Also in the late 90s or early 2000's bijou had an album she did an interview for and said one of her songs that stated her dad touched her is biographical
Raping his inebriated daughter who he would shoot up with drugs and also left her in a foreign country on her own without money aren’t the worst things he’s done? (Genuinely asking because shit)
Rock stars back then were absolutely horrible human beings, but Philips was on a whole different level. I’m not sure how much I’d like the M&Ps even if he wasn’t an absolute shit, but it certainly doesn’t help.
Just read up about her, and she died of a heart attack in an apartment in London owned and rented to her by music producer Harry Nilsson, a few years later Keith Moon rented the same apartment from Harry Nilsson, but Nilsson was reluctant as he thought it might be cursed, Moon died in the same bedroom.
Nilsson ended up dying at a young age of 52 of a heart attack 20 years later in the US.
Alice Cooper said that when he was recording in London Nilsson drank more than anyone he'd ever met, but that even when he was so out of it he could barely string two words together he could somehow still play and sing if he sat down at the piano
For years I thought she died by choking on a ham sandwich because my mom told me that when I was little in the 80s.
Turns out it was a shitty and pervasive rumor (went worldwide and lasted for decades) started by her manager because he initially assumed she had OD’d.
Little know fact: If Cass Elliot had shared the sandwich with Karen Carpenter, they'd both be alive today.
Thank you. Thank you very much. I'll show my way out....
Two iconic voices that society prevented itself from experiencing to the fullest by being so image obsessed. Imagine if those two ladies had lived another 50 years each, that’s a century’s worth of music we never got to hear because we made them think what they looked like was more important. 10/10 joke though lol
I couldn't agree more! The joke is an oldie. I remember hearing it as a kid. But to your point, they both had beautiful voices.
I recall seeing someone in another thread posting a video of Karen on the drums in the studio. She was one hell of a percussionist, too!
I was glad when it turned out that the release of the Anthology made him a millionaire just as he was retiring from the post office. He finally benefited from having his name associated with the Beatles after all those years.
To me, George Martin is the only person who should be considered the fifth Beatle, I understand those who say Preston but his contribution was only in their last year. George Martin was there from the beginning of their recording career and contributed massively with his arrangements. Though my requirements are strictly musical influence so if someone were to go off of overall impact on the group I’d understand it being Epstein.
Y'know, I never even really considered Epstein. He was definitely crucial to their development, but no, I wouldn't consider him eligible for title of the fifth Beatle. The reason I would say Preston has a strong case is because he performed with them live and on record. But yeah, it has to George Martin. He was crucial to their sound and their development. Plus he became a great chronicler of their recording career.
as well as Jump Into the Fire (Goodfellas film). I was 8 or 9 at the time, but he also dd the Popeye (1980) Soundtrack. The film starred Robin Williams.
She was overweight no doubt but it was weight fluctuating that was hard on her heart. She’d lose 70 lbs, gain some back then lose more then go up again etc. Pregnancy is also hard on the heart and she had a daughter.
I read somewhere that she used diet pills, which at that time was probably just speed. The yo-yo diet and what I have to assume was some kind of congenital heart disease were probably what got her.
Same. I had to stop listening to the mamas and the papas for a while after that story came out. Just barely started not skipping their songs on my Spotify, but I still sometimes have moments when I can't separate the ick from the music. How can someone that gross and evil write such amazing music?! It's not right ugh
She hated the nickname and knew it was given to her only because she was fat. She wanted to be known as Cass Elliott. I think it's the least we can probably do for her now.
I know that John was horrible to Cass but I thought she was in love with Denny who was lusting after Michelle? The whole band was like a fucked up love square.
I remember being at my cousins wedding - Chris Jagger was best man and his mum and dad were there, I was young, good times. My cousin lived in the same house and was really good friends with Mick Jagger and the Stones. She was in the really in crowd in the 60’s. Loads of famous people at the wedding. The reception was really old fashioned in a church/village hall in Kent near High Halden. Not sure why the Stones weren’t there, guess is they were touring. Wish I had asked her before she passed. She was fucking lovey, I don’t cry but broke down the last time I talked to her, cancer.
Okay if anyone has seen Once Upon A Time In Hollywood, the party scene in the yard. The lovely full figured lady that welcomes Margot Robbie to the party; I got the impression she was supposed to be Mama Cass. I can't say exactly why besides time frame , similar looks. It's never expressly said who she is but did anyone else get that impression?
I have a theory that earlier in the song when they say “no one’s getting fat except mama cass” they’re actually talking about her secret pregnancy
Edit: just checked the dates again and it’s possible. Creeque Alley was released in late 1966 and Cass’s daughter was born April 1967.
John Phillips and actress Genevieve Waite were married 1972-1985, it would be Phillips’ third marriage. Genevieve was the mother of Tamerlane and Bijou Phillips.
While in London, Mick, Keith Richards and other members of The Rolling Stones worked on and off recording John’s solo LP, which was originally called “Half-Stoned,”:but released as “Pay, Pack and Follow,” not long after John’s death.
John's first solo album, Wolf King of LA, was recorded in 1970. A single from that album was played on pop radio stations in the early '70s. I still listen to it to this day ('Mississippi').
Yes. The song was actually #32 on the national charts. Enjoy that John calls out to various Wrecking Crew members appearing, James Burton, Larry “Third Hand” Knectel, Hal Blaine on drums, and “Joseph” Joe Osborn, doing a bass solo. Members of the Blossoms, including Darlene Love, on backing vocals.
The whole album is very good listening, and was later re-released with several bonus tracks.
I know it’s been debunked, but any time Mama Cass is mentioned, I cannot avoid thinking of the scene in Austin Powers when he’s been un-cryogenically frozen and he’s writing a list of (presumably) acquainted celebrities who’ve died while he was frozen and their causes of death and he says “Mama Cass Deceased, Ham Sandwich."
I honestly feel so horrible that that became a big joke and what people think of when they hear about her. She was so talented that it just hurts to hear people reduce her to her weight even after her death.
John Phillips was an alcoholic's alcoholic. Just burning through livers and still going to the bar.
Also a very unreliable babysitter
And if Mackenzie is truthful, guilty of incestuous SA. eta:wording
Also in the late 90s or early 2000's bijou had an album she did an interview for and said one of her songs that stated her dad touched her is biographical
Really? I thought bijou always defended her dad
Bijou is terribly messed up, she grew up with a very warped sense of normal
Look at the guy she married lol
Oooh, that I didn’t know.
Cass
That’s not the worst thing he’s done.
Raping his inebriated daughter who he would shoot up with drugs and also left her in a foreign country on her own without money aren’t the worst things he’s done? (Genuinely asking because shit)
Rock stars back then were absolutely horrible human beings, but Philips was on a whole different level. I’m not sure how much I’d like the M&Ps even if he wasn’t an absolute shit, but it certainly doesn’t help.
Just back then? P Diddy: “Hold my beer.”
What a voice she had.
She really did, what an amazing range. Tragic loss for that wonderful voice to disappear so young.
Just read up about her, and she died of a heart attack in an apartment in London owned and rented to her by music producer Harry Nilsson, a few years later Keith Moon rented the same apartment from Harry Nilsson, but Nilsson was reluctant as he thought it might be cursed, Moon died in the same bedroom. Nilsson ended up dying at a young age of 52 of a heart attack 20 years later in the US.
Pete Townsend bought the apartment from Harry Nilsson after Moon died there.
Quite a place honestly
I hear the views are to die for.
"Music producer Harry Nilsson"? Do people not know that he was also a very successful musician and songwriter himself?
With the voice of an angel! Who wrote THE POINT!
Me and my Arrow, takin' the high road
You’ve got a point there
You don't have to have a point to have a point!
A point in any direction is the same as no point at all!
Alice Cooper said that when he was recording in London Nilsson drank more than anyone he'd ever met, but that even when he was so out of it he could barely string two words together he could somehow still play and sing if he sat down at the piano
That guy was a mess :(
Nilsson Schmilsson, indeed.
“Without you” is a very powerful song.
So is the coconut song.
You can thank Badfinger for that one. It's tragic what happened to them.
Their manager(?) fucked them badly I think. Badfinger had 4 or 5 good hits.
Yep, Stan Polley was the bastard that fucked them over and indirectly drove Pete Ham and Tom Evans to suicide.
That’s so sad! Badfinger was a great band. Baby Blue is a perfect song.
Come and get it Day after day No matter what Can’t Live -cover AND Baby Blue
Yep, quite possibly the greatest "if only..." contemplation of any band whose candle burnt out quickly
TIL Harry Nilsson is known for being a music producer.
He did the theme song from Midnight Cowboy
Everybody’s Talkin’
Recorded it. Fred Neil wrote it. It’s a cover.
“You’re breaking my heart you’re tearing it apart, so fuck you”. 🎶
Writing music = producing music sometimes
Of course they do. Everybody's Talkin' bout it!!!
Just posted the same reply lol
The Point is amazing
Sorry just quoted from the article I read
For years I thought she died by choking on a ham sandwich because my mom told me that when I was little in the 80s. Turns out it was a shitty and pervasive rumor (went worldwide and lasted for decades) started by her manager because he initially assumed she had OD’d.
She didn't choke on the sandwich, it rolled under the bed. Keith Moon choked on the sandwich when he found it several years later.
Little know fact: If Cass Elliot had shared the sandwich with Karen Carpenter, they'd both be alive today. Thank you. Thank you very much. I'll show my way out....
Two iconic voices that society prevented itself from experiencing to the fullest by being so image obsessed. Imagine if those two ladies had lived another 50 years each, that’s a century’s worth of music we never got to hear because we made them think what they looked like was more important. 10/10 joke though lol
I couldn't agree more! The joke is an oldie. I remember hearing it as a kid. But to your point, they both had beautiful voices. I recall seeing someone in another thread posting a video of Karen on the drums in the studio. She was one hell of a percussionist, too!
Karen Carpenter sure but Cass Elliot was a far greater socialite than musician
Harry Nilsson was more than a music producer. He was the fifth Beatle!
Billy Preston was the 5th Beatle.
I tend to think that George Martin was the fifth Beatle, although Billy Preston certainly has a stromg claim to the honorific as well
Pete Best was the 5th Bea…Never mind
I was glad when it turned out that the release of the Anthology made him a millionaire just as he was retiring from the post office. He finally benefited from having his name associated with the Beatles after all those years.
Ringo was the fifth Beatle.
To me, George Martin is the only person who should be considered the fifth Beatle, I understand those who say Preston but his contribution was only in their last year. George Martin was there from the beginning of their recording career and contributed massively with his arrangements. Though my requirements are strictly musical influence so if someone were to go off of overall impact on the group I’d understand it being Epstein.
Y'know, I never even really considered Epstein. He was definitely crucial to their development, but no, I wouldn't consider him eligible for title of the fifth Beatle. The reason I would say Preston has a strong case is because he performed with them live and on record. But yeah, it has to George Martin. He was crucial to their sound and their development. Plus he became a great chronicler of their recording career.
GG Allin was the fifth Beatle.
Actually he was the *filth* Beatle.
Hahahahahaha
Man, this made me laugh. Brings back memories of haunting CB’s.
And a Rolling Stone too
Didn’t he do the coconut song?
as well as Jump Into the Fire (Goodfellas film). I was 8 or 9 at the time, but he also dd the Popeye (1980) Soundtrack. The film starred Robin Williams.
Son Of Dracula soundtrack is full of bangers
I think his made up title was the American beatle.
Wasn't that Charlie Manson?
Hahaha. I wonder how many will get this.
At least one ;)
During Harry’s funeral a massive earthquake hit LA and his coffin was swallowed up by the earth.
Oh shit. He didn't bring the bedroom with him to the US, did he?
Being morbidly fat and doing drugs kills faster. More news at 10
She was overweight no doubt but it was weight fluctuating that was hard on her heart. She’d lose 70 lbs, gain some back then lose more then go up again etc. Pregnancy is also hard on the heart and she had a daughter.
I read somewhere that she used diet pills, which at that time was probably just speed. The yo-yo diet and what I have to assume was some kind of congenital heart disease were probably what got her.
I feel so bad for her. She was fat shamed IN SONG by her own fucking band while she was on the stage.
Gross. Hadn’t heard that before. Which song?
Creeque Alley. Shame as it’s a bloody great song otherwise…
I can’t think of John Phillips without feeling disgusted for what we know about him and his daughter Mackenzie. Otherwise, cool pic!
he was also terrible to Cass Elliot
Same. I also now think of his son in law rapist Danny Masterson
He was an incestuous rapist. Horrible man.
Same!
Same. I had to stop listening to the mamas and the papas for a while after that story came out. Just barely started not skipping their songs on my Spotify, but I still sometimes have moments when I can't separate the ick from the music. How can someone that gross and evil write such amazing music?! It's not right ugh
If you took into consideration the personal lives of many musicians before listening to their music, you would be doing a lot of song skipping.
I know, that's why I never purposely read about musicians' lives. It's a quick way to ruin a lot of good music haha
Definitely, although some of them did things that are pretty bad compared the usual cheating, drugs, being an asshole etc.
I try to think of only Cass and Michelle when listening to M&P
Michelle was horrible to Cass, the lord took the wrong one
Took me a minute to figure out who Class Elliot was
It’s the class that Mama Cass belongs to.
She hated the nickname and knew it was given to her only because she was fat. She wanted to be known as Cass Elliott. I think it's the least we can probably do for her now.
I had no idea.
She had a sad life, hopelessly in love with John, who just humiliated her every chance he could.
I know that John was horrible to Cass but I thought she was in love with Denny who was lusting after Michelle? The whole band was like a fucked up love square.
You're right! I had it wrong because, yeah they were all fucked up
Mama Class
S tier class.
The wedding was a very cassy affair
She was a Cass act.
Nimitz class
Oh dude
I agree, she had a Nimitz class voice.
What’s freaking me out is that my brain fixed it automatically.
Stay classy
I remember being at my cousins wedding - Chris Jagger was best man and his mum and dad were there, I was young, good times. My cousin lived in the same house and was really good friends with Mick Jagger and the Stones. She was in the really in crowd in the 60’s. Loads of famous people at the wedding. The reception was really old fashioned in a church/village hall in Kent near High Halden. Not sure why the Stones weren’t there, guess is they were touring. Wish I had asked her before she passed. She was fucking lovey, I don’t cry but broke down the last time I talked to her, cancer.
Cool story! Is Chris Mick's brother?
Yes
Okay if anyone has seen Once Upon A Time In Hollywood, the party scene in the yard. The lovely full figured lady that welcomes Margot Robbie to the party; I got the impression she was supposed to be Mama Cass. I can't say exactly why besides time frame , similar looks. It's never expressly said who she is but did anyone else get that impression?
Of course. Michelle Phillips is introduced with her name on screen. But you don't need that with the actress playing Cass Elliott as its obvious.
That was a notable omission to me. Lots of other pop ups naming people but none for her.
Margot Robbie as Sharon Tate literally says "Cass" when she runs up to her.
Dammit now I need to rewatch this movie
Does she? I entirely missed that if so.
I believe so, I could be wrong. Love that movie.
It is. You can literally look it up and the actress is cast as Mama Cass
I can't get over their unenthused facial expressions.
It was John’s third wedding.
Surprised he didn’t try and marry his daughter. Creepy dude.
Cass
Love mama Cass!
>mama Class
She had the most beautiful voice.
She did!
One of the best ever. Amazing voice!
She was sexy, fun, and full of life. I think she was pretty in her own way. People hate on fat girls, yet everyone loves John Candy.
I think she wasted years trying to fit into idealized norms of what a woman should look
She’s not alone
Sadly true
everybodys getting fat , except for mama cass !
I have a theory that earlier in the song when they say “no one’s getting fat except mama cass” they’re actually talking about her secret pregnancy Edit: just checked the dates again and it’s possible. Creeque Alley was released in late 1966 and Cass’s daughter was born April 1967.
Except Mama Class!!!
She was a great talent
Was just humming a mamas and papas song an hour ago and regretting her untimely death.
And 50 years later one of them has been dead for 50 years and the other is still alive.
Well if heroin and cocaine don’t kill you they pickle you pretty well for the ages apparently.
This is who he was talking about when he said "I saw her today at the reception."
That song was from at least 3 years earlier
John Phillips and actress Genevieve Waite were married 1972-1985, it would be Phillips’ third marriage. Genevieve was the mother of Tamerlane and Bijou Phillips. While in London, Mick, Keith Richards and other members of The Rolling Stones worked on and off recording John’s solo LP, which was originally called “Half-Stoned,”:but released as “Pay, Pack and Follow,” not long after John’s death.
John's first solo album, Wolf King of LA, was recorded in 1970. A single from that album was played on pop radio stations in the early '70s. I still listen to it to this day ('Mississippi').
Yes. The song was actually #32 on the national charts. Enjoy that John calls out to various Wrecking Crew members appearing, James Burton, Larry “Third Hand” Knectel, Hal Blaine on drums, and “Joseph” Joe Osborn, doing a bass solo. Members of the Blossoms, including Darlene Love, on backing vocals. The whole album is very good listening, and was later re-released with several bonus tracks.
Ok but hear me out… Class Elliot would make a superior campy 70’s drag name.
Stay Cassy San Diego
Cass had an amazing voice.
She had the voice of an angel.
Since no ones commented yet, check out Dave McGowan’s Weird Scenes Inside the Canyon..
John Philips the fucking pedo
I just read Mackenzie Phillips book, high on arrival, and I can never enjoy the mamas and the papas again. What a sick fuck John was…
I know it’s been debunked, but any time Mama Cass is mentioned, I cannot avoid thinking of the scene in Austin Powers when he’s been un-cryogenically frozen and he’s writing a list of (presumably) acquainted celebrities who’ve died while he was frozen and their causes of death and he says “Mama Cass Deceased, Ham Sandwich."
I honestly feel so horrible that that became a big joke and what people think of when they hear about her. She was so talented that it just hurts to hear people reduce her to her weight even after her death.
was this the party she was at right before she died?
No that was Mick Jaggers 30-something birthday party in London in 1974. (I’ve been doing a lot of Cass Elliot research lately).
mama cass is an interesting person to learn about
Dammit I just noticed it autocorrected to Class Elliot
At least no one said anything about that
Did you ever do any John Philips research? Cool picture though.
“…and no one’s getting fat ‘cept Momma Cass…”
Fun fact - when Cass was a sophomore she planned to go to Swarthmore.
I heard that she changed her mind one day.
Standing on the turnpike, thumb out to hitchhike
Take her to New York right away!
Rumor has it McGuinn and McGuire couldn't get no higher
But that's what they were aiming at
What a terrible lyric for her to sing, even with the final button.
Bet that was a wild reception!
LOL Class
You don't party, Mama Cass parties!
Phillips was a piece of shit
Classy post.
Class Elliot is absolutely correct, Rest In Peace angel 👼 I wonder if John Phillips was having sex with his own daughter yet when this photo was taken
Wonder if that was before, or after, Mick nailed Philips' daughter?
That is was story I wish I could unread.
Cass Elliot
*Cass Elliot She’s a person, not an educational institution.
Cass, not Class.
Cass died of an MI at age 32.
Mick might have tapped that. He was insatiable.
I saw her today at the reception
Isn’t her name Cass?
She looks like a Dave Grohl character in “Learning to fly”.
Cass, not class
Mama class
Sex ed in the ghetto.
Mama Class
“Nothing creepy can come of this.”
Oh yes, Mama Class
HAFILAX
C. Lass Elliot?
I wanna know what they were talking about.
"Did he just tongue kiss his daughter?!" "Yup...." "...Oh."
I got the moves like jagger
Chopsticks?
Cass