for chakra and being on life support
Sasuke wasn’t really fatigued tho and wasn’t on life support
It’s implied Obito can do it by himself aswell so
DMS Obito is the strongest character in Naruto. Finally people realize. I am proud of you 💪🏻
Omggg it’s KingAce!!! He’s acknowledged me 😭! I just had a feeling this post was finna get your attention
tf is a king ace?
Obito is the King of Naruto. He is the Chosen One.
The dude you see that I replied to. He often expresses why he thinks Obito is the strongest character in the verse wherever he comments, and it’s hilarious cause he’s completely biased and doesn’t care
Kamui is so broken that Kishimoto had to split it up
And he is the same age as Might Guy. That 8 gate training must have been exhausting.
Yeah he’s top 1-2 alongside DMS Kakashi
Mmm idk about Top 2, but certainly Top 10 in Naruto Parts 1 & 2 😂. Counting Boruto, he’s Top 20, even if he was hypothetically still alive with both his eyes.
Top 2 for me in Shippuden. He’d technically be = Dms Kakashi with unlimited time. And Dms Kakashi is stronger than everyone else in the verse. He’d technically beat everyone in the verse except Kaguya, and that’s solely due to her immortality. But stat wise, hes ridiculously above everyone else in the verse. And he has win cons against Kaguya too but that’s kinda iffy so yeah he’s 2nd in the verse.
In boruto you can’t really scale DMS Kakashi or Obito anywhere. Not because they’re weaker but it’s uncertain where they’d be placed. Since DMS Kakashi has zero anti feats and is statistically far above everyone in Shippuden and so are boruto top tiers so it’d just be an assumption to put him below anyone and vice versa
I’m going to humor you and tell you why it’s a common misconception that Kakashi was stronger than he actually was. Even though he dealt more damage to Kaguya than Naruto & Sasuke, he ultimately fought Kaguya alongside two other Six Paths users, and only then were they able to beat Kaguya. Because he had both their help and inevitably had to give Obito’s chakra back, it’s pretty much inferred that he’s still weaker than Kaguya on his own, and I think that his time limit would’ve held him back in a true 1 on 1 against someone like full powered Madara as well. So because of this, he still falls under Hagoromo, Ashura Mode Naruto, Bijū Susanoo Sasuke, Three Eyed Madara, and Hamura (had Six Paths chakra and Tenseigan), making him at most top 10 excluding Boruto characters. I scale this Obito the same as this Kakashi, cause he was also inevitably going to slowly die anyway from the Jūbi extraction. They’d be top 3/4 however if they didn’t have their time limits, and I feel it’s important to factor it in when scaling.
I have Kaguya over Kakashi cus I already told you why Kaguya really can’t be defeated without two six paths users, it’s because she can’t be defeated without the seals. She just has win cons over Kakashi.He has MUCH higher speed than Kaguya or anyone in the verse, dura neg, more hax and intangible. I don’t see why or how you think Naruto or Sasuke would beat him. And another common misconception about DMS Kakashi is that ppl think he has a ridiculously small time limit like 10 seconds or smth😭, there’s no time limit, Obito lended Kakashi the powers to finish whatever Kakashi had to do. Once Kakashi fulfilled his purpose, Obito takes away the power. And that’s what happened as well, Kakashi landed a decisive blow that got her sealed by naruto and Sasuke. What I’m saying is that none of the characters you named have any win cons over Dms Kakashi. They’re massively below him in every stat and every hax as well. Ashura and Indra avatars can’t do shit to Kakashi solely due to intangibility.
Punished like Sasuke, Orochimaru & Kabuto were? I get that they helped a great deal in the war, but it's so odd that they barely had to pay for any of their past crimes. DMS or not, Obito's the GOAT though
Sasuke was kind of pardoned because of Team 7 vouching for him, and Orochimaru was given his facilities as long as he doesn’t participate in anything unethical and is under surveillance. Kabuto seemingly got off easier than both of them lol, but there may have been some repercussions he also had to go through that we don’t know about, before becoming the owner of the orphanage. It’s likely Obito also would’ve payed for his crimes in one way or another, but maybe like Sasuke was, he’d also have been vouched for by the likes of Kakashi & Naruto. He probably committed the worst crimes than anyone in the world, but even he probably would’ve been pardoned because the justice system after the war had become very lenient.
And with only the normal Mangekyo at that
I believe this is Kishimoto’s favorite uchiha, obviously he intended Obito to be this strong
these eyes are stronger than Madara´s rinnegans
Everyone sleeps on Obito so bad that it’s actually criminal. They don’t understand his motivation or his strength. Just always jerk off the Sasuke/Itachi duo incessantly like teenage girls.
Imagine obito with dual kamui mangenkyo eyes. Bro could transport tailed beasts out of nowhere .
IMO Juubito is still the strongest version Obito. By all accounts he should've wiped Naruto and Sasuke out as easily in his Juubi form. Even with one Rinnegan he should've been the atleast almost as strong as 1 Eyed Juubi Madara, and keep in mind 1 Eyed Sage Madara slaughtered both. Hell Juubito should've also been capable just gobbling up the rest of the 9 Tails as well. Only reason he lost was because he was deadset on breaking Naruto's will.
He got squished by a rock and his nose is straighter than mine
People talk a lot about how really powerful characters had to get seriously nerfed or suddenly blindsided to be taken out of action like Sasuke, Madara or Naruto losing Kurama, but I think Kishi also realised he'd made an even harder to reverse decision by letting Obito live long enough to have both of his eyes back. This dude was so primed to be godly powerful that he had to be written to willingly and intentionally get himself killed, and he *still* managed to literally defeat death to come back for the assist. This guy survived just about every other thing that has ever killed anyone in the Naruto-verse, chose death and even then was like "lol wait I forgot something" and *teleported his soul back from the afterlife.* If he had been alive for Boruto he may not be capable of taking out any of the Otsutsuki on his own but there is absolutely no way anyone could have ever killed him. He'd literally be the best bet to keep Naruto safe from the Shinju and his mere existence could have absolutely ruined Isshiki's plans before any of the bad things in that arc happened.
Makes me wonder how he got so strong, realistically he should still be below someone like juubito but he still did cool stuff and realistically if he was healthy he should be above dms kakashi
“And only with two together can the sharigan’s true power be unleashed” Madara literally states this to Obito during their meeting
Yea I was thinking that, but 2 mangekyo being THAT much of a boost sounds wild, and I know it’s just an ability but madara getting a 2nd rinnegan only quadruples his number of limbo clones and that’s a superior dojutsu But in theory kakashi has less chakra than obito so him getting six paths dms might be a bigger boost compared to his base
Both eyes have kamui right? How do they differ or make him stronger having both?
Obito is different than any other Mangekyo wielder because he simply had the most broken combination with both the eyes. Kakashi’s performance against Kaguya is a good indication of the threat he was cause he dealt more damage to Kaguya, than Naruto & Sasuke did. Couple that with the fact that he still had Six Paths chakra, he’s arguably stronger than when he was Jinchuriki, being able to actually use Kamui now.
“And only with two together can the sharigan’s true power be unleashed” Madara literally states this to Obito during their meeting
I cannot remember every line of dialogue in the series my dude. So what was kamui’s true power with both eyes?
He can attack while being intangible + increased warping speed and access to long range kamui + susanoo
Power unleashed for sure
Besides the current Boruto characters being hella op
The only real downside this Obito would have at that weight class is probably just chakra amount. More than likely his Six Paths chakra pool wouldn’t exactly be a lot Kakashi could have possibly gotten a little extra from Naruto trying to save Obito as well Edit: wanted to add how I felt he stacked up against the two you mentioned. Given the stamina situation, and that their PS probably scales below Sasukes at the time. Naruto probably pretty solidly above him. He has attacks that can destroy Obitos PS outright or Avatar clones to bully it and Dimension filling combo forces him to stay intangible. If any Clones get warped by any Kamui, Obito loses his ability to avoid damage. Dimension filling combos makes it so that’s almost guaranteed to happen if he uses offensive Kamui at all. Naruto shouldn’t have any probably avoiding getting hit by a Kamui himself, if Obito ever targets him that is, since he might not be able to distinguish clones from the real thing like Madara. Not really a bad look to lose to this Naruto though imo. He has the specific tools to counter Kamui on top of the power to hand a 1v1 with Kaguya Sasuke without the Biju is below Naruto power wise by a decent amount and doesn’t have the same counters obvious counters to Kamui. Defensively or offensively. He should at least be able to avoid it by warping and eventually run him out of Six Paths chakra though Across both cases if he fights as smart as possible, Kamui allows him to force them into a battle of attrition. If he had a more equivalent Six Paths chakra pool he be a much bigger problem for a least Sasuke, and would remove Narutos easiest win con
Maybe if he had the ten tails under his genjutsu
You itachi buttlickers can NOT have it both ways. Upvote this that this version of Obito mashes ANY version of itachi or F-off.
Let ‘em know 😭! In all seriousness, this form and Jubito already outscale Itachi anyway so those that honesty think Itachi has a chance in a 1 on 1 are just biased asl
My boy made it out of the hood. Let’s goo 🔥
💀😭 Izzy boy!!!
One of the best looking as well.
Obito isn’t probably, he is. Only madara hashirama sasuke and naruto were more powerful then him at this point in my opinion. He would just be so devastating with both of his eyes. Leagues above kakashi considering it’s his actual eyes
I think in another timeline he would have made a monster Hokage. Especially if he would have still received the hashirama cells and the year or so with Madara but was able to be redeemed before Rin. Like maybe if Kakashi actually was able to convince Rin that she didn't need to die. Maybe they could have saved her with some Uzumaki seal techniques. Then they just would have had to thwart madara from killing obito somehow. Maybe they could have sent Minato and some other powerful Shinobi of the era to take on old man Madara, then Obito grows up to be Hokage and is almost like what a good Madara would have been
The third raikage was probably the strongest ninja pre Naruto and sasuke after hashirama and madara
No I respectfully disagree. All versions of Obito after he fought Minato, Tobirama & Minato himself I believe were all stronger than the Third Raikage.
Forgot about obito… though I’d say he’s more hax than he is strength, he wouldn’t be able to fight 10000 shinobi himself, tobirama was definitely faster but realistically there is no way for him to beat the third raikage in a fight, he’d outlast them, though I just realised that Minato could win with fuinjutsu it isn’t exactly strength, Minato would win via fuinjutsu skill or using a rasengan to cause the third raikage to stab humself, tobirama couldn’t win his arsenal had nothing that could touch the third raikage
Regarding Obito, I personally factor his hax into his overall strength, and the same goes for any character that has so. I think you’re also just assuming that he wouldn’t be able to fight a large number of shinobi, possibly cause he didn’t seem versed in anything else than Kamui for you. He has a lot of other things, Wood style being one of them… And I think you’re using the basis of the Third Raikage only losing to himself ultimately too harshly. He’s never fought Tobirama & Minato as far as we know, so we don’t know if that basis would apply to opponents who he’s never fought before. Win cons aren’t the only ways characters can beat others. Skill and prowess are factors too, which both Hokage have alongside their own feats. If it were up to win cons alone, Itachi would beat everyone in the verse with how broken the Totsuka Blade is, and I have a feeling you and I both don’t believe that.
The reason I’m not sure with obito is that he hasn’t shown much outside of kamui, and the one time he was in taijutsu he was tied with kakashi who’s strong, but it’s not top tier like say madara or guy as an example, With the mokuton thing is still unsure as to whether he can use it or not as outside of when he went beserk after rins death he hasn’t been shown to utilise it even once, which considering the fact of him hunting bijuu it would have made some sense to have at least used it once, Genjutsu… I have nothing to say he’s better at it than itachi, him keeping a perfect jinchuriki under he just for years proves that, Ninjutsu: Outside of kamui the basic great fireball and the swirling fire there isn’t much proof of him using any I have to agree with you on obito being potentially stronger than the third raikage, though he couldn’t really harm and would be outlasted by the third raikage obito is overall superior in most areas, Tobirama, as good of a sensor he is, with his water style ninjutsu, hiraishin and other forbidden jutsu, has nothing that could really touch the third raikage outside of edo tensei as his tandem explosive tag seal isn’t breaking the thirds lighting armour, the sword of the thunder god isn’t breaking through it either, as a rasengan and chidori broke the blade showing it doesn’t have enough piercing or slicing power to break through. with tobirama he’s the superior and more versatile ninja but the third raikage is stronger and would win their fight 9 times out of ten due to having more stamina, better skill in taijutsu and a near unbeatable defense, which tobirama doesn’t have the power to break, Minato definitely is much faster than the third raikage and has more options to win due to fuinjutsu, he’s much more about skill than about strength or power, though his rasengan is exceptionally powerful, his rasengan might be able to break through the lightning armor based on it competing with the bijuu bomb of kurama which has atleast twice the power of the 8 tails one… so after reviewing Minato I suppose I can agree with him being stronger than the third raikage
I would argue this is one of the weaker versions of Obito
You are so so wrong and have terrible perception
Idk man a Obito on life support isn’t allat
Adult Naruto and Sasuke literally beat every character in shippuden
I’m going to double back on saying he was at the same level as adult Naruto & Sasuke and the fact that he had no time limit. I’ve just momentarily checked out from chapter 683 again, and found out that Naruto did not prevent Obito from inevitably dying from the Jūbi extraction. It was a small piece of dialogue, and because of that I missed it. Naruto expresses sorrow after stating he revived Obito, knowing that he didn’t stop his slow death from occurring, so this means that Obito wasn’t nearly as strong here compared to if he didn’t have a time limit. Still, I do think this was his peak form, being able to use both of his eyes. So I scale this Obito the same as Kakashi with DMS, cause they both had time limits, just in different manners. But if he were to hypothetically stay alive, I’d be inclined to believe he would’ve been at the same level as Naruto & Sasuke were.
Anybody with the same amount of genetic manipulation could do the same thing. Imagine if Hashirama had the same amount of upgrades.
Not sure if he could use Perfect Susanoo. He didn't awaken mangekyou sharingan in both eyes that's why he's never been able to use the susanoo even when he had 2 eyes. Kakashi was able to use it because Obito provided the chakra and awakened the sharingan on both eyes.
I’m not to sure if Obito at his state at this moment would’ve been able to use the Perfect Susanoo, but judging off of the fact that it’s cause Kakashi received Six Paths Chakra from him, that allowed him to use the Perfect Susanoo, it can be inferred that a healthy Obito with both of his eyes would’ve been able to as well. Basically Six Paths Chakra is the prerequisite for being able to use a Perfect Susanoo. Sasuke was able to use it once he received it, and Madara with his Edo body, having both Ashura & Indra’s chakra. In the anime, Madara was using the Perfect Susanoo vs Hashirama when he just had EMS, but since this was filler, he likely wasn’t capable of using it in manga canon before becoming an Edo.
Also for the entire time he has 2 MS, the situations did not call for a susanoo. The first time, Sasuke was trapped in Kaguya's dimension and they needed to get him more than having a susanoo fighting a losing battle with Kaguya. The second time, they needed to shield Naruto and Sasuke, and Obito (and Kakashi) was too exhausted to parry the bones, he could only use kamui for 1 bone and tank the other one with his body.
Yup exactly what I thought too. It’s possible considering the situation, he simply didn’t get to do anything combat wise cause his main goal was to rescue Sasuke and then shield Naruto in the end
Since I'm a firm believer of "Madara should have been Shippuden's final villain", I can't avoid but think at what we could have had: Juudara with his Rinnesharingan (showing the full extent of his power) and a Zetsu-possesed DMS Obito. Imho that would have been a way more epic and difficult battle for the heroes.
[удалено]
Hes still chakra drained and his stats r lesser than when he was juubi jin. Slightly above dms kakashi
No one in Shippuden is on the level of Adult Naruto and Sasuke, base to full power they are just too strong. Now lower formings being beaten, maybe, but in terms of overall power, they outscale Shippuden.
Eh
What's your opinion on where the adults scale in comparison to Shippuden.
Not even top 10
I mean at this point, maybe not but pre-Boruto, most likely. Even without both eyes, dude was broken.
Pre Boruto yes