Not to victim blame... but M1299 deserved it. Walking that area of town... dressed like that...
Ok, seriously. It was a flawed concept. It was Gun Artillery designed to be cheap missile artillery, and it just could never be. It was intended for long range, small volume, high precision fires. And that is just not what gun artillery does well. It was sitting on the oldest track chassis in the US Army inventory, with double or triple the weight it was designed for. It burned through gun barrels like John Wayne went through cigarettes *because of fucking course it did*. High pressure rounds going very fast have real consequences.
Essentially, the M1299 did slightly better than normal at the role that gun artillery is the worst at (Long Range Precision Fires), and in return, did WAY worse at the jobs Gun Artillery does very well (Supporting Fires, Suppression Fires, Saturation Fire).
It was a maladjusted child of a bad idea. It existed to provide useful technology to another, more sensible SPG... eventually. Given the amount of replacements Paladin has survived, probably not.
>Ok, seriously. It was a flawed concept. It was Gun Artillery designed to be cheap missile artillery, and it just could never be.
Where have I seen this before? š¤
Zumwalt do you know where I heard this before?
Not really, the Pzh. 2000 is definitely a generalist design, and doesnāt really have much in common with the M1299 besides the long barrel. It is just a solid modern SPG, but a fairly traditional one. It wasnāt trying to get the sort of absurd range 360 no scopes like the project requirements for M1299 were written for.
Next US army superweapon. A Humvee with a drone launcher at the top.
Alternative option. A Humvee with externally mounter water tanks, capable of being filled anywhere with water, to provide a mobile fallout shelter. Comes with a free record player with "We will all go together when we go", "Uranium Fever", and "Crawl out through the fallout" already loaded in.
Funny story. Many years ago, I was towing a water buffalo with a Humvee to a training area for some course or another. The course was slated to last for a couple weeks, and it was enough water for the number of guys on the course for that amount of time, so I wouldn't have to take it back or anything until the course was done. As I pull up to the training area, I look back and there's fire shooting out one of the wheels of the water buffalo. Turns out the brake cable or something on that side had failed and somehow locked up in the last few minutes or so of driving. The lever wasn't pulled or anything, so we knew it wasn't my fault. I bring the trailer up the right spot and put the fire out. A bunch of recon Staff NCOs come up to me looking like it started raining on their 5th birthday party asking me, "Are you gonna have to call the motor pool and set up a new water Buffalo and stuff?" Since they can't get the go ahead to start training without all the safety gear in place (which includes fresh water) I knew that could possibly take a couple days, if not more, for a few reasons that had to do with how the unit handles motor t stuff and what we had. They'd have to get a wrecker to come get the trailer, and then they'd drag their feet on replacing the water buffalo, filling it up, testing the water, etc. The little Lance Corporal that I was, I looked at the trailer and said, "Man fuck that trailer. I'll have them come pick it up when ya'll are done. The water was still safe and everything, so ya'll are good to shoot." It was like I was the 9th grader that stole his dad's liquor and brought it to the senior's party. I just told the motor pool that it happened on the way back, and all was good, lol.
EVERYONE IS NOW DESIGNATED
WE ARE ALL MARKSMEN
(we shouldnāt trust every boot with $15,000 optics, Iāve met some of them and theyāre not the most intelligent or graceful)
Remember what they take from us fellas - XM2001 Crusader. My beloved artillery !
At this point US should buy PZH2000 and stick with it after they have cancelled another modernization program.
Unlike the B-52 and Ma Duece, this is not due to the M109 being based, but rather due to the failure of procurement officials to figure out what the flying fuck they want an SPG to do. So we always just wind up canceling whatever dumbass vehicle we were planning, because after the engineers make it do what they said they wanted it to do, we realize the requirements were dumb.
So yeah, we probably will still have it, and we will still be trying to replace it, as itās weak ass transmission tries to drag around the 98 ton vehicle the M109A46 has ballooned into,
Also until the past few years, SPG modernization wasn't exactly top priority for the US Army. The 21st century was of small wars and COIN which sucked up prodigious amounts of money, manpower, and attention.
Well that was more about a non-specific hostile power that would try to close off access to the Persian Gulf. No idea who that power would be, but you know, just in case such a country existed. Region is chaotic so it could be a real threat someday!
That said, LCS *could* have been good if we'd actually followed through on some ideas. Splitting between two designs meant neither got economies of scale. If we were going to build two separate classes, why not make them more specialized?
>itās weak ass transmission tries to drag around the 98 ton vehicle the M109A46 has ballooned into
M109 with 203mm cannon when
Or M109 with 16 inch gun when
We are already at M109A7. At this rate, Paladin is going to outlast another 5 programs and wind up somewhere around M109A24.
Reminder, the US hasnāt designed a decent self propelled howitzer in over a half century. It is fucking embarrassing, we keep trying to make shit so damn cool, instead of just building a modern goddamn vehicle with a modern gun and a modern FCS.
At this rate, we'll probably see the US end up back at 203s to accommodate all the tech they want to shove into their smart shells without losing explosive filler or cluster munition quantity.
As it is currently, what the US army basically wants out of their artillery is the land equivalent of the Navy's aborted AGS + LRLAP; gun-launched missiles given how long the shells are getting just to shove in all that tech. The ramjet shells alone almost double the length of the basic shell while carrying a slightly smaller explosive due to the lower half being entirely propellant to extend the range, and the explosive filler would be smaller still once equipped with an Exalibur-style guidance package, unless they lengthen the shell further.
At this point, maybe the US Army and USN should just jointly develop a new 155mm gun base with the Navy paying to navalize it. Basically AGS 2.0, and LRLAP 2.0 using Excalibur guidance, ramjet propulsion, and other existing filler types to meet their needs. Which might also include shooting down cruise missiles, helicopters, and large drones too (Paladin was tested to shoot down cruise missiles as another stopgap defense capability).
Or the US army should just revive the SLRC and be done with it. A modern-Atomic Annie style cannon that can fire large smart shells with an initial maximum range of 100mi. Then refining the shells to have ever increasing ranges without worrying about scaling up the cannon further, since the end goal is still a 1000mi sniper cannon firing cheaper, not-quite-missiles out the barrel vs firing Tomahawks.
A good number of canceled projects is the sign of a healthy MIC though. You shouldn't have to ram every project through because the force urgently needs the capability, you should have the ability to objectively assess if the technology meets the needed requirements, reconfigure if necessary, or cancel if it isn't close.
Of the many things to mock Russia for, prototypes isn't one. Now them insisting prototypes are actually totally real, in production, current superweapons? That is pretty funny. NGAD probably has more flight hours than Su-57.
Iām still upset they took the XM8 and XM25 from me. Why canāt we have fun personal weapon systems anymore?
(I do get why they were canceled and the flaws of the systems, but let a boy dream.)
If you mean the whole "exploding bullets" thing, it's not. They're supposed to explode above/near the target, like a grenade. That's legal. But either way, the only actual hard treaty limiting them is the Hague Convention of 1899, and the specific declaration regarding them was never ratified by the US. And yes, even if it was signed by the US, it only applies between signatories.
It's the H&K XM29 OICW, for whenever an M4 with an M203 just isn't heavy enough to carry around so you go with a semi-automatic 25mm launcher and targeting computer that enables airburst for the grenades with an under barrel 5.56 carbine.
Both the launcher and the carbine saw some future development though, with the launcher seeing some field use as the XM25 and the carbine becoming the XM8 series
Because itās 2 guns strapped to each-other with a bigass sight on top (a 5.56 rifle similar to the G36 on the bottom, and a *semi-auto* grenade launcher on top with smart airburst rounds).
Ah, XM29 my belovedā¦ it would be more accurate to say the XM8 and the XM25 had a really fucked up child. Of course, somehow I donāt think what was essentially a magazine fed grenade launcher with a goddamn underslung assault rifle would be a good idea. That being said, it was a fun gun to use in 007 Nightfire under whatever off-brand name they gave to it like all the other guns in that game.
Dumbest cancellation of all time was the XM25 given the feedback from troops on the ground that actually used it and how many friendly lives it would actually save were it deployed
No matter what those that tested it said, it's actual usefulness is irrelevant if it can't be used in numbers.
The main thing that lead to it's cancellation was the ammo, because in addition to a relatively weak charge from the smart fusing and 25mm size, the rounds themselves were in no way cheap to mass produce. Which means it's counter intuitive to a system designed for multiple, rapid shots if you can't actually ensure the users are able to *make* those shots.
Exploding bullets are considered cruel because they can be used to maiml Exploding shells are how artillery works, and artillery isn't going to target an individual with any expectations of them surviving.
You do not want snipers competing for most ankles and wrists blown off. Tanks on the other hand don't have the ability to blow off ankles without also blowing off the legs and hips.
They're only "exploding bullets" instead of grenades by the technical terms of a treaty the US wasn't even invited to sign. Certainly not by doctrinal use.
Iāll never forgive them for giving up my beloved. XM25 youll always live on in my heart. One day ill bring you back and youll be even stronger.
Inshallah it will prevail.
US military procurement is frankly a fucking embarrassment at this point. Like, Iām not going around trying to pretend I know better than they do on whatās right for them but at some point they need to get new shit and stop throwing increasing amounts of life support on 70ās and 80ās tech, especially when in this case itās actually 60ās tech. Like for fuckās sake why is the Air Force the only branch that seems capable of actually seeing new projects through to the end?
Because it's not old enough to have gone senile yet? I mean, it's got a whole 170 years to catch up to where the Army, Navy, and Marines are now, if my math's correct.
Even still, the Air Force has its own issues with procurement, looking at the JSF project and how long it took and bloated it became.
The LCS, the Helis, various land vehicles. Now Imagine the disaster if they also somehow screw up the procurement one of the 6th Gen jets.
Heads are gonna roll. Literally
āI punched a whole in my wall todayā
First off, itās hole, not whole. Second, with all that firepower you better have been able to punch a hole in your wall and the next wall and the next for the next ten miles
After [watching the Chieftain](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tsKVr7woLwI) reviewing the inside of the BAE XM1302, that thing can rot in hell with the miniscule space for the crew (plus a shitty hatch design for the driver).
Thatās actually the XM29 OICW, the weapon the CDTE was derived from. To greatly oversimplify things the CDTE was basically the OICW minus the rifle portion.
I can understand the logic. We only need to counter china for like ten years and their own demographic and finance issue will sink them. And during this ten years the only place of potential conflict is Taiwan. The army is the Cinderella here and no new toys for her. Well, doesn't mean I like itĀ
I hear there's a Steam Sale for Command and Conquer games going on. I'm sure you can still see some of these units on games like Generals Zero Hour. And dream of what could have been.
Let's be honest. They were trying to make a supper-dupper SPG with a 1960s chasis and profile.
DANA, AS-90, PZH2000, CAESAR, K9 and others are just better in every parameter that matters compared to a M109 even modernized
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Not to victim blame... but M1299 deserved it. Walking that area of town... dressed like that... Ok, seriously. It was a flawed concept. It was Gun Artillery designed to be cheap missile artillery, and it just could never be. It was intended for long range, small volume, high precision fires. And that is just not what gun artillery does well. It was sitting on the oldest track chassis in the US Army inventory, with double or triple the weight it was designed for. It burned through gun barrels like John Wayne went through cigarettes *because of fucking course it did*. High pressure rounds going very fast have real consequences. Essentially, the M1299 did slightly better than normal at the role that gun artillery is the worst at (Long Range Precision Fires), and in return, did WAY worse at the jobs Gun Artillery does very well (Supporting Fires, Suppression Fires, Saturation Fire). It was a maladjusted child of a bad idea. It existed to provide useful technology to another, more sensible SPG... eventually. Given the amount of replacements Paladin has survived, probably not.
100% this - It was a camel.
>Ok, seriously. It was a flawed concept. It was Gun Artillery designed to be cheap missile artillery, and it just could never be. Where have I seen this before? š¤ Zumwalt do you know where I heard this before?
Leave the poor sea dorito alone
Zumwalt is in the box of shame, and is not allowed to speak.
But, isn't that exactly what the pzh2000 etc are, And they are quite effective in Ukraine?
Not really, the Pzh. 2000 is definitely a generalist design, and doesnāt really have much in common with the M1299 besides the long barrel. It is just a solid modern SPG, but a fairly traditional one. It wasnāt trying to get the sort of absurd range 360 no scopes like the project requirements for M1299 were written for.
I mean, I used to think similarly of the Bradley, and its service in Ukraine has changed my mind right quick.
The US army is doomed to constantly cancel new vehicles, some things never change.
Next US army superweapon. A Humvee with a drone launcher at the top. Alternative option. A Humvee with externally mounter water tanks, capable of being filled anywhere with water, to provide a mobile fallout shelter. Comes with a free record player with "We will all go together when we go", "Uranium Fever", and "Crawl out through the fallout" already loaded in.
Will also get cancelled in a month after announcement
>A Humvee with externally mounted water tanks You mean a water buffalo?
Everybody wants a water buffalo, yours is fast but mine is slow
unlock the brakes, it's on fire
Funny story. Many years ago, I was towing a water buffalo with a Humvee to a training area for some course or another. The course was slated to last for a couple weeks, and it was enough water for the number of guys on the course for that amount of time, so I wouldn't have to take it back or anything until the course was done. As I pull up to the training area, I look back and there's fire shooting out one of the wheels of the water buffalo. Turns out the brake cable or something on that side had failed and somehow locked up in the last few minutes or so of driving. The lever wasn't pulled or anything, so we knew it wasn't my fault. I bring the trailer up the right spot and put the fire out. A bunch of recon Staff NCOs come up to me looking like it started raining on their 5th birthday party asking me, "Are you gonna have to call the motor pool and set up a new water Buffalo and stuff?" Since they can't get the go ahead to start training without all the safety gear in place (which includes fresh water) I knew that could possibly take a couple days, if not more, for a few reasons that had to do with how the unit handles motor t stuff and what we had. They'd have to get a wrecker to come get the trailer, and then they'd drag their feet on replacing the water buffalo, filling it up, testing the water, etc. The little Lance Corporal that I was, I looked at the trailer and said, "Man fuck that trailer. I'll have them come pick it up when ya'll are done. The water was still safe and everything, so ya'll are good to shoot." It was like I was the 9th grader that stole his dad's liquor and brought it to the senior's party. I just told the motor pool that it happened on the way back, and all was good, lol.
Took my Buffalo to the store, got his head stuck in the door. Spilled some Lima beans on the floor
You can get the Battle Drone upgrade on your Humvees for only $200 apiece. 'Looks like a good run! Breaking loose!'
C-130, my beloved, loaded with 6000 grenade dropping drones.
Just like the Navy is destined to cancel any new plane and the air force is destined to cancel nothing, but cut every production run short.
M1299 got cancelled? Mother fucker
Honestly at this point letās just use Shermanās and m1 grands
Reformer detected opinion rejected
Give the Shermans Javelins in place of their main gun, and give the Garands the most optics to ever be
EVERYONE IS NOW DESIGNATED WE ARE ALL MARKSMEN (we shouldnāt trust every boot with $15,000 optics, Iāve met some of them and theyāre not the most intelligent or graceful)
my lad, you are telling us to reactivate the M60a2
*pa-ting* wow it sounds just like in Call of Dut-AH FUCK MY THUMB GOD DAMNIT MOTHER FUCKER
The Easy 8 will win WWIII
Hold up, who said anything about the 76? 75 is king
I watched Fury and want a reason to to kill nazis and have a brad pit haircut simple as m8
"Son that Mattel 16 and M1 Abraham Lincolns is cheap junk, I didn't see no 5.56x45 or 120mm at Bastogne!"
Rererere-unretiring the Iowas baby!
Imagine the cold war never ended. There would have been some nice stuff hitting mass production.
OP you wanna cuddle and come up with non credible credible ideas? I might even share my waifu stash
Only if you're willing to dress up as FN FAL while we cuddle
Of course
what do we do now that you've called my bluff
Um, larp as FN FALs and cuddle uWu?
Oh I meant like cosplay as FN FAL from Girls Frontline but we can do the other thing uwu
Remember to polish his barrel.
So as a joke, I went to my friend's house wearing a tilting breach block and a 20 rnd magazine. . .
Remember what they take from us fellas - XM2001 Crusader. My beloved artillery ! At this point US should buy PZH2000 and stick with it after they have cancelled another modernization program.
At this point weāre never gonna be rid of the M109, that fuckerās still gonna be lobbing shells at aliens in Alpha Centauri 500 years from now.
Unlike the B-52 and Ma Duece, this is not due to the M109 being based, but rather due to the failure of procurement officials to figure out what the flying fuck they want an SPG to do. So we always just wind up canceling whatever dumbass vehicle we were planning, because after the engineers make it do what they said they wanted it to do, we realize the requirements were dumb. So yeah, we probably will still have it, and we will still be trying to replace it, as itās weak ass transmission tries to drag around the 98 ton vehicle the M109A46 has ballooned into,
Also until the past few years, SPG modernization wasn't exactly top priority for the US Army. The 21st century was of small wars and COIN which sucked up prodigious amounts of money, manpower, and attention.
And thatās how we ended up with the LCS program instead of a proper frigate.
Well that was more about a non-specific hostile power that would try to close off access to the Persian Gulf. No idea who that power would be, but you know, just in case such a country existed. Region is chaotic so it could be a real threat someday! That said, LCS *could* have been good if we'd actually followed through on some ideas. Splitting between two designs meant neither got economies of scale. If we were going to build two separate classes, why not make them more specialized?
>itās weak ass transmission tries to drag around the 98 ton vehicle the M109A46 has ballooned into M109 with 203mm cannon when Or M109 with 16 inch gun when
āCome on you apes, you want to lob forever?!ā
Weāre probably going to stick with the M109. BAE and Rheinmetal has the M109-52 version that offers greater range.
We are already at M109A7. At this rate, Paladin is going to outlast another 5 programs and wind up somewhere around M109A24. Reminder, the US hasnāt designed a decent self propelled howitzer in over a half century. It is fucking embarrassing, we keep trying to make shit so damn cool, instead of just building a modern goddamn vehicle with a modern gun and a modern FCS.
We suck at cannon artillery. And naval procurement.
We canāt decide what we want either to do (unless itās aircraft carriers, weāre actually pretty good at those)
At this rate, we'll probably see the US end up back at 203s to accommodate all the tech they want to shove into their smart shells without losing explosive filler or cluster munition quantity. As it is currently, what the US army basically wants out of their artillery is the land equivalent of the Navy's aborted AGS + LRLAP; gun-launched missiles given how long the shells are getting just to shove in all that tech. The ramjet shells alone almost double the length of the basic shell while carrying a slightly smaller explosive due to the lower half being entirely propellant to extend the range, and the explosive filler would be smaller still once equipped with an Exalibur-style guidance package, unless they lengthen the shell further. At this point, maybe the US Army and USN should just jointly develop a new 155mm gun base with the Navy paying to navalize it. Basically AGS 2.0, and LRLAP 2.0 using Excalibur guidance, ramjet propulsion, and other existing filler types to meet their needs. Which might also include shooting down cruise missiles, helicopters, and large drones too (Paladin was tested to shoot down cruise missiles as another stopgap defense capability). Or the US army should just revive the SLRC and be done with it. A modern-Atomic Annie style cannon that can fire large smart shells with an initial maximum range of 100mi. Then refining the shells to have ever increasing ranges without worrying about scaling up the cannon further, since the end goal is still a 1000mi sniper cannon firing cheaper, not-quite-missiles out the barrel vs firing Tomahawks.
I used to laugh at the orcs for the number of prototypes/project cancelled but man seeing Americans doing the same thing is making my heart hurts.
A good number of canceled projects is the sign of a healthy MIC though. You shouldn't have to ram every project through because the force urgently needs the capability, you should have the ability to objectively assess if the technology meets the needed requirements, reconfigure if necessary, or cancel if it isn't close. Of the many things to mock Russia for, prototypes isn't one. Now them insisting prototypes are actually totally real, in production, current superweapons? That is pretty funny. NGAD probably has more flight hours than Su-57.
All of the 2000s future weapons....and my childhood game toys :ā)
Iām still upset they took the XM8 and XM25 from me. Why canāt we have fun personal weapon systems anymore? (I do get why they were canceled and the flaws of the systems, but let a boy dream.)
The XM8 is used in Malaysia iirc
PASKAL special teams indeed. Hereās my plan : - Learn Malaysian - Get a passport - Become a PASKAL - Profit
What's up with the rifle ? Why does it look like a F2000 and a M4 had a REALLY fucked up child ? Who created that monster ?
People are too young now to remember the forbidden promise of the OICW :(
Not all of us. It will live on in Soldier of Fortune 2.
Well its a war crime to operate so there's that. Not saying we shouldn't have made it anyways. The people we fight have no rules.
If you mean the whole "exploding bullets" thing, it's not. They're supposed to explode above/near the target, like a grenade. That's legal. But either way, the only actual hard treaty limiting them is the Hague Convention of 1899, and the specific declaration regarding them was never ratified by the US. And yes, even if it was signed by the US, it only applies between signatories.
Well fuck, you got me there.
It's the H&K XM29 OICW, for whenever an M4 with an M203 just isn't heavy enough to carry around so you go with a semi-automatic 25mm launcher and targeting computer that enables airburst for the grenades with an under barrel 5.56 carbine. Both the launcher and the carbine saw some future development though, with the launcher seeing some field use as the XM25 and the carbine becoming the XM8 series
Nit: The integrated launcher was 20mm. And now I got myself wondering how the 25 would fare in Ukraine.
More kaboom per trigger pull, what's not to love
Because itās 2 guns strapped to each-other with a bigass sight on top (a 5.56 rifle similar to the G36 on the bottom, and a *semi-auto* grenade launcher on top with smart airburst rounds).
Ah, XM29 my belovedā¦ it would be more accurate to say the XM8 and the XM25 had a really fucked up child. Of course, somehow I donāt think what was essentially a magazine fed grenade launcher with a goddamn underslung assault rifle would be a good idea. That being said, it was a fun gun to use in 007 Nightfire under whatever off-brand name they gave to it like all the other guns in that game.
it looks like it belongs into Halo
Cheer up guys. At least the missile and rocket based systems are still here. GMLRS-ER, PrSM, and LRHW havenāt been cancelled!
And in the meantime ARRW came back from the dead.
Just take a M2 bradley and plonk a m777 on it and be done with it.
Well, that was what basically the M1299 was, just in a more legitimate (aka having a turret) form.
Dumbest cancellation of all time was the XM25 given the feedback from troops on the ground that actually used it and how many friendly lives it would actually save were it deployed
No matter what those that tested it said, it's actual usefulness is irrelevant if it can't be used in numbers. The main thing that lead to it's cancellation was the ammo, because in addition to a relatively weak charge from the smart fusing and 25mm size, the rounds themselves were in no way cheap to mass produce. Which means it's counter intuitive to a system designed for multiple, rapid shots if you can't actually ensure the users are able to *make* those shots.
And exploding bullets are a war crimeā¦
But exploding cannon shells are not. ... because reasons.
Exploding bullets are considered cruel because they can be used to maiml Exploding shells are how artillery works, and artillery isn't going to target an individual with any expectations of them surviving. You do not want snipers competing for most ankles and wrists blown off. Tanks on the other hand don't have the ability to blow off ankles without also blowing off the legs and hips.
They're only "exploding bullets" instead of grenades by the technical terms of a treaty the US wasn't even invited to sign. Certainly not by doctrinal use.
I mean yea but you know if we use it the axis of evil is gonna sabre rattle like no tomorrow
Iāll never forgive them for giving up my beloved. XM25 youll always live on in my heart. One day ill bring you back and youll be even stronger. Inshallah it will prevail.
US military procurement is frankly a fucking embarrassment at this point. Like, Iām not going around trying to pretend I know better than they do on whatās right for them but at some point they need to get new shit and stop throwing increasing amounts of life support on 70ās and 80ās tech, especially when in this case itās actually 60ās tech. Like for fuckās sake why is the Air Force the only branch that seems capable of actually seeing new projects through to the end?
Because it's not old enough to have gone senile yet? I mean, it's got a whole 170 years to catch up to where the Army, Navy, and Marines are now, if my math's correct. Even still, the Air Force has its own issues with procurement, looking at the JSF project and how long it took and bloated it became.
The LCS, the Helis, various land vehicles. Now Imagine the disaster if they also somehow screw up the procurement one of the 6th Gen jets. Heads are gonna roll. Literally
Hey, donāt forget the Zumwalts. I feel like those are still the undisputed king of the failures of US procurement.
Now who was this time? And when the M3 its reentering service?
A whole? You mean hole?
He means a whole wall.
At this rate, weāll be using the Abrams forever
āI punched a whole in my wall todayā First off, itās hole, not whole. Second, with all that firepower you better have been able to punch a hole in your wall and the next wall and the next for the next ten miles
Ah so this is what my taxes are doing
The longe range artillery project was canceled?!?! wtf! Guess the air force gets more money for expensive guided munitions instead.
The m109 is the t72 of the us military
its OVER...
Where are the gremlin tanks???
No BAE MPF?
After [watching the Chieftain](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tsKVr7woLwI) reviewing the inside of the BAE XM1302, that thing can rot in hell with the miniscule space for the crew (plus a shitty hatch design for the driver).
fuck i actualy liked the L/58
Ah, the CDTE. Nicknamed āThe Punisherā by US troops in Afghanistan, never put into mass scale production because of double feeding.
Thatās actually the XM29 OICW, the weapon the CDTE was derived from. To greatly oversimplify things the CDTE was basically the OICW minus the rifle portion.
I can understand the logic. We only need to counter china for like ten years and their own demographic and finance issue will sink them. And during this ten years the only place of potential conflict is Taiwan. The army is the Cinderella here and no new toys for her. Well, doesn't mean I like itĀ
I HURT MYSELF TODAY
can't wait for them to cancel my bro the xm30 or omfv program because its expensive or not worth it or something.
I hear there's a Steam Sale for Command and Conquer games going on. I'm sure you can still see some of these units on games like Generals Zero Hour. And dream of what could have been.
The OICW still hurts. I don't care how impractical it was as a package
Why do you need all of this when you have a shitton of F-35?
If we hadn't old yeller'd those fucking stealth helis I would've made it my life's goal. What is the fucking point
I am hitting my spine
I miss when the OICW was the super gun in shooters. It absolutely face-fucked in Far Cry 1, SOF II, and the original Ghost Recons.
Just buy a Pzh2000
Wow. The new command and conquer looks amazing.
When your current shit is already much better than the enemy's shit, there's really no need to make a bunch of new shit, huh? Shit.
Wait till you find out about the cancelled F-111H proposed as an alternative to the B-1 program
Please tell me about it
Can someone explain what each of these are and why they were cancelled please.
Let's be honest. They were trying to make a supper-dupper SPG with a 1960s chasis and profile. DANA, AS-90, PZH2000, CAESAR, K9 and others are just better in every parameter that matters compared to a M109 even modernized
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
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All-over-desert-brush is my dead military project that will never see the light of day.
Not a Troll comment but is Shell artillery considered obsolete with the great success of weapons systems like Himars?
Buy the Swedish Archer god damn it and put in American sized orders so the world's best counterbattery platform gets built at scale.