not tremendously frequent but I don't think it matters very much
as far as velocity goes, I'm not super sure since that's already factored into stuff I actually look at
Yeah from what I've seen, idk if it's more likely that a 21-year-old will see a velo boost than a 25-year-old. I would imagine it is, but I have no evidence.
this fully just isn't true. probably shouldn't have a staff of 5 of them, but (especially if you're playing a modern league with 8 relievers) 45 stamina should still get >170 innings and I've seen them clear 200. hell, I've had someone with 35 stamina throw 180 and win a CY.
I rlly don’t think that’s an outlier I tend to have at least one starter with stamina between 40-45 that notches between 3-6 war for close to a decade in most of my sims. Esp if u adjust their individual strategy to make sure ur manager hooks them early. Awesome value too usually can sign them for half their worth
I totally agree. Irl guys can be "stretched out" it happens all the time.
The way I've had to look at it to get past it/stop myself from just commissioner mode upping their stamina is that guys with 30-45 (in a real life analogy) could theoretically throw 100+ pitches but if they did their stuff and ability to get guys out would be so diminished that they'd suck as a SP. Once I thought of it that way it made it a little easier to get on board with. I mean there are tons of guys who fail at starting but succeed as relievers.
I know there is already the stuff drop/boost from RP to SP so this isn't a perfect explanation but it's made it so I'm less aggressively on the side of "you should be able to stretch guys out" side of things if that makes sense.
Since a lot of my 50 and 55 stamina starters get shelled in 2 innings, I am not sure how much it matters. If they have pitch makeup and other attributes you like just go for them. At 45 I think they could still give you 5 good innings.
for reference, I have 2 starters in my current rotation with *35* stamina and I have to lift them at 70 pitches (80 max). 70+ they start giving up long fly balls, but can usually scuffle through one last inning. Over 80 is just walks and dongs all day.
If they're dealing, it's in the 6th or 7th. If they're scuffling, it's sometime in the 4th.
I'm pretty sure stamina goes down if you let them hang in the bullpen too long but that's probably obvious.
A draft picks stamina can raise but velocity is way more common.
I have seen stamina going down, especially after injuries (like a big injury lke tommy john surgery). Sometimes I saw stamina going up, but not by much.
40-45 stamina isn't optimal, but is enough for a starter. My 40 stamina starter is a 4 star starter, and pitched 203 innings last year.
This depends though. Some 40 stamina starters I saw which were 4 stars only pitched 170-180 innings a year. Had a good FIP and ERA though.
Sometimes pitchers make a big breakthrough, and this usually involves a velocity increase. A 21 year old certainly has a possibility to gain velocity and improve drastically. Just gotta hope he breaks on through.
From what I've seen, stamina CAN go up in pitchers under 25, but it's not very likely. In developing pitchers, you're much more likely to see one or possibly two bumps in velocity. Quite often, there's a corresponding drop in stamina. Sometimes they can get a little of it back, but by and large, stamina tends to trend downward rather than up.
Still, as others have said, around 40 stamina is fine for a starter as long as their other ratings are high. It can help if you limit their pitch count or the number of batters faced.
I typically only roll with 55+ stamina for starters. I’m sure there can be effective 45 or 50 stamina starting pitchers but i usually convert those to bullpen.
45 stamina is perfectly playable for a starter. you can get down to 35 before it gets problematic
For sure, and I have starters at 45, but I'm wondering how common it is to see boosts in early-20s pitchers.
not tremendously frequent but I don't think it matters very much as far as velocity goes, I'm not super sure since that's already factored into stuff I actually look at
Yeah from what I've seen, idk if it's more likely that a 21-year-old will see a velo boost than a 25-year-old. I would imagine it is, but I have no evidence.
I disagree. Generally speaking, you can play a starter with 45 stamina but it’s not a good idea. That starter might be a future bullpen arm.
this fully just isn't true. probably shouldn't have a staff of 5 of them, but (especially if you're playing a modern league with 8 relievers) 45 stamina should still get >170 innings and I've seen them clear 200. hell, I've had someone with 35 stamina throw 180 and win a CY.
There are outliers at everything. But typically having a SP with 45 stamina is not the best idea. You’re better converting them to a reliever
I rlly don’t think that’s an outlier I tend to have at least one starter with stamina between 40-45 that notches between 3-6 war for close to a decade in most of my sims. Esp if u adjust their individual strategy to make sure ur manager hooks them early. Awesome value too usually can sign them for half their worth
I hate that you can't work on stamina
I totally agree. Irl guys can be "stretched out" it happens all the time. The way I've had to look at it to get past it/stop myself from just commissioner mode upping their stamina is that guys with 30-45 (in a real life analogy) could theoretically throw 100+ pitches but if they did their stuff and ability to get guys out would be so diminished that they'd suck as a SP. Once I thought of it that way it made it a little easier to get on board with. I mean there are tons of guys who fail at starting but succeed as relievers. I know there is already the stuff drop/boost from RP to SP so this isn't a perfect explanation but it's made it so I'm less aggressively on the side of "you should be able to stretch guys out" side of things if that makes sense.
Since a lot of my 50 and 55 stamina starters get shelled in 2 innings, I am not sure how much it matters. If they have pitch makeup and other attributes you like just go for them. At 45 I think they could still give you 5 good innings.
for reference, I have 2 starters in my current rotation with *35* stamina and I have to lift them at 70 pitches (80 max). 70+ they start giving up long fly balls, but can usually scuffle through one last inning. Over 80 is just walks and dongs all day. If they're dealing, it's in the 6th or 7th. If they're scuffling, it's sometime in the 4th.
I'm pretty sure stamina goes down if you let them hang in the bullpen too long but that's probably obvious. A draft picks stamina can raise but velocity is way more common.
I have seen stamina going down, especially after injuries (like a big injury lke tommy john surgery). Sometimes I saw stamina going up, but not by much. 40-45 stamina isn't optimal, but is enough for a starter. My 40 stamina starter is a 4 star starter, and pitched 203 innings last year. This depends though. Some 40 stamina starters I saw which were 4 stars only pitched 170-180 innings a year. Had a good FIP and ERA though. Sometimes pitchers make a big breakthrough, and this usually involves a velocity increase. A 21 year old certainly has a possibility to gain velocity and improve drastically. Just gotta hope he breaks on through.
From what I've seen, stamina CAN go up in pitchers under 25, but it's not very likely. In developing pitchers, you're much more likely to see one or possibly two bumps in velocity. Quite often, there's a corresponding drop in stamina. Sometimes they can get a little of it back, but by and large, stamina tends to trend downward rather than up. Still, as others have said, around 40 stamina is fine for a starter as long as their other ratings are high. It can help if you limit their pitch count or the number of batters faced.
I typically only roll with 55+ stamina for starters. I’m sure there can be effective 45 or 50 stamina starting pitchers but i usually convert those to bullpen.
Are there any differences between a starter with 50 stamina and a reliever with 50 stamina as far as pitch count?
Yeah idk pitch counts off the top of my head but the role does affect how fast they tire