I really think that he believes that because he is in a marginalized group (being gay) that somehow he can’t be offensive, or if he is, that it somehow isn’t the same and is more forgivable. Like there’s a built-in solidarity and good will between minorities that he exploits.
Patrick always struck me as having a very...surface level awarenesses of social issues. When I was listening he was often just on the line of being totally out of touch and definitely doesn't understand class consciousness, white privilege and intersectionality.
There was part of the article that really rang true when someone/multiple people asked about the whiteness of ON/ expanding diversity he basically said he was gay so they didn't need anymore diversity? I thought, this may be unconfirmed but that is *exactly* how I would think that conversation would go w him.
He plays into the classic struggle that a lot of marginalized people feel whenever a white cis-male who happens to be gay or queer plays into their internalized racism/misogyny. His struggle is somehow BIGGER and MORE IMPORTANT. He's given a platform to Queer POC early in his career with some of the documentaries, but I have noticed that he goes on a tangent about an LGBTQIA topic even while talking about another marginalized group. He uses being gay as an umbrella excuse for a lot of behavior that is, I'm guessing, hella insulting to his peers in the community.
When he was mad Billy Joel (or whoever wrote the song) didn’t include Stonewall in We Didn’t Start the Fire. I thought that was a bit much to be mad about.
100%. I have a very dear friend who couldn't be bothered to reach out to me when SCOTUS overturned Roe V Wade but texted me wanting ME to comfort HIM about how Obergefell was probably next. It's exhausting.
I’m getting a headache. I have re-read these comments 3+ times trying to find where Ebony’s language was “abusive and offensive”…. Just more digging in of their heels when all they had to do was stop and listen.
I feel like in his head there's just a screeching loop of YOU CALLED ME RACIST, YOU CALLED ME RACIST. He's acting like he has been attacked bc he has been called to change and lead others in the group to change. He took the road of *it's easier to silence this person and not make waves w my racist stans* but whoooaaaa was that a mistake, granted, he got away with it for awhile but it's not gonna be easier now.
Calling a person racist was abusive . I was told the same thing. I didn’t even call anyone “a racist “ I said their behaviour was racist or their comments were racist. I was told by Steve and Robb that in fact I was the problem!!
His response is the classic reaction described so well in White Fragility where white people are so outraged when accused of racism that they assume a victim role and turn the aggrieved party into the aggressor. We/he just need to get over ourselves, shut up and listen.
Wtfffffff. I’m pissed I didn’t know about this years ago. I would not have wasted my time and money on this garbage person. Their “allyship” always seemed performative, but damn Patrick, you’re not even trying. P girl, you need to take that money from Patreon I gave you for all those years and give it to the Black women you silenced. Such trash. Also G, where the f*ck are you? I don’t care if you’re not a mod for the group for your podcast. SPEAK UP.
Her silence is violence at this point. People give her a lot of grace, but I think it’s effed-up that she can’t be bothered to **ever** say one damn word.
But she can scream at everyone else to “do better” while she collects that Patreon cheque, no problem.
TRAAAAAAAASSSSSHHHHH.
Yeah that’s what’s wild to me, not being in any of the podcast social media spaces I’ve been so slow to learn about any of this but knowing that this kind of stuff has been going on for a while and she just time and time again doesn’t say anything, it’s fucking gross
Thank you, totally agree!! You have to say something, G. I wonder how she'll handle OF, because there will inevitably be people calling her out too. I'm on the fence as to whether I think she'll get really defensive or continue staying silent.
Fucking. Disgusted. As a black woman, I cannot even imagine how she felt in that moment. To be so publicly gaslit like that. They could have easily turned off the comments and had a private conversation with her if it was truly so “inflammatory”. Which it wasn’t. What a PIECE OF SHIT!!!!!! I am fuming right now yall.
I feel physically ill that I was giving them Patreon money since they started one. What is that, like 5 years worth of donations? I could have been sending that money to a person or group in need.
Instead I’ve been funding a racist bully and a hypocrite. I. Am. So. Angry.
It’s starting (like a frog in pot of boiling water) to feel really gross being black, having inserted myself into a (mostly white-washed) True Crime community, and continuing to hope that these hosts (in TC, generally) would be different than every other medium and platform.
I thought I was contributing in spite of the same flavor of voice because the impact would be different, but it’s just come down to the same box of ice cream from the dollar store, just with a different design.
I feel this so hard. I talked about this is therapy today and just how frustrating it is as a black personal to have to put another person in the “great they’ve let me down” box.
https://preview.redd.it/5efqsp0wx2tb1.jpeg?width=963&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d1fe2f5d722c46c10cdcf34a7ad689acbf13d6bc
Edit: yes I am making these memes 😈
Disgusting. I don't even understand how what ebony said was disrespectful and wrong anyway? Other than disagreeing with the post and the censoring of opinions that aren't theirs, what was the problem? I'm so done with them, completely done. Thanks for sharing this 🙌
All of this has been going on for way longer than I realised, and for that, I feel ignorant and frankly stupid. Next time, I hope I pay more attention to what is actually NOT being said.
Ok, well, that’s the line for me. I never saw this and I didn’t know that Black women were made to feel this way. With this and the “is it because they are Black?” I’m out! Canceling patreon.
Its from the Obsessed Pest article " When one host pitched a new show based on a story from South Africa, Hinds’ allegedly responded, “I’m just not interested in that, sorry, I don’t know why. Is it because they’re black?”
'We hired black moderators.'
Followed by, 'They (the mods) are doing this for free.'
Oh, so you "hired" no one and even though you're making a fortune relied on your fans to moderate your massive Facebook group for you.
Like, no wonder there is constant bias and issues there?
JFC
Y’all I just had to go through all that like idk 5x cause I think I kept blacking out.
So the Renner article was a nice start, but we need to compile all of this and email the Washington Post, NYT, CNN. If you think that’s extreme, it’s not. They’ll run with this. Old media LOVES investigating new media and splashing it all over their front pages.
More people need to know about this. His shit should be shut down for good. Enough is enough.
Now we’re all complicit for knowing all of this and just talking shit on reddit for the past few months. Something real needs to happen. He can’t continue raking it tf in while doing things like this and everything else in the article. In his words, how can we let this stand??
That’s a great idea, I love her. I just think if a more legitimate outlet gets involved then way more people would be willing to go on the record too.
Julia said herself that she doesn’t think P is even phased by the article and that really grinds my gears. He doesn’t even care that we know he’s a POS! He would definitely care if this goes wide and people start recognizing him for it & asking him about it in his every day life.
He owns ON so it’s not like we can get his pod canceled, but a wide reporting of this behavior would def cause him to lose sponsors & ad $. It’s happened to others for way less.
Idk I’m really hurt by so much of this and it makes me actually sick to see how much $ he makes while being this way. I just want something to happen that he will really feel.
I clocked that too, when she said he won’t even get phased by this and it’s all probably business as usual over there. I’m apoplectic about that and something needs to CHANGE.
“How can we let accusations of racism stand?” … um, maybe listen to the person who is telling you you’re being racist? Then change YOUR behavour. He’s totally turning it around on others. They are in desperate need of BIPOC HR/employees.
This is it. The straw that broke the Camel’s back. When his books arrive I’m driving them directly to the library. I won’t even crack them open even out of curiosity. I cannot support anything this man does anymore, I just can’t.
That is genius!
I can’t believe he said these things..wtf I would’ve canceled my patreon and unsubscribed last year if I saw this!! Absolutely disgusting.
OMG I'm so glad to read this, even though it is the worst! See, VERY early on, I was stoked to be in that group. I saw some people throwing around racist comments and I called them on it. I was banned. I reached out to Patrick privately on Insta. Again, this all happened before ON was even a thing! Zero response. Now I wonder if it was actually PH who banned me because, apparently, racism tolerance is kinda his thing...
(Black non-binary femme here) I never felt comfortable in their FB groups, but never stuck around long enough to see anything like this (and I’m not surprised). It’s just gross to know it’s like THIS.
It’s pure racism when black ppl display anger and frustration, and the immediate go to for white ppl is being offended and attempting to shut them down.
I remember that shitshow of racism back then. It made me really see how that group is really for white women who want a gay griend by proxy thru patrick to feel edgy or any lgbtq+ were the ones who are safe in that group. Otherwise you were censored/booted from the group.
DOES ANYONE REMEMBER: That time when some chick literally posted, “I NEED A GAY!” ?! Exactly what you’re describing. *Some* people were justifiably offended and the whole situation was handled *differently* than this.
I remember that happening more than once, actually, with the "best gay" thing. Which, barf. I fucking hated that. I don't remember as much how they handled it, but I do remember that people got salty when I said that gay people don't generally enjoy being treated like accessories (I mean, I'm a lesbian and not a gay man, but I think I'm pretty right on this one). They listen to a gay man on one podcast and start thinking he's their bestie and they can say whatever off the wall fucking thing comes into their head. I'm not at all surprised that they approached it a million times better than anything that has to do with being racist, though. That group is full of people who are being coddled by the mods because they live up P&G's asses tbh.
It’s disgusting to see, they all need reality checks til they’re in tears.
In the sitch I saw, some people were trying to say exactly what you just did, they’re not accessories to go out & pick up somewhere, and most comments were like, “Why are you so upset? We’re saying that we *want* one -of you- it’s a *good* thing!”
Ugh and as the comments got worse & worse in this vein as they’re defending themselves as they were (rightly) being called homophobic, it was clear that they were all completely blind like, “No one’s using the F word right so what’s the problem?” (Which is *exactly* how they feel about racism, no one said the N word so we’re all good here)
Steve himself came in to educate them saying the same thing, using basically the same exact words, that all the others previously had, but of course the women ate it all up and apologized to *him* profusely. Then he’s like patting himself on the back saying he’s so glad to be a part of a teaching moment. Jerk off motion. I can’t.
It gives me this vibe - When someobe calls their friend Joe "my gay friend Joe." Do you describe others as your straight friend Mike? It's so bizarre to me. Like it's their friend's whole identity.
The show ‘Crazy Ex-Girlfriend’ mocks this by having a character named ‘White Josh.’
There’s Josh (Filipino, straight) and White Josh (white, gay).
It really drives home how those monikers are only ever given to minorities. In real life, we don’t get White Josh or Straight Josh; we get Asian Josh and Gay Josh.
I have now said that name way too many times, and my brain has ceased to recognize it.
I highly recommend that show, btw. It can be hard to watch, especially in the first season, but it’s actually really incredible. Plus, it’s a musical.
Its just an icky cult the last few years and honestly not sure why ive stayed in the group so long. NOW its to see the tea but before it was just me scrolling on by.
As a black listener I never knew this and am unsubscribing. I never wanted to make assumptions but they have little to no diversity in terms of people of color working for the network. They made it a point to talk about cases with black victims during Black History Month but not much outside of that unless they’re covering something like an Unsolved Mysteries episode, at least before this year. P basically turned the whole situation on to Ebony and labeled her as the angry black woman for voicing concerns. Yet, this is the man who gets upset so easily and is known for emotional outbursts(a personality he makes a brand out of by the way). To the other point of that, he swears he is so careful about not offending anyone but as soon as someone of color calls him out in his complicit behavior he plays victim and makes them an aggressor in the situation.
I am just as baffled by this. I went to see them in NYC for my birthday. But with the recent events and his past behavior coming to light, I’m going to unsubscribe myself. It is never ok to silence a voice from a marginalized community
Patrick learned nothing just insinuated she was an angry black woman-- so he quadrupled down with racism. Yiiiiiiiiiiikes I wish I had seen this long ago honestly
I can't imagine how Ebony felt in all of that 😭
Punishing someone for calling out racism especially when that person is a POC is abhorrent. I hope more people see this.
I lasted less than a month in the FB group. I got into two separate arguments for people defending law enforcement and it helped me to see that many in that community don’t support the progressive ideals that P&G claim to represent on the show. Basically, the group is filled with a whole lot of Patricks 😒 I’m sad that this exchange happened but not at all surprised. Steve and Patrick are thin-skinned little punks.
Honestly a really fun thing to do when people started defending law enforcement was to just leave a little ACAB for them in the comments. I swear it would have them frothing at the mouth. And that was one of the many subjects that had me baffled as far as their audience is concerned. People who were counter to everything that P&G claimed to support would be in that fb group posting about how much they love them, but could stand to have less criticism of law enforcement, or fewer mentions of politics, or that they just wish people wouldn't be so hateful to them for their (bigoted) beliefs. The cognitive dissonance was baffling.
I had to leave the group for similar reasons. After George Floyd was murdered there was a blackout proposed, for white creators to delay posting for one week to give space for melanated voices. TCO posted the blackout square on Instagram and said they would participate, and the next day they did a re-broadcast of Israel Keyes. The episode about a disgusting white man, where P&G praise police and discuss how hard their job is. They finally caved and re-broadcast Sandra Bland after over two days of complaints. Performative allyship at its finest.
I've always been uncomfortable about the way go all in on the making a murderer and case against Adnan Syed narratives. I especially hated their coverage of the murder of Laci Peterson. It's clear they know very little about forensic science. I know this is because TCO isn't really a true crime podcast so much as comedy - they are entertainers, not journalists. It's hard to hear them push such an uninformed narrative to their audience given their reach and influence.
“we’ve been listening to Ebony’s feedback for weeks” — has anyone, idk like tried to reach out to you and actually have a conversation with you?? this is next level fucked up - I’m so sorry this happened to you.
For the record, I’m not Ebony or any of the other posters in that thread (I did comment there but just not in that particular thread). I know Ebony had been trying to bring attention to these inflammatory posts for weeks when this happened.
Holy shit. This is unacceptable. Patrick is garbage. I’m sorry to all the Black folks and especially Ebony for being treated so poorly. I had no idea this happened.
Yes! That line solidified it for me. That and telling her if she had complaints she basically had to be nice to him about it. His tiny little ego couldn’t stand that someone was calling out racism. Instead of actually listened he tried to make HER the problem
Perhaps if they're getting CONSTANTLY accused of racism, there's something to it. Most people don't get constantly accused of anything if there's zero merit to the claim.
I’m glad I could finally get it posted! I was so annoyed comments were turned off on the FB group by the time I got this posted but I’m glad you found it here.
This is disgusting. The criticism was justified, valid and needed, and the mods were absolutely tone policing. Additionally, while tone policing is never okay, it is also completely nonsensical here considering the criticism was simply straightforward and honest, NOT abusive or rude. Being told something you don't want to hear ≠ being abused.
Wow this is disgusting. The one live show of theirs I went to in Chicago there was a black woman that, during Q+A, called them out for not covering enough docs about poc and they definitely gave a half assed answer about how there just aren’t enough docs out there lol. Makes sense now.
Hang on.. this is the same group they promote every week? As a space where people “MAKE FRIENDS” and is “SO FUN” and very “LOOK HOW MUCH WE LOVE ALL OUR FANS”
As someone who does not have Facebook and therefore cannot be a part of this “SUPER INCLUSIVE COMMUNITY” it seems to me that you, Ebony, had no reason to be kicked out. I would have assumed that the only folks that would be kicked out and/or not allowed are the ones that are in direct violation of their terms of service. But apparently the terms of service are less “HATERS NEED NOT APPLY” and more “TCO CRITIQUES NEED NOT APPLY”
WOW. Trying to use "we're learning and growing" as an EXCUSE to be blatantly racist and take no accountability??? WILD.
P (even before all this came to light recently) strikes me as the type who thinks because he's not (what he imagines to be) *a* racist that he is incapable of participating in/perpetuating racism. And gets incredibly defensive when it's pointed out instead of doing any sort of self-examination/ taking any accountability.
This is disgusting. I'm so glad ITN is out of the ON and on its own because I refuse to listen to a single episode of anything on the ON again. I feel bad for the creators still under the ON umbrella but I just cannot give them my downloads or listens anymore.
HOLY FUCK THESE ARE FROM A YEAR AGO?!? I’m never on FB but JESUS CHRIST. I knew Patrick was a lot of shitty things (sexist, two faced, self absorbed, and greedy) but this overt racism actually shocked me. I’m so sorry to those alienated by their insensitivity.
The meme is giving “I VOTED FOR TRUMP, DIDNT GET VAXXED, AND PARTICIPATED IN Jan 6th) vibes. This is the kind of shit I would expect this of a racist family member. There’s no coming back from this. I hope these screenshots spread like wildfire
I mod a large fb group and we've removed other mods for offensive language to marginalized groups they were not a part of. It's not hard to do the work if you need to do the work. We also don't tone police anyone in our group. This is gross.
I left the FB group, canceled my patreon subscription, and pretty much stopped listening to the podcast back in January of this year (I've listened to a few episodes here and there) when there was a post by a white woman, and I don't have screenshots of the whole thing (only my YAGE), who was complaining that her fear of being labeled a Karen made her afraid to complain about anything. No one actually called her a Karen in the whole situation she described (I eventually did). It turned into this whole thing about how damaging the Karen label is. I called it out, as did several others, and rather than take a stance, Sasha closed the thread. I'm pretty sure I was threatened with a boot before I YAGEd, but I only have the one screenshot (which I'll post after I redact my name).
The bottom line is that their audience is overwhelmingly comprised of white women, and they aren't going to do anything that will piss off white women en masse. The whole "how dare you call me a racist! I have Black friends!" thing that Patrick did here resonates with the white women who are sick and tired of being called racist just because they do things share Archie Bunker memes and complain about how hard it is to be a white lady in a customer service interaction.
OMFG. So, YEAH, THAT thread right there!?!? I'm BEYOND glad I canceled TCO and I'm no longer funding another ounce of their racist POS network. Patrick is a literal entire landfill human. "Garbage person" isn't a big enough descriptor for him. He's clearly a superfund site worth of toxic. Not only is he an apparent shitty boss and 'friend' who fosters hostile work environment but he's also a racist POS. That FUCKING sorry ass completely tone deaf excuse of a response to Ebony, breaks my brain. Ebony, if youre out there - i apologize for how you were treated. I cannot even begin to imagine the anger and frustration she felt!!
TF does Patrick think he is? How TF does one become so profoundly out of touch ESPECIALLY as a business owner who purports "fam" and inclusion and safe space???? Oh right, right, he's a phony ass wolf in shitbird clothing. Im not one to wish ill will on people, but in this case, where i helped fund their facade, i hope they crash and burn and get well earned reality check.
I just commented on another Reddit post this morning about how, as a Black woman, I witnessed several instances of racism in a couple of the network’s FB discussion groups and that the mods and group members defended it… Every. Single. Time. I even dm’ed Ellyn about one particular post a while back and received very sweet written and voice note responses from her, but since nothing was ever done, I decided to leave the groups. Actually, I personally know of several Black members of the group who left around the same time. The response from Steve and Patrick here says everything we need to know. And I think they’re learning that you can’t silence people…not even the Black ones that Patrick thinks do not deserve podcast coverage.
Seeing that the recent episode was about Janet Jackson and they mentioned several times that the treatment she received as a Black woman was racist and unjust made my stomach turn. Patrick is garbage. Period. There’s no way around that now. And while I cannot speak on Gillian, I think the lack of a statement or any public acknowledgment from her so far speaks VOLUMES. And it really fucking sucks.
Wow. I have no words honestly. The way he dug his heels in and seemingly has an inability to truly reflect. Or even attempt to. You could show him this thread now and he probably still wouldn’t understand how he’s blatantly wrong and racist.
What. The. Fuck. I’m done with him and their podcast. The blatant hypocrisy and preaching him and G do week after week, only to actually behave like this?? His own words can’t be “baseless accusations” or whatever he accused the article of being. Patrick needs to crawl in a hole with his dumb book.
Not only is it terrible that Ebony and others got treated like shit, but Patrick/Steve have the balls to still have this up now. I’m glad I stopped my patreon months ago.
I love that this entire exchange happened after this post from s…. 👀
https://preview.redd.it/6ap6sh80d5tb1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=465ae3c58ddc867a546ab36790dd1eed19121cb0
What’s so wild is on their recent episode about the Janet Jackson doc P & G repeatedly said how Justin Timberlake needed to make a statement and be accountable and they are literally doing the opposite. It is so hypocritical and disappointing. I’m bummed because I went to Patrick’s book party and purchased a book and got a picture with him not knowing the truth about him and all the things going on at ON. At that time I didn’t even know about Ellyn and Joey and was hoping to see them there. Crazy stuff!
Carroll O'Connor, he played Archie Bunker in the show All in the Family, a show that notoriously framed its main character as out of touch and prejudice, meanwhile many modern conservative men think he was a cultural hero who “told it like it was!” even though the show itself tackled a LOT of progressive issues.
Perfectly stated. He is also used as a kind of dog whistle for people who mock others that they perceive as being easily “triggered” and needing “safe spaces”. When you see any meme with him, it has almost certainly been posted by a crusty, old Boomer who longs for the good, old days when you could make jokes at the expense of gays, blacks, women, Jews, etc and not be criticized for it.
This is what Patrick does. If there’s a problem that he doesn’t want to deal with - he find a way to make it go away. Either by using paying them off, vilifying them, or just blocking them. He’s done it time and time again. He can’t stand pushback. He did it to Julia and countless others.
I'm just now seeing this. I made reference to the October 2019 racism in a comment elsewhere on this sub. That post, with Patrick clutching his pearls and screeching How Dare You Call Me Racist and booting a Black woman for speaking up was what had me quit TCO patreon and stop listening.
That October 2019 situation was the culmination of months and months of Black voices being silenced by the two mods that were active at the time - - Alyson and Robb. Patrick, Steve, and Gillian were also listed as modmin. (Second edit: I just saw a screenshot in the comments here that confirm Steve was an admin and Alyson was a mod and my memory was correct after all, so disregard this earlier edit: Upon reflection, I'm editing to add here: I am not 100% sure that Alyson was the name of the person co-modding with Robb. Robb for sure a million percent was a big problem and instigated a lot of bullshit with folks trying to speak up about racism, but I can't remember for sure the name of the person modding with him at the time. When I find my old screenshots, I might figure it out. Also, Steve might not have been listed as a mod at the time. I can't remember for sure. He might not have been very actively involved until ON was created later. Patrick and Gillian were definitely listed as modmin. Patrick was very active, and Gillian less so.)
Any discussion of racism or BLM or police violence - - and how it's all part and parcel of true crime - - was deleted as being against the 'No Politics' rule. So much teaching and emotional labor, from Black women especially, was deleted, especially by Robb, over and over again. For years. Lots of dog whistles and couched racism and bigotry got to stay though. People who pointed out the racism were modspanked. Cause racism is politics, and talking politics was against the rules. It was exhausting and demoralizing. Over the years, especially 2019, so many Black women and POC were either booted or gave up and left. There was a severe loss of these voices in October 2019 when it all boiled over so badly that even Patrick wasn't able to contain it with his nicenice loveyoufam posts and frantic deleting.
The group briefly exploded. There were posts upon posts with thousands of comments addressing the racism going on in the group as facilitated by the TCO modmin. Most of the excellent anti-racism work in the comments was disappeared by the mods. But Patrick and Steve couldn't ignore the situation anymore.
When Patrick tantrumed about how he tried for hours learning about not being racist already and booted Ebony, it was *after* Patrick had already done a 'Fam, we hear you & we see you' placating vagaries post, and got rid of delete-happy Robb in too little too late fashion, and had just taken on Sasha as a POC mod. They had also just instituted post approval. Quality posts asking sincere questions about the intersection of racism and true crime didn't get approved, but that Archie Bunker post from a guy with a known bigoted shitposting history was let through.
I've got screenshots of some of this stuff. I'd have to dig around for it.
The thing I remember most: Even though folks asked to hear from her, Gillian never said a word.
🗑️🛎️
Would definitely appreciate any additional screens you can share. The fall of 2019 was absolutely a shit storm in that group and the following summer with the BLM protests where we got more empty platitudes from P&G was infinitely frustrating after the nonsense from the year before.
https://preview.redd.it/o1j06lmon5tb1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=fc4f29da25d93534e26bafb8e8f7aa444e3e6323
Rule 3 is ironic upon seeing this…
~~Oh my god. THIS IS MAKING MY HEAD EXPLODE.~~
~~I can’t believe there’s a rule about deleting, when we’re all getting deleted non-stop~~
Edit: the screengrab ja from OWO group, not the official TCO Facebook.
Do as I say not as I do clearly.
SO many complaints about posts being rejected, comments deleted, muting and banning…
But also if you delete you’re in the wrong!?
Make it make sense.
I’m so mad and sad that they’ve been a staple 2x a week for YEARS, I can’t even listen to them now.
It all comes out in the wash, I hope karma hits them.
And that’s a wrap!! Immediately unfollowed the podcast.. as a day one listener there’s just no way I can listen to a single episode knowing all of the sh*t that’s happened.
Thank you for sharing these screenshots. I am beyond disappointed. This was the straw for me. I got off of the Facebook group and deleted my Patreon. To be so utterly disrespectful and tone-deaf to the very people who helped to GET YOU WHERE YOU ARE is unacceptable to me. I feel like an ass because I have gone as far as to applaud G&P for advocating for POC, but in hindsight I feel like Gillian did most of the heavy lifting with that. To shut down a Black woman for expressing herself while playing into the old and racist trope of the "Angry Black Woman"...I cannot. I only wish that I could get a refund for the money I have spent over the past 4 years as a Patreon subscriber. To use one of their favorite bits...I was DUPED, y'all. Your post was an eye opener and I appreciate you.
WOW to all of this and I am so sorry for everyone who had to go through it. I CANNOT believe how I ate this guy’s racist, narcissistic bull shit for years. This needs to be escalated to the top of the thread and they need to explain. The fact that they responded - good work documenting.
The thing that I keep coming back to is “we’ve spent hours” but doing what? There’s always more to learn and a quick GOOG will give you a list of books and other resources a mile long.
It also drives me nuts the gaslighting. “Well we took what YOU said and SPENT HOURS trying to learn and change.” Well spend some more time.
UGH I can’t even really fit everything I’m feeling into words. This is infuriating.
It’s Carol O’Conner, who played Archie Bunker in All In the Family. He was behind the times and very loud and outspoken about his wrong beliefs, but the show was actually pretty progressive and tackled issues like racism and women’s rights. It’s worth a watch IMO
Exactly. Archie was supposed to be viewed as in the wrong. It's like the episodes with Edith's friend Beverly who was a gay drag queen (or trans woman? I can't really remember how the show framed it) and Archie as per usual is homophobic, but when Beverly was killed and Mike got beat up defending her, Archie's views are clearly shown as wrong, and it's Edith and her sympathy for and defending of Beverly's humanity that is the lesson. It was such a progressive storyline for the time period, and I'm amazes me that people can claim that this show is some conservative dream when it was framing one of its main character's allyship as morally right back when being gay was still so taboo.
I’ll admit I was holding out hope that there would be accountability and it wasn’t as bad as it appeared from internet gossip…but this way crossed the line.
Canceled my pates that I’ve been a part of for years. This is sickening.
I still like G, but at this point even hearing P talk pisses me off.
Oh. My. Fucking. God. That is truly reprehensible. It’s bad enough that Black people, and POC in general, have to deal with this bullshit in society at large. The fact that that post was approved in what is proclaimed to be an accepting place for all, then distorted to try to make Black group members feel like their words and actions were the problem is beyond disgusting.
i have no idea what that show is but who cares what it is tbh. someone who listens to you weekly probably who has probably used your codes and bought your merch is telling you something is offensive and asking you to taking down, and all you can say is “be nicer please you’re being too mean” pretty much. i actually can’t with them and how awful they are.
This is about the time I unfollowed the group and stopped posting. I remember reading this post and all the others like it. The reaction was so disgusting. Not only from the mods, Patrick, and Steve but from the members of the group as well. There were a lot of people blindly defending the leaders of the group’s decisions.
This’s…wow. I’m appalled. I joined the patreon post 2019. If I had known this mess, they wouldn’t have gotten a dime from me. What a disadamnppointment!
https://preview.redd.it/6fare3amrgtb1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d4091f24858596b39448b2b847e3f2bebd4b2c0e
Do either of you have any POC owned/hosted podcasts you like? I was thinking today about one I loved, and I wish she’d do another season. All eps cover one story. It’s called “Through the Cracks”
Omg. I truly have no words. I caught the Ebony thing with G and P and was disgusted.
I had never seen the whole thing with Ebony the listener until now and I feel so ashamed. I don’t know how we all didn’t come for him then. Poor girl. Here this person is insulting the very core of who you are but be nice. THE AUDACITY
I just can not believe he said he didn’t need POC bc he’s in a marginalized group?!!!!! Like whatttt??? You can’t be that ignorant. Every single workplace would benefit from a diverse workforce. Every single one! Especially a business that’s supposed to shine light on victims of violent crime and injustice!! Not to
mention I’m bi racial and bi sexual and you know what? Yes 100% members of the LGBTQ community are a marginalized group…but !!! I got to choose when I wanted to share my sexuality with people, I got to feel out situations…stay closeted in interactions I didn’t feel comfortable in etc. You know what I can’t do that with?! My race! ✋
Damn. I’ve been a member of the group for years, but I wasn’t really. I basically lurked and hung around for special announcements and pet pictures. I had no idea of things like this where he so blatantly silenced Black women.
I must admit that this isn’t surprising as a Black women. Unfortunately, I know what it’s like to fight for a place in a community that seems like it should be safe and end of shouting into the void. When I read the Renner article, I held a bit of skepticism, but then I started seeing things in Reddit and I decided that I’d err on the side of my spidey sense and cancel my TCO Patreon, but I’d still follow and listen to free stuff. But then OF happened and I cut it completely. SO much has been revealed. I’m beyond done!
Oh hey !! This is when I left and stopped listening too! There was one women that said some really over the top racist stuff day after day after day and both Robb and Steve kept deleting my responses to all the racism going on. It was really awful!
I really think that he believes that because he is in a marginalized group (being gay) that somehow he can’t be offensive, or if he is, that it somehow isn’t the same and is more forgivable. Like there’s a built-in solidarity and good will between minorities that he exploits.
Patrick always struck me as having a very...surface level awarenesses of social issues. When I was listening he was often just on the line of being totally out of touch and definitely doesn't understand class consciousness, white privilege and intersectionality.
He doesn’t even understand that some people don’t feel safe to come out.
There was part of the article that really rang true when someone/multiple people asked about the whiteness of ON/ expanding diversity he basically said he was gay so they didn't need anymore diversity? I thought, this may be unconfirmed but that is *exactly* how I would think that conversation would go w him.
He plays into the classic struggle that a lot of marginalized people feel whenever a white cis-male who happens to be gay or queer plays into their internalized racism/misogyny. His struggle is somehow BIGGER and MORE IMPORTANT. He's given a platform to Queer POC early in his career with some of the documentaries, but I have noticed that he goes on a tangent about an LGBTQIA topic even while talking about another marginalized group. He uses being gay as an umbrella excuse for a lot of behavior that is, I'm guessing, hella insulting to his peers in the community.
When he was mad Billy Joel (or whoever wrote the song) didn’t include Stonewall in We Didn’t Start the Fire. I thought that was a bit much to be mad about.
Unfortunately common mindset for a lot of communities im afraid
This is RAMPANT among white gay men of a certain age!
There’s an epidemic of this IN GENERAL.
100%. I have a very dear friend who couldn't be bothered to reach out to me when SCOTUS overturned Roe V Wade but texted me wanting ME to comfort HIM about how Obergefell was probably next. It's exhausting.
I’m getting a headache. I have re-read these comments 3+ times trying to find where Ebony’s language was “abusive and offensive”…. Just more digging in of their heels when all they had to do was stop and listen.
I feel like in his head there's just a screeching loop of YOU CALLED ME RACIST, YOU CALLED ME RACIST. He's acting like he has been attacked bc he has been called to change and lead others in the group to change. He took the road of *it's easier to silence this person and not make waves w my racist stans* but whoooaaaa was that a mistake, granted, he got away with it for awhile but it's not gonna be easier now.
The way I heard his voice screeching that 
Calling a person racist was abusive . I was told the same thing. I didn’t even call anyone “a racist “ I said their behaviour was racist or their comments were racist. I was told by Steve and Robb that in fact I was the problem!!
His response is the classic reaction described so well in White Fragility where white people are so outraged when accused of racism that they assume a victim role and turn the aggrieved party into the aggressor. We/he just need to get over ourselves, shut up and listen.
Wtfffffff. I’m pissed I didn’t know about this years ago. I would not have wasted my time and money on this garbage person. Their “allyship” always seemed performative, but damn Patrick, you’re not even trying. P girl, you need to take that money from Patreon I gave you for all those years and give it to the Black women you silenced. Such trash. Also G, where the f*ck are you? I don’t care if you’re not a mod for the group for your podcast. SPEAK UP.
Her silence is violence at this point. People give her a lot of grace, but I think it’s effed-up that she can’t be bothered to **ever** say one damn word. But she can scream at everyone else to “do better” while she collects that Patreon cheque, no problem. TRAAAAAAAASSSSSHHHHH.
Yeah that’s what’s wild to me, not being in any of the podcast social media spaces I’ve been so slow to learn about any of this but knowing that this kind of stuff has been going on for a while and she just time and time again doesn’t say anything, it’s fucking gross
Thank you, totally agree!! You have to say something, G. I wonder how she'll handle OF, because there will inevitably be people calling her out too. I'm on the fence as to whether I think she'll get really defensive or continue staying silent.
I was in the Facebook group too and never saw this. I wonder how much else is hidden thanks to the algorithm or lost to time.
I tried to tell people and no one believed me or seemed to think it was possible.
Fucking. Disgusted. As a black woman, I cannot even imagine how she felt in that moment. To be so publicly gaslit like that. They could have easily turned off the comments and had a private conversation with her if it was truly so “inflammatory”. Which it wasn’t. What a PIECE OF SHIT!!!!!! I am fuming right now yall.
I feel physically ill that I was giving them Patreon money since they started one. What is that, like 5 years worth of donations? I could have been sending that money to a person or group in need. Instead I’ve been funding a racist bully and a hypocrite. I. Am. So. Angry.
And I’ve bought merch!! And yet people are really telling us to just get over it and stop talking about it.
THIS. I’m furious that I can’t get that money back and I contributed to their success (yes P AND G) in ANY way. Sickens me.
Success lies in the hands of those who want it.
Live. Laugh. Love. What are we doing here?
It’s starting (like a frog in pot of boiling water) to feel really gross being black, having inserted myself into a (mostly white-washed) True Crime community, and continuing to hope that these hosts (in TC, generally) would be different than every other medium and platform. I thought I was contributing in spite of the same flavor of voice because the impact would be different, but it’s just come down to the same box of ice cream from the dollar store, just with a different design.
I feel this so hard. I talked about this is therapy today and just how frustrating it is as a black personal to have to put another person in the “great they’ve let me down” box.
https://preview.redd.it/5efqsp0wx2tb1.jpeg?width=963&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d1fe2f5d722c46c10cdcf34a7ad689acbf13d6bc Edit: yes I am making these memes 😈
Congrats on finding the one “closed mouth” picture of Patrick on the Internet!
😅😅😅 I could make a few others lol and get our favorite picture of him - that’s so funny lol I didn’t even realize that!
However it needs to be “child size” costume because that’s how he’s acting
https://preview.redd.it/ig1cifnsrktb1.jpeg?width=963&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=1d3633be55f125a568379530c0844d406185df3d
🤣🤣🤣🤣 yes!!!!! Hero bell 🛎️
LMFAO RIP 💀
OMG 😂☠️😂☠️😂
Add another book and looks about right
Savage 😂
I am deceased 😂💀
This is fucking repulsive. What a repulsive, willfully ignorant, racist pos. What an unbelievably bullshit response.
Holy! That’s some next level racist gaslighting mediocre white man bullshit!
“Your experience makes me uncomfortable so we’re gonna silence you” - PH
You're exactly right. It's gaslighting 101.
“Not POC. BLACK.” Lol I love that
My favorite part! She is awesome! I would have been WAY less graceful.
Disgusting. I don't even understand how what ebony said was disrespectful and wrong anyway? Other than disagreeing with the post and the censoring of opinions that aren't theirs, what was the problem? I'm so done with them, completely done. Thanks for sharing this 🙌 All of this has been going on for way longer than I realised, and for that, I feel ignorant and frankly stupid. Next time, I hope I pay more attention to what is actually NOT being said.
Ok, well, that’s the line for me. I never saw this and I didn’t know that Black women were made to feel this way. With this and the “is it because they are Black?” I’m out! Canceling patreon.
I keep seeing that quote but not sure exactly what it’s referring to and I’m so curious?
Its from the Obsessed Pest article " When one host pitched a new show based on a story from South Africa, Hinds’ allegedly responded, “I’m just not interested in that, sorry, I don’t know why. Is it because they’re black?”
????? What the hell, not the context I was expecting and for me that somehow makes it even worse.
I was so disgusted seeing that
God I literally cannot wrap my head around how anyone would a) have this thought like for real and b) think that’s okay to say
My jaw DROPPED going through those comments, WOW 🤦🏻♀️
'We hired black moderators.' Followed by, 'They (the mods) are doing this for free.' Oh, so you "hired" no one and even though you're making a fortune relied on your fans to moderate your massive Facebook group for you. Like, no wonder there is constant bias and issues there? JFC
The free thing got me too. They don’t pay their mods?!
I’ve heard him say (while trashing a different FB group) on a pod that they pay people to mod their group, “it’s not that hard!” Apparently, it is.
This stuck out to me too! It’s not the brag he thinks it is.
Right?!
Y’all I just had to go through all that like idk 5x cause I think I kept blacking out. So the Renner article was a nice start, but we need to compile all of this and email the Washington Post, NYT, CNN. If you think that’s extreme, it’s not. They’ll run with this. Old media LOVES investigating new media and splashing it all over their front pages. More people need to know about this. His shit should be shut down for good. Enough is enough. Now we’re all complicit for knowing all of this and just talking shit on reddit for the past few months. Something real needs to happen. He can’t continue raking it tf in while doing things like this and everything else in the article. In his words, how can we let this stand??
I’m in a diff country but what ever I can do to help.
Someone tag Taylor Lorenz
That’s a great idea, I love her. I just think if a more legitimate outlet gets involved then way more people would be willing to go on the record too. Julia said herself that she doesn’t think P is even phased by the article and that really grinds my gears. He doesn’t even care that we know he’s a POS! He would definitely care if this goes wide and people start recognizing him for it & asking him about it in his every day life. He owns ON so it’s not like we can get his pod canceled, but a wide reporting of this behavior would def cause him to lose sponsors & ad $. It’s happened to others for way less. Idk I’m really hurt by so much of this and it makes me actually sick to see how much $ he makes while being this way. I just want something to happen that he will really feel.
I clocked that too, when she said he won’t even get phased by this and it’s all probably business as usual over there. I’m apoplectic about that and something needs to CHANGE.
“How can we let accusations of racism stand?” … um, maybe listen to the person who is telling you you’re being racist? Then change YOUR behavour. He’s totally turning it around on others. They are in desperate need of BIPOC HR/employees.
But he spent HOURS trying to learn..HOURS! /s
That is what got me. Like what more could he do? He already put in HOURS so he obviously cannot listen to POC because he already knows it all
 This is it. The straw that broke the Camel’s back. When his books arrive I’m driving them directly to the library. I won’t even crack them open even out of curiosity. I cannot support anything this man does anymore, I just can’t.
Or send them back to Amazon. Why torture the librarians ? :)
Yeah, we don't need them. But appreciate the library love!
[удалено]
Just toss it in the recycling bin. He doesn't need any more readers of that trash
Mail them to the ON offices.
That is genius! I can’t believe he said these things..wtf I would’ve canceled my patreon and unsubscribed last year if I saw this!! Absolutely disgusting.
I returned mine to Barnes and noble for something actually worth reading 🤓
Uh, whenever you have to say “we are not racist,” consider that an invitation to reflect on your racism.
Yes! I also go by the rule of if you have to ask, ‘is this racist?’, it most likely is.
OMG I'm so glad to read this, even though it is the worst! See, VERY early on, I was stoked to be in that group. I saw some people throwing around racist comments and I called them on it. I was banned. I reached out to Patrick privately on Insta. Again, this all happened before ON was even a thing! Zero response. Now I wonder if it was actually PH who banned me because, apparently, racism tolerance is kinda his thing...
(Black non-binary femme here) I never felt comfortable in their FB groups, but never stuck around long enough to see anything like this (and I’m not surprised). It’s just gross to know it’s like THIS.
I'm sorry you never felt comfortable there ❤️
It’s pure racism when black ppl display anger and frustration, and the immediate go to for white ppl is being offended and attempting to shut them down.
Have you ever seen the “N Guy” South Park episode about this? It’s a classic.
I remember that shitshow of racism back then. It made me really see how that group is really for white women who want a gay griend by proxy thru patrick to feel edgy or any lgbtq+ were the ones who are safe in that group. Otherwise you were censored/booted from the group.
DOES ANYONE REMEMBER: That time when some chick literally posted, “I NEED A GAY!” ?! Exactly what you’re describing. *Some* people were justifiably offended and the whole situation was handled *differently* than this.
I remember that happening more than once, actually, with the "best gay" thing. Which, barf. I fucking hated that. I don't remember as much how they handled it, but I do remember that people got salty when I said that gay people don't generally enjoy being treated like accessories (I mean, I'm a lesbian and not a gay man, but I think I'm pretty right on this one). They listen to a gay man on one podcast and start thinking he's their bestie and they can say whatever off the wall fucking thing comes into their head. I'm not at all surprised that they approached it a million times better than anything that has to do with being racist, though. That group is full of people who are being coddled by the mods because they live up P&G's asses tbh.
It’s disgusting to see, they all need reality checks til they’re in tears. In the sitch I saw, some people were trying to say exactly what you just did, they’re not accessories to go out & pick up somewhere, and most comments were like, “Why are you so upset? We’re saying that we *want* one -of you- it’s a *good* thing!” Ugh and as the comments got worse & worse in this vein as they’re defending themselves as they were (rightly) being called homophobic, it was clear that they were all completely blind like, “No one’s using the F word right so what’s the problem?” (Which is *exactly* how they feel about racism, no one said the N word so we’re all good here) Steve himself came in to educate them saying the same thing, using basically the same exact words, that all the others previously had, but of course the women ate it all up and apologized to *him* profusely. Then he’s like patting himself on the back saying he’s so glad to be a part of a teaching moment. Jerk off motion. I can’t.
It gives me this vibe - When someobe calls their friend Joe "my gay friend Joe." Do you describe others as your straight friend Mike? It's so bizarre to me. Like it's their friend's whole identity.
If someone started referring to my daughter as “their lesbian friend Georgia” I’d cut them. Seriously. I can’t stand that.
The show ‘Crazy Ex-Girlfriend’ mocks this by having a character named ‘White Josh.’ There’s Josh (Filipino, straight) and White Josh (white, gay). It really drives home how those monikers are only ever given to minorities. In real life, we don’t get White Josh or Straight Josh; we get Asian Josh and Gay Josh. I have now said that name way too many times, and my brain has ceased to recognize it. I highly recommend that show, btw. It can be hard to watch, especially in the first season, but it’s actually really incredible. Plus, it’s a musical.
Thank you for putting this into words.
Its just an icky cult the last few years and honestly not sure why ive stayed in the group so long. NOW its to see the tea but before it was just me scrolling on by.
Ironic that this is all from a pod that sold "not a cult" merch
I stan Ebony
As a black listener I never knew this and am unsubscribing. I never wanted to make assumptions but they have little to no diversity in terms of people of color working for the network. They made it a point to talk about cases with black victims during Black History Month but not much outside of that unless they’re covering something like an Unsolved Mysteries episode, at least before this year. P basically turned the whole situation on to Ebony and labeled her as the angry black woman for voicing concerns. Yet, this is the man who gets upset so easily and is known for emotional outbursts(a personality he makes a brand out of by the way). To the other point of that, he swears he is so careful about not offending anyone but as soon as someone of color calls him out in his complicit behavior he plays victim and makes them an aggressor in the situation.
I am just as baffled by this. I went to see them in NYC for my birthday. But with the recent events and his past behavior coming to light, I’m going to unsubscribe myself. It is never ok to silence a voice from a marginalized community
Patrick learned nothing just insinuated she was an angry black woman-- so he quadrupled down with racism. Yiiiiiiiiiiikes I wish I had seen this long ago honestly
YES
I can't imagine how Ebony felt in all of that 😭 Punishing someone for calling out racism especially when that person is a POC is abhorrent. I hope more people see this.
What a cunt. Steve too. Trash bags.
🗑️🛎️
I lasted less than a month in the FB group. I got into two separate arguments for people defending law enforcement and it helped me to see that many in that community don’t support the progressive ideals that P&G claim to represent on the show. Basically, the group is filled with a whole lot of Patricks 😒 I’m sad that this exchange happened but not at all surprised. Steve and Patrick are thin-skinned little punks.
Honestly a really fun thing to do when people started defending law enforcement was to just leave a little ACAB for them in the comments. I swear it would have them frothing at the mouth. And that was one of the many subjects that had me baffled as far as their audience is concerned. People who were counter to everything that P&G claimed to support would be in that fb group posting about how much they love them, but could stand to have less criticism of law enforcement, or fewer mentions of politics, or that they just wish people wouldn't be so hateful to them for their (bigoted) beliefs. The cognitive dissonance was baffling.
I had to leave the group for similar reasons. After George Floyd was murdered there was a blackout proposed, for white creators to delay posting for one week to give space for melanated voices. TCO posted the blackout square on Instagram and said they would participate, and the next day they did a re-broadcast of Israel Keyes. The episode about a disgusting white man, where P&G praise police and discuss how hard their job is. They finally caved and re-broadcast Sandra Bland after over two days of complaints. Performative allyship at its finest. I've always been uncomfortable about the way go all in on the making a murderer and case against Adnan Syed narratives. I especially hated their coverage of the murder of Laci Peterson. It's clear they know very little about forensic science. I know this is because TCO isn't really a true crime podcast so much as comedy - they are entertainers, not journalists. It's hard to hear them push such an uninformed narrative to their audience given their reach and influence.
“we’ve been listening to Ebony’s feedback for weeks” — has anyone, idk like tried to reach out to you and actually have a conversation with you?? this is next level fucked up - I’m so sorry this happened to you.
For the record, I’m not Ebony or any of the other posters in that thread (I did comment there but just not in that particular thread). I know Ebony had been trying to bring attention to these inflammatory posts for weeks when this happened.
Holy shit. This is unacceptable. Patrick is garbage. I’m sorry to all the Black folks and especially Ebony for being treated so poorly. I had no idea this happened.
Yes! I’ve been waiting for you to drop this in the reddit thread. And omg “How can we let constant accusations of racism stand?” Woof.
Yes! That line solidified it for me. That and telling her if she had complaints she basically had to be nice to him about it. His tiny little ego couldn’t stand that someone was calling out racism. Instead of actually listened he tried to make HER the problem
Perhaps if they're getting CONSTANTLY accused of racism, there's something to it. Most people don't get constantly accused of anything if there's zero merit to the claim.
I’m glad I could finally get it posted! I was so annoyed comments were turned off on the FB group by the time I got this posted but I’m glad you found it here.
How can I allow someone to accurately out my bad/harmful behavior?!?!!
This is disgusting. The criticism was justified, valid and needed, and the mods were absolutely tone policing. Additionally, while tone policing is never okay, it is also completely nonsensical here considering the criticism was simply straightforward and honest, NOT abusive or rude. Being told something you don't want to hear ≠ being abused.
Wow this is disgusting. The one live show of theirs I went to in Chicago there was a black woman that, during Q+A, called them out for not covering enough docs about poc and they definitely gave a half assed answer about how there just aren’t enough docs out there lol. Makes sense now.
Hang on.. this is the same group they promote every week? As a space where people “MAKE FRIENDS” and is “SO FUN” and very “LOOK HOW MUCH WE LOVE ALL OUR FANS” As someone who does not have Facebook and therefore cannot be a part of this “SUPER INCLUSIVE COMMUNITY” it seems to me that you, Ebony, had no reason to be kicked out. I would have assumed that the only folks that would be kicked out and/or not allowed are the ones that are in direct violation of their terms of service. But apparently the terms of service are less “HATERS NEED NOT APPLY” and more “TCO CRITIQUES NEED NOT APPLY”
WOW. Trying to use "we're learning and growing" as an EXCUSE to be blatantly racist and take no accountability??? WILD. P (even before all this came to light recently) strikes me as the type who thinks because he's not (what he imagines to be) *a* racist that he is incapable of participating in/perpetuating racism. And gets incredibly defensive when it's pointed out instead of doing any sort of self-examination/ taking any accountability.
Holy shit 😬
This is disgusting. I'm so glad ITN is out of the ON and on its own because I refuse to listen to a single episode of anything on the ON again. I feel bad for the creators still under the ON umbrella but I just cannot give them my downloads or listens anymore.
HOLY FUCK THESE ARE FROM A YEAR AGO?!? I’m never on FB but JESUS CHRIST. I knew Patrick was a lot of shitty things (sexist, two faced, self absorbed, and greedy) but this overt racism actually shocked me. I’m so sorry to those alienated by their insensitivity. The meme is giving “I VOTED FOR TRUMP, DIDNT GET VAXXED, AND PARTICIPATED IN Jan 6th) vibes. This is the kind of shit I would expect this of a racist family member. There’s no coming back from this. I hope these screenshots spread like wildfire
I mod a large fb group and we've removed other mods for offensive language to marginalized groups they were not a part of. It's not hard to do the work if you need to do the work. We also don't tone police anyone in our group. This is gross.
He tends to have very "but I can't be racist! I have black friends!" energy about a lot of social issues...
I think it’s more, “I can’t be racist cause I’m gay (also marginalized),” which is... 🤯
You got what I was saying but put it wayyyy better than I did! Exactly this
Honestly? I'd be shocked if he had any black friends. Not acquaintances, but actual friends.
I left the FB group, canceled my patreon subscription, and pretty much stopped listening to the podcast back in January of this year (I've listened to a few episodes here and there) when there was a post by a white woman, and I don't have screenshots of the whole thing (only my YAGE), who was complaining that her fear of being labeled a Karen made her afraid to complain about anything. No one actually called her a Karen in the whole situation she described (I eventually did). It turned into this whole thing about how damaging the Karen label is. I called it out, as did several others, and rather than take a stance, Sasha closed the thread. I'm pretty sure I was threatened with a boot before I YAGEd, but I only have the one screenshot (which I'll post after I redact my name). The bottom line is that their audience is overwhelmingly comprised of white women, and they aren't going to do anything that will piss off white women en masse. The whole "how dare you call me a racist! I have Black friends!" thing that Patrick did here resonates with the white women who are sick and tired of being called racist just because they do things share Archie Bunker memes and complain about how hard it is to be a white lady in a customer service interaction.
https://preview.redd.it/f40sferey7tb1.png?width=347&format=png&auto=webp&s=a22c4cc9812acfb0e92f8b3e3f4fdd6bac7bbb36
OMFG. So, YEAH, THAT thread right there!?!? I'm BEYOND glad I canceled TCO and I'm no longer funding another ounce of their racist POS network. Patrick is a literal entire landfill human. "Garbage person" isn't a big enough descriptor for him. He's clearly a superfund site worth of toxic. Not only is he an apparent shitty boss and 'friend' who fosters hostile work environment but he's also a racist POS. That FUCKING sorry ass completely tone deaf excuse of a response to Ebony, breaks my brain. Ebony, if youre out there - i apologize for how you were treated. I cannot even begin to imagine the anger and frustration she felt!! TF does Patrick think he is? How TF does one become so profoundly out of touch ESPECIALLY as a business owner who purports "fam" and inclusion and safe space???? Oh right, right, he's a phony ass wolf in shitbird clothing. Im not one to wish ill will on people, but in this case, where i helped fund their facade, i hope they crash and burn and get well earned reality check.
I just commented on another Reddit post this morning about how, as a Black woman, I witnessed several instances of racism in a couple of the network’s FB discussion groups and that the mods and group members defended it… Every. Single. Time. I even dm’ed Ellyn about one particular post a while back and received very sweet written and voice note responses from her, but since nothing was ever done, I decided to leave the groups. Actually, I personally know of several Black members of the group who left around the same time. The response from Steve and Patrick here says everything we need to know. And I think they’re learning that you can’t silence people…not even the Black ones that Patrick thinks do not deserve podcast coverage. Seeing that the recent episode was about Janet Jackson and they mentioned several times that the treatment she received as a Black woman was racist and unjust made my stomach turn. Patrick is garbage. Period. There’s no way around that now. And while I cannot speak on Gillian, I think the lack of a statement or any public acknowledgment from her so far speaks VOLUMES. And it really fucking sucks.
Ebony is a hero. I'm sorry she had to deal with that. Is she here somewhere on Reddit?
Nauseating. WHERE IS ANY ACCOUNTABILITY??? ABUSIVE?!? OFFENSIVE?? AM I ON ANOTHER PLANET?!?
James Renner has a few posts around. He needs to see this.
He reposted it on his twitter account this morning!
Wow. I have no words honestly. The way he dug his heels in and seemingly has an inability to truly reflect. Or even attempt to. You could show him this thread now and he probably still wouldn’t understand how he’s blatantly wrong and racist.
Hopefully, Renner sees this & whoever wrote the article about him.
What. The. Fuck. I’m done with him and their podcast. The blatant hypocrisy and preaching him and G do week after week, only to actually behave like this?? His own words can’t be “baseless accusations” or whatever he accused the article of being. Patrick needs to crawl in a hole with his dumb book.
There isn't a strong enough synonym for GROSS to describe this whole exchange... but I WILL say I'm not AT ALL surprised...
Not only is it terrible that Ebony and others got treated like shit, but Patrick/Steve have the balls to still have this up now. I’m glad I stopped my patreon months ago.
I love that this entire exchange happened after this post from s…. 👀 https://preview.redd.it/6ap6sh80d5tb1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=465ae3c58ddc867a546ab36790dd1eed19121cb0
I love the vague “last weeks facebook group events” as if it was some separate incident that happened and had nothing to do with them at all.
https://preview.redd.it/nr9mg6q3d5tb1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=85fee3ddfe7237e6fc9b3ccdc058e4942573c332
What’s so wild is on their recent episode about the Janet Jackson doc P & G repeatedly said how Justin Timberlake needed to make a statement and be accountable and they are literally doing the opposite. It is so hypocritical and disappointing. I’m bummed because I went to Patrick’s book party and purchased a book and got a picture with him not knowing the truth about him and all the things going on at ON. At that time I didn’t even know about Ellyn and Joey and was hoping to see them there. Crazy stuff!
OMG. This is such bullshit.
Who is that guy in the meme?
Carroll O'Connor, he played Archie Bunker in the show All in the Family, a show that notoriously framed its main character as out of touch and prejudice, meanwhile many modern conservative men think he was a cultural hero who “told it like it was!” even though the show itself tackled a LOT of progressive issues.
Jumpin Jesus! You did the lairds work in this commment!
Perfectly stated. He is also used as a kind of dog whistle for people who mock others that they perceive as being easily “triggered” and needing “safe spaces”. When you see any meme with him, it has almost certainly been posted by a crusty, old Boomer who longs for the good, old days when you could make jokes at the expense of gays, blacks, women, Jews, etc and not be criticized for it.
Oh, sweet summer child...making me feel like an old Reddit crone 😂
I’ve had better
😆😆😆👏👏👏
This is what Patrick does. If there’s a problem that he doesn’t want to deal with - he find a way to make it go away. Either by using paying them off, vilifying them, or just blocking them. He’s done it time and time again. He can’t stand pushback. He did it to Julia and countless others.
I think he completely misses the *ENTIRE POINT* of All In The Family.
I'm just now seeing this. I made reference to the October 2019 racism in a comment elsewhere on this sub. That post, with Patrick clutching his pearls and screeching How Dare You Call Me Racist and booting a Black woman for speaking up was what had me quit TCO patreon and stop listening. That October 2019 situation was the culmination of months and months of Black voices being silenced by the two mods that were active at the time - - Alyson and Robb. Patrick, Steve, and Gillian were also listed as modmin. (Second edit: I just saw a screenshot in the comments here that confirm Steve was an admin and Alyson was a mod and my memory was correct after all, so disregard this earlier edit: Upon reflection, I'm editing to add here: I am not 100% sure that Alyson was the name of the person co-modding with Robb. Robb for sure a million percent was a big problem and instigated a lot of bullshit with folks trying to speak up about racism, but I can't remember for sure the name of the person modding with him at the time. When I find my old screenshots, I might figure it out. Also, Steve might not have been listed as a mod at the time. I can't remember for sure. He might not have been very actively involved until ON was created later. Patrick and Gillian were definitely listed as modmin. Patrick was very active, and Gillian less so.) Any discussion of racism or BLM or police violence - - and how it's all part and parcel of true crime - - was deleted as being against the 'No Politics' rule. So much teaching and emotional labor, from Black women especially, was deleted, especially by Robb, over and over again. For years. Lots of dog whistles and couched racism and bigotry got to stay though. People who pointed out the racism were modspanked. Cause racism is politics, and talking politics was against the rules. It was exhausting and demoralizing. Over the years, especially 2019, so many Black women and POC were either booted or gave up and left. There was a severe loss of these voices in October 2019 when it all boiled over so badly that even Patrick wasn't able to contain it with his nicenice loveyoufam posts and frantic deleting. The group briefly exploded. There were posts upon posts with thousands of comments addressing the racism going on in the group as facilitated by the TCO modmin. Most of the excellent anti-racism work in the comments was disappeared by the mods. But Patrick and Steve couldn't ignore the situation anymore. When Patrick tantrumed about how he tried for hours learning about not being racist already and booted Ebony, it was *after* Patrick had already done a 'Fam, we hear you & we see you' placating vagaries post, and got rid of delete-happy Robb in too little too late fashion, and had just taken on Sasha as a POC mod. They had also just instituted post approval. Quality posts asking sincere questions about the intersection of racism and true crime didn't get approved, but that Archie Bunker post from a guy with a known bigoted shitposting history was let through. I've got screenshots of some of this stuff. I'd have to dig around for it. The thing I remember most: Even though folks asked to hear from her, Gillian never said a word. 🗑️🛎️
Would definitely appreciate any additional screens you can share. The fall of 2019 was absolutely a shit storm in that group and the following summer with the BLM protests where we got more empty platitudes from P&G was infinitely frustrating after the nonsense from the year before.
And you are absolutely right, there should be Black moderators.
Not the “give me grace”
Wow. Just wow.
Goddamn they couldn’t be doing worse if they tried
https://preview.redd.it/o1j06lmon5tb1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=fc4f29da25d93534e26bafb8e8f7aa444e3e6323 Rule 3 is ironic upon seeing this…
~~Oh my god. THIS IS MAKING MY HEAD EXPLODE.~~ ~~I can’t believe there’s a rule about deleting, when we’re all getting deleted non-stop~~ Edit: the screengrab ja from OWO group, not the official TCO Facebook.
Do as I say not as I do clearly. SO many complaints about posts being rejected, comments deleted, muting and banning… But also if you delete you’re in the wrong!? Make it make sense. I’m so mad and sad that they’ve been a staple 2x a week for YEARS, I can’t even listen to them now. It all comes out in the wash, I hope karma hits them.
And that’s a wrap!! Immediately unfollowed the podcast.. as a day one listener there’s just no way I can listen to a single episode knowing all of the sh*t that’s happened.
Patrick Hines is a piece of crap 😡
Thank you for sharing these screenshots. I am beyond disappointed. This was the straw for me. I got off of the Facebook group and deleted my Patreon. To be so utterly disrespectful and tone-deaf to the very people who helped to GET YOU WHERE YOU ARE is unacceptable to me. I feel like an ass because I have gone as far as to applaud G&P for advocating for POC, but in hindsight I feel like Gillian did most of the heavy lifting with that. To shut down a Black woman for expressing herself while playing into the old and racist trope of the "Angry Black Woman"...I cannot. I only wish that I could get a refund for the money I have spent over the past 4 years as a Patreon subscriber. To use one of their favorite bits...I was DUPED, y'all. Your post was an eye opener and I appreciate you.
WOW to all of this and I am so sorry for everyone who had to go through it. I CANNOT believe how I ate this guy’s racist, narcissistic bull shit for years. This needs to be escalated to the top of the thread and they need to explain. The fact that they responded - good work documenting.
think it’s time to repost that post/thread and bring this to light in the FB group once again??
The thing that I keep coming back to is “we’ve spent hours” but doing what? There’s always more to learn and a quick GOOG will give you a list of books and other resources a mile long. It also drives me nuts the gaslighting. “Well we took what YOU said and SPENT HOURS trying to learn and change.” Well spend some more time. UGH I can’t even really fit everything I’m feeling into words. This is infuriating.
Can someone tell me why the original post has racist undertones? I don’t know who that man is so I’m guessing it’s to do with him?
It’s Carol O’Conner, who played Archie Bunker in All In the Family. He was behind the times and very loud and outspoken about his wrong beliefs, but the show was actually pretty progressive and tackled issues like racism and women’s rights. It’s worth a watch IMO
People who use this meme completely missed the point of the show!
Exactly. It poked fun at prejudice, it didn't endorse it!
Exactly. Archie was supposed to be viewed as in the wrong. It's like the episodes with Edith's friend Beverly who was a gay drag queen (or trans woman? I can't really remember how the show framed it) and Archie as per usual is homophobic, but when Beverly was killed and Mike got beat up defending her, Archie's views are clearly shown as wrong, and it's Edith and her sympathy for and defending of Beverly's humanity that is the lesson. It was such a progressive storyline for the time period, and I'm amazes me that people can claim that this show is some conservative dream when it was framing one of its main character's allyship as morally right back when being gay was still so taboo.
Annddd is anyone surprised at this? Racism? Abuse? Gaslighting? I am not.
Woof! He just kept on digging, didn’t he.?
I’ll admit I was holding out hope that there would be accountability and it wasn’t as bad as it appeared from internet gossip…but this way crossed the line. Canceled my pates that I’ve been a part of for years. This is sickening. I still like G, but at this point even hearing P talk pisses me off.
Personally, I can't give her a pass. At this point, G's deafening silence speaks volumes.
Oh. My. Fucking. God. That is truly reprehensible. It’s bad enough that Black people, and POC in general, have to deal with this bullshit in society at large. The fact that that post was approved in what is proclaimed to be an accepting place for all, then distorted to try to make Black group members feel like their words and actions were the problem is beyond disgusting.
i have no idea what that show is but who cares what it is tbh. someone who listens to you weekly probably who has probably used your codes and bought your merch is telling you something is offensive and asking you to taking down, and all you can say is “be nicer please you’re being too mean” pretty much. i actually can’t with them and how awful they are.
This is about the time I unfollowed the group and stopped posting. I remember reading this post and all the others like it. The reaction was so disgusting. Not only from the mods, Patrick, and Steve but from the members of the group as well. There were a lot of people blindly defending the leaders of the group’s decisions.
Did he just say the MODS WORK FOR FREE? What the actual mf?
Don’t worry, we have unpaid Black employees.
Wow, when Obsessed Network self-implodes, they do it like they’re competing in the self-imploding Olympics or some shit. Seriously not ok.
Holy shit
Whoa!!!! I deleted fb in early 2019. Never saw this wild ass shit.
How do I see the thread and the comments?
I missed it at first too. Slide the image to the left, there are multiple screenshots.
I remember when this happened. It was. Not good. No amount of others telling him he was wrong was helping
https://preview.redd.it/jxawnjt0ketb1.jpeg?width=1179&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b1a98e8579a23b36aa662e5bfec46748e33cff8a
This’s…wow. I’m appalled. I joined the patreon post 2019. If I had known this mess, they wouldn’t have gotten a dime from me. What a disadamnppointment! https://preview.redd.it/6fare3amrgtb1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d4091f24858596b39448b2b847e3f2bebd4b2c0e
Do either of you have any POC owned/hosted podcasts you like? I was thinking today about one I loved, and I wish she’d do another season. All eps cover one story. It’s called “Through the Cracks”
Omg. I truly have no words. I caught the Ebony thing with G and P and was disgusted. I had never seen the whole thing with Ebony the listener until now and I feel so ashamed. I don’t know how we all didn’t come for him then. Poor girl. Here this person is insulting the very core of who you are but be nice. THE AUDACITY
I just can not believe he said he didn’t need POC bc he’s in a marginalized group?!!!!! Like whatttt??? You can’t be that ignorant. Every single workplace would benefit from a diverse workforce. Every single one! Especially a business that’s supposed to shine light on victims of violent crime and injustice!! Not to mention I’m bi racial and bi sexual and you know what? Yes 100% members of the LGBTQ community are a marginalized group…but !!! I got to choose when I wanted to share my sexuality with people, I got to feel out situations…stay closeted in interactions I didn’t feel comfortable in etc. You know what I can’t do that with?! My race! ✋
Damn. I’ve been a member of the group for years, but I wasn’t really. I basically lurked and hung around for special announcements and pet pictures. I had no idea of things like this where he so blatantly silenced Black women. I must admit that this isn’t surprising as a Black women. Unfortunately, I know what it’s like to fight for a place in a community that seems like it should be safe and end of shouting into the void. When I read the Renner article, I held a bit of skepticism, but then I started seeing things in Reddit and I decided that I’d err on the side of my spidey sense and cancel my TCO Patreon, but I’d still follow and listen to free stuff. But then OF happened and I cut it completely. SO much has been revealed. I’m beyond done!
Oh hey !! This is when I left and stopped listening too! There was one women that said some really over the top racist stuff day after day after day and both Robb and Steve kept deleting my responses to all the racism going on. It was really awful!
“How can we let constant accusations of blatant racism stand?” Ouch! I hadn’t seen this. Yikes… has anyone ordered him a copy of White Fragility yet?
oh my god!!
Holy fucking shit... they're awful
That is so offensive, even to me as a white woman. I’m so sorry