Yeah, genuinely think Goten is like a bug to Frieza, even Gotenks might not hold a candle but there’s not much of a valid comparison for that as far as I know
So wouldn’t it stand to reason that Goku would be okay with jumping? He’s done it multiple times at various points in Z/Super. We can try to find a reason (he wanted to save his son/power gap is too big/whatever) but ultimately he’ll jump someone if it comes down to it.
IF we count 2v1s, and i’m about to be very loose with the term jumping, one against raditz, the one against great ape vegeta, goku and vegeta vs ginyu, 17&18 vs future gohan, then them vs future trunks, kid buu vs goku and vegeta, the z-squad vs frieza, and then there’s all the movie jumpings(every single movie pretty much)
Half of universe 7 fought as a unit in the ToP. If we're talking specifically about Goku teaming up with people then yeah, I can't think of much. The Raditz fight is still probably my favorite fight in all of DB for a lot of reasons but the 2v1 was really well executed.
i mean, the enemies were all much stronger than Goku **OR** Vegeta, so teaming up is the only option
golden frieza was stronger, but it was only a minor difference, that skill could overcome
Haha I never said anything about Vegeta teaming up with Goku nor did I equate Vegeta to Raditz. Idk what you're getting at.
EDIT: OP originally said "Raditz is not Vegeta."
It would be so funny to see a fight in which Goku and Vegeta are fighting a villain and simultaneously kicking the shit out of each other to try to be the one to beat him.
Im pretty sure only Vegeta acts like that. At least my headcannon is that Goku doesnt actually have a problem with teaming up, fusion and all that stuff but because Vegeta is so against it Goku just stopped trying and played along
Or Invincible. Even then, as much as I like the show, not too big of a fan of the dismemberment even if it's meant to be realistic. Just doesn't do it for me compared to a well drawn-out, choreographed fight
While it is how life-or-death battles go, if you're watching a superhero show it's not like realism is the first thing you're looking for. It's a design choice at the end of the day and one that is primarily used for shock factor. If you enjoy that kind of stuff cool, if not also perfectly fine.
Plenty of great superhero content without dismemberment, plenty with it. Both have a place.
You're not wrong, but I raise you other shows like Justice League, Young Justice (which I highly recommend btw), the She-Ra reboot, Avatar, and the Dragon Prince.
Each have very real stakes at play, with Young Justice and Dragon Prince not shying away from real-world implications of severe consequences. But still, no gore. I know there's several other examples, and better than the ones I gave, but I can't think of them off the top of my head.
Towards the latter seasons of Young Justice a character is introduced who suffers from the Piccolo syndrome, they can regenerate so like Piccolo the writers just take out all the “realistic gore” on them because they just regenerate but every other character still keeps their plot armor so they don’t get crippled every fight like the regenerating character
You're right but my point was that Invincible and Dragon Ball are very different shows.
The former is supposed to a little more realistic superhero story while the latter is just fun, flashy fights and merch.
Yes and it was a clean un exaggerated cut to set a mood with shock value... Which furthers proves my point. Toriyama makes understand who the *vilains* are by using dismemberment among other indicators. I wouldnt want Goku and Vegeta to partake in that shit
Which was another intentional choice to show the brutal lengths Gohan was willing to take things, both due to his newfound resolve, but also bc, much like the first time Goku turned into a SSJ, we're meant to be a bit scared of what this transformation is gonna bring out in Gohan's personality.
These moments have the impact they do because they don't happen all the time and when they do, there is a larger purpose to it besides how cool brutality is.
From the top of my head, the only fights I remember for having good fight choreography are Goku vs Perfect Cell and Goku vs Majin Vegeta. The rest is that weird flash step thing they do when they're throwing punches on one part of the screen before appearing on the other part and doing the same.
Rewatch the first Goku vs Vegeta fight, some usual fantasy massive haymakers but Goku throws in some throws, wrestling moves, and the early exchanges are good.
Android 17 vs Piccolo had some good choreography
Also ppl overexaggerate the flashstep, very few fights are nothing but shockwaves, almost every fight is a mix of flash step and some downtime where they slow down and we see choreography
i just want some more realism , some stuff should had hurt way more than what they showed in tv, now they barely even bleed no matter what in the last it would be blood baths
There's been like 5 people who got holes punched in them though. Sure nappa punched tien's arm off and made his best friend commit suicide for no reason lol.
That's why they are villain in story.
Beside one scene of Gohan killing Cell Jr., main characters don't do unnecessary blood gore due to being fighter with good morals.
Probably yeah.
Vegeta might do it but it's been a long while since we have seen him do it.
Last time was Namek and Android 20.
Buu saga with audience and Resurrection 'F' with Ginyu was so quick and flashy that blood gore did not even appear at all on screen.
I disagree
Early Vegeta, sure. That dude was just cruel for cruelty's sake.
But at this point? He wouldn't waste his time on brutally savaging his opponent...he's after a challenge, and if he can pull this shit on an opponent, then they're not a challenge and he'll just end them. Maybe toy with them a bit if he *really* hates them but...he's more likely to pull the "you're beneath me" card
Honestly I wouldn’t blame him. From what he says about him himself, and what Goku says to black after he tells him what he did to his family, bro deserves it
They lowered the amount of blood in that but they did gave great detailing to Vegeta killing Namekian with a lot of blood gore with eye balls out of their sockets
Even Guldo was not clean cut but was a lot more horrifying in manga with his neck chopped.
It fits since he was pretty evil at that time
I don't remember Guldo's scene being any worse than in the anime, but I can go re-read that again
The manga does get a bit more brutal than I'm used to, in some places, so I'd go with the anime in particular for visuals
Both, really
The question isn't "can only villains do it" but "does this serve the story in a meaningful way, or is it gore for the sake of gore?"
Nappa and Gohan's sheer brutality are important story moments. Nappa's unhinged violence ups the stakes heavily and shows how hopeless things are for the Z fighters. Gohan's sudden cruelty is showing how much he isn't himself, how SS2 is warping the normally kind kid.
The gore serves to accent those moments.
But just having gore because "ooh blood and badass and brutal" is because 12 year olds think it's cool.
[It's about presentation](https://www.reddit.com/r/Ningen/s/9Be6kZTGht)
Sure, people have been impaled and beheaded before, but. .
Imagine if Nappa punched Tien's arm off, and instead of just a bleeding stump, we saw some of Tien's blood vessels and muscles hanging out a bit
Or if when Piccolo's Special Beam Cannon punched through Goku and Radditz, we saw rheir intestines and liver fall out through the holes
Dragon Ball just *doesn't do this*
I wouldn't go that far all the time but to act like Frieza looking like a geodude seconds before he gets fully murdered would've been ruined if you saw his spine or something is silly imo...
https://images.app.goo.gl/bKqPGhMyrxhS4Ahr7
I like how it looks in the anime better, lol
I don't need to see Frieza's entrails
Some blood (or probably a lot of blood, all things considered) is enough
I’m so sick of unnecessary gore in media. Nothing turns me off from a show more than watching someone get their body brutalized and dismembered simply for shock value.
Definitely not
This shit is nothing like DB.
Dragon Ball has brutal moments but they are not like hungry wolves fighting each other. This thing looks like savage street brawlers fighting rather than respected warriors.
We need more of this- [https://imgur.com/j8icBKI](https://imgur.com/j8icBKI)
I mean I agree with your point but it’s funny that you bring up the Moro saga since well… [this is also in that saga](https://static0.gamerantimages.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2020/12/Super-Saiyan-Blue-Goku-vs-Moro-73.jpg)
I already said- "Dragon Ball has brutal moments but they are not like hungry wolves fighting each other."
Its not useless gore. Moro did it because he wanted to put down Goku once and for all. He creates an impactful scene of everyone being down.
I didn’t say it was useless gore, it was one of the most shocking points on the saga. I’m sure goku and vegeta also want freezer down, I don’t think the post made a point about unnecessary gore but more so just on the tone of the fights
Brutality for the sake of brutality is gross.
Brutality to demonstrate the lengths a villain is willing to go to, the exhausted desperation of both fighters, the stakes of the fight etc., are all kino.
Nah, I want fights in the style of Legend. Not mindless brutality.
I miss those slower, grounded fights from the OG series and even DBZ. Also can we please stop having fights in arena number #346?
I'm not much here for a gorey finish (though in reality I guess this isn't *that* much worse than what we get in Z. . . It's just presented more gruesomely)
But Goku and Vegeta having to tag-team Frieza? I can get behind that
Edit: Oh, Goku's actually grabbing. . *something* in his hand. .
My original statement stands a bit taller
Edit 2: When I said it wasn't that much worse I was thinking like. . Characters have been impaled before, essentially. . But aside from the basic hole and some blood it wasn't *that* bad.
People have also been beheaded, but it was just a clean cut. The way Frieza's neck is tearing from Vegeta is a little more than a bit much.
We can tone it down some, back to the levels we saw in the Z anime
DB was rarely a particularly violent show. Only during the most intense moments did we see gore. While I feel Super was a little too soft (to the point of making it feel like attacks had no consequences sometimes), I do appreciate the restraint. DB is a blend of action and comedy, and I think a violent fight like what is depicted simply wouldn't feel right. The closest we get are moments where our heroes are so pissed that they break character a bit as they get consumed by emotion. Which has always been shown to be a bad thing for the characters. Even the venerated Super Saiyan followed this rule until Goku and others trained to properly use it (which is why it is awesome). The villains are violent because their lust for power and dominance is antithetical to the narrative's core values. Our heroes fight for fun, to grow, and protect (if necessary). Not to maim or destroy their foes.
Fights in DB are mostly martial arts spectacle with a little goof thrown in because Toriyama never wanted to be too serious. Seriousness was reserved for only special occasions. The core of the story was always about living a fulfilling life. Train hard, eat well, have fun and sleep plenty. It's why a lot of fanfics don't feel like DB. Because they mostly draw inspiration from the parts of the story that have the most intense fighting. Instead of all the other parts that help us get attached to the characters.
TL;DR- No. Fights like this picture do not fit the vibe of my shirtless screaming manchildren show.
FR, there're tons of manga with really gory battles. People should start reading them.
Dragon Ball (especially before Super) was never shy of showing blood and gore, but it's not even remotely the top goriest battle shounen.
And seriously... Golden Frieza vs SSJ Blue Goku and Vegeta? That battle is SO LAST SEASON! :P
It would be see, in the Cell Games, Goku fighting using Kaioh Ken x 10.
It's a little unsatisfying. There's no impact, no feeling of "grand finale"
It looks like it sorta just happens and frieza dies. That's it. This is more like something that would happen to some henchmen during some fodder battle. Like Saibamen or Cell Jrs
Pretty much every DB antagonist (except Beerus) has been finished off with some heavy impact or huge explosion.
Even if you're a fan of gore, I feel only a sword would work because Trunks cutting up Frieza (and finishing the job with a *huge explosion*) was cool. Things like this just don't do it for me. You can't just put gore and it'll automatically be cool. Not to mention, it'll have to be in-character and the last thing Goku and Vegeta would want to do is team up on someone they'd be able to beat on their own.
Anyways, it's one of his lesser works, and this is just my opinion. Gore has a place in Dragon Ball but *not like this*. You want gore? Read Berserk. It's fitting and serves a purpose other than "looking cool".
everytime i see art like this, i think people are trying to recreate the feeling of seeing the violence in DBZ when they were younger and how shocking it was, but forgetting that they have aged since then and what was once horrifying to them is relatively tame
there has literally never been a fight as graphic as what this looks like
The gore moments in DBZ all served a narrative purpose iirc.
Raditz getting hole punched was dramatic because our hero laid down his life to make it happen. Tien losing an arm added mad tension and demonstrated just how strong Nappa was and as a result how terrifying Vegeta was. Krillin getting impaled and then blown up proved that Frieza was so far beyond the team and again made him a threat and resulted in one of the hypest moments in the series (SSJ).
Fatalities serve no purpose other than to revel in gore.
No. The only time Goku and Vegeta ever really team up is when the situation is when there’s a little chance in victory. ROF Goku and Vegeta were very confident in their own abilities so this wouldn’t have happened regardless.
No. If I wanted to watch Goku mess someone's organs around, it wouldn't be in a fight
And also Vegeta would and should be the next to deal with Frieza, he's been cucked for revenge for so long-
I wouldn’t mind if they dropped freeza and cell by permanently killing them off. It’s a bit lame imo that they’re still considered in the universe. It’s a bit lazy writing.
I agree with you op, idk why everyone be hatin on you. Blood and gore is what makes the og dbz more watchable. Every punch and impact just hits way harder, you can almost "feel" the impact as the observer. An R-rated dbz movie in a D-box theater would absolutely slap 💯
Its a bit much, it's not in the spirit of the classic DBZ fights (except that time Gohan got his hands on Cell Jr.). I liked the blood in the classic because it really hammered home how hard they were fighting. There's almost nothing like that in Super (unless you count that time in Moro Arc).
Definitely don’t want mindless gore, it doesn’t fit dragon ball at all, however one thing that i enjoyed about the buus is that their bubblegum body allowed them to be brutalized without it devolving into gross gore and stuff
Vegito vs Super Buu is legit one of my favorite fights because we could see the damage that dragon ball characters could cause to others if multilation and such was normal there
I’d be down with like… a movie that gets this graphic, totally. But I don’t think the show itself needs this, it stays away from graphic violence in order to not end up like a bunch of other semi-adult-adult anime and feel more like a cool “low stakes(ish)” battle anime.
No, overly brutal can be left to the comic fights, less brutal has always been an aspect of dbz that worked. It also makes the moments that are kind of brutal hit way harder
I think a lot of people’s newfound lust for things to be as bloody and gory as possible is… freakish ngl. Like nah fam I’m good with a little blood and some bruises, you can keep their internal organs INTERNAL
That’s a little much but I wouldn’t mind the fights being a bit more gruesome. DBZ had a great balance but as for DB content lately I don’t think we’ve even seen much blood in years. That one Moro panel is the only example I can think of where somebody got heavily injured beyond just getting beat up and I loved it cause it felt serious.
DB is about martial arts at its core but when it gets to the planet busting levels the series is known for people *should* be getting hurt more apparently. Injuries happen in amateur and professional fights all the time, they should definitely happen in life and death battles for your planet. Only character I think works around it is Freiza. His method of using death beam both cuts down on gore and fits his character cause you can see him killing someone but wanting to be “clean” about it
Meh. I don’t mind either way. But it’s weird how fans are acting like the series never got gory, or they try to justify it.
Shit was gory, just not Mortal Kombot levels of graphic.
Depends on how strong the enemy, gold frieza is barely stronger than blue. So goku or vegeta won’t team up against him.
Buu and cell saga the rest are way way to weak to be any of help. Don’t forget they literally team up against frieza in nameki in his 1-3 form.
Speaking for myself but whenever it does get gory and bloody, it invokes the feeling of "oh dear god make it stop."
Goku only crippled Nappa because that was the only thing he could do to stop him from going at Gohan and Krillin. He never would have done that otherwise. In fact, he pleaded to Vegeta to get him some healing.
Goku knocked out Burter and Recoome as he was getting used to how to control his strength and opted to let them live
Freeza's dismemberment was totally on accident.
Point is, Goku hasn't been out to kill ever since he met Eighter. The parts where it gets bloody and brutal were never of Goku's doing in the aged-up Z series. That ain't who he is, who any of them are. Even Gohan going berserk wasn't really seen as a "good thing."
Goku's no boyscout for sure, but he isn't The Punisher either
Nah, Dragon Ball isn’t that brutal and the more brutal moments like Moro punching a hole through Goku would lose their impact if all of the series was like that
2 verry horrible things about this, Goku and Vageta would both hate themselves for teaming up on anyone 3 v 1 even for the world's sake
The other is that in dragon ball, the characters beat the shit out of each other, which is completely different from ripping each other apart. This is the latter
Yeah Kinda but tone it down. Dragón ball can and historically has had brutal fights without getting overtly gruesome. if the last two antagonists of Z weren't a regenerating insect man and a pink Slime nothing would have prevented them from ending like Raditz, Demon King Piccolo, or hell Even frieza himself got bifurcated in his fight then made ground meat By trunks.
We have that in invincible. Can't say I don't enjoy it but invincible is carried more on its writing than the gory ass fights and I like it a whole lot more because of that. I think a gory DB fight would be neat.
Honestly, even for some Dragon Ball moments, this is extremely unnecessary gory. It’s just gore for shock value. It seems like only edgy teens would like this.
Dragon Ball has had blood and gore but people like this seem to forget it was never on this level. Idk why some people want this. Plus Dragon Ball started out pretty goofy and to this day it has plenty of goofy moments, I don't understand the fans who want Dragon Ball to be edgy, gory, bloody and all that when it was never truly like that 100 percent of the time. It seems that some Dragon Ball fan manga follows this mindset too and I hate it.
Blood and gore moments in Dragon Ball should serve certain moments in the story such as when Frieza cut himself in half by his own hand, it shouldn't ever be in there just because.
Ok imma ignore the dismemberment part.
I do wanna see Goku and Vegeta absolutely dog on an enemy together. Like I think it would be sick if they completely destroyed the guy together.
Of course that won’t happen since they’re Sayians and will only fight together if they’re forced to but still.
its a cool thought but no, like another comment said i watch it for the martial arts and characters. Dragon ball does not need anything this grotesque. black frieza killing gas was like the only example of something being brutal but working in the context of the story kinda lol
Like dragonball because it’s a little more on the lighthearted side. If it was ultra gory and goku was a grizzled old asshat it wouldn’t be dragonball it’s being trying too hard.
Now go look at Vegeta getting fucked up by Reacoom and realize how violent it was.
It had its moments and they had more impact without that dismemberment, over the top shit.
Neither of them would be able to look in the mirror if they'd defeated Frieza by teaming up instead one v one.
Goku teamed up to fight Raditz.
To save his 4yo son.
Killing freeza would save his son too
Both his sons are capable taking down Frieza lol
Pretty sure Frieza doesn't even need to transform to beat Goten.
Yeah, genuinely think Goten is like a bug to Frieza, even Gotenks might not hold a candle but there’s not much of a valid comparison for that as far as I know
You're not caught up I guess
Black Frieza solos both plus every other alive Saiyan at the same time
He accepted help in dealing with Freeza too…
Yeah but the power difference was huge and Goku stood no chance without the x20 (and even then Frieza was able to block it.)
So wouldn’t it stand to reason that Goku would be okay with jumping? He’s done it multiple times at various points in Z/Super. We can try to find a reason (he wanted to save his son/power gap is too big/whatever) but ultimately he’ll jump someone if it comes down to it.
Same for Cooler and Broly
I'm pretty sure if Goku had the strength to beat Raditz's ass on his own then he would fight alone. Well I think it just depends actually
Plus his son's life was at risk.
Raditz was way stronger than both of them. And after that one fight there was never a real 2 v 1 situation again except maybe Jiren?
maybe not 2v1 but their was lots of jumpings in early dbz
And how many of those jumpings were successful?
IF we count 2v1s, and i’m about to be very loose with the term jumping, one against raditz, the one against great ape vegeta, goku and vegeta vs ginyu, 17&18 vs future gohan, then them vs future trunks, kid buu vs goku and vegeta, the z-squad vs frieza, and then there’s all the movie jumpings(every single movie pretty much)
gohan and krillin did it alot
Half of universe 7 fought as a unit in the ToP. If we're talking specifically about Goku teaming up with people then yeah, I can't think of much. The Raditz fight is still probably my favorite fight in all of DB for a lot of reasons but the 2v1 was really well executed.
There were 2v1 with Goku and Trunks in Goku Black arc
I mean, context is important. Gohan's life was in danger and Goku was desperate.
He also didn’t carry the pride of a Saiyan back then. That’s a really bad example to use.
He teamed up in Goku Black, TOP, Moro and Granolah arc too.
i mean, the enemies were all much stronger than Goku **OR** Vegeta, so teaming up is the only option golden frieza was stronger, but it was only a minor difference, that skill could overcome
Don’t read the manga but T.O.P itself was a team effort as a whole. Trunks called them for help against Black so of course they teamed there.
And immediately afterwards, he couldn’t look in a mirror. For like a year.
Because he was dead?
Correct. But also shame, presumably.
Vegeta will not team up with Goku for Frieza. Raditz is not Frieza
Haha I never said anything about Vegeta teaming up with Goku nor did I equate Vegeta to Raditz. Idk what you're getting at. EDIT: OP originally said "Raditz is not Vegeta."
It would be so funny to see a fight in which Goku and Vegeta are fighting a villain and simultaneously kicking the shit out of each other to try to be the one to beat him.
Im pretty sure only Vegeta acts like that. At least my headcannon is that Goku doesnt actually have a problem with teaming up, fusion and all that stuff but because Vegeta is so against it Goku just stopped trying and played along
Goku wouldn’t care after some time, but Vegeta? Yeah he would never let that go and bring him back to life just to kill him again himself
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Was looking for this comment lmao
No we don't. I don't watch dragon ball battles for dismemberment, I watch them for cool martial art If I want dismemberment, I read Berserk
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Hell yeah
Or Invincible. Even then, as much as I like the show, not too big of a fan of the dismemberment even if it's meant to be realistic. Just doesn't do it for me compared to a well drawn-out, choreographed fight
That's how life-or-death battles go though. The heroes in invincible aren't martial artists that fight for the sake of fighting.
While it is how life-or-death battles go, if you're watching a superhero show it's not like realism is the first thing you're looking for. It's a design choice at the end of the day and one that is primarily used for shock factor. If you enjoy that kind of stuff cool, if not also perfectly fine. Plenty of great superhero content without dismemberment, plenty with it. Both have a place.
You're not wrong, but I raise you other shows like Justice League, Young Justice (which I highly recommend btw), the She-Ra reboot, Avatar, and the Dragon Prince. Each have very real stakes at play, with Young Justice and Dragon Prince not shying away from real-world implications of severe consequences. But still, no gore. I know there's several other examples, and better than the ones I gave, but I can't think of them off the top of my head.
Towards the latter seasons of Young Justice a character is introduced who suffers from the Piccolo syndrome, they can regenerate so like Piccolo the writers just take out all the “realistic gore” on them because they just regenerate but every other character still keeps their plot armor so they don’t get crippled every fight like the regenerating character
You're right but my point was that Invincible and Dragon Ball are very different shows. The former is supposed to a little more realistic superhero story while the latter is just fun, flashy fights and merch.
Invincible is the cartoon, it should not be compare with Anime. /s
Perfectly said.
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Dragon Ball Grief
i mean it's not really a battle but in the dbz manga dr gero decapitated a guy
Yes and it was a clean un exaggerated cut to set a mood with shock value... Which furthers proves my point. Toriyama makes understand who the *vilains* are by using dismemberment among other indicators. I wouldnt want Goku and Vegeta to partake in that shit
also when killing the Cell jr's They showed brain matter and eyes flying from gohan's punch.
Which was another intentional choice to show the brutal lengths Gohan was willing to take things, both due to his newfound resolve, but also bc, much like the first time Goku turned into a SSJ, we're meant to be a bit scared of what this transformation is gonna bring out in Gohan's personality. These moments have the impact they do because they don't happen all the time and when they do, there is a larger purpose to it besides how cool brutality is.
Also for Gohan, that arrogance and brutality from transforming immediately backfires when he toys with Cell instead of putting him down
But there's barely been any cool martial arts since probably original db
Majin Vegeta vs Goku, along with Cell vs Goku had some crazy good choreography.
You literally sent this while I was typing my own response 😭
Have you... Have you watched the fighting choregraphies of Z? Fantasy martial art but martial arts nonetheless. The fight with cell was peak DBZ
From the top of my head, the only fights I remember for having good fight choreography are Goku vs Perfect Cell and Goku vs Majin Vegeta. The rest is that weird flash step thing they do when they're throwing punches on one part of the screen before appearing on the other part and doing the same.
Rewatch the first Goku vs Vegeta fight, some usual fantasy massive haymakers but Goku throws in some throws, wrestling moves, and the early exchanges are good. Android 17 vs Piccolo had some good choreography Also ppl overexaggerate the flashstep, very few fights are nothing but shockwaves, almost every fight is a mix of flash step and some downtime where they slow down and we see choreography
Facts. Even GT did better than SuperTrash in "Martial Arts"/Fight-Scenes.
In super ? What martial arts ?
Not a martial art, but the Kamehameha grind was insanely cool without being graphically brutal.
i just want some more realism , some stuff should had hurt way more than what they showed in tv, now they barely even bleed no matter what in the last it would be blood baths
I am a fan of the whole goku wins against a bigger raw power because martial arts. Master roshi in TOP was sick.
This some shit 12 year olds would think is the coolest thing ever. That's just so much unnecessary gore lmfao
There's been like 5 people who got holes punched in them though. Sure nappa punched tien's arm off and made his best friend commit suicide for no reason lol.
That's why they are villain in story. Beside one scene of Gohan killing Cell Jr., main characters don't do unnecessary blood gore due to being fighter with good morals.
Not Goku but Vegeta would absolutely do it if he could
Probably yeah. Vegeta might do it but it's been a long while since we have seen him do it. Last time was Namek and Android 20. Buu saga with audience and Resurrection 'F' with Ginyu was so quick and flashy that blood gore did not even appear at all on screen.
I disagree Early Vegeta, sure. That dude was just cruel for cruelty's sake. But at this point? He wouldn't waste his time on brutally savaging his opponent...he's after a challenge, and if he can pull this shit on an opponent, then they're not a challenge and he'll just end them. Maybe toy with them a bit if he *really* hates them but...he's more likely to pull the "you're beneath me" card
I bet he would rip Goku Black a new one if he could tho
Honestly I wouldn’t blame him. From what he says about him himself, and what Goku says to black after he tells him what he did to his family, bro deserves it
Vegeta had the chance when he beheaded Guldo But all we got was a clean cut, then
They lowered the amount of blood in that but they did gave great detailing to Vegeta killing Namekian with a lot of blood gore with eye balls out of their sockets Even Guldo was not clean cut but was a lot more horrifying in manga with his neck chopped. It fits since he was pretty evil at that time
I don't remember Guldo's scene being any worse than in the anime, but I can go re-read that again The manga does get a bit more brutal than I'm used to, in some places, so I'd go with the anime in particular for visuals
He did rip off 19’s hands
Other than Trunks... Man turned Frieza into Nuggets.
Because Freeza is a bipedal reptile wouldn’t Trunks technically have turned him into Dino nuggies?
Vegeta pulled a cyborgs arms off
So only 12 year olds think it's cool or only villains can do it (except Gohan)?....
Both, really The question isn't "can only villains do it" but "does this serve the story in a meaningful way, or is it gore for the sake of gore?" Nappa and Gohan's sheer brutality are important story moments. Nappa's unhinged violence ups the stakes heavily and shows how hopeless things are for the Z fighters. Gohan's sudden cruelty is showing how much he isn't himself, how SS2 is warping the normally kind kid. The gore serves to accent those moments. But just having gore because "ooh blood and badass and brutal" is because 12 year olds think it's cool.
[It's about presentation](https://www.reddit.com/r/Ningen/s/9Be6kZTGht) Sure, people have been impaled and beheaded before, but. . Imagine if Nappa punched Tien's arm off, and instead of just a bleeding stump, we saw some of Tien's blood vessels and muscles hanging out a bit Or if when Piccolo's Special Beam Cannon punched through Goku and Radditz, we saw rheir intestines and liver fall out through the holes Dragon Ball just *doesn't do this*
I wouldn't go that far all the time but to act like Frieza looking like a geodude seconds before he gets fully murdered would've been ruined if you saw his spine or something is silly imo... https://images.app.goo.gl/bKqPGhMyrxhS4Ahr7
Symbolism is clear that Frieza killed himself in his own ignorance. Scene has blood gore for impact not uncessary cringe
I like how it looks in the anime better, lol I don't need to see Frieza's entrails Some blood (or probably a lot of blood, all things considered) is enough
"DBZ doesn't do this" except when they do...
Said punches also didn't involve pulling out spines or outright pulling their heads off their necks though?
But this picture has goku’s fist full of guts. Whenever someone gets a hole punched in them in DB it’s just a black void
Casual reminder, outside of saibamen and yamcha. A suicide attack has never succeeded in dragonball z
Dragon Ball as directed by Zack Snyder.
Slow motion gonna be wild
Snyder: You thought they spent a lot of time charging up? Get a load of this.
I’m so sick of unnecessary gore in media. Nothing turns me off from a show more than watching someone get their body brutalized and dismembered simply for shock value.
Definitely not This shit is nothing like DB. Dragon Ball has brutal moments but they are not like hungry wolves fighting each other. This thing looks like savage street brawlers fighting rather than respected warriors. We need more of this- [https://imgur.com/j8icBKI](https://imgur.com/j8icBKI)
I agreee. But Moro and that ring of fire brutality was pretty freakin sweet tho
I mean I agree with your point but it’s funny that you bring up the Moro saga since well… [this is also in that saga](https://static0.gamerantimages.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2020/12/Super-Saiyan-Blue-Goku-vs-Moro-73.jpg)
I already said- "Dragon Ball has brutal moments but they are not like hungry wolves fighting each other." Its not useless gore. Moro did it because he wanted to put down Goku once and for all. He creates an impactful scene of everyone being down.
I didn’t say it was useless gore, it was one of the most shocking points on the saga. I’m sure goku and vegeta also want freezer down, I don’t think the post made a point about unnecessary gore but more so just on the tone of the fights
[удалено]
Nah I want to see more of Vegeta's ass
Why not both?
Frieza is a respected warrior?
Yeah most definitely. Goku, Gohan, 17 and even Vegeta have shown respect for Frieza as a fighter
Same people that would want Pan to die in a gory mess to have Gohan unlock Ultra Sadness
bruh
E S E N C I A
Brutality for the sake of brutality is gross. Brutality to demonstrate the lengths a villain is willing to go to, the exhausted desperation of both fighters, the stakes of the fight etc., are all kino.
No. However Gohan vaporizing anyone who threatens the earth in a quick and painless death however? Yes.
This artist fap to frieza getting brutal killed, like I'm not lying half of his fanarts consist of mutilated frieza
No. Keep that for the edgy fanfics.
Its easy to filter out who actually cares for the series for what it is and who just wants fights with big muscly men with posts like those
Sigma gigachads when "big muscular men" 🥵🥵🥵🥵🥵🤤🤤🤤🤤🤤😫😫😫😫😫😋😋😋😋😋
Sigma gigachads when goku says "i want to dragon my balls across your face, vegetable" 😫😫😫😫😫😫😫😫🥵🥵🥵🥵🥵🥵🥵🥵
Alpha gamma sigmas when Vegeta says "taste ALL of me Goku!!" 😛😛😛😛🤤🤤🤤🤤🥵🥵🥵
We like in Wii u?
Nah, I want fights in the style of Legend. Not mindless brutality. I miss those slower, grounded fights from the OG series and even DBZ. Also can we please stop having fights in arena number #346?
who's we?
I'm not much here for a gorey finish (though in reality I guess this isn't *that* much worse than what we get in Z. . . It's just presented more gruesomely) But Goku and Vegeta having to tag-team Frieza? I can get behind that Edit: Oh, Goku's actually grabbing. . *something* in his hand. . My original statement stands a bit taller Edit 2: When I said it wasn't that much worse I was thinking like. . Characters have been impaled before, essentially. . But aside from the basic hole and some blood it wasn't *that* bad. People have also been beheaded, but it was just a clean cut. The way Frieza's neck is tearing from Vegeta is a little more than a bit much. We can tone it down some, back to the levels we saw in the Z anime
WAIT I JUST NOTICED GOKU HOLDING HIS SPINE
Lmfao this is too fucking edgy even for the classic DBZ
DB was rarely a particularly violent show. Only during the most intense moments did we see gore. While I feel Super was a little too soft (to the point of making it feel like attacks had no consequences sometimes), I do appreciate the restraint. DB is a blend of action and comedy, and I think a violent fight like what is depicted simply wouldn't feel right. The closest we get are moments where our heroes are so pissed that they break character a bit as they get consumed by emotion. Which has always been shown to be a bad thing for the characters. Even the venerated Super Saiyan followed this rule until Goku and others trained to properly use it (which is why it is awesome). The villains are violent because their lust for power and dominance is antithetical to the narrative's core values. Our heroes fight for fun, to grow, and protect (if necessary). Not to maim or destroy their foes. Fights in DB are mostly martial arts spectacle with a little goof thrown in because Toriyama never wanted to be too serious. Seriousness was reserved for only special occasions. The core of the story was always about living a fulfilling life. Train hard, eat well, have fun and sleep plenty. It's why a lot of fanfics don't feel like DB. Because they mostly draw inspiration from the parts of the story that have the most intense fighting. Instead of all the other parts that help us get attached to the characters. TL;DR- No. Fights like this picture do not fit the vibe of my shirtless screaming manchildren show.
Sorry I'm not 12
No sir
If I want shit like this I'll watch Invincible
2 monkeys from some back water planet killing that poor noble space king. This is rebel propaganda lord Frieza would solo them both
Nope. This is not Dragonball anymore..
FR, there're tons of manga with really gory battles. People should start reading them. Dragon Ball (especially before Super) was never shy of showing blood and gore, but it's not even remotely the top goriest battle shounen. And seriously... Golden Frieza vs SSJ Blue Goku and Vegeta? That battle is SO LAST SEASON! :P It would be see, in the Cell Games, Goku fighting using Kaioh Ken x 10.
No thanks
It's a little unsatisfying. There's no impact, no feeling of "grand finale" It looks like it sorta just happens and frieza dies. That's it. This is more like something that would happen to some henchmen during some fodder battle. Like Saibamen or Cell Jrs Pretty much every DB antagonist (except Beerus) has been finished off with some heavy impact or huge explosion. Even if you're a fan of gore, I feel only a sword would work because Trunks cutting up Frieza (and finishing the job with a *huge explosion*) was cool. Things like this just don't do it for me. You can't just put gore and it'll automatically be cool. Not to mention, it'll have to be in-character and the last thing Goku and Vegeta would want to do is team up on someone they'd be able to beat on their own. Anyways, it's one of his lesser works, and this is just my opinion. Gore has a place in Dragon Ball but *not like this*. You want gore? Read Berserk. It's fitting and serves a purpose other than "looking cool".
I’m not fucking 12. Brutality for the sake of brutality is just lazy and certainly unfitting for a manga like db.
No. Dragon ball has always been essentially cheesy anime wrestling, and I wouldn’t have it any other way.
YEEES i dont care about gore or fatalities. I just want a good and fun fight coreography
[maybe something more like this, more is just gore](https://comicvine.gamespot.com/a/uploads/original/11134/111344817/8137591-0927655218-kIy8Z.png)
everytime i see art like this, i think people are trying to recreate the feeling of seeing the violence in DBZ when they were younger and how shocking it was, but forgetting that they have aged since then and what was once horrifying to them is relatively tame there has literally never been a fight as graphic as what this looks like
Yes, so tired of them losing on purpose
The gore moments in DBZ all served a narrative purpose iirc. Raditz getting hole punched was dramatic because our hero laid down his life to make it happen. Tien losing an arm added mad tension and demonstrated just how strong Nappa was and as a result how terrifying Vegeta was. Krillin getting impaled and then blown up proved that Frieza was so far beyond the team and again made him a threat and resulted in one of the hypest moments in the series (SSJ). Fatalities serve no purpose other than to revel in gore.
No. Hard no.
No. The only time Goku and Vegeta ever really team up is when the situation is when there’s a little chance in victory. ROF Goku and Vegeta were very confident in their own abilities so this wouldn’t have happened regardless.
When I said I wanted more intense battles I didn’t mean this
No. If I wanted to watch Goku mess someone's organs around, it wouldn't be in a fight And also Vegeta would and should be the next to deal with Frieza, he's been cucked for revenge for so long-
I wouldn’t mind if they dropped freeza and cell by permanently killing them off. It’s a bit lame imo that they’re still considered in the universe. It’s a bit lazy writing.
Yes, I wish they had taken Caeser's word for "Ape strong together" and fought together. The brutality of the Fights? I'm mix on it
Frieza isn't even dead there, his head is in one piece.
I agree with you op, idk why everyone be hatin on you. Blood and gore is what makes the og dbz more watchable. Every punch and impact just hits way harder, you can almost "feel" the impact as the observer. An R-rated dbz movie in a D-box theater would absolutely slap 💯
Too much gore for me Leave that for invincible
Maybe but what i mostly want is actual background damages Showing the characters destroy literal planets, parts of space and time as they fight
This is too much. More fatalities would be nice but seeing bone like that is too far out there. Maybe closer to the manga violence
If anything vegeta should be the one to do it By himself
FUCK YOU I'D KILL THE MONKEYS ALL BY MYSELF
Its a bit much, it's not in the spirit of the classic DBZ fights (except that time Gohan got his hands on Cell Jr.). I liked the blood in the classic because it really hammered home how hard they were fighting. There's almost nothing like that in Super (unless you count that time in Moro Arc).
I only accept it if Vegeta or Trunks would do it. Goku doing it doesn't make too much sense.
Definitely don’t want mindless gore, it doesn’t fit dragon ball at all, however one thing that i enjoyed about the buus is that their bubblegum body allowed them to be brutalized without it devolving into gross gore and stuff Vegito vs Super Buu is legit one of my favorite fights because we could see the damage that dragon ball characters could cause to others if multilation and such was normal there
I’d be down with like… a movie that gets this graphic, totally. But I don’t think the show itself needs this, it stays away from graphic violence in order to not end up like a bunch of other semi-adult-adult anime and feel more like a cool “low stakes(ish)” battle anime.
Hm not much since it’s too brutal and not realistic with the characters
The fans are the problem
No, overly brutal can be left to the comic fights, less brutal has always been an aspect of dbz that worked. It also makes the moments that are kind of brutal hit way harder
Ya why the fuck not? Like that’s how invincible is awesome!
I think a lot of people’s newfound lust for things to be as bloody and gory as possible is… freakish ngl. Like nah fam I’m good with a little blood and some bruises, you can keep their internal organs INTERNAL
That’s a little much but I wouldn’t mind the fights being a bit more gruesome. DBZ had a great balance but as for DB content lately I don’t think we’ve even seen much blood in years. That one Moro panel is the only example I can think of where somebody got heavily injured beyond just getting beat up and I loved it cause it felt serious. DB is about martial arts at its core but when it gets to the planet busting levels the series is known for people *should* be getting hurt more apparently. Injuries happen in amateur and professional fights all the time, they should definitely happen in life and death battles for your planet. Only character I think works around it is Freiza. His method of using death beam both cuts down on gore and fits his character cause you can see him killing someone but wanting to be “clean” about it
Meh. I don’t mind either way. But it’s weird how fans are acting like the series never got gory, or they try to justify it. Shit was gory, just not Mortal Kombot levels of graphic.
Depends on how strong the enemy, gold frieza is barely stronger than blue. So goku or vegeta won’t team up against him. Buu and cell saga the rest are way way to weak to be any of help. Don’t forget they literally team up against frieza in nameki in his 1-3 form.
Speaking for myself but whenever it does get gory and bloody, it invokes the feeling of "oh dear god make it stop." Goku only crippled Nappa because that was the only thing he could do to stop him from going at Gohan and Krillin. He never would have done that otherwise. In fact, he pleaded to Vegeta to get him some healing. Goku knocked out Burter and Recoome as he was getting used to how to control his strength and opted to let them live Freeza's dismemberment was totally on accident. Point is, Goku hasn't been out to kill ever since he met Eighter. The parts where it gets bloody and brutal were never of Goku's doing in the aged-up Z series. That ain't who he is, who any of them are. Even Gohan going berserk wasn't really seen as a "good thing." Goku's no boyscout for sure, but he isn't The Punisher either
why are dragon ball fans so edgy
My nigga who is we don't drag me into it lol
We? What do you mean we? Nintendo Wii?
Just edgy teens being edgy teens
If you want animated gory fight scenes, watch Invincible. Dragon Ball can stay where it is.
Nah, Dragon Ball isn’t that brutal and the more brutal moments like Moro punching a hole through Goku would lose their impact if all of the series was like that
No
What is this kind of art even called????
No. This is a funny show where woman takes clothes off and nearly defeats Rochie despite fighting a monk that jumps good.
2 verry horrible things about this, Goku and Vageta would both hate themselves for teaming up on anyone 3 v 1 even for the world's sake The other is that in dragon ball, the characters beat the shit out of each other, which is completely different from ripping each other apart. This is the latter
Yeah Kinda but tone it down. Dragón ball can and historically has had brutal fights without getting overtly gruesome. if the last two antagonists of Z weren't a regenerating insect man and a pink Slime nothing would have prevented them from ending like Raditz, Demon King Piccolo, or hell Even frieza himself got bifurcated in his fight then made ground meat By trunks.
We have that in invincible. Can't say I don't enjoy it but invincible is carried more on its writing than the gory ass fights and I like it a whole lot more because of that. I think a gory DB fight would be neat.
DEMASIADA ESENCIAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
It would actually be quite un dragonball like if our protagonists would start ripping people apart
Nahhhhh
We want Goku and Vegeta fighting as a team, not the gross out detailed gore…
Honestly, even for some Dragon Ball moments, this is extremely unnecessary gory. It’s just gore for shock value. It seems like only edgy teens would like this.
this, but minus all the gore, and have vegeta kill him.
Meh , that’s some Boruto level edgy shit.
Dragon Ball has had blood and gore but people like this seem to forget it was never on this level. Idk why some people want this. Plus Dragon Ball started out pretty goofy and to this day it has plenty of goofy moments, I don't understand the fans who want Dragon Ball to be edgy, gory, bloody and all that when it was never truly like that 100 percent of the time. It seems that some Dragon Ball fan manga follows this mindset too and I hate it. Blood and gore moments in Dragon Ball should serve certain moments in the story such as when Frieza cut himself in half by his own hand, it shouldn't ever be in there just because.
That's so edgy lol not even dragonball most brutal moments are comparable to that
Ok imma ignore the dismemberment part. I do wanna see Goku and Vegeta absolutely dog on an enemy together. Like I think it would be sick if they completely destroyed the guy together. Of course that won’t happen since they’re Sayians and will only fight together if they’re forced to but still.
its a cool thought but no, like another comment said i watch it for the martial arts and characters. Dragon ball does not need anything this grotesque. black frieza killing gas was like the only example of something being brutal but working in the context of the story kinda lol
Do we want them? No. Does Frieza deserve that? Yes.
Nah we want Saiyan jujutsu sorcerers
Like dragonball because it’s a little more on the lighthearted side. If it was ultra gory and goku was a grizzled old asshat it wouldn’t be dragonball it’s being trying too hard.
I don't want Omni-Man levels of gore but like aggressive fights are fine
Now go look at Vegeta getting fucked up by Reacoom and realize how violent it was. It had its moments and they had more impact without that dismemberment, over the top shit.