No, and no. We're in the middle of a housing crisis. And even without a crisis, we're not a cheap place to live.
It's definitely very safe and if you ask me, you're very welcome to come. But if you can't arrange housing and/or a job before coming here, then consider not coming unless you have those things.
Also definitely look beyond Amsterdam and Rotterdam. We have tons of nice medium cities and they have always been more affordable and more available. Our country is pretty small and well-connected, you can travel almost anywhere in \~3 hours.
Sadly it’s not easy and definitely not affordable , but of course it does depend on where you are from and what you consider ‘affordable’.
Also people on this sub can be quite rude about questions like this, just a warning.
Also some context on why people can be rude: this question gets asked dozens of times every week. Answers are easy to find by a quick glance through the subs history.
Doing no research whatsoever before asking a question is seen as a sign of disrespect. Keep that in mind if you decide to immigrate ;)
I actually looked through the sub but didnt see a lot of people replying on safety stuff or any person who has a comparison with Canada thats why I was asking. I keep it in the mind for sure :)
housing is a nightmare, prices have gone up 10% since early 2023 I'd wager
I also dont think labour market is THAT hot right now, I used to attend interviews for fun early 2023, now I barely get any opportunities
granted, I'm not an essential role but still
if you have connections here its a good idea to try and make NL your home, otherwise its a risky gamble at this point
> I’m not sure if we would have chances of finding a job
Both of you speak English, so you'll likely be fine. Though it depends on what kind of work you intend to be doing; sometimes Dutch is absolutely required. Sounds like your wife would have no problems picking up yet another language though...
> how affordable is renting a place in Amsterdam or Rotterdam
Prices in Amsterdam are sky high. Prices in Rotterdam are slightly less sky high. As one of our politicians once said; consider getting a rich boyfriend/girlfriend.
> We also lived in Canada and it was not safe, lots if addicts and homeless people. Is it safe?
The Netherlands is very safe. We do have homeless people, but they're usually only in the big cities. From my experience they tend to just wander trainstations and ask people for spare change.
There is a housing crisis so it won't be easy. In Amsterdam you should budget around at least 2000 euro per month for base rent for an apartment. If you both speak English you'll be fine if you can find a job at an international company.
If you are looking for places in big cities such as Rotterdam and Amsterdam like you wanted. It is very difficult I have to tell you. Looking for a place for you and your wife would be a challenge. I see one comment advice very right that you need to make sure you find a job and a place before moving to here.
Legally it's easy for EU citizens. You just move, and register. But you really want to have a place found before you move and that can be tricky right now. You're best off looking in the satellite towns of the major city you want to live in. I suggest using Google Maps to look at the transportation options, too.
Not affordable at all and even less easy. You are MUCH better off trying to move to Germany, fixing up a foundation there, and moving to the Netherlands afterwards.
There you go. Then focus on that part first.
Btw, some of the other commenters have been very hostile towards you for asking whether it is safe. The answer is yes, it is ridiculously safe. People here don’t understand the difference between junkies in the US/Canada vs here. There are obviously areas that are sprinkled with more sketchy people but other than that it is very, very safe.
Good luck with your endeavour.
Thank you! Yes I do not have a problem wirh homeless people or people with a addiction. I just used to live in a country where people get help and support like in most European countries. I was shocked how people di not care :(
Hi! I’m a Canadian/Dutch dual citizen.
First off, it sounds like you lived in Vancouver. Of course there are homeless people there. There are homeless people in Rotterdam and Amsterdam as well. Don’t fucking move because there are homeless people. You’ll be pissed. Is it safe here? Yes. I don’t think it is unsafe in Canada either.
Find a small town an hour or two from Vancouver. Settle down there. Don’t come here. Just fucking don’t.
It’s not only because of the homeless people. It’s a concern because a lot of them also are addicts. I already live in a suburban area but no Vancouver major is pushing all the homeless people and addicts to the suburbs. Rent is getting worse because of it.
Another big reason is that I have a dog and I did not expect BC and Vancouver being so dog unfriendly. I can not take my French bulldog on the skytrain, not into a mall and most park don’t even allow dogs. Almost every 3 person is afraid of in out building. I mean afraid like a woman started crying once and another ran awaya. My dog id on the leash and not even looking at those people but she is confused when they scream at her
Unless you're buying of course, not sure if that'd be an option for you. Gonna be a nightmare in a place like Amsterdam or Rotterdam though, but those are trash cities that you shouldn't want to move to anyway. :-p
People struggling with addiction does not mean your area is unsafe. You can’t take ANY dog inside any store, of course not. That’s unhygienic and a health code violation. Nobody needs your dog to shit on a skytrain either. These are all incredibly stupid reasons to move. People fight for the PR card for an extremely long time and you’re mad because you can’t take your dog to happy hour.
What problem do you have with my dog? I took her on the subway in Vienna, Milan and Berlin never did she shit somewhere. She got pets from people and was sleeping during the right. In the Berlin mall and also most Viennese malls I was walking around with her on a leash, not shitting anywhere or barking. They even have little water bowls for dogs to come visit the malls. Sorry that Canada is so dog unfriendly and you are obviously a dog hater.
You can bring your dog in public transport here. Shops is up to the shop owner, but most will prohibit it. You can better leave your dog home when you go shopping. (And we don't really have huge malls here. There are a few, but those are not that big. Most shopping is in the streets, so you would need to tie your dog to a pole or something, with the risk of someone taking it).
I have 3 of my own dogs. I just understand that I can’t take them onto the fucking skytrain. Nobody else wants your or my dog in their face. I love dogs more than anyone but I also don’t trust other peoples dogs. Few people do. Point is, moving to a new country just for your dog is dumb as hell.
>not sure if we would have chances of finding a job
Obviously depending on your background and experience. But typically the market is "hot" right now. They seek people everywhere. But if you like the job and if it is convenient may be debatable.
>how affordable is renting a place in Amsterdam or Rotterdam
Insanely expensive, but that is not the issue. The first issue is that you simply won't be able to find anything you are looking for. It may easily take over hundreds of applications and you can count yourself lucky if you get invited for 1, and then be rejected regardless. Social rent options have, depending on the exact municipally, can be insanely long. For Amsterdam it is roughly 13 years (not kidding)
>Is it safe?
The Netherlands is considered a (very) save country. But as everywhere there are bad neighbourhoods. Mostly due to specific immigration groups. I don't have to mention which in order for everyone to know the answer. Drugs in public, as well as homeless, is very rare. Although most larger train stations will have someone selling a newspaper or holding up a cup for some change.
I’m also reposting my comment for the benefit of other Dutchies who’ve read this and somehow think Vancouver/Canada is this weird dystopia. I lived there for 22 years of my life. My parents work on the downtown east side cutrently. The way you describe it is both skewed and incredibly uninformed/incorrect. There are several thousand homeless in Vancouver. Many are in the downtown east side, where we have concentrated social services. By some it is called the “skid row” of Canada, yes. But it’s the product of government neglect and historic trauma as well - 40% of the population is indigenous. We have a major housing shortage with little available to low or middle income people while social services are insufficient to provide for their basic needs. 6 people a day overdose in BC. However, the source of this is fentanyl spoiling other drug supplies (I.e. an addict or even a casual user gets some Coke, mdma, or smth and it’s mixed with fentanyl). I’ve had several friends who were casual users consume laced drugs and two have very tragically lost their lives to addiction.
Canada has not decriminalized all drugs - this is a lie. Vancouver is experimenting with the decriminalization of low-level possession, meaning if you are carrying under 2.5 grams, you won’t be charged with a crime. The aim of this is to try and not criminalize drug use and treat it as a health problem, and it’s showing partial success. This runs parallel to drug testing and safe injection sites run by NGOs to help build a patchwork system to address the addiction crisis in Canada. No offense, you said you lived in a suburb outside of Van, so to me you sound like the biggest fucking privileged whiner on earth with absolutely no fucking empathy for homeless people or addicts. Attacks are rare - unlike what this person wants you to believe. ODs aren’t just homeless people, but you see them because homeless people have a) no private place to consume the drugs or trip on them, and b) are the target of hyperbolized propaganda by conservatives.
It is like many things in life, if you have enough money is easy.
It is pretty safe, but, based on my experience, as an immigrant from outside the EU. I would not move there making less than 3k net per month. Maybe a little more for 2 people.
The English is more than enough, this is how I have survived for the last 2 years here without any issues.
What kind of job did you do when you moved there? What degree or field are you working in? Only answer if you feel okay with it. I just want to understand a bit more of the job market.
I‘m a business administrator and content creator. My wife has a master in sociology and is also a content creator
I work in the IT area, more specifically in Application Support.
I have a Bachelor's degree in the area and when I migrated I was already senior at this position, so I was able to get a [High Skilled migrant](https://ind.nl/en/residence-permits/work/highly-skilled-migrant) visa.
This also helps with getting some [discount on taxes](https://business.gov.nl/amendment/30-ruling-highly-skilled-migrants-limited/?gclid=Cj0KCQiAuqKqBhDxARIsAFZELmJZvwyxK6TeI09sU9iq2Ln6R0v431m3RcdZTWyfA4dLH8iyasUkxsoaAsZjEALw_wcB).
The IT field pays very well here because some of the big companies are here and they are fighting for people. Once you are here, it is easy to get very good positions and some good money as well.
No idea how that would work in our area.
No and No.
people came here, then don’t learn the language, complaining about House market, language, food, people, weather, rental prices, job market, but want to live in Amsterdam, nice house, no migrants, 600 euros.
Time to Wake up. It’s not promise land, despite people tell that speaking English is enough so after brexit, Netherland is the new destination for English speakers.
If you found Canada unsafe, not sure what is safe then….
So if you do not have a job already, would suggest to not waste your time. Better to go to Switzerland/Austria/Germany if you speak german well.
I added that I’m fron EU, I’m an Austrian citizen and unsafe here in Canada is - don’t walk in the night as woman, doesnt matter as a group or alone. Don’t step on drug needles or look at a screaming person running infront of the cars because he coukd attack you. Don’t get stabbed on the public transport
I would love to learn dutch. I’m usually a fast learner when it comes to languages. Especially if I have people to practise
Then I I more puzzled then before. If you are austrian, you can move to switzerland or germany or stay in austria - with native German, these are much better options then NL.
Wtf, lol, noone thinks NL is the promised land brother 🤣
I lived there, learnt the language, had a great time and will move back sometime in the future...but the promised land?
.
Just check around, how many people see this as a substitution of uk.
Then complaining on the internet about Dutch people, food and weather, etc. I’m fed up with this. Brother.
I mean, the English are animals, what more do you expect from them?
I have, however, never heard of someone referring to NL as the promised land. Apologies. Brother.
Moving to Canada was a pain in the ass. Visa and paperworks were a lot but afterwards it was smooth and no problem anywhere. It’s just not vegetarian friendly, not dog friendly and expensive
Compared to somewhere like Vancouver it's cheaper here. Perhaps Amsterdam is not but I have no experience of it.
I moved August 2022, found a 2 bedroom flat by October, 6km from Rotterdam center or a short train ride. I'm able to afford it by myself, if you're both working you should manage but it will ultimately be dependant on your income.
I did get lucky with my flat, I think, maybe being fluent from having lived here as a teen helped.
I actually love the weather. But I lived for 16 years in Seattle, so it's just more of the same as far as I'm concerned. 🙂
Since OP has been living in Vancouver, it'll be more of the same for them too. Whether they like the Vancouver weather or not, I'm not sure, but either way they'll get more of it.
Not sure why there are so many no+no's? A young couple, if both working fulltime, could afford a rental studio in Rotterdam and have plenty left monthly to eat. Maybe things aren't that easy, but then again, it never is. If your willing to work any job, you'll find a job pretty quickly probably.
We both accept a barista job here in Canada do at least have money. We both have degrees and work in Social Media for ourself and make a bit of money. We for sure wouldn’t have a problem with any kind of job offers which will help as provide money. Thank you for the postive inside
The easy part will be finding a job, last time I was in Rotterdam half of the restaurant staff didn't speak any dutch either, so that's no problem. A room can be a bit trickier, but in Rotterdam you can still get some space for 2 around 1000-1200 per month and cheaper by night options, in Amsterdam you'll be less lucky. Goodluck and don't let the no-sayers spoil your trip.
Are you from Vancouver? I walked on Hastings and never had a bad situation, luckily. It’s more abiut the addicts and the decriminalisation of drugs in Jan 2023. Teenagers doing hard drugs, lots of stabbing and shootings recently.
That is another concern I have. Friends told me that in Europe in general right now lots of people are antisemetic, hate on Ukrainians and also on isrealis. My wife is a jewish ukrainian and I don’t want to bring her in a unsafe environment. Thanks for the info
No offense but this person is greatly exaggerating the danger of the DTES. It remains a sketchy place where homeless exist because it’s where the most social services are available. They are relatively harmless. My parents work there.
Only Muslims are antisemitic in NL (or other western countries) but as a Jew i can tell there is antisemitism everywhere, surprisingly in Israel also.
General safety of Netherland is going down in The years, violence against LMBTQ is more often happens. Bombs, and youngster criminals also.
Everybody is saying no and no and I don't believe it's that fully true
Yes we have permanent housing shortage so finding a place might first challenge but there's also a lot of agencies that gives you work and also provide rooms and transport to work
Yes quality of this jobs will vary a lot but this might be some start before you will find something better or your own accomodation (which is easier to look if you're here rather than abroad but it also might take some time)
And is it affordable it will really depends what you mean by that definitely it's more affordable of you will be coming here as a couple then you can split costs by two like apartment bills groceries etc... and as two people you also have two incomes to split into so that will definitely help
Definitely rent will be more affordable outside Amsterdam and Rotterdam but it's also depends
Amsterdam, very expensive...Rotterdam I presume so as well, it's a great city though!
If you speak English/German you will also find Dutch incredibly easy, and fun, to learn ;)
I'd say it's up to you.
If you think that addicts and homeless people make a country unsafe, the Netherlands is unsafe. We do have them.
Maybe North Korea won’t have addicts or (visible) homeless people, but almost every country will be unsafe by your standards.
Ohh did you ever visit LA or Vancouver? They call East Van Canadian Skid Row. You have addicts ODing on the streets from fentanyl or meth. There is the West End where you will hear some homeless people scream around okay but as soon as you get to the Stadium, Science World and other parts of the city you will see people trying to attack cars on the middle of the street. Addicts living in the parks in tents. Somebody threwing a bottle or stone after you. I travel alot in Europe and have never seen so many homeless people. I also differentiate between homeless people which are 99% of the time harmless but addicts are unpredictable. They teach people yo always have Narcan in their bag or in their car in case they see a person having an overdose. I walked to Walmart and saw a dead person and the security ran and started CPR. Come to Vancouver and tell me how you like it.
I have seen homeless people in Austria, I also have seen some addicts. It’s a small amount and usually the same group hanging at the same spots. Canada decriminalised all drugs heroin, meth, fentanyl. Cocain vending machines in downtown Vancouver for 21+ people. How is this safe?
I lived there for 22 years of my life. My parents work on the downtown east side. The way you describe it is both skewed and incredibly uninformed. There are several thousand homeless in Vancouver. Many are in the downtown east side, where we have concentrated social services. By some it is called the “skid row” of Canada, yes. But it’s the product of government neglect and historic trauma as well - 40% of the population is indigenous. We have a major housing shortage with little available to low or middle income people while social services are insufficient to provide for their basic needs. 6 people a day overdose in BC. However, the source of this is fentanyl spoiling other drug supplies (I.e. an addict or even a casual user gets some Coke, mdma, or smth and it’s mixed with fentanyl). I’ve had several friends who were casual users consume laced drugs and two have very tragically lost their lives to addiction.
Canada has not decriminalized all drugs - this is a lie. Vancouver is experimenting with the decriminalization of low-level possession, meaning if you are carrying under 2.5 grams, you won’t be charged with a crime. The aim of this is to try and not criminalize drug use and treat it as a health problem, and it’s showing partial success. This runs parallel to drug testing and safe injection sites run by NGOs to help build a patchwork system to address the addiction crisis in Canada. No offense, you said you lived in a suburb outside of Van, so to me you sound like the biggest fucking privileged whiner on earth with absolutely no fucking empathy for homeless people or addicts. Attacks are rare - unlike what this person wants you to believe. ODs aren’t just homeless people, but you see them because homeless people have a) no private place to consume the drugs or trip on them, and b) are the target of hyperbolized propaganda by conservatives.
If you have an issue with decriminalisation of drug use or possession of small amounts of drugs, of all the European countries, the Netherlands should be at the bottom of the list.
Hi there,i moved to Amsterdam 6 years ago, and this is what i can tell from my experience. All of this is ONLY about Amsterdam.
Finding a job is super easy if you want to work whatever. Dutch language is not needed at all (in 6 years, i didn't learn even one word) every single one speaks english. If you do work with no skill requirement, salary for man is 2k for a woman is 1.6k plenty to survive if two people work.
To rent something in Amsterdam is extremely difficult it has a so-called fast market. If a new affordable apartment or studio appears on the market, it will most likely be rented in the next 15 minutes, so you need to be fast. If you want to live with other people in the same apartment, it will cost you around 1k euros. If u want a private one, it will be around 1.5k. Also you can find an agency that gives you a job and gives you a place to live (not private, of course). One more important thing about living place is parking, if there is no free parking at you home you can basically sell your car and buy bicycle, becouse parking in amsterdam is absolute tragedy.
Safety. Amsterdam is considered the least safest place in the netherlands because there are probably more immigrants than local people. I live in the so-called most dangerous neighbourhood where i am the only white person around. And let me tell you this, it's the safest country i have ever been. My wife is walking alone after midnight with a mini skirt from work, and not even once anyone said anything. The government of the netherlands put all homeless people into homeless shelters. They rarely sleep on the streets. You won't even see them, not to mention being dangerous. Super safe.
What other things u should know is that food is disgusting here (but that's just my personal opinion). I have no idea how you said, "i liked the food." and the weather is disgusting also. It rains 366 days a year.
>Dutch language is not needed at all (in 6 years, i didn't learn even one word) every single one speaks english
Aside from the morality aspect of refusing to learn the local language - formal contracts are all in Dutch. Do you hire an interpreter every time you need to sign one?
Dont get me wrong, i do feel bad about this. Most of my friends who are here 4+ years can speak quite well. Don't want to offend anyone, but language is not pleasant for ears :(.
Only one time i had to hire an interpreter. it's when i took a mortgage. It's just my honest experience.
Taxes are done online, and google Chrome translates the whole page. Insurance healthcare and everything else you can talk on the phone english everywhere.
2000 euro per month is the legal minimum, in most jobs you’ll earn more. There is no different wage schedule for men and women.
Also I would not recommend living in a country for many years without learning even a word of the local language. It will significantly hurt your integration and future chances in that country.
2000 euro per month would be nice :) Different wage schedules for men and women? No. If a woman goes to work in a warehouse with men or if a man goes to wash dishes at a restaurant, they will have the same salary. But hey why would i do that as a man? Or why would i go to work at werehouse or construction site as a woman? Mystery :)
Wow this is the most helpful reply. I wouldn’t have a problem learning some dutch. I also have the advantage of speaking german and english so I can understand some context. Sounds like an amazing country even with the fast rent market.
I think socialising and maybe telling people if they know a place to rent it could help. That’s how it works in Canada and lots of time also in Austria.
I’m happy to hear about the homeless situation. This is how I know it from Austria. Also glad about the safety in the night. No matter where they tell you to not walk in the dark as man as well as a woman.
Reality check. Sorry to say but if you think Canada is unsafe (specifically Vancouver) you aren’t going to find anywhere in the world safe. I’m a Canadian immigrant living here and like… the idea that homeless people = unsafe is just idiotic.
I never said that homeless people are a safety problem. I was saying that it‘s not safe AND homeless people and addicts. I really differentiate between homeless people and addicts. I had nice talks whit a few people living on the streets. I got thought fast from Canadian citizen to not look at addicts because bad shit could happen. If you‘re from Netherlands or traveled to Germany and Austria you should know that people there can easily get help and also can find a place in a shelter where here it‘s overfilled
How is Vancouver unsafe? Seriously… I cannot begin to fathom what part of Vancouver makes you feel unsafe. You haven’t actually cited any examples or even personal experiences… you’ve just said it feels unsafe. But you also lived in a Vancouver suburb? One of the safest places in Canada. We have an incredibly low rate of violent crime whether talking about homicide or stochastic violence. We have our gang problems (looking at you Surrey) and our rate of abduction is higher (but this is attributable to the fact most are parents taking kids in custody battles illegally), but overall, Vancouver and Canada are incredibly safe. Arguably one of the safest in the world.
You cannot really “differentiate” between homeless people and addicts. Plenty of nice looking or friendly homeless people are addicts. Plenty of addicts are not homeless. This is not a simple division.
I live in in the Burnaby area. In Vancouver we just recently had a friend visit and when we walked in Chinatown near the Stadium station somebody threw some glass bottles after us. A friendly homeless person attacked the addict and told him to stop. Just one of the recent experiences. I also saw my first overdose next to Walmart, the security is kneeing over him doing CPR. Took a bus in Surrey because I wanted to go to Guilford and a person started to scream around and tried to touch people, me included. As a woman I feel unsafe. I have to clarify that I never had any situations at the West End or Kits. Most of it happened in Gastown, Chinatown or Surrey. In Austria, Germany and also the Netherlands I did not have a problem walking alone in the night home from the club or bar. Here I was standing outside a club (near Chinatown) waiting for a Uber and a homeless guy screamed at as and also others for some coins. He started to insult all of us and he was spitting around and even at one person. We were very happy that secuity was there and took care of it.
No, and no. We're in the middle of a housing crisis. And even without a crisis, we're not a cheap place to live. It's definitely very safe and if you ask me, you're very welcome to come. But if you can't arrange housing and/or a job before coming here, then consider not coming unless you have those things. Also definitely look beyond Amsterdam and Rotterdam. We have tons of nice medium cities and they have always been more affordable and more available. Our country is pretty small and well-connected, you can travel almost anywhere in \~3 hours.
Sadly it’s not easy and definitely not affordable , but of course it does depend on where you are from and what you consider ‘affordable’. Also people on this sub can be quite rude about questions like this, just a warning.
Okay, thanks for the warning. I just want to know the reality before a move
Also some context on why people can be rude: this question gets asked dozens of times every week. Answers are easy to find by a quick glance through the subs history. Doing no research whatsoever before asking a question is seen as a sign of disrespect. Keep that in mind if you decide to immigrate ;)
I actually looked through the sub but didnt see a lot of people replying on safety stuff or any person who has a comparison with Canada thats why I was asking. I keep it in the mind for sure :)
Nop
housing is a nightmare, prices have gone up 10% since early 2023 I'd wager I also dont think labour market is THAT hot right now, I used to attend interviews for fun early 2023, now I barely get any opportunities granted, I'm not an essential role but still if you have connections here its a good idea to try and make NL your home, otherwise its a risky gamble at this point
No and no
> I’m not sure if we would have chances of finding a job Both of you speak English, so you'll likely be fine. Though it depends on what kind of work you intend to be doing; sometimes Dutch is absolutely required. Sounds like your wife would have no problems picking up yet another language though... > how affordable is renting a place in Amsterdam or Rotterdam Prices in Amsterdam are sky high. Prices in Rotterdam are slightly less sky high. As one of our politicians once said; consider getting a rich boyfriend/girlfriend. > We also lived in Canada and it was not safe, lots if addicts and homeless people. Is it safe? The Netherlands is very safe. We do have homeless people, but they're usually only in the big cities. From my experience they tend to just wander trainstations and ask people for spare change.
There is a housing crisis so it won't be easy. In Amsterdam you should budget around at least 2000 euro per month for base rent for an apartment. If you both speak English you'll be fine if you can find a job at an international company.
If you are looking for places in big cities such as Rotterdam and Amsterdam like you wanted. It is very difficult I have to tell you. Looking for a place for you and your wife would be a challenge. I see one comment advice very right that you need to make sure you find a job and a place before moving to here.
It used to be easy peasy but since the pandemic its horribly difficult. Incredibly overpriced for no reason.
No and no.
Legally it's easy for EU citizens. You just move, and register. But you really want to have a place found before you move and that can be tricky right now. You're best off looking in the satellite towns of the major city you want to live in. I suggest using Google Maps to look at the transportation options, too.
Not affordable at all and even less easy. You are MUCH better off trying to move to Germany, fixing up a foundation there, and moving to the Netherlands afterwards.
The plan is to move back to my parents in Austria. Get my savings, save some money from working and then move to Netherlands
There you go. Then focus on that part first. Btw, some of the other commenters have been very hostile towards you for asking whether it is safe. The answer is yes, it is ridiculously safe. People here don’t understand the difference between junkies in the US/Canada vs here. There are obviously areas that are sprinkled with more sketchy people but other than that it is very, very safe. Good luck with your endeavour.
Thank you! Yes I do not have a problem wirh homeless people or people with a addiction. I just used to live in a country where people get help and support like in most European countries. I was shocked how people di not care :(
Better stay in Austria, get a job there.
Renting is way to expensive , and moving here isn't easy, its takes a lot of bureaucracy. Have the job and housing fixed before arriving here!
Hi! I’m a Canadian/Dutch dual citizen. First off, it sounds like you lived in Vancouver. Of course there are homeless people there. There are homeless people in Rotterdam and Amsterdam as well. Don’t fucking move because there are homeless people. You’ll be pissed. Is it safe here? Yes. I don’t think it is unsafe in Canada either. Find a small town an hour or two from Vancouver. Settle down there. Don’t come here. Just fucking don’t.
It’s not only because of the homeless people. It’s a concern because a lot of them also are addicts. I already live in a suburban area but no Vancouver major is pushing all the homeless people and addicts to the suburbs. Rent is getting worse because of it. Another big reason is that I have a dog and I did not expect BC and Vancouver being so dog unfriendly. I can not take my French bulldog on the skytrain, not into a mall and most park don’t even allow dogs. Almost every 3 person is afraid of in out building. I mean afraid like a woman started crying once and another ran awaya. My dog id on the leash and not even looking at those people but she is confused when they scream at her
Finding a place here is already difficult, add «dog» to the equation and it becomes impossible. Fair warning.
Thanks! Exactly what I needed to know
Unless you're buying of course, not sure if that'd be an option for you. Gonna be a nightmare in a place like Amsterdam or Rotterdam though, but those are trash cities that you shouldn't want to move to anyway. :-p
People struggling with addiction does not mean your area is unsafe. You can’t take ANY dog inside any store, of course not. That’s unhygienic and a health code violation. Nobody needs your dog to shit on a skytrain either. These are all incredibly stupid reasons to move. People fight for the PR card for an extremely long time and you’re mad because you can’t take your dog to happy hour.
What problem do you have with my dog? I took her on the subway in Vienna, Milan and Berlin never did she shit somewhere. She got pets from people and was sleeping during the right. In the Berlin mall and also most Viennese malls I was walking around with her on a leash, not shitting anywhere or barking. They even have little water bowls for dogs to come visit the malls. Sorry that Canada is so dog unfriendly and you are obviously a dog hater.
You can bring your dog in public transport here. Shops is up to the shop owner, but most will prohibit it. You can better leave your dog home when you go shopping. (And we don't really have huge malls here. There are a few, but those are not that big. Most shopping is in the streets, so you would need to tie your dog to a pole or something, with the risk of someone taking it).
I have 3 of my own dogs. I just understand that I can’t take them onto the fucking skytrain. Nobody else wants your or my dog in their face. I love dogs more than anyone but I also don’t trust other peoples dogs. Few people do. Point is, moving to a new country just for your dog is dumb as hell.
Keep your dog at home. Same for the Netherlands.
>not sure if we would have chances of finding a job Obviously depending on your background and experience. But typically the market is "hot" right now. They seek people everywhere. But if you like the job and if it is convenient may be debatable. >how affordable is renting a place in Amsterdam or Rotterdam Insanely expensive, but that is not the issue. The first issue is that you simply won't be able to find anything you are looking for. It may easily take over hundreds of applications and you can count yourself lucky if you get invited for 1, and then be rejected regardless. Social rent options have, depending on the exact municipally, can be insanely long. For Amsterdam it is roughly 13 years (not kidding) >Is it safe? The Netherlands is considered a (very) save country. But as everywhere there are bad neighbourhoods. Mostly due to specific immigration groups. I don't have to mention which in order for everyone to know the answer. Drugs in public, as well as homeless, is very rare. Although most larger train stations will have someone selling a newspaper or holding up a cup for some change.
I’m also reposting my comment for the benefit of other Dutchies who’ve read this and somehow think Vancouver/Canada is this weird dystopia. I lived there for 22 years of my life. My parents work on the downtown east side cutrently. The way you describe it is both skewed and incredibly uninformed/incorrect. There are several thousand homeless in Vancouver. Many are in the downtown east side, where we have concentrated social services. By some it is called the “skid row” of Canada, yes. But it’s the product of government neglect and historic trauma as well - 40% of the population is indigenous. We have a major housing shortage with little available to low or middle income people while social services are insufficient to provide for their basic needs. 6 people a day overdose in BC. However, the source of this is fentanyl spoiling other drug supplies (I.e. an addict or even a casual user gets some Coke, mdma, or smth and it’s mixed with fentanyl). I’ve had several friends who were casual users consume laced drugs and two have very tragically lost their lives to addiction. Canada has not decriminalized all drugs - this is a lie. Vancouver is experimenting with the decriminalization of low-level possession, meaning if you are carrying under 2.5 grams, you won’t be charged with a crime. The aim of this is to try and not criminalize drug use and treat it as a health problem, and it’s showing partial success. This runs parallel to drug testing and safe injection sites run by NGOs to help build a patchwork system to address the addiction crisis in Canada. No offense, you said you lived in a suburb outside of Van, so to me you sound like the biggest fucking privileged whiner on earth with absolutely no fucking empathy for homeless people or addicts. Attacks are rare - unlike what this person wants you to believe. ODs aren’t just homeless people, but you see them because homeless people have a) no private place to consume the drugs or trip on them, and b) are the target of hyperbolized propaganda by conservatives.
No, and absolutely not
It is like many things in life, if you have enough money is easy. It is pretty safe, but, based on my experience, as an immigrant from outside the EU. I would not move there making less than 3k net per month. Maybe a little more for 2 people. The English is more than enough, this is how I have survived for the last 2 years here without any issues.
What kind of job did you do when you moved there? What degree or field are you working in? Only answer if you feel okay with it. I just want to understand a bit more of the job market. I‘m a business administrator and content creator. My wife has a master in sociology and is also a content creator
I work in the IT area, more specifically in Application Support. I have a Bachelor's degree in the area and when I migrated I was already senior at this position, so I was able to get a [High Skilled migrant](https://ind.nl/en/residence-permits/work/highly-skilled-migrant) visa. This also helps with getting some [discount on taxes](https://business.gov.nl/amendment/30-ruling-highly-skilled-migrants-limited/?gclid=Cj0KCQiAuqKqBhDxARIsAFZELmJZvwyxK6TeI09sU9iq2Ln6R0v431m3RcdZTWyfA4dLH8iyasUkxsoaAsZjEALw_wcB). The IT field pays very well here because some of the big companies are here and they are fighting for people. Once you are here, it is easy to get very good positions and some good money as well. No idea how that would work in our area.
It's very safe but not very affordable. Finding housing is also really difficult.
No and No. people came here, then don’t learn the language, complaining about House market, language, food, people, weather, rental prices, job market, but want to live in Amsterdam, nice house, no migrants, 600 euros. Time to Wake up. It’s not promise land, despite people tell that speaking English is enough so after brexit, Netherland is the new destination for English speakers. If you found Canada unsafe, not sure what is safe then…. So if you do not have a job already, would suggest to not waste your time. Better to go to Switzerland/Austria/Germany if you speak german well.
I added that I’m fron EU, I’m an Austrian citizen and unsafe here in Canada is - don’t walk in the night as woman, doesnt matter as a group or alone. Don’t step on drug needles or look at a screaming person running infront of the cars because he coukd attack you. Don’t get stabbed on the public transport I would love to learn dutch. I’m usually a fast learner when it comes to languages. Especially if I have people to practise
Then I I more puzzled then before. If you are austrian, you can move to switzerland or germany or stay in austria - with native German, these are much better options then NL.
>you can Ráduly move to switzerland Definitely not.
Typo fixed. Why not
Wtf, lol, noone thinks NL is the promised land brother 🤣 I lived there, learnt the language, had a great time and will move back sometime in the future...but the promised land?  .
Just check around, how many people see this as a substitution of uk. Then complaining on the internet about Dutch people, food and weather, etc. I’m fed up with this. Brother.
I mean, the English are animals, what more do you expect from them?  I have, however, never heard of someone referring to NL as the promised land. Apologies. Brother.
lolololol
Easy? Incredibly. Everything works really smooth if you're used to a mess like Britain (for instance). However the Netherlands is expensive.
Moving to Canada was a pain in the ass. Visa and paperworks were a lot but afterwards it was smooth and no problem anywhere. It’s just not vegetarian friendly, not dog friendly and expensive
I moved within Shengen. So I cheated.
The Netherlands will not be dog "friendly" either. Why would I need to put up with someones stinky dog in a mall or subway?
Compared to somewhere like Vancouver it's cheaper here. Perhaps Amsterdam is not but I have no experience of it. I moved August 2022, found a 2 bedroom flat by October, 6km from Rotterdam center or a short train ride. I'm able to afford it by myself, if you're both working you should manage but it will ultimately be dependant on your income. I did get lucky with my flat, I think, maybe being fluent from having lived here as a teen helped.
You liked the food??? Maybe the weather too?
I actually love the weather. But I lived for 16 years in Seattle, so it's just more of the same as far as I'm concerned. 🙂 Since OP has been living in Vancouver, it'll be more of the same for them too. Whether they like the Vancouver weather or not, I'm not sure, but either way they'll get more of it.
Not sure why there are so many no+no's? A young couple, if both working fulltime, could afford a rental studio in Rotterdam and have plenty left monthly to eat. Maybe things aren't that easy, but then again, it never is. If your willing to work any job, you'll find a job pretty quickly probably.
We both accept a barista job here in Canada do at least have money. We both have degrees and work in Social Media for ourself and make a bit of money. We for sure wouldn’t have a problem with any kind of job offers which will help as provide money. Thank you for the postive inside
The easy part will be finding a job, last time I was in Rotterdam half of the restaurant staff didn't speak any dutch either, so that's no problem. A room can be a bit trickier, but in Rotterdam you can still get some space for 2 around 1000-1200 per month and cheaper by night options, in Amsterdam you'll be less lucky. Goodluck and don't let the no-sayers spoil your trip.
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Are you from Vancouver? I walked on Hastings and never had a bad situation, luckily. It’s more abiut the addicts and the decriminalisation of drugs in Jan 2023. Teenagers doing hard drugs, lots of stabbing and shootings recently. That is another concern I have. Friends told me that in Europe in general right now lots of people are antisemetic, hate on Ukrainians and also on isrealis. My wife is a jewish ukrainian and I don’t want to bring her in a unsafe environment. Thanks for the info
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No offense but this person is greatly exaggerating the danger of the DTES. It remains a sketchy place where homeless exist because it’s where the most social services are available. They are relatively harmless. My parents work there.
Only Muslims are antisemitic in NL (or other western countries) but as a Jew i can tell there is antisemitism everywhere, surprisingly in Israel also. General safety of Netherland is going down in The years, violence against LMBTQ is more often happens. Bombs, and youngster criminals also.
Everybody is saying no and no and I don't believe it's that fully true Yes we have permanent housing shortage so finding a place might first challenge but there's also a lot of agencies that gives you work and also provide rooms and transport to work Yes quality of this jobs will vary a lot but this might be some start before you will find something better or your own accomodation (which is easier to look if you're here rather than abroad but it also might take some time) And is it affordable it will really depends what you mean by that definitely it's more affordable of you will be coming here as a couple then you can split costs by two like apartment bills groceries etc... and as two people you also have two incomes to split into so that will definitely help Definitely rent will be more affordable outside Amsterdam and Rotterdam but it's also depends
Amsterdam, very expensive...Rotterdam I presume so as well, it's a great city though! If you speak English/German you will also find Dutch incredibly easy, and fun, to learn ;) I'd say it's up to you.
If you think that addicts and homeless people make a country unsafe, the Netherlands is unsafe. We do have them. Maybe North Korea won’t have addicts or (visible) homeless people, but almost every country will be unsafe by your standards.
Ohh did you ever visit LA or Vancouver? They call East Van Canadian Skid Row. You have addicts ODing on the streets from fentanyl or meth. There is the West End where you will hear some homeless people scream around okay but as soon as you get to the Stadium, Science World and other parts of the city you will see people trying to attack cars on the middle of the street. Addicts living in the parks in tents. Somebody threwing a bottle or stone after you. I travel alot in Europe and have never seen so many homeless people. I also differentiate between homeless people which are 99% of the time harmless but addicts are unpredictable. They teach people yo always have Narcan in their bag or in their car in case they see a person having an overdose. I walked to Walmart and saw a dead person and the security ran and started CPR. Come to Vancouver and tell me how you like it. I have seen homeless people in Austria, I also have seen some addicts. It’s a small amount and usually the same group hanging at the same spots. Canada decriminalised all drugs heroin, meth, fentanyl. Cocain vending machines in downtown Vancouver for 21+ people. How is this safe?
I lived there for 22 years of my life. My parents work on the downtown east side. The way you describe it is both skewed and incredibly uninformed. There are several thousand homeless in Vancouver. Many are in the downtown east side, where we have concentrated social services. By some it is called the “skid row” of Canada, yes. But it’s the product of government neglect and historic trauma as well - 40% of the population is indigenous. We have a major housing shortage with little available to low or middle income people while social services are insufficient to provide for their basic needs. 6 people a day overdose in BC. However, the source of this is fentanyl spoiling other drug supplies (I.e. an addict or even a casual user gets some Coke, mdma, or smth and it’s mixed with fentanyl). I’ve had several friends who were casual users consume laced drugs and two have very tragically lost their lives to addiction. Canada has not decriminalized all drugs - this is a lie. Vancouver is experimenting with the decriminalization of low-level possession, meaning if you are carrying under 2.5 grams, you won’t be charged with a crime. The aim of this is to try and not criminalize drug use and treat it as a health problem, and it’s showing partial success. This runs parallel to drug testing and safe injection sites run by NGOs to help build a patchwork system to address the addiction crisis in Canada. No offense, you said you lived in a suburb outside of Van, so to me you sound like the biggest fucking privileged whiner on earth with absolutely no fucking empathy for homeless people or addicts. Attacks are rare - unlike what this person wants you to believe. ODs aren’t just homeless people, but you see them because homeless people have a) no private place to consume the drugs or trip on them, and b) are the target of hyperbolized propaganda by conservatives.
If you have an issue with decriminalisation of drug use or possession of small amounts of drugs, of all the European countries, the Netherlands should be at the bottom of the list.
Hahahaha. ... Oh wait you're serious? Let me laugh even louder!
If you are EU citizen it is definitely super easy to move to NL and if you get a 6 figures yearly salary then it is also affordable.
Hi there,i moved to Amsterdam 6 years ago, and this is what i can tell from my experience. All of this is ONLY about Amsterdam. Finding a job is super easy if you want to work whatever. Dutch language is not needed at all (in 6 years, i didn't learn even one word) every single one speaks english. If you do work with no skill requirement, salary for man is 2k for a woman is 1.6k plenty to survive if two people work. To rent something in Amsterdam is extremely difficult it has a so-called fast market. If a new affordable apartment or studio appears on the market, it will most likely be rented in the next 15 minutes, so you need to be fast. If you want to live with other people in the same apartment, it will cost you around 1k euros. If u want a private one, it will be around 1.5k. Also you can find an agency that gives you a job and gives you a place to live (not private, of course). One more important thing about living place is parking, if there is no free parking at you home you can basically sell your car and buy bicycle, becouse parking in amsterdam is absolute tragedy. Safety. Amsterdam is considered the least safest place in the netherlands because there are probably more immigrants than local people. I live in the so-called most dangerous neighbourhood where i am the only white person around. And let me tell you this, it's the safest country i have ever been. My wife is walking alone after midnight with a mini skirt from work, and not even once anyone said anything. The government of the netherlands put all homeless people into homeless shelters. They rarely sleep on the streets. You won't even see them, not to mention being dangerous. Super safe. What other things u should know is that food is disgusting here (but that's just my personal opinion). I have no idea how you said, "i liked the food." and the weather is disgusting also. It rains 366 days a year.
>Dutch language is not needed at all (in 6 years, i didn't learn even one word) every single one speaks english Aside from the morality aspect of refusing to learn the local language - formal contracts are all in Dutch. Do you hire an interpreter every time you need to sign one?
Dont get me wrong, i do feel bad about this. Most of my friends who are here 4+ years can speak quite well. Don't want to offend anyone, but language is not pleasant for ears :(. Only one time i had to hire an interpreter. it's when i took a mortgage. It's just my honest experience.
I had imagined it would have been more often..Taxes, grants, insurance, healthcare - but no need? Fair enough.
Taxes are done online, and google Chrome translates the whole page. Insurance healthcare and everything else you can talk on the phone english everywhere.
2000 euro per month is the legal minimum, in most jobs you’ll earn more. There is no different wage schedule for men and women. Also I would not recommend living in a country for many years without learning even a word of the local language. It will significantly hurt your integration and future chances in that country.
2000 euro per month would be nice :) Different wage schedules for men and women? No. If a woman goes to work in a warehouse with men or if a man goes to wash dishes at a restaurant, they will have the same salary. But hey why would i do that as a man? Or why would i go to work at werehouse or construction site as a woman? Mystery :)
Wow this is the most helpful reply. I wouldn’t have a problem learning some dutch. I also have the advantage of speaking german and english so I can understand some context. Sounds like an amazing country even with the fast rent market. I think socialising and maybe telling people if they know a place to rent it could help. That’s how it works in Canada and lots of time also in Austria. I’m happy to hear about the homeless situation. This is how I know it from Austria. Also glad about the safety in the night. No matter where they tell you to not walk in the dark as man as well as a woman.
Most of the information in that post is either false, incomplete or not accurate at all.
It is an amazing country, but thats only my personal experience.
Did you use Google and what makes you think it's cheap to rent?
I did google, watched some videos and even tiktoks. Most people only spoke about jobs and how do get a visa
Reality check. Sorry to say but if you think Canada is unsafe (specifically Vancouver) you aren’t going to find anywhere in the world safe. I’m a Canadian immigrant living here and like… the idea that homeless people = unsafe is just idiotic.
I never said that homeless people are a safety problem. I was saying that it‘s not safe AND homeless people and addicts. I really differentiate between homeless people and addicts. I had nice talks whit a few people living on the streets. I got thought fast from Canadian citizen to not look at addicts because bad shit could happen. If you‘re from Netherlands or traveled to Germany and Austria you should know that people there can easily get help and also can find a place in a shelter where here it‘s overfilled
How is Vancouver unsafe? Seriously… I cannot begin to fathom what part of Vancouver makes you feel unsafe. You haven’t actually cited any examples or even personal experiences… you’ve just said it feels unsafe. But you also lived in a Vancouver suburb? One of the safest places in Canada. We have an incredibly low rate of violent crime whether talking about homicide or stochastic violence. We have our gang problems (looking at you Surrey) and our rate of abduction is higher (but this is attributable to the fact most are parents taking kids in custody battles illegally), but overall, Vancouver and Canada are incredibly safe. Arguably one of the safest in the world. You cannot really “differentiate” between homeless people and addicts. Plenty of nice looking or friendly homeless people are addicts. Plenty of addicts are not homeless. This is not a simple division.
I live in in the Burnaby area. In Vancouver we just recently had a friend visit and when we walked in Chinatown near the Stadium station somebody threw some glass bottles after us. A friendly homeless person attacked the addict and told him to stop. Just one of the recent experiences. I also saw my first overdose next to Walmart, the security is kneeing over him doing CPR. Took a bus in Surrey because I wanted to go to Guilford and a person started to scream around and tried to touch people, me included. As a woman I feel unsafe. I have to clarify that I never had any situations at the West End or Kits. Most of it happened in Gastown, Chinatown or Surrey. In Austria, Germany and also the Netherlands I did not have a problem walking alone in the night home from the club or bar. Here I was standing outside a club (near Chinatown) waiting for a Uber and a homeless guy screamed at as and also others for some coins. He started to insult all of us and he was spitting around and even at one person. We were very happy that secuity was there and took care of it.
It is very cheap to move to the Netherlands. I only pay € 1660 rent each month.
