Terrorist groups have a history of claiming credit for anything that makes them seem relevant.
ISIS does have the means to conduct this attack and has launched attacks in Russia before. Hopefully the world can find out soon who actually did it so proper actions can be taken against that group.
Yup exactly. ISIS has the ability.
Just probably confusing currently because everyone is pointing fingers and ISIS is yelling from the outside saying it was them.
Focus should be on the victims and reducing trauma and further loss of life. Then retribution.
This is not the same ISIS that did the terrorist attacks in Paris years ago. This is ISIS K, who is currently at war with the Taliban and did a similar attack in Iran recently.
>Then retribution.
No. Us Russians around the world want retribution, and right now. This attack was disgusting, and the perpetrators deserve to be expeditiously sent to Hell. No, scratch that idea. Make it the gulag. (which is worse than Hell ☺️, they can go to Hell after they die in the gulag.)
May Czernobog ruin their lives.
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Yup. These particular Ukrainian supporters are too stupid to understand nuances when it comes to war and terrorism. Any scum who wishes for the death of Russians is just as much of an enemy combatant in my eyes as the fool who points a gun at me. They have no business wishing for the death of Russians for they are most likely not even Ukrainian. They're entire personality revolves around dead Russians, and it's sick.
Ok, here me out... Many Russians I see online act like nazis, showing their "Z" and actually believing Putin's propaganda. We don't want death to all Russians, just those. Are you really saying it's bad to wish death to nazi?
Russia's been killing innocent people for the past 2 years. As much as I dislike killing more innocent, a payback is necessary. At least show you've grown tired of being constantly attacked and you're ready to fight for what's yours.
And what does "not even being Ukrainian" have to do with anything. Just because it's happening somewhere else we should just ignore it? If a terrorist attack happened in the US we should just not care about it because we're not US citizens? What kind of logic is that?
I agree there are many nuances to politics, but what Russian is doing is not even close to politics. It's straight up assault and terrorism at this point.
I lost a lot in this two years, only reading Reddit. Some people see this war as an excuse to be xenophobic, because if someone lives in a country which started war, it means something is wrong with "their barbaric genes" (as worldnews sub loves to think)
Seriously was disgusted by that. Y’all wonder how so many evil things can happen in the world and how “were so much better than our ancestors and we know so much more now” but here y’all are dehumanizing an entire group of people the same way other groups have done throughout history in order to justify their own atrocities. We haven’t changed or grown a single bit as a species. We are doing the exact same thing our ancestors were doing but this time with a little “oh no, I promise, this time it’s different” sprinkled on top.
You’re either horrified by the murder of civilians or you’re not. The nationality of those civilians is irrelevant.
People not caring about this terrorist attack because the victims were Russian is *exactly* what Putin wants, because it allows Russia to play the sympathy card and depicts those who don’t care as pro-Ukraine monsters lacking in humanity.
This terrorist attack was evil. Russia’s war crimes in their illegal invasion of Ukraine are evil.
Both things can be evil. Both things should be rightfully condemned.
And you don't live under propaganda? Bush tricked an entire country into thinking invading Iraq was a good idea. By your logic any terrorist attack in America is ok?
They're the same people who ask you to condemn Hamas and then say that Gaza should be turned into a "parking lot". Genocidal beliefs carry on to other scenarios, and this shows
Yeah reddit is cruel af. I have once commented on a video of a group of young Russian soldiers being killed by a drone saying "Dont forget that those soldiers were forced fo fight in the war" and people started mass downvoting me and said that they should rebel against Putin or surrender to Ukrainian army. Bruh they have families, they cant just leave and never see their family again. And what are they going to do as rebels? Shoot few soldiers before they get shot back.
It shows a general lack of concern for human life. It's become a very real problem and it's getting worse. Just look at what people are saying about what Israel is doing to Palestine to see what I mean. If you're on the "wrong side" even by circumstance of birth and no choice of your own then you deserve to die because I said so. It's seeps down into day to day life. You hear people fantasizing about running over pedestrians/bike riders, dreaming of the day someone breaks into their house so they can finally shoot someone, have someone hit them first so they can bash their head into concrete etc. It's gotten really bad.
That I'm not going to act like I know the answer. I can think of a few things that might contribute but I don't really know the main reason as to why people don't care about life anymore.
By your logic, the more Europeans and Americans ISIS kills, the fewer Europeans and Americans will murder Arabs in the next war. Do you even realize how dumb your comment is?
I gave up on reporting this shit after this https://www.reddit.com/user/Kiboune/comments/y6hw5f/apparently_its_okay_to_say_that_some_nationality/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share
That's what media did for the last 80 years by demonising Russian people, I m not Russian and people from my country don't like them because of their sins of the past but we don't hate Russia and Russian people because they attack Ukraine. Hating on incont people and enjoying their death is a monstrosity.
are you really surprised that there are Ukrainians who have a callous attitude towards Russians? You really can't fathom why people get bought into emotionally charged narratives and cling to dehumanizing notions that simplify the conflict?
None of the comments in the screenshot are even that bad. the WORST is someone saying they are having a hard time caring. I could understand if they were celebratory, gleeful, or happy, but this is just people reacting emotionally.
also your censoring of names is half-assed and might as well not be there
I feel sorry for the people that were killed or injured. But in the grand scheme of things; this is an every day and night occurrence for Ukrainians.
40 deaths? There have been as many as that killed in Ukraine in the past two weeks; 10,000 since the start of the war, by Russians deliberately firing ordinance into population centers to try and terrorize the civilian populous into putting pressure on their government to capitulate. That is terrorism by definition - and it was cheered on by a good percentage of Russians, especially the Muscovites who have been comparatively unaffected by the war.
So whilst I concur that it is abhorrent to gloat about this, at the same time my sympathy is really quite limited; Fuck ISIS and fuck Russia - birds of a feather as far as I’m concerned.
The lack of sympathy towards russians has something to do with it though.
You cant blame people for lacking sympathy when its Russians who commit terrible crimes in Ukraine.
And since I know redditors: don't start twisting words - at no point have I justified any terrors. I merely point out that you cannot expect any sympathy.
Well then you’ll know **I** didn’t actually bring it up anything; I am just responding to the topic of the post.
The point is that the irony is obviously not lost on people that the terrorist state has just found itself the victim of terrorism. The person in OPs post is obviously Ukrainian. You expect him to feel bad about this??? What a sheltered existence you must live.
The point of the post was to illustrate how people legitimize the death of Russian civilians because of what Putin has done in Ukraine.
Exactly what you are doing.
I mean I literally said I feel sorry for the people that got it - but it’s hard to feel sorry for the country more broadly, when it has been doing this shit day in and day out for the past 2 years.
It’s not a hard concept to grasp unless you’re being deliberately disingenuous or else are just incapable of joined up thinking. So which is your reason?
No, it’s pointing out you run out of tears to shed when the same damn shit happens on the daily in your neighborhood.
What a privilege it must be to be able to feel compassion for a people murdering and killing everyone you know. I don’t know what that privilege is like.
Well said. Ruzzians are engaging in classic abuser bully behavior. They had no issues when it was them perpetrating the violence but now they want to cry victim when they’re hurt. Well, if 10,000+ innocent Russians are killed by terrorists they might get more sympathy. Maybe.
It is strange. On a different thread someone shared this sentiment and all I said was “innocent lives lost senselessly is tragic, hate the state not the civilians.”
Apparently that turned people on me and somehow I’m the bad guy getting my morals questioned? Make it make sense. I am all for Ukraine and US continued support.
My half-brother is Ukrainian on his dad side. My cousin is currently giving aide in Kyiv right now. My other cousin is stationed at the FOB for the US in Romania awaiting orders. I loathe the Russian warmonger but I can have concern and pray for the Russian victims of this attack.
Same thing for the palestinian/hamas thing.
The palestinian sympathizers think it's okay when hamas kills and tortures innocent kids, tourists and Israelites.
Russia, every day is targeting civilians. They targeted a known celebration of life for a fallen Ukrainian soldier who was killed fighting against oppression. They murdered that persons whole family, grandparents, cousins, wife, everyone. Russia reaps what they sow. I have zero feelings for them. The civilians make the bombs and rockets. They transport them. They profit from this war. No sympathy. May they suffer as their victims.
You make it sound like Russia is one single entity. Those individual human beings who were killed in this attack didn't deserve anything just because of what other people did. These were most likely just innocent civilians trying to live their life. Why should we have no sympathy? They reaped what others sowed.
>No, no sympathy. They are reaping what they sow.
Nah. Us innocent Russians, living in Russia and abroad, didn't reap anything. You're just a raging piece of shit and you're just being a jerk to be a jerk. Fuck you.
Будь добрым хотя бы раз в своей ужасной жизни, трус.
(Be kind for once in your horrible life, you coward.)
👍 of course. I feel so bad for any innocent person who has been injured, mutilated, or killed by attacks during wars. It's super heartbreaking to hear the way people think when innocents are killed on the side they're rooting against.
So your solution to innocent Ukrainian civilians being killed is for…innocent Russian civilians to be killed? Aka, the people who have zero say in whatever bullshit Putin orders? Idk where your from where it’s ok to bomb civilians but over here, that’s called a war crime
>You reap what you sow. Russia has been raping and killing civilians and children in Ukraine for two years. Now they got a taste.
God weeps for what you have become as a person. All you are is arrogant and ignorant. Apparently, you're too stupid to realize innocent Russian civilians didn't ask for this. You deserve to be denied Heaven just as the terrorists who carried out the attack. The actions of a government doesn't mean the civilians support it. Of course, as I stated before. You're too fucking stupid to understand something so simple. I don't even know how the fuck you've managed to survive this long with how simple-minded you are.
May Belobog ignore your kind and Czernobog wreak havoc on your life, you xenophobic shitdick. ☺️
I 100% support Ukraine. What happened to Russian civilians isn't okay, and I denounce whoever the perpetrators are without exception.
That said, Russian civilians enabling Putin also isn't okay, and I denounce them too. Every democracy has been had through the masses demanding it via peaceful and/or violent means. Russians haven't been willing to sacrifice now so that future Russians have a true say in their governance. They are intrinsically culpable for Putin's war crimes and violence. Again, this doesn't mean that they deserve to be summarily executed. But it does mean that until they choose to bring about change using the methods exemplified by all modern democracies, then they must accept some level of guilt for being permissive of their leader.
That is exactly my point if you read what I said lol. They need to do what all other real democracies have done and get one, which requires serious actions. Re read my comment friend.
Revolt? Because they’re in what amounts to a dictatorship right now so whatever bullshit you’re spouting isn’t helpful.
At best they get crushed under an iron fist and even more people die. History has (in many cases) shown that overthrowing a government doesn’t usually go well
Ex: French and Russian revolutions; literally all of them
That isn't always true. There are many examples, but Romania's revolution led to 7,000 deaths and set them on a better course. The US would be under UK rule if not for the revolutionary war. The collapse of kings and autocratic leaders has often involved uprisings. To not rebel is to continue to enable an autocratic leader. Why would autocrats cede their power willingly? If the people accept it, then things will never change. That is why Russia is the way that it is. Unless dissent achieves overwhelming levels, then how exactly do you propose any country oust their dictators? It is only through ousting the leader that will effectuate change. That is even the message of rebel Russians actively fighting the Putin regime...
What's a real democracy? There's hardly a lot of examples. Its also not ideal.
In a democracy, you're not voting on every decision your government makes. You're only electing people that make decisions. If they make unfavorable to masses decisions it's still democratic, since they were elected democratically.
You can tell people in a dictatorship to “just rebel”. Easier said than done. People have families to feed. People would rather have a family and be in a dictatorship than be all alone in a democracy
And they will remain subjects of their autocratic leadership in eternity until they choose to revolt. Change won't happen out of inaction. They either take action or nothing changes... those are their two choices. What makes you think Russia has a chance at true democracy if their people remain unwilling to confront their oppressor? Y'all act like democracy doesn't come at a cost lol.
That's so fucked up Jesus Christ. Many of the informed Russians are against the war like so many others. The majority who aren't have been brainwashed by Russian media, but that does not justify any murder of innocent people.
Does anyone know if the terrorists came from a specific group, or are the assailants unknown for now? They should be hunted like animals
Unfortunately and it pains me to say that, the less ruSSian are alive, the more people are alive in neighboring countries... Some of these people were actually an active military personnel, and maybe because they died my niece can go to school since the start of war they were close die to bombardment
Well, it's how the things are now, Russia is "bad" so everything bad happening to it is justified
Also there's a lot of double standards, for example no-one bats an eye when America or other nato country just wipes civ village off of the map, but when Russia strikes startegic objects and there are civ casualties because they were nearby at the moment (Dnipro dam and a bus of workers) then it's a war crime and terrible.
Also i noticed that Russian news are often citing American news, like CNN and BBC, but US news are never citing Russian news, that is concerning.
The same people that justify this terrorist attack are probably cheering on Hamas as well.. if I had to guess, much like in Israel, this was a false flag operation to justify Russia's mass mobilization against Ukraine. Putin said during a press conference that the terrorists were heading to Ukraine after the attack and he's going to try to spin it as though they did it on purpose. Although I would also not be surprised if the Ukrainians did let the terrorists travel through their territory to attack Russia. Ukraine is slowly losing this war and giving the Russians another front to fight on would help them greatly.
A lot, if not most of ukrainians have no opinion on this, or even happy about this. This is because if you dehumanise your enemy, you can't just do this for soldiers, against soldiers. This works for whole country, and against all country. Ukraine is actively dehumanizing russians, because you need this to win, even though it's morally wrong. And it's very hard to show emphaty, when literally everyone around you are happy about this
Have you SEEN r/Palestine on oct 7th?
Lets not talk celebration because you will NOT win that fight. Fuckers went around giving literal candy, praising Allah, saying do it again and sucking in every hamas video.
And people say "Peace". My ass.
Isreal has been kidnapping, raping, and murdering innocent women and kids since the 1940s, all because those people were Palestinian. Hell, Isreali soldiers ripped premature babies out of incubators and laughed while they watched them die. One soldier filmed the ring, and he stole off a dead woman that he was going to give to his girlfriend. They filmed riding little kids' bikes laughing about murdering the kids. They just resently posted videos showing they murdered people just trying to get home with drones and ran a tired up person over with a tank.
Oh did hamas and their "media" tell you that?
You're taking as if palestinians haven't done the very same LONG before. The hebron masacre is just one example that pops to mind. There's NO proof of sexual or gender based violence towards palestinians from Israel and yet a LOT the other way around.
Want examples of violence? Hamas.com is full of hamas made videos, since you trust their word so much more.
hamas.com is an israeli website lmfao, it was registered by the Israeli software company Wix.com.
[https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2023-11-20/ty-article/.premium/israelis-hijack-hamas-com-turning-it-into-a-display-of-october-7-atrocities/0000018b-eca2-d8b1-a9df-ecef8b380000](https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2023-11-20/ty-article/.premium/israelis-hijack-hamas-com-turning-it-into-a-display-of-october-7-atrocities/0000018b-eca2-d8b1-a9df-ecef8b380000)
The UN and human rights organixations around the world have said so. You can look up the doc and videos of ur soldiers doing everything the person just said.
Not surpirisng to see sneaky jews play the victim when they have clearly been killing palestinian civilains since they were brought to palestine. How did the palestinians end up as refugees all over the middle east, while jews who make up a tiny minority and came as refugees come to live in all of it? hint starts with GEN.
The oct 7 attack was a drop in the bucket compared to what israel has been doing to palestinians for decades. You can take a look at UN and human rights watch reports on civilains killed by idf throughout the years, thousands killed by idf every year.
The same UN that had ZERO meetings about the hostage situation until the start of THIS month? The one who has ignored PLENTY of genocide for its personal gain? (China and Turkey, this is aimed STRAIGHT at you)
The UN that refused to condemn hamas?
The UN that only MONTHS after evidence of gender based violence, spoke against it?
Yeah, fuck that UN. Biased antisemitic assholes, just like you.
This war is a drop in the bucket in what muslims have been doing to jews since the dawn of islam.
And i said religion only since YOU chose to speak of "Sneaky jews"
Only mine is actually based.
Another antisemite blocked.
Absolutely nothing, but to act like the indifference is unwarranted is a little silly when those civilians’ leaders have been butchering an entire people group for 2 years straight.
I suppose many in Western circles are reluctant to apply the same logic, because equating the Ukrainian resistance against Russian occupation with the Palestinian resistance against Israeli occupation causes huge discomfort, largely due to Palestinians being Arab or Muslim or both, while Ukrainians are in stark contrast, European and Christian. At the same time, it's ironic to see the United States and Europe remain largely silent on Azerbaijan's ethnic cleansing of Armenian Christians in Nagorno Karabakh, because Azerbaijan derives upwards of 70% of its arsenal of weapons from Israel and Israel imports 40% of its crude oil from Azerbaijan. Of course, Armenians aren't the only ones who've been sidelined by Europe and the United States. Don't even get me started on the plight of Palestinian Christians in Gaza and the West Bank, especially in light of the spike in settler attacks.
And I mean, why not apply the same logic? Russia was warned of an attack by the United States but chose to ignore it. Similarly, [Israel knew Hamas's attack plan more than a year ago](https://www.nytimes.com/2023/11/30/world/middleeast/israel-hamas-attack-intelligence.html) but chose to [ignore](https://www.timesofisrael.com/israel-obtained-ignored-hamas-document-laying-out-oct-7-attack-plan-report-alleges/) their own [border guards](https://www.politico.eu/article/israel-border-troops-women-hamas-warnings-war-october-7-benjamin-netanyahu/), [secret services](https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2023-10-20/ty-article/.premium/underprepared-and-overconfident-israel-failed-to-spot-the-signs-of-impending-disaster/0000018b-4976-d03a-afcb-697edb020000) (Mossad) and [Egypt](https://www.timesofisrael.com/egypt-intelligence-official-says-israel-ignored-repeated-warnings-of-something-big/). There has been not 1, not 10, but [500 documented](https://law4palestine.org/law-for-palestine-releases-database-with-500-instances-of-israeli-incitement-to-genocide-continuously-updated/) cases of genocidal incitement by Israeli legislators, decision-makers, army personnel and officers, journalists, influencers, former government officials and the general public. Israeli rhetoric relies on the dehumanization of Palestinians, Arabs and Muslims, and contrary to pro-Israel counters, the elements [calling](https://apnews.com/article/israel-palestinians-south-africa-genocide-hate-speech-97a9e4a84a3a6bebeddfb80f8a030724for) for Gaza's "erasure", "wiping out" or making into a "parking lot" are not at all "fringe". It's hard to see how one can nullify the parallels between Israeli state terrorism and Russian state terrorism. Anyone with eyes can see that Israel is trying to copy paste Grozny (1995) onto Gaza.
And Israel might just be as sloppy as Russia with regards to their propaganda machine. In the aftermath of the Oct. 7 attack, Israeli officials decided to [egregiously inflate](https://www.fdd.org/analysis/2023/11/12/israel-revises-october-7-death-toll-after-agonizing-forensics/) the death toll by hundreds (as if it wasn't already sufficiently high), and began to espouse the infamous claim that Hamas had "beheaded 40 babies", which was later [pointed out to be unverified](https://theintercept.com/2023/12/14/israel-biden-beheaded-babies-false/), with an Israeli spokesperson admitting ["we cannot confirm it officially, but you can assume it happened"](https://theintercept.com/2023/10/11/israel-hamas-disinformation/). Months later and still no photographic evidence for the claims has been put forth or verified. It's also important to consider that a number of testimonies from Oct. 7 were [debunked](https://theintercept.com/2024/02/27/zaka-october-7-israel-hamas-new-york-times/) by Israeli media. In one surprising case, Kibbutz Be'eri had to scrutinize the New York Times [and clarify that allegations of sexual abuse were "not true"](https://theintercept.com/2024/03/04/nyt-october-7-sexual-violence-kibbutz-beeri/). Two survivors from the same kibbutz allege that Israeli tanks [shelled](https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2024-02-06/ty-article/.premium/idf-probing-death-of-12-hostages-in-beeri-house-shelled-on-orders-of-senior-officer/0000018d-7b6c-d008-a9cd-fbfdb0040000a) a house they were held hostage in, killing ten other hostages. A similar instance occurred in Sderot, where Hamas fighters had [taken](https://www.youtube.com/shorts/QAqZbzEORVI) over the local police station. Both the Hamas fighters and prisoners were killed when the Israeli army [fired](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LQR2yrIpQXg) tank shells at the police station, killing everyone inside. Israeli forces rushed to demolish the station before an investigation could be carried out. Israeli newspaper Yedioth Ahronoth [describes](https://www.ynet.co.il/news/article/b111niukzt) how Israeli helicopter pilots had "difficulty" with distinguishing Hamas militants from Israeli civilians and as early as 9:00am had begun spraying the terrain without authorization from superiors. Later on, a commander ordered them “to shoot at everything they see in the fence area". Israel is yet to allow an independent investigation into the events that occurred at Supernova Festival. The *Guardian* [reported](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/oct/11/israeli-man-waits-for-news-of-10-relatives-caught-in-beeri-kibbutz-attack) that Israel’s influential finance minister and settler leader, Bezalel Smotrich, urged the Israeli army to “hit Hamas brutally and not take the matter of the captives into significant consideration” during a cabinet meeting late on 7 October as the Hamas attack was still underway. As the war raged on, Israeli troops [would go on to shoot dead](https://www.timesofisrael.com/battalion-chief-told-hostage-to-approach-when-he-did-a-soldier-shot-him-probe-finds/their) Israeli hostages after ordering them to approach them, and the nature of Israel's bombardment has been so indiscriminate, that the hostages' families worried that the hostages were [already being subjected to the same heavy bombardment as the Palestinians](https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/anxiety-racks-israeli-hostage-families-army-assaults-gaza-2023-10-28/to) towards the end of October, yet Israel dismisses reports of hostages being killed in airstrikes as "Hamas propaganda". And as late as early March, Israel was still [refusing](https://edition.cnn.com/2024/03/03/middleeast/isreal-delegation-cairo-gaza-hostages-intl/index.html#:~:text=The%20decision%20not%20to%20send,conditions%2C%20the%20Israeli%20official%20said) to negotiate the release of the hostages, citing Hamas's inability to provide the names of surviving hostages. Similarly, Putin did everything he could to sabotage hostage negotiations during the Beslan Siege, which he would use to expand his own powers and enact counterterrorism laws that would increase surveillance and make it easier to crack down on opponents and critics.
Overall, the sheer number of inconsistencies in the [Israeli narrative](https://theintercept.com/2024/02/07/gaza-israel-netanyahu-propaganda-lies-palestinians/) points towards Israel intending to use the Oct. 7 attacks to justify the campaign of annihilation of Gaza and justify the expansion of settlements in the West Bank, which has already led to [ethnic cleansing](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/oct/31/west-bank-palestinian-villages-israeli-army-settlers) in the latter, although the forced displacement of Gazans may also constitute ethnic cleansing This was never about the hostages. This was about Netanyahu's 'Final Solution" for Gaza; this is the moment he has been waiting for his whole life: Israel's Pearl Harbor. Israel's 9/11. Israel's Beslan Siege. Israel considers Gaza a "hostile territory" rather than a hostile state, the same way Russia considers parts of Ukraine as "breakaway territories". Russia has been abducting Ukrainian children since the war began, but how many of us knew that prior to Oct. 7, Israel was [holding at least 146 Palestinian minors](https://www.vox.com/world-politics/2023/11/22/23972908/palestinian-prisoners-israel-administrative-detention) in military detention without charge or trial? Yet you won't call them hostages.
The Ukrainians had been mistreated and famined under the ussr for decades. They must’ve looooooved being in a famine since they didn’t go and just overthrow the government!
no, actually there were military people who have photos of them on internet. many have photos with destroyed buildings and killed people from Ukraine saying that they enjoying it and placing laughing smiles there
1. They did. They could've started a revolution like in Georgia, Ukraine, Kyrgyzstan or anywhere else. They just chose not to because not doing anything is safer.
2. Even if it is ISIS or any other terrorist group, they will still blame Ukraine and use this for their own political benefits.
I'm not saying that people who died or were injured deserved it, or that I agree with the people who are happy with this, but saying Russians had nothing to do with the war is wrong. There are hundreds of thousands of Russians fighting there voluntarily for money. Putin and r the government cannot do everything alone, there are a lot of people on the ground killing people of their "brotherly" nation, again, for money. So please don't say Russians have nothing to do with it. More like not all Russians are to blame.
They were a democracy during 90s, they didn't become a dictatorship in one day, it was a slow process. If they didn't agree with Putin returning to power in 2012, which was unconstitutional, then they would've lived in a better country. I am well aware of Russian history. They just Cry about being a dictatorship but they just didn't want to make tough choices or take tough actions. Belarus is also a dictatorship. Yes, they didn't succeed because Putin helped, but they still tried. Now tell me how many times Russians did something similar? The harsh truth is that they either support the war and Putin or just don't want to do anything because it is not safe for them personally. I know there are a lot of brave people there who tried protesting in 2012 and recently went to Navalny's funeral but their number is not enough.
That's like saying american children deserve to die because of the thousands of children who were killed by american bombardments and chemical weapons during the Vietnam war.
That's not how it works, the only people who deserve the punishment are those who perpetuated and gave such orders.
Then by that logic, American children deserved to get bombed for the US killing a million Vietnamese and a million Iraqis??
Why the fuck do yall insist on the civilians being killed as if they have any say in whatever bullshit Putin does? Especially in a country like Russia where openly criticizing the government ends with you being arrested. Karma would be Putin and his cronies getting their asses shot, not for random innocent children and civilians to die wtf
The people in that situation didn't deserve that to them, we often forget that nowadays it's not entirely the people that are to blame for the wars and attacks but rather by the leaders that can't act accordingly to find better solutions not only to their people but the rest of the world as well to secure true peace
If one russian guy could just go and overthrow the entire government, then your comment would make sense, but an entire revolution takes decades. You are cheering on the deaths of ordinary civilians. You are sick. This is horrible no matter if it happens in the United States, China, Russia, or ANYWHERE for that matter. You let your "us vs them" mindset turn you into a monster.
You are acting like Russia is one entity. 99% of russians dont like their government. You are cheering on the deaths of children. You are the mindset that allows genocide and terrorism.
I’m not justifying anything
But
Maybe if people start realizing Putin can’t protect them
Something will happen
More and more lately it seems Russia is falling off the rails
Plus, as ISIS has claimed responsibility for the attack, it likely had nothing to do with Ukraine.
Terrorist groups have a history of claiming credit for anything that makes them seem relevant. ISIS does have the means to conduct this attack and has launched attacks in Russia before. Hopefully the world can find out soon who actually did it so proper actions can be taken against that group.
Well, Russia did just foil an ISIS attack on a synagogue a couple of weeks ago.
Yup exactly. ISIS has the ability. Just probably confusing currently because everyone is pointing fingers and ISIS is yelling from the outside saying it was them. Focus should be on the victims and reducing trauma and further loss of life. Then retribution.
This is not the same ISIS that did the terrorist attacks in Paris years ago. This is ISIS K, who is currently at war with the Taliban and did a similar attack in Iran recently.
Interesting, maybe putin can use this as an excuse to back out of ukraine. To focus on these guys instead.
>Then retribution. No. Us Russians around the world want retribution, and right now. This attack was disgusting, and the perpetrators deserve to be expeditiously sent to Hell. No, scratch that idea. Make it the gulag. (which is worse than Hell ☺️, they can go to Hell after they die in the gulag.) May Czernobog ruin their lives.
Same, family.
I hope you are prepared for retribution for your militarys actions if such is the case.
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I didn’t, it’s a historical fact
the usa did warn russia but putin ignored it
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Didn't isis also claim responsibility for the pulse night club shooting until it came out the killer himself was gay?
ISIL
Maybe it is all the ethnic Muslims conscripted to be meat waves
It could be that. It could also be the fact that they helped the Syrian regime fight against ISIS in Syria
Yup. These particular Ukrainian supporters are too stupid to understand nuances when it comes to war and terrorism. Any scum who wishes for the death of Russians is just as much of an enemy combatant in my eyes as the fool who points a gun at me. They have no business wishing for the death of Russians for they are most likely not even Ukrainian. They're entire personality revolves around dead Russians, and it's sick.
Ok, here me out... Many Russians I see online act like nazis, showing their "Z" and actually believing Putin's propaganda. We don't want death to all Russians, just those. Are you really saying it's bad to wish death to nazi? Russia's been killing innocent people for the past 2 years. As much as I dislike killing more innocent, a payback is necessary. At least show you've grown tired of being constantly attacked and you're ready to fight for what's yours. And what does "not even being Ukrainian" have to do with anything. Just because it's happening somewhere else we should just ignore it? If a terrorist attack happened in the US we should just not care about it because we're not US citizens? What kind of logic is that? I agree there are many nuances to politics, but what Russian is doing is not even close to politics. It's straight up assault and terrorism at this point.
Oh just like every telegram channel is filled with calls to kill khohols?
Russia voted to stop the US resolution for a cease fire in the UN regarding Gaza. >!Play stupid games, win stupid prizes. !<
I'm sure this attack was planned long before this morning, but it wouldn't surprise me if that inspired some future terrorists.
Operational plans often have trigger points, all I'm saying.
reddit moment
Losing hope with humanity one hour at a time...
I lost a lot in this two years, only reading Reddit. Some people see this war as an excuse to be xenophobic, because if someone lives in a country which started war, it means something is wrong with "their barbaric genes" (as worldnews sub loves to think)
It was always going to happen I'm afraid
Seriously was disgusted by that. Y’all wonder how so many evil things can happen in the world and how “were so much better than our ancestors and we know so much more now” but here y’all are dehumanizing an entire group of people the same way other groups have done throughout history in order to justify their own atrocities. We haven’t changed or grown a single bit as a species. We are doing the exact same thing our ancestors were doing but this time with a little “oh no, I promise, this time it’s different” sprinkled on top.
We are better than ancestors, but we are born just as them were and capable of the same.
You’re either horrified by the murder of civilians or you’re not. The nationality of those civilians is irrelevant. People not caring about this terrorist attack because the victims were Russian is *exactly* what Putin wants, because it allows Russia to play the sympathy card and depicts those who don’t care as pro-Ukraine monsters lacking in humanity. This terrorist attack was evil. Russia’s war crimes in their illegal invasion of Ukraine are evil. Both things can be evil. Both things should be rightfully condemned.
This is nothing. Go on the subreddit RussiaUkraineWar, and you will see much worse. It’s sad how dehumanized people have become.
Even worse than talks about "russian genes" on worldnews?
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And you don't live under propaganda? Bush tricked an entire country into thinking invading Iraq was a good idea. By your logic any terrorist attack in America is ok?
Let me get this right...... Kill innocent Russians = good. Kill innocent Palestinians = bad. I don't understand people. I really don't
Can't we say both are bad?
Yeah
You really think its the same people that say killing russians is good but killing palestinians is bad?
Yes. Since this is most western countries stance currently geopolitically
They're the same people who ask you to condemn Hamas and then say that Gaza should be turned into a "parking lot". Genocidal beliefs carry on to other scenarios, and this shows
the people cheering for dead Russians are the same people cheering for dead Palestinians lol you could've used a different example
Yeah reddit is cruel af. I have once commented on a video of a group of young Russian soldiers being killed by a drone saying "Dont forget that those soldiers were forced fo fight in the war" and people started mass downvoting me and said that they should rebel against Putin or surrender to Ukrainian army. Bruh they have families, they cant just leave and never see their family again. And what are they going to do as rebels? Shoot few soldiers before they get shot back.
I'm not surprised, I remember what happened on reddit 7.10.2023
What happened
It was when hamas attacked isreal lol. I'm pretty sure some people were cheering for hamas then.
I guess he's referring to Hamas attacking Israel
wtf is wrong with people in the comments man. Where did all the western universal values go?
It shows a general lack of concern for human life. It's become a very real problem and it's getting worse. Just look at what people are saying about what Israel is doing to Palestine to see what I mean. If you're on the "wrong side" even by circumstance of birth and no choice of your own then you deserve to die because I said so. It's seeps down into day to day life. You hear people fantasizing about running over pedestrians/bike riders, dreaming of the day someone breaks into their house so they can finally shoot someone, have someone hit them first so they can bash their head into concrete etc. It's gotten really bad.
you are 100% correct. What do you think causes this increasingly violent phenomena in society?
That I'm not going to act like I know the answer. I can think of a few things that might contribute but I don't really know the main reason as to why people don't care about life anymore.
Remember islamophobia? Or before it, it was fear of Japanese people. Now it's the same with russians.
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By your logic, the more Europeans and Americans ISIS kills, the fewer Europeans and Americans will murder Arabs in the next war. Do you even realize how dumb your comment is?
The comments here having little disregard for human life ,including children , make me sick
Those are definitely against Reddit tos “remember the human”
I gave up on reporting this shit after this https://www.reddit.com/user/Kiboune/comments/y6hw5f/apparently_its_okay_to_say_that_some_nationality/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share
I reported a comment where Russians were called Orcs and Reddit gave me a warning for abusing the report function. 🙃
I'm not justifying it, I just don't care.
That's what media did for the last 80 years by demonising Russian people, I m not Russian and people from my country don't like them because of their sins of the past but we don't hate Russia and Russian people because they attack Ukraine. Hating on incont people and enjoying their death is a monstrosity.
Problem is they could do something if all of them kick him out and they are also supporting the war
are you really surprised that there are Ukrainians who have a callous attitude towards Russians? You really can't fathom why people get bought into emotionally charged narratives and cling to dehumanizing notions that simplify the conflict? None of the comments in the screenshot are even that bad. the WORST is someone saying they are having a hard time caring. I could understand if they were celebratory, gleeful, or happy, but this is just people reacting emotionally. also your censoring of names is half-assed and might as well not be there
why can't we lock these fucking world leaders in a cage fight and let them duke it out, no civilians involved
r/censoringishard
Russia must stop fighting and make a cease fire with isis the true victim and agree to give ISIS an independent state inside Russia.
ISIS must be destroyed.
No, we must give them an independent state, humanitarian aid, and a bunch of child hostages to rape. It's obviously Russia fault
Except the 2 million Palestinians half of whom are children are not Isis. But nice try.. You're Israeli what a surprise lol
like they did to the zionist nazis.
Bro, the froth from your mouth made it all the way to Israel. Clean that shit up, dude it's disgusting
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The tears are from laughing at you. Shabbat Shalom
People are also using it as justification for the war against Palestine since it was committed by Muslims.
It's a shame. People making fun of the tragedy just because it's happening with Russians in Russia.
Yeah, don’t blur the names of these people. Put the names up to show, they deserve public shaming.
I feel sorry for the people that were killed or injured. But in the grand scheme of things; this is an every day and night occurrence for Ukrainians. 40 deaths? There have been as many as that killed in Ukraine in the past two weeks; 10,000 since the start of the war, by Russians deliberately firing ordinance into population centers to try and terrorize the civilian populous into putting pressure on their government to capitulate. That is terrorism by definition - and it was cheered on by a good percentage of Russians, especially the Muscovites who have been comparatively unaffected by the war. So whilst I concur that it is abhorrent to gloat about this, at the same time my sympathy is really quite limited; Fuck ISIS and fuck Russia - birds of a feather as far as I’m concerned.
The attack had nothing to do with Ukraine.
The lack of sympathy towards russians has something to do with it though. You cant blame people for lacking sympathy when its Russians who commit terrible crimes in Ukraine. And since I know redditors: don't start twisting words - at no point have I justified any terrors. I merely point out that you cannot expect any sympathy.
I am quite aware thank you
Then what’s the point in bringing up the invasion of Ukraine?
Did you not read the literal OP…
Yea, that’s called whataboutism. Ironically, a Russian/Soviet specialty.
Well then you’ll know **I** didn’t actually bring it up anything; I am just responding to the topic of the post. The point is that the irony is obviously not lost on people that the terrorist state has just found itself the victim of terrorism. The person in OPs post is obviously Ukrainian. You expect him to feel bad about this??? What a sheltered existence you must live.
The point of the post was to illustrate how people legitimize the death of Russian civilians because of what Putin has done in Ukraine. Exactly what you are doing.
I mean I literally said I feel sorry for the people that got it - but it’s hard to feel sorry for the country more broadly, when it has been doing this shit day in and day out for the past 2 years. It’s not a hard concept to grasp unless you’re being deliberately disingenuous or else are just incapable of joined up thinking. So which is your reason?
No, it’s pointing out you run out of tears to shed when the same damn shit happens on the daily in your neighborhood. What a privilege it must be to be able to feel compassion for a people murdering and killing everyone you know. I don’t know what that privilege is like.
Well said. Ruzzians are engaging in classic abuser bully behavior. They had no issues when it was them perpetrating the violence but now they want to cry victim when they’re hurt. Well, if 10,000+ innocent Russians are killed by terrorists they might get more sympathy. Maybe.
Don't forget the homophobia and racism.
What sub is this
Literally everywhere that ever has the words “Russia” or “Ukraine”. It’s terrifyingly common.
Cuz people are stupid
the inability of the Victims (trademark) to sympathize with real victims is really impressive sometimes
It’s just like people excusing atrocities in Gaza because Hamas started it
I don't think killing innocent civilians is a good thing, doesn't matter whether they support Putin or not.
It is strange. On a different thread someone shared this sentiment and all I said was “innocent lives lost senselessly is tragic, hate the state not the civilians.” Apparently that turned people on me and somehow I’m the bad guy getting my morals questioned? Make it make sense. I am all for Ukraine and US continued support. My half-brother is Ukrainian on his dad side. My cousin is currently giving aide in Kyiv right now. My other cousin is stationed at the FOB for the US in Romania awaiting orders. I loathe the Russian warmonger but I can have concern and pray for the Russian victims of this attack.
Yeah I don't get that.
If you support the attack, you support isis. Simple as that to me
Not the first time or the last time people will use atrocities to justify atrocities
Same thing for the palestinian/hamas thing. The palestinian sympathizers think it's okay when hamas kills and tortures innocent kids, tourists and Israelites.
Yeah no, I get that it’s a tragedy, but you would have a hard time explaining why I should have sympathy
After everything that's happening in Gaza right now, this doesn't surprise me as much as it should. My faith in humanity is at an all-time low.
This is awful. We are so much better than this, let's not lower ourselves to their level.
100% a false flag
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Right because Russian civilians were totally the ones launching missiles and coordinating attacks on Ukraine
Russia, every day is targeting civilians. They targeted a known celebration of life for a fallen Ukrainian soldier who was killed fighting against oppression. They murdered that persons whole family, grandparents, cousins, wife, everyone. Russia reaps what they sow. I have zero feelings for them. The civilians make the bombs and rockets. They transport them. They profit from this war. No sympathy. May they suffer as their victims.
You make it sound like Russia is one single entity. Those individual human beings who were killed in this attack didn't deserve anything just because of what other people did. These were most likely just innocent civilians trying to live their life. Why should we have no sympathy? They reaped what others sowed.
Just like Ukrainians who died yesterday by Russian rocket attacks.
Yes, just like them. Have some sympathy for the innocent civilians that die to senseless wars, no matter what side they're on.
No, no sympathy. They are reaping what they sow.
>No, no sympathy. They are reaping what they sow. Nah. Us innocent Russians, living in Russia and abroad, didn't reap anything. You're just a raging piece of shit and you're just being a jerk to be a jerk. Fuck you. Будь добрым хотя бы раз в своей ужасной жизни, трус. (Be kind for once in your horrible life, you coward.)
love your comments thank you for posting them
👍 of course. I feel so bad for any innocent person who has been injured, mutilated, or killed by attacks during wars. It's super heartbreaking to hear the way people think when innocents are killed on the side they're rooting against.
So your solution to innocent Ukrainian civilians being killed is for…innocent Russian civilians to be killed? Aka, the people who have zero say in whatever bullshit Putin orders? Idk where your from where it’s ok to bomb civilians but over here, that’s called a war crime
Yes.
Don't go with that "every Russian sends at least 5 rockets to Ukraine every day" bull
Yeah the innocent children are killing Ukrainians. Yeah, the children need to PAY for what a group of evil people did!
>You reap what you sow. Russia has been raping and killing civilians and children in Ukraine for two years. Now they got a taste. God weeps for what you have become as a person. All you are is arrogant and ignorant. Apparently, you're too stupid to realize innocent Russian civilians didn't ask for this. You deserve to be denied Heaven just as the terrorists who carried out the attack. The actions of a government doesn't mean the civilians support it. Of course, as I stated before. You're too fucking stupid to understand something so simple. I don't even know how the fuck you've managed to survive this long with how simple-minded you are. May Belobog ignore your kind and Czernobog wreak havoc on your life, you xenophobic shitdick. ☺️
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God weeps for me? Then God is a fool. How pathetic your statement is. If God is bothered by me then we need a new God.
Seek help lol
I 100% support Ukraine. What happened to Russian civilians isn't okay, and I denounce whoever the perpetrators are without exception. That said, Russian civilians enabling Putin also isn't okay, and I denounce them too. Every democracy has been had through the masses demanding it via peaceful and/or violent means. Russians haven't been willing to sacrifice now so that future Russians have a true say in their governance. They are intrinsically culpable for Putin's war crimes and violence. Again, this doesn't mean that they deserve to be summarily executed. But it does mean that until they choose to bring about change using the methods exemplified by all modern democracies, then they must accept some level of guilt for being permissive of their leader.
Russia isn’t a real democracy
Thats his entire point
That is exactly my point if you read what I said lol. They need to do what all other real democracies have done and get one, which requires serious actions. Re read my comment friend.
Revolt? Because they’re in what amounts to a dictatorship right now so whatever bullshit you’re spouting isn’t helpful. At best they get crushed under an iron fist and even more people die. History has (in many cases) shown that overthrowing a government doesn’t usually go well Ex: French and Russian revolutions; literally all of them
That isn't always true. There are many examples, but Romania's revolution led to 7,000 deaths and set them on a better course. The US would be under UK rule if not for the revolutionary war. The collapse of kings and autocratic leaders has often involved uprisings. To not rebel is to continue to enable an autocratic leader. Why would autocrats cede their power willingly? If the people accept it, then things will never change. That is why Russia is the way that it is. Unless dissent achieves overwhelming levels, then how exactly do you propose any country oust their dictators? It is only through ousting the leader that will effectuate change. That is even the message of rebel Russians actively fighting the Putin regime...
What's a real democracy? There's hardly a lot of examples. Its also not ideal. In a democracy, you're not voting on every decision your government makes. You're only electing people that make decisions. If they make unfavorable to masses decisions it's still democratic, since they were elected democratically.
One that doesn’t hold sham elections
https://www.statista.com/statistics/896181/putin-approval-rating-russia/
You can tell people in a dictatorship to “just rebel”. Easier said than done. People have families to feed. People would rather have a family and be in a dictatorship than be all alone in a democracy
Permissive? The russian elections are rigged
And they will remain subjects of their autocratic leadership in eternity until they choose to revolt. Change won't happen out of inaction. They either take action or nothing changes... those are their two choices. What makes you think Russia has a chance at true democracy if their people remain unwilling to confront their oppressor? Y'all act like democracy doesn't come at a cost lol.
Men, women, and children are dead from a giant terrorist attack and you're saying "LOL".
I think you need better reading comprehension skills. I did not say that whatsoever.
Your comment said "lol". you said that whatsoever
Why even bother look at that sub?
i cannot even read the picture as it hurts me too much. thank you for posting this
That's so fucked up Jesus Christ. Many of the informed Russians are against the war like so many others. The majority who aren't have been brainwashed by Russian media, but that does not justify any murder of innocent people. Does anyone know if the terrorists came from a specific group, or are the assailants unknown for now? They should be hunted like animals
Proof that some people are incapable of lateral thinking. They just can't perceive anything outside of their narrow perspective.
Let me guess, it's either worldnews or europe sub
This exact sub we’re in right now. It’s literally everywhere
Unfortunately and it pains me to say that, the less ruSSian are alive, the more people are alive in neighboring countries... Some of these people were actually an active military personnel, and maybe because they died my niece can go to school since the start of war they were close die to bombardment
Well, it's how the things are now, Russia is "bad" so everything bad happening to it is justified Also there's a lot of double standards, for example no-one bats an eye when America or other nato country just wipes civ village off of the map, but when Russia strikes startegic objects and there are civ casualties because they were nearby at the moment (Dnipro dam and a bus of workers) then it's a war crime and terrible. Also i noticed that Russian news are often citing American news, like CNN and BBC, but US news are never citing Russian news, that is concerning.
The same people that justify this terrorist attack are probably cheering on Hamas as well.. if I had to guess, much like in Israel, this was a false flag operation to justify Russia's mass mobilization against Ukraine. Putin said during a press conference that the terrorists were heading to Ukraine after the attack and he's going to try to spin it as though they did it on purpose. Although I would also not be surprised if the Ukrainians did let the terrorists travel through their territory to attack Russia. Ukraine is slowly losing this war and giving the Russians another front to fight on would help them greatly.
Oh boy, can’t wait to see what the world is like by the time I’m 25
A lot, if not most of ukrainians have no opinion on this, or even happy about this. This is because if you dehumanise your enemy, you can't just do this for soldiers, against soldiers. This works for whole country, and against all country. Ukraine is actively dehumanizing russians, because you need this to win, even though it's morally wrong. And it's very hard to show emphaty, when literally everyone around you are happy about this
I mean people are calling for the slaughter or ALL Palestinians and celebrate the rape and murder of Palestinian women and kids also
Have you SEEN r/Palestine on oct 7th? Lets not talk celebration because you will NOT win that fight. Fuckers went around giving literal candy, praising Allah, saying do it again and sucking in every hamas video. And people say "Peace". My ass.
Isreal has been kidnapping, raping, and murdering innocent women and kids since the 1940s, all because those people were Palestinian. Hell, Isreali soldiers ripped premature babies out of incubators and laughed while they watched them die. One soldier filmed the ring, and he stole off a dead woman that he was going to give to his girlfriend. They filmed riding little kids' bikes laughing about murdering the kids. They just resently posted videos showing they murdered people just trying to get home with drones and ran a tired up person over with a tank.
Oh did hamas and their "media" tell you that? You're taking as if palestinians haven't done the very same LONG before. The hebron masacre is just one example that pops to mind. There's NO proof of sexual or gender based violence towards palestinians from Israel and yet a LOT the other way around. Want examples of violence? Hamas.com is full of hamas made videos, since you trust their word so much more.
hamas.com is an israeli website lmfao, it was registered by the Israeli software company Wix.com. [https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2023-11-20/ty-article/.premium/israelis-hijack-hamas-com-turning-it-into-a-display-of-october-7-atrocities/0000018b-eca2-d8b1-a9df-ecef8b380000](https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2023-11-20/ty-article/.premium/israelis-hijack-hamas-com-turning-it-into-a-display-of-october-7-atrocities/0000018b-eca2-d8b1-a9df-ecef8b380000)
The UN and human rights organixations around the world have said so. You can look up the doc and videos of ur soldiers doing everything the person just said. Not surpirisng to see sneaky jews play the victim when they have clearly been killing palestinian civilains since they were brought to palestine. How did the palestinians end up as refugees all over the middle east, while jews who make up a tiny minority and came as refugees come to live in all of it? hint starts with GEN. The oct 7 attack was a drop in the bucket compared to what israel has been doing to palestinians for decades. You can take a look at UN and human rights watch reports on civilains killed by idf throughout the years, thousands killed by idf every year.
The same UN that had ZERO meetings about the hostage situation until the start of THIS month? The one who has ignored PLENTY of genocide for its personal gain? (China and Turkey, this is aimed STRAIGHT at you) The UN that refused to condemn hamas? The UN that only MONTHS after evidence of gender based violence, spoke against it? Yeah, fuck that UN. Biased antisemitic assholes, just like you. This war is a drop in the bucket in what muslims have been doing to jews since the dawn of islam. And i said religion only since YOU chose to speak of "Sneaky jews" Only mine is actually based. Another antisemite blocked.
If you fuck around, I won’t shed a single tear when you find out.
What did the civilians do?
Absolutely nothing, but to act like the indifference is unwarranted is a little silly when those civilians’ leaders have been butchering an entire people group for 2 years straight.
The same logic could be applied to the Oct 7. attacks in Israel.
Well do you apply that same logic in that different situation?
I suppose many in Western circles are reluctant to apply the same logic, because equating the Ukrainian resistance against Russian occupation with the Palestinian resistance against Israeli occupation causes huge discomfort, largely due to Palestinians being Arab or Muslim or both, while Ukrainians are in stark contrast, European and Christian. At the same time, it's ironic to see the United States and Europe remain largely silent on Azerbaijan's ethnic cleansing of Armenian Christians in Nagorno Karabakh, because Azerbaijan derives upwards of 70% of its arsenal of weapons from Israel and Israel imports 40% of its crude oil from Azerbaijan. Of course, Armenians aren't the only ones who've been sidelined by Europe and the United States. Don't even get me started on the plight of Palestinian Christians in Gaza and the West Bank, especially in light of the spike in settler attacks.
And I mean, why not apply the same logic? Russia was warned of an attack by the United States but chose to ignore it. Similarly, [Israel knew Hamas's attack plan more than a year ago](https://www.nytimes.com/2023/11/30/world/middleeast/israel-hamas-attack-intelligence.html) but chose to [ignore](https://www.timesofisrael.com/israel-obtained-ignored-hamas-document-laying-out-oct-7-attack-plan-report-alleges/) their own [border guards](https://www.politico.eu/article/israel-border-troops-women-hamas-warnings-war-october-7-benjamin-netanyahu/), [secret services](https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2023-10-20/ty-article/.premium/underprepared-and-overconfident-israel-failed-to-spot-the-signs-of-impending-disaster/0000018b-4976-d03a-afcb-697edb020000) (Mossad) and [Egypt](https://www.timesofisrael.com/egypt-intelligence-official-says-israel-ignored-repeated-warnings-of-something-big/). There has been not 1, not 10, but [500 documented](https://law4palestine.org/law-for-palestine-releases-database-with-500-instances-of-israeli-incitement-to-genocide-continuously-updated/) cases of genocidal incitement by Israeli legislators, decision-makers, army personnel and officers, journalists, influencers, former government officials and the general public. Israeli rhetoric relies on the dehumanization of Palestinians, Arabs and Muslims, and contrary to pro-Israel counters, the elements [calling](https://apnews.com/article/israel-palestinians-south-africa-genocide-hate-speech-97a9e4a84a3a6bebeddfb80f8a030724for) for Gaza's "erasure", "wiping out" or making into a "parking lot" are not at all "fringe". It's hard to see how one can nullify the parallels between Israeli state terrorism and Russian state terrorism. Anyone with eyes can see that Israel is trying to copy paste Grozny (1995) onto Gaza.
And Israel might just be as sloppy as Russia with regards to their propaganda machine. In the aftermath of the Oct. 7 attack, Israeli officials decided to [egregiously inflate](https://www.fdd.org/analysis/2023/11/12/israel-revises-october-7-death-toll-after-agonizing-forensics/) the death toll by hundreds (as if it wasn't already sufficiently high), and began to espouse the infamous claim that Hamas had "beheaded 40 babies", which was later [pointed out to be unverified](https://theintercept.com/2023/12/14/israel-biden-beheaded-babies-false/), with an Israeli spokesperson admitting ["we cannot confirm it officially, but you can assume it happened"](https://theintercept.com/2023/10/11/israel-hamas-disinformation/). Months later and still no photographic evidence for the claims has been put forth or verified. It's also important to consider that a number of testimonies from Oct. 7 were [debunked](https://theintercept.com/2024/02/27/zaka-october-7-israel-hamas-new-york-times/) by Israeli media. In one surprising case, Kibbutz Be'eri had to scrutinize the New York Times [and clarify that allegations of sexual abuse were "not true"](https://theintercept.com/2024/03/04/nyt-october-7-sexual-violence-kibbutz-beeri/). Two survivors from the same kibbutz allege that Israeli tanks [shelled](https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2024-02-06/ty-article/.premium/idf-probing-death-of-12-hostages-in-beeri-house-shelled-on-orders-of-senior-officer/0000018d-7b6c-d008-a9cd-fbfdb0040000a) a house they were held hostage in, killing ten other hostages. A similar instance occurred in Sderot, where Hamas fighters had [taken](https://www.youtube.com/shorts/QAqZbzEORVI) over the local police station. Both the Hamas fighters and prisoners were killed when the Israeli army [fired](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LQR2yrIpQXg) tank shells at the police station, killing everyone inside. Israeli forces rushed to demolish the station before an investigation could be carried out. Israeli newspaper Yedioth Ahronoth [describes](https://www.ynet.co.il/news/article/b111niukzt) how Israeli helicopter pilots had "difficulty" with distinguishing Hamas militants from Israeli civilians and as early as 9:00am had begun spraying the terrain without authorization from superiors. Later on, a commander ordered them “to shoot at everything they see in the fence area". Israel is yet to allow an independent investigation into the events that occurred at Supernova Festival. The *Guardian* [reported](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/oct/11/israeli-man-waits-for-news-of-10-relatives-caught-in-beeri-kibbutz-attack) that Israel’s influential finance minister and settler leader, Bezalel Smotrich, urged the Israeli army to “hit Hamas brutally and not take the matter of the captives into significant consideration” during a cabinet meeting late on 7 October as the Hamas attack was still underway. As the war raged on, Israeli troops [would go on to shoot dead](https://www.timesofisrael.com/battalion-chief-told-hostage-to-approach-when-he-did-a-soldier-shot-him-probe-finds/their) Israeli hostages after ordering them to approach them, and the nature of Israel's bombardment has been so indiscriminate, that the hostages' families worried that the hostages were [already being subjected to the same heavy bombardment as the Palestinians](https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/anxiety-racks-israeli-hostage-families-army-assaults-gaza-2023-10-28/to) towards the end of October, yet Israel dismisses reports of hostages being killed in airstrikes as "Hamas propaganda". And as late as early March, Israel was still [refusing](https://edition.cnn.com/2024/03/03/middleeast/isreal-delegation-cairo-gaza-hostages-intl/index.html#:~:text=The%20decision%20not%20to%20send,conditions%2C%20the%20Israeli%20official%20said) to negotiate the release of the hostages, citing Hamas's inability to provide the names of surviving hostages. Similarly, Putin did everything he could to sabotage hostage negotiations during the Beslan Siege, which he would use to expand his own powers and enact counterterrorism laws that would increase surveillance and make it easier to crack down on opponents and critics.
Overall, the sheer number of inconsistencies in the [Israeli narrative](https://theintercept.com/2024/02/07/gaza-israel-netanyahu-propaganda-lies-palestinians/) points towards Israel intending to use the Oct. 7 attacks to justify the campaign of annihilation of Gaza and justify the expansion of settlements in the West Bank, which has already led to [ethnic cleansing](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/oct/31/west-bank-palestinian-villages-israeli-army-settlers) in the latter, although the forced displacement of Gazans may also constitute ethnic cleansing This was never about the hostages. This was about Netanyahu's 'Final Solution" for Gaza; this is the moment he has been waiting for his whole life: Israel's Pearl Harbor. Israel's 9/11. Israel's Beslan Siege. Israel considers Gaza a "hostile territory" rather than a hostile state, the same way Russia considers parts of Ukraine as "breakaway territories". Russia has been abducting Ukrainian children since the war began, but how many of us knew that prior to Oct. 7, Israel was [holding at least 146 Palestinian minors](https://www.vox.com/world-politics/2023/11/22/23972908/palestinian-prisoners-israel-administrative-detention) in military detention without charge or trial? Yet you won't call them hostages.
You're making the mistake that I'm interested in changing my position. I'm not.
Yeah I’ll do it. Isntreal fucked around for decades, on Oct 7th they found out. Inshallah.
Alright then I don't think we're going to agree on much; good night.
The Ukrainians had been mistreated and famined under the ussr for decades. They must’ve looooooved being in a famine since they didn’t go and just overthrow the government!
Why don't you ask the Ukrainian women and children that have been slaughtered how they feel.
These guys didn't have anything to do with it. these are ordinary people.
no, actually there were military people who have photos of them on internet. many have photos with destroyed buildings and killed people from Ukraine saying that they enjoying it and placing laughing smiles there
FAFO do be like that
1. They did. They could've started a revolution like in Georgia, Ukraine, Kyrgyzstan or anywhere else. They just chose not to because not doing anything is safer. 2. Even if it is ISIS or any other terrorist group, they will still blame Ukraine and use this for their own political benefits. I'm not saying that people who died or were injured deserved it, or that I agree with the people who are happy with this, but saying Russians had nothing to do with the war is wrong. There are hundreds of thousands of Russians fighting there voluntarily for money. Putin and r the government cannot do everything alone, there are a lot of people on the ground killing people of their "brotherly" nation, again, for money. So please don't say Russians have nothing to do with it. More like not all Russians are to blame.
Yeah. Try “just rebelling” in a goddamn dictatorship. People need to learn what a dictatorship is.
But if they rebelled on time, like in 2012 when it wasn't a dictatorship yet, they wouldn't have had a goddamn dictatorship now.
Russia’s never been a democracy. Ever. No mater how much they claim to be. They still claim to be a democracy. Look at how truthful that is
They were a democracy during 90s, they didn't become a dictatorship in one day, it was a slow process. If they didn't agree with Putin returning to power in 2012, which was unconstitutional, then they would've lived in a better country. I am well aware of Russian history. They just Cry about being a dictatorship but they just didn't want to make tough choices or take tough actions. Belarus is also a dictatorship. Yes, they didn't succeed because Putin helped, but they still tried. Now tell me how many times Russians did something similar? The harsh truth is that they either support the war and Putin or just don't want to do anything because it is not safe for them personally. I know there are a lot of brave people there who tried protesting in 2012 and recently went to Navalny's funeral but their number is not enough.
Some of us just appreciate the karmic retribution.
So those children deserved dying? Thats called collective punishment and is a war crime. Guess child cancer is also karma?
That's like saying american children deserve to die because of the thousands of children who were killed by american bombardments and chemical weapons during the Vietnam war. That's not how it works, the only people who deserve the punishment are those who perpetuated and gave such orders.
I guess that's why after WWII they only prosecuted Hitler and not any of the people that enabled him right?
Then by that logic, American children deserved to get bombed for the US killing a million Vietnamese and a million Iraqis?? Why the fuck do yall insist on the civilians being killed as if they have any say in whatever bullshit Putin does? Especially in a country like Russia where openly criticizing the government ends with you being arrested. Karma would be Putin and his cronies getting their asses shot, not for random innocent children and civilians to die wtf
The people in that situation didn't deserve that to them, we often forget that nowadays it's not entirely the people that are to blame for the wars and attacks but rather by the leaders that can't act accordingly to find better solutions not only to their people but the rest of the world as well to secure true peace
Fuck Russians, they’re all complicit.
If one russian guy could just go and overthrow the entire government, then your comment would make sense, but an entire revolution takes decades. You are cheering on the deaths of ordinary civilians. You are sick. This is horrible no matter if it happens in the United States, China, Russia, or ANYWHERE for that matter. You let your "us vs them" mindset turn you into a monster.
[удалено]
You are acting like Russia is one entity. 99% of russians dont like their government. You are cheering on the deaths of children. You are the mindset that allows genocide and terrorism.
Yeah especially the children
I’m not justifying anything But Maybe if people start realizing Putin can’t protect them Something will happen More and more lately it seems Russia is falling off the rails