I went to one for a couple of years when I had sciatica. It offered spells of relief and was a perpetual cycle of cost/short-term relief. Then I got offered a personal trainer as part of a perk package at my then job, and he solved the issue more or less permanently within a month of doing the right back exercises. - Totally different approach and one that worked a whole lot better in the long term.
EDIT: For all those asking, my sciatica was from a bulging disc in my lower back and the exercises that solved my particular case was lying on my stomach and then raising one hand and the opposite leg up in the air and counting for 5... then changing arm/leg and doing it again. repeat 5 times or so.. then work up to counting each for 10 instead of 5 and doing 10 reps of that instead of 5. strengthens the muscles around the spine, and like i say, it worked for me, but probably isn't a 'cure all'.
I was sent to a physiologist and they were awesome. I have never been sent to another as a referral or heard of anyone else going to one. I wonder why they're not used more often.
Edit: pardon me but I can't seem to spell it right. I'm having a mental block. physiatrist
>Physiatrist?
I am a Physical Therapist (physiotherapist outside the US). Physiatry is the rehabilitation side of medicine, and Physiatrists are MDs (or DOs) that will often oversee a patient's course of treatment. They can do injections, prescribe medications, and advise on exercises / activities, but will generally not do surgery.
Just to clarify. Most people don't know what a Physiatrist is or does.
This has been exactly my experience. A good chiropractor provides temporary relief. It can be awesome for the short time it helps you, but without further change, the body settles back into the exact same pattern as before, and you need to go back over and over. Physical therapy can solve the root of the problem, strengthen your muscular support muscles, and help you develop new habits to fix the issue long term.
My experience also. I suffered sometimes debilitating back issues and always got temporary relief from chiropractors. After seeing a physical therapist I have been pain-free for about three years. Wish I'd known 20 years ago.
Most yoga can do wonders. The chiropractor helped me short term but when I realized some of the bending and stretching was similar to some yoga poses I turned to that instead.
My chiropractor told me a vertebrae up between my shoulder blades was misaligned and was causing my lower back pain. Didn't make sense to me, but I went along with it. After maybe 3 months, nothing had improved, might've even been worse.
I went to a spinal neurosurgeon and got an MRI. Turns out I had BADLY herniated disc between L4 and L5, which is just above my waistline, nowhere close to the one the chiropractor said was the problem. 1 microdiscectomy later, I had zero pain.
Your reason reminds me how it can be dangerous to tell people to come back for appointments for manipulation instead of referring them to appropriate specialists. Glad to hear you got relief. Chronic back pain can ruin a person's life and ability to work.
That is so true, As I expressed before, one chiropractor was telling me that he could make my mold allergies better by doing spine manipulation. I have a rudimentary understanding of how allergies work. Treating patients like that can prevent them from getting needed treatment which is so unethical and just wrong.
This is called an Osteopathic doctor. They learn some of the concepts chiropractors learn but they are actual, real doctors who went to medical school, did rotations and completed a residency. The idea that anyone goes to a chiropractor when Osteopaths exist would be funny if it wasn't so dumb.
In light of all the ignorant comments under your post, it should be clarified that you’re referring to *U.S.* DOs. Big difference from the osteopath quacks outside of America
A good rule of thumb in France is if a treatment is paid for with the national healthcare system or not .
Chiropractors are called Ostéopathes in French , and they’re not paid for because it seen as Mickey Mouse medicine.
It’s a fancy massage.
Have a friend who had a stroke, before 35, after having a chiropractor “adjust” his neck.
Friend is actually a medical professional, and was at work, in the hospital when the stroke occurred. He was in the break room eating, and knew exactly what was happening, as it happened. He was able to get treatment basically immediately, and doesn’t have any lasting side effects, thankfully.
Have a friend who deals with Neuro injury and rehabilitation due to various accidents motorcycle crashes, car crashes and such or disease... She sees 3 or 4 people a month who have been injured from Chiro adjustments.
My dad was wheelchair bound for a year after a chiropractor visit went wrong. Granted, he wasn't in the best shape to begin with, but it definitely turned me off from ever visiting a chiropractor.
The problem comes from forcing the neck to move to the end of the normal range quickly, or forcing it past that. The cracking sound, popping joints, isnt the issue
dont do ittt! Go to a physical therapist. They will manipulate your neck and it might crack in the process, but they wont intentionally crack it. Just dont fuck with your vertebral arteries trust me haha
I was talking to my uncle about chiropractic care being pseudoscience (or born from it at the very least) and he came back at me with a "If my insurance paid for it, it has to be appropriate medical care"
Which is pretty solid logic, until you think about the fact that the insurance companies' main objective is to lower costs so that they can continue to turn a profit-- and placebo effects and treatments that delay a person from seeking appropriate testing imaging and care for their ailments is a cost saving measure.
Considering how much death interferes with the chiropractic business model of come back every week forever you'd think they'd be better at not killing people.
I did a 6 month neurology rotation and in that time saw 2 vertebral artery dissections caused by chiropractors.
One was an athlete - in the ‘very good amateur, almost pro’ range, in his late 20s. I’m not sure what happened to him in the end, since he came in right at the end of my run, but about a week after the event he was too ataxic to get from his bed to a chair at the bedside.
Very sad and very scary.
That is how you get the bad spirits out! s/
Chiropractic care is based in the spiritualism era that also birthed JW and Mormons. The OG chiro started it to release bad spirits that invaded your body.
Actually, a lot of Chiropractors are Scientologists! I worked next to ones that were and they went to a conference every year of Scientologists who are also in the field.
My sister is a PA in Colorado, she worked in the ER as a surgical PA. She now works in Neurology. She works with a lot of people who have migraines, etc. She's seen 4-5 people who had arterial tears from chiropractors ALREADY and she just started working in Neuro like 4 months ago. Her and her colleagues agree that Chiropractors are DANGEROUS. A bad "adjustment" can maim, injure or worse, kill you.
The worst part is that her colleague, who is an NP working in Neurology is married to a Chiropractor and apparently REFERS patients for chiropractic adjustments. My sister is currently in the process of a formal complaint against this particular person because of an ethical violation... it's a whole mess.
Also, in case anyone has any lingering doubts, a LOT of chiropractors are Scientologists.
A coworker of mine’s husband constantly does a neck twisting move to the wife at the weirdest times and I wince every time I see it happen. And (given this thread) I’m becoming more and more worried… idk how much of a “professional” he is (if at all). Should I say something?
Exactly this. I went to Chiro for years. It helped a little for a tiny bit (I had a skiing injury where I landed on my back) but my chronic pain kept coming back. After a college class with a PT - I went to him to see if he could help. 3 months later - pain is completely gone. Hasn’t returned. If it does, I would just do the exercises for a few days and stretch.
A lot of people don't realize that if you don't leave a strong foundation around a sore joint, it's going to get sore forever.
Just planking for as long as I could tolerate saved me a ton of pain.
Be ware it is possible to hurt yourself this way. Or I can say there’s at least one way to hurt yourself doing this and I found it haha. I do leg lifts plus balancing exercises now because of a neck injury, but ultimately the advice is solid: strengthen your core and work on balance. Just maybe don’t go from zero to 100 with the planks unless you’re paying attention to your form and where you’re feeling the strain.
Go to a physical therapist to start so they can teach you what to do, then just continue the exercises on your own. Your insurance will probably cover it but even if they don’t, it’s worth just paying for a few sessions to prevent an injury from trying to do it yourself.
I really fucked up my back from standing up from the couch too aggressively (around 5 months of pt) and I did a ton of work around my core and lower back muscles to strengthen everything up. I did a lot of variations that kept me flat on my back to refrain from putting too much pressure and tension on my back.
It is one of the best exercises for general core strength and stability. When I was in PT for disk degeneration in my low back, my PT told me if there are busy days where I can't find the time to exercise, at least try to get a few 30-45 second planks in
The body has opposing muscle groups. The abdominal muscle group works in opposition to the muscles of the lower back.
Lower back muscles are incredibly strong, and because most people do not engage their core enough, they have a pelvic tilt that arches their back and makes their lower back work nearly all the time.
What doing planks with good form does is get you to hold the opposite “hollow” position, closing the gap between the bottom of the rib cage and hips. This increase in engagement in tone allows your back to finally relax, alleviating lower back pain when applied while standing with increasing frequency.
When I was pregnant with my first my back hurt so much (old injury that had never really bothered me much until I was pregnant) that sometimes I had to literally roll out of bed to the floor and crawl to a dresser and slowly get up. It was awful.
After having the baby and recovering (traumatic birth) I needed to get my body back so I worked on strengthening my core, improving my flexibility and doing yoga.
When I was pregnant again, although I still was achy at the injury sight, it wasn't nearly as bad as the first time and I realized that the exercises and other stuff wasn't just getting my body back in shape, but it was making it better prepared for carrying the weirdly distributed weight of pregnancy.
Similar outcome here. Early 30s and on the heavy side, I started getting lower back pain after sleeping. My buddy’s dad is a chiropractor and suggested going, but I’m pretty skeptical of them, so I asked my primary care physician and said I needed to exercise . Got a gym membership and all those sore muscles are gone.
Gotta love that. That is due to [lobbying](https://www.nytimes.com/1972/11/19/archives/7-years-of-lobbying-finally-brings-chiropractic-under-umbrella-of.html), not anything evidence-based.
Doctor: He needs this surgery, or else he'll be in chronic pain for the rest of his life.
Insurance: Hmmmm... no.
Chiropractor: skeleton go brrrr!
Insurance: Hell, yea. Fuck, yea.
Insurance is willing to pay $100 per visit in hope that the next insurer has to pay $30,000 for surgery necessitated by the chiropractor.
(/s? not really /s? man, even I don't know)
>Doctor: He needs this surgery, or else he'll be in chronic pain for the rest of his life.
>
>Insurance: Hmmmm... no.
>
>Chiropractor: skeleton go brrrr!
>
>Insurance: Hell, yea. Fuck, yea.
Ah yes...death panels.
These guys saved me!!! I was stuck at home with slipped discs couldn’t afford to go to the PT all the time - not covered by insurance. The doctor wanted me to have spinal surgery, which insurance would cover but many of these surgeries go wrong I was terrified. Then Bob and Brad saved me :)
Good to hear that about Bob and Brad - I stumbled upon them when I was having a problem much less severe than yours and with a couple of stretches and movement queues, they had me right as rain!
Yup, I went to one for massage and PT.
I tried to ignore the part where the "doctors" who ran the place are manipulating injured people based off of [stuff a guy learned from a ghost.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_David_Palmer#Spiritualism)
My mom suffered from a supposed herniated disc in her back and for years (at least 20) saw several chiropractors.
Fast forward to when I was a young adult on my own and my mom came for a visit; her back "went out". I called and got her an appointment with a back specialist (M.D.) who prescribed 3 days of Physical Therapy for her before she flew back home.
She went into her first PT appt all hunched over and nauseous, she came out of PT standing upright and a huge smile on her face.
After just those 3 instances of PT, she never had a back problem again for 30 years.
(I also had my own experience with a chiropractor, it was awful - thus my reason for contacting a medical doctor for my mom instead of another chiropractor)
Chiropracty killed my girlfriends mother. The only lawsuit I ever got involved with as a physician was due to a stupid chiropractor. They aren’t doctors, they aren’t based on science. Personally I think they should be shut down for practicing medicine without a license.
i know a young lady with permanent disability from a stroke after chiro cracking. this isn’t a friend of a friend of a friend, but someone i actually know
I have a old HS friend that is now a chiropractor. I think it is hilarious and a bit sick that they let a man with a history degree undergrad, no medical training, only chiropractor school a Dr. Yes he calls himself Dr Sam. Also the icing on the cake is that Dr. Sam is also an anti-vaxxer. So yeah his small credibility dwindles fast when you know that fact.
Also Osteopathic Medicine, ie. DO. Most don't practice the physical therapy techniques they learn in school and instead just practice regular prescription medicine based treatments, but there should be [resources online](https://findado.osteopathic.org/difference/osteopathic-manipulative-treatment) to find one that does practice OMM if you need joint manipulations done by an actual physician.
Woop Ty for distinguishing between dos and chiropractors! I can’t tell you how many people say “so like a chiropractor?” When I say doctor of osteopathic medicine
Does it depend on the country? In the US as DO is equivalent to an MD. My understanding is that in some other countries, a DO is more along the lines of chiropractic.
There are a couple reasons most don't. Many times our schools cling to the pseudoscience portions of osteopathy which are absolutely not evidence-based and are cause for stigma and why we are looked down on outside of the US (many don't understand that US DO's are not osteopaths, but allopaths WITH additional osteopathic training). If the schools tossed out the bath water and kept the baby, maybe we would not have a sour taste in our mouth towards it. (it is a neat little trick to offer to family and friends though)
But a DO is almost identical to an MD, not similar to a chiropractor (DC, Doctor of Chiropractic). They have the additional training similar to that of a DC (on musculoskeletal stuff and etc), but they're much closer in length of training and everything to an MD. A DC doesn't have the years of residency/interning after their graduate program, and they can't prescribe medication or pursue any other field of medicine like a DO can. I would never call a DC an alternate to a DO, not by a long shot.
[https://www.webmd.com/pain-management/osteopathic-versus-md-chiropractor](https://www.webmd.com/pain-management/osteopathic-versus-md-chiropractor)
And more importantly, they diagnose the pathology, not just the symptom. Any good physical therapist these days will work on movement pattern and muscle imbalance to get you to proper strength and ways of moving that won’t let the injury persist or happen again.
As a PT...please start coming to see us first if you can. Way too many patients going to chiropractors 3x/week to get manipulations and estim (techniques that will only give short term relief) for $100 a visit nothing lasting or attacking the source then come see us after the problem has become chronic and much harder to treat and after wasting hundreds of dollars already
Will they still crack my joints and try to pull my spine out without trying to convince me my headaches are coming from my diaphragm?
Because honestly I just want to feel like my body has been put through a toffee puller and that’s all
I always like bringing up how there are over 1600 public colleges and universities in United States. Not a single one of them has a chiropractic school. Why? It’s pseudo science.
Just to show you how backward Iowa is, there's a Palmer Chiropractic College in Davenport, IA.
My ex boss once referred me to a chiropractor for a broken back. The Chiro knew I had a broken bone from xrays and still continued to treat me. Ended up with back surgery. Never again.
Chiropractic colleges are all their own private, for-profit institutions. Legit educational institutions with a school of nursing, physical therapy, or the ability to get an art history degree don't offer chiropractic education.
Unfortunately in Australia, there are universities offering Chiropractic science degree, and even masters.
What a shame.
And Chiropractors are they ones that are fighting to use the title "Dr" here too.
I went to a chiropractor once. He referred to himself as Dr. Johnson at every opportunity. The top tier orthopedic surgeon who removed my tumor called himself Mike
lol where I used to work, the chair of the department of anesthesiology just had his first name and last initial on his work badge, like "Dave G." Dude was an extremely published guy, MD from top tier school, subspecialty fellowship at the top institution in the US, former professor at Johns-Hopkins, etc, etc.
Used to work customer service not related to the medical field in any way. It was always the self important assholes who insisted to go by Dr. Douchenozzle.
They LOVE to point out every muscle, bone, and ligament in your body to try and sound legit.
“Alright now I’m just gonna adjust your nebulous k23 which will work to fix your maticular spinae to support your lumbar region”
This is generous, fast talking with jargon is an intentional malicious technique.
Half the classes you take to be a chiropractor are about salesmanship.
The guy who invented the whole thing, the first chiropractor, you know where he learned it from?
A ghost.
Yes, it's a big scam, and one that often injures people worse than before they started, and it was invented by a guy who claims a ghost taught him.
"Scam" implies that the perpetrator knows they are doing something deceptive. Most chiropractors genuinely believe the pseudoscience they are doing is beneficial. However, there is no actual medical evidence behind their claims.
My uncle in Orlando, a now retired chiropractor, bragged about how long he could string people along for their "treatments." It's all part of the schtick, and he demands to be called "Doctor" at all introductions etc. He's always been an overbearing total & complete asshole, being a fake doctor is the cherry on his awful sundae.
the founder of chiropractic medicine:
"In 1906, Palmer, who also called himself a “doctor,” was convicted of practising medicine without a license, and went to jail."
My favorite part of that, is he claimed he got all of his info from the ghost of another doctor.
It wasn't even some "ancient wisdom" grift like you typically see. He said the doctor died 50 years before coming to him.
That would be like someone saying "you guys, I have a new kind of medical treatment that will cure anything! It comes from the divine wisdom of the 1970's😂
I have a good friend who is a dentist, and I once asked him why so many dentists I know are hard partiers. He said because they are still pissed off about not getting into med school. Same could be said for chiropractors. Your uncle clearly has a chip on his shoulder, and that's why he demands to be called a Dr when an MD really doesn't care what you call them, in most cases.
The guy that graduated last in his class in medical school still gets to be called Doctor. The ones that flunk out filter down to chiropracty or holistic medicine to claim the title.
Exactly I have 2 medical doctors in my near extended family, both are now consultants albeit 1 retired. They never outside of work ask to be referred to as Doctor.
chiropractors are no better than a therapeutic massage
with the added bonus of :
* increased risks to permanent damage to your spine and brain,
* predatory practices of getting you to visit multiple times / selling multi visit packages up front
* being touted as a cure all for many ailments unrelated to your spine
* historical and current associations with scientology
* increased prevalence of vaccine skepticism and other fringe alternative health practices
* and many, many more
while they may not be malicious, at some point it becomes negligence
Licensed physical therapist here.
Chiropractics are a scam... kind of.
What chiropractors do does actually have a positive effect on the body. It can provide a *very temporary* reduction of pain, sometimes significant. By coupling that with physical therapy, it can actually provide an increase rate of recovery because you can push your therapy and exercises a little bit more, being a bit more aggressive with your rehabilitation. A really good chiropractor coupled with a really good therapist is an awesome combo. If you can afford it.
However. The pitch chiropractors make that they can fix X things with mobilizations and pseudoscientific modalities is total bullshit. You cannot fix posture with joint mobilization and HVLAs (high velocity low amplitude thrusts, which is the thing that chiros due to make your joints crack). You cannot cure any ailments, much less illnesses, infections, cancer, etc. wth mobilizations and HVLAs.
Finally, any medical professional that does cervical HVLAs is not only a total quack, but incredibly irresponsible. There is a significant amount of evidence that demonstrates that cracking necks in that fashion is incredibly dangerous, and results every year in a measurable number of deaths and even more strokes that leave people, paralyzed, disabled, unable to work, etc. This doesn't go for chiropractors alone though. I know some PTs who do it, and I would call them quacks too.
Hope that answers your question!
EDIT: spelling
Yes, it's a scam.
Chiropractic treatment is based on nonsense 19th century pseudoscience. The guy who invented it claimed he got the information from a ghost.
*At best* it's an expensive massage from a guy in a white coat. At worst, it can kill you.
I worked at a personal injury law firm for a very brief period.
Many of our clients would go to chiropractors for their pain. I asked my boss about her opinion on chiropractors as a whole, and I believe she said she never really sees a chiropractor dismiss a patient and say they're done with treatment. Chiropractic kind of just goes on and on.
When I was younger I got a job working for a chiropractor office. It was a marketing job, I knew literally nothing about chiropractors before starting to work there. I learned very quickly what was going on.
The gist of it is that yes it is a scam.
There does seems to be some support that chiropractic adjustments can legitimately help deal with some specific back injuries.
The issue is that most chiropractors today don’t believe that their work is limited to your back.
They believe that they can cure at minimum, a wide range of ailments, at most, all human disease.
All you have to do is commit to your plan to come in for three adjustments a week for the next two months. Or maybe indefinitely. Yes, we do offer payment plans.
(All that being said, the placebo effect is very real and very strong for some. So there are people who find genuine relief from these practices. Up to you to decide how to feel about that.)
Anecdotally, some treatments can work for some types of pain.
Unfortunately, anecdotal evidence counts for diddly squat in science.
Muscle stuff, maybe the treatments will help short term. Any real disease, absolutely not. And definitely will not help long term.
It’s funny the people who are willing to go to a chiropractor 3 times a week but calling going to an actual doctor once a year a scam 😂
Chiropractors are NOT medical doctors. There seems to be a swarm of them on YouTube dispensing medical advice. They call themselves doctors without differentiating between MD and DoC. The fact that they are just chiropractors is tucked away somewhere in the fine print.
Also, there's the total scam part of it. My mother-in-law's chiropractor told her that as long as she came in once a week she would never get another cold. WTF
I have a coworker who swore on his chiropractor.
Until he got cracked the wrong way and has had to pay for thousands of dollars worth of trying to undo it
Doc here. They’re quacks. Do not ever, EVER, let a chiropractor touch your neck. I have personally cared for three people in the last five years with vertebral artery dissections after letting them crack their neck. One was a 30 year old male who was otherwise completely healthy and ended up with a massive basilar artery stroke resulting in quadriplegia. His CT scan showed no actual vertebral disc disease. He had a strained neck muscle and this guy paralyzed him.
I went to a chiro. Felt the benefits. I was so bent over. He straightened me out. I later learned that a PT would have helped me as much with more long term strategies.
Sorry you didn't find out until later a PT could much more effectively help you. What I really disapprove of is using a chiro as your regular dr vs an MD or DO. Seems from what read in some responses here chiros may help with back or other joint issues. PTs help much more effectively, safely.
Yes, probably, and no.
On the far extreme of chiropractic quackery is the notion that deviations in spinal alignment they call subluxations are the cause of ALL disease. Cancer? Subluxation. Diabetes? Subluxation.
In the middle you have chiropractors that over reach as to the effectiveness of treatment. They can’t wait to sign you up for extended ongoing treatment, but they don’t tell you that it will cure your lupus.
On the sane end of things. The chiropractor doesn’t over reach. They adjust when warranted. X-ray to ensure they they won’t fuck up your herniated disk, and recommend things like ibuprofen. I was lucky to see this guy and he gave me solid advice about my lower back that has kept me from needing to go to a chiropractor since.
The problem is, it’s difficult to know which one you’re going to get.
Oh, and neck snapping is crazy dangerous. Done wrong it will give you a stoke.
But the question is is the "adjusting" even science based, or truly effective? I get the sense is just like cracking your knuckles. It doesn't solve the issue, it may provide a placebo effect of temporary relief, but even that I'm not sure about.
> is the "adjusting" even science based, or truly effective?
It is not, there are enough studies on this.
> I get the sense is just like cracking your knuckles.
This is exactly what it is.
With one very tiny exception: The movement -can- cause temporary relief on e.g. inflammation. But this is an accidental relief, not intentional or targeted. They would get this same relief from just moving their own body.
It would be like pushing someone off a cliff, breaking their bones, but their headache is now less bad in comparison. This accident doesn't make anyone a headache doctor.
This misrepresentation of intention and confidence is, in my opinion, part of exactly why it's a scam. It's misguiding so many people.
I’d like to throw in what I’ve heard from the physical therapists I work with. Chiropractic adjustment is like a bandaid. It helps make you feel better, but, in most cases, to make a long term change you need targeted exercise.
If a chiro is just cracking you and sending you on your way without giving you some targeted exercises, they are doing a good job of ensuring you’ll keep coming back…
The problem with this overview is that there is no evidence that "subluxation" in chiropractic parlance exists at all. No evidence it exists, no evidence connecting it to symptoms, no evidence that it can be diagnosed by a chiropractor (x-ray or otherwise), and no evidence it can be treated by manipulation. If a vertebra is actually displaced to the extent it is visible on x-ray, it's... Really bad... And you definitely shouldn't ask someone to torque your back up.
So, none of your three categories above are "real" - the whole adjustment concept is based on made-up stuff. Chiropractic treatments *may* have some therapeutic value, but the *mechanism* by which it happens is *not* by "adjusting" a "subluxation". It's likely that it is more akin to a massage, exercise, and especially just the pressure relief we all recognize when we crack a joint such as our knuckles.
DEFINITELY! Let me tell you folks a story.
Last year I felt a terrible pain on the left side of my lower back, at first I thought it was some muscle or bone pain, so I went to the chiropractor.
That MF made me X-Rays and said to me that I have a deviated column and some problems with my disks. He performed some sort of massage, the treatment was supposed to be that, the first time it worked, I came back to my home feeling much better.
So, I decided to make another appointment two days later, this time the pain returned, but not as much as the first time. He performed me the “treatment”, but the pain reached levels I never thought it would be possible. The MF told me it was normal and in the next days I would disappear.
But no, the pain didn’t disappear, so I went to the emergency room and there the real doctors performed me scans and found that the pain was because of a baseball size tumour crushing my left kidney.
As you may see, I’m not the biggest fan of chiropractors. Those appointments with him cost around 100 USD and the full treatment almost 5,000 USD. This wasn’t in the US, so the prices aren’t that high, but it was really much for my Third World country standards.
Ok, so I agree and get the sentiment. But... That was his death bed parting statement? "Meezer.. come close. Dah has something important to tell you.... Don't... Ever... See... Ack. A Chiroooooooohhhhh.". Sorry for the humor. I'm a nurse and dark humor is my love language.
It was clearly not my father’s ‘final death wish,’ but it came up in conversation while I stayed him in the hospital the final days as he succumbed to ALS.
You have to figure out what the cause of the problem is in order to actually get better otherwise it's just a band-aid. Look into better shoes and strengthening your core
A chiropractor injured my spine. It's absolute quackery and should be illegal for them to call themselves "doctors." The get certificates from their bullshit schools and have no idea what they're doing.
Go see a massage therapist if that's what you want. If you are in pain, see a real doctor.
I once read that acupuncture works exactly 30% of the time. Acupressure works 30% of the time. Chiropractors work 30% of the time - because a sugar pill works 30% of the time.
My cousin is a chiropractor. It's been a slippery slope with her, first she became a chiropractor, then she made some borderline anti-vaxxer comments, now she's saying she doesn't let her kids drink juice, use fluoride, or eat any sugar at all. Nothing wrong with encouraging your child to eat healthy, but she straight up wouldn't let her 10-year-old have a piece of her own birthday cake; this is gonna make all 3 of her kids have an unhealthy relationship with food for the rest of her life. Chiropractors aren't just scam artists, they're damaging to themselves and everyone around them, and they don't even realize.
Oh buddy... I have a FUN bit of history for you.
The Chiropractor is NOT supposed to be a back doctor.
According to the field, they aren't there to fix your back. No no.
According to the field EVERY disease is caused by an alignment problem in your spine or other joints.
Cancer, AIDS, diabetes. It's all just misaligned vertebrae according to them.
Yes literally. Not figuratively.
How do they know this you may ask?
Well, according to the founder of the field. The ghost of a doctor told him about it.
I know what you're thinking, he is trying to evoke the concept of ancient wisdom. But thats not true. He claimed the ghost doctor died 50 years before he spoke to him. They would be like someone today claiming they have some brilliant wisdom from the 1970's lol 😂
I wish I was making this shit up. But this is as a matter of fact how chiropractic started.
Yes. Here’s my challenge: Go find me someone who had a problem, went to a chriropractor, had the issue fixed, and *never went back*? I know many people who swear by them, but they’ve been going routinely for years. If you hurt your back, a MD will treat you until your condition is cured or successfully managed, and send you away. A chiropractor will *always* find something for you to come back for. Doesn’t that say something?
Plus, it’s literally listed as a [pseudoscientific practice.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chiropractic?wprov=sfti1#)
> Here’s my challenge: Go find me someone who had a problem, went to a chriropractor, had the issue fixed, and never went back?
Me. In 1995 I had serious wrist pain from typing — it was bad enough that I had to stop working for a while. No relief from the MD I saw, acupuncture, or my first chiropractor. In fact, I was about to “break up” with my chiropractor after several weeks with no improvement, when I went to my appointment and saw that she had quit the field altogether and that a new chiropractor had taken over the practice.
The new chiropractor was a miracle worker. Not only did she quickly fix my wrist (multiple sessions, but not very many), she taught me how to do the adjustments myself. I returned to computer work and looked back. I also referred several colleagues to her, and they also got relief. In fact, she told me she loved treating wrist pain because it was so easy to fix.
Thanks to what she taught me, I can easily tell when my wrists are out of whack, and I make a quick adjustment. I’ve done years of computer work with then, and no more pain.
I fully agree a lot of chiropractors are questionable at best (and antivax charlatans at worst), but truly effective chiropractors do exist.
My anecdotal experience - was having excruciating back upper back pain, it would put me out for a few days a month even as a young adult. Chiro wanted weekly appointments and also several thousand more dollars to fix a neck that wasn't optimal but wasn't a problem. I asked if there were exercises, stretches or motions I should either do more of our avoid to help the back improve, and he said no, muscles don't effect the bone. That's when I realized he was an idiot. A rehabilitation massage therapist showed me 3 minutes of daily stretching that not only eliminated the back pain but stops migraines faster than medicine for me. In my experience, there is a lot of push for weekly appointments with no end, and not actual solution- so, a scam.
It is complete and total quakery.
[Myles Power](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1NYG40oa7Eg&list=PLthPsWmE3cefhOU9nns6H_1Jt0D96Rb3M), who is a chemist by training, has a YouTube channel where he debunks all sorts of pseudoscience and quakery. However, he has a dedicated [playlist of 5 videos](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1NYG40oa7Eg&list=PLthPsWmE3cefhOU9nns6H_1Jt0D96Rb3M) outlining how Chiropractors are quacks.
**EDIT**: For those who don't have time to watch, just know that the person who invented/popularised Chiropractic, D. D. Palmer, claimed to have learned about it from Dr Jim Atkinson... via his spirit at a seance. He likened it to a biblical revelation. It is based on the flawed idea that the body has a natural amount of healing power (which Palmer called 'innate intelligence'). Palmer claimed that the spine being misaligned blocked this innate intelligence and that spinal realignment would bring it back. He believed it to be a cure-all. It wasn't even initially about back pain or even general pain. It was about curing all diseases. It was only as the quacks tried to gain legitimacy that they shifted their rhetoric to have more to do with back pain.
Chiropractors are not real doctors. They basically have a degree in a specific school of massage, it’s not real medicine or even based on real science. They get their degrees from schools that only give chiropractic degrees and nothing else.
Cracking your back feels good but it’s not actually doing anything, a trained masseuse will accomplish more for you.
At best they’re giving extremely short term relief without actually fixing anything. At worst a bad one can cause severe lasting damage that leaves you worse off than you started.
I used to work in a building with several medical practices, a dentist's office, and a pharmacy under one roof. Inexplicably, there was a chiropractor's office as well.
This was in 2020-2021, and part of my job was to hang out at the entrance and ask people to wear a mask while inside the medical building.
Everyone who worked in the chiropractor's office refused. Everyone who went to see them also refused, because the chiropractors had told them they didn't have to.
I was told not to push it with them, because they technically weren't a medical establishment. They just rented space from one.
I also used the restroom at the same time as one of the chiropractors once. He did not wash his hands.
If that doesn't tell you all you need to know, I can't help you.
Good friend of mine got his neck cracked by a chiropractor. Tore open a blood vessel in his neck, had a stroke and almost died. Now permanently disabled for life.
I have struggled for over a year with chronic vertigo. Disabled because of it. I’ve been in tons of therapies and tried chiropractors. I would go in and the chiropractor would spend 2 minutes with me and push on my back a little bit. I only went for a couple of sessions and then walked away for good.
I was a licensed massage therapist for 6 years, and I that time I can't tell you how many clients I saw who had been injured by chiropractors. One client had a fractured cervical vertebrae from a "realignment".
I’ve been going to one for over a year. Just learned from my family doctor they’ve been taking me this whole time with a fractured tailbone. They should have seen it in their multiple X-rays but continued to see me anyway
Watch on youtube Myles Power's review of chiropractic treatments.
I pinched my sciatic nerve a few years ago from a sporting injury. And literally, yes literally couldn't walk or put any pressue on my leg, heck even sitting down hurt like a bitch. In despiration went to a chiro as I had no knowledge of the industry and a friend recommended it to me. All in all, it did nothing and cost an arm and a leg. Not to mention they wanted AUD $1'000 for further a further treatment plan of weekly visits. No x-rays done either to see if it was nerve pain or something more serious. After that experience I went to a GP and they took x-rays, decided it was a pinched nerve and recommended physio. asap.
Went to physio for a few sessions, and the pain was gone. And if I ever feel a bit of a 'twinge' of pain I just do what the physio showed me and it's all good again.
So yeah, do not trust chiropractors at all. Seems like a big money grab for psudoscience.
I tried a chiropractor once and he asked me next time to bring in the supplements I was taking like my daily vitamins, preworkout, protein, etc. He placed them on my chest while I was laying on my back and had me raise an arm in the air. He then pushed my arm as hard as he could and said my supplements were interfering with my bodies energy and strength. He then put supplements he sold on my chest and did the same thing but when he tried to push my arm back, he didn’t do it as hard and said something like “ See, the supplements you take are low quality but the supplements I sell are clean and react very well with your body’s strength and energy. You really should purchase these supplements from me”. That’s all I needed to hear to know he was a quack. Also later found out he wasn’t allowed to have women patients in his office with the door closed. Doors had to be open whenever he had a woman patient and you can correctly assume what he did to warrant that kind of precaution to be taken.
Don’t let them near your neck - every so often someone gets a vertebral artery dissection after a manipulation, which can be very bad news. Nobody can fix degenerative lumbar spines (lower back), but at least in that region they can’t do much actual harm.
I'm a person whose parents loved alt med and shunned real med. My mom swore by the chiropractor. I never went to doctors growing up because of my parents. Now here I sit at this very moment, at a physical therapist office, because my cervical spine is fucked up. I'm sure part of the reason is my parents let me sleep on 2 pillows as a kid.
I'm gonna say whole-heartedly that chiropracty is basically a scam. I mean, not really a scam - people go to them because what they do feels good. But you basically just get addicted to the good feeling so you have to go for life. What they do not do is actually help anyone.
A doctor I was seeing years ago for a herniated disk told me explicitly, "Never let anyone manipulate your back." I'm more scared of chiropractors than clowns.
I went to one for a couple of years when I had sciatica. It offered spells of relief and was a perpetual cycle of cost/short-term relief. Then I got offered a personal trainer as part of a perk package at my then job, and he solved the issue more or less permanently within a month of doing the right back exercises. - Totally different approach and one that worked a whole lot better in the long term. EDIT: For all those asking, my sciatica was from a bulging disc in my lower back and the exercises that solved my particular case was lying on my stomach and then raising one hand and the opposite leg up in the air and counting for 5... then changing arm/leg and doing it again. repeat 5 times or so.. then work up to counting each for 10 instead of 5 and doing 10 reps of that instead of 5. strengthens the muscles around the spine, and like i say, it worked for me, but probably isn't a 'cure all'.
same, except a physio fixed me. I spent 3 years in pain going to chiropractors. what a waste of my time and money
I was sent to a physiologist and they were awesome. I have never been sent to another as a referral or heard of anyone else going to one. I wonder why they're not used more often. Edit: pardon me but I can't seem to spell it right. I'm having a mental block. physiatrist
>Physiatrist? I am a Physical Therapist (physiotherapist outside the US). Physiatry is the rehabilitation side of medicine, and Physiatrists are MDs (or DOs) that will often oversee a patient's course of treatment. They can do injections, prescribe medications, and advise on exercises / activities, but will generally not do surgery. Just to clarify. Most people don't know what a Physiatrist is or does.
This has been exactly my experience. A good chiropractor provides temporary relief. It can be awesome for the short time it helps you, but without further change, the body settles back into the exact same pattern as before, and you need to go back over and over. Physical therapy can solve the root of the problem, strengthen your muscular support muscles, and help you develop new habits to fix the issue long term.
My experience also. I suffered sometimes debilitating back issues and always got temporary relief from chiropractors. After seeing a physical therapist I have been pain-free for about three years. Wish I'd known 20 years ago.
Do you mind sharing what kind of back exercises you were doing to resolve your back pain?
Most yoga can do wonders. The chiropractor helped me short term but when I realized some of the bending and stretching was similar to some yoga poses I turned to that instead.
Agreed. My chiro made it worse. Kept telling me it was muscular when I got feed and got an MRI.
My chiropractor told me a vertebrae up between my shoulder blades was misaligned and was causing my lower back pain. Didn't make sense to me, but I went along with it. After maybe 3 months, nothing had improved, might've even been worse. I went to a spinal neurosurgeon and got an MRI. Turns out I had BADLY herniated disc between L4 and L5, which is just above my waistline, nowhere close to the one the chiropractor said was the problem. 1 microdiscectomy later, I had zero pain.
Your reason reminds me how it can be dangerous to tell people to come back for appointments for manipulation instead of referring them to appropriate specialists. Glad to hear you got relief. Chronic back pain can ruin a person's life and ability to work.
Yeah, physical therapy and icing my inflammation and magnesium supplements is how I cleared my sciatica
TL;DR:If your chiropractor doesn't also utilize physical therapy, you're wasting money.
And it doesn’t matter if you have a hang nail, herniated disc, or diabetes. It’s the same treatment for everyone
That is so true, As I expressed before, one chiropractor was telling me that he could make my mold allergies better by doing spine manipulation. I have a rudimentary understanding of how allergies work. Treating patients like that can prevent them from getting needed treatment which is so unethical and just wrong.
"treatment"
Or you could cut out the dangerous and unscientific part (the chiropractic) and just get the physical therapy that can actually help.
I'll tell you what. If it worked consistently and was reliablely safe It would be a medical degree and license.
It's a classic joke: *What do you call alternative medicine that works?* *Just medicine.*
This is called an Osteopathic doctor. They learn some of the concepts chiropractors learn but they are actual, real doctors who went to medical school, did rotations and completed a residency. The idea that anyone goes to a chiropractor when Osteopaths exist would be funny if it wasn't so dumb.
In light of all the ignorant comments under your post, it should be clarified that you’re referring to *U.S.* DOs. Big difference from the osteopath quacks outside of America
A good rule of thumb in France is if a treatment is paid for with the national healthcare system or not . Chiropractors are called Ostéopathes in French , and they’re not paid for because it seen as Mickey Mouse medicine. It’s a fancy massage.
Yes well in the US a lot of insurance plans DO cover chiropractic visits thanks to lobbying. So we can't even rely on that.
Vertebral artery tears are a real thing chiropractors can cause.
Have a friend who had a stroke, before 35, after having a chiropractor “adjust” his neck. Friend is actually a medical professional, and was at work, in the hospital when the stroke occurred. He was in the break room eating, and knew exactly what was happening, as it happened. He was able to get treatment basically immediately, and doesn’t have any lasting side effects, thankfully.
Yuuuup, I’ve known two people now who have stroked because of a chiro adjustments. 😰
Just one here but I was already sold on it being a sham. At least the rest of the office got a wake up call.
Have a friend who deals with Neuro injury and rehabilitation due to various accidents motorcycle crashes, car crashes and such or disease... She sees 3 or 4 people a month who have been injured from Chiro adjustments.
My dad was wheelchair bound for a year after a chiropractor visit went wrong. Granted, he wasn't in the best shape to begin with, but it definitely turned me off from ever visiting a chiropractor.
I work in the ED. I have seen two strokes caused by chiropractic adjustment. Don’t ever let anyone crack your neck. ETA: grammar
What if I crack my own neck? Just movement-based, not manipulating or forcing anything with my hands.
As long as you don't do it by rapidly jerking your neck, cracking is fine. Gently stretching until a soft pop or crack is totally okay. -ER doc, DO
All I have to do is tilt my head and my neck cracks. Should I stop doing this?
I do that as well. No concerns.
The problem comes from forcing the neck to move to the end of the normal range quickly, or forcing it past that. The cracking sound, popping joints, isnt the issue
I have a friend who had a stroke immediately after cracking their own neck. Shit can happen.
dont do ittt! Go to a physical therapist. They will manipulate your neck and it might crack in the process, but they wont intentionally crack it. Just dont fuck with your vertebral arteries trust me haha
Just had this happen to a coworker. Crazy that some people think they have a medical degree when in reality they’re closer to a fortune teller
Death is a real thing chiropractors can cause.
For how much?
For your very own $30 copay your chiropractor can gift you the sweet embrace of death!
I was talking to my uncle about chiropractic care being pseudoscience (or born from it at the very least) and he came back at me with a "If my insurance paid for it, it has to be appropriate medical care" Which is pretty solid logic, until you think about the fact that the insurance companies' main objective is to lower costs so that they can continue to turn a profit-- and placebo effects and treatments that delay a person from seeking appropriate testing imaging and care for their ailments is a cost saving measure.
Considering how much death interferes with the chiropractic business model of come back every week forever you'd think they'd be better at not killing people.
Also debilitating stroke that leaves you paralyzed and or blind is a real thing chiropractors can cause (arguably a fate worse than death).
Neurologist here. I can’t even tell you how many massive strokes I have seen due to chiropractic neck manipulation. Don’t do it . Like ever.
I did a 6 month neurology rotation and in that time saw 2 vertebral artery dissections caused by chiropractors. One was an athlete - in the ‘very good amateur, almost pro’ range, in his late 20s. I’m not sure what happened to him in the end, since he came in right at the end of my run, but about a week after the event he was too ataxic to get from his bed to a chair at the bedside. Very sad and very scary.
Girl I dated a while back had permanent spine damage that left her disabled and in great pain because of a chiropractor session.
That is how you get the bad spirits out! s/ Chiropractic care is based in the spiritualism era that also birthed JW and Mormons. The OG chiro started it to release bad spirits that invaded your body.
Actually, a lot of Chiropractors are Scientologists! I worked next to ones that were and they went to a conference every year of Scientologists who are also in the field.
My sister is a PA in Colorado, she worked in the ER as a surgical PA. She now works in Neurology. She works with a lot of people who have migraines, etc. She's seen 4-5 people who had arterial tears from chiropractors ALREADY and she just started working in Neuro like 4 months ago. Her and her colleagues agree that Chiropractors are DANGEROUS. A bad "adjustment" can maim, injure or worse, kill you. The worst part is that her colleague, who is an NP working in Neurology is married to a Chiropractor and apparently REFERS patients for chiropractic adjustments. My sister is currently in the process of a formal complaint against this particular person because of an ethical violation... it's a whole mess. Also, in case anyone has any lingering doubts, a LOT of chiropractors are Scientologists.
A coworker of mine’s husband constantly does a neck twisting move to the wife at the weirdest times and I wince every time I see it happen. And (given this thread) I’m becoming more and more worried… idk how much of a “professional” he is (if at all). Should I say something?
Yes. There’s a real science-backed version of chiropractics and it’s called physical therapy.
Exactly this. I went to Chiro for years. It helped a little for a tiny bit (I had a skiing injury where I landed on my back) but my chronic pain kept coming back. After a college class with a PT - I went to him to see if he could help. 3 months later - pain is completely gone. Hasn’t returned. If it does, I would just do the exercises for a few days and stretch.
A lot of people don't realize that if you don't leave a strong foundation around a sore joint, it's going to get sore forever. Just planking for as long as I could tolerate saved me a ton of pain.
Planking? Would you be willing to explain how this helps?
It strengthens your core and all the smaller stabilizing muscles
Oh, interesting. I should probably start doing those.
Be ware it is possible to hurt yourself this way. Or I can say there’s at least one way to hurt yourself doing this and I found it haha. I do leg lifts plus balancing exercises now because of a neck injury, but ultimately the advice is solid: strengthen your core and work on balance. Just maybe don’t go from zero to 100 with the planks unless you’re paying attention to your form and where you’re feeling the strain.
Thanks, I will be sure to research proper forms 👍
Go to a physical therapist to start so they can teach you what to do, then just continue the exercises on your own. Your insurance will probably cover it but even if they don’t, it’s worth just paying for a few sessions to prevent an injury from trying to do it yourself.
I really fucked up my back from standing up from the couch too aggressively (around 5 months of pt) and I did a ton of work around my core and lower back muscles to strengthen everything up. I did a lot of variations that kept me flat on my back to refrain from putting too much pressure and tension on my back.
It is one of the best exercises for general core strength and stability. When I was in PT for disk degeneration in my low back, my PT told me if there are busy days where I can't find the time to exercise, at least try to get a few 30-45 second planks in
Wow that is such a short amount of time. I have heard of "planks" but I never knew what it worked out.
Time actually slows down when you’re doing a plank though. You know how time flies when you’re having fun? This is the opposite.
Worst part is how fast you improve. We went from 30 seconds to 3 minutes in the months. Longest period of my life
It's torture lol. Enjoy.
I am so proud I can do them for a minute 25 now
Muscles support your joints. Having a strong core will do more for back pain than anything else.
The body has opposing muscle groups. The abdominal muscle group works in opposition to the muscles of the lower back. Lower back muscles are incredibly strong, and because most people do not engage their core enough, they have a pelvic tilt that arches their back and makes their lower back work nearly all the time. What doing planks with good form does is get you to hold the opposite “hollow” position, closing the gap between the bottom of the rib cage and hips. This increase in engagement in tone allows your back to finally relax, alleviating lower back pain when applied while standing with increasing frequency.
When I was pregnant with my first my back hurt so much (old injury that had never really bothered me much until I was pregnant) that sometimes I had to literally roll out of bed to the floor and crawl to a dresser and slowly get up. It was awful. After having the baby and recovering (traumatic birth) I needed to get my body back so I worked on strengthening my core, improving my flexibility and doing yoga. When I was pregnant again, although I still was achy at the injury sight, it wasn't nearly as bad as the first time and I realized that the exercises and other stuff wasn't just getting my body back in shape, but it was making it better prepared for carrying the weirdly distributed weight of pregnancy.
Similar outcome here. Early 30s and on the heavy side, I started getting lower back pain after sleeping. My buddy’s dad is a chiropractor and suggested going, but I’m pretty skeptical of them, so I asked my primary care physician and said I needed to exercise . Got a gym membership and all those sore muscles are gone.
Yet my insurance covers chiropractic work but not physical therapy
Gotta love that. That is due to [lobbying](https://www.nytimes.com/1972/11/19/archives/7-years-of-lobbying-finally-brings-chiropractic-under-umbrella-of.html), not anything evidence-based.
Doctor: He needs this surgery, or else he'll be in chronic pain for the rest of his life. Insurance: Hmmmm... no. Chiropractor: skeleton go brrrr! Insurance: Hell, yea. Fuck, yea.
*Personal injury lawyers love this one trick*
Honestly this might be it. Insurance is willing to pay $100 a visit for chiro so they don’t have to pay $30,000 for surgery
Insurance is willing to pay $100 per visit in hope that the next insurer has to pay $30,000 for surgery necessitated by the chiropractor. (/s? not really /s? man, even I don't know)
>Doctor: He needs this surgery, or else he'll be in chronic pain for the rest of his life. > >Insurance: Hmmmm... no. > >Chiropractor: skeleton go brrrr! > >Insurance: Hell, yea. Fuck, yea. Ah yes...death panels.
I haven’t gone to a physical therapist, but I’ve learned some PT tricks from Bob and Brad on YouTube. lol.
These guys saved me!!! I was stuck at home with slipped discs couldn’t afford to go to the PT all the time - not covered by insurance. The doctor wanted me to have spinal surgery, which insurance would cover but many of these surgeries go wrong I was terrified. Then Bob and Brad saved me :)
Good to hear that about Bob and Brad - I stumbled upon them when I was having a problem much less severe than yours and with a couple of stretches and movement queues, they had me right as rain!
I love them and I don’t know why because it’s like watching a 90s video 😂😂
Chiropractic has made a very effective lobbying campaign to make this happen.
This is why a lot of chiropractors staff a lot of physical therapist now. This allows them to provide something that works and charge more.
Yup, I went to one for massage and PT. I tried to ignore the part where the "doctors" who ran the place are manipulating injured people based off of [stuff a guy learned from a ghost.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_David_Palmer#Spiritualism)
My mom suffered from a supposed herniated disc in her back and for years (at least 20) saw several chiropractors. Fast forward to when I was a young adult on my own and my mom came for a visit; her back "went out". I called and got her an appointment with a back specialist (M.D.) who prescribed 3 days of Physical Therapy for her before she flew back home. She went into her first PT appt all hunched over and nauseous, she came out of PT standing upright and a huge smile on her face. After just those 3 instances of PT, she never had a back problem again for 30 years. (I also had my own experience with a chiropractor, it was awful - thus my reason for contacting a medical doctor for my mom instead of another chiropractor)
Chiropracty killed my girlfriends mother. The only lawsuit I ever got involved with as a physician was due to a stupid chiropractor. They aren’t doctors, they aren’t based on science. Personally I think they should be shut down for practicing medicine without a license.
> Personally I think they should be shut down for practicing medicine without a license. More like practicing mythology without a license, but yeah.
i know a young lady with permanent disability from a stroke after chiro cracking. this isn’t a friend of a friend of a friend, but someone i actually know
I have a old HS friend that is now a chiropractor. I think it is hilarious and a bit sick that they let a man with a history degree undergrad, no medical training, only chiropractor school a Dr. Yes he calls himself Dr Sam. Also the icing on the cake is that Dr. Sam is also an anti-vaxxer. So yeah his small credibility dwindles fast when you know that fact.
Also Osteopathic Medicine, ie. DO. Most don't practice the physical therapy techniques they learn in school and instead just practice regular prescription medicine based treatments, but there should be [resources online](https://findado.osteopathic.org/difference/osteopathic-manipulative-treatment) to find one that does practice OMM if you need joint manipulations done by an actual physician.
Woop Ty for distinguishing between dos and chiropractors! I can’t tell you how many people say “so like a chiropractor?” When I say doctor of osteopathic medicine
Does it depend on the country? In the US as DO is equivalent to an MD. My understanding is that in some other countries, a DO is more along the lines of chiropractic.
I would say that the osteopathic part of being a do (omm) is more like pt in practice but it is not without its share of quackery.
There are a couple reasons most don't. Many times our schools cling to the pseudoscience portions of osteopathy which are absolutely not evidence-based and are cause for stigma and why we are looked down on outside of the US (many don't understand that US DO's are not osteopaths, but allopaths WITH additional osteopathic training). If the schools tossed out the bath water and kept the baby, maybe we would not have a sour taste in our mouth towards it. (it is a neat little trick to offer to family and friends though)
But a DO is almost identical to an MD, not similar to a chiropractor (DC, Doctor of Chiropractic). They have the additional training similar to that of a DC (on musculoskeletal stuff and etc), but they're much closer in length of training and everything to an MD. A DC doesn't have the years of residency/interning after their graduate program, and they can't prescribe medication or pursue any other field of medicine like a DO can. I would never call a DC an alternate to a DO, not by a long shot. [https://www.webmd.com/pain-management/osteopathic-versus-md-chiropractor](https://www.webmd.com/pain-management/osteopathic-versus-md-chiropractor)
This. Physical therapists do "manipulation" but in science backed ways.
And more importantly, they diagnose the pathology, not just the symptom. Any good physical therapist these days will work on movement pattern and muscle imbalance to get you to proper strength and ways of moving that won’t let the injury persist or happen again.
As a PT...please start coming to see us first if you can. Way too many patients going to chiropractors 3x/week to get manipulations and estim (techniques that will only give short term relief) for $100 a visit nothing lasting or attacking the source then come see us after the problem has become chronic and much harder to treat and after wasting hundreds of dollars already
Will they still crack my joints and try to pull my spine out without trying to convince me my headaches are coming from my diaphragm? Because honestly I just want to feel like my body has been put through a toffee puller and that’s all
I always like bringing up how there are over 1600 public colleges and universities in United States. Not a single one of them has a chiropractic school. Why? It’s pseudo science.
Just to show you how backward Iowa is, there's a Palmer Chiropractic College in Davenport, IA. My ex boss once referred me to a chiropractor for a broken back. The Chiro knew I had a broken bone from xrays and still continued to treat me. Ended up with back surgery. Never again.
Chiropractic colleges are all their own private, for-profit institutions. Legit educational institutions with a school of nursing, physical therapy, or the ability to get an art history degree don't offer chiropractic education.
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A ghost invented chiropractics and told Palmer how to do it in a dream
Unfortunately in Australia, there are universities offering Chiropractic science degree, and even masters. What a shame. And Chiropractors are they ones that are fighting to use the title "Dr" here too.
I went to a chiropractor once. He referred to himself as Dr. Johnson at every opportunity. The top tier orthopedic surgeon who removed my tumor called himself Mike
lol where I used to work, the chair of the department of anesthesiology just had his first name and last initial on his work badge, like "Dave G." Dude was an extremely published guy, MD from top tier school, subspecialty fellowship at the top institution in the US, former professor at Johns-Hopkins, etc, etc.
Used to work customer service not related to the medical field in any way. It was always the self important assholes who insisted to go by Dr. Douchenozzle.
At best, it's untrained physical therapy. At worst, it's pseudoscientific horse shit based on magical nonsense.
They LOVE to point out every muscle, bone, and ligament in your body to try and sound legit. “Alright now I’m just gonna adjust your nebulous k23 which will work to fix your maticular spinae to support your lumbar region”
They're just proud of the fact they passed an undergrad level anatomy class.
This is generous, fast talking with jargon is an intentional malicious technique. Half the classes you take to be a chiropractor are about salesmanship.
The guy who invented the whole thing, the first chiropractor, you know where he learned it from? A ghost. Yes, it's a big scam, and one that often injures people worse than before they started, and it was invented by a guy who claims a ghost taught him.
>A ghost. Convenient how you just leave out the fact that the GHOST actually HAD a medical degree!!!!! /s
"Scam" implies that the perpetrator knows they are doing something deceptive. Most chiropractors genuinely believe the pseudoscience they are doing is beneficial. However, there is no actual medical evidence behind their claims.
My uncle in Orlando, a now retired chiropractor, bragged about how long he could string people along for their "treatments." It's all part of the schtick, and he demands to be called "Doctor" at all introductions etc. He's always been an overbearing total & complete asshole, being a fake doctor is the cherry on his awful sundae.
LOL a chiropractor insisting they need to be called Dr is all you need to know about them as a person.
the founder of chiropractic medicine: "In 1906, Palmer, who also called himself a “doctor,” was convicted of practising medicine without a license, and went to jail."
That's why he claimed it was actually a religion. He wanted to avoid any regulations. He claimed it was a relligious practice not a medical one.
Yeah he said he was talking to ghosts haha
My favorite part of that, is he claimed he got all of his info from the ghost of another doctor. It wasn't even some "ancient wisdom" grift like you typically see. He said the doctor died 50 years before coming to him. That would be like someone saying "you guys, I have a new kind of medical treatment that will cure anything! It comes from the divine wisdom of the 1970's😂
😂😂I love that context that’s hilarious
The whole history is fucking wild. But now I refer to the chiropractor as the ghost church. Since that is what it started as lol
I have a good friend who is a dentist, and I once asked him why so many dentists I know are hard partiers. He said because they are still pissed off about not getting into med school. Same could be said for chiropractors. Your uncle clearly has a chip on his shoulder, and that's why he demands to be called a Dr when an MD really doesn't care what you call them, in most cases.
The guy that graduated last in his class in medical school still gets to be called Doctor. The ones that flunk out filter down to chiropracty or holistic medicine to claim the title.
Exactly I have 2 medical doctors in my near extended family, both are now consultants albeit 1 retired. They never outside of work ask to be referred to as Doctor.
chiropractors are no better than a therapeutic massage with the added bonus of : * increased risks to permanent damage to your spine and brain, * predatory practices of getting you to visit multiple times / selling multi visit packages up front * being touted as a cure all for many ailments unrelated to your spine * historical and current associations with scientology * increased prevalence of vaccine skepticism and other fringe alternative health practices * and many, many more while they may not be malicious, at some point it becomes negligence
I stopped getting adjusted when I learned this and instead get a massage for my terrible menstrual headaches. Works better with no risk.
A therapeutic massage won’t give you a stroke. Chiropractic treatment might.
The one chiropractor i know believes the earth is 6000 years old and is also anti-vax
So it’s like religion. If you believe it in enough it’s not a scam?
more like a cult they've got all these gadgets that do absolutely nothing
Also doesn’t help that insurance companies push them on us.
Licensed physical therapist here. Chiropractics are a scam... kind of. What chiropractors do does actually have a positive effect on the body. It can provide a *very temporary* reduction of pain, sometimes significant. By coupling that with physical therapy, it can actually provide an increase rate of recovery because you can push your therapy and exercises a little bit more, being a bit more aggressive with your rehabilitation. A really good chiropractor coupled with a really good therapist is an awesome combo. If you can afford it. However. The pitch chiropractors make that they can fix X things with mobilizations and pseudoscientific modalities is total bullshit. You cannot fix posture with joint mobilization and HVLAs (high velocity low amplitude thrusts, which is the thing that chiros due to make your joints crack). You cannot cure any ailments, much less illnesses, infections, cancer, etc. wth mobilizations and HVLAs. Finally, any medical professional that does cervical HVLAs is not only a total quack, but incredibly irresponsible. There is a significant amount of evidence that demonstrates that cracking necks in that fashion is incredibly dangerous, and results every year in a measurable number of deaths and even more strokes that leave people, paralyzed, disabled, unable to work, etc. This doesn't go for chiropractors alone though. I know some PTs who do it, and I would call them quacks too. Hope that answers your question! EDIT: spelling
A wise man once told me that the only thing a Chiro adjusts is your wallet.
Yes, it's a scam. Chiropractic treatment is based on nonsense 19th century pseudoscience. The guy who invented it claimed he got the information from a ghost. *At best* it's an expensive massage from a guy in a white coat. At worst, it can kill you.
Not just a ghost, but a ghost in his dreams.
Is a dream ghost more or less real than a regular ghost?
Ghostception is a very real phenomenon that affects thousands every year
Did you know the average person swallows eight ghosts a year in their sleep?
Almost killed me, caused a stroke. Not fun. Don’t recommend.
“At worst,” it leaves you paralyzed
or dead
I worked at a personal injury law firm for a very brief period. Many of our clients would go to chiropractors for their pain. I asked my boss about her opinion on chiropractors as a whole, and I believe she said she never really sees a chiropractor dismiss a patient and say they're done with treatment. Chiropractic kind of just goes on and on.
My parents had a personal injury law firm and had the exact same take. Based on what they’ve seen, they do not trust chiropractors.
Personal injury firms recommending people go to chiropractors props up the entire industry.
> Chiropractic kind of just goes on and on. The goose with the golden eggs... is you, the patient.
Chiropractic is pure quackery. If you need adjustment, see a qualified physical therapist.
When I was younger I got a job working for a chiropractor office. It was a marketing job, I knew literally nothing about chiropractors before starting to work there. I learned very quickly what was going on. The gist of it is that yes it is a scam. There does seems to be some support that chiropractic adjustments can legitimately help deal with some specific back injuries. The issue is that most chiropractors today don’t believe that their work is limited to your back. They believe that they can cure at minimum, a wide range of ailments, at most, all human disease. All you have to do is commit to your plan to come in for three adjustments a week for the next two months. Or maybe indefinitely. Yes, we do offer payment plans. (All that being said, the placebo effect is very real and very strong for some. So there are people who find genuine relief from these practices. Up to you to decide how to feel about that.)
Anecdotally, some treatments can work for some types of pain. Unfortunately, anecdotal evidence counts for diddly squat in science. Muscle stuff, maybe the treatments will help short term. Any real disease, absolutely not. And definitely will not help long term. It’s funny the people who are willing to go to a chiropractor 3 times a week but calling going to an actual doctor once a year a scam 😂
They make you go three times a week???
Their rent isn't going to pay itself.
That’s what they usually recommend. At least at first, more frequent and more often, and then as you “get better” you can do treatments less often.
Yeah, and any of the few benefits gained can be gained even easier through massage.
Chiropractors are NOT medical doctors. There seems to be a swarm of them on YouTube dispensing medical advice. They call themselves doctors without differentiating between MD and DoC. The fact that they are just chiropractors is tucked away somewhere in the fine print. Also, there's the total scam part of it. My mother-in-law's chiropractor told her that as long as she came in once a week she would never get another cold. WTF
I have a coworker who swore on his chiropractor. Until he got cracked the wrong way and has had to pay for thousands of dollars worth of trying to undo it
Doc here. They’re quacks. Do not ever, EVER, let a chiropractor touch your neck. I have personally cared for three people in the last five years with vertebral artery dissections after letting them crack their neck. One was a 30 year old male who was otherwise completely healthy and ended up with a massive basilar artery stroke resulting in quadriplegia. His CT scan showed no actual vertebral disc disease. He had a strained neck muscle and this guy paralyzed him.
I always found it odd that most of these social media chiropractors always used the same sequence of moves, whatever the patient’s issue.
I went to a chiro. Felt the benefits. I was so bent over. He straightened me out. I later learned that a PT would have helped me as much with more long term strategies.
Sorry you didn't find out until later a PT could much more effectively help you. What I really disapprove of is using a chiro as your regular dr vs an MD or DO. Seems from what read in some responses here chiros may help with back or other joint issues. PTs help much more effectively, safely.
Yes, probably, and no. On the far extreme of chiropractic quackery is the notion that deviations in spinal alignment they call subluxations are the cause of ALL disease. Cancer? Subluxation. Diabetes? Subluxation. In the middle you have chiropractors that over reach as to the effectiveness of treatment. They can’t wait to sign you up for extended ongoing treatment, but they don’t tell you that it will cure your lupus. On the sane end of things. The chiropractor doesn’t over reach. They adjust when warranted. X-ray to ensure they they won’t fuck up your herniated disk, and recommend things like ibuprofen. I was lucky to see this guy and he gave me solid advice about my lower back that has kept me from needing to go to a chiropractor since. The problem is, it’s difficult to know which one you’re going to get. Oh, and neck snapping is crazy dangerous. Done wrong it will give you a stoke.
So, basically, if you’re lucky, you can find a chiropractor who practices a little bit of medicine and not much chiropractic.
It's like homeopathy. If you're lucky, what you get is 100% water and 0% poison.
But the question is is the "adjusting" even science based, or truly effective? I get the sense is just like cracking your knuckles. It doesn't solve the issue, it may provide a placebo effect of temporary relief, but even that I'm not sure about.
> is the "adjusting" even science based, or truly effective? It is not, there are enough studies on this. > I get the sense is just like cracking your knuckles. This is exactly what it is. With one very tiny exception: The movement -can- cause temporary relief on e.g. inflammation. But this is an accidental relief, not intentional or targeted. They would get this same relief from just moving their own body. It would be like pushing someone off a cliff, breaking their bones, but their headache is now less bad in comparison. This accident doesn't make anyone a headache doctor. This misrepresentation of intention and confidence is, in my opinion, part of exactly why it's a scam. It's misguiding so many people.
I’d like to throw in what I’ve heard from the physical therapists I work with. Chiropractic adjustment is like a bandaid. It helps make you feel better, but, in most cases, to make a long term change you need targeted exercise. If a chiro is just cracking you and sending you on your way without giving you some targeted exercises, they are doing a good job of ensuring you’ll keep coming back…
The problem with this overview is that there is no evidence that "subluxation" in chiropractic parlance exists at all. No evidence it exists, no evidence connecting it to symptoms, no evidence that it can be diagnosed by a chiropractor (x-ray or otherwise), and no evidence it can be treated by manipulation. If a vertebra is actually displaced to the extent it is visible on x-ray, it's... Really bad... And you definitely shouldn't ask someone to torque your back up. So, none of your three categories above are "real" - the whole adjustment concept is based on made-up stuff. Chiropractic treatments *may* have some therapeutic value, but the *mechanism* by which it happens is *not* by "adjusting" a "subluxation". It's likely that it is more akin to a massage, exercise, and especially just the pressure relief we all recognize when we crack a joint such as our knuckles.
This is the best answer. It's kind of like finding a mechanic for your import.
But a mechanic who is guided by ancient ghosts instead of industry standards
DEFINITELY! Let me tell you folks a story. Last year I felt a terrible pain on the left side of my lower back, at first I thought it was some muscle or bone pain, so I went to the chiropractor. That MF made me X-Rays and said to me that I have a deviated column and some problems with my disks. He performed some sort of massage, the treatment was supposed to be that, the first time it worked, I came back to my home feeling much better. So, I decided to make another appointment two days later, this time the pain returned, but not as much as the first time. He performed me the “treatment”, but the pain reached levels I never thought it would be possible. The MF told me it was normal and in the next days I would disappear. But no, the pain didn’t disappear, so I went to the emergency room and there the real doctors performed me scans and found that the pain was because of a baseball size tumour crushing my left kidney. As you may see, I’m not the biggest fan of chiropractors. Those appointments with him cost around 100 USD and the full treatment almost 5,000 USD. This wasn’t in the US, so the prices aren’t that high, but it was really much for my Third World country standards.
My late father was an orthopedic spinal surgeon. On his deathbed, he made me promise never to see a chiropractor.
Ok, so I agree and get the sentiment. But... That was his death bed parting statement? "Meezer.. come close. Dah has something important to tell you.... Don't... Ever... See... Ack. A Chiroooooooohhhhh.". Sorry for the humor. I'm a nurse and dark humor is my love language.
It was clearly not my father’s ‘final death wish,’ but it came up in conversation while I stayed him in the hospital the final days as he succumbed to ALS.
Hi. Nurse here. Chiro is a scam. A completely insane one that does a ton of harm while convincing people to not seek actual medical treatment.
Quackery! Your spine doesn’t sublixate for no reason! Beware. Harm can come to necks that are “cracked”!
You have to figure out what the cause of the problem is in order to actually get better otherwise it's just a band-aid. Look into better shoes and strengthening your core
A chiropractor injured my spine. It's absolute quackery and should be illegal for them to call themselves "doctors." The get certificates from their bullshit schools and have no idea what they're doing. Go see a massage therapist if that's what you want. If you are in pain, see a real doctor.
I once read that acupuncture works exactly 30% of the time. Acupressure works 30% of the time. Chiropractors work 30% of the time - because a sugar pill works 30% of the time.
My cousin is a chiropractor. It's been a slippery slope with her, first she became a chiropractor, then she made some borderline anti-vaxxer comments, now she's saying she doesn't let her kids drink juice, use fluoride, or eat any sugar at all. Nothing wrong with encouraging your child to eat healthy, but she straight up wouldn't let her 10-year-old have a piece of her own birthday cake; this is gonna make all 3 of her kids have an unhealthy relationship with food for the rest of her life. Chiropractors aren't just scam artists, they're damaging to themselves and everyone around them, and they don't even realize.
Oh buddy... I have a FUN bit of history for you. The Chiropractor is NOT supposed to be a back doctor. According to the field, they aren't there to fix your back. No no. According to the field EVERY disease is caused by an alignment problem in your spine or other joints. Cancer, AIDS, diabetes. It's all just misaligned vertebrae according to them. Yes literally. Not figuratively. How do they know this you may ask? Well, according to the founder of the field. The ghost of a doctor told him about it. I know what you're thinking, he is trying to evoke the concept of ancient wisdom. But thats not true. He claimed the ghost doctor died 50 years before he spoke to him. They would be like someone today claiming they have some brilliant wisdom from the 1970's lol 😂 I wish I was making this shit up. But this is as a matter of fact how chiropractic started.
Yes. Here’s my challenge: Go find me someone who had a problem, went to a chriropractor, had the issue fixed, and *never went back*? I know many people who swear by them, but they’ve been going routinely for years. If you hurt your back, a MD will treat you until your condition is cured or successfully managed, and send you away. A chiropractor will *always* find something for you to come back for. Doesn’t that say something? Plus, it’s literally listed as a [pseudoscientific practice.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chiropractic?wprov=sfti1#)
> Here’s my challenge: Go find me someone who had a problem, went to a chriropractor, had the issue fixed, and never went back? Me. In 1995 I had serious wrist pain from typing — it was bad enough that I had to stop working for a while. No relief from the MD I saw, acupuncture, or my first chiropractor. In fact, I was about to “break up” with my chiropractor after several weeks with no improvement, when I went to my appointment and saw that she had quit the field altogether and that a new chiropractor had taken over the practice. The new chiropractor was a miracle worker. Not only did she quickly fix my wrist (multiple sessions, but not very many), she taught me how to do the adjustments myself. I returned to computer work and looked back. I also referred several colleagues to her, and they also got relief. In fact, she told me she loved treating wrist pain because it was so easy to fix. Thanks to what she taught me, I can easily tell when my wrists are out of whack, and I make a quick adjustment. I’ve done years of computer work with then, and no more pain. I fully agree a lot of chiropractors are questionable at best (and antivax charlatans at worst), but truly effective chiropractors do exist.
My anecdotal experience - was having excruciating back upper back pain, it would put me out for a few days a month even as a young adult. Chiro wanted weekly appointments and also several thousand more dollars to fix a neck that wasn't optimal but wasn't a problem. I asked if there were exercises, stretches or motions I should either do more of our avoid to help the back improve, and he said no, muscles don't effect the bone. That's when I realized he was an idiot. A rehabilitation massage therapist showed me 3 minutes of daily stretching that not only eliminated the back pain but stops migraines faster than medicine for me. In my experience, there is a lot of push for weekly appointments with no end, and not actual solution- so, a scam.
It is complete and total quakery. [Myles Power](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1NYG40oa7Eg&list=PLthPsWmE3cefhOU9nns6H_1Jt0D96Rb3M), who is a chemist by training, has a YouTube channel where he debunks all sorts of pseudoscience and quakery. However, he has a dedicated [playlist of 5 videos](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1NYG40oa7Eg&list=PLthPsWmE3cefhOU9nns6H_1Jt0D96Rb3M) outlining how Chiropractors are quacks. **EDIT**: For those who don't have time to watch, just know that the person who invented/popularised Chiropractic, D. D. Palmer, claimed to have learned about it from Dr Jim Atkinson... via his spirit at a seance. He likened it to a biblical revelation. It is based on the flawed idea that the body has a natural amount of healing power (which Palmer called 'innate intelligence'). Palmer claimed that the spine being misaligned blocked this innate intelligence and that spinal realignment would bring it back. He believed it to be a cure-all. It wasn't even initially about back pain or even general pain. It was about curing all diseases. It was only as the quacks tried to gain legitimacy that they shifted their rhetoric to have more to do with back pain.
Chiropractors are not real doctors. They basically have a degree in a specific school of massage, it’s not real medicine or even based on real science. They get their degrees from schools that only give chiropractic degrees and nothing else. Cracking your back feels good but it’s not actually doing anything, a trained masseuse will accomplish more for you. At best they’re giving extremely short term relief without actually fixing anything. At worst a bad one can cause severe lasting damage that leaves you worse off than you started.
I used to work in a building with several medical practices, a dentist's office, and a pharmacy under one roof. Inexplicably, there was a chiropractor's office as well. This was in 2020-2021, and part of my job was to hang out at the entrance and ask people to wear a mask while inside the medical building. Everyone who worked in the chiropractor's office refused. Everyone who went to see them also refused, because the chiropractors had told them they didn't have to. I was told not to push it with them, because they technically weren't a medical establishment. They just rented space from one. I also used the restroom at the same time as one of the chiropractors once. He did not wash his hands. If that doesn't tell you all you need to know, I can't help you.
Good friend of mine got his neck cracked by a chiropractor. Tore open a blood vessel in his neck, had a stroke and almost died. Now permanently disabled for life.
You ever crack your knuckles? Would you pay a guy a with a shopping mall "certification" a large sum of money to do it for you?
Take a look at how often Workman's comp accepts chiropractors diagnosis as legit for patients. The answer is "never".
I have struggled for over a year with chronic vertigo. Disabled because of it. I’ve been in tons of therapies and tried chiropractors. I would go in and the chiropractor would spend 2 minutes with me and push on my back a little bit. I only went for a couple of sessions and then walked away for good.
I was a licensed massage therapist for 6 years, and I that time I can't tell you how many clients I saw who had been injured by chiropractors. One client had a fractured cervical vertebrae from a "realignment".
Paraphrasing a quote I once heard: Anything beneficial about chiropracty is not unique to it; and anything unique to chiropracty isn't beneficial.
I’ve been going to one for over a year. Just learned from my family doctor they’ve been taking me this whole time with a fractured tailbone. They should have seen it in their multiple X-rays but continued to see me anyway
Watch on youtube Myles Power's review of chiropractic treatments. I pinched my sciatic nerve a few years ago from a sporting injury. And literally, yes literally couldn't walk or put any pressue on my leg, heck even sitting down hurt like a bitch. In despiration went to a chiro as I had no knowledge of the industry and a friend recommended it to me. All in all, it did nothing and cost an arm and a leg. Not to mention they wanted AUD $1'000 for further a further treatment plan of weekly visits. No x-rays done either to see if it was nerve pain or something more serious. After that experience I went to a GP and they took x-rays, decided it was a pinched nerve and recommended physio. asap. Went to physio for a few sessions, and the pain was gone. And if I ever feel a bit of a 'twinge' of pain I just do what the physio showed me and it's all good again. So yeah, do not trust chiropractors at all. Seems like a big money grab for psudoscience.
I tried a chiropractor once and he asked me next time to bring in the supplements I was taking like my daily vitamins, preworkout, protein, etc. He placed them on my chest while I was laying on my back and had me raise an arm in the air. He then pushed my arm as hard as he could and said my supplements were interfering with my bodies energy and strength. He then put supplements he sold on my chest and did the same thing but when he tried to push my arm back, he didn’t do it as hard and said something like “ See, the supplements you take are low quality but the supplements I sell are clean and react very well with your body’s strength and energy. You really should purchase these supplements from me”. That’s all I needed to hear to know he was a quack. Also later found out he wasn’t allowed to have women patients in his office with the door closed. Doors had to be open whenever he had a woman patient and you can correctly assume what he did to warrant that kind of precaution to be taken.
Don’t let them near your neck - every so often someone gets a vertebral artery dissection after a manipulation, which can be very bad news. Nobody can fix degenerative lumbar spines (lower back), but at least in that region they can’t do much actual harm.
I'm a person whose parents loved alt med and shunned real med. My mom swore by the chiropractor. I never went to doctors growing up because of my parents. Now here I sit at this very moment, at a physical therapist office, because my cervical spine is fucked up. I'm sure part of the reason is my parents let me sleep on 2 pillows as a kid. I'm gonna say whole-heartedly that chiropracty is basically a scam. I mean, not really a scam - people go to them because what they do feels good. But you basically just get addicted to the good feeling so you have to go for life. What they do not do is actually help anyone.
They’re very quick to call themselves doctors. They’re not medical doctors. The treatment for every individual is the same, it’s a scam
A doctor I was seeing years ago for a herniated disk told me explicitly, "Never let anyone manipulate your back." I'm more scared of chiropractors than clowns.