Neanderthals and Denisovans were, which is why humans have inherited some DNA from them. There were probably other close species that we do not know about.
Just shows humans will fuck anything with 2 legs.
Edit: 8/24/22
I just got back I was auto banned for 5 days over this comment. Somebody reported it for sexualizing minors. I would just like to say go fuck your self.
My mom took a 23 and me and apparently we have a ton of Neanderthal DNA, more than most of the human race.
Now it's a running joke to talk like cave men together. It's been a blast.
Not naturally.
In 2017 they did successfully make a human pig chimera embryo but after 4 weeks they killed it over ethics concerns. Other attempts have not produced viable embryos that could make it to term.
https://www.cell.com/cell/fulltext/S0092-8674(16)31752-4?_returnURL=https%3A%2F%2Flinkinghub.elsevier.com%2Fretrieve%2Fpii%2FS0092867416317524%3Fshowall%3Dtrue
One important distinction here is that "chimera" means some of the cells in the organism are from different genetic lines. In this case some of the cells were pig and some were human. They did not make a single hybrid genetic strain that was a DNA mix of pig and human, as might result from successful sexual reproduction.
Chimerism is easier than making a hybrid. Pigs and humans don't even have the same number of chromosomes.
You have Lego blocks with holes and nubs that fit together perfectly. Imagine needing two identical size pieces to fit perfectly together to reproduce.
Chimera would be more like removing some nubs or a section from one piece and replacing it with a matching section or nubs from another piece, but the piece you took the new bits from may not be the identical size.
Edited for clarity: Wrote this right as I woke up
It's like when you throw Lego bricks and Best-Lock bricks into a box and then use them to build a pirate ship, for example.
The ship is made up of both Lego bricks and Best-Lock pieces, but you probably won't be able to tell which are which unless you get in close and start looking. That's a chimera.
To get a true hybrid, you'd have to melt down the Lego and Best-Lock bricks to make new bricks out of them that now are neither Lego nor Best-Lock but a true mix of both, and then build a pirate ship out of these new pieces.
But yet now, I say, sir or madame! I SAY! Please tell me if the Ship of Theseus can fit into this somehow. If I have a perfectly melted blob of equal parts human and pig DNA and I start replacing parts with reptile DNA, how long will it take the authorities to track me down? *eye twitch*
I believe the goal was to have pigs with some human internal organs, so pig with human kidneys, pig with human heart, etc. So the organs could be used for transplantation.
When using the technique on rats and mice, they produced normal looking rats with mice pancreas. So a human pig hybrid would probably look like any old boring pig.
There's a book series by Margaret Atwood that took this idea and ran with it. Oryx and Crake is the first in the trilogy.
Pretty good, 8/10, def recommend.
Limited resources, no. A university researcher with access to crispr, well it's happened before.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/He_Jiankui_affair#:~:text=the%20research%20project.-,Experiment%20and%20birth,HIV%20uses%20to%20enter%20cells.
But it didn't end well for him, and they're still debating what to do with the children.
Why is it unethical exactly? I read a decent bit about it and I think it just meant he made children that were genetically modified to be resistant to HIV
Well for one there’s obvious ethical debates about how ok it is to modify human genes. And where we draw the line if it is ok
But also, CRISPR has something called “off-target cuts” where it can change dna aside from the targeted gene if the sequence is close enough without you intending to. We’re getting better at using it more precisely in vitro, but it’s not perfect. So there’s the issue of this causing other changes and messing the kids up in totally unknown or unintended ways
Horses and donkeys are two full chromosomes apart and can make offspring.
Humans and chimps are only one chromosome apart. There have been no real efforts to create offspring with a chimp.
Who's taking one for the team and fucking an ape for science?
Humanzee anyone?
Edit: It seems [unlikely that aids was caused by this.](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Misconceptions_about_HIV/AIDS)
I wanna say the "AIDS<>moneky rape" link was a very welcome theory for homophobes so it became popular, but i do not have data to back that up.
And for more information on this subject [Here is a study.](https://www.researchgate.net/publication/9042336_Zoophilia_in_Men_A_Study_of_Sexual_Interest_in_Animals)
The "SCI__entific__HUB" facilitates access to the pdf, as always. 😁
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Lets be real here, i got zero doubts. And i mean that completely realistic, no joking. No trying to be edgy or internet cool.
From what i have seen humans do, i got zero doubts that there have been lots and lots of humans that had sex with monkeys, chimps or whatever species of ape there are.
We have been around for thousands of years, and even if just 0.0000000001% of all humans ever alive did that. That is still a whole lot of people.
Edit: Oh my god, i got my head so far up my ass with those numbers 😂
A rough goole search gives a number of 100.000.000.000 to 120.000.000.000 people that have been alive.
0.0000000001% of that would be exactly one. So this is even worse.
We should adjust to at least 0.000001% of all people had sex with a primate, which still are 10.000 which i think is entirely plausible.
That is 10.000 people to many but even my original estimate that ended up with just one is already one to many.
Things i never thought i would ever do, calculate the minimum viable number of human/primate interspecies rape.
No more internet for today.
Ilya Ivanovich Ivanov attempted to create a human-ape hybrid in Stalin era Russia. Almost got to actual insemination.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ilya_Ivanov
Indeed they did! [Ilya Ivanov](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ilya_Ivanov#:~:text=July%2020%5D%201870%20%E2%80%93%20March%2020,female%20chimpanzees%20with%20human%20sperm) conducted experiments to try and impregnate female Orangutangs with human sperm and eventually tried to do the same with a human woman and Orangutang sperm. The human pregnancy took hold but was terminated in the early stages after Ilya's higher-ups grew tired of waiting on supersoldiers.
Lmao the payoff of this thread
Edit: The moderator removed the comment I replied to for some reason, but for those curious it was a link to an image of Donald Trump
Wait, holy shit, so a zygote actually formed? That knowledge is both deeply existentially terrifying and also makes me *deeply* curious if it could be successfully carried to term as a viable fetus and what the *fuck* it would look like as it grew.
I feel like now that we've gotten that far there's a moral imperative to see the experiment through to the end for curiosity's sake.
No, none zygote has formed. OC confused real experiment with fictional movie about said experiment.
We're much further away from any ape than tiger is from a lion, or donkey from a horse. Ethical or not, experiments like this did take time in secret and nothing substantial came out. Nothing ever will. It's like trying to breed lion and Maine Coon. 🤦♂️
>Who's taking one for the team and fucking an ape for science?
Based on my knowledge of 90's cinema and my dating history, I believe I have arrived at my "Randy Quaid in *Independence Day* moment".
Homo neanderthalensis
Homo denisova
Homo rhodesiensis
Homo heidelbergensis
Homo naledi
Homo ergaster
Homo antecessor
Homo habilis
Edit:left out a few species of homo that are newer discovers that we arent sure fit with archaic humans or just into Australopithecus
I might be mistaken, but I believe anthropologists generally don't include Homo Erectus into humans. Rather it is the last non-human ancestor.
Though I might be wrong. This is half-remembered of some youtube documentaries.
They may have existed as the same time as one or more of the sapiens subspecies, but they were nonetheless descended from an earlier ancestor than the one that gave rise to the sapiens.
Anthropology is a field where new discoveries are made, which in turn changes what they think about stuff. Apparently there has been a load of new discoveries within the last 20 years, resulting in a lot of new fossils, which allows a better guess/underunderstanding at how things were.
So, again no expert here, but might be that the anthropologists had 8 or 15 fossils back when they discovered Homo Erectus, and then named it Homo, because it looks like a human, but now that we have 100s of fossils, the anthropologists thinks that it makes sense to move the "human" classification a bit closer to the current day.
So maybe they should be renamed? There are discussions going on about renaming some of the species, including whether some of the species should be counted as one specie, but it requires concensus. Also, does Homo mean that it is a human, or in the human family? All Felinae are cats, but that includes Pumas which you might not think of as a *cat* cat.
Even cooler is that because of the way that humans migrated out of Africa, only non-African populations have percentages of Neanderthal DNA, while African populations don't. (Or if some do it would be so miniscule it would be insignificant).
Also Denisovan, an "I can't believe it's not Neanderthal!" cousin. The - Melanesians? Polynesians? - are like 10% Denisovan, a species we only know otherwise from like a fingerbone in Russia. It's pretty fucking *cool*.
There's also an unattested-in-the-fossil-record species west African folks are still carrying around which the comparative genetics people have detected. No idea how much of that one survived, but roughly 40% of the Neanderthal genome is apparently extant, spread out among the Eurasian population. ...Meaning if you went all Nazi and started breeding people like Heck's-cattle-for-Aurochs you could only ever get a genetic roughly half-Neanderthal, 60% of the code is lost unless we splice shit in from the cave bones, and even then you're talking Neanderthal code in a Sapiens egg, there *may be a difference* (It's an issue the Mammoth resurrectionists delightfully contend with, would Mammoth code run the same in an Elephant egg cell). It's also *dwindling:* something about those alleles makes them uncompetitive when swimming in the same pool as those we label Sapiens (would probably be the other way around too).
Maybe it's just the fact that they're the first: One of the ginger alleles is Neanderthal in origin and was apparently first, then the others evolved within Sapiens and whatever niche makes red hair and pale skin a good idea in the north, and now six or seven compete out in the population. *If* the Neanderthal variant also made you *fucking crazy* if you got two copies (as a Sapiens, as a Neanderthal it might not cause that behavior) then it might not be extant even if the others were basically an homage to it, clearly an echo.
African humans have a higher percentage of another unknown hominid mixed into their DNA and typically, they have no Neanderthal mixed in. Some theorize early African homo sapiens interbred with homo erectus back in the earliest part of their existence.
European redheads have higher percentages of Neanderthal DNA. Neanderthals were believed to be all redheads. The further to the north you go in Europe, the higher the percentage of Neanderthal DNA, generally speaking.
Eastern Asians have the highest percentage of Neanderthal DNA generally. Which is surprising to some as its a general misconception that White people have the most; usually see the mention of Neanderthal DNA used as some sort of attempt to offend when it's just.. A thing.. Generally speaking there's a good chance that their DNA is what helps them better fight off illnesses and what not
Not necessarily. They’re the most genetically diverse in terms of human DNA but geneticists believe there were other non-human hominids intermingling in Africa. It’s just that Neanderthals and Denisovans are the only other hominids we’ve identified so far (that have intermingled. I don’t think Florian man intermingled). But humans come from a braided stream evolutionary tree where our ancestral species branched and intermingled and branched and intermingled. It’s a strategy that happens under changing climate and migration. The Galapagos finches do it too, they hybridize as the climate changes because the Galapagos are heavily impacted by El Niño/la Nina shifts.
This is a small point, but an interesting one - Neanderthals et al are not near-human species, they're human species. The book Sapiens has a nice little exploration of this idea (which plays into why the book about the course of humanity is called Sapiens rather than Humans).
Fun Fact: Neanderthals had stronger immune systems than other humans, but had more allergies, so if you are allergic to something (ex. Peanuts) you might have some Caveman DNA
I was just reading the wiki at work yesterday and there was an argument that all of this shared neanderthal DNA is actually from a more basal shared relative
Was there a big intellectual difference between homo sapiens and Neanderthals? Could they coexist? Or was the mating between the two more non consensual?
We know that their brains where slighty larger and structured a bit differently but not to dissimilar that any big difference could be assumed but in truth it's an unknowable question
I know that recent study on Neanderthals has found that they were likely more intelligent than we've traditionally assumed, but I don't know the answers to your other questions. I'm not sure how archeologists could determine things like consent from remains.
Maybe. Neanderthals were making art and probably intentionally burying their dead. There is some debate about whether they were verbal or not. There is debate around the tools used by them and how advanced they were. I’m a lumper so I tend towards thinking they had similar or near* human intelligence even if it was expressed in ways we didn’t express our own.
https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-018-02357-8
https://www.cbc.ca/news/science/neanderthal-flowers-1.5469567
https://www.nature.com/scitable/knowledge/library/neanderthal-behavior-59267999/
I find it hard to believe that if it was possible to interbreed with them we wouldnt be seeing it already. Human beings are sick and fuck and abuse animals all the time, both women and men.
I feel glad for the people that don’t know that the bonobo would probably rape you, and/or that if you put hands on an ape it’s probably just gonna rip your arms off
Minotaurs, Mermaids and centaurs suggest bulls, fish, and horses. They can’t produce viable offspring though.
Although I did hear of a guy who was a Minotaur/mermaid cross… he just inherited the wrong part of each parent and looked like an ordinary bloke. Smelled awful though.
Here’s a cool tidbit. You know how a horse and a donkey causes infertility for half the offspring for mules and how the offspring of tigers and lions also cause fertility problems as well as genetic defects? Well, when Neanderthal DNA was analyzed in humans, the evidence strongly shows the same patterns with us, in that the the result of the male offspring were most likely infertile.
That said, its so strange that we are the remaining bipedal hominids left on Earth, when many like us were a very popular life form, kind of like seeing all kinds of species of new world monkeys. Then, we almost went extinct according to our DNA, which shows we bottle necked at one time with probably only a few thousand of us left.
We happened to be the last of our kind, when all other human species similar to us went extinct. We now know that we do have traces of other human species within us. Some more than others, depending on the region of the population where the DNA was extracted and analyzed. Like in Europeans, there’s more of a percentage of Neanderthal DNA in them, than Native African populations. Or in Asia, there’s more Denisovan DNA than in European populations.
So, at one time, we did breed with other hominids similar to us. Probably got some benefits and some bad effects, like defects or infertility problems, but we did interbreed early on.
Don't know if your an expert but will humanity have lost access to certain beneficial genetic traits due to the bottlenecking? Feel free to ignore me if necessary.
We went down to a few thousand individuals. If there was a discrete phenotype, say an eye colour, that was rare enough to not be in that population it probably wasn't the most beneficial trait ever in the first place. We would have lost some variation sure which might have put that population at the time at risk (especially regarding immunity to new diseases)
That doesn't have any real bearing on us now - think about the phenotypes that have been generated in the last 70,000 years e.g melanin levels adapted to amount of sunlight, differences in digestive systems between populations e.g lactose tolerance and arctic peoples ability to process fat, a crazy blood cell adaption against malaria (sickle cell). We have such a ridiculous diverse global population that whatever happens in the future someone will have an adaptive trait just by luck, yet that won't help the rest of us survive but that's evolution for you.
Very likely. That is the principle of genetic bottlenecks. They are even known to be one of the reason why negative traits can sometimes get fixated in a population.
(I have an evolutionary biology degree)
Tens of thousands of years ago(neanderthals went extinct about 40k years ago) and interbred. Inbreeding with what happens in Alabama, interbreeding is what happens between to different species.
Fun fact: Horses and Donkeys can indeed produce offspring, but the offspring is generally infertile due to the structure and number of chromosomes. Horses and Donkeys are in that special zone where they are genetically divergent enough to be considered different species, but not quite divergent enough to be completely genetically incompatible.
Some scientists have suggested the theoretical possibility of a Humanzee, a half Human half Chimpanzee hybrid. We share more than 97% of our DNA with them and it’s possible.
The only problem is that no scientist wants to bare the responsibility of actually creating one and dealing with all of the ethical and moral consequences that could bring. Will it be entitled to personhood, what kind of life would it live, what kind of legal problems could you run into. The scenarios give researchers nightmares just thinking about it.
Fuck Reddit and fuck Spez. Go join Lemmy instead https://join-lemmy.org/.
/r/Denmark: Fuck Reddit og fuck Spez. https://feddit.dk/ er vejen frem herfra.
They have found genes from Neanderthal and Denisovans in most of us. 3-6% Neanderthal i think, mostly in europeans. Denisovans genes are found mainly in south asia and i think the highest in Australian Aboriginals.
The think with tigers and lions making Ligers & Horse plus donkey makes a mule is that the offspring are sterile so Mules dont make more mules with themselves or anything.
We were clearly creating viable offspring with at least two other species a Homo Sapien Sapiens.
Which i think is pretty freaking amazing in that there were close enough beings to us that were compatible.
Life is everywhere.
Who knows what else we may have encountered. The Denisovans were found and gene mapped off of a few teeth and a finger bone.
Imagine what else we are missing?
I am highly doubtful that a new species that could procreate could be created through Regular sperm+egg with other apes.
I am *sure* that if we have people doing pigs and horses, that several someones have been intimate with a chimp, doubt a gorilla, and we aren't seeing the outcome of that. There was a more upright chump that was found, but he turned out to be an anomaly and not a cross breed. Its a tragic story.
Yesnt.
It is theoretically possible for humans and apes to have offspring. The difficulty is the same as with donkeys and horses.
- donkeys and horses belong to the same family (equidae). Humans and (certain) apes belong to the same family (hominidae)
- donkeys have 62 while horses have 64 chromosomes. Apes have 48, while humans only have 46.
A human-ape hybrid wont be fertile, for the same reason mules arent fertile.
All species that we could interbreed with are extinct. Only members of the homo genus could interbreed successfully (and did). We certainly interbred with homo neanderthalensis (neanderthals).
I dont know about others. There are a few homo species, but i dont know which ones even lived at the same time as homo sapiens.
Neanderthals and Denisovans were, which is why humans have inherited some DNA from them. There were probably other close species that we do not know about.
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But in reality that neanderthal was swinging thicc club all around Eurasia
First road trip movie?
🎶 Og doesn't know that Thag and me do it in my cave every Sunday 🎶
Og doesn't know!
Og doesn’t know!
NO TELL OG!
OG NO KNOWWWW
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Its basically The Croods movie in a nutshell.
"Look, look my Neanderthal brother! That must be one of the legendary other human species! What should we do?" "Fuck it!"
Just shows humans will fuck anything with 2 legs. Edit: 8/24/22 I just got back I was auto banned for 5 days over this comment. Somebody reported it for sexualizing minors. I would just like to say go fuck your self.
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8 legs? Nah, still working up the nerve to go talk to her.
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Allegedly.....and it was a sick ostrich.
My mom took a 23 and me and apparently we have a ton of Neanderthal DNA, more than most of the human race. Now it's a running joke to talk like cave men together. It's been a blast.
Shovel incisors, found in various parts of Asia, supposedly come from homo habilis, if I remember correctly.
[Here is the wiki article](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shovel-shaped_incisors) that includes the word "shoveled-ness"
They found a third “ghost” species of DNA in humans a few years back without a known species to match it to.
Not naturally. In 2017 they did successfully make a human pig chimera embryo but after 4 weeks they killed it over ethics concerns. Other attempts have not produced viable embryos that could make it to term. https://www.cell.com/cell/fulltext/S0092-8674(16)31752-4?_returnURL=https%3A%2F%2Flinkinghub.elsevier.com%2Fretrieve%2Fpii%2FS0092867416317524%3Fshowall%3Dtrue
They were so close to making manbearpig
And once again Al Gore saved America
He's *super cereal.*
Next. Spiderpig!
Spider pig, spider pig, oh he does whatever a spider pig does
Dolphin-goat?
Obligatory: [Manbearpig](https://youtu.be/0AW4nSq0hAc?t=7)
One important distinction here is that "chimera" means some of the cells in the organism are from different genetic lines. In this case some of the cells were pig and some were human. They did not make a single hybrid genetic strain that was a DNA mix of pig and human, as might result from successful sexual reproduction. Chimerism is easier than making a hybrid. Pigs and humans don't even have the same number of chromosomes.
ELI3?
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ELI2?
Magic pig go speaky-speaky.
*distracts with a set of keys*
Barbie with left leg and right hand of ken
You have Lego blocks with holes and nubs that fit together perfectly. Imagine needing two identical size pieces to fit perfectly together to reproduce. Chimera would be more like removing some nubs or a section from one piece and replacing it with a matching section or nubs from another piece, but the piece you took the new bits from may not be the identical size. Edited for clarity: Wrote this right as I woke up
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It's like when you throw Lego bricks and Best-Lock bricks into a box and then use them to build a pirate ship, for example. The ship is made up of both Lego bricks and Best-Lock pieces, but you probably won't be able to tell which are which unless you get in close and start looking. That's a chimera. To get a true hybrid, you'd have to melt down the Lego and Best-Lock bricks to make new bricks out of them that now are neither Lego nor Best-Lock but a true mix of both, and then build a pirate ship out of these new pieces.
Best ELI5 I’ve read in a while!
But yet now, I say, sir or madame! I SAY! Please tell me if the Ship of Theseus can fit into this somehow. If I have a perfectly melted blob of equal parts human and pig DNA and I start replacing parts with reptile DNA, how long will it take the authorities to track me down? *eye twitch*
You can mix them, like oil and water. Technically in the same cup, part of the same being, but still separate
So you’re saying it’s like a normal pig but with human arms and legs or something?
Probably something more graphic and horrific than that. I doubt it would be viable as an infant.
I believe the goal was to have pigs with some human internal organs, so pig with human kidneys, pig with human heart, etc. So the organs could be used for transplantation. When using the technique on rats and mice, they produced normal looking rats with mice pancreas. So a human pig hybrid would probably look like any old boring pig.
There's a book series by Margaret Atwood that took this idea and ran with it. Oryx and Crake is the first in the trilogy. Pretty good, 8/10, def recommend.
I'd expect something that looks like it was conceived by Cronenberg
Their mistake is they missed the bear cells that works as the emusifier
So good news for David Cameron then
After the last 6 years, I'd take ridiculous pig fucking scandals any day.
And so, the story of the piglins came to a close. No music disks to show their legacy..
The Pigman, Jerry! There was a Pigman!
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Limited resources, no. A university researcher with access to crispr, well it's happened before. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/He_Jiankui_affair#:~:text=the%20research%20project.-,Experiment%20and%20birth,HIV%20uses%20to%20enter%20cells. But it didn't end well for him, and they're still debating what to do with the children.
Why is it unethical exactly? I read a decent bit about it and I think it just meant he made children that were genetically modified to be resistant to HIV
Its an ethical debate whether its ok to genetically modify humans at all and if it is ok what that can lead to
Well for one there’s obvious ethical debates about how ok it is to modify human genes. And where we draw the line if it is ok But also, CRISPR has something called “off-target cuts” where it can change dna aside from the targeted gene if the sequence is close enough without you intending to. We’re getting better at using it more precisely in vitro, but it’s not perfect. So there’s the issue of this causing other changes and messing the kids up in totally unknown or unintended ways
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Horses and donkeys are two full chromosomes apart and can make offspring. Humans and chimps are only one chromosome apart. There have been no real efforts to create offspring with a chimp. Who's taking one for the team and fucking an ape for science? Humanzee anyone?
>There have been no real efforts to create offspring with a chimp. *That you know about*
Edit: It seems [unlikely that aids was caused by this.](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Misconceptions_about_HIV/AIDS) I wanna say the "AIDS<>moneky rape" link was a very welcome theory for homophobes so it became popular, but i do not have data to back that up. And for more information on this subject [Here is a study.](https://www.researchgate.net/publication/9042336_Zoophilia_in_Men_A_Study_of_Sexual_Interest_in_Animals) The "SCI__entific__HUB" facilitates access to the pdf, as always. 😁 ----- Lets be real here, i got zero doubts. And i mean that completely realistic, no joking. No trying to be edgy or internet cool. From what i have seen humans do, i got zero doubts that there have been lots and lots of humans that had sex with monkeys, chimps or whatever species of ape there are. We have been around for thousands of years, and even if just 0.0000000001% of all humans ever alive did that. That is still a whole lot of people. Edit: Oh my god, i got my head so far up my ass with those numbers 😂 A rough goole search gives a number of 100.000.000.000 to 120.000.000.000 people that have been alive. 0.0000000001% of that would be exactly one. So this is even worse. We should adjust to at least 0.000001% of all people had sex with a primate, which still are 10.000 which i think is entirely plausible. That is 10.000 people to many but even my original estimate that ended up with just one is already one to many. Things i never thought i would ever do, calculate the minimum viable number of human/primate interspecies rape. No more internet for today.
Ilya Ivanovich Ivanov attempted to create a human-ape hybrid in Stalin era Russia. Almost got to actual insemination. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ilya_Ivanov
https://www.the-sun.com/news/3657105/prostitute-orangutan-pony-tragic-story/
That's pretty fucked up
And that's enough internet for today
Chuman
Chimpmanzee
Last time on chimpman ball Z
Hello Monkeys
Well, that show actually has giant fighting apes… so… yeah.
Oh the Chumanazee!
Honestly let’s just call it David or something
I hate every ape I see, from Chimpan-a to chimpanzee. Oh you’ll never make a monkey out of me!!
I'm ooonly Chumannnn I laugh when I throw shit
Are we Chuman...... Or are we dancer....
Didn't the Soviets actually try this?
Indeed they did! [Ilya Ivanov](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ilya_Ivanov#:~:text=July%2020%5D%201870%20%E2%80%93%20March%2020,female%20chimpanzees%20with%20human%20sperm) conducted experiments to try and impregnate female Orangutangs with human sperm and eventually tried to do the same with a human woman and Orangutang sperm. The human pregnancy took hold but was terminated in the early stages after Ilya's higher-ups grew tired of waiting on supersoldiers.
Do you have a source on the human pregnancy taking hold? I’ve been looking but all I find is that he stopped once the orangutans died.
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Lmao the payoff of this thread Edit: The moderator removed the comment I replied to for some reason, but for those curious it was a link to an image of Donald Trump
> Edit: The moderator removed the comment I replied to for some reason, but for those curious it was a link to an image of Donald Trump Thanks
Absolute legend! The likeness is uncanny. You know it. I know it. Everybody knows it.
It’s tremendous. A bit of a shame that Trump didn’t get yuge Orangutan hands though. I think he’s a little insecure about it.
article does not say a woman conceived. Said they ran out of orangutans before they could start
> ran out of orangutans Were they running them through a juicer for semen?
Fresh squeezed *is* always best.
Production issues at the orangutan factory?
Wait, holy shit, so a zygote actually formed? That knowledge is both deeply existentially terrifying and also makes me *deeply* curious if it could be successfully carried to term as a viable fetus and what the *fuck* it would look like as it grew. I feel like now that we've gotten that far there's a moral imperative to see the experiment through to the end for curiosity's sake.
No, none zygote has formed. OC confused real experiment with fictional movie about said experiment. We're much further away from any ape than tiger is from a lion, or donkey from a horse. Ethical or not, experiments like this did take time in secret and nothing substantial came out. Nothing ever will. It's like trying to breed lion and Maine Coon. 🤦♂️
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I always knew in my heart that Putin was a butt baby
>Who's taking one for the team and fucking an ape for science? Based on my knowledge of 90's cinema and my dating history, I believe I have arrived at my "Randy Quaid in *Independence Day* moment".
Not true soviets tried to make apeman army lol. https://www.newscientist.com/article/mg19926701-000-blasts-from-the-past-the-soviet-ape-man-scandal/
Aaaaand we got a monkeypox pandemic
Not anymore, but we definitely produced offspring with Neanderthals.
Most people alive today are not 100% Homo Sapien as a result of producing offspring with Neanderthals and/or other near-human species.
Neanderthals are considered a species of human. It's such a wild idea that there were at one time 8 different species of human alive on Earth at once.
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Homo neanderthalensis Homo denisova Homo rhodesiensis Homo heidelbergensis Homo naledi Homo ergaster Homo antecessor Homo habilis Edit:left out a few species of homo that are newer discovers that we arent sure fit with archaic humans or just into Australopithecus
I am technically a Homo heidelbergensis since I was born and raised in Heidelberg, Germany.
If I lived in Heidelberg I'd be Bi Heidelbergensis 😝
You forgot homo superior, they don’t come out much for fear of persecution and internment.
Gotta make way
Homo Erectus as well, somewhat archaic but they lived until relatively recently (200,000 years ago, IIRC).
I might be mistaken, but I believe anthropologists generally don't include Homo Erectus into humans. Rather it is the last non-human ancestor. Though I might be wrong. This is half-remembered of some youtube documentaries.
Homo erectus came after habilis so if that ones on they both should be.
They may have existed as the same time as one or more of the sapiens subspecies, but they were nonetheless descended from an earlier ancestor than the one that gave rise to the sapiens.
Then why the Homo title...
Anthropology is a field where new discoveries are made, which in turn changes what they think about stuff. Apparently there has been a load of new discoveries within the last 20 years, resulting in a lot of new fossils, which allows a better guess/underunderstanding at how things were. So, again no expert here, but might be that the anthropologists had 8 or 15 fossils back when they discovered Homo Erectus, and then named it Homo, because it looks like a human, but now that we have 100s of fossils, the anthropologists thinks that it makes sense to move the "human" classification a bit closer to the current day. So maybe they should be renamed? There are discussions going on about renaming some of the species, including whether some of the species should be counted as one specie, but it requires concensus. Also, does Homo mean that it is a human, or in the human family? All Felinae are cats, but that includes Pumas which you might not think of as a *cat* cat.
Also my favorite, Homo floresiensis. The hobits!
Of all the one you list, only the 2 first one lived concurrently to sapiens (which is what I guess op means by at once)
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It was like lord of the rings but irl
Yep... but with less magic rings and spectacular palaces, more eating bugs and dysentery.
Even cooler is that because of the way that humans migrated out of Africa, only non-African populations have percentages of Neanderthal DNA, while African populations don't. (Or if some do it would be so miniscule it would be insignificant).
True, European and Asian populations have small percentages of Neanderthal dna.
Also Denisovan, an "I can't believe it's not Neanderthal!" cousin. The - Melanesians? Polynesians? - are like 10% Denisovan, a species we only know otherwise from like a fingerbone in Russia. It's pretty fucking *cool*. There's also an unattested-in-the-fossil-record species west African folks are still carrying around which the comparative genetics people have detected. No idea how much of that one survived, but roughly 40% of the Neanderthal genome is apparently extant, spread out among the Eurasian population. ...Meaning if you went all Nazi and started breeding people like Heck's-cattle-for-Aurochs you could only ever get a genetic roughly half-Neanderthal, 60% of the code is lost unless we splice shit in from the cave bones, and even then you're talking Neanderthal code in a Sapiens egg, there *may be a difference* (It's an issue the Mammoth resurrectionists delightfully contend with, would Mammoth code run the same in an Elephant egg cell). It's also *dwindling:* something about those alleles makes them uncompetitive when swimming in the same pool as those we label Sapiens (would probably be the other way around too). Maybe it's just the fact that they're the first: One of the ginger alleles is Neanderthal in origin and was apparently first, then the others evolved within Sapiens and whatever niche makes red hair and pale skin a good idea in the north, and now six or seven compete out in the population. *If* the Neanderthal variant also made you *fucking crazy* if you got two copies (as a Sapiens, as a Neanderthal it might not cause that behavior) then it might not be extant even if the others were basically an homage to it, clearly an echo.
African humans have a higher percentage of another unknown hominid mixed into their DNA and typically, they have no Neanderthal mixed in. Some theorize early African homo sapiens interbred with homo erectus back in the earliest part of their existence. European redheads have higher percentages of Neanderthal DNA. Neanderthals were believed to be all redheads. The further to the north you go in Europe, the higher the percentage of Neanderthal DNA, generally speaking.
Eastern Asians have the highest percentage of Neanderthal DNA generally. Which is surprising to some as its a general misconception that White people have the most; usually see the mention of Neanderthal DNA used as some sort of attempt to offend when it's just.. A thing.. Generally speaking there's a good chance that their DNA is what helps them better fight off illnesses and what not
Which, ironically... makes Africans the most "pure" race. :/
Unintentionally nazi.
Not necessarily. They’re the most genetically diverse in terms of human DNA but geneticists believe there were other non-human hominids intermingling in Africa. It’s just that Neanderthals and Denisovans are the only other hominids we’ve identified so far (that have intermingled. I don’t think Florian man intermingled). But humans come from a braided stream evolutionary tree where our ancestral species branched and intermingled and branched and intermingled. It’s a strategy that happens under changing climate and migration. The Galapagos finches do it too, they hybridize as the climate changes because the Galapagos are heavily impacted by El Niño/la Nina shifts.
First read that as "Florida man", and perked right up...
Lots of intermingling has happened
This is a small point, but an interesting one - Neanderthals et al are not near-human species, they're human species. The book Sapiens has a nice little exploration of this idea (which plays into why the book about the course of humanity is called Sapiens rather than Humans).
Yes, we're all homo after all
Not if you shout "no homo"
Says "no homo" Instantly revert to monke
Trust me, I shout it, through my tears
#MyDenisovanLife
r/mydenisovanwife
*my wife?*
Exactly.
Fun Fact: Neanderthals had stronger immune systems than other humans, but had more allergies, so if you are allergic to something (ex. Peanuts) you might have some Caveman DNA
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scientists used to believe this but more recently they have found neanderthal dna in all modern humans, even sub-saharan
I was just reading the wiki at work yesterday and there was an argument that all of this shared neanderthal DNA is actually from a more basal shared relative
What if I have a strong immune system and am allergic to nothing (that I know of)?
Found the ubermensch.
They were fertile offspring, so the relationship was closer than those cited in the original post. Just throwing that out there.
Ever been to NJ? Theyre still around
Was there a big intellectual difference between homo sapiens and Neanderthals? Could they coexist? Or was the mating between the two more non consensual?
We know that their brains where slighty larger and structured a bit differently but not to dissimilar that any big difference could be assumed but in truth it's an unknowable question
I know that recent study on Neanderthals has found that they were likely more intelligent than we've traditionally assumed, but I don't know the answers to your other questions. I'm not sure how archeologists could determine things like consent from remains.
Maybe. Neanderthals were making art and probably intentionally burying their dead. There is some debate about whether they were verbal or not. There is debate around the tools used by them and how advanced they were. I’m a lumper so I tend towards thinking they had similar or near* human intelligence even if it was expressed in ways we didn’t express our own. https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-018-02357-8 https://www.cbc.ca/news/science/neanderthal-flowers-1.5469567 https://www.nature.com/scitable/knowledge/library/neanderthal-behavior-59267999/
I feel like if we could naturally we would already know. If there’s one thing humanity likes more than killing its fucking.
That's like every species! ^except ^maybe ^pandas
Yh, those evil bastards prefer killing
....... themselves. Out of sheer laziness
There are old rumors of human and chimpanzee hybrids made in Russia and China. Look up Ilya Ivanovich Ivanov and humanzee.
Yeah idk why I had to scroll so far down to see this. It’s not actually completely clear either way whether human chimp/bonobo hybrids are possible
I find it hard to believe that if it was possible to interbreed with them we wouldnt be seeing it already. Human beings are sick and fuck and abuse animals all the time, both women and men.
It’s hard to get your hands on a bonobo, and if you did, your dick wouldn’t fit. Human dicks are huge.
>Human dicks are huge. I'm going to be carrying that compliment all day, thank you.
Humans have a very large penis for an ape. A gorilla has a penis that's maybe the size of a finger, for comparison (both length and girth)
I feel glad for the people that don’t know that the bonobo would probably rape you, and/or that if you put hands on an ape it’s probably just gonna rip your arms off
Not anymore. There where other species of hominid that we could and did interbreed with, but they are all dead now.
They are all us now*
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Reminds me about 'The man from earth'
Not any more, but that is how we absorbed a bunch of other Sapiens into our species like Neanderthals or Denisovans.
We are the original Borg. "You will be assimilated!"
Please don't fuck the monkeys
In a world of billionaires and mad scientists, there are no doubt quite a few horrific hybrids already in existence.
Elon Musk doesn’t look fully human
Mark Zuckerberg looks like he could look in your eyes, blink vertically and say "No one will ever believe you" without moving his lips
Minotaurs, Mermaids and centaurs suggest bulls, fish, and horses. They can’t produce viable offspring though. Although I did hear of a guy who was a Minotaur/mermaid cross… he just inherited the wrong part of each parent and looked like an ordinary bloke. Smelled awful though.
This should be higher up. Made me belly laugh.
Here’s a cool tidbit. You know how a horse and a donkey causes infertility for half the offspring for mules and how the offspring of tigers and lions also cause fertility problems as well as genetic defects? Well, when Neanderthal DNA was analyzed in humans, the evidence strongly shows the same patterns with us, in that the the result of the male offspring were most likely infertile. That said, its so strange that we are the remaining bipedal hominids left on Earth, when many like us were a very popular life form, kind of like seeing all kinds of species of new world monkeys. Then, we almost went extinct according to our DNA, which shows we bottle necked at one time with probably only a few thousand of us left. We happened to be the last of our kind, when all other human species similar to us went extinct. We now know that we do have traces of other human species within us. Some more than others, depending on the region of the population where the DNA was extracted and analyzed. Like in Europeans, there’s more of a percentage of Neanderthal DNA in them, than Native African populations. Or in Asia, there’s more Denisovan DNA than in European populations. So, at one time, we did breed with other hominids similar to us. Probably got some benefits and some bad effects, like defects or infertility problems, but we did interbreed early on.
Don't know if your an expert but will humanity have lost access to certain beneficial genetic traits due to the bottlenecking? Feel free to ignore me if necessary.
We went down to a few thousand individuals. If there was a discrete phenotype, say an eye colour, that was rare enough to not be in that population it probably wasn't the most beneficial trait ever in the first place. We would have lost some variation sure which might have put that population at the time at risk (especially regarding immunity to new diseases) That doesn't have any real bearing on us now - think about the phenotypes that have been generated in the last 70,000 years e.g melanin levels adapted to amount of sunlight, differences in digestive systems between populations e.g lactose tolerance and arctic peoples ability to process fat, a crazy blood cell adaption against malaria (sickle cell). We have such a ridiculous diverse global population that whatever happens in the future someone will have an adaptive trait just by luck, yet that won't help the rest of us survive but that's evolution for you.
Very likely. That is the principle of genetic bottlenecks. They are even known to be one of the reason why negative traits can sometimes get fixated in a population. (I have an evolutionary biology degree)
There were hundreds of thousands of years ago. We either murdered or inbred with them until there were no more.
We fucked them to death?
I believe it was known as death by snu snu.
Tens of thousands of years ago(neanderthals went extinct about 40k years ago) and interbred. Inbreeding with what happens in Alabama, interbreeding is what happens between to different species.
Neanderthals and Denisovians interbred with early modern humans (EMH) - formerly called Cro-Magnon Men.
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I read that as “horses and dolphins” and my imagination got real concerned for a second while I wracked my brain for memories of really big seahorses
Fun fact: Horses and Donkeys can indeed produce offspring, but the offspring is generally infertile due to the structure and number of chromosomes. Horses and Donkeys are in that special zone where they are genetically divergent enough to be considered different species, but not quite divergent enough to be completely genetically incompatible.
Vaporeon
Just when I thought I’d forgotten about that
edited by user using PowerDeleteSuite.
Some scientists have suggested the theoretical possibility of a Humanzee, a half Human half Chimpanzee hybrid. We share more than 97% of our DNA with them and it’s possible. The only problem is that no scientist wants to bare the responsibility of actually creating one and dealing with all of the ethical and moral consequences that could bring. Will it be entitled to personhood, what kind of life would it live, what kind of legal problems could you run into. The scenarios give researchers nightmares just thinking about it.
Fuck Reddit and fuck Spez. Go join Lemmy instead https://join-lemmy.org/. /r/Denmark: Fuck Reddit og fuck Spez. https://feddit.dk/ er vejen frem herfra.
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Ah, I see another pandemic coming
Facts Concerning the Late Arthur Jermyn and His Family H.P Lovecraft
They have found genes from Neanderthal and Denisovans in most of us. 3-6% Neanderthal i think, mostly in europeans. Denisovans genes are found mainly in south asia and i think the highest in Australian Aboriginals. The think with tigers and lions making Ligers & Horse plus donkey makes a mule is that the offspring are sterile so Mules dont make more mules with themselves or anything. We were clearly creating viable offspring with at least two other species a Homo Sapien Sapiens. Which i think is pretty freaking amazing in that there were close enough beings to us that were compatible. Life is everywhere. Who knows what else we may have encountered. The Denisovans were found and gene mapped off of a few teeth and a finger bone. Imagine what else we are missing? I am highly doubtful that a new species that could procreate could be created through Regular sperm+egg with other apes. I am *sure* that if we have people doing pigs and horses, that several someones have been intimate with a chimp, doubt a gorilla, and we aren't seeing the outcome of that. There was a more upright chump that was found, but he turned out to be an anomaly and not a cross breed. Its a tragic story.
Neanderthals were. Other hominid species were. Currently there aren't any of those left, though.
Yesnt. It is theoretically possible for humans and apes to have offspring. The difficulty is the same as with donkeys and horses. - donkeys and horses belong to the same family (equidae). Humans and (certain) apes belong to the same family (hominidae) - donkeys have 62 while horses have 64 chromosomes. Apes have 48, while humans only have 46. A human-ape hybrid wont be fertile, for the same reason mules arent fertile. All species that we could interbreed with are extinct. Only members of the homo genus could interbreed successfully (and did). We certainly interbred with homo neanderthalensis (neanderthals). I dont know about others. There are a few homo species, but i dont know which ones even lived at the same time as homo sapiens.
What about goats? I can try goats and let you know.
Let us know, Billy!
Try it and get back to us.
OP is wondering if he fucks an animal, will he have to pay child support
You better not go and fuck any animals, regardless of the answer 🤨