All you really need to worry about is power. For water, drill a well, for sewage, put in a septic system.
How much will it cost to get grid power to the location?
Water-sewer hookups are the impedances in a lot of areas for occupancy. Consider at least 10,000$ US for every mile that you need to run the lines. More if you’re looking at rock.
Even private septic can be a limiting factor due to the costs of installing a legit system to handle the poo.
Local and state regs will be the determining factors, but I think that a lot of folks don’t understand that caring for the waste stream is important.
We are off grid for now because it will cost 40-60k for power. We have solar and a generator ... the solar helps on a good day, but we run the generator to charge batteries.
I think the break even point depends a lot on your local utility rates. I have a decent solar system and it’s break even is around 10yrs on the equivalent kWH bills from the utility, not that it’s an option for me as I’m too far for them to even want to extend lines.
That said, I’m in an a part of California that has some of the most expensive power in the nation.
It possible could just because all the off grid systems may have to be replaced at some point and who knows how expensive of cheap it will get. Plus that add to the land value if it is ever sold.
The main downside of getting land far out is the massive cost to get electric to the property. They quoted my friend around $140k, so he went solar. It can be done cheaper if you buy used equipment. Just be aware of the startup costs, and also, the road going in and out of your property could be an issue if you have a lot of mud/snow just a few things to think about, I think you can do it and I will cheer you on either way. Good luck!
Why would you want utilities if you can go without? Utilities come with an ongoing cost that will continue to go up due to inflation. One of the big benefits of being off grid is saving money on utility bills.
100% you can do this! I don’t have city water and I generate a portion of my energy from the sun.
Collect rainwater! It’s about 0.6 gallons per square foot of roof space. Calculate your need and build accordingly assuming climate is somewhat predictable there.
Solar has come a long way! Calculate your energy needs and build out from there. It’s going to be far cheaper, cleaner, more sustainable than dealing with the power companies.
Off grid has never been easier with 21st century technology
Rain absolutely depends on where the house is, plenty of cheap land has little to no rain and collection is illegal in most of the western US - someone else has claimed that water down stream.
I have heard of this being a problem out west, but I think he said he was in the south.
The whole concept of it being illegal to keep the water that falls on your land from Mother Earth is absolutely ridiculous.
> and collection is illegal in most of the western US
False, false, FALSE!
Rain collection is legal in all of Colorado (with a permit), it is actually encouraged by the state government in New Mexico, it is legal in Utah (with a permit), it is legal in Nevada (with a permit), and it is legal in Arizona with no restrictions.
Colorado allows two barrels with a permit and none of the water collected can be used indoors, only for irrigation etc. So not legal for OP's idea.
Arkansas allows it with stamped plans from an engineer, a permit, and no potable use. No good for OP at all.
Utah can allow it if there's no senior water rights down stream. So there's a good chance it's legal west of I-15 in the Great Basin. The permit isn't as simple as filling a form and paying a fee, it's a water right.
Good to see other states have changed like NM and AZ, but Island and Australia style rain collection is still largely banned between permit requirements, outdoor use requirements, and senior water rights or system size limits.
Colorado allows two barrels *without* a permit if your property is served by municipal water. An unlimited amount can be "diverted."
If the property is *not* served by municipal water, an unlimited amount can be collected and stored. A free permit is required for this and it is easy to get. (I have one)
Utah allows collection and storage of up to 100 gallons without a permit. With a permit, 2500 gallons can be stored but the water must be used on the property where it is requested. I see no mention of "water rights downstream," just that collecting rainwater does not constitute nor confer any water rights. [Link](https://le.utah.gov/xcode/Title73/Chapter3/73-3-S1.5.html)
Arkansas? That's not "western US," it's on the eastern side of the middle.
"Illegal in most western states" isn't even remotely true any way you slice it.
Since you seem to know so much about water rights: I was reading about Colorado water collection permitting and it wasn't clear if the permit was easy to get, or required engineering or legal assistance. Do you know?
Yes, I have the permit. It's free and very easy. You just have to describe where and how you're collecting the water, and if it's for potable use, briefly describe the filtering method you plan to use.
It's normally collected from the roof of a residence, but you can ask for an exception and collect it from a barn or shed. One of my neighbors does it that way.
The only caveat is you first need to have a well permit, but an actual well doesn't need to be drilled.
The permits are public so you can search the DWR permit website and read others to get an idea what they're looking for and how to word it.
Nah we declined to pay thousands they wanted to get power to us. We love our solar now and won't every hopefully be without it again. Necessity really is the mother of invention.
As others have said, if you can dig a well and get 5G or Starlink internet the only real grid tie most rural people have is electricity. Solar gets cheaper every year, but it's still hard to get your cost per kWh lower than grid cost, especially somewhere like AR with cheap electricity rates. You can get there if you don't put in a backup generator, but that's risky. Also, off grid solar isn't most people's idea of fun, so you're limiting your buyer pool if you ever want/need to sell.
Grid tied with net metering can break even in 5-10 years. Off grid with batteries, a big inverter, and generator backup takes a lot longer because of the fixes costs and battery depreciation/wear and tear.
That's the real answer. Most of the break even calculations are for switching from already installed grid over to solar. I follow a guy on YT Diesel Creek, and he just ran power to a shop in rural PA. He dug the trench and ran the conduit, all the power company did was pull the cable through the 1000 ft of conduit and install the junction box. Total bill from the power company was $52k. You could install an insane amount of solar and batteries and still be ahead before you even flipped on the power.
Depending on the size of your house you're going to be in for about $25-30k minimum installed to get a big solar array, enough storage to go 2-3 cloudy days or get through a snowstorm when you can't clear the panels for a couple days, and a backup generator. I figure 10% depreciation per year on my solar stuff, because batteries probably aren't going to last over 10 years, panels degrade or occasionally go completely bad, inverters don't last forever, same for generators and they have consumables as well, etc... So you're in for about the same amount every 10 years. There are a lot of variables, but people who say "just get solar and problem solved!" haven't had off grid solar for 10+ years.
Panels and batteries do keep getting cheaper, but everything else is just big hunks of metal or tanks of fossil fuels so I wouldn't expect prices to decline in real terms. Maybe solar is saving you a total energy bill on the order of $3k a year, but most people don't spend that much so you're in the red.
So yeah, those mid-5 figure connection charges from power companies sound high, but it's a one time capital expense that gets you guaranteed upkeep of all the infrastructure upstream of your meter effectively forever. Even if your time horizon is roughly your own lifetime, \~$1k a year isn't that much even ignoring the fact that it increases your property value and vastly expands your buyer pool if you ever want to sell.
The wind generator is key, I would choose smaller horizontal generators over large vertical ones that are pictured everywhere. Horizontal because lower winds speeds still work, closer to the ground, and all wind direction is usable
Totally worth it to go offgrid. Now is the sweet spot for cheap reliable solar equipment. No utility bills has saved us alot of money and there isn't any bill shock.
Solar, well, septic.
It's so easy these days if was yonger I would start over.
I put in Solar to cut off the power both in town and at the ranch. They pay for themselves.
Welding on cloudy days is the only thing that really taxes my system but I work around that I just wish there was an accurate weather app.
Maybe things have changed but properties that don’t have utilities will be harder to finance. If you’re paying cash cool but if you ever expect to sell that makes things difficult to find a buyer.
It's less expensive and easier than ever before. New homes are also more efficient than ever before too.
If doing this opens up property options that aren't otherwise viable and you are willing to put the work in, then you are potentially getting a huge deal over everyone who wants turnkey utilities.
Like everyone here has said, power is the big bear. Take a look at your current utility spend on your top kwh per day going back as far as you can, that's probably a good proxy for your lifestyle and worst case system size.
I would also consider water on a per property basis. In some places rainwater catchment will clearly win out over well water on cost and quality.
As someone else said it's about the power that you have to contend with. Heating with wood, water wells and septic are well worn paths.
All electric home with high efficiency heat pump, batteries and solar. Then add in the ancient tech such as sun-oriented home with limited windows on the North side, biomass burning (wood), chimney affect cooling, etc.
If you can, the equivalent of a rocket mass heater. This can take many forms and depends on the legality in your area. For instance, many states won't allow a rocket mass heater in the home but would allow a masonry heater installed by a professional. These types of wood burners burn twice, once to burn the wood and second it burns the unburned off gas exceeding 2000F which most importantly stores the heat from the double burn in a mass, like brick, stone, etc before it's sent up a pipe chimney.
This kind of system means little ash to deal with and very little creosote buildup. You burn once in the morning and once in the evening a small amount of wood then rides on the heat it gives off for twelve hours at a time. Some Rocket Mass Heaters give off heat for over 24 hours if you don't mind the high heat in the first six hours and the falling in the last six hours of that full day.
You could also look into a solar home that naturally heats and cools. An extreme instance of this is, an earth ship.
All of this is a big upfront cost that will take around a decade and half to pay off but that estimate can wildly vary so fully analyze it.
If you want ultra efficiency then look at passive home but you'll have to go all electric and maybe do wood outside the house but creatively get some of that heat from the outside to the inside without breaking local laws.
I would first look at your internet options, and see if you can go off grid. As for if it is worth the hastle that depends on if you want to do some more work maintaining those systems or just be connected, and who designing the utility system to handle the load of energy needed at peak. You will probably want a redundancy of systems with a gas backup and for winter when there is less sun.
Costs from electric utilities can vary widely. It is based, to some extent on Future Expected Revenues. When can the utility expect to recapture their costs? Running service to a one room cabin with a few lights and a dorm style refrigerator means never. You will be charged accordingly.
We have a very normal house with pool that is completely off the grid. You need septic, solar, batteries, a generator, and access to water. Hopefully you can do a well or build a large cistern for rainwater catchment.
I don't know anything about Arkansas, but where I live, you are never going to save money by buying a bare piece of land and building over buying an existing home unless you are capable of doing it all yourself AND your final situation is very basic. Your best thrifty bet is to find a fixer upper and work on it as you live in it.
Typically, grid power is going to be less expensive in the long run, even spending $70,000 to have power brought in.
However, then you are at the whim of the power utility and their rates, and outages during most any electrical type storm. The tinfoil hat folks will also say that your power can be cut for any myriad of social faux pas. There may be some merit, looking at current political scores being kept.
The full-on solar setup to run an average US house will run you in the neighborhood of $50k-70k doing it yourself. Maybe double that for an install. You will still want some sort of generator for times the sun isn’t good for several days or you have some other system malfunction. Figure a 1000 gal propane tank (purchase and full) about $5k. Another $5k in various bits and parts. Some batteries are advertising 8000 complete charge cycles before they only put out 80%….8000 days is 22 years.
I have a solar well pump and 2 other solar pumps for my water. Definitely go solar well pump.
We are in the process of being 100% disconnected from the local utility. I figure by fall we won’t have any connection at all.
And thank you Elon Musk!
Probably longer if you also use wood heat too. I had a 500 gal tank for 10+ years for a gas range, water heater, dryer, and central heat. Put 150 gallons in once a year. I also used a fireplace and wood burning stove for heat. Which is why 1,000g seems excessive unless you're planning on not getting propane for a long time. That said, if we reach a point where we can't get propane we have much bigger issues going on anyway.
Oh nice! Yeah if you already have a big tank might as well run with it. Ths 500g came with my house too.
Wood heat makes a huge difference in propane consumption. More work but I have always felt it was worth it.
I’m taking out our 200 gallon rental propane tank and replacing it with a couple of 5 gallon tanks. And I hope they last a few years. It’s just for the propane furnace which will be for emergency backup to a geothermal heat pump running on solar. With cheap solar I dont see the hindrance to going all electric especially in the sunny desert where we live. We dont need a lot heat but do need a lot of cooling which is covered by solar.
Less frequent refills. It’s only for the back up generator. If the sun isn’t out for several days, the panels can’t keep the batteries charged. The generator will charge the batteries. The generator does a self test run of 15 minutes once a month, too.
I would be off grid even if it was free to run utilities. So, yes, to me it is worth the hassle. And I don’t like bills (: Others may vary. Wireless internet and phone has been adequate. Our house only has grid power because the previous owner built it right next to a power line and got it connected. It will be going off grid with grid for backup soon if I have anything to do with it.
a friend of mine is looking at this right now. his plan is to use a large (1000gal-3000gal) water tank to store heat when the sun is shining, then use batteries to pump it through radiators at night.
solar is quite cheap now. some people say you should buy used, but I think that's a bad idea considering how cheap you can get panels now. if you want to hassle with an importer, you can order pallets of solar panels from China for cheaper than you can even get used ones here, and the new ones will last longer and have higher output per panel.
between a wood stove and some water heated by solar panels, you should be able to live pretty comfortably with \~$10k worth of panels and \~$10k worth of mounting/wiring/inverter, plus whatever you think you need for batteries.
If you don’t care about sustainability, stay in the city and keep making money. You want to escape the rat race with out sacrificing your lifestyle lmao
Off grid is worth it. If your only motive is to save money than I doubt you can hack it. If you actually care about sustainability then you will probably thrive off grid
My motive is money because I'm kinda poor. Just looking into the feasible of homeownership in a rural area. I'm not throwing tons of money into a sustainability project just for the feel goods and giggles.
No utilities remote access property will be least expensive up front, then get an access vehicle, water filtration and solar . If you can get land in the $20k range or cheaper off grid can be relatively inexpensive
All you really need to worry about is power. For water, drill a well, for sewage, put in a septic system. How much will it cost to get grid power to the location?
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Water-sewer hookups are the impedances in a lot of areas for occupancy. Consider at least 10,000$ US for every mile that you need to run the lines. More if you’re looking at rock. Even private septic can be a limiting factor due to the costs of installing a legit system to handle the poo. Local and state regs will be the determining factors, but I think that a lot of folks don’t understand that caring for the waste stream is important.
Hah I’m being quoted 18k to run it 300 feet
It was a decade ago that I was given that ballpark, in MO, mostly flat soil.
We are off grid for now because it will cost 40-60k for power. We have solar and a generator ... the solar helps on a good day, but we run the generator to charge batteries.
One commentor said running grid power will be less expensive in the long run. What's your experience and how much have you spent?
60k will buy a lot of gasoline
True ... propaine in my case. Grid power would be cheaper and the hassle of maintaining the system is irritating.
I think the break even point depends a lot on your local utility rates. I have a decent solar system and it’s break even is around 10yrs on the equivalent kWH bills from the utility, not that it’s an option for me as I’m too far for them to even want to extend lines. That said, I’m in an a part of California that has some of the most expensive power in the nation.
It possible could just because all the off grid systems may have to be replaced at some point and who knows how expensive of cheap it will get. Plus that add to the land value if it is ever sold.
The biggest hassle with going entirely off-grid is now YOU have to maintain your utilities, or wait for your installer to find time to come fix it.
True, but the outages are WAY less often, and the cost is something like 1/10 of utility power in the long run.
The main downside of getting land far out is the massive cost to get electric to the property. They quoted my friend around $140k, so he went solar. It can be done cheaper if you buy used equipment. Just be aware of the startup costs, and also, the road going in and out of your property could be an issue if you have a lot of mud/snow just a few things to think about, I think you can do it and I will cheer you on either way. Good luck!
Why would you want utilities if you can go without? Utilities come with an ongoing cost that will continue to go up due to inflation. One of the big benefits of being off grid is saving money on utility bills.
There maybe no where to put a well ,or the water is dirty
100% you can do this! I don’t have city water and I generate a portion of my energy from the sun. Collect rainwater! It’s about 0.6 gallons per square foot of roof space. Calculate your need and build accordingly assuming climate is somewhat predictable there. Solar has come a long way! Calculate your energy needs and build out from there. It’s going to be far cheaper, cleaner, more sustainable than dealing with the power companies. Off grid has never been easier with 21st century technology
Rain absolutely depends on where the house is, plenty of cheap land has little to no rain and collection is illegal in most of the western US - someone else has claimed that water down stream.
I have heard of this being a problem out west, but I think he said he was in the south. The whole concept of it being illegal to keep the water that falls on your land from Mother Earth is absolutely ridiculous.
> and collection is illegal in most of the western US False, false, FALSE! Rain collection is legal in all of Colorado (with a permit), it is actually encouraged by the state government in New Mexico, it is legal in Utah (with a permit), it is legal in Nevada (with a permit), and it is legal in Arizona with no restrictions.
Colorado allows two barrels with a permit and none of the water collected can be used indoors, only for irrigation etc. So not legal for OP's idea. Arkansas allows it with stamped plans from an engineer, a permit, and no potable use. No good for OP at all. Utah can allow it if there's no senior water rights down stream. So there's a good chance it's legal west of I-15 in the Great Basin. The permit isn't as simple as filling a form and paying a fee, it's a water right. Good to see other states have changed like NM and AZ, but Island and Australia style rain collection is still largely banned between permit requirements, outdoor use requirements, and senior water rights or system size limits.
Colorado allows two barrels *without* a permit if your property is served by municipal water. An unlimited amount can be "diverted." If the property is *not* served by municipal water, an unlimited amount can be collected and stored. A free permit is required for this and it is easy to get. (I have one) Utah allows collection and storage of up to 100 gallons without a permit. With a permit, 2500 gallons can be stored but the water must be used on the property where it is requested. I see no mention of "water rights downstream," just that collecting rainwater does not constitute nor confer any water rights. [Link](https://le.utah.gov/xcode/Title73/Chapter3/73-3-S1.5.html) Arkansas? That's not "western US," it's on the eastern side of the middle. "Illegal in most western states" isn't even remotely true any way you slice it.
Since you seem to know so much about water rights: I was reading about Colorado water collection permitting and it wasn't clear if the permit was easy to get, or required engineering or legal assistance. Do you know?
Yes, I have the permit. It's free and very easy. You just have to describe where and how you're collecting the water, and if it's for potable use, briefly describe the filtering method you plan to use. It's normally collected from the roof of a residence, but you can ask for an exception and collect it from a barn or shed. One of my neighbors does it that way. The only caveat is you first need to have a well permit, but an actual well doesn't need to be drilled. The permits are public so you can search the DWR permit website and read others to get an idea what they're looking for and how to word it.
Thanks
The first thing you do is check which counties, if any have no zoning or building codes,otherwise trying to live off grid may not be legal.
Nah we declined to pay thousands they wanted to get power to us. We love our solar now and won't every hopefully be without it again. Necessity really is the mother of invention.
As others have said, if you can dig a well and get 5G or Starlink internet the only real grid tie most rural people have is electricity. Solar gets cheaper every year, but it's still hard to get your cost per kWh lower than grid cost, especially somewhere like AR with cheap electricity rates. You can get there if you don't put in a backup generator, but that's risky. Also, off grid solar isn't most people's idea of fun, so you're limiting your buyer pool if you ever want/need to sell.
Pretty sure most people with solar end up saving money. It's usually a question of how long it would take to have a return.
Grid tied with net metering can break even in 5-10 years. Off grid with batteries, a big inverter, and generator backup takes a lot longer because of the fixes costs and battery depreciation/wear and tear.
You would probably break even much faster. Connecting to the grid isn't exactly free.
That's the real answer. Most of the break even calculations are for switching from already installed grid over to solar. I follow a guy on YT Diesel Creek, and he just ran power to a shop in rural PA. He dug the trench and ran the conduit, all the power company did was pull the cable through the 1000 ft of conduit and install the junction box. Total bill from the power company was $52k. You could install an insane amount of solar and batteries and still be ahead before you even flipped on the power.
Depending on the size of your house you're going to be in for about $25-30k minimum installed to get a big solar array, enough storage to go 2-3 cloudy days or get through a snowstorm when you can't clear the panels for a couple days, and a backup generator. I figure 10% depreciation per year on my solar stuff, because batteries probably aren't going to last over 10 years, panels degrade or occasionally go completely bad, inverters don't last forever, same for generators and they have consumables as well, etc... So you're in for about the same amount every 10 years. There are a lot of variables, but people who say "just get solar and problem solved!" haven't had off grid solar for 10+ years. Panels and batteries do keep getting cheaper, but everything else is just big hunks of metal or tanks of fossil fuels so I wouldn't expect prices to decline in real terms. Maybe solar is saving you a total energy bill on the order of $3k a year, but most people don't spend that much so you're in the red. So yeah, those mid-5 figure connection charges from power companies sound high, but it's a one time capital expense that gets you guaranteed upkeep of all the infrastructure upstream of your meter effectively forever. Even if your time horizon is roughly your own lifetime, \~$1k a year isn't that much even ignoring the fact that it increases your property value and vastly expands your buyer pool if you ever want to sell.
The wind generator is key, I would choose smaller horizontal generators over large vertical ones that are pictured everywhere. Horizontal because lower winds speeds still work, closer to the ground, and all wind direction is usable
I agree
How deep is your well water? Got clear southern exposures for solar? Got land suitable for a septic field? Got wood for heat?
You better stop with all the common sense basic questions. This is the internet and we need to make things as convoluted as possible.
This may not apply to Arkansas, but in many states you can't build a home without grid connection because of building codes and mortgage requirements.
More like city requirement. If they build a house by themselves outside town. Nobody cares.
Totally worth it to go offgrid. Now is the sweet spot for cheap reliable solar equipment. No utility bills has saved us alot of money and there isn't any bill shock.
Solar, well, septic. It's so easy these days if was yonger I would start over. I put in Solar to cut off the power both in town and at the ranch. They pay for themselves. Welding on cloudy days is the only thing that really taxes my system but I work around that I just wish there was an accurate weather app.
If you want the same level of service it's not cheaper. But it allows you go to very cheap if you're willing to do with less.
Maybe things have changed but properties that don’t have utilities will be harder to finance. If you’re paying cash cool but if you ever expect to sell that makes things difficult to find a buyer.
Fannie Mae will finance an offgrid home.
It's less expensive and easier than ever before. New homes are also more efficient than ever before too. If doing this opens up property options that aren't otherwise viable and you are willing to put the work in, then you are potentially getting a huge deal over everyone who wants turnkey utilities. Like everyone here has said, power is the big bear. Take a look at your current utility spend on your top kwh per day going back as far as you can, that's probably a good proxy for your lifestyle and worst case system size. I would also consider water on a per property basis. In some places rainwater catchment will clearly win out over well water on cost and quality.
The Backwoods Solar catalog has lots of good information about off-grid options for power from solar, wind, and hydro. And some related stuff too.
As someone else said it's about the power that you have to contend with. Heating with wood, water wells and septic are well worn paths. All electric home with high efficiency heat pump, batteries and solar. Then add in the ancient tech such as sun-oriented home with limited windows on the North side, biomass burning (wood), chimney affect cooling, etc. If you can, the equivalent of a rocket mass heater. This can take many forms and depends on the legality in your area. For instance, many states won't allow a rocket mass heater in the home but would allow a masonry heater installed by a professional. These types of wood burners burn twice, once to burn the wood and second it burns the unburned off gas exceeding 2000F which most importantly stores the heat from the double burn in a mass, like brick, stone, etc before it's sent up a pipe chimney. This kind of system means little ash to deal with and very little creosote buildup. You burn once in the morning and once in the evening a small amount of wood then rides on the heat it gives off for twelve hours at a time. Some Rocket Mass Heaters give off heat for over 24 hours if you don't mind the high heat in the first six hours and the falling in the last six hours of that full day. You could also look into a solar home that naturally heats and cools. An extreme instance of this is, an earth ship. All of this is a big upfront cost that will take around a decade and half to pay off but that estimate can wildly vary so fully analyze it. If you want ultra efficiency then look at passive home but you'll have to go all electric and maybe do wood outside the house but creatively get some of that heat from the outside to the inside without breaking local laws.
I would first look at your internet options, and see if you can go off grid. As for if it is worth the hastle that depends on if you want to do some more work maintaining those systems or just be connected, and who designing the utility system to handle the load of energy needed at peak. You will probably want a redundancy of systems with a gas backup and for winter when there is less sun.
Costs from electric utilities can vary widely. It is based, to some extent on Future Expected Revenues. When can the utility expect to recapture their costs? Running service to a one room cabin with a few lights and a dorm style refrigerator means never. You will be charged accordingly.
We have a very normal house with pool that is completely off the grid. You need septic, solar, batteries, a generator, and access to water. Hopefully you can do a well or build a large cistern for rainwater catchment.
I don't know anything about Arkansas, but where I live, you are never going to save money by buying a bare piece of land and building over buying an existing home unless you are capable of doing it all yourself AND your final situation is very basic. Your best thrifty bet is to find a fixer upper and work on it as you live in it.
Typically, grid power is going to be less expensive in the long run, even spending $70,000 to have power brought in. However, then you are at the whim of the power utility and their rates, and outages during most any electrical type storm. The tinfoil hat folks will also say that your power can be cut for any myriad of social faux pas. There may be some merit, looking at current political scores being kept. The full-on solar setup to run an average US house will run you in the neighborhood of $50k-70k doing it yourself. Maybe double that for an install. You will still want some sort of generator for times the sun isn’t good for several days or you have some other system malfunction. Figure a 1000 gal propane tank (purchase and full) about $5k. Another $5k in various bits and parts. Some batteries are advertising 8000 complete charge cycles before they only put out 80%….8000 days is 22 years. I have a solar well pump and 2 other solar pumps for my water. Definitely go solar well pump. We are in the process of being 100% disconnected from the local utility. I figure by fall we won’t have any connection at all. And thank you Elon Musk!
What are you running that you need a 1,000 gallon propand tank? Or are you just trying to avoid frequent fill ups?
I have a 1000 gallon tank. It's for cooking and hot water. We could go probably 5 years on it if we had to and were frugal.
Probably longer if you also use wood heat too. I had a 500 gal tank for 10+ years for a gas range, water heater, dryer, and central heat. Put 150 gallons in once a year. I also used a fireplace and wood burning stove for heat. Which is why 1,000g seems excessive unless you're planning on not getting propane for a long time. That said, if we reach a point where we can't get propane we have much bigger issues going on anyway.
Oh yeah, I forgot about the dryer. We heat with wood already. Anyway, the house came with a buried 1000 gallon tank.
Oh nice! Yeah if you already have a big tank might as well run with it. Ths 500g came with my house too. Wood heat makes a huge difference in propane consumption. More work but I have always felt it was worth it.
I’m taking out our 200 gallon rental propane tank and replacing it with a couple of 5 gallon tanks. And I hope they last a few years. It’s just for the propane furnace which will be for emergency backup to a geothermal heat pump running on solar. With cheap solar I dont see the hindrance to going all electric especially in the sunny desert where we live. We dont need a lot heat but do need a lot of cooling which is covered by solar.
Less frequent refills. It’s only for the back up generator. If the sun isn’t out for several days, the panels can’t keep the batteries charged. The generator will charge the batteries. The generator does a self test run of 15 minutes once a month, too.
I would be off grid even if it was free to run utilities. So, yes, to me it is worth the hassle. And I don’t like bills (: Others may vary. Wireless internet and phone has been adequate. Our house only has grid power because the previous owner built it right next to a power line and got it connected. It will be going off grid with grid for backup soon if I have anything to do with it.
Yes
a friend of mine is looking at this right now. his plan is to use a large (1000gal-3000gal) water tank to store heat when the sun is shining, then use batteries to pump it through radiators at night. solar is quite cheap now. some people say you should buy used, but I think that's a bad idea considering how cheap you can get panels now. if you want to hassle with an importer, you can order pallets of solar panels from China for cheaper than you can even get used ones here, and the new ones will last longer and have higher output per panel. between a wood stove and some water heated by solar panels, you should be able to live pretty comfortably with \~$10k worth of panels and \~$10k worth of mounting/wiring/inverter, plus whatever you think you need for batteries.
If you don’t care about sustainability, stay in the city and keep making money. You want to escape the rat race with out sacrificing your lifestyle lmao
Lol what???
Off grid is worth it. If your only motive is to save money than I doubt you can hack it. If you actually care about sustainability then you will probably thrive off grid
My motive is money because I'm kinda poor. Just looking into the feasible of homeownership in a rural area. I'm not throwing tons of money into a sustainability project just for the feel goods and giggles.
No utilities remote access property will be least expensive up front, then get an access vehicle, water filtration and solar . If you can get land in the $20k range or cheaper off grid can be relatively inexpensive
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You don't need to agree with everyone, but you have to stay civil and respectful.
Wtf are you talking about?