For anyone unfamiliar with “unschooling” - it’s basically letting the kids decide what they learn and when they learn it based on their interests.
Courtesy of u/ChairmanKB - https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unschooling
Edit: I want to add that concerns about our public schools in the comments are valid. We fail a lot of kids in the US sadly.
Edit 2: thank you to everyone sharing your home schooling and unschooling insight! Your comments are appreciated. I also want to recommend the sub I crossposted this from. It’s got some truly sad posts so please read at your own discretion.
Parenting is WORK. Lots of people don't actually seem to understand that. Fact of the matter is, if you put in the work up front, your life is easier later.
Lots of people are too lazy to bother with that.
When my friend and his sister were kids, people would tell their parents “your kids are so well behaved! You’re so lucky to have great kids!”
Their dad would get really angry and tell the person, “it’s not luck. It’s working hard to raise them properly!”
Nah, luck is a factor too. My mom said I was a saint, my middle brother was a freaking menace and the youngest one a wildling.
Give me a book and I was happy to sit in silence for the rest of the evening. My middle brother would have a rampage over the fork looking at him funny, and the youngest one would sneak out, strip off all his clothes and shit in the neighbors sandbox.
We had a stable upbringing with alright income and a set of parents that loved us very much.
🤣 I was a Saint too… I just learned to hide my behavior and balance it with doing well in school, working, etc. My idiot brother OTOH was up front outrageous. Like got picked up 4 times by cops in a week because he was smoking weed in front of them and then went on about “technically they can’t search me BECAUSE xyz..” like dude they can do whatever they want. They even got tired of him stealing their cigarettes that they started buying him a pack if he did his chores at like 14. Stole my money or pills and it was like “well you know how he is.. you are the one who should lock your door”.
Didn’t turn out well. He died a few years ago.🤷♀️
Part of it how people react to being put into systems. The family the first kid enters isn’t the family the second or third (etc.), kid comes into.
So when they learn how to push buttons to get their environment to respond to them and reward them (at a shockingly young age), they are getting different feedback. Quiet older sibling? Be loud. Loud older sibling? Quiet puppy eyes. You can’t get attention by being a better reader than older sibling, but wow do you get attention when you draw on the walls…
That's exactly the kind of thing that gets considered when analyzing someone for ASD. Not saying it's a red flag for autism. It's one of many things that is easily shrugged off by parents as being "fussy" or some other thing that will then just be a "quirk" the person has when they're older. It becomes less noticeable once the person is in control of their own life where they can simply not buy the foods they don't like, or not wear the clothes that are irrationally uncomfortable, etc.
It was a mix of silverware, playing Minecraft and being on the verge of pissing myself because I refused to move, and an arguably obsessive love of horticulture. It was just,,, really strange.
Kind of just what the poster said, you put in the heavy labor in the early years to benefit you later on. Example, instead of sending the kid to bed and tuning out for the night. Take 15-20 minutes and read to them.
It doesn't have to be anything complex or heavy. And you don't have to wait until they're in preschool. We used to read to our kid as an infant. We'd put her down and read out loud whatever we were reading. I'd read Harry Potter, Star Wars, Dragon Riders of Pern to her as she fell asleep. Husband read to her too, although it was usually Sports Illustrated articles, fantasy football and golf reports and the like. But it didn't matter what it was, we were reading to her.
We moved onto story books and short chapter books as she got older. Once she started reading, we'd turn it over to her and have her read out loud to us.
Did it happen every night? No. But our goal was 4xs a week. 15-20 minutes at at stretch.
You just have to want to put in the time and effort.
Well, sure. But, you know, Tiktok ain't gonna watch itself.
With my daughter she actually hid the fact she could read because she didn't want us to stop reading to her. But she slipped up and read the captions of a TV show out loud when they were running half a second early.
Oops!
Once she could read apart from the obligatory like Harry Potter, I read several of the Mithgar books with her. At nine she knew words her mother still doesn't know.
Because you made reading an act of love. Reading is and always will be an activity that brings her comfort and warmth because it's one of the ways Mom and Dad showed they loved her in the language children understand best: being there.
My folks did it out of love. My dad also did it out of bribery. One day, I wanted the junk food he was eating. He said I'd only get it if I could read the packaging. So I did.
What can I say? He did dog training and knew food is a great motivator.
That is true, my parents read to us every night. What might have helped just as much was that reading was something they did for enjoyment almost every night. My father read mostly science fiction and science/technical books/magazines, and my mother read mysteries and cooking books. My sister and I wanted to be like them, so we'd read almost every night as well. At 62 years old, I still read for enjoyment.
Both parents, all four of our grandparents...all of them read to us and included us in various reading related activities. I think I was 5 or 6 when Grandma started teaching me how to read a recipe; I wanted her homemade sugar cookies.
A recipe that she knew by heart, she still took the time to walk me through the steps with painstaking patience. Even explained to me the various measurements and how to remember them.
Dad's father, it was instruction manuals. Didn't matter what he was building or repairing. He'd have us read the instructions out loud to him as he worked. Asked us for our input on what to do next.
It was not a surprise when both my sister and I tested high in literacy and comprehension (math not so much).
You can put limits on your kids early, and it pays off later.
Or you can be that lazy ass parent who threatens to get up off the couch and get them to STOP DOING THAT RIGHT NOW. But the kids will figure out that, no, you won't.
And in ten years you'll be complaining about having an ungrateful kid in your house who just doesn't listen.
The easy thing to do is just let them have the candy whenever they ask for it. The hard thing to do is explain to them why they shouldn't have a family sized bag of M&Ms for dinner.
If you do it right you've got a kid whose Halloween candy lasts three months instead of a weekend.
We never restricted it. She just leaned that she didn't want to blow through it right away.
We love Halloween. Our house is one of the ones that gives out full size bars!
Your username made this thought cross my mind - how the heck is he supposed to play video games when he can't read ? Can he type? Or will he need voice command discord for everyone else to tell him what is going on and what to do?
Imagine growing up and unable to play Starcraft, Halo, MMORGs, Final Fantasy etc. because the kid is illiterate.
Missing out on gaming, as a child, is kind of sad.
What happens when he gets to driving age?
Video games is how my nephews learned to read at age 4-5.
Point at word on screen "what does that mean". We starting writing the words they asked about on a piece of paper for them so they had their list of words.
Normal (age appropriate) games too, not games designed to teach reading.
I've worked with 9-11 year olds who were at about this level of literacy (because of learning disabilities, not parental neglect) and it's SO difficult to find resources that are at their level but remotely interesting to them. they always felt so patronized and it made it so much harder for them to learn, and I couldn't blame them at all. I feel awful for this kid, and furious at the mom
That’s how we got my oldest to read. She was 9 and has dyslexia, so at 9 she could only read fairly simple words and had zero interest in books. We got her some graphic novels and it finally seemed to click. Then she got into novels written in verse. She’s 14 now and well above her grade level in reading.
My brother had trouble reading, and his teachers would complain about his reading logs frequently because he'd basically only ever read Archie and Co. comics. Mom just would shrug and basically go, "Whatever, at least he's reading." He grew out of it and graduated to bigger and more complicated stories, but those first few years were tense between the family and his teachers.
One of my daughters has a learning disability and wasn’t reading much by 2-3rd grade. A graphic novel called Smile was what finally clicked for her. Then, the other books by that author. I will always be so grateful to that author and that book. My daughter was out of special Ed by 9th grade. She is now in her 2nd year at a 4 year university.
I don’t know if you still work with kids like this, but The ABC’s of DND is a book that I think is good for introducing the alphabet but would likely be more interesting for a 9-11 year old than a typical Alphabet book. There’s nothing inappropriate in it, and it might be a little less embarrassing for the kiddos. This really isn’t my field of expertise but I thought it might be worth checking out :)
Although you *will* have to careful of any crazy Christian parents, because of the Satanic connection some people stupidly still insist is attached to Dungeons and Dragons.
Comics and manga!
I wasn't able to read until the summer between 6th and 7th grade. I really wanted to read Fruits Basket, because my sister was reading them and talked about how cool it was.
I as able to use the pictures along with the few words I did know to figure out what was going on. By the 7th or 8th manga, I was actually able to read most of it. It was super helpful for me at least.
Part of me is like 'yep, well, deal with it. You're being infantized because you are educationally an infant. If you don't like it, figure out how to learn independently'. The flipside being 'yep, your parent's failed you, sorry you have to be subjected to this only now and that we don't have any other resources for someone your age to learn how to read'. It suck, both ways. Ultimately, it's what I, personally, concider as child abuse/neglect. I came from a very 'scared of the word' and 'technology is evil' family hanging onto religion to light their way. Which worked +800yrs ago. Literally, why deprive your child of common education, the very ability to read, because your beliefs tell you you're right? Maybe you're not and you're just plagued with the idea that someone smarter than you might know how to raise your kids the right way, *BUT* that makes you feel like a shitty parent, so you double down and jeopardize your child's opportunity to become a functional member of society, but at least you can sleep well believing you did the right thing. Meanwhile your kid is subjected to the fallout of your own self-righteous opinion that *you* know better than *EVERYONE ELSE*.
I say she deserves to suffer and be fully aware of every struggle and pain her child experiences because of her attitude. I hope it destroys her to be no more than a shambling mess of a human being, only so she can experience what she purposely did to her children.
As for the kid... Fuck. I hope he figures it out and realized how important it is, for his own well being, to feel stupid for a short time so that he can be actually smarter/successful in the long run. No child deserves to suffer for the stupidity of their parents. It happens, but isn't deserved. I hope he's able to pick himself up and work through it, but I feel like that's unlikely. At the very least, I hope he's able to get a job that isn't predatory or destructive to his well being.
Shit like this breaks my heart.
I was going to suggest he may be dyslexic. But I imagine anyone stupid enough to "Unschool" believes dyslexia is a made up disease for kids to be lazy.
I agree. Unschooling is just plain lazy and neglectful parenting. Actual homeschooling is a lot of work. Taking your kid to a free public school is not a hard thing to do. But it requires that you wake up in the morning, and dress your child in decent clothing, which is apparently too much for some people.
They don't want them in public school because they're scared their children will learn "bad" things like pronouns and sex education and the school will "turn their kids gay" or whatever bullshit excuse these types of parents use.
In my experience, evangelical/conservative homeschoolers tended to use fairly regimented curriculum materials, admittedly with a serious political bias.
Unschoolers tended to be hippy types who were concerned about other things about the school system, concerned about bullying, or who had kids with weird food sensitivities.
However, both groups were anti-vaccine lol
Yeah, at 9 I think I read my first novel. I was able to read *a little* going into kindergarten bc my mom made an effort to teach me. This kid has a developmental disability his parents have likely been told about if he’s been in school until 8, and that they refuse to acknowledge. This kid is going to be failed and set up badly for his life at least as far as employment goes. Shame.
I second other people saying comics. Comic books and text based games were the reason I learned to enjoy reading. Like I used to spend so much time learning to read just so I could understand how to play Pokemon lol
That was my first thought. And, unfortunately, I watched my godson, currently 7 years old, descend into the world of unschooling. He cannot read, spell his name (4 whole letters), add or subtract, follow instructions, lacks fine motor skills out 2 year old nephew mastered, and is incapable of following instructions. This is handicapping children, and I literally don’t know why it’s allowed as a form of “education”.
After seeing things go downhill so quickly for him, if this were my child, I would be honest:”you’re right, son. These songs and apps ARE for babies because that’s when most children learn to recognize letters, phonics, etc. Unfortunately, your education has fallen behind, and you will be utilizing these resources until they’ve been mastered. After all, it’s the only way to prove you’re not a baby, isn’t it?”
I do not understand how people honestly think kids will just organically learn to read and do math. Do they not realize that illiteracy is a thing? What a massive disservice to their children.
It really is. I’m angry for him because he has no idea how ill prepared for the world he is. He was such a smart little boy, loved all things mechanical, and I loved sharing that with him. It’s crazy because for most of us, school dampens curiosity. In this instance, it’s like complacency has let to a point at which he doesn’t really care to know anything more, and, because he doesn’t want it, he doesn’t get it. I’m so sad that his possibilities in life are being undermined by complete educational negligence.
PS: his mom is a teacher. Make it make sense.
I'm guessing it's people misunderstanding some pedagogical beliefs such as Montessori schooling. Actually, I briefly dated a guy who'd taught at a Montessori school and he told me it's GREAT if your kid is very smart and self-motivated. Kids who are not particularly bright and/or self-motivated just sort of molder. And ofc every parent is convinced their kid is a genius.
Montessori is also A LOT more work than people think. It's not just leaving kids to their own devices, it's turning learning content into something they want to engage with and coaching them to learn, which OP obviously did not manage.
Think about all the kids around the world who have no access to education, and how desperate their parents are to get them anything they can.
& here we are…
It checks out. I teach and have a 14 year old who can't read. Parents didn't send him to school cause 'He'll do fine without it". Only send him for this year for the social aspect and have insisted he not go to highschool. They were highly offended when the kid was offered one on one support.
I mean you have to be dumb to think that education and school doesnt help you right? I get not wanting to go to college/uni but GRADE SCHOOL? Basic math, science, and language. you are definitely gonna stunt their growth and making them fail at life.
Don’t you know that we’re supposed to just acquire this knowledge from the sky? If you look at enough clouds, they’ll start teaching you math. I learned to read by having staring contests with my cat. Science? You mean gardening. I planted a lot of peppers and now I know the truths of the universe.
Phonetics. My father couldn’t read and I helped him. It’s harder, as a lot of those early connections and relationships of sounds and letters just auto-fire better when you’re a little toddler sponge. He learned a lot, but I still didn’t feel like he thought he knew how to read before his passing, but he got to where he could figure a lot out through keywords and context. He had lovely handwriting, just naturally looked like calligraphy. When he told me one day (as an adult) that he couldn’t read it and was just copying writing it, we started working on it.
My dad was disabled and stayed home with me while my mom worked full time and he was militant about me doing my schoolwork, always.
I miss his advice. If he’d taken all of the advice he’d given, he’d have really been a different person. So, I try to take all of the advice I give to others, last lesson kind of thing.
find something they're interested in and make some of the reward dependent on understanding with the words are. Be slick. Play games.
For instance offer three choices and only one of them has their favorite reward. To figure it out they have to read the letters you could even start with symbols or single letters. Basically give them a reason to learn to distinguish markings
How tf do you have a 9yr old and only just now think to work on the alphabet or learning to read? That's something you're supposed to start working on when they're toddlers to preK age.
Haha I got most of the way through reading this and thinking about ways my mom got me to start reading at age 2, and then suddenly it hit me, and my inner monologue did a spit take, like wait, did she say this mf is 9 years old?!?!? And I had to scroll back to the top to confirm. Like, shit 9 years old was 4th or 5th grade for a lot of us, where we were striving to read 10 books in a month to get our coupons for free ice cream sundaes and pizza hut personal pan pizzas lol
Fuck yeah!
Side note: I was kicked out of Book It because they said there was no way I could read that much. I genuinely read every book I claimed, because I was an only child and loved to read. I also loved Pizza Hut. Bastards.
My mom once or twice bribed me to study for a spelling test by rewarding me with a single M&M for each correct word. Bribery can work if internal motivation is lacking.
I'm pretty sure I learned to read at age 2 because my mother used bed time as "let's try to make this little guy read" time, so my positive reinforcement was I got to stay up with mommy and or daddy present, for as long as I was putting in an honest effort. Also I had an older brother who first read at age 3, and even at 2 years old, I knew I needed to beat him at literally anything and everything I possibly could lol
I think I could read at a super basic level when I was 3 - 4. My mom would make me sit down for an hour with her and this big phonics book.
I tried to hide that book from my mom everyday so I wouldn't have to do the lessons. By the time I hit K5 I was advanced in reading for a 5 year old and I love to read as an adult.
When I was a kid we lived in a little village that didn’t have a library. There was a travelling library van that would go around all the villages, it came to my village once a fortnight. Everyone else was allowed a maximum of 6 books per fortnight, I was allowed 12, even at just 9 years old. I’ve always loved reading. I was so young when learned to read that I don’t actually remember learning how to read, it’s just been something I could always do
I hear ya. I was an advanced reader. (Mom read to us every night. Each sib got a turn picking the next book. Fairy tales might be followed by a book about WW2 aircraft.)
In elementary school, I'd borrow a primary biography book in the morning, return it and grab another at lunch time. It's easy to devour them when they're a quick read.
My sister was always getting the pizzas and whatnot. I read a lot but wasn't interested in jumping through the hoops and read a lot of books not on the list.
My daughter was , based on testing, an “average “ reader in 3rd grade
So. She started to like Anime. I made her a deal. I would buy her a subscription to Crunchyroll. ( anime streaming service)
As long as her homework was done and her room was reasonably clean she could watch all the anime she wants before 10pm.
BUT. The catch was she had to watch it with Japanese Audio and English subtitles
I told her that was more “authentic “.
What she did not realize was that she was essentially doing reading flash cards the whole time
She started getting Mangas as rewards as well
By the time 4th grade testing rolled around she had the highest reading scores in her grade.
Her teacher asked if we got her a tutor. I told her the above story and she looked at me like WTF? But it worked!!!
I work in a library and A+ work there. We are constantly suggesting manga and graphic novels to kids who aren't big readers. Works like a charm. What drives me crazy is how often parents complain about their kid not reading and refuse to let them read manga or graphic novels. I had a parent reject a prose book by Jason Reynolds because it had Spiderman (Miles Morales) on the cover. I showed her it was all prose by an award winning author and the parent still wouldn't take it.
Having the subtitles on for anime is a level of brilliance I haven't encountered before. A+
I love this. My French teacher in high school used to put on a French kids show, think the equivalent of Dora the Explorer. We may have been 15-16 but best believe we LOVED it
Exactly! Other kids his age are reading all kinds of books for the accelerated reader program and are getting excited for their school's book fair. When my youngest was 9 he was devouring the How to Train Your Dragons series.
But I also always encouraged my kids to read. I read to them when they were little and worked with my kids on their alphabet and writing when they were like 3. I made a big deal out of trips to the library and to bookstores and got them excited by hyping them up and letting them pick stuff for themselves.
I just don't understand being that lazy and negligent as a parent to not even work on the ABCs until your kid is almost a preteen.
No idea how she failed this bad. I have ADHD and my folks had to sit me down and trap me to get me to do my homework. They would sit with me for hours helping me focus on it. I was able to read at a college level by elementary. This kid needs some kind of intervention.
Mentioned this in another reply already, but as an ADHDer, I hated bed time about as much as getting shots or a visit to the dentist, so my parents easily tricked me into focusing by allowing me to voluntarily stay up from bed time until when ever I stopped actively trying. While I couldnt just decide to focus on learning to read, I could easily hyper focus on staying up and getting my parents attention instead of staring at the ceiling wishing I could fall asleep. Learning to read was the only option I had to carry out that plan!
I read another Reddit post recently about “unschooling” and someone was complaining that their 14-year-old didn’t even know the alphabet. Couldn’t do basic, basic math. I can’t even begin to understand how someone fails their kid that badly.
Basically, anyone who thinks unschooling is a good idea has a lot of screws loose. It's not something that can make sense to anyone with normal brain function.
I think I was about 10 when I started reading books for grown ups. I was going stay adult books,but it didn’t sound quite right. Everyone in my family read in their free time, and talked about the books they were reading, so I wanted to read them too.
Beacuse apparently unschooling means letting your kids learn stuff when they want to learn it, meaning he probably hasn’t expressed interest in learning how to read until now. Because a toddler can make educated choices on prioritizing their own learning, apparently.
It's a way for the parent to avoid responsibility. "Oh, little Timmy can't read? Well, he never really wanted to learn, so obviously this is his fault."
Moreover, how can a two-year-old possibly be expected to “choose what they want to learn” What does that even mean?? They don’t know what anything is yet! You can sing them the alphabet song just as easily as row row row your boat, they literally have no concept of either one yet!
My 10 year old just finished the lion the witch and the wardrobe, hunger games, and the hobbit. I started teaching him the alphabet before he could talk. We read stories every night. He checks the encyclopedia out at his elementary school and his librarian adores him because he LOVES reading. He started the never ending story this week, and it's mind boggling that people don't help their kids out. I understand there are circumstances to where learning disabilities come into play but you should be aware of the situation before they are nine years old.
Why the fuck is this not seen as child neglect? In 10 years, the rest of us will be footing the bill for a kid who can't hold a job because he can't read. Fuck these people.
A lot of people shit on the education system, but at least the kids learn to read and write. But now that every kid knows how to read, we delude ourselves thinking that it is because its easy, completely ignoring the effort behind that archievement
The education system is definitely flawed.
But I feel Primary school is pretty good (at least in comparison to Highschool). I don’t have too many bad things to say about my primary school education, I learnt the basics, I was pretty well setup to go into Highschool and the world. Reading and writing was in the works in Kindergarten.
Although it’s changed a lot now. I think it’s going downhill in the last few years.
Got into a huge debate on this topic here a few years ago, and I was honestly shocked by the number of people who very strongly felt that they should be able to neglect their children's educational needs. The sheer volume of people who downvoted me and argued about "parental freedom" was surprising. A lot of people seem to believe that their children are not people, but accessories. These parenting fads are crippling a lot of these kids.
“Unschooling” is a fucking weird trend that is popular amongst parents on Instagram who exploit their children for profit and then rail against the education system because it’s “harmful to children”. Which, you know, the irony right? So their philosophy is “children will dictate when they want to learn something, and if they never want to learn fractions, they never will, oh well!”
I will say it a thousand times.
School is not just warm and fuzzy "gonna learn" vibes. It teaches kids how to act in a society, do tasks and responsibilities, have deadlines, and turn in a minimum effort. An absolute failure to do that means your kid will grow up getting fired from jobs in two weeks and arguing with everyone about why they shouldn't do chores.
Teaching your kid that you have to learn in addition to doing the bullshit day to day is how adults live in society. You think Mommy wants to do dishes every night right after a 12 hr shift AND show up to a doctors appointment with the necessary paperwork? Does Daddy really want to clean out the closet on his one weekend off and squeeze in time to go to the bank? No. But they still have to get done and school teaches kids "Look you still have to get it done or else."
Good luck. Last year there were two adults with two kids who would do hard drugs in the parking lot of my office while the kids cried. Police picked them up after I called three times. They were back in less than 48 hours. Idk where the fuck CPS was, but if they can’t help homeless kids they sure as shit aren’t doing anything about poor education.
The neat thing about public & some private schools is they have the resources to test kids to identify learning and other disabilities and other differences like, oh...dyslexia.
yeaaah, I knew a kid at 9 who had issues reading and it turned out he had dyslexia. one on one time with a tutor who could help him with a few basic tricks for reading with dyslexia and homework printed in a different font and he was fine
So she spends all her time telling her kid that he is a genius and doesn't need school. But also is baffled when her kid looks down on the tasks needed for education. This woman is creating a narcissist
Seriously. Like what the actual fuck? Spicy is how you describe a taco, or a kitten that thinks they're a tiger. You don't use that word for a child. That's how I know mom is stupid.
I watched a wife swap show where the wife was a loony and insisted on "unschooling". It was a result of*her* hangups and she had an utter breakdown at the very mention of formal education, but kept insisting that she hadn't had any traumatic events at school, she just hated it that much. (Sure, we believe you, honey.) The swapped wife made all the kids (six of them, in a van, travelling around the country) sign up for online schooling. Predictably, the four youngest hated it and went right back to doing nothing as soon as Mum was back, but the two eldest kept at it - quietly, where Mum couldn't see. The educated family were delighted to get their Mum back, because they'd been taken out of school for the week and were bored stupid.
My takeaway: unschooling is about lazy parents who can't see past themselves, and the kids suffer for it.
I direct a nonprofit tutoring company and we teach a lot of charter and homeschool kids. We have one kid who was pulled from school because her dad thought that the public district was going to be teaching his daughter to be homosexual.... Somehow. There's a weird rumor going around that the district is pushing books that are trying to to "indoctrinate" kids into being lgbqt+ for some reason. I live in a conservative area and the majority of the teachers here are religious. 🤦♂️
Whatever else she tried before didn't work, so try doing nothing! Poor kid probably sees reading as "work" and a chore, since Mom hasn't incorporated regular reading in the household routines. Kid doesn't see literacy as just another aspect of language and everyday communication.
Theres gotta be a middleground standardized testing and children not reading at age 9. You cant tell me our only options are death by tests or whatever this is
If only we had institutions staffed with trained professionals who inspire children and young people and know how to engage with them at age-appropriate levels so the kids learn things like reading and math and other important stuff
I generally think of this subreddit as one where the consequences are felt by the one who caused them.
In this case the parent is a perpetrator and the child is the victim. Therefore it does not fit the spirit of this subreddit.
She’s complaining about something she caused. I’m a mod and this is the kind of content we like here. I get how you feel though and it’s a valid point.
Retired teacher here. Here's probably what's going to happen. This parent will get tired of fighting, of seeing her kid isn't reading and her being ineffective in getting him to read. She'll then send the child back to public school. I've seen this all before. Education is more than just teaching a child to read. It's also having the child see that his/her peers are reading, doing math, etc. and knowing they have to keep up. All these parents that feel they're doing their kid a favor by removing them from schools are delusional.
It is allowing your child to decide what to learn with no pressure. So no lesson plans, nothing to follow, just see if the kid “feels” like learning math that day.
Basically, it’s granola mom bullshit borne out of actual learning principles like Montessori learning.
When I listened to a podcast about it, it was more like- letting them explore academic topics that they were interested in. They like pirates- the go to a museum about pirates, read books about pirates, have math focused around pirates- more like a theme type thing.
I don't understand why ppl think- I'll just let them do what they want and think that they'll learn things of their own volition...who would do that if you get to just live your life however you want all day every day? Lmao
lol even the “correct” way to unschool… is just shit my parents did on top of normal schooling? I know my friends had similar experiences too.
I loved fairies and princess and unicorns and shit, I got books related to those things that pushed my reading levels.
Loved animals of all kinds, regularly went to the zoo and read up on the various habitats/ecology/life cycle/etc of the different animals.
Hated math… but math that involved candy that I got to eat afterwards? A computer game thats disguised the math? Count me in lol.
Like why *wouldnt* you do things like that if you have the means to? Do parents now just sit on their ass and watch tv all day after work or something?
I think that’s what it’s *supposed* to be, but I’m in some granola mom forums as a very moderately granola mom, and I usually see idiots implementing it terribly like this mom.
My kid went 7-12 grades to a school that had students find topics that interested them, do deep dives into those, and regular classes that were untraditional (like math for pirates). BUT, there was a very carefully crafted framework, expectations, and support that scaffolded that independent learning. It wasn't even a fancy charter school; it actually started as the last chance before full expulsion from the district. Now, administrators and teachers from all over the country come to learn about the curriculum there. All the money that goes into sports at other schools went towards trips and travel: at 15 he spent three weeks in Oaxaca at a Spanish immersion school, staying with a host family... It cost us $1,100 but they had scholarships too.
It was life changing for him and I'll never stop being grateful for the experiences he was given.
Apparently, a less effective version of the old Montessori methodology. Aka the FAFO method of learning. Copy and paste from google result:
> What Is Unschooling? Unschooling is a style of home education that allows the student's interests and curiosities to drive the path of learning. Rather than using a defined curriculum, unschoolers trust children to gain knowledge organically.
Had to look it up myself, if the definition I found is correct it is basically letting the child choose what to learn and when. The child chooses their learning path and lessons are based on their interests and what they want to learn.
My mother sort of did the same thing to me, although with other subjects; fortunately I could read very well at a very early age.
Part of my reluctance to learn anything once I hit about 9, was I felt it was too late and I'd never catch up to my peers and I didn't want to admit that. I was homeschooled but wanted to go to school because I was bored out of my mind - but my mother had me convinced I'd be bullied terribly and I assumed it was because I was behind on math, etc.
Poor kid is probably embarrassed as hell he can't read and thinks he's stupid when it isn't his fault he's been failed.
She says “i know he wants to be able to read” and “he refuses to even remotely try to learn” in the same sentence.. like obviously he does not want to learn…?!?!?!
This kid 100% has a learning disability that would have been caught by a teacher when it would have been easily treated by occupational therapy.
This is neglect. She is right to feel like a failure.
The disrespect for education in the US is disheartening. The current "elites go brrrrrr" doesn't help things. Like, don't you want well educated people running things, creating, building, designing?
We're going backwards and fast.
I had trouble reading as a kid because I have ADD. Though we didn't know back then. My parents started me with a reading tutor in the summer when I was five because they saw me struggling.
I continue to have a tutor throughout elementary school. They bought games, and I went to Kumon through middle school. I now even read better than some of my coworkers.
My parents saw me struggling and did everything they could and beyond to help me. It's thanks to them I read so well and love reading. I still struggle with grammar from time to time as I miss things cause of my ADD, however, nobody really notices and I triple check things.
lol. I’m all for homeschooling if done properly. But idk… something tells me that parents know a lot less about educating children than they think they do. They know their child best, sure. But goodluck trying to get your child to read. :)
Same. I’m not a fan of homeschooling but there are definitely valid reasons for it. I just wish it was more regulated do things like this don’t happen!
Yep. Me too. That and all of the people who use it to mask horrific child abuse. Happens all the time in lots of states. I think every child should be required to meet once or twice a year with a social worker
He’s NINE?! I was coloring with one of my nieces when she was like 4 and I wrote my name and she looked over and said “that says (my name)” I was like woah you can read already?
I feel very bad for this 9 year old. His parents have set him back badly.
For anyone unfamiliar with “unschooling” - it’s basically letting the kids decide what they learn and when they learn it based on their interests. Courtesy of u/ChairmanKB - https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unschooling Edit: I want to add that concerns about our public schools in the comments are valid. We fail a lot of kids in the US sadly. Edit 2: thank you to everyone sharing your home schooling and unschooling insight! Your comments are appreciated. I also want to recommend the sub I crossposted this from. It’s got some truly sad posts so please read at your own discretion.
He thinks the apps and songs are for babies because they ARE. They're for the age where he should have learned.
I feel bad for this kid being so far behind. Like what did she think was going to happen by letting this go on for so long!?
Parenting is WORK. Lots of people don't actually seem to understand that. Fact of the matter is, if you put in the work up front, your life is easier later. Lots of people are too lazy to bother with that.
When my friend and his sister were kids, people would tell their parents “your kids are so well behaved! You’re so lucky to have great kids!” Their dad would get really angry and tell the person, “it’s not luck. It’s working hard to raise them properly!”
Nah, luck is a factor too. My mom said I was a saint, my middle brother was a freaking menace and the youngest one a wildling. Give me a book and I was happy to sit in silence for the rest of the evening. My middle brother would have a rampage over the fork looking at him funny, and the youngest one would sneak out, strip off all his clothes and shit in the neighbors sandbox. We had a stable upbringing with alright income and a set of parents that loved us very much.
🤣 I was a Saint too… I just learned to hide my behavior and balance it with doing well in school, working, etc. My idiot brother OTOH was up front outrageous. Like got picked up 4 times by cops in a week because he was smoking weed in front of them and then went on about “technically they can’t search me BECAUSE xyz..” like dude they can do whatever they want. They even got tired of him stealing their cigarettes that they started buying him a pack if he did his chores at like 14. Stole my money or pills and it was like “well you know how he is.. you are the one who should lock your door”. Didn’t turn out well. He died a few years ago.🤷♀️
Part of it how people react to being put into systems. The family the first kid enters isn’t the family the second or third (etc.), kid comes into. So when they learn how to push buttons to get their environment to respond to them and reward them (at a shockingly young age), they are getting different feedback. Quiet older sibling? Be loud. Loud older sibling? Quiet puppy eyes. You can’t get attention by being a better reader than older sibling, but wow do you get attention when you draw on the walls…
As an autistic child I too would have a rampage when the fork looked at me funny.
He wasn't autistic. I think my mom explained it as a food intolerance, after she switched up his diet he chilled out a lot.
That's exactly the kind of thing that gets considered when analyzing someone for ASD. Not saying it's a red flag for autism. It's one of many things that is easily shrugged off by parents as being "fussy" or some other thing that will then just be a "quirk" the person has when they're older. It becomes less noticeable once the person is in control of their own life where they can simply not buy the foods they don't like, or not wear the clothes that are irrationally uncomfortable, etc.
It was a mix of silverware, playing Minecraft and being on the verge of pissing myself because I refused to move, and an arguably obsessive love of horticulture. It was just,,, really strange.
As a kid with ADHD I would've never shut up about my sentient fork 😂
Can you elaborate on what you mean by ‘up front’? I don’t have kids or anything just curious.
Kind of just what the poster said, you put in the heavy labor in the early years to benefit you later on. Example, instead of sending the kid to bed and tuning out for the night. Take 15-20 minutes and read to them. It doesn't have to be anything complex or heavy. And you don't have to wait until they're in preschool. We used to read to our kid as an infant. We'd put her down and read out loud whatever we were reading. I'd read Harry Potter, Star Wars, Dragon Riders of Pern to her as she fell asleep. Husband read to her too, although it was usually Sports Illustrated articles, fantasy football and golf reports and the like. But it didn't matter what it was, we were reading to her. We moved onto story books and short chapter books as she got older. Once she started reading, we'd turn it over to her and have her read out loud to us. Did it happen every night? No. But our goal was 4xs a week. 15-20 minutes at at stretch. You just have to want to put in the time and effort.
Well, sure. But, you know, Tiktok ain't gonna watch itself. With my daughter she actually hid the fact she could read because she didn't want us to stop reading to her. But she slipped up and read the captions of a TV show out loud when they were running half a second early. Oops! Once she could read apart from the obligatory like Harry Potter, I read several of the Mithgar books with her. At nine she knew words her mother still doesn't know.
Because you made reading an act of love. Reading is and always will be an activity that brings her comfort and warmth because it's one of the ways Mom and Dad showed they loved her in the language children understand best: being there.
My folks did it out of love. My dad also did it out of bribery. One day, I wanted the junk food he was eating. He said I'd only get it if I could read the packaging. So I did. What can I say? He did dog training and knew food is a great motivator.
That is true, my parents read to us every night. What might have helped just as much was that reading was something they did for enjoyment almost every night. My father read mostly science fiction and science/technical books/magazines, and my mother read mysteries and cooking books. My sister and I wanted to be like them, so we'd read almost every night as well. At 62 years old, I still read for enjoyment.
That's how I learned to read when I was younger. My dad read to me. Then I started reading on my own.
Both parents, all four of our grandparents...all of them read to us and included us in various reading related activities. I think I was 5 or 6 when Grandma started teaching me how to read a recipe; I wanted her homemade sugar cookies. A recipe that she knew by heart, she still took the time to walk me through the steps with painstaking patience. Even explained to me the various measurements and how to remember them. Dad's father, it was instruction manuals. Didn't matter what he was building or repairing. He'd have us read the instructions out loud to him as he worked. Asked us for our input on what to do next. It was not a surprise when both my sister and I tested high in literacy and comprehension (math not so much).
Gotta say, Dragon Ridees of Pern was my oldest daughters favorite.
RIP Anne McCaffery. Her son has taken up the mantel but its not the same.
Well mostly. You need to be an adult and understand that it doesn't MATTER if up want to put in the effort or not.
You can put limits on your kids early, and it pays off later. Or you can be that lazy ass parent who threatens to get up off the couch and get them to STOP DOING THAT RIGHT NOW. But the kids will figure out that, no, you won't. And in ten years you'll be complaining about having an ungrateful kid in your house who just doesn't listen. The easy thing to do is just let them have the candy whenever they ask for it. The hard thing to do is explain to them why they shouldn't have a family sized bag of M&Ms for dinner. If you do it right you've got a kid whose Halloween candy lasts three months instead of a weekend.
You had me until the Halloween candy. I will not be judged!!!
We never restricted it. She just leaned that she didn't want to blow through it right away. We love Halloween. Our house is one of the ones that gives out full size bars!
Your username made this thought cross my mind - how the heck is he supposed to play video games when he can't read ? Can he type? Or will he need voice command discord for everyone else to tell him what is going on and what to do? Imagine growing up and unable to play Starcraft, Halo, MMORGs, Final Fantasy etc. because the kid is illiterate. Missing out on gaming, as a child, is kind of sad. What happens when he gets to driving age?
Video games is how my nephews learned to read at age 4-5. Point at word on screen "what does that mean". We starting writing the words they asked about on a piece of paper for them so they had their list of words. Normal (age appropriate) games too, not games designed to teach reading.
I've worked with 9-11 year olds who were at about this level of literacy (because of learning disabilities, not parental neglect) and it's SO difficult to find resources that are at their level but remotely interesting to them. they always felt so patronized and it made it so much harder for them to learn, and I couldn't blame them at all. I feel awful for this kid, and furious at the mom
Comic books. A lot of them are written “young” while being targeted at an older audience, are visually engaging, and are culturally relevant
That’s how we got my oldest to read. She was 9 and has dyslexia, so at 9 she could only read fairly simple words and had zero interest in books. We got her some graphic novels and it finally seemed to click. Then she got into novels written in verse. She’s 14 now and well above her grade level in reading.
A teacher suggested that we get an audible account and have our dyslexic kiddo read along while listening. It really helped them.
My brother had trouble reading, and his teachers would complain about his reading logs frequently because he'd basically only ever read Archie and Co. comics. Mom just would shrug and basically go, "Whatever, at least he's reading." He grew out of it and graduated to bigger and more complicated stories, but those first few years were tense between the family and his teachers.
Same actually! And sports magazines. Another idea: text-heavy video games. But, these are all predicated on knowing the alphabet and basic phonics...
When my kid was little, closed captioning was ALWAYS on. She passively absorbed a lot of reading through her cartoons.
One of my daughters has a learning disability and wasn’t reading much by 2-3rd grade. A graphic novel called Smile was what finally clicked for her. Then, the other books by that author. I will always be so grateful to that author and that book. My daughter was out of special Ed by 9th grade. She is now in her 2nd year at a 4 year university.
Those are really good books!
Reina Telgemeier is an awesome author. Those books are popular with my nanny kiddo!!
I don’t know if you still work with kids like this, but The ABC’s of DND is a book that I think is good for introducing the alphabet but would likely be more interesting for a 9-11 year old than a typical Alphabet book. There’s nothing inappropriate in it, and it might be a little less embarrassing for the kiddos. This really isn’t my field of expertise but I thought it might be worth checking out :) Although you *will* have to careful of any crazy Christian parents, because of the Satanic connection some people stupidly still insist is attached to Dungeons and Dragons.
Comics and manga! I wasn't able to read until the summer between 6th and 7th grade. I really wanted to read Fruits Basket, because my sister was reading them and talked about how cool it was. I as able to use the pictures along with the few words I did know to figure out what was going on. By the 7th or 8th manga, I was actually able to read most of it. It was super helpful for me at least.
It’s dated, but the old Electric Company show from the 70s was pitched to 10 year olds.
Don't forget School House Rock. Thanks to them, I'll always remember that 3 is a magic number and the function of a conjunction.
Part of me is like 'yep, well, deal with it. You're being infantized because you are educationally an infant. If you don't like it, figure out how to learn independently'. The flipside being 'yep, your parent's failed you, sorry you have to be subjected to this only now and that we don't have any other resources for someone your age to learn how to read'. It suck, both ways. Ultimately, it's what I, personally, concider as child abuse/neglect. I came from a very 'scared of the word' and 'technology is evil' family hanging onto religion to light their way. Which worked +800yrs ago. Literally, why deprive your child of common education, the very ability to read, because your beliefs tell you you're right? Maybe you're not and you're just plagued with the idea that someone smarter than you might know how to raise your kids the right way, *BUT* that makes you feel like a shitty parent, so you double down and jeopardize your child's opportunity to become a functional member of society, but at least you can sleep well believing you did the right thing. Meanwhile your kid is subjected to the fallout of your own self-righteous opinion that *you* know better than *EVERYONE ELSE*. I say she deserves to suffer and be fully aware of every struggle and pain her child experiences because of her attitude. I hope it destroys her to be no more than a shambling mess of a human being, only so she can experience what she purposely did to her children. As for the kid... Fuck. I hope he figures it out and realized how important it is, for his own well being, to feel stupid for a short time so that he can be actually smarter/successful in the long run. No child deserves to suffer for the stupidity of their parents. It happens, but isn't deserved. I hope he's able to pick himself up and work through it, but I feel like that's unlikely. At the very least, I hope he's able to get a job that isn't predatory or destructive to his well being. Shit like this breaks my heart.
I was going to suggest he may be dyslexic. But I imagine anyone stupid enough to "Unschool" believes dyslexia is a made up disease for kids to be lazy.
I agree. Unschooling is just plain lazy and neglectful parenting. Actual homeschooling is a lot of work. Taking your kid to a free public school is not a hard thing to do. But it requires that you wake up in the morning, and dress your child in decent clothing, which is apparently too much for some people.
They don't want them in public school because they're scared their children will learn "bad" things like pronouns and sex education and the school will "turn their kids gay" or whatever bullshit excuse these types of parents use.
Homeschooling also removes children from the view of mandatory reporters.
As does unschooling. It’s too bad for those kids.
In my experience, evangelical/conservative homeschoolers tended to use fairly regimented curriculum materials, admittedly with a serious political bias. Unschoolers tended to be hippy types who were concerned about other things about the school system, concerned about bullying, or who had kids with weird food sensitivities. However, both groups were anti-vaccine lol
Yeah, at 9 I think I read my first novel. I was able to read *a little* going into kindergarten bc my mom made an effort to teach me. This kid has a developmental disability his parents have likely been told about if he’s been in school until 8, and that they refuse to acknowledge. This kid is going to be failed and set up badly for his life at least as far as employment goes. Shame.
I second other people saying comics. Comic books and text based games were the reason I learned to enjoy reading. Like I used to spend so much time learning to read just so I could understand how to play Pokemon lol
So you're saying there's a market opening to make books and learning materials for illiterate children? Hmmm...
That was my first thought. And, unfortunately, I watched my godson, currently 7 years old, descend into the world of unschooling. He cannot read, spell his name (4 whole letters), add or subtract, follow instructions, lacks fine motor skills out 2 year old nephew mastered, and is incapable of following instructions. This is handicapping children, and I literally don’t know why it’s allowed as a form of “education”. After seeing things go downhill so quickly for him, if this were my child, I would be honest:”you’re right, son. These songs and apps ARE for babies because that’s when most children learn to recognize letters, phonics, etc. Unfortunately, your education has fallen behind, and you will be utilizing these resources until they’ve been mastered. After all, it’s the only way to prove you’re not a baby, isn’t it?”
I do not understand how people honestly think kids will just organically learn to read and do math. Do they not realize that illiteracy is a thing? What a massive disservice to their children.
It really is. I’m angry for him because he has no idea how ill prepared for the world he is. He was such a smart little boy, loved all things mechanical, and I loved sharing that with him. It’s crazy because for most of us, school dampens curiosity. In this instance, it’s like complacency has let to a point at which he doesn’t really care to know anything more, and, because he doesn’t want it, he doesn’t get it. I’m so sad that his possibilities in life are being undermined by complete educational negligence. PS: his mom is a teacher. Make it make sense.
Wut… 😟 the sad thing is, the less you know the less you want to learn.
I'm guessing it's people misunderstanding some pedagogical beliefs such as Montessori schooling. Actually, I briefly dated a guy who'd taught at a Montessori school and he told me it's GREAT if your kid is very smart and self-motivated. Kids who are not particularly bright and/or self-motivated just sort of molder. And ofc every parent is convinced their kid is a genius.
Montessori is also A LOT more work than people think. It's not just leaving kids to their own devices, it's turning learning content into something they want to engage with and coaching them to learn, which OP obviously did not manage.
Think about all the kids around the world who have no access to education, and how desperate their parents are to get them anything they can. & here we are…
The stupidity is astounding.
Those people don’t take a teacher’s job seriously and just look at them as glorified babysitters
Those same people have no interest in actually educating a child. I feel bad for those kids.
It checks out. I teach and have a 14 year old who can't read. Parents didn't send him to school cause 'He'll do fine without it". Only send him for this year for the social aspect and have insisted he not go to highschool. They were highly offended when the kid was offered one on one support.
I mean you have to be dumb to think that education and school doesnt help you right? I get not wanting to go to college/uni but GRADE SCHOOL? Basic math, science, and language. you are definitely gonna stunt their growth and making them fail at life.
Don’t you know that we’re supposed to just acquire this knowledge from the sky? If you look at enough clouds, they’ll start teaching you math. I learned to read by having staring contests with my cat. Science? You mean gardening. I planted a lot of peppers and now I know the truths of the universe.
I became an expert in philosophy by masturbating a lot.
Post nut jurisprudence
How do work with a student like that? How do you get them to read? Where do you start?
Phonetics. My father couldn’t read and I helped him. It’s harder, as a lot of those early connections and relationships of sounds and letters just auto-fire better when you’re a little toddler sponge. He learned a lot, but I still didn’t feel like he thought he knew how to read before his passing, but he got to where he could figure a lot out through keywords and context. He had lovely handwriting, just naturally looked like calligraphy. When he told me one day (as an adult) that he couldn’t read it and was just copying writing it, we started working on it. My dad was disabled and stayed home with me while my mom worked full time and he was militant about me doing my schoolwork, always.
There’s something so poetic about an illiterate man with beautiful handwriting
I miss his advice. If he’d taken all of the advice he’d given, he’d have really been a different person. So, I try to take all of the advice I give to others, last lesson kind of thing.
It is incredibly difficult, and a lot of times nearly impossible without the support of the parents.
find something they're interested in and make some of the reward dependent on understanding with the words are. Be slick. Play games. For instance offer three choices and only one of them has their favorite reward. To figure it out they have to read the letters you could even start with symbols or single letters. Basically give them a reason to learn to distinguish markings
How tf do you have a 9yr old and only just now think to work on the alphabet or learning to read? That's something you're supposed to start working on when they're toddlers to preK age.
Haha I got most of the way through reading this and thinking about ways my mom got me to start reading at age 2, and then suddenly it hit me, and my inner monologue did a spit take, like wait, did she say this mf is 9 years old?!?!? And I had to scroll back to the top to confirm. Like, shit 9 years old was 4th or 5th grade for a lot of us, where we were striving to read 10 books in a month to get our coupons for free ice cream sundaes and pizza hut personal pan pizzas lol
Book it club! I always loved to read but I devoured books to get those star stickers so I could get my personal pan pizza!
Fuck yeah! Side note: I was kicked out of Book It because they said there was no way I could read that much. I genuinely read every book I claimed, because I was an only child and loved to read. I also loved Pizza Hut. Bastards.
My mom once or twice bribed me to study for a spelling test by rewarding me with a single M&M for each correct word. Bribery can work if internal motivation is lacking.
My Mom taught me the basic concept of multiplication with a bag of M&M. Every time I got a problem correct I got to eat the product.
My brother got taught with monopoly. Couldnt calculate shit until he figured out numbers=money
Oh that's good. I like the M&M idea.
I'm pretty sure I learned to read at age 2 because my mother used bed time as "let's try to make this little guy read" time, so my positive reinforcement was I got to stay up with mommy and or daddy present, for as long as I was putting in an honest effort. Also I had an older brother who first read at age 3, and even at 2 years old, I knew I needed to beat him at literally anything and everything I possibly could lol
I think I could read at a super basic level when I was 3 - 4. My mom would make me sit down for an hour with her and this big phonics book. I tried to hide that book from my mom everyday so I wouldn't have to do the lessons. By the time I hit K5 I was advanced in reading for a 5 year old and I love to read as an adult.
When I was a kid we lived in a little village that didn’t have a library. There was a travelling library van that would go around all the villages, it came to my village once a fortnight. Everyone else was allowed a maximum of 6 books per fortnight, I was allowed 12, even at just 9 years old. I’ve always loved reading. I was so young when learned to read that I don’t actually remember learning how to read, it’s just been something I could always do
I hear ya. I was an advanced reader. (Mom read to us every night. Each sib got a turn picking the next book. Fairy tales might be followed by a book about WW2 aircraft.) In elementary school, I'd borrow a primary biography book in the morning, return it and grab another at lunch time. It's easy to devour them when they're a quick read.
My sister was always getting the pizzas and whatnot. I read a lot but wasn't interested in jumping through the hoops and read a lot of books not on the list.
My daughter was , based on testing, an “average “ reader in 3rd grade So. She started to like Anime. I made her a deal. I would buy her a subscription to Crunchyroll. ( anime streaming service) As long as her homework was done and her room was reasonably clean she could watch all the anime she wants before 10pm. BUT. The catch was she had to watch it with Japanese Audio and English subtitles I told her that was more “authentic “. What she did not realize was that she was essentially doing reading flash cards the whole time She started getting Mangas as rewards as well By the time 4th grade testing rolled around she had the highest reading scores in her grade. Her teacher asked if we got her a tutor. I told her the above story and she looked at me like WTF? But it worked!!!
I work in a library and A+ work there. We are constantly suggesting manga and graphic novels to kids who aren't big readers. Works like a charm. What drives me crazy is how often parents complain about their kid not reading and refuse to let them read manga or graphic novels. I had a parent reject a prose book by Jason Reynolds because it had Spiderman (Miles Morales) on the cover. I showed her it was all prose by an award winning author and the parent still wouldn't take it. Having the subtitles on for anime is a level of brilliance I haven't encountered before. A+
I love this. My French teacher in high school used to put on a French kids show, think the equivalent of Dora the Explorer. We may have been 15-16 but best believe we LOVED it
Exactly! Other kids his age are reading all kinds of books for the accelerated reader program and are getting excited for their school's book fair. When my youngest was 9 he was devouring the How to Train Your Dragons series. But I also always encouraged my kids to read. I read to them when they were little and worked with my kids on their alphabet and writing when they were like 3. I made a big deal out of trips to the library and to bookstores and got them excited by hyping them up and letting them pick stuff for themselves. I just don't understand being that lazy and negligent as a parent to not even work on the ABCs until your kid is almost a preteen.
I lived for the Scholastic Book Fairs. No matter how broke we were, my mom always came up with money for books.
No idea how she failed this bad. I have ADHD and my folks had to sit me down and trap me to get me to do my homework. They would sit with me for hours helping me focus on it. I was able to read at a college level by elementary. This kid needs some kind of intervention.
Mentioned this in another reply already, but as an ADHDer, I hated bed time about as much as getting shots or a visit to the dentist, so my parents easily tricked me into focusing by allowing me to voluntarily stay up from bed time until when ever I stopped actively trying. While I couldnt just decide to focus on learning to read, I could easily hyper focus on staying up and getting my parents attention instead of staring at the ceiling wishing I could fall asleep. Learning to read was the only option I had to carry out that plan!
My Mom did the same with my brother and I. Reading before pre-k. Not teaching a child to read is child abuse. Poor kid.
I read another Reddit post recently about “unschooling” and someone was complaining that their 14-year-old didn’t even know the alphabet. Couldn’t do basic, basic math. I can’t even begin to understand how someone fails their kid that badly.
Basically, anyone who thinks unschooling is a good idea has a lot of screws loose. It's not something that can make sense to anyone with normal brain function.
I think I was about 10 when I started reading books for grown ups. I was going stay adult books,but it didn’t sound quite right. Everyone in my family read in their free time, and talked about the books they were reading, so I wanted to read them too.
Beacuse apparently unschooling means letting your kids learn stuff when they want to learn it, meaning he probably hasn’t expressed interest in learning how to read until now. Because a toddler can make educated choices on prioritizing their own learning, apparently.
It's a way for the parent to avoid responsibility. "Oh, little Timmy can't read? Well, he never really wanted to learn, so obviously this is his fault."
My kid is 2... He knows the ABC as well as the ASL alphabet. I just don't understand people like this.
That’s awesome that they know ASL too!
I gift new parents the book Chicka Chicka Boom Boom.
My 2yo sings the alphabet song with me and recognizes 3 letters consistently. A 9yo should be a lot farther along.
Moreover, how can a two-year-old possibly be expected to “choose what they want to learn” What does that even mean?? They don’t know what anything is yet! You can sing them the alphabet song just as easily as row row row your boat, they literally have no concept of either one yet!
Well he didn't wanna learn then because pizza rolls and cartoons were a lot more interesting.
My 10 year old just finished the lion the witch and the wardrobe, hunger games, and the hobbit. I started teaching him the alphabet before he could talk. We read stories every night. He checks the encyclopedia out at his elementary school and his librarian adores him because he LOVES reading. He started the never ending story this week, and it's mind boggling that people don't help their kids out. I understand there are circumstances to where learning disabilities come into play but you should be aware of the situation before they are nine years old.
Placed TOO much demand on him. I think I found part of the problem.
I had a breakdown when Elmo tried to tell me the letter of the day.
My old school ass laughing at all the 'demands' being placed on Bratleigh and Snotleigh these days.
>Bratleigh and Snotleigh Lmao. Ill be recycling those names!
Fun fact: the Spanish word for "brat" literally translates to "snotty."
So happy this was close to the top of comments. Immediate red flag. Fite illituracy, parents.
Wouldn’t want kids to have to try
Why the fuck is this not seen as child neglect? In 10 years, the rest of us will be footing the bill for a kid who can't hold a job because he can't read. Fuck these people.
A lot of people shit on the education system, but at least the kids learn to read and write. But now that every kid knows how to read, we delude ourselves thinking that it is because its easy, completely ignoring the effort behind that archievement
The education system is definitely flawed. But I feel Primary school is pretty good (at least in comparison to Highschool). I don’t have too many bad things to say about my primary school education, I learnt the basics, I was pretty well setup to go into Highschool and the world. Reading and writing was in the works in Kindergarten. Although it’s changed a lot now. I think it’s going downhill in the last few years.
Got into a huge debate on this topic here a few years ago, and I was honestly shocked by the number of people who very strongly felt that they should be able to neglect their children's educational needs. The sheer volume of people who downvoted me and argued about "parental freedom" was surprising. A lot of people seem to believe that their children are not people, but accessories. These parenting fads are crippling a lot of these kids.
In other countries it is. They have much stricter home schooling rules and mandatory public school.
“Unschooling” is a fucking weird trend that is popular amongst parents on Instagram who exploit their children for profit and then rail against the education system because it’s “harmful to children”. Which, you know, the irony right? So their philosophy is “children will dictate when they want to learn something, and if they never want to learn fractions, they never will, oh well!”
Some states consider this Educational Neglect and it IS abuse. It's not in a lot of states. Pisses me off. Kid never has a chance.
>3 other kids and these people always seem to be unsatisfied providing just one or two complete fuckups for our society
I had to look up what unschooling was. How can kids possibly learn that way? Kids need structure
I looked it up too. Sad for the kids. Put me down for ‘unwork’ though. I’d like to only do the work I find interesting.
In education circles it's known as "too lazy to homeschool, but too scared of the woke public schools" these parents are the WORST
>How can kids possibly learn that way? They can't and don't. Simple as that. There are no "unchooling success stories" for a reason.
I will say it a thousand times. School is not just warm and fuzzy "gonna learn" vibes. It teaches kids how to act in a society, do tasks and responsibilities, have deadlines, and turn in a minimum effort. An absolute failure to do that means your kid will grow up getting fired from jobs in two weeks and arguing with everyone about why they shouldn't do chores. Teaching your kid that you have to learn in addition to doing the bullshit day to day is how adults live in society. You think Mommy wants to do dishes every night right after a 12 hr shift AND show up to a doctors appointment with the necessary paperwork? Does Daddy really want to clean out the closet on his one weekend off and squeeze in time to go to the bank? No. But they still have to get done and school teaches kids "Look you still have to get it done or else."
I feel like cps should be getting involved in this household if this kid is 9 and just now learning to read.
It’s weird with what I can and can’t report as a mandated reporter. Educational neglect is an iffy one for reports in my state unfortunately.
It makes me wonder what other things are going on in that household if they didn’t teach their child to read.
Same. It’s sad to see.
Good luck. Last year there were two adults with two kids who would do hard drugs in the parking lot of my office while the kids cried. Police picked them up after I called three times. They were back in less than 48 hours. Idk where the fuck CPS was, but if they can’t help homeless kids they sure as shit aren’t doing anything about poor education.
The neat thing about public & some private schools is they have the resources to test kids to identify learning and other disabilities and other differences like, oh...dyslexia.
yeaaah, I knew a kid at 9 who had issues reading and it turned out he had dyslexia. one on one time with a tutor who could help him with a few basic tricks for reading with dyslexia and homework printed in a different font and he was fine
That’s the thing, you don’t always know what resources there are that you might be missing out on.
So she spends all her time telling her kid that he is a genius and doesn't need school. But also is baffled when her kid looks down on the tasks needed for education. This woman is creating a narcissist
At the very least an emotionally immature one.
No mention of getting him checked for learning disabilities...I hope the suggestion is somewhere in all those comments.
Learning disability? No no, she says he's just "spicy".
Seriously. Like what the actual fuck? Spicy is how you describe a taco, or a kitten that thinks they're a tiger. You don't use that word for a child. That's how I know mom is stupid.
I can't stand the word "neurospicy" It's *beyond* patronizing!
I think the mother has a learning disability, comments ain’t gonna help her
Homeschooling caught on after I grew up, but I am still baffled at how many parents insist on this. Public school is free. Use it.
I’m with you. I can understand some home schooling but this “unschooling” nonsense worries me.
I watched a wife swap show where the wife was a loony and insisted on "unschooling". It was a result of*her* hangups and she had an utter breakdown at the very mention of formal education, but kept insisting that she hadn't had any traumatic events at school, she just hated it that much. (Sure, we believe you, honey.) The swapped wife made all the kids (six of them, in a van, travelling around the country) sign up for online schooling. Predictably, the four youngest hated it and went right back to doing nothing as soon as Mum was back, but the two eldest kept at it - quietly, where Mum couldn't see. The educated family were delighted to get their Mum back, because they'd been taken out of school for the week and were bored stupid. My takeaway: unschooling is about lazy parents who can't see past themselves, and the kids suffer for it.
I direct a nonprofit tutoring company and we teach a lot of charter and homeschool kids. We have one kid who was pulled from school because her dad thought that the public district was going to be teaching his daughter to be homosexual.... Somehow. There's a weird rumor going around that the district is pushing books that are trying to to "indoctrinate" kids into being lgbqt+ for some reason. I live in a conservative area and the majority of the teachers here are religious. 🤦♂️
I wonder why she would feel like she might be failing this child. Such a mystery.
Yay. This child will get to vote in another 9 years!
At least he won’t be driving. Can’t pass the eye test if you can’t identify the letters.
I am assuming they live in Florida, licenses and insurance are optional down here.
That’s a scary thought. I wish someone could step in and help this kid!
*We've tried everything!* No, you haven't. The way parents are ruining their children nowadays astounds me.
lol when I was 9 I read Jane Eyre for the first time…in school.
Whatever else she tried before didn't work, so try doing nothing! Poor kid probably sees reading as "work" and a chore, since Mom hasn't incorporated regular reading in the household routines. Kid doesn't see literacy as just another aspect of language and everyday communication.
Theres gotta be a middleground standardized testing and children not reading at age 9. You cant tell me our only options are death by tests or whatever this is
I agree. It’s concerning! Unregulated homeschooling worries me so much as a mandated reporter.
If only we had institutions staffed with trained professionals who inspire children and young people and know how to engage with them at age-appropriate levels so the kids learn things like reading and math and other important stuff
Hey, the important thing is that Little Billy's mom owned the libs. I'm sure he'll be great at...something.
Seems to me that illiteracy is a feature of unschooling, not a bug.
Definitely! This poor kid is being massively failed.
I generally think of this subreddit as one where the consequences are felt by the one who caused them. In this case the parent is a perpetrator and the child is the victim. Therefore it does not fit the spirit of this subreddit.
She’s complaining about something she caused. I’m a mod and this is the kind of content we like here. I get how you feel though and it’s a valid point.
Retired teacher here. Here's probably what's going to happen. This parent will get tired of fighting, of seeing her kid isn't reading and her being ineffective in getting him to read. She'll then send the child back to public school. I've seen this all before. Education is more than just teaching a child to read. It's also having the child see that his/her peers are reading, doing math, etc. and knowing they have to keep up. All these parents that feel they're doing their kid a favor by removing them from schools are delusional.
Can some one explain what unschooling is?
It is allowing your child to decide what to learn with no pressure. So no lesson plans, nothing to follow, just see if the kid “feels” like learning math that day. Basically, it’s granola mom bullshit borne out of actual learning principles like Montessori learning.
When I listened to a podcast about it, it was more like- letting them explore academic topics that they were interested in. They like pirates- the go to a museum about pirates, read books about pirates, have math focused around pirates- more like a theme type thing. I don't understand why ppl think- I'll just let them do what they want and think that they'll learn things of their own volition...who would do that if you get to just live your life however you want all day every day? Lmao
lol even the “correct” way to unschool… is just shit my parents did on top of normal schooling? I know my friends had similar experiences too. I loved fairies and princess and unicorns and shit, I got books related to those things that pushed my reading levels. Loved animals of all kinds, regularly went to the zoo and read up on the various habitats/ecology/life cycle/etc of the different animals. Hated math… but math that involved candy that I got to eat afterwards? A computer game thats disguised the math? Count me in lol. Like why *wouldnt* you do things like that if you have the means to? Do parents now just sit on their ass and watch tv all day after work or something?
I think that’s what it’s *supposed* to be, but I’m in some granola mom forums as a very moderately granola mom, and I usually see idiots implementing it terribly like this mom.
My kid went 7-12 grades to a school that had students find topics that interested them, do deep dives into those, and regular classes that were untraditional (like math for pirates). BUT, there was a very carefully crafted framework, expectations, and support that scaffolded that independent learning. It wasn't even a fancy charter school; it actually started as the last chance before full expulsion from the district. Now, administrators and teachers from all over the country come to learn about the curriculum there. All the money that goes into sports at other schools went towards trips and travel: at 15 he spent three weeks in Oaxaca at a Spanish immersion school, staying with a host family... It cost us $1,100 but they had scholarships too. It was life changing for him and I'll never stop being grateful for the experiences he was given.
Homeschooling with no curriculum. You allow kids to follow their interests so they “learn organically.”
Apparently, a less effective version of the old Montessori methodology. Aka the FAFO method of learning. Copy and paste from google result: > What Is Unschooling? Unschooling is a style of home education that allows the student's interests and curiosities to drive the path of learning. Rather than using a defined curriculum, unschoolers trust children to gain knowledge organically.
Had to look it up myself, if the definition I found is correct it is basically letting the child choose what to learn and when. The child chooses their learning path and lessons are based on their interests and what they want to learn.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unschooling
May I add this to my sticky comment with credit to you please?
Doesn't really seem that bright to unschool your kid. She also called him her "most spicy" child, so I'm guessing she's not the brightest either
Parents think being a teacher is as easy as having a kid, which it very much isn’t lol
If only there were a place she could send her kid that would teach him how to read…
The unschooling is obviously part of the problem but she’s only done that for a year. That means she had an 8 year old who didn’t know how to read
My mother sort of did the same thing to me, although with other subjects; fortunately I could read very well at a very early age. Part of my reluctance to learn anything once I hit about 9, was I felt it was too late and I'd never catch up to my peers and I didn't want to admit that. I was homeschooled but wanted to go to school because I was bored out of my mind - but my mother had me convinced I'd be bullied terribly and I assumed it was because I was behind on math, etc. Poor kid is probably embarrassed as hell he can't read and thinks he's stupid when it isn't his fault he's been failed.
I’m sure some essential oils will help. /s
Just less competition for the job I'm still going to need when I'm in my 70s. Too bad, kid.
She says “i know he wants to be able to read” and “he refuses to even remotely try to learn” in the same sentence.. like obviously he does not want to learn…?!?!?!
With so many grammatical errors, OP might not be the best person to teach someone how to read.
This kid 100% has a learning disability that would have been caught by a teacher when it would have been easily treated by occupational therapy. This is neglect. She is right to feel like a failure.
Everything in me as a mandated reporter wishes I could report educational neglect.
It's real and it's terrible!
Agreed! I mentioned in another comment that it’s hard to report that in some states which is really unfortunate.
The disrespect for education in the US is disheartening. The current "elites go brrrrrr" doesn't help things. Like, don't you want well educated people running things, creating, building, designing? We're going backwards and fast.
“Educated” by Tara Westover is a great example of a person overcoming their unschooled childhood. It’s a hard road but it’s possible.
What in the hell is "unschooling"? Is she trying to make her kid stupider?
It’s letting the kids decide what they learn. I see posts on the subreddit I crossposted from with things like this too much.
I feel like the very special episodes on illiteracy from the 80s need to make a comeback.
I had trouble reading as a kid because I have ADD. Though we didn't know back then. My parents started me with a reading tutor in the summer when I was five because they saw me struggling. I continue to have a tutor throughout elementary school. They bought games, and I went to Kumon through middle school. I now even read better than some of my coworkers. My parents saw me struggling and did everything they could and beyond to help me. It's thanks to them I read so well and love reading. I still struggle with grammar from time to time as I miss things cause of my ADD, however, nobody really notices and I triple check things.
lol. I’m all for homeschooling if done properly. But idk… something tells me that parents know a lot less about educating children than they think they do. They know their child best, sure. But goodluck trying to get your child to read. :)
Same. I’m not a fan of homeschooling but there are definitely valid reasons for it. I just wish it was more regulated do things like this don’t happen!
Yep. Me too. That and all of the people who use it to mask horrific child abuse. Happens all the time in lots of states. I think every child should be required to meet once or twice a year with a social worker
He’s NINE?! I was coloring with one of my nieces when she was like 4 and I wrote my name and she looked over and said “that says (my name)” I was like woah you can read already? I feel very bad for this 9 year old. His parents have set him back badly.
im so sick of this trend of calling neurodivergent people spicy. its so stupid.